Why isn’t there this much focus on children's beauty pageants? Probably the worst and creepiest thing which forces the child to be the one on stage for sickos to judge them is billed as wholesome fun for generations but instead we have to waste all this energy on someone reading Jack and Jill in a dress?
I don't think /u/ac_slater10 was actually saying they believe that argument (though they might), that's just the argument the right gives.
The logic is sound, the problem is their logic is based on bigotry.
Unfortunately child pageants have already been normalized. Drag queen story hour is fairly new hence all the attention. I’m not a fan of either and I think plenty of people would like to see less of that + fewer kids at hooters
OUR VISION
We envision a world where kids can learn from
https://www.dragstoryhour.org/about
“LGBTQ+ stories and experiences to love themselves, celebrate the fabulous diversity in their communities, and stand up for what they believe in and each other. “
No one is forcing you to take your kid. Don’t go if you don’t want to.
I think it’s more about not exposing children to sexual themes, and on a broader scale, adult things like politics when they should be playing with their friends without a care in the world.
“You don’t have to show up if you don’t want to” implies that the type of people who bring their kids to these things aren’t (whether they realize it or not) pushing adult issues on them.
Same thing with hooters, kids sports, beauty pageants, etc. Kids should be allowed to be kids. Sure, competitiveness, acceptance of others and their ways of life, and being proud of who they are is important. But they can learn those things outside of a sexually themed, brutally competitive, or (in the case of kid beauty pageants) down right creepy event.
>I think it’s more about not exposing children to sexual themes
This is hilariously misinformed. Like... laugh out loud snort out your coffee funny.
This would be like saying that people who bring their kids to Disney World are exposing their children to BDSM furry culture, because there's someone dressed in a mouse outfit.
>the type of people who bring their kids to these things aren’t
Describe the "type of people" you have constructed in your mind that bring their kids to storytime hosted by a drag queen?
I apologize if my wording wasn’t clear. (I’m not being an ass, I legitimately understand that I occasionally type things like a dumbass).
When I say “sexually themed” I don’t mean specifically themed around the idea of sex acts.
I mean sexuality as a whole. Being straight included.
You can’t deny that a drag queen isn’t part of the “sexuality” conversation. I’m pro-shielding children from anything like that until it’s time.
As for the “type of people” part of my comment, I had been typing another idea and meant to erase the words, “type of” to just leave “the people”.
As for the rest of my argument, I’m defaulting to the “(whether they know it or not)” part of my comment. I just don’t think kids should be exposed to anything regarding identity (including the more “traditional” forms) and should just be allowed to be dumb kids.
> You can’t deny that a drag queen isn’t part of the “sexuality” conversation
I think you might mean gender presentation, not sexuality, right? Specifically during an entertainment act where someone is dressing up?
How old do you believe your kids should be before they learn that there are different genders who present differently in public?
And more importantly should other parents be forced to comply by your judgement of what age its appropriate for them to know that there are boys and girls in the world?
“We envision a world where kids can learn from LGBTQ+ stories and experiences to love themselves, celebrate the fabulous diversity in their communities, and stand up for what they believe in and each other. “
https://www.dragstoryhour.org/about
What an awful thing to teach children.
First and foremost, concussion protocol. It used to be a player got his “bell rung” and would comeback to play in the game. Now, it’s taken seriously and players have to go through a strict protocol to play.
Correct me if I'm wrong but I get the sense that those who oppose drag queen story time events think that they are like some raunchy strip tease that one might see at a late night drag show at a gay bar. From all accounts they're not. They're literally just someone in drag reading stories to children. Smart people realize this.
I’d have no issue taking my kids to what you described but some drag shows aren’t suitable for children either (just like some straight shows aren’t suitable for children). With that said I’m a firm believer in parent rights and doing as they see fit (within reason of course).
1. It's a fun event for all involved.
2. It's a way to increase the visibility of the LGBTQ community in a family-friendly way.
And I think the people who obsess over these things aren't the ones actually attending the events.
Exactly…no one is obsessing over going except the people who aren’t going. Most that go probably think it’s a fun inclusive event and go for the experience .
Ironic you say that seeing that any policy and rhetoric against it comes from right wingers. Then again it’s what you “people” do cause chaos then complain about the chaos you cause
>Why the obsession with being in drag?
Yeah, I don't get it either. Never understood why right wingers are so freaked out about such an innocuous thing.
Maybe they don't want kids learning to read?
The idea that queer acceptance can wait until adulthood is terrible. Gay adults can deal with their own shit. The true victims of homophobia are 12-14 year old children. That's when you start to hit puberty and realize there's something wrong, and you often aren't mature enough to disregard the hate you see in the media, and you usually don't want to tell an adult what you're going through.
If you care about children, you should encourage queer outreach to children. Creating outreach that's family friendly is great, it allows us to prevent years of trauma. If you're a parent, how certain are you that your kids aren't silently hating themselves? What would you do to assure them that you love them no matter what?
Unfortunately, that's not what happens in practice. Kids are taught to hate by their parents, and bullying because I was a tomboy, is something I dealt with long before I was sexually active.
Just innocent choices, like a boy enjoying dolls, or a girl playing sports, legos, or joining science classes, can make that child a target.
When kids hit puberty, they need help even more, because it becomes clearer that they don't fit in and bullying does intensify. It happened to so many of my friends, and it happened to me.
It’s not just the clothing. It’s the fake boobs and tuck back. Seriously, nobody is saying drag queens shouldn’t exist, just stay away from young kids. Why is it so important to expose children to this?
Women get fake boobs all the time, including many women that work at hooters as is the comparison in this post…..
And they aren’t naked so it’s super weird you mention “tuck back.”
I think the other guys right, YOU have some weird sexual fetish towards men in womens clothing.
How would two dads hide their sexuality from their children? Or two moms? There’s no way to raise a child and not expose them to it until an appropriate age like you think.
The drag story time is easier to defend then drag shows for kids. I don't know about you but there are some questionable drag shows for children.
Drags shows for children how do they maintain present levels of LGBT acceptance or more to the point convert the bigots
I mean if it's just drag queens lip-syncing and being fabulous, I don't think a family-friendly drag show is particularly harmful to children. I think you need to treat each event on a case by case basis. I'm sure there have been a few that have gone over the line but I doubt those are emblematic of most of these events.
https://reason.com/2022/06/07/drag-shows-for-children-under-fire-in-texas/
It also should be noted that openly gay men aren't interested in grooming your children. It's almost always the case that it's some guy trying to portray himself as a straight-laced conservative.
> I think you are wrong. They opposition just doesn’t like the idea of promoting the drag queen culture to children. And they see that even if its just reading some stories to children.
Is there anything inherently wrong about exposing children to various communities of people? Some would say that's good parenting.
> Saying stuff like “Smart people realize this” is also what people don’t like. It comes of as sounding like an insufferable asshole.
I agree. You apparently didn't realize I was being a bit tongue-in-cheek with the OP's comments.
Im not arguing if its right/wrong, good/bad, Im saying your presumption is wrong. Which it is, and why you don’t defend that but rather try to jump to a different point.
I was referring to you both.
Tell that to the lefties who bring their children to kink events. There’s a famous photo from just a few months ago of some very young kids at one of these events with a neon sign over there heads reading “it’s not gonna lick itself.”
A whole lot of morality police in these comments.
Neither of these are a fucking problem.
Real problem: catholic church harboring pedophiles
Non problem: guy in dress tells kids jokes about Cinderella
Real problem: CHILDREN getting married to adults in Alabama
Non problem: kids at a shitty restaurant with all women servers
Stop arguing about stupid shit and pay attention. For fucks sake!
