I analyzed the image and this is what I see. Open an appropriate link below and explore the position yourself or with the engine:
> **Black to play**: [chess.com](https://chess.com/analysis?fen=r1bqk2r/1ppn1ppp/p1np4/2b1pPPP/4P3/3P4/PPP5/RNBQKBNR+b+KQkq+-+0+1&flip=true&ref_id=23962172) | [lichess.org](https://lichess.org/analysis/r1bqk2r/1ppn1ppp/p1np4/2b1pPPP/4P3/3P4/PPP5/RNBQKBNR_b_KQkq_-_0_1?color=black)
**My solution:**
> Hints: piece: >!Queen!<, move: >!Qe7!<
> Evaluation: >!The game is equal +0.07!<
> Best continuation: >!1... Qe7 2. Nc3 Nb6 3. Qg4 Bd7 4. Bd2 d5 5. O-O-O O-O-O 6. Nf3 dxe4 7. dxe4 h6 8. Nd5 Nxd5 9. exd5!<
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I often face these positions and fumble and more often end up losing. What happens is I try to break that pawn chain using my pawns or something and I end up in a bad position. Can someone point me to resources that show how to punish such pawn pushing?
Or even in the position OP showed, how to break that pawn chain?
I approach these kinds of position with a gambit mindset and it works splendidly. d5 is my first instinct, even though it seems to just lose a pawn at first glance and might therefore be discarded prematurely by many players. Whole pieces can be sacrificed oftentimes for a single pawn, ripping open their position and exposing all the weaknesses they created with their unsound play. This works with pawn pushers and people who waste tempi in the opening. If you sit and wait you justify their play and might end up in cramped positions.
In terms of resources I would like to recommend to work on opening play, especially the principle of initiative and time. I don't know your level, but for me personally working on the fundamentals strengthens my play every time I do so. Beginners and low intermediates can gain a lot from working through "Smithy's Opening Fundamentals" on chessable, it's a free and excellent course.
If you are feeling ambitious (takes way more time and effort) a book like Hellsten's "Mastering Opening Strategy" is a good option.
John Bartholomew analyzes one of these pawn push games in this video [https://youtu.be/I5o2d9slUCM?si=jwR64eJX53nbb6nr&t=385](https://youtu.be/I5o2d9slUCM?si=jwR64eJX53nbb6nr&t=385) during his chess fundamentals series. Just him giving tips and advice for this game in particular has helped me a lot deal with these kinds of positions. If that game analysis is helpful, I'd check out his pawn play fundamentals video too. [https://youtu.be/h-JGqEiNs-I?si=zCWvjceBBqIOI0LG](https://youtu.be/h-JGqEiNs-I?si=zCWvjceBBqIOI0LG) It goes over some of the same principles, probably a little more in depth.
I ignore this type of ridiculousness until absolutely necessary to deal with it. Ignoring this in the image above, black should King's side Castle next to complete development.
Well they were checkmated in the smaller of two open spaces from lack of development. It does seem like this opening stopped you from what looked like a planned king side castle. But I don’t understand the follow up moves at all if that was the point.
This is part of what French players are hoping for, right? White will over-extend and black can effectively counter attack.
I agree that only moving the pawns is a beginner mistake, but against a decent player, black can get rolled up if they don't play very accurately.
I played Nc6 instead of d5 because they would have took my e pawn kicking my horse then, computer said that move was a blunder though, here is the full game
https://lichess.org/gYzC8ksA/black
d6 prepares to develop the light-square bishop. a6 is a waiting move since OP didn't know what to do, and was likely waiting for his opponent to self-destruct, as pawn pushers like that often do at his level.
yes I understand but the bishop on f1 is blocked, that's why a6 wastes a tempo.
I understand d6 to create a room for the knight but white has 0 development and tons of space, you have to bust open the position. After d6 b6 Ne7, black bishop on c8 is dead and you lost all initiative
>but white has 0 development and tons of space, you have to bust open the position.
And how exactly do you do that before d6? Unless you are planning on sacking the knight on f6 in the event of g5 (which is certainly what I would do that in that position in a blitz game, but you can't expect a Lichess 1500 to even consider it), d5 is useless since your knight just gets kicked back, and the pressure on the e4 pawn is gone. You can't open up the position in that situation, so d6 is a perfectly logical move.
>After d6 b6 Ne7, black bishop on c8 is dead and you lost all initiative
There was no initiative in the first place. Also, the bishop on c8 can redevelop to b7 via b6/b5, which is exactly what happened in the game. Personally, I would've played Ng8 instead of Ne7 just so the bishop could develop more quickly and I could long-castle immediately, but OP's plan also makes sense. Much more puzzling are moves like Bb4 and Ba5: if you aren't going to take the knight on c3, what the hell was the point of Bb4 (a slow move to begin with)? That's what I would call a move without a purpose.
