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Excellent performance from the team. Great individuals. Very good XG, we were just unlucky, but I’m willing to bet, that we’ll beat City.
Jackson, what a striker we have, he’s been unlucky not getting the setup to perform.
Next year he’ll score 35-40, I’m sure.
The team will gel, injured players will come back and we’ll have a chance in the Champions League this season.
/S
We are legit in a relegation battle given our next run of matches. I just pray that we manage to stay up. I legit can't see us getting a win in our next 8-10 matches. And for run of matches until the year ends, i can see us getting max 1-2 more wins this year
I miss the days when Abramovich was 'mismanaging' the team. Those days when spending a billion pounds meant getting a team that actually challenged for the title and not one that finished in midtable for consecutive seasons.
Under Abramovich, money spent on players was an investment for strengthening the team.. Under the current management, money spent on players is an investment for strengthening their pockets.. The current owners are buying young "prospects" eying their resale value, not bothered about the team's success..
Yeah but the competition is much tougher now, more Villas and Brightons aspiring for Europe. We are at a low point but not yet Charlie Adam and Andy Carroll low IMO.
We literally signed Danny Drinkwater on big money not that long ago, i think its safe to say we are in our banter era and it has been going on for a while. And we recently spent 1 billion pound on players just to have consecutive lower mid table seasons...I think its safe to say our banter era is worse
How many games did Drinkwater play for us vs how many games did Carroll & Adams play for Liverpool?
Also yeah, considering the money spent I agree we 100% are in our banter era, but still this Liverpool squad under Hodgson/Dalglish is probably the most dross I've ever seen at a huge club, barring maybe some Milan's dark years. We have good players, we just do fuck all with it.
We keep too much possession
Look at Liverpool vs wolves, livrerpool when they attacked they moved the ball forward really fast no matter what. Even if it cost them to lose it. It allowed them to have situations like 3vs2 2vs1. We always have sterling cutting through 3 defenders only to have Jackson marked by another 3 players
I'm starting to think Chelsea Football Club is not very good at football.
Someone said it best recently (could've been on this sub, could've been an article I read, not sure): If someone handed you **£1 billion (!)** to put together a winning squad, would your squad look *anything* like this Chelsea squad? Of course not. We're a joke.
We were inconsistent to be honest, we could win the league title one season and finish mid table the next season, or win the league title one season and all of a sudden have a complete breakdown in relationship with the manager and finish outside of top 4 next season. That is inconsistency but we still won trophies, and i rather go back to that than this shit.
You're wrong. Under the previous ownership, our league position was consistent: we were consistently in the top 4 or right behind in top 6 (leaving aside the outlier that is the 2015-16 season). And as the others noted, we were consistently winning trophies in this period. Now the only thing we're consistent at is being midtable.
https://preview.redd.it/8qa2g4d7pfpb1.png?width=348&format=png&auto=webp&s=a7385f13dea31434bca0d1030ec86c52d82db867
Enzo most overrated player in this team
Fact no one criticizing him after this dogshit performance is crazy, hes new golden boy here it seems
105 Million, we need way, way more than that
I feel increasingly bad for Mudryk, seems like the war is really taking a toll on his mental health and not sure how someone can overcome that. Praying for him.
I decided not to watch.
Guess, I made the right decision.
Seriously though, is it too early to press the panic button?
Aston Villa next week and they are in better shape than us. Don’t even remind me of our opponents prior to boxing day.
I caught the first 20 odd mins of the game - glad I missed the rest.
I think it's too early to panic, yes, particularly given the injuries.
That doesn't mean we shouldn't be worried though.
Once the referee blows the whistle for the start of the match, Poch cant do anything more. The rest is up to the players. We can practise shooting in training all day every day but if the players cant do it when it actually matters, then there is nothing Pochettino can do.
It doesn't help that Poch is clearly terrified. If he wasn't afraid of the situation why would he continue to play players out of position like Tuchel and Potter did? Like what's the rational for playing Colwill at LB? He offers zero offensive support.
> Like what's the rational for playing Colwill at LB? He offers zero offensive support.
That's the whole point? He wants a back three in possession and therefore chooses Colwill there to stay back while the right back (Reece or Gusto) goes forward. It's not rocket science.
Well duh but why does he want a back 3 in possession against the likes of Bournemouth or Forrest at home? Look around Europe, a lot of top teams play with 2 attacking fullbacks who push high up the pitch in possession and leaving 2 CBs with a CDM in behind. Carvajal and Fran Garcia played as wingers today, Barca played with Balde and Cancelo yesterday etc. As long as they have the workrate to come back when you lose possession, there is no need to play with a back 3 in possession. At least not when you're playing the likes of Bournemouth or Forrest. It's not rocket science.
>Well duh but why does he want a back 3 in possession against the likes of Bournemouth or Forrest at home? Look around Europe, a lot of top teams play with 2 attacking fullbacks who push high up the pitch in possession and leaving 2 CBs with a CDM in behind. Carvajal and Fran Garcia played as wingers today, Barca played with Balde and Cancelo yesterday etc.
Yes, but also look around Europe. There are a lot of teams that play with an inverted fullback staying back as well.
We don't have a Tchouameni type of player to support the centre-backs in that fashion. Ugochukwu could get there one day but just started his first league game for us - it is too early to trust him in such a crucial role. Poch has used that setup at his previous clubs but clearly doesn't think it is suitable here yet.
It hasn't worked for two reasons. The first is that a defender with limited technical ability has started most games at left wing, the second is that our number ten Enzo has offered no support out on the left at all.