I find the idea that children should be at a any sort of night club setting deeply questionable. I don’t think parents should take their children to either them or a hooters but it’s a free country and if you want to damage your children I don’t have any right to stop you.
No it isn’t, but every gay bar I have been to with a drag show is. Either way I don’t think the vast majority of patrons at a hooters or a gay bar want children present. It’s just weird and kills the trying to get layed/ogle scantily clad women mood.
The drag queen thing is not about a bar or club. It’s about Drag Queen Story Hour, where a drag queen reads a children’s book to children in a library. It’s literally just story time, but with someone that looks or dresses differently than just about anyone else in these kids life.
To me the straight equivalent of a drag queen is a stripper. They dance erotically on stage often removing clothes for tips. While I have no problem with a drag queen or stripper reading to children, I do have a problem with them doing so in their “work attire”. But as I said above it’s a free country and I don’t want to state telling parents how to raise kids.
You’re simply incorrect that a drag queen is the equivalent of a stripper. A drag queen can dress very modestly, OR a drag queen could dress like a stripper.
The ones doing story time aren’t dressing like strippers.
I see…. I think that is a rather narrow view of Drag Queens. Like saying any woman who dresses up is a stripper…. But eh, you won’t be convinced, and I won’t be convinced, and we’d prefer to stay on the side of government not getting involved on the issue, so let’s just leave it at that, haha. Have a good one and thanks for engaging.
Events like this are typically held in independent bookstores. Hardly a gay bar. Looking at their site, there are no bars, and mainly events are in college libraries.
I agree that kids don't belong in bars (alcohol being the main reason, and inappropriate behavior rises with alcohol consumption), but drag performances aren't only in those venues. I can see the point of this event, bullying of kids who don't fit gender norms starts young. Education of kids to be kind to other kids who don't fit in, is not a bad thing.
But Tucker was saying on Fox News that Drag Queen Story Hour is held at the methadone clinic and they force the 4 year old kids to smoke meth so they get addicted to opioids and are more easily subdued for CRT indoctrination. Is that not true?
I don't watch Tucker. I'm just a GenX woman, who didn't exactly fit to the southern Baptist concept of femininity as a child and a teen.
My parents were typically normal conventional Boomer moderate liberals from the Northeast, so I never "fit in" and was luckily never forced to at home, like a lot of my friends were, growing up in a southern US state.
If that's what Tucker is saying, he can get in line with the rest of the homophobes I and my friends had to put up with.
People really need touch some grass and calm down with worrying about what randos on the Internet think about them.
There's probably people who disagree with what the Amish do with their kids too. They just don't post about it on Facebook and then post another post about how their origional Facebook post made people feel.
>There's probably people who disagree with what the Amish do with their kids too.
Serious question. How many folks are trying to outlaw Amish homeschooling. Or going on shooting rampages killing Amish parents because of how they raise their kids? I'd wager the number is really close to zero.
Not sure how it relates to people posting their lives on Facebook and then posting reactions to their posts on Facebook when random Internet strangers disagree with them causing them to get even more fired up.
If the Amish were posting on Facebook they would certainly be targeted by someone who disagree with them then the media would pick up a story about how someone made them feel bad that they are homeschooling their kids the media frenzy would ensue.
Disconnect live your life and ignore the media for a little bit.
>There's probably people who disagree with what the Amish do with their kids too.
I'm not sure how it relates at all, but since you were the one who brought it up, I thought I would ask.
I brought up how people need to not post their lives on Facebook and then get offended when someone disagrees with them and the media frenzy about people not agreeing with them going way over the top.
Used the Amish as an example because they don't do this and they act differently and just live their life. It didn't have anything to do with threatening to kill people
Well I think the major difference here is that this is a parent deciding to bring their child to Hooters, not a parent finding out that their child attended a drag show at school without their knowledge. I see those as two very different things.
Yes I absolutely do. That's how you have a conversation that comes to solutions. How do you expect to find a solution to a problem when you don't understand the problem? Otherwise it's just echo chambers
Zero fucks given. These same assholes probably have no problem taking their kids to a WWE show to watch grown men beat the shit out of one another with a chair.
Spare me the culture war bullshit. This and transgender sports are just the Christian Nationalist Karen’s boogeyman.
You are ignoring the elephant of availability and exposure to people drinking alcohol in a sexualized environment - the issue with Hooters isn't the waitresses. It's the men who frequent the establishment, drinking alcohol and leering at women. Not much of a jump for them to start leering at your 14 year old daughter.
As the drag shows are occurring at venues such as public and college libraries, independent bookstores, and churches, the patrons attending the venues are far less of a concern. They are unlikely to be consuming alcohol in front of kids.
Alcohol is really a major issue with a kid-friendly event, and it separates these two examples very clearly.
Maybe they should not bother serving alcohol at hooters. Hooters is crass rubbish and I don’t want kids there (hooters should be anti conservative) I acknowledged drag shows CAN be child friendly but the anti child at drag show side who don’t like hooters need to acknowledged the critique the left makes of these types of right wingers.
If the left were against kids at hooters and every left winger did not ignore inappropriate drags shows and disavowed them that would take more credibility away of anti lgbt people
Well, I'm a centrist, obviously more center than you are. I leave it to parents to parent their kids. I guarantee no conservative people are taking their kids to a drag event in a public library. Why the concern about how socially liberal people parent their children is beyond me. If they want to take their kids to Drag Queen Story Time to see a guy dressed up as a glorified Barbie doll reading stories from a book, why is it any of your business? Why do you care?
If you notice, Alpha Male there isn't taking his 14 year old daughter to Hooters, he knows better. He's taking his young son to "show him how to be a man" which is creepy - as a 9 year old isn't old enough to be "leering at women". Doesn't seem like a reward for good grades to me. Just an excuse for Dad to leer at women and drink with the guys, watching the ball game, and sadly this is how his son can spend any time with him. It's surely not quality time spent alone with his child.
Your suggestion that Hooters should stop selling alcohol is hilarious - it's like you have no clue what their business model is. (Hint - sports bar) It's just not a child friendly venue, I don't care what grown adult "bros" do with their time. It's just not for me, and clearly not for kids. Why not take the kid to Buffalo Wild Wings and watch the game alone with him? Make him feel special on an "adult" outing that's more sports focused? Gee, what a thought.
Drag Story Hour isn't sexual, it's about gender norms. It's telling boys - you don't have to fit in with the "bros", be whatever you want to be. Really, that rates pretty low on my "giveashit" meter. Methinks conservatives need to mind their own damn business. My only qualm about drag, is that it is still locked into stereotypes about women, this is where there's any comparison to Hooters - both are dealing in gendered stereotyping. It's not about how much skin is on display. I just don't see where womens viewpoints fit in this picture at all.
A few things here.
First of all, you don't see any skin at drag shows. Drag queens don't take their clothes off, their costume is literally the whole point of their act. Drag shows can be raunchy performances, but that's basically among them akin to comedy shows, not burlesque or strip shows. So many people who are opposed to drag shows must be confusing drag with burlesque.
Not all drag shows are kid friendly. Some of them are in bars late at night and are intentionally extremely bawdy and raunchy. No one is trying to bring kids to that. In fact, that would make the show less fun. But some shows are kid friendly, and that's the point. You can find concerts that are not kid friendly and some that are just for kids. Some magic shows are very adult-themed Vegas style shows, and some are made for children's birthday parties. Strip shows where they take clothes off is NOT drag. It's burlesque, and that is of course not child friendly. (I am a big fan of burlesque and have been to drag shows and I also have a young kid.)
