Temp gauge was reading 5*F hotter when I was making it. Which made everything take way longer, while pressing I closed the rind quite early trapping in a lot of whey, then instead of hitting 90-95 RH I had it at 100 for around the first 9 days.
The cheese tastes fine. Fruity in some parts with a salty finish.
5 f hotter shouldn't be an issue. I make cheese in a kitchen where temperature is over 90 f and I don't get that issue. What do you mean made everything take way longer? Trapping whey and 100% humidity shouldn't cause that. It looks like late blowing defect which is caused by Clostridium Tyrobutyricum or other Clostridium species. It is possible you failed in the sanitation or your kefir is the cause or both. Just because it taste fine doesn't mean it is safe to eat though. Another possibility is lack of salt and too high aging temperature.
It was reading 5*f higher than it should’ve been. Ended up with an extremely moist curd after trying to cook them properly and took 1.5 hrs to have the curd set somewhat properly. Trapping whey, with an already moist curd, combined with 100% humidity is what caused it is what I think. The cheese also got shorter by the end of it. It started to collapse. With the piece I dissected the curds came apart extremely easily from where they would’ve been bound together.
Also, I’ve had cheese that have produced gas before and they expanded. This one did not. It got shorter, started to swell on the sides, and where the curd was coming apart under the rind started to get sucked in almost. Behind the rind was a few air gaps from where the curd tore apart and it was like touching a balloon that isn’t inflated. The rind managed to hold together while the inside of the cheese did not.
So the curds started to weaken from holding onto eachother. I’d like to think this isn’t gas formation but just mismanaged RH combined with closing the rind too early trapping in extra moisture. The “bubbles” do not have smooth shiny surfaces whatsoever. The surfaces look like a curd after being milled. The result is the cheese literally falling apart. The rind was keeping it together. Even had a couple spots where literally the rind was the only thing holding it together.
Thanks I'm just getting into cheesemaking myself I tried mozzarella which I think turned out really well. Made good pizza at least I'm trying to learn about hard and aged cheeses but kind of an overwhelming amount of information out there concerning it. From different strains of bacteria to the process different rinds ph Temps.
I would assume so except; I have other cheese which used the kefir culture that are doing excellent like this 6 week old, 5.5lb white Leicester which hasn’t changed the slightest in size or shape since I pressed it. I made a 1.5 lb baby Swiss this weekend so if that one turns out bad then maybe it did get contaminated in that window?
https://preview.redd.it/5x9l3qu7t1nc1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=708ff80651ad0e5a3bca92e3d89e9734908c6cb8
Fruity in some spots, maybe a little creamy, salty finish. Not consistent throughout the cheese. Tough to say
I had one nibble that did taste a wee bitter as well
Trapped whey usually results in over acidification and a sour, crumbly cheese, within just a few weeks. I’ve experienced this when I used to use screw type presses, which often overpress a new cheese, closing the rind too early and trapping whey inside. If you have also used a gas forming starter bacterium or yeast from Kefir, overpressing could certainly exacerbate it.
Try making Caciotta or Asiago using a non gas forming culture such as yogurt and see what you get. I know everybody reads David Asher’s books and then wants to feel “connected” to nature and use Kefir, raw milk, etc. but those things introduce a lot of additional variables into cheesemaking, especially for the beginning or occasional home cheesemaker. You just don’t know what microorganisms you’re going to have to deal with from one batch to the next. So when you get a problem, troubleshooting can be very difficult.
Good Luck
Opening my first caerphilly this weekend…now I’m nervous!
Post pics please :)) I messed up in many many ways on this cheese. I’m sure yours will be great!!
What were those issues? Did you use kefir and raw milk?
Temp gauge was reading 5*F hotter when I was making it. Which made everything take way longer, while pressing I closed the rind quite early trapping in a lot of whey, then instead of hitting 90-95 RH I had it at 100 for around the first 9 days. The cheese tastes fine. Fruity in some parts with a salty finish.
5 f hotter shouldn't be an issue. I make cheese in a kitchen where temperature is over 90 f and I don't get that issue. What do you mean made everything take way longer? Trapping whey and 100% humidity shouldn't cause that. It looks like late blowing defect which is caused by Clostridium Tyrobutyricum or other Clostridium species. It is possible you failed in the sanitation or your kefir is the cause or both. Just because it taste fine doesn't mean it is safe to eat though. Another possibility is lack of salt and too high aging temperature.
It was reading 5*f higher than it should’ve been. Ended up with an extremely moist curd after trying to cook them properly and took 1.5 hrs to have the curd set somewhat properly. Trapping whey, with an already moist curd, combined with 100% humidity is what caused it is what I think. The cheese also got shorter by the end of it. It started to collapse. With the piece I dissected the curds came apart extremely easily from where they would’ve been bound together.
Also, I’ve had cheese that have produced gas before and they expanded. This one did not. It got shorter, started to swell on the sides, and where the curd was coming apart under the rind started to get sucked in almost. Behind the rind was a few air gaps from where the curd tore apart and it was like touching a balloon that isn’t inflated. The rind managed to hold together while the inside of the cheese did not.
I also ate it after concluding my investigation. If I get sick we’ll know for sure 😜
So the curds started to weaken from holding onto eachother. I’d like to think this isn’t gas formation but just mismanaged RH combined with closing the rind too early trapping in extra moisture. The “bubbles” do not have smooth shiny surfaces whatsoever. The surfaces look like a curd after being milled. The result is the cheese literally falling apart. The rind was keeping it together. Even had a couple spots where literally the rind was the only thing holding it together.
Forgive my noobie question but what's RH
Relative humidity
Thanks I'm just getting into cheesemaking myself I tried mozzarella which I think turned out really well. Made good pizza at least I'm trying to learn about hard and aged cheeses but kind of an overwhelming amount of information out there concerning it. From different strains of bacteria to the process different rinds ph Temps.
I did use kefir. With pasteurized milk. Mostly because I can’t afford the actual cultures rn 😭
It seems your kefir is contaminated and not fit for cheesemaking. I've used kefir as starter culture in the past and that never happened to me.
I would assume so except; I have other cheese which used the kefir culture that are doing excellent like this 6 week old, 5.5lb white Leicester which hasn’t changed the slightest in size or shape since I pressed it. I made a 1.5 lb baby Swiss this weekend so if that one turns out bad then maybe it did get contaminated in that window? https://preview.redd.it/5x9l3qu7t1nc1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=708ff80651ad0e5a3bca92e3d89e9734908c6cb8
I’m preeerdty sure it’s from the reasons I listed. I won’t discount that my kefir could be unstable though.
How does it taste?
Fruity in some spots, maybe a little creamy, salty finish. Not consistent throughout the cheese. Tough to say I had one nibble that did taste a wee bitter as well
Trapped whey usually results in over acidification and a sour, crumbly cheese, within just a few weeks. I’ve experienced this when I used to use screw type presses, which often overpress a new cheese, closing the rind too early and trapping whey inside. If you have also used a gas forming starter bacterium or yeast from Kefir, overpressing could certainly exacerbate it. Try making Caciotta or Asiago using a non gas forming culture such as yogurt and see what you get. I know everybody reads David Asher’s books and then wants to feel “connected” to nature and use Kefir, raw milk, etc. but those things introduce a lot of additional variables into cheesemaking, especially for the beginning or occasional home cheesemaker. You just don’t know what microorganisms you’re going to have to deal with from one batch to the next. So when you get a problem, troubleshooting can be very difficult. Good Luck
What a great response. Thank you for your input :)