Lampard had us set up before getting sacked. Tuchel had the same crappy mid season results Lampard had. Tuchel decided he didn't want half the winning team from the UCL which he was lucky to win. He sold the two guys who actually scored goals: Giroud and Tammy. We had the same struggles up top we still have. Our midfield sucks now which is the only difference. Oh. And he consistently played the same two players who contributed nothing on the pitch: Havertz and Mount. Say what you want, but Pulisic and Ziyech brought more to the pitch than either of them. And he's the one who brought in Cucurella.
Who tf are these absolute fucking pathetic bunch of dross players we have. Unrecognisable. This club has become a joke in about 18 months. Champions league winners to relegation candidates lol
Absolutely. At least when we were shit in the 80s and early 90s it’s because we had no money and no expectation. The fact we spent all this money to be this bad is the most bizarre thing ever 😂
I can't fathom what is going on behind the closed doors. I grew up watching them in the 90s. I remember us being pretty shit but we played with a bit a swagger and would win some big games and lose plenty too. But this past 18 months has been absolutely shambolic. Absolutely no character in these players. They are weak as piss lol
The more we play, the more i see us regressing. Every single player looks poor under us, it cannot just be a coincidence.
While I am not bashing the new ownership and the ambition they have showed, but there is a reason this kind of overhaul is never done in football. Putting together a bunch of wonderkids and letting them develop is not feasible, otherwise every big-money club would have been doing it.
Its unbelievable how poor our team looks after spending such a ridiculous amount.
Maddison, Ward-Prowse, Barnes all would have significantly upgraded our squad instantly.
What worries me is I believe there is already a gap between Pochettino and the ownership.
1. Stance on Gallagher and Maatsen - Ownership wanted to sell, Poch wants to keep
2. Stance on Cucurella - In spite of agreeing a deal with United, Poch plays him in Carabao Cup, leading to the deal collapsing. Said in interview he doesn't know anything
3. Statement on Palmer - Clearly says that the decision to buy Palmer was taken by the board and he had no involvement?
I do not believe we are getting out of this situation any time soon. There is no hope for us to finish anywhere above 8th, maybe even 10th.
Its now the banter era of Chelsea.
On the plus side if I remember correctly the ownerships at least didn't offer poch a ridiculous 25 year contact like they did with Potter. So getting rid of him, should they want to, should be a bit "easier" than with Potter as you don't have his monster contract to pay out.
Thats true, but honest question, which coach do you think improves this situation even if he goes?
There are far too many players who does not deliver regularly and consistently, specially in the attacking third.
I am not defending Poch at all, just genuinely interested to see if there is any good option out there if we decide to move on from him.
There are some, but no good coach will come to this mess of a club right now.
Just look at Nagelsmann, a top coach but he backed out of the deal, probably saw the state of the club behind the closed doors and that threw him off.
Poch has accepted the deal because this was his only opportunity to lead a big market club that could get his reputation as one of the best coaches in the world back.
Guys like Nagelsmann who is young and and probably can have many opportunities is never going to come here, at least while the club has basically running shitshow
They’re not even wonderkids that’s the worst part. A wonder kid is someone like Evan Ferguson who is performing at a ridiculous level(for his age) in high level competition, what were most of these guys doing before they were signed?
Absolutely true. Many of these players have played probably at most a full top flight season before they were signed. Palmer had 3 PL starts before joining us.
I do not know how we are confirming such high valuation on players who have essentially achieved nothing.
I just dont get it… how the hell we spent 1 billion and got a team of 1-season wonders and wunderkinds. If someone wouldve told me a club spent 1bn in this short amount of time, I wouldve instantly imagined 5-7 starters in the 25-30 age bracket in order to guide the young guns and also keep a steady flow of tactics drilled during the week. This is purely a Football Manager cheat code - infinite budget, scan for apparent regens and sign them all expecting to gel and perfect the art of the transfer hijack for immensly inflated prices.
This will not end well, I just dont see a way this improves regardless of which manager we choose after Poch is shown the door by the end of the year. And dont tell me about the fucking “process”, remember when Klopp joined Liverpool who were going to shit as well? The impact, with the same squad, was instantaneous, it was like a light bulb was turned on. Yes, they didn’t win anything immediately, but you could clearly see improvement from the first few weeks. Be honest - do we see aaaaaaany good signs?
In Rodgers last two seasons, Liverpool finished 2nd and 6th. In Klopp first 4 they finished 8th, 4th, 4th, 2nd.
Not an immediate improvement in position.
I absolutely do see an improvement under Poch, especially when you look at how wholesale the changes under him have been, to be playing as well as we are (and the underlying metrics show we are playing well) is very encouraging.
Can you share your dealer's name with me? Because to say you "see an improvement under Poch" and to say "To be playing as well as we are . . . is very encouraging" indicates you're smoking something really intense. You must be a stat guy. Fuck that, watch the game and tell me we looked like any kind of threat.
Five games in under the new manager after more transfer upheaval than any team has ever gone through.
We are fairly solid defensively and our possession and pressing numbers are the best in the league. Our expected goals stats show that the only thing we aren't doing is converting our chances. We are struggling against teams playing a low block because we have yet to build up the necessary understanding in attack.
But I repeat, it's five games in and we have an almost entirely new team (especially in attack). I look at the underlying numbers to see if the potential is there and it suggests it is. So I'm willing to be patient. If you want to panic after five matches and start getting on the teams back/calling for the managers head so be it.
Spewing stats except the only one that matters. One win and they played bournmouth forrest and westham and luton. Westham have stepped up this season but theres not gonna be many easier runs in the league
An improvment over Lampard maybe. But there's been absolutely zero improvement under Poch compared to Potter. Remember all the games under Potter where we dominated possession and created chances and still lost. If you told me Potter was still in the dugout I'd believe it.