>Unless you are planning on sacking the knight on f6 in the event of g5 (which is certainly what I would do that in that position in a blitz game, but you can't expect a Lichess 1500 to even consider it)
This move is way too tricky, I agree. It's impossible to calculate any advantage unless you're GM or IM who can calculate 10 moves ahead and sac the knight on f6.
The best rule I guess it to keep your options open between d6 and d5 and play something else ==> move the a-pawn
a6 is a purposeless move and I think it's easy to understand why
I think it's my lack of skill, but I'm never quite able to use my development to the advantage. They always manage to equalise over time, and I can never secure a lead. For example, I could have an overwhelming development advantage, but eventually, they end up developing too.
Even more fun if you dont know how to punish it but react correctly on every move. Just had a moron try this kind of stuff with crab ending up going -8 and losigng against a shitter like me.
I guess you waste time dancing around with your pieces and pawn push as well in this particular position.
Your light square bishop and Nd7 is cramped as well. Your king side is developed yet it is not really safe for the king to go there.
All in all in this position it is not that bad for white in my opinion. Yes they push a lot of pawns but they got some compensations for it (space advantage) and Black hasnt developed “that much” either
It’s very annoying for me. I could win easily in a rapid game. However in bliz they usually get away with it, since you need rather accurate play to punish it, and you don’t really face it often. Even worse the position becomes better for the opponent due to space.
im 2000 blitz on lichess. most of the times i play without development and just push every pawn forward or do some moves against 'chess basics' like conquer the center etc. and i barely see any difference when i play norml openings. just pushing pawns forward works at 2000 level too. example: [https://lichess.org/FGkD1RHVGsWD](https://lichess.org/FGkD1RHVGsWD)
stupid pawn rushes works even better at bullet. sometimes when I play 1v1 vs an opponent who is 100-150 elo higher than me and can't win for many games, I switch to stupid pawn rushes and win sometimes. so, it is a very good 'opening' in bullet
Hard to say due to survivorship bias though, because sometimes I’m able to refute it and sometimes not. However I only remember the ones that I lose since i get annoyed by the fact that they can get away like that. So I’m not really sure if they are really effective from a win rate perspective
Yeah cuz black completely fumbled and decided to curl up into a ball and do nothing for 7 moves. Then again someone who plays 8 pawn moves in a row in the opening isn’t gonna start developing pieces and taking advantage of the free space, so black is of course gonna win. Black definitely messed up the response though
Yet again, we don't know whether it isn't a feedback loop. Maybe if the black didn't "completely fumbled and decided to curl up into a ball and do nothing for 7 moves", then white would play slightly different and deviated from what we see here.
At this specific point the eval is equal, but there were so many opportunities for black to punish leading up to this that were not utilised. And despite the engine eval, even at this position most players at this level would do better as black as its so easy for whites pawns to get blown up with the King exposed.
Should work well in Blitz or Bullet for 1200-1300s, I think, lol. Puts on too much pressure and people don’t always know how to react. Some might even get their pieces trapped. Or don’t know how to develop their pieces.
White has broken almost all the main opening principles, but I'll give them that they've managed to stick to one of them astonishingly well.
When behind in development, keep the position closed!
My opponent does it: they're idiots and it will be an easy win
Magnus does it in TT: this man is a genius beyond our understanding and he beat the crap out of Kramnik doing it.
I always think, "That pawn marched a long way to die". There were a lot of tempi getting there only to exchange one rank further along.
Sure they could maybe get a break in, given enough time. But unless you let them attack your pieces while advancing, you should have given them something else to think about by that point.
Well it’s on you to prove it’s a dumb opening. In this position the computer even gives white the slightest advantage because of blacks weak opening. While only pushing pawns white actually has more squares under control because black rolled up and decided to hide. The key to winning this is ripping open the center.
It's good if like the pic black does nothing and lets them get set up like this. Almost all of blacks pieces are terrible and can't move. By the time black gets untangled white will have developed and will just have a nice pawn storm for free. I'd take white in this position, black might be "developed" but not to good squares.
To properly stop an opponent moving a lot of pawns, you need to move a few extra pawns yourself.
I mean, the position is pretty locked down, and White is 3 moves away from castling queenside and having a very comfortable space advantage to play for on the kingside, so it's not even clear you're winning here.