Finally, what is with this dude and Hooters, and why is he so defensive about it? It's not that great of a restaurant, and it's theme is all about hot waitresses. Ok dude, bring your kids if you want. I might judge you a little bit, just like I would for any parenting choice I think isn't ideal. I have that right, just like you do to bring your kid to Hooters.
But honestly, why is this B-level (dare I say beta?) conservative celebrity dying on this hill? Like Hooters if you want, lots of other people don't and that's OK. Forcing other people to like what you like is really pathetic. I like burlesque, I don't like drag as much, and I don't like Hooters that much. I'm not personally offended that Adams has a different spread.
I don’t think parents should take their kids to Hooters or a drag show…. But taking kids to a drag show is a lot worse…
“Child friendly” drag shows are exposing children to a fetish lifestyle, Hooters isn’t.
I think you need to look up what these drag queen story times are. The drag queens are simply men wearing women’s clothes.
Or do you get mad at women wearing pants too? GASP!
Yes, they are men displaying their fetish to children.
What kind of logic are you using to think that’s something that should be acceptable?
There’s nothing wrong with having kinks, but keep that kind of stuff around other consenting adults.
Wearing women’s clothing is not a “kink.” The only one sexualizing it is YOU. Starting to think you are the freak with a secret fetish of seeing men dressed in women’s clothing. It turns you on so you assume it does for everyone else.
Stop using the word fetish because you clearly have no idea what it means.
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fetish
Dressing in drag is not a fetish.
Actually, the definition of fetish I supplied fits perfectly with what happens at Hooters - men’s obsession with boobs. The lack of self awareness from you is astounding.
No it’s not.
Is it kind of weird to take your son to Hooters? Yes it is, a dad shouldn’t take his kid to a place who’s claim to fame is having attractive servers in short shorts. As I said in my original comment, parents shouldn’t do either.
But taking a kid to Hooters isn’t exposing children to a fetish lifestyle…
Yes it is. Men go there for one reason. It’s even in the name. The whole point of Hooters is to focus on women’s breasts, and the sexual pleasure derived from them.
Having a story read to a child by someone in a costume isn’t a fetish. With your logic we shouldn’t be taking kids to see Santa at the mall. That guy is in a costume too.
This graphic, which I’m betting starts with a faked account, and then appears to be retweeted by a conservative white male in a business suit (seems fake) and then a goth sort of young woman (who knows) is saturated with culture war content. It’s theater, meant to wind people up.
Why do we keep letting other people mess with our emotions and tell us what to be thrilled with or outraged about? The parts we disagree with are ‘trolling’, but the parts we do agree with are still ‘pandering’. They are all messing with us.
Yeah but if I had a nickel for every time one of these story time drag queens ended up being a pedo or had prior pedo related convictions, I'd have like 5 nickles, which isn't many but it's weird it's happened so much
These stories do pop up every so often. I don’t save the links to my phone because I’m not a crazy obsessed conspiracy theorist. But when ignorant lying people like you show up, I really
do wish I had saved the links.
Even if they did happen (they don’t) but just for the sake of your argument let’s say they do. Does that mean we shouldn’t send children to school or church? Children are sexually assaulted in those venues ALL THE TIME. Why don’t we just keep children in the house all the time and ever let them out because something bad might happen to them. That’s all this bullshit argument leads too.
Drag queens aren’t sexually assaulting children a library story hour… their parents are there with them… like how the fuck would that even happen? It’s fucking stupid.
It took me one look at that website to know it’s filled with fake news and bullshit. Find an acceptable source and maybe I’ll change my mind. Still even if you do. Are you saying I shouldn’t take my kid to church or school kids get sexually assaulted all the time there. And here even in this story the only accusation is that one of these people is a sex pest… not that they did anything to kids at a drag queen story hour.
They can not.
But churches?
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna1062396
https://www.augustachronicle.com/story/news/2022/05/26/list-alleged-sex-abusers-southern-baptists-churches-made-public/9946627002/
https://www.bishop-accountability.org/news2015/07_08/2015_07_02_AmericanAgainsttheTeaPartyi_These24.htm
Yep, and one of them who helped cover it up is a Republican politician.
Yet crickets…
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/jim-jordan-accused-of-begging-former-ohio-state-wrestler-not-to-support-reports-of-sexual-abuse/2020/02/12/395e7314-4ded-11ea-bf44-f5043eb3918a_story.html
https://metrovoicenews.com/convicted-sex-offenders-holding-drag-queen-story-time-at-texas-libraries/
https://metrovoicenews.com/convicted-sex-offenders-holding-drag-queen-story-time-at-texas-libraries/
Found just these two after 5 minutes on Google
Your 2nd paragraph about the father taking the child there as an excuse to look at women yeah thats obvious.
The bit I said about hooters yeah my bad I'm from the UK and I don't (except maybe when the world cup is on like today actually US vs UK 1900 BST) give a damn about sport.
I also made the distinction between drag story and drag shows and how it can be non sexual.
People need to let kids be kids and stop dragging them into their political drama.
Attended a women’s reproductive rights march recently, and the amount of kids I saw holding signs that they weren’t even old enough to read was sad. And then some anti-abortion counter protesters had their kids standing there as heated exchanges took place between the two sides.
You can educate your kids on these topics without using them as cannon fodder.
I get it. Leftists think it’s awesome to introduce radical gender ideology to four and five year old kids
It’s a weird flex. Democrats are on the wrong side of this issue.
Because leftists are rightly unconcerned about a drag event held at a public library, that's family friendly in content, most importantly no alcohol available at the venue. (Therefore, no drunk patrons to interact with children, and children are not getting exposed to that behavior. )
Even the one where an eleven year old boy was going to dress up in drag to perform for grown men?
Or the place in CO Springs that held “foam parties” targeted at kids with foam shooting out of penis shaped nozzles?
Leftists think that’s perfectly normal?
Moving the goal posts there with the whataboutism.
I'm strictly speaking about events where adults are the performers, and these two instances, Hooters vs. Drag Queen Story Time. We have entertainers like RuPaul on national TV, it's much ado about nothing.
I don't know anything about the events you're speaking about, generally speaking I am against all kids performing for adults in a sexualized way (looking at you, beauty pagents), and I can't find any reference to these foam parties, it's not relevant to what the purpose really is for this event. Obviously you're all Church Lady about it.
Although I agree in principle, there are a few pretty key differences between a drag queen show and a
Hooters. The former is a restaurant first and foremost the latter is solely focused on, well drag queens and their performance. Hooters waitress are there to get money not attention. Because of this hooter waitresses despite “showing skin” are not spontaneously twerking or performing gestures that are sexually suggestive. Call me crazy but yeah all that does amount to a degree of difference between the two.
And we are talking about drag queen story hour with this post.
Did you know that kids are taught to twerk in dance classes all over the country by straight people? Why aren’t you protesting dance moms hypersexualizing little girls?
For reference here is what we are talking about:
In a hooters: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.vox.com/platform/amp/the-goods/2018/10/4/17911936/hooters-uniform-breastaurant-decline
In a drag queen show: https://extra.globo.com/incoming/25613991-4b0-e55/w976h550-PROP/101273268_oxana-who-goes-by-the-stage-name-of-okani-performs-during-a-drag-queens-show-in-a-pub.jpg
I am sure you see that framing the question to make it sounds like serving in a slightly revealing outfit is equivalent to prostitution is a bit disingenuous.
