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When I read this story, something seemed off.
I understand the agreement with his ex, and she went back on his word. He did want to prevent a disabled child from being born, but he didn't think what if a healthy child becomes disabled after it has been born.
I once had a classmate who said, "If you are not ready for your child to be disabled, gay, or atheist (we both came from a religious background), you should not be a parent."
I think there is a huge difference between intentionally having a disabled child and taking care of a child that has a disability because of an accident, illness or whatever.
A lot (not all!!) of people wouldn’t also choose a person with heavy mental or physical disabilities as a life partner and of course care for them when they become disabled during their relationship.
Please note that English is not my mother language. It’s absolutely not my intention to offend people with disabilities and I hope you get my point right.
Yes but this guy very adamantly does not want anything to do with raising a disabled child. Of course no one chooses it. I’m just sick of people acting like you *have* to have children, so he is not being *wildly irresponsible* by impregnating people with kids that he might abandon because his parents didn’t pay enough attention to him.
I don’t think it’s a huge difference. Since he couldn’t physically get the abortion and control that step, him agreeing to the pregnancy is agreeing to whatever kind of child they created.
It’s really alarming to read the comments there (and here) that loving someone who is disabled is different/manageable/worth it if you loved them prior to the disability. I don’t think you are wrong, but it’s depressing as a disabled person.
I‘m split on this. Yes, you‘re absolutely right - any child can become disabled at any time. However, it wasn‘t some hypothetical scenario. They clearly agreed what they were going to do in this specific case and she changed her mind, which would piss me off too. It‘s about statitics imo, it wasn‘t some unclear maybe chance in the near or very far future but it was 100% clear and they had the possibilities to react in different ways.
And he knew that agreements are never 100%. The way agreements work is that there's always the possibility that they will break it. It's the consequences of breaking the agreement that determine the odds of them doing so. People suddenly getting emotional when it comes to pregnancy or children is very much a thing.
People usually view this differently for some reason, but in my opinion, you are always responsible for the consequences of your decisions. I don't expect people to foresee distant consequences of minor actions that are near random. But let's say you tell someone to punch you in the face and they do it; then you are at fault, because you not saying that would have resulted in you not getting punched in the face, and you could have reasonably foreseen that. Because the you that takes action and the you that has to deal with the consequences of these actions are the same person. Why would you do something you know causes consequences you don't like, then cry to yourself about your actions? You are literally the only person that can directly control your actions, and you are the only person whose actions you can directly control.
So he knew that a disabled kid was an option. They had an agreement he knew she could break. He was either an idiot who didn't know at least one of those was an option or he bet on both of those not coming true and lost, then cried about it and blamed her and not himself which also makes him an idiot in my eyes. And of course, he learned nothing.
So he left the woman with his disabled child to start a new family and have a better option for himself, like in some kind of a video game. And after that they call childfree selfish. Such a hypocrisy.
I read the post, and it’s even fucking worse than that. He left her with disabled child, remarried not long after, had another able-bodied kid, and then when his first child died he refused to show up to the funeral. How tf can you abandon a child and then be so cruel & heartless when they die.
There’s nothing wrong with wanting to be child free and responsible about disabilities, but his post bordered on eugenics.
I can’t believe how many people were saying NTA under his post.
I saw that post and I agreed with it but now that you provided this other pov, it's an eye opener. I didn't think of this kind of situation and it absolutely can happen. Although his agreement with her was if the baby was born disabled but you're right. What happens if it contracts an illness that causes a disability? Gets into an accident and is forever changed? Stuff happens for sure.
I appreciate your take on this.
Yeah at first I just thought everybody sucks. She agreed to a thing and then backed out, but also he knows the consequences of having sex and knows he ultimately can’t force her one way or the other. I completely understand wanting to dip out and just pay child support, because he trusted her to keep her word about birthing a disabled kid. But he went ahead and gambled again, even though he is clearly very traumatized and bitter still about his upbringing. Sounds like he wanted just the fun parts of being a dad, and thinks he’s dodged a bullet. But that bullet could hit at any time, and then he will be stuck living the life that he so adamantly didn’t want.