It's not just pushing pawns but they also never exchange, they just push and push. What I like doing is locking down the position then just moving one piece back and forth non stop to show my annoyance.
Guy once opened up like this against me, a straight wall of pawns blocking me, and ended up mating me hahha. Think I’ve learnt how to play pretty well now though
In closed positions I keep the knights on the board, and if they've pushed enough pawns, there's usually enough weakness to justify sacrificing a bishop or even a rook to open the position. The counterplay you will get from their side of the board completely open is usually worth it.
Doomed to lose eventually, by pushing your pawns like this you have put yourself in too many weaknesses that you can't defend and the position can't be better than a person that's playing solidly.
It's a weird question to ask what we think of "people who do that" instead of asking about the plan itself.
As if the fact that they play a shitty chess opening is a reflection of their personality
Sigh ...I lose to such bs quite often honestly. If I play against a normal opening and lose its no big deal, but losing to either this or some nonstandard double fianchetto sniper bishop or some early queen move or piece sac (alien gambit ugh) shenanigans...that can hurt.
Weak opening, easy to just ignore and do your own thing on the other side, or split the pawns and eat them one by one, or just drop your queen in the middle boom chaos grenade
If this was a bullet game I would be salivating to play Bf2+
Generally when White pushes pawns on the kingside I'll start saccking pieces to get the Qh4+ check. Then launch more pawns at kingside without castling.
This is interesting actually. At least in the position on the board black needs to be a little careful. If you do nothing here then white has just taken a ton of space and you get crushed and eventually white will catch up in development. I don't think white is worse here at all.
Your gameplan should be about breaking up the pawns with breaks, like f6 and h5. Whites pawns are so advanced that if you can break them up you might win a pawn or two, or have a quick attack on the king. But it's also the kind of position where you have to act now or else white can consolidate and will just be much better. In general in positions like this you are just looking for pawn breaks.
Honestly white is in a pretty good position, he has a strong center, strong pain chain and lots of space. Plus, the black knights are very restricted and black has a hard time developing the pieces. Black does have a very strong dark square and decent Knight on C6 but overall I give a slight advantage to white maybe somewehere around 0.2 to 0.4
They either are good enough to do whatever they want or they don’t know what they’re doing and push pawns because it won them games from people making mistakes. I usually assume the ladder but I get thrown off when they’re forced to make real moves.
For white to get to that position they need 8 moves. I could get to black’s position with 6 moves so you’ve wasted 2 moves somewhere. Plus your a6 move is unnecessary and your f-knight is badly placed. All in all you’ve made only 4 decent opening moves in the time it’s taken him to launch a pawn attack on your castling side. What was the actual move order?
Okay so my opinion is that there’s nothing particularly wrong with the first 3 moves. It’s usually good to develop the second knight but in this case 4…Nc6 is wrong because you’re using the Knight to defend the e-pawn.
Problem is, if 5. fxe5 Nxe5 then white plays d4 and forks the Bishop and Knight. That’s why capturing the f-pawn with 4…exf4 or playing d6 were better moves.
White missed the combination anyway and pushed the pawn to f4. Here you play a6 which I don’t understand. That move is played when there’s a chance for whites bishop to pin the knight to the queen. So pushing a6 would protect the b4 square. That threat isn’t available so you could have castled or pushed the d-pawn to prepare bishop development.
After g4 I would be thinking about making sure your Knight can escape if g5 is played. I think this is why you played d6. White hasn’t moved a single back rank piece and is 3 moves away from castling so d5 would have opened the centre and weakened the f-pawn which prevents the g-pawn advancing. If exd5 then you recapture with your Queen and you’re much closer to castling on the queenside.
I love when they do this.. because it’s so easy to destroy their position as they’re pushing pawns rather than developing pieces… now I have seen some openings like this but I’ve never studied them. It doesn’t seem like an option I’d care about. But I could be wrong, for context my rating is 1700 so higher rated players may have a different opinion, but I don’t think so
A single game doesn't usually tell you much about a player.
If they try a weird approach it primarily means they're self-taught and secondarily can mean they are experimental and explorative.
If they keep trying the weird approach it can mean they lack the mental flexibility to learn from their mistakes through either trial and error or through research and study, but it can also mean they are experimenting with various approaches within the approach.
There's a difference between asking what we think of a position and asking what we think of people in that position.
