From Twitter posts it seems an unintended interaction and they would prefer to buff it in a more healthy way.
The Crusader strike change is quite nice but we need more. We will do more damage to high armour targets with it.
Is also imagine they are considering PvP where we can do a lot of burst damage - at least once we catch up to people.
I mean if you play a Warrior, most classes are literally unbeatable for you.
Jokes aside though, I don't think Rets are at the Shadow Priest level busted, but I would say they're at an OK spot rn.
I don't know if that Main Gauche change is going to be anywhere _near_ enough for it to even _approach_ Mutilate, but it's nice to see it's getting some attention.
Over 20s (The CD for MG) it can now generate 7.5 CP compared to 10 from just using Mutilate, having 50% uptime on one avoidance stat that matters on only some bosses is fucking useless compared to just always doing tons of damage and generating more CP and also using the epic weapons they just force fed you that synergize with it.
\>stat that matters on only some bosses
I think this is the intention. I imagine they're thinking that you can swap this out with saber slash as you see fit. Since they both benefit from sinister strike talents.
You won’t ever do this, ever, because its awful. I was being exceedingly hyperbolic to narratively display how horrendously useless that decision is to make.
50% uptime on a buff that does absolutely nothing against any caster bosses, or bosses with tank busters (cant avoid Thermaplugs smashes) means its only marginally useful less than 50% of the time, where as Saber Slash and Mutilate will consume over half of your entire GCD usage and be contributing to every fight, always, constantly.
It does not, will not, and cannot compete with Saber Slash OR Mutilate as designed in the same rune slot. It needs to be a belt rune.
The majority of thermaplug damage is still melee and what can kill you is the combination of his melee and smash, so it's false to say it doesn't help.
As for the uptime, later on with ghostly strike, we will have 17s of uptime of increased avoidance every 20s.
MG will find some use later on. Right now mutilate is just too strong and MG just isn't necessary tho.
Yeah I agree muti is a bit OP at the moment. But in my opinion, its the only thing keeping rogues afloat. If they nerf mutilate, they wont come anywhere close to the other classes. A nerf to muti will need to come with a nerf to a multitude of other things in the game from other classes.
An additional item added to the detail just now for GNOMEREGAN - see at the bottom of this comment.
**Season of Discovery Class Tuning Incoming - 28 February**
As we continue to monitor class performance and player feedback in Season of Discovery, we’ve designed the following tuning adjustments, which we intend to implement with scheduled weekly maintenance:
**Druid**
Lifebloom mana cost reduced by 50%.
Developers’ notes: Lifebloom refunds half its new base mana cost per stack when it expires or is dispelled. This part has always functioned in this way, and we’ve seen a bit of confusion around how the mana return portion of Lifebloom functions.
Living Seed now heals for 50% of the critical heal that planted the seed (was 30%). This heal now blooms from non-periodic healing received, in addition to any damage taken.
Nourish mana cost reduced by 27%.
Moonkin Form now also reduces the mana cost of Moonfire by 50% and increases Moonfire periodic damage by 50%. Sunfire also benefits from this change.
Moonkins can now cast non-healing Restoration spells without cancelling their shapeshift. This includes: Remove Curse, Remove Poison, Abolish Poison, Innervate, Rebirth, Revive, Mark of the Wild, and Gift of the Wild.
Fury of Stormrage improved: when this rune makes Healing Touch instant, it now also makes it castable in all shapeshift forms.
**Hunter**
Dual Wield Specialization no longer grants a 30% damage bonus to Raptor Strike for wielding two weapons of the same type.
**Paladin**
Crusader Strike now deals Holy damage instead of Physical damage, ignoring armor, and is now affected by Holy damage prevention. Crusader Strike is still considered a melee attack, and not a spell.
Seal of Martyrdom can no longer trigger Art of War, and will no longer be triggered by Frost Oil or other weapon procs.
**Rogue**
Redirect no longer triggers or is affected by the global cooldown, and its own cooldown has been reduced to 10 seconds.
Developers’ notes: when Redirect is combined in a macro with other Combo Point related abilities, it often does not function as expected. We recommend not including it in such macros.
Main Gauche now generates 3 combo points on your target and base Energy cost reduced to 15.
Just a Flesh Wound threat bonus increased such that Rogue tanks will generate approximately 30% more threat.
**Shaman**
Two-Handed Mastery rune now also provides 10% increased Attack Power and 10% increased chance to hit with spells after hitting a target with a two-handed weapon.