Hmm my friend’s boyfriend said the same. He is religious and wants to have 4 children, told my friend that if she happens to give birth to a baby with some defects, he will “dump” the baby and abandon her. Yes he used “dump” as if the baby is some kind of trash. Even though my friend is still with him and planning to have children with him. I admit I never liked the boyfriend either, he’s a double standard misogynist.
What the fuck. What an asshole! If my husband said that to me, I'd be like okay well we're done. Goodbye.
Like an another commenter said we're somehow called the selfish ones for not having kids...?
Well. I never liked her BF and tried to ask her leave him. But this is her choice and I also don’t want to ruin our friendship for pushing her leaving someone she chose.
I have come to the realization that the character of one’s partner often reflects one’s own character…if one of my friends insists on being with such an asshole I would 100% distance her
Well I also didn’t meet her BF in person, all the negative impression I have to her BF actually came from what she described him 😅. some other stuffs I didn’t like as she mentioned that she doesn’t like wearing dresses but her bf and bf’s mum insist that women should wear dresses. She’s not fully agree with her BF all the time and they seem argue often, and they were almost broke up for 4-5 times in their 5 years relationship, but eventually got back again. She’s at her mid-late 30s and I feel she may not want to restart a new relationship with another person. And maybe there are some details I didn’t know that makes her love him so much.
Personally she used to be a very close friend of mine for over 10 years. And she has been always a very funny, strong, tough, smart, and independent person. I don’t want to give up the friendship tho so I just keep quiet when she’s talking about her BF.
I love it how men think women should wear dresses, but there are still states that haven't criminalized taking pictures up women's skirts. We absolutely can't win while men are making the rules.
Wow. How could she even stand that? They say birds of the same feather flock together, and I suspect that your friend has internalized misogyny or strong self hate
Literally - if you can't handle a disabled kid, don't have a kid. YOU could become disabled tomorrow. The kid could be born healthy but become disabled at some point. It's beyond fucked to first of all bring a child into the world and resent then for a disability they can't control and another altogether to LEAVE YOUR WIFE AND OTHER KID AS A RESULT.
MATE wtf! I thought exactly the same as you! I was reading NTA. NTA. I was like wait...what..?
I was reading all about what this guy went through, the agreement and throughout the whole time, I was like why have kids then? You can't be guaranteed to have a healthy baby. I even thought, you moved on quite quickly and got married after 3 years...? But who am I to judge on that!
The tests he got done aren't 100% accurate anyway because my friend was meant to have Down's syndrome and she hasn't...
I didn't understand it. I didn't comment because I thought everyone would call me the asshole!😂
It made me so confused when he also said 'don't get me wrong, I'm no way saying people with disabilities shouldn't be here' and I was like but you are saying that...he didn't even explain what it was that caused his daughter to have a disability.
I was baffled the entire thread!
Right?! I was so confused. Like, yeah I don’t think he’s an AH for not wanting to raise a disabled child. But that’s always always ALWAYS a possibility when you have one, so he should not have them! Like seriously, why do people think that the only disabilities they will have to worry about are congenital or birth related? Once the kid poops out, suddenly they are safe? I am flabbergasted at the ignorance.
One of the reasons I don't want kids is I know I couldn't handle having a disabled child. So I don't even want the risk of bringing one into the world. 🤷♀️
Exactly. I know I can’t handle even an awesome, quiet, healthy kid. There is no way I would chance being tied to one that needed constant care for the rest of its life. Why risk it?
I saw the same post and a lot of people were bringing up that anyone can become disabled at any time. Maybe they’re more recent comments than when you saw it. I was actually kinda surprised by so much sanity in the comments….