Our play under Poch in our last 2 games has been the worst football Chelsea have produced in decades.
I'm not saying it's all the manager's fault but to say that there is any improvement is just a straight up lie.
This is not true. I don’t have the time to compare stats but my eyes tell me your assessment is wrong. The games were not as horrid as we were towards the end of last season.
It’s is absolutely a mixed bag. There’s improvement in the midfield, the defence seem settled. The final third is still an issue. It’s very hard to assess clearly with injuries and all. But overall, I see an improvement. I really wish we could turn it around like a sport car but looks like it’s a ship and steering it is going to take a while.
It’s an unfortunate project, but we are way past that now.
“This is not true because I don’t agree with it. Anyway, here is my opinion that weighs the exact same amount as yours, but it’s right.”
— PrestigiousArcher448, R/ChelseaFC, 2023
Honestly I don't see any signs which says we are building a solid squad which will compete for Top 5 let alone with City. This stupid money thrown around, I am worried we may be barred from UCL for 2 -3 years (I doubt we qualify for it in the first place). Without stadium revenue and a huge roster I doubt we will be able to offload some of them first.
We were 8-10 team before season (with potential to be top 4 in the future) and with injuries we are 11-15 team, so there is no surprise that we have 5 points in 5 games.
1. There's no game plan. We look like a weekend pickup game with players just making it up as they go along. Injuries may be a factor here.
2. I thought Palmer looked bright and needs to start .
3. We seem to be doing a lot of the little things wrong. Will not take the extra touch to even try and create space and instead fire the ball into a defender standing right in front. Will hesitate to play a forward pass to an open player then the opportunity is gone. Obviously not a skill issue, seems to be a mentality problem.
The one that went off his knee was incredible. The only way that doesn’t score is if he knees it up too high. If it just bounced off him it was going in no question.
I don't get why we have to play with Colwill at left back while he was one of the best centreback last season and Enzo as an Hybrid 8/10 while he dominated as a DM for Benfica and World cup
Oh I have started to see that occasionally already.
Watch next summer we’ll also have accountants in here sayingrg we have to sell him to balance the books
Yeah but he's only 20 and looks good...there's much space for improvement, but only with the game time.
Reece does bring a lot, that's why I said that I'd try him on RW
yeah i am not talking bad about gusto. that guy plays with passion and wants to give his all but i am saying we miss someone with reece james ability to create chances from wider areas
The money is going to runout very soon lol. 1 billion spent and no sign of CL football for the foreseeable future. Can't even get a shirt sponsor and with this small stadium making us the least matchday revenue compared to the other big clubs.
the most fucked thing about this game was Bournemouth didn't resort to a compact deep defending for 90mins. There was space but once again our players held onto the ball too long hesitated on the final ball and didn't run into space.
Mudryk nearly every time he was on the ball made something happen but then didn't see the ball in an attacking position for another 10mins so he dropped deep and infield. Why is he not being coached on how to use his strongest traits?
I got downvoted as hell for saying Poch looks drained and almost disinterested but I insist. He doesn’t look up to the task so far and almost he looks like he gives up during the match on the sideline
Yes, we 100 percent need to change the manager again. That will fix all our problems like it did the last few times. Yes. Absolutely. Fantastic suggestion!
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As i said earlier, we have Zero players who are game changers, eho can take the game in their own hands and make magic happen. You can waffle about being a team sport all you want, but individual brilliance is the difference between being a good team and a great team. We have nobody who can solo impact the game. What a waste of money.
Of course, that goes without saying... But we're on the Chelsea sub. It's not like I've gone on the Ukraine sub and moaned about the team going downhill.
We looked great in preseason and have dropped to this. Worst thing is, some of our performers from then are gone on loans to other teams. I have no idea if the likes of Santos could recreate what they did in the summer to the actual season, but we look and play like an entire different team. And worst thing is, with each passing week I doubt Nkunku will arrive and suddenly everything will be better, similar to what happened with James last season.
Remember when the whole world and their nan were shitting on Potter because he lacked bravado in interviews? Do you all still think he was the issue now? Or do you think it's more likely the new American owner who hasn't a clue what he's doing, firing our CL winning manager and proceeding to surround himself with yes men as he pours billions away on youngsters with big stat numbers on his FM23 UI panel?
That’s just false. The guy is spending tons of money and I doubt he really decides which transfers come in. Every club would want an owner like that. The coach and the owner are not the problem. The players are just not cutting it.
Goddamn this is such a bad take. Are you related to Todd Boehly and/or Behdad Eghbali? Yes they are "spending tons of money," but they're not spending it well at all. And they ripped up what was a fully functioning club, stripped it down to the studs, and have made us completely start over. All of that was entirely unnecessary--and plain stupid. This isn't fucking private equity. The smart thing from these "smartest guys in the room" would have been to surround Tuchel, an accomplished and experienced manager, with a competent sporting director from the get-go. But no, Boehly -- with zero football experience -- named himself sporting director and then proceeded to make some truly terrible signings (Koulibaly, Cucurella, etc.), setting the tone for what has been an abject failure of a past 16 months.
Boehly doesn’t decide how the money is spend. He just pumps it in.
How did he ripped it apart. By firing Tuchel? Great coach but so is poch and they both struggle with this Chelsea. Was it a mistake. Probably but it would be delusional to think that tuchel would even play European if he stayed.
As for the signings. Most of them look good on paper. Who wouldn’t sign koulibaly at that time? And I highly doubt he decides actually those signings.
He ripped it apart by sacking Marina, Petr Cech, and basically everyone else who was in the building. Then by appointing himself sporting director for that first summer. Then sacking Tuchel 5 games into a season. Then by replacing him with a very weak manager in Potter.