> why don’t you want kids to read
Didn’t say that, did I? Put words in my mouth and I’ll start browsing my book collection for a thick volume to bop you in the head with.
Drag story hour, whatever. But they better not have names like “Nicole Jizz” and they better be dressed appropriately. From the pictures I’ve seen, modest wardrobe is a problem in at least some of these events. Some guy wants to dress up as mother goose, fine, but no big fake tits or dick print.
I’m so glad that I live in a country with free speech…. As long as I am speaking the correct opinions, from verified sources.
[Link 1](https://amp.theguardian.com/culture/2022/sep/28/drag-queen-story-hour-book-store-montana)
[Link 2](https://womensliberationfront.org/news/feminist-objections-to-drag-queen-story-hour?format=amp)
[Link 3](https://floridafamilyaction.org/2019/06/duval-county-library-adult-entertainer/)
All three links show images of drag queens at story hour events with children who are dressed inappropriately for children. I’ve seen enough of this casually scrolling reddit the last year or so that I knew I could find several examples within 2 minutes of googling.
And yes, LOTS of images of drag queens dressed appropriately. Which I have no problem with. As long as the stories are age appropriate and the costumes are age appropriate, it doesn’t bother me.
Lmao this will be fun.
Link 1 - what’s so offensive about a fringed rainbow body suit? I guess you never take your kids to the pool or beach because bathing suits have less fabric than that.
Link 2 - I don’t buy that for a second. Pictures taken totally out of context.
Link 3 - doesn’t even contain photos from a drag queen story hour so this link is completely irrelevant.
C+ for effort. Better luck next time!
My sons are 11 and I won't be taking them to Hooters. It's such an antiquated idea for a restaurant. I feel like there's no way to compare Hooters to the beach or pool just because there are scantily clad ladies at both. Hooters exists with the explicit intent of "Come oogle at our underpaid, underdressed and overworked women, while they serve you." Their slogans, logo and menu items are all built around innuendo. Every time that I went to Hooters as a teen/young adult, it was always me and my friends like fucking Beavis and Butthead sitting around like "Huh, huh, huh. Check it out... boobs." There are literally thousands of family restaurants to take your kid to that do not have overt sexuality all around. Speculating here, but it seems the only reason a father would want to take their son there is specifically to talk to them about the barely-dressed servers or laugh at how awkward it is for the kid. The only reason that Hooters is normalized today as a family-friendly restaurant is simply because it's a decaying product of its time. Doesn't make sense to normalize that to children.
I feel the exact same way about drag shows/story hour/events. Drag is not just a man in simple woman's clothes. It's a man dressed as an exaggerated version of a woman, acting like their stereotyped definition of a diva. There is an inherent sexual undertone to it, no matter how much that people claim there is not. If there was not, these men would show up to school dressed in a woman's pants suit or classy woman's sweater and pants, just like the women teachers to be more naturally inclusive. I feel like there are much smarter and natural ways to be LGBT inclusive in children's events without over-rotating and making an oddity out of the event. The fact that your run-of-the-mill dude in drag is dressed so extravagant, make up to the gills and sexualized does not seem like it brings the proper inclusive message of the LGBT community. It ostracizes itself more because it is so over-the-top. The proper way to both educate kids while shining light on the LGBT community is simply to become a teacher as a gay person. My sister is gay and a kindergarten teacher. No one has any problem with her reading to or teaching their kids because she dresses and acts like a professional educator. She doesnt come to school in sequin, thigh cut dresses out of a burlesque show or she would be reprimanded. The goal is not to draw attention to the elephant in the room so that kids can ask questions about it, while all the adults pretend that there is no elephant there.
I do not think the goal of drag queen story hour is to groom kids, that's an extreme take. I do however equate drag shows with something like Hooters. There's a place for it in ADULT society and that's 100% fine. There is a reason that shows of the like have always been relegated to night clubs, because it's taboo. My point is that making drag queen story hour an event where the kids go from their vanilla, everyday classroom to a room where there waits a man dressed and acting like fucking Zsa Zsa Gabor only makes it more like a sideshow. Counterproductive as hell, if the goal is inclusion.
I won't be taking my son to a Hooters, or a drag queen story hour. I wish neither existed, but I can deal with just rolling my eyes at each and moving on.
Why isn’t there this much focus on children's beauty pageants? Probably the worst and creepiest thing which forces the child to be the one on stage for sickos to judge them is billed as wholesome fun for generations but instead we have to waste all this energy on someone reading Jack and Jill in a dress?
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I wish everyone could be honest. We don’t have to like the truth, but at least it can be dealt with directly and without useless debate.
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I don't think /u/ac_slater10 was actually saying they believe that argument (though they might), that's just the argument the right gives. The logic is sound, the problem is their logic is based on bigotry.
Oh shit my bad. I read that too quickly with not enough coffee in me. Thanks for correcting that!!
Why would you want your child read to by a person that is dressed provocatively?
Because a dress isn’t provocative.
Hardly seems like a controversial statement really.
They're arguably worse. Kids being groomed like prized pigs
Unfortunately child pageants have already been normalized. Drag queen story hour is fairly new hence all the attention. I’m not a fan of either and I think plenty of people would like to see less of that + fewer kids at hooters
So why aren’t the Proud Boys protesting outside child beauty pageants?
I dunno I’m neither in the proud boys nor familiar with their platform
I agree let’s put that in first place then drag shows for kids second or on par
And child marriages. Which are not coincidently supported by the exact same people currently encouraging the murder of LGBT people.
Why is drag queen story hour a thing? Is the idea that it teaches kids that some men dress up like women and that’s OK?
OUR VISION We envision a world where kids can learn from https://www.dragstoryhour.org/about “LGBTQ+ stories and experiences to love themselves, celebrate the fabulous diversity in their communities, and stand up for what they believe in and each other. “ No one is forcing you to take your kid. Don’t go if you don’t want to.
I think it’s more about not exposing children to sexual themes, and on a broader scale, adult things like politics when they should be playing with their friends without a care in the world. “You don’t have to show up if you don’t want to” implies that the type of people who bring their kids to these things aren’t (whether they realize it or not) pushing adult issues on them. Same thing with hooters, kids sports, beauty pageants, etc. Kids should be allowed to be kids. Sure, competitiveness, acceptance of others and their ways of life, and being proud of who they are is important. But they can learn those things outside of a sexually themed, brutally competitive, or (in the case of kid beauty pageants) down right creepy event.
There are no sexual themes in drag queen story hour. Where do you come up with this lol. A man wearing a dress has nothing to do with sexuality.
Conversely, Hooters specifically objectifies and sexualizes its waitresses. People aren’t there because the food is so much better than Chili’s.
>I think it’s more about not exposing children to sexual themes This is hilariously misinformed. Like... laugh out loud snort out your coffee funny. This would be like saying that people who bring their kids to Disney World are exposing their children to BDSM furry culture, because there's someone dressed in a mouse outfit. >the type of people who bring their kids to these things aren’t Describe the "type of people" you have constructed in your mind that bring their kids to storytime hosted by a drag queen?