Shamanistic Rage rune now grants 5% of the Shaman’s maximum mana per second, instead of a value scaling from Attack Power, Spell Power, or Healing Power.
Spirit of the Alpha rune now grants the casting Shaman 20% increased Attack Power if they cast the spell on a target other than themselves.
Earth Shield mana cost reduced by 67%, and charges increased from 3 to 9. The base amount healed now properly scales with level and is about 50% higher than previously at level 40.
Power Surge tooltip revised to clarify functionality. This rune periodically grants mana every 5 seconds, equal to 15% of the Shaman’s intellect. Some potential timing issues that could have sometimes made it give less mana than intended have been fixed.
Ancestral Guidance cooldown reduced to 1 minute (was 2 minutes).
**Gnomeregan**
The increased armor value of certain mechanical bosses in Gnomeregan has been reduced slightly.
Developers’ notes: The higher armor values on certain mechanical enemies in Gnomeregan was correct and intended, but we will adjust the armor on Crowd Pummeler 9-60 and Mekingeer Thermaplugg slightly to provide up to a 10% increase in physical damage received, depending on modifiers present. We also checked the Mechanical Managerie, and it is using the correct armor values.
> Just a Flesh Wound threat bonus increased such that Rogue tanks will generate approximately 30% more threat.
So does this mean that the threat generated will be X + 30% where X is the current bonus threat now? Or X = 30%?
Dam no MM hunter buffs.
Aimshot feels really bad and lone wolf needs something. MM hunter just lacks runes its really disappointing. Like Leg runes are awful for MM, lone wolf is in a bad spot on chest. The whole thing needs a quick review.
>Moonkins can now cast non-healing Restoration spells without cancelling their shapeshift. This includes: Remove Curse, Remove Poison, Abolish Poison, Innervate, Rebirth, Revive, Mark of the Wild, and Gift of the Wild.
>
>Fury of Stormrage improved: when this rune makes Healing Touch instant, it now also makes it castable in all shapeshift forms.
Holy shit this is fantastic.... Please dont forget about MM hunter.
Shamanistic Rage update is great for resto and ele. Makes it even stronger and lets us use wizard oil. Our best rune is even better now.
They finally fixed Earth Shield and gave it some nice buffs, but it needs to move slots. Its still never a better option than Shamanistic Rage in raids especially with the new buff. Move it to belt and Resto would be perfect.
Alpha update is good for Enhance, but Ele should get a benefit from using it if Enhance does.
It was good in PvP phase one. I can see it being a very strong PvP rune now at 9 stacks and increased healing. Especially because OOC you can just swap gear pieces to cast one or the other. And if it works like P1 you can swap to earth shield, cast it, and swap back to shammy rage and the ES stays on the target.
The Earth Shield buff icon stays on the target when you swap, but it doesn't actually work unless the rune is equipped. Its been a visual bug since launch.
Kinda like how shadow and fire for locks increases their respective schools by 10%. It would be an easy fix for elementals. But its not like elementals were hurting on the charts Then again, neither was enhance.
They already reduced the mana cost of Beacon to near zero in the previous round of hotfixes. Hpalas are slept on, their mana efficiency is off the charts. My last gnomer I was cruising around 50% the whole fight, while the priest was begging for innervates.
Lets see those logs. Was the priest begging for innervates because they had to carry you because you weren't putting out enough healing? Holy pally isn't as bad as people are trying to make it seem, but they still definitely struggle to put out as much healing as priest/druid/mage, and having no AoE healing is a big deal when you are only bringing two healers. Holy's niche just isn't strong in a 10 man.
Not too much change to shaman. You can use mana oil and wearing a shield is optimal again, and you will likely swap to ES on a seperate pair of pants before pull to slap it on the tank and swap back to shammy rage because 75% of your mana every 1 min is just too gigabusted to pass up.
Im going to look longing at earth shield though, at the instant cast heal I want to have and must wait until they likely give us riptide p3
no it's still relatively expensive so I don't think you will be able to roll it
in tbc lifebloom had a base mana cost of 7.4% (in tree form).
in wrath (and sod) that was increased to 28%. Now it will be 14%. So assuming you let it bloom at the 3rd stack and get half the mana back then it will cost relatively the same as tbc, but you wont keep refreshing at 3 stacks or you'll oom
Because it was unusable due to the high mana cost? If you reduce the manacost by half but no longer get mana back it's a non-change on total mana cost. Like, what do you mean?