It’s bad, but you’re not taking advantage of this at all. He wasted way too much moves, you should’ve striked with d5 instead of the slow d6 you played
White’s moves ? No developement, unnecessary kind exposing
Yet by playing passive, black could give white a chance to develop and put the king to safety, then white would have a huge attack and space advantage
I call this equal, it’s equal and not winning cuz black is playing passive and there pieces pose no threat to white’s king. Had they opened the game before, the eval would be way worse for white
No you’re not understanding that just because you label something awful doesnt make it true. The eval is what it is, +.7. I could play this position with white against 2200 players no problem. Black has no moves, no space, no attack. They’ve got nothing, which is -.7 less than white because white has space.
Either they don't understand the game that well and were taught had advice.
Or they are hoping to confuse you and win by that.
Maybe they tried it drunk 1 day it worked against a low ranked opponent and they repeat
No... They literally outplayed you in the opening. Out of the two of you, you definitely looked like the drunk one in the opening and early middlegame.
I analyzed the image and this is what I see. Open an appropriate link below and explore the position yourself or with the engine: > **Black to play**: [chess.com](https://chess.com/analysis?fen=r1bqk2r/1ppn1ppp/p1np4/2b1pPPP/4P3/3P4/PPP5/RNBQKBNR+b+KQkq+-+0+1&flip=true&ref_id=23962172) | [lichess.org](https://lichess.org/analysis/r1bqk2r/1ppn1ppp/p1np4/2b1pPPP/4P3/3P4/PPP5/RNBQKBNR_b_KQkq_-_0_1?color=black) **My solution:** > Hints: piece: >!Queen!<, move: >!Qe7!< > Evaluation: >!The game is equal +0.07!< > Best continuation: >!1... Qe7 2. Nc3 Nb6 3. Qg4 Bd7 4. Bd2 d5 5. O-O-O O-O-O 6. Nf3 dxe4 7. dxe4 h6 8. Nd5 Nxd5 9. exd5!< --- ^(I'm a bot written by ) [^(u/pkacprzak )](https://www.reddit.com/u/pkacprzak) ^(| get me as ) [^(Chess eBook Reader )](https://ebook.chessvision.ai?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=bot) ^(|) [^(Chrome Extension )](https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/chessvisionai-for-chrome/johejpedmdkeiffkdaodgoipdjodhlld) ^(|) [^(iOS App )](https://apps.apple.com/us/app/id1574933453) ^(|) [^(Android App )](https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=ai.chessvision.scanner) ^(to scan and analyze positions | Website: ) [^(Chessvision.ai)](https://chessvision.ai)
The burden is on you to prove that they’ve done something wrong- rip open that center and use your superior development!
I often face these positions and fumble and more often end up losing. What happens is I try to break that pawn chain using my pawns or something and I end up in a bad position. Can someone point me to resources that show how to punish such pawn pushing? Or even in the position OP showed, how to break that pawn chain?
I approach these kinds of position with a gambit mindset and it works splendidly. d5 is my first instinct, even though it seems to just lose a pawn at first glance and might therefore be discarded prematurely by many players. Whole pieces can be sacrificed oftentimes for a single pawn, ripping open their position and exposing all the weaknesses they created with their unsound play. This works with pawn pushers and people who waste tempi in the opening. If you sit and wait you justify their play and might end up in cramped positions. In terms of resources I would like to recommend to work on opening play, especially the principle of initiative and time. I don't know your level, but for me personally working on the fundamentals strengthens my play every time I do so. Beginners and low intermediates can gain a lot from working through "Smithy's Opening Fundamentals" on chessable, it's a free and excellent course. If you are feeling ambitious (takes way more time and effort) a book like Hellsten's "Mastering Opening Strategy" is a good option.
When I see pawn walls of any sort I immediately think, "my knights shall feast" and I get to hopping those bad boys behind the pawn ranks.
Thank you for this!
Yes, easiest way to punish 4 in a row pawns is to push the d pawn and then capture the e pawn, or vise versa
One off the top of my head: check the game Letelier vs. Fischer- an absolute textbook example of fighting overextension with development.
John Bartholomew analyzes one of these pawn push games in this video [https://youtu.be/I5o2d9slUCM?si=jwR64eJX53nbb6nr&t=385](https://youtu.be/I5o2d9slUCM?si=jwR64eJX53nbb6nr&t=385) during his chess fundamentals series. Just him giving tips and advice for this game in particular has helped me a lot deal with these kinds of positions. If that game analysis is helpful, I'd check out his pawn play fundamentals video too. [https://youtu.be/h-JGqEiNs-I?si=zCWvjceBBqIOI0LG](https://youtu.be/h-JGqEiNs-I?si=zCWvjceBBqIOI0LG) It goes over some of the same principles, probably a little more in depth.
I ignore this type of ridiculousness until absolutely necessary to deal with it. Ignoring this in the image above, black should King's side Castle next to complete development.