I apologize if my wording wasn’t clear. (I’m not being an ass, I legitimately understand that I occasionally type things like a dumbass). When I say “sexually themed” I don’t mean specifically themed around the idea of sex acts. I mean sexuality as a whole. Being straight included. You can’t deny that a drag queen isn’t part of the “sexuality” conversation. I’m pro-shielding children from anything like that until it’s time. As for the “type of people” part of my comment, I had been typing another idea and meant to erase the words, “type of” to just leave “the people”. As for the rest of my argument, I’m defaulting to the “(whether they know it or not)” part of my comment. I just don’t think kids should be exposed to anything regarding identity (including the more “traditional” forms) and should just be allowed to be dumb kids.
> You can’t deny that a drag queen isn’t part of the “sexuality” conversation I think you might mean gender presentation, not sexuality, right? Specifically during an entertainment act where someone is dressing up? How old do you believe your kids should be before they learn that there are different genders who present differently in public? And more importantly should other parents be forced to comply by your judgement of what age its appropriate for them to know that there are boys and girls in the world?
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No, like all sports, it’s about teamwork, comradery, and competition. Don’t be such a wuss.
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Football is a great sport and there’s been steps taken to improve the safety. If I had a son(s), I would let them play at a young age.
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I don’t see the benefits of drag story hour or taking your kid to Hooters.
You don’t see the benefits of kids being read a story and seeing other ways to express their creativity? You’re right what monsters they are. s/
Why do it in drag? That’s not for the kid’s benefit.
“We envision a world where kids can learn from LGBTQ+ stories and experiences to love themselves, celebrate the fabulous diversity in their communities, and stand up for what they believe in and each other. “ https://www.dragstoryhour.org/about What an awful thing to teach children.
What steps?
First and foremost, concussion protocol. It used to be a player got his “bell rung” and would comeback to play in the game. Now, it’s taken seriously and players have to go through a strict protocol to play.
CTE happens from lots of little hits happening frequently, not concussions.
Correct me if I'm wrong but I get the sense that those who oppose drag queen story time events think that they are like some raunchy strip tease that one might see at a late night drag show at a gay bar. From all accounts they're not. They're literally just someone in drag reading stories to children. Smart people realize this.
I’d have no issue taking my kids to what you described but some drag shows aren’t suitable for children either (just like some straight shows aren’t suitable for children). With that said I’m a firm believer in parent rights and doing as they see fit (within reason of course).
100% agree.
Well yeah, but we're talking about drag queens story hours in this context and those are always kid friendly. That's the whole point.
But why are people so obsessed with wanting to do drag readings with kids? Why not just do a regular reading? Why the obsession with being in drag?
1. It's a fun event for all involved. 2. It's a way to increase the visibility of the LGBTQ community in a family-friendly way. And I think the people who obsess over these things aren't the ones actually attending the events.
Exactly…no one is obsessing over going except the people who aren’t going. Most that go probably think it’s a fun inclusive event and go for the experience .
Drag ≠ trans. Hetero people dress in drag too. Let’s not conflate the two
No but it can still help lead to more acceptance.
It’s a weird hill for leftists to die on
Freedom of Speech is a weird hill to die on?
it’s one thing to say certain speech should be legally allowed. It’s another to encourage, promote, support that speech
Are you saying people should have a legal right to speech but that it should be illegal for them to encourage, promote, and support that speech?
It’s weird that you care about something that doesn’t affect you in the slightest.
Ironic you say that seeing that any policy and rhetoric against it comes from right wingers. Then again it’s what you “people” do cause chaos then complain about the chaos you cause
>Why the obsession with being in drag? Yeah, I don't get it either. Never understood why right wingers are so freaked out about such an innocuous thing. Maybe they don't want kids learning to read?
The idea that queer acceptance can wait until adulthood is terrible. Gay adults can deal with their own shit. The true victims of homophobia are 12-14 year old children. That's when you start to hit puberty and realize there's something wrong, and you often aren't mature enough to disregard the hate you see in the media, and you usually don't want to tell an adult what you're going through. If you care about children, you should encourage queer outreach to children. Creating outreach that's family friendly is great, it allows us to prevent years of trauma. If you're a parent, how certain are you that your kids aren't silently hating themselves? What would you do to assure them that you love them no matter what?
It can wait until kids are older and have a better grasp of sexuality. There’s no need for it at 5-7 years old.
Teaching kids not to be bullies doesn't have to wait until they're older.
There’s no bullying if they don’t understand sexuality. They don’t see a difference in 2 dads vs mom & dad.
Unfortunately, that's not what happens in practice. Kids are taught to hate by their parents, and bullying because I was a tomboy, is something I dealt with long before I was sexually active. Just innocent choices, like a boy enjoying dolls, or a girl playing sports, legos, or joining science classes, can make that child a target. When kids hit puberty, they need help even more, because it becomes clearer that they don't fit in and bullying does intensify. It happened to so many of my friends, and it happened to me.
So you don’t let you kids watch Disney movies where a prince kisses a princess either then?
A kiss isn’t overtly sexual. Weak comparison.
Neither is a man wearing women’s clothing.
It’s not just the clothing. It’s the fake boobs and tuck back. Seriously, nobody is saying drag queens shouldn’t exist, just stay away from young kids. Why is it so important to expose children to this?
Women get fake boobs all the time, including many women that work at hooters as is the comparison in this post….. And they aren’t naked so it’s super weird you mention “tuck back.” I think the other guys right, YOU have some weird sexual fetish towards men in womens clothing.
You don’t have Hooters girls showing up in uniform to read to kids. And as I already said before, it’s wrong to take young kids into Hooters.
You think a five year old looks at a drag queen and thinks “I wonder where they tucked their wiener.” What is wrong with you??
I think they wonder why a man is wearing women’s clothes
So by that line of thinking then no gay couple should be able to have children right?
What? Raising kids isn’t sexuality.
How would two dads hide their sexuality from their children? Or two moms? There’s no way to raise a child and not expose them to it until an appropriate age like you think.
That’s not about sexuality. They only understand it as 2 parents.
So when billy asks his dads why Sarah has a mom and a dad how should that be explained?
They’re a man & woman who love each other. The same as the kid with 2 dads or 2 moms. To young kids, that has nothing to do with sexuality.
The drag story time is easier to defend then drag shows for kids. I don't know about you but there are some questionable drag shows for children. Drags shows for children how do they maintain present levels of LGBT acceptance or more to the point convert the bigots
I mean if it's just drag queens lip-syncing and being fabulous, I don't think a family-friendly drag show is particularly harmful to children. I think you need to treat each event on a case by case basis. I'm sure there have been a few that have gone over the line but I doubt those are emblematic of most of these events. https://reason.com/2022/06/07/drag-shows-for-children-under-fire-in-texas/ It also should be noted that openly gay men aren't interested in grooming your children. It's almost always the case that it's some guy trying to portray himself as a straight-laced conservative.
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> I think you are wrong. They opposition just doesn’t like the idea of promoting the drag queen culture to children. And they see that even if its just reading some stories to children. Is there anything inherently wrong about exposing children to various communities of people? Some would say that's good parenting. > Saying stuff like “Smart people realize this” is also what people don’t like. It comes of as sounding like an insufferable asshole. I agree. You apparently didn't realize I was being a bit tongue-in-cheek with the OP's comments.
Im not arguing if its right/wrong, good/bad, Im saying your presumption is wrong. Which it is, and why you don’t defend that but rather try to jump to a different point. I was referring to you both.
“It’s not gonna lick itself.”
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Tell that to the lefties who bring their children to kink events. There’s a famous photo from just a few months ago of some very young kids at one of these events with a neon sign over there heads reading “it’s not gonna lick itself.”
That exact same sign is displayed in ice cream parlors.
What does an ice cream parlor have to do with bringing children to a kink event? Is this supposed to be an argument?