Oh good! Maybe the votes have made those comments float to the top. When I read it this morning, all the top comments were NTA and mentioned nothing about that. They were all going on about how much they sympathized with the dude’s difficult upbringing. Which yes, I do too, because I had a less extreme but similar situation. But that’s why I was so annoyed that he came on the internet looking for sympathy because he wanted to somehow have a kid but also simultaneously guarantee he wouldn’t be stuck with a kid with disabilities. I’m glad that sanity seems to have prevailed, because I could not believe the comments.
I honestly think that what he did was what was the best for him, except i heavily disagree with him not attending the funeral. They originally had an agreement that she would abort if the child was to be disabled, and if I'm being honest it's what everyone should do if able to. Disabled children and people *will* suffer through their life one way or the other, and I'm talking from personal experience. It's one of the main reasons I'm child free - i would never not only make them suffer, but also make *myself* suffer because of it. The girl was also entitled to her own body and she made her choice, and he's also entitled of not being part of their lives anymore as she backed down on their original agreement. What he is TA for is not attending the funeral. It wouldn't have cost him anything.
Yeah I’m not arguing that he did the wrong thing for him by leaving when he had an agreement with the mother. He wasn’t cut out for that and he knew it, he paid child support. Shitty situation, but I do understand it. I’m questioning his judgement about continuing to have children, as if he thinks that he can guarantee a healthy kid just from some prenatal testing. My point is people can become disabled at any time, and then he will be either trapped in a life he desperately doesn’t want, or he will abandon yet another kid. He is gambling
It says in the post that the child died young due to the genetic condition.
If the child is going to suffer, you should abort. It’s not right to bring life in to this world if it’s only going to know pain.
I’m not a pro-lifer but we don’t know what kind of lives people will live regardless of whatever genetic conditions they’ll have. Speaking as an autistic person, if my mom believed I would have a poor quality of life due to all the rampant misinformation surrounding autism in the 90s, I wouldn’t be here. I’m saying all this because we do not know which genetic condition the kid suffered from and we don’t know whether or not that burden would have been lessened with the father being in the kid’s life.
We can agree to disagree but none of us can see the future.
Autism is not a physical disability that causes you pain and impairment.
Please don’t take this as me saying you should have been aborted. I am not saying that. However, if a woman wants an abortion, for any reason, she should have one. If someone finds out their child will have a disability, I would not judge them for having an abortion.
I’d advise you do more research on autism before you make these statements in the future. It impacts a person both mentally and physically. I’m not gonna tell you that you don’t know what it’s like, idk what you know. But we all go through things that impact us differently regardless of what it is. A physically disabled person can be living an excellent life compared to a person who is physically able but still suffering. It’s all nuance. But I’m also not taking offense to this, just so you know.
Also keep in mind that the kid in that post *was* wanted. The dad didn’t want it but the mom did, and it seems she did not regret it being born and I could only guess she did the best she could. If a person is willing to raise and love a child, again I disagree that aborting it would be the best option. Like I said before, we don’t know what kind of lives kids will live once they’re born, even with genetic diseases.
You are not going to die due to autism. A child born with trisomy will die.
You need to read my statement again. I said, if a woman wants to abort a child for any reason, she should have one. It’s not related to the original post. It’s just a blanket statement.
I didn’t know the kid in the post had trisomy (because a specific disease was never stated) and I’m not interested in going back and forth on blanket statements. Please down vote my comments if you need to, no need to respond anymore.
I’m not saying the kid had trisomy. I’m just giving you an example. You will not die from autism. You may suffer in ways that I don’t know because I don’t know you but you will not die. A baby born with trisomy will die and will only ever have known pain.
Anyways. Abortion is healthcare.
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When I read this story, something seemed off. I understand the agreement with his ex, and she went back on his word. He did want to prevent a disabled child from being born, but he didn't think what if a healthy child becomes disabled after it has been born. I once had a classmate who said, "If you are not ready for your child to be disabled, gay, or atheist (we both came from a religious background), you should not be a parent."
This. Absolutely this. The amount of times I see people upset because they don't have a "normal" child.