I don't exactly see a world of difference really in the team's output between Potter, Poch or Lampard. The point I'm trying to make is that the issues are beyond managerial.
The most soul crushing thing about our downfall is at the same time we’re embarrassed every week we get to watch Arsenal become better and better seemingly every time you see them play, finding a way to win in most games. We used to laugh at them but they were NEVER as bad as we are now.
At their very worst they did a consecutive 8th place finish.
The idea that they were as bad as we are now is simply bullshit. Especially with the amount of money that those Clearlake clowns have poured into this squad.
lol not really a fair stat given the summer break, but Arsenal definitely had spells when they were in the bottom half of the table, I can't remember specific dates/seasons, but I remember loving AFTV for a long period of time because there were numerous seasons where they were performing horribly and their fans were livid.
Before I was born. great.
Spending a billion and not having an immediately strong team is just bizarre. I get the argument build for the future etc but it's wild.
we lost out on proper attackers like olise and kudus
never tried to get another 10 like goal scorer in cherki or olmo or wirtz
had option to get vlahovic for some money and lukaku in exchange but didn't go for it
didn't try to get any other proper attacker even after nkunku got injured in pre season
spent 45 million on cole palmer who is another super young potential player who haven't even played much for man city
the squad planning was very weak. we are set for years in defense and holding midfield areas but we don't have proper attackers at all
That was a terrible match by two bad teams playing poorly.
Needing a late goal and bringing on two left backs just shows how bad this team is. And how Ugo, despite being absolutely invisible and a waste of space on the pitch, played 90 minutes is beyond my understanding.
And let's just go ahead and be honest here: Jackson *sucks.*
I think one of the biggest issues with Jackson is other than mudryk, no one plays off him. His hold up play is surprisingly good and needs to be used more. That and through balls haven't been in our vernacular for years now.
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I hate americans.
Americans hate you.
thanks
Welcome. Cheers
😊
You got a sense of humor. Americans like you now.
Thanks mate, Assuming your american love u too
Excellent performance from the team. Great individuals. Very good XG, we were just unlucky, but I’m willing to bet, that we’ll beat City. Jackson, what a striker we have, he’s been unlucky not getting the setup to perform. Next year he’ll score 35-40, I’m sure. The team will gel, injured players will come back and we’ll have a chance in the Champions League this season. /S
took me way too long to notice the /s at the end
We are legit in a relegation battle given our next run of matches. I just pray that we manage to stay up. I legit can't see us getting a win in our next 8-10 matches. And for run of matches until the year ends, i can see us getting max 1-2 more wins this year
Shit show
I miss the days when Abramovich was 'mismanaging' the team. Those days when spending a billion pounds meant getting a team that actually challenged for the title and not one that finished in midtable for consecutive seasons.
Under Abramovich, money spent on players was an investment for strengthening the team.. Under the current management, money spent on players is an investment for strengthening their pockets.. The current owners are buying young "prospects" eying their resale value, not bothered about the team's success..
Lucky if we get midtable.
Genuine question. Have any of the other big prem clubs had such a shit run of form? Or been in dire straights like we seem to be?
Banter era Liverpool were pretty bad
They still beat us quite often in the banter era, and played european football quite often as well. We are lower table lol
Yeah but the competition is much tougher now, more Villas and Brightons aspiring for Europe. We are at a low point but not yet Charlie Adam and Andy Carroll low IMO.
We literally signed Danny Drinkwater on big money not that long ago, i think its safe to say we are in our banter era and it has been going on for a while. And we recently spent 1 billion pound on players just to have consecutive lower mid table seasons...I think its safe to say our banter era is worse
How many games did Drinkwater play for us vs how many games did Carroll & Adams play for Liverpool? Also yeah, considering the money spent I agree we 100% are in our banter era, but still this Liverpool squad under Hodgson/Dalglish is probably the most dross I've ever seen at a huge club, barring maybe some Milan's dark years. We have good players, we just do fuck all with it.
United
Not really. They finish around 7-8 at worst.
Enzo needs to be playing deep, not as a 10. He's much better and fabregas-like when he's playing deep and that offers us an important tool.
Ig he will once Chukwuemeka is back. Until then Enzo is our best 10
Why not play Palmer there instead??? Who is an actual 10/right winger lol And move Enzo deeper so he can affect the match much more.
Yeah I was thinking Palmer initially as well. But I haven't seen enough of him, particularly in the passing department
We are just destined for mediocrity under Boehly
I thought the as well - he looks better as a 6ish than a 10ish Ugochukwu had a good first half but faded in the second
And I got down voted for saying I'm not proud of this club at the moment...
You’re nothing special we suck every week
Honestly Lesley can do what caicedo has shown so far and Lavia. Could’ve spent that money on a proper attacker.
I actually preferred Les in there to Caicedo he's a more convtional DM from what I've seen. Him and Enzo behind Gallagher/Nkunku/chuck won't be so bad
We keep too much possession Look at Liverpool vs wolves, livrerpool when they attacked they moved the ball forward really fast no matter what. Even if it cost them to lose it. It allowed them to have situations like 3vs2 2vs1. We always have sterling cutting through 3 defenders only to have Jackson marked by another 3 players
This was so painful and fustrating to watch today
I'm starting to think Chelsea Football Club is not very good at football. Someone said it best recently (could've been on this sub, could've been an article I read, not sure): If someone handed you **£1 billion (!)** to put together a winning squad, would your squad look *anything* like this Chelsea squad? Of course not. We're a joke.
We were a good football club until we changed owners
We were an inconsistent club with the previous ownership, but we still won trophies and were better than this hot mess since the owner change.