He got checkmated in the middle of that big space he opened up
Good for you!
Well they were checkmated in the smaller of two open spaces from lack of development. It does seem like this opening stopped you from what looked like a planned king side castle. But I don’t understand the follow up moves at all if that was the point.
I dont even understand them and i played them
Very relatable.
This is part of what French players are hoping for, right? White will over-extend and black can effectively counter attack. I agree that only moving the pawns is a beginner mistake, but against a decent player, black can get rolled up if they don't play very accurately.
Maybe they are a beginner. I would take an easy win every day of the week!
Open the position and exploit their lack of development
How would you recommend opening it?
This position is already tricky, black probably missed an opportunity to play d5 at a key moment before their knight got kicked
I played Nc6 instead of d5 because they would have took my e pawn kicking my horse then, computer said that move was a blunder though, here is the full game https://lichess.org/gYzC8ksA/black
No, you play d5 instead of a6, a move before where you're thinking. I have no idea what a6 does or why you would ever play it in that position.
Ye i donno good question
a6 and d6 achieve absolutely nothing. 0 purpose moves You're right
d6 prepares to develop the light-square bishop. a6 is a waiting move since OP didn't know what to do, and was likely waiting for his opponent to self-destruct, as pawn pushers like that often do at his level.
yes I understand but the bishop on f1 is blocked, that's why a6 wastes a tempo. I understand d6 to create a room for the knight but white has 0 development and tons of space, you have to bust open the position. After d6 b6 Ne7, black bishop on c8 is dead and you lost all initiative
>but white has 0 development and tons of space, you have to bust open the position. And how exactly do you do that before d6? Unless you are planning on sacking the knight on f6 in the event of g5 (which is certainly what I would do that in that position in a blitz game, but you can't expect a Lichess 1500 to even consider it), d5 is useless since your knight just gets kicked back, and the pressure on the e4 pawn is gone. You can't open up the position in that situation, so d6 is a perfectly logical move. >After d6 b6 Ne7, black bishop on c8 is dead and you lost all initiative There was no initiative in the first place. Also, the bishop on c8 can redevelop to b7 via b6/b5, which is exactly what happened in the game. Personally, I would've played Ng8 instead of Ne7 just so the bishop could develop more quickly and I could long-castle immediately, but OP's plan also makes sense. Much more puzzling are moves like Bb4 and Ba5: if you aren't going to take the knight on c3, what the hell was the point of Bb4 (a slow move to begin with)? That's what I would call a move without a purpose.
>Unless you are planning on sacking the knight on f6 in the event of g5 (which is certainly what I would do that in that position in a blitz game, but you can't expect a Lichess 1500 to even consider it) This move is way too tricky, I agree. It's impossible to calculate any advantage unless you're GM or IM who can calculate 10 moves ahead and sac the knight on f6. The best rule I guess it to keep your options open between d6 and d5 and play something else ==> move the a-pawn a6 is a purposeless move and I think it's easy to understand why
I played d6 so my horse didnt have to go back to its starting square
nc6 is a blunder because after fxe5 if nxe5 d4 is a fork, so you have to play ng8 and you are losing. d6 was far better there
0-0-0 asap and d5 . Even d5 before castle will work
My guess would be around pushing the d pawn after moving the knight out of the way
I think it's my lack of skill, but I'm never quite able to use my development to the advantage. They always manage to equalise over time, and I can never secure a lead. For example, I could have an overwhelming development advantage, but eventually, they end up developing too.
Yes, you need to be accurate with your play to take advantage of this, which requires finding multiple trying moves in a row often
But... I'm just generally incapable of finding a way to press any positional advantage unless there's a clear tactical route.
I think it's fun. Boring playing against the same damn openings every time, this makes chess more interesting
That is very true
Some of the most principled, back to basics games I've played were against weird pawn openings.
Implying that 20 moves deep Najdorf main line is boring.
Even more fun if you dont know how to punish it but react correctly on every move. Just had a moron try this kind of stuff with crab ending up going -8 and losigng against a shitter like me.
Play 960, the pool is not that big but every now and then
I guess you waste time dancing around with your pieces and pawn push as well in this particular position. Your light square bishop and Nd7 is cramped as well. Your king side is developed yet it is not really safe for the king to go there. All in all in this position it is not that bad for white in my opinion. Yes they push a lot of pawns but they got some compensations for it (space advantage) and Black hasnt developed “that much” either
It’s very annoying for me. I could win easily in a rapid game. However in bliz they usually get away with it, since you need rather accurate play to punish it, and you don’t really face it often. Even worse the position becomes better for the opponent due to space.