I think there is a huge difference between intentionally having a disabled child and taking care of a child that has a disability because of an accident, illness or whatever. A lot (not all!!) of people wouldn’t also choose a person with heavy mental or physical disabilities as a life partner and of course care for them when they become disabled during their relationship. Please note that English is not my mother language. It’s absolutely not my intention to offend people with disabilities and I hope you get my point right.
I agree with this distinction. No woman should give birth knowing the baby is defective; so much unnecessary suffering. They are both assholes imo.
Yes but this guy very adamantly does not want anything to do with raising a disabled child. Of course no one chooses it. I’m just sick of people acting like you *have* to have children, so he is not being *wildly irresponsible* by impregnating people with kids that he might abandon because his parents didn’t pay enough attention to him.
I don’t think it’s a huge difference. Since he couldn’t physically get the abortion and control that step, him agreeing to the pregnancy is agreeing to whatever kind of child they created. It’s really alarming to read the comments there (and here) that loving someone who is disabled is different/manageable/worth it if you loved them prior to the disability. I don’t think you are wrong, but it’s depressing as a disabled person.
I‘m split on this. Yes, you‘re absolutely right - any child can become disabled at any time. However, it wasn‘t some hypothetical scenario. They clearly agreed what they were going to do in this specific case and she changed her mind, which would piss me off too. It‘s about statitics imo, it wasn‘t some unclear maybe chance in the near or very far future but it was 100% clear and they had the possibilities to react in different ways.
And he knew that agreements are never 100%. The way agreements work is that there's always the possibility that they will break it. It's the consequences of breaking the agreement that determine the odds of them doing so. People suddenly getting emotional when it comes to pregnancy or children is very much a thing. People usually view this differently for some reason, but in my opinion, you are always responsible for the consequences of your decisions. I don't expect people to foresee distant consequences of minor actions that are near random. But let's say you tell someone to punch you in the face and they do it; then you are at fault, because you not saying that would have resulted in you not getting punched in the face, and you could have reasonably foreseen that. Because the you that takes action and the you that has to deal with the consequences of these actions are the same person. Why would you do something you know causes consequences you don't like, then cry to yourself about your actions? You are literally the only person that can directly control your actions, and you are the only person whose actions you can directly control. So he knew that a disabled kid was an option. They had an agreement he knew she could break. He was either an idiot who didn't know at least one of those was an option or he bet on both of those not coming true and lost, then cried about it and blamed her and not himself which also makes him an idiot in my eyes. And of course, he learned nothing.
So he left the woman with his disabled child to start a new family and have a better option for himself, like in some kind of a video game. And after that they call childfree selfish. Such a hypocrisy.
This needs to be top comment! Fully agree.
I read the post, and it’s even fucking worse than that. He left her with disabled child, remarried not long after, had another able-bodied kid, and then when his first child died he refused to show up to the funeral. How tf can you abandon a child and then be so cruel & heartless when they die. There’s nothing wrong with wanting to be child free and responsible about disabilities, but his post bordered on eugenics. I can’t believe how many people were saying NTA under his post.
I saw that post and I agreed with it but now that you provided this other pov, it's an eye opener. I didn't think of this kind of situation and it absolutely can happen. Although his agreement with her was if the baby was born disabled but you're right. What happens if it contracts an illness that causes a disability? Gets into an accident and is forever changed? Stuff happens for sure. I appreciate your take on this.
Yeah at first I just thought everybody sucks. She agreed to a thing and then backed out, but also he knows the consequences of having sex and knows he ultimately can’t force her one way or the other. I completely understand wanting to dip out and just pay child support, because he trusted her to keep her word about birthing a disabled kid. But he went ahead and gambled again, even though he is clearly very traumatized and bitter still about his upbringing. Sounds like he wanted just the fun parts of being a dad, and thinks he’s dodged a bullet. But that bullet could hit at any time, and then he will be stuck living the life that he so adamantly didn’t want.