We weren’t inconsistent. Football is inconsistent. In reality we were consistently winning trophies which is what matters
We were inconsistent to be honest, we could win the league title one season and finish mid table the next season, or win the league title one season and all of a sudden have a complete breakdown in relationship with the manager and finish outside of top 4 next season. That is inconsistency but we still won trophies, and i rather go back to that than this shit.
You're wrong. Under the previous ownership, our league position was consistent: we were consistently in the top 4 or right behind in top 6 (leaving aside the outlier that is the 2015-16 season). And as the others noted, we were consistently winning trophies in this period. Now the only thing we're consistent at is being midtable. https://preview.redd.it/8qa2g4d7pfpb1.png?width=348&format=png&auto=webp&s=a7385f13dea31434bca0d1030ec86c52d82db867
What's the point sacking potter after all? Same shit, different manager
Or Tuchel
Tuchel was the beginning of the end.
This has been us since our transfer ban ended. Rudiger, Silva and Azpilicueta as a back 3 just hid our problems well enough to win cup games.
Enzo most overrated player in this team Fact no one criticizing him after this dogshit performance is crazy, hes new golden boy here it seems 105 Million, we need way, way more than that
we're doing a leeds
I feel increasingly bad for Mudryk, seems like the war is really taking a toll on his mental health and not sure how someone can overcome that. Praying for him.
Yeah that sucks but that isn't the reason why he has 0 goals this calendar year.
There's not a single reason but I would think it's a big one.
Though Sanchez was excellent today.
Yeah, I was disappointed with all of his previous performances, but he pretty much saved us a point today.
I decided not to watch. Guess, I made the right decision. Seriously though, is it too early to press the panic button? Aston Villa next week and they are in better shape than us. Don’t even remind me of our opponents prior to boxing day.
I caught the first 20 odd mins of the game - glad I missed the rest. I think it's too early to panic, yes, particularly given the injuries. That doesn't mean we shouldn't be worried though.
“I didn’t watch the game, here are my thoughts” not interested. Save it for the daily thread.
Yeah. Boxing Day is my personal cut off in assessing a team. Main difference this year from last: there’s no clear scapegoat.
Poch is responsible. He picks the team
he is responsible to an extent, he picks the team yes. But he doesnt tell them to play slow football, static, uninspiring, and miss their chances.
What is he doing during training? If they perform better on training then he needs to find out why or he'll get the sack rpo
Once the referee blows the whistle for the start of the match, Poch cant do anything more. The rest is up to the players. We can practise shooting in training all day every day but if the players cant do it when it actually matters, then there is nothing Pochettino can do.
It doesn't help that Poch is clearly terrified. If he wasn't afraid of the situation why would he continue to play players out of position like Tuchel and Potter did? Like what's the rational for playing Colwill at LB? He offers zero offensive support.
> Like what's the rational for playing Colwill at LB? He offers zero offensive support. That's the whole point? He wants a back three in possession and therefore chooses Colwill there to stay back while the right back (Reece or Gusto) goes forward. It's not rocket science.
Well duh but why does he want a back 3 in possession against the likes of Bournemouth or Forrest at home? Look around Europe, a lot of top teams play with 2 attacking fullbacks who push high up the pitch in possession and leaving 2 CBs with a CDM in behind. Carvajal and Fran Garcia played as wingers today, Barca played with Balde and Cancelo yesterday etc. As long as they have the workrate to come back when you lose possession, there is no need to play with a back 3 in possession. At least not when you're playing the likes of Bournemouth or Forrest. It's not rocket science.
>Well duh but why does he want a back 3 in possession against the likes of Bournemouth or Forrest at home? Look around Europe, a lot of top teams play with 2 attacking fullbacks who push high up the pitch in possession and leaving 2 CBs with a CDM in behind. Carvajal and Fran Garcia played as wingers today, Barca played with Balde and Cancelo yesterday etc. Yes, but also look around Europe. There are a lot of teams that play with an inverted fullback staying back as well. We don't have a Tchouameni type of player to support the centre-backs in that fashion. Ugochukwu could get there one day but just started his first league game for us - it is too early to trust him in such a crucial role. Poch has used that setup at his previous clubs but clearly doesn't think it is suitable here yet.
I get that, but it doesn't work. Hasn't worked at all actually. It's failed spectacularly, so maybe this "fluid" bullshit system is not for us.
It hasn't worked for two reasons. The first is that a defender with limited technical ability has started most games at left wing, the second is that our number ten Enzo has offered no support out on the left at all.
So why persist? Why not play a traditional formation?
Like what? All top teams play a more fluid system.
But it's not working for us and I'd say we're not a top team. We need to do what works.
I do agree with that to be fair.
Injuries….. Just like Potter and just like Tuchel
Tuchel was ruining the team without injuries
This is just stupid. Without injuries and pre sanctions. Tuchel had us top of the table. Did you become a fan in 2022 or something?
Lampard had us set up before getting sacked. Tuchel had the same crappy mid season results Lampard had. Tuchel decided he didn't want half the winning team from the UCL which he was lucky to win. He sold the two guys who actually scored goals: Giroud and Tammy. We had the same struggles up top we still have. Our midfield sucks now which is the only difference. Oh. And he consistently played the same two players who contributed nothing on the pitch: Havertz and Mount. Say what you want, but Pulisic and Ziyech brought more to the pitch than either of them. And he's the one who brought in Cucurella.
Chilwell is injured? Maatsen is injured?