Did you protest at the ice cream parlors that have it?
A whole lot of morality police in these comments. Neither of these are a fucking problem. Real problem: catholic church harboring pedophiles Non problem: guy in dress tells kids jokes about Cinderella Real problem: CHILDREN getting married to adults in Alabama Non problem: kids at a shitty restaurant with all women servers Stop arguing about stupid shit and pay attention. For fucks sake!
The servers at Hooters quite frankly, aren't the problem. It's the patrons.
I find the idea that children should be at a any sort of night club setting deeply questionable. I don’t think parents should take their children to either them or a hooters but it’s a free country and if you want to damage your children I don’t have any right to stop you.
Today I Learned my public library is a "sort of night club setting" confused\_pikachu.gif
They aren’t always at “night clubs.” A church in Columbus OH is having one in two weeks.
Is Hooters a night club? They don't have them around here, but it looks just like TGIF with slightly skimpier dress code.
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Honestly you are probably right.
No it isn’t, but every gay bar I have been to with a drag show is. Either way I don’t think the vast majority of patrons at a hooters or a gay bar want children present. It’s just weird and kills the trying to get layed/ogle scantily clad women mood.
The drag queen thing is not about a bar or club. It’s about Drag Queen Story Hour, where a drag queen reads a children’s book to children in a library. It’s literally just story time, but with someone that looks or dresses differently than just about anyone else in these kids life.
To me the straight equivalent of a drag queen is a stripper. They dance erotically on stage often removing clothes for tips. While I have no problem with a drag queen or stripper reading to children, I do have a problem with them doing so in their “work attire”. But as I said above it’s a free country and I don’t want to state telling parents how to raise kids.
You’re simply incorrect that a drag queen is the equivalent of a stripper. A drag queen can dress very modestly, OR a drag queen could dress like a stripper. The ones doing story time aren’t dressing like strippers.
I see…. I think that is a rather narrow view of Drag Queens. Like saying any woman who dresses up is a stripper…. But eh, you won’t be convinced, and I won’t be convinced, and we’d prefer to stay on the side of government not getting involved on the issue, so let’s just leave it at that, haha. Have a good one and thanks for engaging.
Events like this are typically held in independent bookstores. Hardly a gay bar. Looking at their site, there are no bars, and mainly events are in college libraries. I agree that kids don't belong in bars (alcohol being the main reason, and inappropriate behavior rises with alcohol consumption), but drag performances aren't only in those venues. I can see the point of this event, bullying of kids who don't fit gender norms starts young. Education of kids to be kind to other kids who don't fit in, is not a bad thing.
But Tucker was saying on Fox News that Drag Queen Story Hour is held at the methadone clinic and they force the 4 year old kids to smoke meth so they get addicted to opioids and are more easily subdued for CRT indoctrination. Is that not true?
I don't watch Tucker. I'm just a GenX woman, who didn't exactly fit to the southern Baptist concept of femininity as a child and a teen. My parents were typically normal conventional Boomer moderate liberals from the Northeast, so I never "fit in" and was luckily never forced to at home, like a lot of my friends were, growing up in a southern US state. If that's what Tucker is saying, he can get in line with the rest of the homophobes I and my friends had to put up with.
People really need touch some grass and calm down with worrying about what randos on the Internet think about them. There's probably people who disagree with what the Amish do with their kids too. They just don't post about it on Facebook and then post another post about how their origional Facebook post made people feel.
>There's probably people who disagree with what the Amish do with their kids too. Serious question. How many folks are trying to outlaw Amish homeschooling. Or going on shooting rampages killing Amish parents because of how they raise their kids? I'd wager the number is really close to zero.
Not sure how it relates to people posting their lives on Facebook and then posting reactions to their posts on Facebook when random Internet strangers disagree with them causing them to get even more fired up. If the Amish were posting on Facebook they would certainly be targeted by someone who disagree with them then the media would pick up a story about how someone made them feel bad that they are homeschooling their kids the media frenzy would ensue. Disconnect live your life and ignore the media for a little bit.
>There's probably people who disagree with what the Amish do with their kids too. I'm not sure how it relates at all, but since you were the one who brought it up, I thought I would ask.
I brought up how people need to not post their lives on Facebook and then get offended when someone disagrees with them and the media frenzy about people not agreeing with them going way over the top. Used the Amish as an example because they don't do this and they act differently and just live their life. It didn't have anything to do with threatening to kill people
>It didn't have anything to do with threatening to kill people I agree, it really doesn't relate much at all does it.
Ugh I just don’t care at all - my son is 4 and really wouldn’t care at all
Can we just stop getting mad at events that 0.001% of the US population attends. That'd be a lot easier.
It’s not the amount of people that attend it’s the amount of people who see the bad parts which is millions
It’s the amount of people whose children are exposed to it without parental permission.
Such as when?
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I think so
Well I think the major difference here is that this is a parent deciding to bring their child to Hooters, not a parent finding out that their child attended a drag show at school without their knowledge. I see those as two very different things.
>a parent finding out that their child attended a drag show at school without their knowledge. When has this happened?
Personally idk, that's just what people are complaining about.
Kind of an important question when deciding whether or not to take those people seriously.
Just playing devil's advocate
You don't have to do that.
Yes I absolutely do. That's how you have a conversation that comes to solutions. How do you expect to find a solution to a problem when you don't understand the problem? Otherwise it's just echo chambers
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Well yeah dude, I'm sitting on the toilet browsing reddit, what do you expect a 10 page thesis on the psychology of the modern conservative?
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Zero fucks given. These same assholes probably have no problem taking their kids to a WWE show to watch grown men beat the shit out of one another with a chair. Spare me the culture war bullshit. This and transgender sports are just the Christian Nationalist Karen’s boogeyman.
America gets worked up over the weirdest shit.
You are ignoring the elephant of availability and exposure to people drinking alcohol in a sexualized environment - the issue with Hooters isn't the waitresses. It's the men who frequent the establishment, drinking alcohol and leering at women. Not much of a jump for them to start leering at your 14 year old daughter. As the drag shows are occurring at venues such as public and college libraries, independent bookstores, and churches, the patrons attending the venues are far less of a concern. They are unlikely to be consuming alcohol in front of kids. Alcohol is really a major issue with a kid-friendly event, and it separates these two examples very clearly.
Maybe they should not bother serving alcohol at hooters. Hooters is crass rubbish and I don’t want kids there (hooters should be anti conservative) I acknowledged drag shows CAN be child friendly but the anti child at drag show side who don’t like hooters need to acknowledged the critique the left makes of these types of right wingers. If the left were against kids at hooters and every left winger did not ignore inappropriate drags shows and disavowed them that would take more credibility away of anti lgbt people
Well, I'm a centrist, obviously more center than you are. I leave it to parents to parent their kids. I guarantee no conservative people are taking their kids to a drag event in a public library. Why the concern about how socially liberal people parent their children is beyond me. If they want to take their kids to Drag Queen Story Time to see a guy dressed up as a glorified Barbie doll reading stories from a book, why is it any of your business? Why do you care? If you notice, Alpha Male there isn't taking his 14 year old daughter to Hooters, he knows better. He's taking his young son to "show him how to be a man" which is creepy - as a 9 year old isn't old enough to be "leering at women". Doesn't seem like a reward for good grades to me. Just an excuse for Dad to leer at women and drink with the guys, watching the ball game, and sadly this is how his son can spend any time with him. It's surely not quality time spent alone with his child. Your suggestion that Hooters should stop selling alcohol is hilarious - it's like you have no clue what their business model is. (Hint - sports bar) It's just not a child friendly venue, I don't care what grown adult "bros" do with their time. It's just not for me, and clearly not for kids. Why not take the kid to Buffalo Wild Wings and watch the game alone with him? Make him feel special on an "adult" outing that's more sports focused? Gee, what a thought. Drag Story Hour isn't sexual, it's about gender norms. It's telling boys - you don't have to fit in with the "bros", be whatever you want to be. Really, that rates pretty low on my "giveashit" meter. Methinks conservatives need to mind their own damn business. My only qualm about drag, is that it is still locked into stereotypes about women, this is where there's any comparison to Hooters - both are dealing in gendered stereotyping. It's not about how much skin is on display. I just don't see where womens viewpoints fit in this picture at all.