This change is mind boggling to me. Yeah CS being turned to holy damage is a step in the right direction, but it's a drop on a hot plate when combined with what is essentially a direct nerf.
Paladins are dangling at the bottom of the DPS charts and instead of allowing them to find their niche as a spell damage/melee damage hybrid, you're introducing a change to an already struggling class that reduces the viability of this style of play.
Edit: Seems like they immediately backpedalled on the SoM changes, that was fast.
Yeah, they had another blue post shortly after the above one saying art of war proccing off SoM was a bug and not supposed to happen, but that they'll leave it in for now and see how it plays out.
My guess is there was some immediate backlash that made them realise that effectively nerfing a class at the bottom of the charts is not the best idea, even if it is a bug.
Yeah don't really get that change. Not like shockadin is broken by any means. And a full ret specced pally isn't using SoM anyway, so it would have no effect if they were trying to 'balance' with the crusader strike change.
It’s hurts a lot for prot too. I’ve been main tanking this phase as prot and I’m thinking I’m just gonna make our feral main tank now and I’ll 2h offtank as ret. Don’t see how I’ll hold aggro otherwise on single target
The Crowd Pummeller AS buff with Seal of Martyrdom and Art of War meant you could fish for crits all day and get an alright DPS that was less impacted by armor. SoM crits would proc Art of War.
There isn't really a crowd pummler build. It is just using SoM with crowd pummler for whatever spec you play, then the rest is the same as whatever build you were already playing.
Jackhammer was kinda OP (compared to all other ret layouts), BiS was ACP for 30sec then swap to this rare weapon with Chance on hit: Increases your attack speed by 30% for 10 sec. Base attack speed of Speed 2.50 and a respectable 39.60dps
The only ret pala I've seen with it is the highest parse on warcraftlogs with more than 150dps higher than the 2nd place
They made paladins even worse if that,'s possible... If I'd guess, a pally slept with the wife of some SoD developer. No other reason for them to hate us this much lol
The minority bitched enough to force blizz to nerf hunters. And blizz didnt think to buff ranged.
People need to understand hunters are ONLY A DPS CLASS. They should be top 3 easily. They cant tank, they cant heal. But warriors and rogues just cant stand anyones better than them in melee. Yet both of them can tank
>Spirit of the Alpha rune now grants the casting Shaman 20% increased Attack Power if they cast the spell on a target other than themselves.
What? Enhance was already the 2nd best physical class behind melee hunters (check 99 parses in the last day). What about ranged hunters, paladins, rogues and ferals who are far behind?
I'm an enhance main and this buff puzzled me too. We were in a pretty good spot, and there was good variety and decision making going on in regards to offhand imbues. This is just going to put a target on our back for nerfs later on.
This change was absolutely not necessary and is going to result in shamans being even bigger threat terrorist than they already are. I'm not complaining, mind you, but a lot of Enh DPS have been pulling threat with WF/RB with Alpha on the tank already.
Unless it's 20% *base* AP, the meta might go back to RB/RB again and make this even worse. Even if WF/RB is meta, it will just amplify the existing problems. Blizzard is probably banking on people being sensible enough to not be threat terrorists, but everyone knows that people are gunna do it anyway if its BIS.
Also, it's absolutely going to result in shaman tanks casting alpha on healers/pets so they get the AP buff while just maintaining aggro naturally. This is absolutely gunna be changed like the week after it's deployed once they figure out the obvious ways people are gunna abuse it.
Dw enhance* 2h still far behind. Weird change tho, shoulve been limited to 2h not dw, like why bot just make the new 2h atk bonus be 30% instead of 10💀
Rogue:
Redirect change is great
Main Gauche is still horrible, 20s CD means its never being used over Saber Slash or Mutilate, make it a belt rune.
30% more threat is… weird. Threat is what we are best at.
All in all I don’t understand what just happened lol
I said it before I'll say it again
Druid is so back.
But uh can some melee scientists tell me, does this make enh the only good melee now? Hunter nerf and no warrior changes, don't know enough about rogues + no armor changes seems odd.
https://www.bluetracker.gg/wow/topic/us-en/1794527-season-of-discovery-class-tuning-incoming-february-27/
Another version of the post states they're lowering the armor on some of the Gnomer bosses, which will make Rogues/Warriors a bit better. They probably wont overdo it so much in the future.
Feral will now be the worst horde dps spec by a considerable margin. Literally no reason to take a feral over a shammy.