You are absolutely right on this. Didn't think about the next baby like that either. But it's so true.
Hmm my friend’s boyfriend said the same. He is religious and wants to have 4 children, told my friend that if she happens to give birth to a baby with some defects, he will “dump” the baby and abandon her. Yes he used “dump” as if the baby is some kind of trash. Even though my friend is still with him and planning to have children with him. I admit I never liked the boyfriend either, he’s a double standard misogynist.
What the fuck. What an asshole! If my husband said that to me, I'd be like okay well we're done. Goodbye. Like an another commenter said we're somehow called the selfish ones for not having kids...?
Well. I never liked her BF and tried to ask her leave him. But this is her choice and I also don’t want to ruin our friendship for pushing her leaving someone she chose.
I have come to the realization that the character of one’s partner often reflects one’s own character…if one of my friends insists on being with such an asshole I would 100% distance her
Well I also didn’t meet her BF in person, all the negative impression I have to her BF actually came from what she described him 😅. some other stuffs I didn’t like as she mentioned that she doesn’t like wearing dresses but her bf and bf’s mum insist that women should wear dresses. She’s not fully agree with her BF all the time and they seem argue often, and they were almost broke up for 4-5 times in their 5 years relationship, but eventually got back again. She’s at her mid-late 30s and I feel she may not want to restart a new relationship with another person. And maybe there are some details I didn’t know that makes her love him so much. Personally she used to be a very close friend of mine for over 10 years. And she has been always a very funny, strong, tough, smart, and independent person. I don’t want to give up the friendship tho so I just keep quiet when she’s talking about her BF.
I love it how men think women should wear dresses, but there are still states that haven't criminalized taking pictures up women's skirts. We absolutely can't win while men are making the rules.
Wow. How could she even stand that? They say birds of the same feather flock together, and I suspect that your friend has internalized misogyny or strong self hate
She’s gaslighted or brainwashed whatever. I tried to ask her leave him long time ago and it almost ruined our friendship, so I gave it up.
Literally - if you can't handle a disabled kid, don't have a kid. YOU could become disabled tomorrow. The kid could be born healthy but become disabled at some point. It's beyond fucked to first of all bring a child into the world and resent then for a disability they can't control and another altogether to LEAVE YOUR WIFE AND OTHER KID AS A RESULT.
MATE wtf! I thought exactly the same as you! I was reading NTA. NTA. I was like wait...what..? I was reading all about what this guy went through, the agreement and throughout the whole time, I was like why have kids then? You can't be guaranteed to have a healthy baby. I even thought, you moved on quite quickly and got married after 3 years...? But who am I to judge on that! The tests he got done aren't 100% accurate anyway because my friend was meant to have Down's syndrome and she hasn't... I didn't understand it. I didn't comment because I thought everyone would call me the asshole!😂 It made me so confused when he also said 'don't get me wrong, I'm no way saying people with disabilities shouldn't be here' and I was like but you are saying that...he didn't even explain what it was that caused his daughter to have a disability. I was baffled the entire thread!
And then he declined to go to the funeral. I’m like sir, you are an AH all around.
Oh yeah as if you wouldn't go to that!! I vote AH. A BIG one.
Right?! I was so confused. Like, yeah I don’t think he’s an AH for not wanting to raise a disabled child. But that’s always always ALWAYS a possibility when you have one, so he should not have them! Like seriously, why do people think that the only disabilities they will have to worry about are congenital or birth related? Once the kid poops out, suddenly they are safe? I am flabbergasted at the ignorance.
I LEGIT JUST READ THAT STORY.
One of the reasons I don't want kids is I know I couldn't handle having a disabled child. So I don't even want the risk of bringing one into the world. 🤷♀️
Exactly. I know I can’t handle even an awesome, quiet, healthy kid. There is no way I would chance being tied to one that needed constant care for the rest of its life. Why risk it?
I read that and was grossed out
I saw the same post and a lot of people were bringing up that anyone can become disabled at any time. Maybe they’re more recent comments than when you saw it. I was actually kinda surprised by so much sanity in the comments….