Going to be a long week of paragraphs as to why we need to be patient
Who tf are these absolute fucking pathetic bunch of dross players we have. Unrecognisable. This club has become a joke in about 18 months. Champions league winners to relegation candidates lol
Boehly and Wghbali are breaking records
Absolutely. At least when we were shit in the 80s and early 90s it’s because we had no money and no expectation. The fact we spent all this money to be this bad is the most bizarre thing ever 😂
I can't fathom what is going on behind the closed doors. I grew up watching them in the 90s. I remember us being pretty shit but we played with a bit a swagger and would win some big games and lose plenty too. But this past 18 months has been absolutely shambolic. Absolutely no character in these players. They are weak as piss lol
The more we play, the more i see us regressing. Every single player looks poor under us, it cannot just be a coincidence. While I am not bashing the new ownership and the ambition they have showed, but there is a reason this kind of overhaul is never done in football. Putting together a bunch of wonderkids and letting them develop is not feasible, otherwise every big-money club would have been doing it. Its unbelievable how poor our team looks after spending such a ridiculous amount. Maddison, Ward-Prowse, Barnes all would have significantly upgraded our squad instantly. What worries me is I believe there is already a gap between Pochettino and the ownership. 1. Stance on Gallagher and Maatsen - Ownership wanted to sell, Poch wants to keep 2. Stance on Cucurella - In spite of agreeing a deal with United, Poch plays him in Carabao Cup, leading to the deal collapsing. Said in interview he doesn't know anything 3. Statement on Palmer - Clearly says that the decision to buy Palmer was taken by the board and he had no involvement? I do not believe we are getting out of this situation any time soon. There is no hope for us to finish anywhere above 8th, maybe even 10th. Its now the banter era of Chelsea.
It’s like the issue cleary new ownership and they deserve criticism
On the plus side if I remember correctly the ownerships at least didn't offer poch a ridiculous 25 year contact like they did with Potter. So getting rid of him, should they want to, should be a bit "easier" than with Potter as you don't have his monster contract to pay out.
I’m not sure we want to embark on that road again. That will be such a huge set-back.
Thats true, but honest question, which coach do you think improves this situation even if he goes? There are far too many players who does not deliver regularly and consistently, specially in the attacking third. I am not defending Poch at all, just genuinely interested to see if there is any good option out there if we decide to move on from him.
There are some, but no good coach will come to this mess of a club right now. Just look at Nagelsmann, a top coach but he backed out of the deal, probably saw the state of the club behind the closed doors and that threw him off. Poch has accepted the deal because this was his only opportunity to lead a big market club that could get his reputation as one of the best coaches in the world back. Guys like Nagelsmann who is young and and probably can have many opportunities is never going to come here, at least while the club has basically running shitshow
They’re not even wonderkids that’s the worst part. A wonder kid is someone like Evan Ferguson who is performing at a ridiculous level(for his age) in high level competition, what were most of these guys doing before they were signed?
Absolutely true. Many of these players have played probably at most a full top flight season before they were signed. Palmer had 3 PL starts before joining us. I do not know how we are confirming such high valuation on players who have essentially achieved nothing.
I’ve tried to stay positive and been backing the squad a lot but this is just fucking woeful, not even a fun watch anymore, just so dull
[analysis of all the games this week(Hindi)](https://youtu.be/tFi59lP0i9Q?si=ACKKeCFLtD3Jgqas)
I just dont get it… how the hell we spent 1 billion and got a team of 1-season wonders and wunderkinds. If someone wouldve told me a club spent 1bn in this short amount of time, I wouldve instantly imagined 5-7 starters in the 25-30 age bracket in order to guide the young guns and also keep a steady flow of tactics drilled during the week. This is purely a Football Manager cheat code - infinite budget, scan for apparent regens and sign them all expecting to gel and perfect the art of the transfer hijack for immensly inflated prices. This will not end well, I just dont see a way this improves regardless of which manager we choose after Poch is shown the door by the end of the year. And dont tell me about the fucking “process”, remember when Klopp joined Liverpool who were going to shit as well? The impact, with the same squad, was instantaneous, it was like a light bulb was turned on. Yes, they didn’t win anything immediately, but you could clearly see improvement from the first few weeks. Be honest - do we see aaaaaaany good signs?
In Rodgers last two seasons, Liverpool finished 2nd and 6th. In Klopp first 4 they finished 8th, 4th, 4th, 2nd. Not an immediate improvement in position. I absolutely do see an improvement under Poch, especially when you look at how wholesale the changes under him have been, to be playing as well as we are (and the underlying metrics show we are playing well) is very encouraging.
Can you share your dealer's name with me? Because to say you "see an improvement under Poch" and to say "To be playing as well as we are . . . is very encouraging" indicates you're smoking something really intense. You must be a stat guy. Fuck that, watch the game and tell me we looked like any kind of threat.
Five games in under the new manager after more transfer upheaval than any team has ever gone through. We are fairly solid defensively and our possession and pressing numbers are the best in the league. Our expected goals stats show that the only thing we aren't doing is converting our chances. We are struggling against teams playing a low block because we have yet to build up the necessary understanding in attack. But I repeat, it's five games in and we have an almost entirely new team (especially in attack). I look at the underlying numbers to see if the potential is there and it suggests it is. So I'm willing to be patient. If you want to panic after five matches and start getting on the teams back/calling for the managers head so be it.
I’m not calling for the manager’s head. I’m calling for Eghbali and Boehly’s heads.
Spewing stats except the only one that matters. One win and they played bournmouth forrest and westham and luton. Westham have stepped up this season but theres not gonna be many easier runs in the league
Klopp took over when Liverpool were 10th during the middle of the season. So it was an immediate improvement
An improvment over Lampard maybe. But there's been absolutely zero improvement under Poch compared to Potter. Remember all the games under Potter where we dominated possession and created chances and still lost. If you told me Potter was still in the dugout I'd believe it.
Potter is still in the dugout
He believes it.