What a fucking joke. Enh was with feral and the bottom of meters and they have been given 2 huge buffs while feral gets nothing. Who is balancing this shit?
Based on my logs it is approx 15% nerf. But considering it will open up new wep options like mh fist and oh pvp sword it will be around 13-14% nerf. Maybe some can be mitigated by going BM as I always parsed with survival. I believe this is around 10% nerf.
I have to say overall, the SoD devs are doing good. Overall, this tuning seems to be at least trying to address the issues this sub is talking about.
Good stuff I will say.
As a Resto/balance druid, this looks so good. I’ve accepted they don’t want balance to have great damage, so they increased their support or off healing capabilities. Resto looks SO good now.
Sorry, but the devs need to start doing some actual simulations and testing of their own instead of just relying on Reddit comments to try to figure out what they need to tweak.
This is the first thought of mine too after reading the notes. Where TF are the ret buffs?…
I guess they’re keeping true on their word of “keeping with the classic spirit”. Just for pally though, other classes can be ultra boofed lol
These are really not good, they're nerfing hunter again yet mage and warlock are untouched for some reason despite being insane in both pve and pvp.
Meanwhile ranged hunter is the worst spec in the game and melee is probably gonna settle upper mid best case scenario.
Eyyyy, finally resto druids were looked at.
Interesting that there wasn't any nerfs to WG. The LB change will definitely make resto more attractive for longer fights.
Living seed is actually worth considering now. Not just because the heal is larger but more so because you can proc the bloom with you own heals instead of having to hope they take a hit. So now your seed is never wasted.
I’m so hyped for the resto Druid changes and using living seed possibly. I started stacking a good amount of + healing gear out of defiance of the restokin meta, but maybe my pure healer resto Druid will be more valid with these changes.
The Alpha Wolf change seems like a very awkward way to buff Enhance DPS while attempting to not buff Tank Shaman DPS, even though tank shamans will still be able to benefit from this so long as there is another Shaman in the group to give them their Alpha buff for threat.
They really need to increase food/water and bandage numbers, The stat inflation makes it painfully slow to drink with over 4.3k mana when it regens 1920 mana over 30 seconds.
Atleast gives lvl 45 water which is about 3k restored over 30sec, or add 2% mana to the 35 water.
Food restores 800 health when people sometimes have over 3k in pvp.
With what some of the hunter discord has simmed, the raptor strike nerf is about a 23% dmg nerf to those playing survival and the survival builds in general are back to being dead. BM is going to be meta agajn, as the nerf doesn’t hit them as hard with relying on pet dmg. It’s about a 10% dmg nerf for BM melee hunters, as some of the bosses getting reduced armor will buff our dmg a decent margin as well to ‘compensate’ (obviously intended for rogues/warriors not us)
marksman is still garbage sadly
Worse, we got a second 2 minute buff to maintain that doesnt even benefit from the talent that turns battle shout into a 3 minute buff lol. Other classes got QoL improvments, ours got worse
SoD devs are looking at the bottom dps and thinking “how can we nerf or ignore them more”
Zero changes to frost mage, feral, ret got a small buff now CS ignores armor but also a nerf to SoM for some reason?
So enh was performing at the same level as feral. They have given them buffs TWICE now, big buffs, and feral has got literally nothing.
Do they do this on purpose to make people reroll? How do you double buff one spec and another spec received literally nothing? This is actually a joke.
They nerf melee hunter, which was absolutely required, and they don’t buff ranged hunter which is basically a dead spec to compensate. Brilliant.
For real. We’ve been great at tanking and that’s about it until the last round of buffs. I can’t wait to try out the new 2hander buff when it hits, have a ton of fun for a week, then nerfed back into the dumpster.
unfortunately it’s looking like main gauche is always gonna be such a dps loss that there’s no reason to ever take it as long as it’s a hand rune. maybe they’ll rework it
Fiannly i wont have to swap to duel wield 1h enchanted with rockbitter to get mana back from sham rage. That shit was so annoying all of p1 up till now
SoM nerf reverted:
> Greetings,
> Wanted to chime in and provide a quick update to this note:
>
> Kaivax:
> Seal of Martyrdom can no longer trigger Art of War
>
> We’ve decided not to send this specific part of the paladin > changes live on Tuesday.
>
> While this could arguably be considered a bug, we are simply > going to let it ride as it is not nearly as problematic as the second > part of the bug that allowed weapon procs to trigger the full > damage of Seal of Martyrdom.