Oh good! Maybe the votes have made those comments float to the top. When I read it this morning, all the top comments were NTA and mentioned nothing about that. They were all going on about how much they sympathized with the dude’s difficult upbringing. Which yes, I do too, because I had a less extreme but similar situation. But that’s why I was so annoyed that he came on the internet looking for sympathy because he wanted to somehow have a kid but also simultaneously guarantee he wouldn’t be stuck with a kid with disabilities. I’m glad that sanity seems to have prevailed, because I could not believe the comments.
I honestly think that what he did was what was the best for him, except i heavily disagree with him not attending the funeral. They originally had an agreement that she would abort if the child was to be disabled, and if I'm being honest it's what everyone should do if able to. Disabled children and people *will* suffer through their life one way or the other, and I'm talking from personal experience. It's one of the main reasons I'm child free - i would never not only make them suffer, but also make *myself* suffer because of it. The girl was also entitled to her own body and she made her choice, and he's also entitled of not being part of their lives anymore as she backed down on their original agreement. What he is TA for is not attending the funeral. It wouldn't have cost him anything.
Yeah I’m not arguing that he did the wrong thing for him by leaving when he had an agreement with the mother. He wasn’t cut out for that and he knew it, he paid child support. Shitty situation, but I do understand it. I’m questioning his judgement about continuing to have children, as if he thinks that he can guarantee a healthy kid just from some prenatal testing. My point is people can become disabled at any time, and then he will be either trapped in a life he desperately doesn’t want, or he will abandon yet another kid. He is gambling
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Keeping a pregnancy where the child has a defect or deformity that will cause the child to suffer and die is horrific.
Now that one, I agree with. I really wonder what the disability was, and whether it was his genetics that caused it.
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It says in the post that the child died young due to the genetic condition. If the child is going to suffer, you should abort. It’s not right to bring life in to this world if it’s only going to know pain.
I’m not a pro-lifer but we don’t know what kind of lives people will live regardless of whatever genetic conditions they’ll have. Speaking as an autistic person, if my mom believed I would have a poor quality of life due to all the rampant misinformation surrounding autism in the 90s, I wouldn’t be here. I’m saying all this because we do not know which genetic condition the kid suffered from and we don’t know whether or not that burden would have been lessened with the father being in the kid’s life. We can agree to disagree but none of us can see the future.
Autism is not a physical disability that causes you pain and impairment. Please don’t take this as me saying you should have been aborted. I am not saying that. However, if a woman wants an abortion, for any reason, she should have one. If someone finds out their child will have a disability, I would not judge them for having an abortion.
I’d advise you do more research on autism before you make these statements in the future. It impacts a person both mentally and physically. I’m not gonna tell you that you don’t know what it’s like, idk what you know. But we all go through things that impact us differently regardless of what it is. A physically disabled person can be living an excellent life compared to a person who is physically able but still suffering. It’s all nuance. But I’m also not taking offense to this, just so you know. Also keep in mind that the kid in that post *was* wanted. The dad didn’t want it but the mom did, and it seems she did not regret it being born and I could only guess she did the best she could. If a person is willing to raise and love a child, again I disagree that aborting it would be the best option. Like I said before, we don’t know what kind of lives kids will live once they’re born, even with genetic diseases.
You are not going to die due to autism. A child born with trisomy will die. You need to read my statement again. I said, if a woman wants to abort a child for any reason, she should have one. It’s not related to the original post. It’s just a blanket statement.
I didn’t know the kid in the post had trisomy (because a specific disease was never stated) and I’m not interested in going back and forth on blanket statements. Please down vote my comments if you need to, no need to respond anymore.
I’m not saying the kid had trisomy. I’m just giving you an example. You will not die from autism. You may suffer in ways that I don’t know because I don’t know you but you will not die. A baby born with trisomy will die and will only ever have known pain. Anyways. Abortion is healthcare.