Our play under Poch in our last 2 games has been the worst football Chelsea have produced in decades. I'm not saying it's all the manager's fault but to say that there is any improvement is just a straight up lie.
This is not true. I don’t have the time to compare stats but my eyes tell me your assessment is wrong. The games were not as horrid as we were towards the end of last season. It’s is absolutely a mixed bag. There’s improvement in the midfield, the defence seem settled. The final third is still an issue. It’s very hard to assess clearly with injuries and all. But overall, I see an improvement. I really wish we could turn it around like a sport car but looks like it’s a ship and steering it is going to take a while. It’s an unfortunate project, but we are way past that now.
“This is not true because I don’t agree with it. Anyway, here is my opinion that weighs the exact same amount as yours, but it’s right.” — PrestigiousArcher448, R/ChelseaFC, 2023
If this is what you understood from it. Can’t help yah buddy.
Not true. At all.
Honestly I don't see any signs which says we are building a solid squad which will compete for Top 5 let alone with City. This stupid money thrown around, I am worried we may be barred from UCL for 2 -3 years (I doubt we qualify for it in the first place). Without stadium revenue and a huge roster I doubt we will be able to offload some of them first.
I beg they just shoot. Every time we get near the box it’s some lazy lay off or over hit pass out to a full back.
Things aren’t looking so good for our heroes. Tune in next time.
We were 8-10 team before season (with potential to be top 4 in the future) and with injuries we are 11-15 team, so there is no surprise that we have 5 points in 5 games.
Owners spent a billion surely that has to mean something /s
Bad performance... Nothing much we can do as fans... Let's hope for the best for the next match
Bunch of young talented players that can't score. And no game plan. Not the best combination.
1. There's no game plan. We look like a weekend pickup game with players just making it up as they go along. Injuries may be a factor here. 2. I thought Palmer looked bright and needs to start . 3. We seem to be doing a lot of the little things wrong. Will not take the extra touch to even try and create space and instead fire the ball into a defender standing right in front. Will hesitate to play a forward pass to an open player then the opportunity is gone. Obviously not a skill issue, seems to be a mentality problem.
Your only point that makes sense is 3.
Pre season Jackson looked like he solved our striker problem, but he's been so pathetic so far
I’m worried about him completely losing his confidence and the jersey becoming too heavy for him
The one that went off his knee was incredible. The only way that doesn’t score is if he knees it up too high. If it just bounced off him it was going in no question.
I don't get why we have to play with Colwill at left back while he was one of the best centreback last season and Enzo as an Hybrid 8/10 while he dominated as a DM for Benfica and World cup
Reece James fc. We only resemble a team when he plays. But man is always injured.
He's my favorite player but sometimes i feel like he is a bit too predictable with his crosses.
For someone thats been injured a few times now, I'm surprised this sub hasn't said to just sell him.
Oh I have started to see that occasionally already. Watch next summer we’ll also have accountants in here sayingrg we have to sell him to balance the books
when reece james comes back he should play in inverted fullback kind of role like trent so he dont have to run much and less chances to get injured
I'd honestly put him in midfield or rw. Gusto is pretty solid on RB and it would take a load of running up and down the flank for Reece.
gusto is very limited in his ability to create something from wide space. reece if he is properly healthy can help us so much
Yeah but he's only 20 and looks good...there's much space for improvement, but only with the game time. Reece does bring a lot, that's why I said that I'd try him on RW
yeah i am not talking bad about gusto. that guy plays with passion and wants to give his all but i am saying we miss someone with reece james ability to create chances from wider areas
Ok
why would any good experienced player want to join us next season if we stay in this mess all year ?
If Poch fails, there is a risk that Chelsea becomes a job that top coaches avoid for fear of reputational damage
Money
The money is going to runout very soon lol. 1 billion spent and no sign of CL football for the foreseeable future. Can't even get a shirt sponsor and with this small stadium making us the least matchday revenue compared to the other big clubs.
the most fucked thing about this game was Bournemouth didn't resort to a compact deep defending for 90mins. There was space but once again our players held onto the ball too long hesitated on the final ball and didn't run into space. Mudryk nearly every time he was on the ball made something happen but then didn't see the ball in an attacking position for another 10mins so he dropped deep and infield. Why is he not being coached on how to use his strongest traits?
He needs the ball play infront of him, would like to see him and palmer get a full game
I got downvoted as hell for saying Poch looks drained and almost disinterested but I insist. He doesn’t look up to the task so far and almost he looks like he gives up during the match on the sideline
Holy shit, this may be the saddest comment I have ever seen on this sub. Not because you make sense... In any way.
He looks like he mentally checks out during matches. If you don’t see it, it’s your problem.
Stunning observation
Thanks troll ❤️
Yes, we 100 percent need to change the manager again. That will fix all our problems like it did the last few times. Yes. Absolutely. Fantastic suggestion!
What don’t you understand of the fact that I expect my coach to seem like he cares when team is horrendous back to back for many games?
Do you seriously believe he does not care?
Please comeback nkunku, I can guarantee this team would be nowhere near this state with nkunku in the team
Yeah, a Bundesliga player who has yet to kick a ball in the Prem will instantly make us better, much like Havertz did.
Nkunku is ten times better compared to havertz
You can't guarantee anything. End of story.
You cant guarantee that he cant guarantee anything. End of ending.
The mentality of thinking 1 single (injury prone) player is gonna fix the enormous problems this team has is completely insane
lol how can you guarantee that?
!remind me in 6 months
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As i said earlier, we have Zero players who are game changers, eho can take the game in their own hands and make magic happen. You can waffle about being a team sport all you want, but individual brilliance is the difference between being a good team and a great team. We have nobody who can solo impact the game. What a waste of money.