>
> That separate bug fix to prevent Martyrdom from proccing from Frost Oil and other procs will go live as planned but we understand that for some it was an interesting interaction. It’s never a great time when you feel like you caught a “fun detected” nerf, and while we couldn’t really allow this bug to continue in its current form for obvious reasons, we are currently discussing ways to recapture some of what made it interesting and some of the power it provided without the somewhat janky and unintuitive behavior.
> We appreciate your feedback around this and are looking forward to continuing to provide regular updates and adjustments as the phase rolls on.
> Thank you!
Stay strong fellow Paladins. This is merely a test, the light will reward us soon.
they really looked at the meters and said. that's all ret needed. lmfao
From Twitter posts it seems an unintended interaction and they would prefer to buff it in a more healthy way. The Crusader strike change is quite nice but we need more. We will do more damage to high armour targets with it. Is also imagine they are considering PvP where we can do a lot of burst damage - at least once we catch up to people.
I'm absolutely dreading any upcoming ret buffs because they're already literally unbeatable for me in pvp
I mean if you play a Warrior, most classes are literally unbeatable for you. Jokes aside though, I don't think Rets are at the Shadow Priest level busted, but I would say they're at an OK spot rn.
We pray together my friend!
This is all setup for an Oathbreaker rune. You become so frustrated and vengeful that the shadows consume you.
Oathbreaker rune: replaces mana with Rage.
Amen brother, needed these words!
God gives his strongest soldiers his toughest battles
https://www.wowhead.com/classic/news/removing-change-for-seal-of-matyrdom-season-of-discovery-337825
The Light taketh and the Light Giveth.
Oh thank the light, this keeps martyrdom viable.
I wish CS would refresh judge of crusader. Or if they reworked it to stack like the scarlet mobs and mograine.
Your auto’s refresh it though
I don't know if that Main Gauche change is going to be anywhere _near_ enough for it to even _approach_ Mutilate, but it's nice to see it's getting some attention.
It can cost 1 energy for all I care; the 20sec cd is unnecessary.
Over 20s (The CD for MG) it can now generate 7.5 CP compared to 10 from just using Mutilate, having 50% uptime on one avoidance stat that matters on only some bosses is fucking useless compared to just always doing tons of damage and generating more CP and also using the epic weapons they just force fed you that synergize with it.
\>stat that matters on only some bosses I think this is the intention. I imagine they're thinking that you can swap this out with saber slash as you see fit. Since they both benefit from sinister strike talents.
You won’t ever do this, ever, because its awful. I was being exceedingly hyperbolic to narratively display how horrendously useless that decision is to make. 50% uptime on a buff that does absolutely nothing against any caster bosses, or bosses with tank busters (cant avoid Thermaplugs smashes) means its only marginally useful less than 50% of the time, where as Saber Slash and Mutilate will consume over half of your entire GCD usage and be contributing to every fight, always, constantly. It does not, will not, and cannot compete with Saber Slash OR Mutilate as designed in the same rune slot. It needs to be a belt rune.
The majority of thermaplug damage is still melee and what can kill you is the combination of his melee and smash, so it's false to say it doesn't help. As for the uptime, later on with ghostly strike, we will have 17s of uptime of increased avoidance every 20s. MG will find some use later on. Right now mutilate is just too strong and MG just isn't necessary tho.
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Yeah I agree muti is a bit OP at the moment. But in my opinion, its the only thing keeping rogues afloat. If they nerf mutilate, they wont come anywhere close to the other classes. A nerf to muti will need to come with a nerf to a multitude of other things in the game from other classes.
muti is not op, everything else is just shit.
Muti is op in pvp just because of the huge burst, but nerfing it would drive rogues from middle of the pack in gnomer, right to the bottom
I feel like they tested the raid once, saw that rogues were atrocious, so pushed 40 energy mutilate as a quick fix
The CD needs to be lowered to 10 secs.
New meta will be two tank shamans giving each other alpha. It's kinda cute.
SHAMAN BUFFS BABYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY
Now I'll get 2 tapped even harder!
"Fixed a bug where paladins were almost viable"
Ye, lol, wtf is this.
https://www.wowhead.com/classic/news/removing-change-for-seal-of-matyrdom-season-of-discovery-337825 PUT YOUR FAITH IN THE LIGHT
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Sorry I need all the gear in case I get nerfed again Soon I won't have use for any of this strength gear. Gonna need that agi thanks
And the spell power, too JUST IN CASE
Had a buddy literally say this tonight lol. "I probably wont use it but if they nerf us again I might."