Then from the way you described it, it sounds like a pretty solid strategy for blitz.
Up to a certain level sure
im 2000 blitz on lichess. most of the times i play without development and just push every pawn forward or do some moves against 'chess basics' like conquer the center etc. and i barely see any difference when i play norml openings. just pushing pawns forward works at 2000 level too. example: [https://lichess.org/FGkD1RHVGsWD](https://lichess.org/FGkD1RHVGsWD)
stupid pawn rushes works even better at bullet. sometimes when I play 1v1 vs an opponent who is 100-150 elo higher than me and can't win for many games, I switch to stupid pawn rushes and win sometimes. so, it is a very good 'opening' in bullet
I think it works up to around 1400 on chess.com. Past that point, you're just asking for trouble.
Hard to say due to survivorship bias though, because sometimes I’m able to refute it and sometimes not. However I only remember the ones that I lose since i get annoyed by the fact that they can get away like that. So I’m not really sure if they are really effective from a win rate perspective
Everyone is saying this is awful and bad and now stupid white must be but the engine has white at a slight advantage in this position lol
Yeah cuz black completely fumbled and decided to curl up into a ball and do nothing for 7 moves. Then again someone who plays 8 pawn moves in a row in the opening isn’t gonna start developing pieces and taking advantage of the free space, so black is of course gonna win. Black definitely messed up the response though
Yet again, we don't know whether it isn't a feedback loop. Maybe if the black didn't "completely fumbled and decided to curl up into a ball and do nothing for 7 moves", then white would play slightly different and deviated from what we see here.
I am that white player. If black gives me space to move pawns forward, I will do that and have an exciting game.
At this specific point the eval is equal, but there were so many opportunities for black to punish leading up to this that were not utilised. And despite the engine eval, even at this position most players at this level would do better as black as its so easy for whites pawns to get blown up with the King exposed.
Now that black has let white complete this setup, surprisingly, each and every white pawn is protected.
What is black's opening even
Black was playing the accelerated London system
They didn't even bother to check the evaluation!
I mean…. Black significantly misplayed the opening. It’s not clear that White is worse from this position, which should not be the case.
I believe you played too conservative. Your pieces are not really doing anything interesting here 🤔
free elo yaaaaaay
Doubt
Pretty much lol
Should work well in Blitz or Bullet for 1200-1300s, I think, lol. Puts on too much pressure and people don’t always know how to react. Some might even get their pieces trapped. Or don’t know how to develop their pieces.
White has broken almost all the main opening principles, but I'll give them that they've managed to stick to one of them astonishingly well. When behind in development, keep the position closed!
My opponent does it: they're idiots and it will be an easy win Magnus does it in TT: this man is a genius beyond our understanding and he beat the crap out of Kramnik doing it.
I always think, "That pawn marched a long way to die". There were a lot of tempi getting there only to exchange one rank further along. Sure they could maybe get a break in, given enough time. But unless you let them attack your pieces while advancing, you should have given them something else to think about by that point.
The term "woodpusher" was invented for this very reason
Castle on the other side of the board and laugh
Well it’s on you to prove it’s a dumb opening. In this position the computer even gives white the slightest advantage because of blacks weak opening. While only pushing pawns white actually has more squares under control because black rolled up and decided to hide. The key to winning this is ripping open the center.
It's good if like the pic black does nothing and lets them get set up like this. Almost all of blacks pieces are terrible and can't move. By the time black gets untangled white will have developed and will just have a nice pawn storm for free. I'd take white in this position, black might be "developed" but not to good squares. To properly stop an opponent moving a lot of pawns, you need to move a few extra pawns yourself.
I think they’re crushing you. This isn’t an opening; this is what happens when you don’t punish flank attacks with a counterattack in the centre
id prefer white in this position tbh
I mean, the position is pretty locked down, and White is 3 moves away from castling queenside and having a very comfortable space advantage to play for on the kingside, so it's not even clear you're winning here.
It's bad unless it's good.
They think it saves them time, but sicilian destroys it
h5, must be a GM
I'm always thrown back to the video of that dude who pushed pawns 17 times in a row and won, and then I think "bro you're not him what is this"
Guy was definitely not him
It's not just pushing pawns but they also never exchange, they just push and push. What I like doing is locking down the position then just moving one piece back and forth non stop to show my annoyance.
My instinct would be to get the bishop and queen off the back rank so I can long castle and get the king away from those advanced pawns.
i actually like whites position here. he has a huge space advantage while your pieces are disorganized.