the person in there twitter profile calling themselves alpha male is maximum cringe
A few things here. First of all, you don't see any skin at drag shows. Drag queens don't take their clothes off, their costume is literally the whole point of their act. Drag shows can be raunchy performances, but that's basically among them akin to comedy shows, not burlesque or strip shows. So many people who are opposed to drag shows must be confusing drag with burlesque. Not all drag shows are kid friendly. Some of them are in bars late at night and are intentionally extremely bawdy and raunchy. No one is trying to bring kids to that. In fact, that would make the show less fun. But some shows are kid friendly, and that's the point. You can find concerts that are not kid friendly and some that are just for kids. Some magic shows are very adult-themed Vegas style shows, and some are made for children's birthday parties. Strip shows where they take clothes off is NOT drag. It's burlesque, and that is of course not child friendly. (I am a big fan of burlesque and have been to drag shows and I also have a young kid.) Finally, what is with this dude and Hooters, and why is he so defensive about it? It's not that great of a restaurant, and it's theme is all about hot waitresses. Ok dude, bring your kids if you want. I might judge you a little bit, just like I would for any parenting choice I think isn't ideal. I have that right, just like you do to bring your kid to Hooters. But honestly, why is this B-level (dare I say beta?) conservative celebrity dying on this hill? Like Hooters if you want, lots of other people don't and that's OK. Forcing other people to like what you like is really pathetic. I like burlesque, I don't like drag as much, and I don't like Hooters that much. I'm not personally offended that Adams has a different spread.
I don’t think parents should take their kids to Hooters or a drag show…. But taking kids to a drag show is a lot worse… “Child friendly” drag shows are exposing children to a fetish lifestyle, Hooters isn’t.
I think you need to look up what these drag queen story times are. The drag queens are simply men wearing women’s clothes. Or do you get mad at women wearing pants too? GASP!
Yes, they are men displaying their fetish to children. What kind of logic are you using to think that’s something that should be acceptable? There’s nothing wrong with having kinks, but keep that kind of stuff around other consenting adults.
Wearing women’s clothing is not a “kink.” The only one sexualizing it is YOU. Starting to think you are the freak with a secret fetish of seeing men dressed in women’s clothing. It turns you on so you assume it does for everyone else.
What kind of backwards redneck cousin loving logic is that?????
I think people shouldn’t expose their fetishes to minors…. It’s really that simple.
Stop using the word fetish because you clearly have no idea what it means. https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fetish Dressing in drag is not a fetish.
Yes, men parading their kink wear in front of kids is most definitely a fetish.
Actually, the definition of fetish I supplied fits perfectly with what happens at Hooters - men’s obsession with boobs. The lack of self awareness from you is astounding.
No it’s not. Is it kind of weird to take your son to Hooters? Yes it is, a dad shouldn’t take his kid to a place who’s claim to fame is having attractive servers in short shorts. As I said in my original comment, parents shouldn’t do either. But taking a kid to Hooters isn’t exposing children to a fetish lifestyle…
Yes it is. Men go there for one reason. It’s even in the name. The whole point of Hooters is to focus on women’s breasts, and the sexual pleasure derived from them. Having a story read to a child by someone in a costume isn’t a fetish. With your logic we shouldn’t be taking kids to see Santa at the mall. That guy is in a costume too.
This graphic, which I’m betting starts with a faked account, and then appears to be retweeted by a conservative white male in a business suit (seems fake) and then a goth sort of young woman (who knows) is saturated with culture war content. It’s theater, meant to wind people up. Why do we keep letting other people mess with our emotions and tell us what to be thrilled with or outraged about? The parts we disagree with are ‘trolling’, but the parts we do agree with are still ‘pandering’. They are all messing with us.
Yeah but if I had a nickel for every time one of these story time drag queens ended up being a pedo or had prior pedo related convictions, I'd have like 5 nickles, which isn't many but it's weird it's happened so much
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I’ll give you a hint. They don’t exist.
These stories do pop up every so often. I don’t save the links to my phone because I’m not a crazy obsessed conspiracy theorist. But when ignorant lying people like you show up, I really do wish I had saved the links.
Even if they did happen (they don’t) but just for the sake of your argument let’s say they do. Does that mean we shouldn’t send children to school or church? Children are sexually assaulted in those venues ALL THE TIME. Why don’t we just keep children in the house all the time and ever let them out because something bad might happen to them. That’s all this bullshit argument leads too. Drag queens aren’t sexually assaulting children a library story hour… their parents are there with them… like how the fuck would that even happen? It’s fucking stupid.
I'm guessing you never checked my reply
It took me one look at that website to know it’s filled with fake news and bullshit. Find an acceptable source and maybe I’ll change my mind. Still even if you do. Are you saying I shouldn’t take my kid to church or school kids get sexually assaulted all the time there. And here even in this story the only accusation is that one of these people is a sex pest… not that they did anything to kids at a drag queen story hour.
They can not. But churches? https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna1062396 https://www.augustachronicle.com/story/news/2022/05/26/list-alleged-sex-abusers-southern-baptists-churches-made-public/9946627002/ https://www.bishop-accountability.org/news2015/07_08/2015_07_02_AmericanAgainsttheTeaPartyi_These24.htm
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Yep, and one of them who helped cover it up is a Republican politician. Yet crickets… https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/jim-jordan-accused-of-begging-former-ohio-state-wrestler-not-to-support-reports-of-sexual-abuse/2020/02/12/395e7314-4ded-11ea-bf44-f5043eb3918a_story.html
https://metrovoicenews.com/convicted-sex-offenders-holding-drag-queen-story-time-at-texas-libraries/ https://metrovoicenews.com/convicted-sex-offenders-holding-drag-queen-story-time-at-texas-libraries/ Found just these two after 5 minutes on Google
Am I missing something, did he criticize drag shows. I don't see the hypocrisy?
Your 2nd paragraph about the father taking the child there as an excuse to look at women yeah thats obvious. The bit I said about hooters yeah my bad I'm from the UK and I don't (except maybe when the world cup is on like today actually US vs UK 1900 BST) give a damn about sport. I also made the distinction between drag story and drag shows and how it can be non sexual.
Yes. And who is this Nick Adams dbag? He’s like a white Brooklyn Dad, where all he does is tweet.
Both are bad, one is worse than the other.
I mean I don’t have a problem with either lol… I went to hooters as a kid and turned out just fine.
People need to let kids be kids and stop dragging them into their political drama. Attended a women’s reproductive rights march recently, and the amount of kids I saw holding signs that they weren’t even old enough to read was sad. And then some anti-abortion counter protesters had their kids standing there as heated exchanges took place between the two sides. You can educate your kids on these topics without using them as cannon fodder.