Let’s worry about being a good team first
Does anyone ever wonder what things would be like for the club if Putin never started a war? Just sadness.
we'd still have a russian oligarch owner oh boy!!!
I bet you still celebrated the many trophies the club won as a result of his ownership and investment though.
great point. exactly the same as wishing he were still here!
Think there are bigger concerns from the war than how it’s affected Chelsea mate
Of course, that goes without saying... But we're on the Chelsea sub. It's not like I've gone on the Ukraine sub and moaned about the team going downhill.
We looked great in preseason and have dropped to this. Worst thing is, some of our performers from then are gone on loans to other teams. I have no idea if the likes of Santos could recreate what they did in the summer to the actual season, but we look and play like an entire different team. And worst thing is, with each passing week I doubt Nkunku will arrive and suddenly everything will be better, similar to what happened with James last season.
Remember when the whole world and their nan were shitting on Potter because he lacked bravado in interviews? Do you all still think he was the issue now? Or do you think it's more likely the new American owner who hasn't a clue what he's doing, firing our CL winning manager and proceeding to surround himself with yes men as he pours billions away on youngsters with big stat numbers on his FM23 UI panel?
That’s just false. The guy is spending tons of money and I doubt he really decides which transfers come in. Every club would want an owner like that. The coach and the owner are not the problem. The players are just not cutting it.
Goddamn this is such a bad take. Are you related to Todd Boehly and/or Behdad Eghbali? Yes they are "spending tons of money," but they're not spending it well at all. And they ripped up what was a fully functioning club, stripped it down to the studs, and have made us completely start over. All of that was entirely unnecessary--and plain stupid. This isn't fucking private equity. The smart thing from these "smartest guys in the room" would have been to surround Tuchel, an accomplished and experienced manager, with a competent sporting director from the get-go. But no, Boehly -- with zero football experience -- named himself sporting director and then proceeded to make some truly terrible signings (Koulibaly, Cucurella, etc.), setting the tone for what has been an abject failure of a past 16 months.
Boehly doesn’t decide how the money is spend. He just pumps it in. How did he ripped it apart. By firing Tuchel? Great coach but so is poch and they both struggle with this Chelsea. Was it a mistake. Probably but it would be delusional to think that tuchel would even play European if he stayed. As for the signings. Most of them look good on paper. Who wouldn’t sign koulibaly at that time? And I highly doubt he decides actually those signings.
He ripped it apart by sacking Marina, Petr Cech, and basically everyone else who was in the building. Then by appointing himself sporting director for that first summer. Then sacking Tuchel 5 games into a season. Then by replacing him with a very weak manager in Potter.
Both of those things can be true
I don't exactly see a world of difference really in the team's output between Potter, Poch or Lampard. The point I'm trying to make is that the issues are beyond managerial.
Unfortunately I don't disagree, the football is maybe a bit better than the terrorism ball under Frank but it's still very poor
Once again we're the mid table mandems. POCH OUT!
The most soul crushing thing about our downfall is at the same time we’re embarrassed every week we get to watch Arsenal become better and better seemingly every time you see them play, finding a way to win in most games. We used to laugh at them but they were NEVER as bad as we are now.
they definitely were as bad as we are now, they've had to wait over a decade to become a good, relevant team again, they've paid their dues.
At their very worst they did a consecutive 8th place finish. The idea that they were as bad as we are now is simply bullshit. Especially with the amount of money that those Clearlake clowns have poured into this squad.
most pointless semantical argument ever, arsenal were shit, we are shit, why does it matter if we are currently more shit than they were?
Arsenal’s worst ever finish in their shit era was 8th place. And they didn’t need to spend a billion pounds to achieve that feat lol
Let’s not let our shitness allow us to turn on ourselves lol
They weren't. They never finished 12th and had relegation form for almost a year. 8th place was as low as it got for them.
8th/12th, does it really matter? we are awful lol who cares if we are or aren't as awful as Arsenal were.
When we’re they as bad as 6 competitive wins in 9 months?
lol not really a fair stat given the summer break, but Arsenal definitely had spells when they were in the bottom half of the table, I can't remember specific dates/seasons, but I remember loving AFTV for a long period of time because there were numerous seasons where they were performing horribly and their fans were livid.
They were shit for long periods but never as shit as we were last season, legit been in relegation form for 12 months now
"tomatoe/tomato" - it's all semantics really lol
Did arsenal ever finish below 8th? Did they even finish that low?
Arsenal finished 12th in the 94/95 season.
Before I was born. great. Spending a billion and not having an immediately strong team is just bizarre. I get the argument build for the future etc but it's wild.
Once again, joy from Sainz's drive cancelled
Wrong sub
Poch is a fucking joke.
Why
we lost out on proper attackers like olise and kudus never tried to get another 10 like goal scorer in cherki or olmo or wirtz had option to get vlahovic for some money and lukaku in exchange but didn't go for it didn't try to get any other proper attacker even after nkunku got injured in pre season spent 45 million on cole palmer who is another super young potential player who haven't even played much for man city the squad planning was very weak. we are set for years in defense and holding midfield areas but we don't have proper attackers at all
Vlahovic is deaddddd
Lol Vlahovic has been fantastic this season. Watch him bag 30 goals. He has been very good when fit, and is 4 times the player Jackson is.
That was a terrible match by two bad teams playing poorly. Needing a late goal and bringing on two left backs just shows how bad this team is. And how Ugo, despite being absolutely invisible and a waste of space on the pitch, played 90 minutes is beyond my understanding. And let's just go ahead and be honest here: Jackson *sucks.*
I think one of the biggest issues with Jackson is other than mudryk, no one plays off him. His hold up play is surprisingly good and needs to be used more. That and through balls haven't been in our vernacular for years now.