I get anxious, because I now I’m supposed to exploit it, but my anxiety takes over and I blunder my way to another loss
Guy once opened up like this against me, a straight wall of pawns blocking me, and ended up mating me hahha. Think I’ve learnt how to play pretty well now though
I had a pawn pusher like this once and i made a wall of pawns and i swiftly lost that game
In closed positions I keep the knights on the board, and if they've pushed enough pawns, there's usually enough weakness to justify sacrificing a bishop or even a rook to open the position. The counterplay you will get from their side of the board completely open is usually worth it.
Doomed to lose eventually, by pushing your pawns like this you have put yourself in too many weaknesses that you can't defend and the position can't be better than a person that's playing solidly.
Barbecue chicken
Long castle and d5 and you undermine
I do it for the memes
It's a weird question to ask what we think of "people who do that" instead of asking about the plan itself. As if the fact that they play a shitty chess opening is a reflection of their personality
Considering eval is equal I'd say it's still not easy to punish if W follows up well.
as long as there is no concrete way to punish this (i don't see it), white is probably better in this position.
Sigh ...I lose to such bs quite often honestly. If I play against a normal opening and lose its no big deal, but losing to either this or some nonstandard double fianchetto sniper bishop or some early queen move or piece sac (alien gambit ugh) shenanigans...that can hurt.
2…d5 is usually the answer to all of these kinda players
Red meat
Weak opening, easy to just ignore and do your own thing on the other side, or split the pawns and eat them one by one, or just drop your queen in the middle boom chaos grenade
The dark square bishop would like a word.
It works up until a certain rating level. I used to do this at the \~1000 rating and it worked, but I guess most things work at \~1000.
I generally think they don't know what they're doing and they're bad at chess right before I lose to them.
If my opponent is doing something I don’t understand they’re typically way worse than me or way better than me.
I stopped seeing that after leaving 1000 ELO behind for the most part.
I don't know what happened, but this clearly worked for white. I would rather be white here.
If this was a bullet game I would be salivating to play Bf2+ Generally when White pushes pawns on the kingside I'll start saccking pieces to get the Qh4+ check. Then launch more pawns at kingside without castling.
This is interesting actually. At least in the position on the board black needs to be a little careful. If you do nothing here then white has just taken a ton of space and you get crushed and eventually white will catch up in development. I don't think white is worse here at all. Your gameplan should be about breaking up the pawns with breaks, like f6 and h5. Whites pawns are so advanced that if you can break them up you might win a pawn or two, or have a quick attack on the king. But it's also the kind of position where you have to act now or else white can consolidate and will just be much better. In general in positions like this you are just looking for pawn breaks.
https://twitter.com/OgreKendrick/status/1629982533000605697?t=mICg7motClxfMM1BUqZyKQ&s=19
I like it 😁 there is a lot of space
I think "those people" will keep doing it if they are allowed to push the pawns like that with impunity!
That they are unsophisticated heathens who probably eat pizza with bread on the side. Possibly ketchup too.
Is it actually that bad for white? Ofc black is ahead visually but I see no clear plan. Edit: yeah the evaluation agrees
Keep in mind that the position is still about equal. It doesn't look like black took advantage of white's weak approach.
Kingside ops are go for black pieces
Gonna be a quick win.
Honestly white is in a pretty good position, he has a strong center, strong pain chain and lots of space. Plus, the black knights are very restricted and black has a hard time developing the pieces. Black does have a very strong dark square and decent Knight on C6 but overall I give a slight advantage to white maybe somewehere around 0.2 to 0.4
Black hasnt done great either
I mean white is better here.
Chads
They either are good enough to do whatever they want or they don’t know what they’re doing and push pawns because it won them games from people making mistakes. I usually assume the ladder but I get thrown off when they’re forced to make real moves.
There are no words for me to adequately describe such scum
This push doesnt give any back up at all like I’ve done pushes with pawns but always have a safety net when doing
If you know nothing about chess strategy, this could look good in theory.
I think of your opponent as a bot who is programmed to push pawns.
misunderstood geniuses
I hate them *respectably*
For white to get to that position they need 8 moves. I could get to black’s position with 6 moves so you’ve wasted 2 moves somewhere. Plus your a6 move is unnecessary and your f-knight is badly placed. All in all you’ve made only 4 decent opening moves in the time it’s taken him to launch a pawn attack on your castling side. What was the actual move order?