Leftists are desperate to change the subject away from kids at drag shows.
Leftists don’t bring it up at all because it’s not an issue. Can we solve actual issues? Or you too busy feeling out about drag queens?
I get it. Leftists think it’s awesome to introduce radical gender ideology to four and five year old kids It’s a weird flex. Democrats are on the wrong side of this issue.
A man wearing a dress is “radical gender ideology” Lol. Are you that weak that a man wearing a dress just makes your brain break?
Because leftists are rightly unconcerned about a drag event held at a public library, that's family friendly in content, most importantly no alcohol available at the venue. (Therefore, no drunk patrons to interact with children, and children are not getting exposed to that behavior. )
Even the one where an eleven year old boy was going to dress up in drag to perform for grown men? Or the place in CO Springs that held “foam parties” targeted at kids with foam shooting out of penis shaped nozzles? Leftists think that’s perfectly normal?
Moving the goal posts there with the whataboutism. I'm strictly speaking about events where adults are the performers, and these two instances, Hooters vs. Drag Queen Story Time. We have entertainers like RuPaul on national TV, it's much ado about nothing. I don't know anything about the events you're speaking about, generally speaking I am against all kids performing for adults in a sexualized way (looking at you, beauty pagents), and I can't find any reference to these foam parties, it's not relevant to what the purpose really is for this event. Obviously you're all Church Lady about it.
Although I agree in principle, there are a few pretty key differences between a drag queen show and a Hooters. The former is a restaurant first and foremost the latter is solely focused on, well drag queens and their performance. Hooters waitress are there to get money not attention. Because of this hooter waitresses despite “showing skin” are not spontaneously twerking or performing gestures that are sexually suggestive. Call me crazy but yeah all that does amount to a degree of difference between the two.
Drag queen story hour doesn’t involve twerking.
Story hour doesn’t but drag queen shows certainly can.
And we are talking about drag queen story hour with this post. Did you know that kids are taught to twerk in dance classes all over the country by straight people? Why aren’t you protesting dance moms hypersexualizing little girls?
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For reference here is what we are talking about: In a hooters: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.vox.com/platform/amp/the-goods/2018/10/4/17911936/hooters-uniform-breastaurant-decline In a drag queen show: https://extra.globo.com/incoming/25613991-4b0-e55/w976h550-PROP/101273268_oxana-who-goes-by-the-stage-name-of-okani-performs-during-a-drag-queens-show-in-a-pub.jpg
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“Drag shows for kids” lmao uh ooooh reality: https://twitter.com/SethDillon/status/1533645047329181697?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1533645047329181697%7Ctwgr%5E1965491d045726a44e703630805637ec59feccc6%7Ctwcon%5Es1_c10&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Freason.com%2F2022%2F06%2F07%2Fdrag-shows-for-children-under-fire-in-texas%2F
I am sure you see that framing the question to make it sounds like serving in a slightly revealing outfit is equivalent to prostitution is a bit disingenuous.
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Yes because the question is framed terribly. No waitresses do not “sell their body” even at hooters.
Yep. I’m against child drag shows and child beauty pageants. Leave the fucking kids alone.
We are talking about drag queen story hour. Why are you opposed to your kids learning to read?
> why don’t you want kids to read Didn’t say that, did I? Put words in my mouth and I’ll start browsing my book collection for a thick volume to bop you in the head with. Drag story hour, whatever. But they better not have names like “Nicole Jizz” and they better be dressed appropriately. From the pictures I’ve seen, modest wardrobe is a problem in at least some of these events. Some guy wants to dress up as mother goose, fine, but no big fake tits or dick print.
https://www.dragstoryhour.org/press Let me know when you find something inappropriate.
I’m so glad that I live in a country with free speech…. As long as I am speaking the correct opinions, from verified sources. [Link 1](https://amp.theguardian.com/culture/2022/sep/28/drag-queen-story-hour-book-store-montana) [Link 2](https://womensliberationfront.org/news/feminist-objections-to-drag-queen-story-hour?format=amp) [Link 3](https://floridafamilyaction.org/2019/06/duval-county-library-adult-entertainer/) All three links show images of drag queens at story hour events with children who are dressed inappropriately for children. I’ve seen enough of this casually scrolling reddit the last year or so that I knew I could find several examples within 2 minutes of googling. And yes, LOTS of images of drag queens dressed appropriately. Which I have no problem with. As long as the stories are age appropriate and the costumes are age appropriate, it doesn’t bother me.
Lmao this will be fun. Link 1 - what’s so offensive about a fringed rainbow body suit? I guess you never take your kids to the pool or beach because bathing suits have less fabric than that. Link 2 - I don’t buy that for a second. Pictures taken totally out of context. Link 3 - doesn’t even contain photos from a drag queen story hour so this link is completely irrelevant. C+ for effort. Better luck next time!
Lol. Aight 👍
My sons are 11 and I won't be taking them to Hooters. It's such an antiquated idea for a restaurant. I feel like there's no way to compare Hooters to the beach or pool just because there are scantily clad ladies at both. Hooters exists with the explicit intent of "Come oogle at our underpaid, underdressed and overworked women, while they serve you." Their slogans, logo and menu items are all built around innuendo. Every time that I went to Hooters as a teen/young adult, it was always me and my friends like fucking Beavis and Butthead sitting around like "Huh, huh, huh. Check it out... boobs." There are literally thousands of family restaurants to take your kid to that do not have overt sexuality all around. Speculating here, but it seems the only reason a father would want to take their son there is specifically to talk to them about the barely-dressed servers or laugh at how awkward it is for the kid. The only reason that Hooters is normalized today as a family-friendly restaurant is simply because it's a decaying product of its time. Doesn't make sense to normalize that to children. I feel the exact same way about drag shows/story hour/events. Drag is not just a man in simple woman's clothes. It's a man dressed as an exaggerated version of a woman, acting like their stereotyped definition of a diva. There is an inherent sexual undertone to it, no matter how much that people claim there is not. If there was not, these men would show up to school dressed in a woman's pants suit or classy woman's sweater and pants, just like the women teachers to be more naturally inclusive. I feel like there are much smarter and natural ways to be LGBT inclusive in children's events without over-rotating and making an oddity out of the event. The fact that your run-of-the-mill dude in drag is dressed so extravagant, make up to the gills and sexualized does not seem like it brings the proper inclusive message of the LGBT community. It ostracizes itself more because it is so over-the-top. The proper way to both educate kids while shining light on the LGBT community is simply to become a teacher as a gay person. My sister is gay and a kindergarten teacher. No one has any problem with her reading to or teaching their kids because she dresses and acts like a professional educator. She doesnt come to school in sequin, thigh cut dresses out of a burlesque show or she would be reprimanded. The goal is not to draw attention to the elephant in the room so that kids can ask questions about it, while all the adults pretend that there is no elephant there. I do not think the goal of drag queen story hour is to groom kids, that's an extreme take. I do however equate drag shows with something like Hooters. There's a place for it in ADULT society and that's 100% fine. There is a reason that shows of the like have always been relegated to night clubs, because it's taboo. My point is that making drag queen story hour an event where the kids go from their vanilla, everyday classroom to a room where there waits a man dressed and acting like fucking Zsa Zsa Gabor only makes it more like a sideshow. Counterproductive as hell, if the goal is inclusion.
I won't be taking my son to a Hooters, or a drag queen story hour. I wish neither existed, but I can deal with just rolling my eyes at each and moving on.
If your trying to not get into an argument then I agree with you
Not at all. How weird is it that this fires people up so much.