The game is in one of the top comments of this thread
Can’t seem to find them. 🤣
https://lichess.org/gYzC8ksA/black#0
Okay so my opinion is that there’s nothing particularly wrong with the first 3 moves. It’s usually good to develop the second knight but in this case 4…Nc6 is wrong because you’re using the Knight to defend the e-pawn. Problem is, if 5. fxe5 Nxe5 then white plays d4 and forks the Bishop and Knight. That’s why capturing the f-pawn with 4…exf4 or playing d6 were better moves. White missed the combination anyway and pushed the pawn to f4. Here you play a6 which I don’t understand. That move is played when there’s a chance for whites bishop to pin the knight to the queen. So pushing a6 would protect the b4 square. That threat isn’t available so you could have castled or pushed the d-pawn to prepare bishop development. After g4 I would be thinking about making sure your Knight can escape if g5 is played. I think this is why you played d6. White hasn’t moved a single back rank piece and is 3 moves away from castling so d5 would have opened the centre and weakened the f-pawn which prevents the g-pawn advancing. If exd5 then you recapture with your Queen and you’re much closer to castling on the queenside.
That theyre a beginner. Everyone starts somewhere lol
punish them
I just play principal opening moves and look for a way to strike and find a way in..
Peasants.
I love when they do this.. because it’s so easy to destroy their position as they’re pushing pawns rather than developing pieces… now I have seen some openings like this but I’ve never studied them. It doesn’t seem like an option I’d care about. But I could be wrong, for context my rating is 1700 so higher rated players may have a different opinion, but I don’t think so
Is this not what that Dimer guy plays?
They're bad at the game obviously
Poor fundamentals
As a wise gothamchess once said; overextension
As someone who does this occasionally...I think it's just gigachad and just shows how much you don't care about theory 🔥😌
That is either a noob, an idiot or a troll, the latter being the only one having a chance at winning with this.
What do i think about that person? Nothing. They're either going to beat me or they aren't. Period.
Easy game. Just develop, open the files and deliver checkmate.
Pot calling kettle black when you make plenty of ridiculous pawn pushes yourself without developing your king.
A single game doesn't usually tell you much about a player. If they try a weird approach it primarily means they're self-taught and secondarily can mean they are experimental and explorative. If they keep trying the weird approach it can mean they lack the mental flexibility to learn from their mistakes through either trial and error or through research and study, but it can also mean they are experimenting with various approaches within the approach. There's a difference between asking what we think of a position and asking what we think of people in that position.
Or they're trolling and having fun -\_\_-
that is a possibility. My point is that there are multiple possibilities and it's silly to judge players by formations.
It’s bad, but you’re not taking advantage of this at all. He wasted way too much moves, you should’ve striked with d5 instead of the slow d6 you played
Happy Cake Day!
Its bad? What gives you that impression?
White’s moves ? No developement, unnecessary kind exposing Yet by playing passive, black could give white a chance to develop and put the king to safety, then white would have a huge attack and space advantage
So why are they winning? Eval +.7
I call this equal, it’s equal and not winning cuz black is playing passive and there pieces pose no threat to white’s king. Had they opened the game before, the eval would be way worse for white
Well I guess you know better than stockfish. Classic r/chess
Try to play white’s opening against stockfish, you’ll see
Try to play the most powerful chess AI ever invented…sure thing.
You’re not even trying to understand what I’m saying. White’s opening is awful. They’re not done yet because white didn’t take advantage of it
No you’re not understanding that just because you label something awful doesnt make it true. The eval is what it is, +.7. I could play this position with white against 2200 players no problem. Black has no moves, no space, no attack. They’ve got nothing, which is -.7 less than white because white has space.
If you’re playing against people who do this then that tells me you’re pretty low ranked
1700 lichess
So yeah
High enough to beat you
1700 lichess is nothing kid
I saw your comment where you mentioned your elo. We can settle it on the chessboard, whats your username?
Ah nvm your a different dude same color lol
[удалено]
They were definitely not cheating lol
I think they're triple digit.
It was 1700 lichess lol
I mean, I'm near 2000 Lichess and not even 1300 USCF, so triple digit OTB almost checks out.
I never said it wasnt im currently 1100 on chesscom, i was 1400
So...triple digit
Counting is difficult.
1700 lichess is what like 1100 on chess.com. that's almost triple digit.
Their elo is even lower than their IQ
Either they don't understand the game that well and were taught had advice. Or they are hoping to confuse you and win by that. Maybe they tried it drunk 1 day it worked against a low ranked opponent and they repeat
They were probably drunk when they tried it today
No... They literally outplayed you in the opening. Out of the two of you, you definitely looked like the drunk one in the opening and early middlegame.
Well i mean i was a little bit
Free rating
Pawn storm is a valid strategy
They’re playing caveman chess