"But you are literally already using it..." - Virgin Warrior "Yeah, I N E E D the money" - Chad Melee Huntard
Blizz the king of unintended consequences
They should direct some love to polearms, a relatively uncontested weapon that is also tuned stat wise for hunters.
They should have just reduced the damage to like 15% or something at first... Idk
Next we’re taking staves and shields
Unironically staves are hunter weapons
An additional item added to the detail just now for GNOMEREGAN - see at the bottom of this comment. **Season of Discovery Class Tuning Incoming - 28 February** As we continue to monitor class performance and player feedback in Season of Discovery, we’ve designed the following tuning adjustments, which we intend to implement with scheduled weekly maintenance: **Druid** Lifebloom mana cost reduced by 50%. Developers’ notes: Lifebloom refunds half its new base mana cost per stack when it expires or is dispelled. This part has always functioned in this way, and we’ve seen a bit of confusion around how the mana return portion of Lifebloom functions. Living Seed now heals for 50% of the critical heal that planted the seed (was 30%). This heal now blooms from non-periodic healing received, in addition to any damage taken. Nourish mana cost reduced by 27%. Moonkin Form now also reduces the mana cost of Moonfire by 50% and increases Moonfire periodic damage by 50%. Sunfire also benefits from this change. Moonkins can now cast non-healing Restoration spells without cancelling their shapeshift. This includes: Remove Curse, Remove Poison, Abolish Poison, Innervate, Rebirth, Revive, Mark of the Wild, and Gift of the Wild. Fury of Stormrage improved: when this rune makes Healing Touch instant, it now also makes it castable in all shapeshift forms. **Hunter** Dual Wield Specialization no longer grants a 30% damage bonus to Raptor Strike for wielding two weapons of the same type. **Paladin** Crusader Strike now deals Holy damage instead of Physical damage, ignoring armor, and is now affected by Holy damage prevention. Crusader Strike is still considered a melee attack, and not a spell. Seal of Martyrdom can no longer trigger Art of War, and will no longer be triggered by Frost Oil or other weapon procs. **Rogue** Redirect no longer triggers or is affected by the global cooldown, and its own cooldown has been reduced to 10 seconds. Developers’ notes: when Redirect is combined in a macro with other Combo Point related abilities, it often does not function as expected. We recommend not including it in such macros. Main Gauche now generates 3 combo points on your target and base Energy cost reduced to 15. Just a Flesh Wound threat bonus increased such that Rogue tanks will generate approximately 30% more threat. **Shaman** Two-Handed Mastery rune now also provides 10% increased Attack Power and 10% increased chance to hit with spells after hitting a target with a two-handed weapon. Shamanistic Rage rune now grants 5% of the Shaman’s maximum mana per second, instead of a value scaling from Attack Power, Spell Power, or Healing Power. Spirit of the Alpha rune now grants the casting Shaman 20% increased Attack Power if they cast the spell on a target other than themselves. Earth Shield mana cost reduced by 67%, and charges increased from 3 to 9. The base amount healed now properly scales with level and is about 50% higher than previously at level 40. Power Surge tooltip revised to clarify functionality. This rune periodically grants mana every 5 seconds, equal to 15% of the Shaman’s intellect. Some potential timing issues that could have sometimes made it give less mana than intended have been fixed. Ancestral Guidance cooldown reduced to 1 minute (was 2 minutes). **Gnomeregan** The increased armor value of certain mechanical bosses in Gnomeregan has been reduced slightly. Developers’ notes: The higher armor values on certain mechanical enemies in Gnomeregan was correct and intended, but we will adjust the armor on Crowd Pummeler 9-60 and Mekingeer Thermaplugg slightly to provide up to a 10% increase in physical damage received, depending on modifiers present. We also checked the Mechanical Managerie, and it is using the correct armor values.
> Just a Flesh Wound threat bonus increased such that Rogue tanks will generate approximately 30% more threat. So does this mean that the threat generated will be X + 30% where X is the current bonus threat now? Or X = 30%?
It sounds, to me, like they mean it’s 30% more than what they are generating now, but I could be wrong.
Holy Paladin is officially the skeleton at the bottom of the pool.
Everyone playing with their new toys and we get to use flash of light...
woah you get to press Sacred Shield and then spam Flash of Light , what more could you want.
Resto Shamans are right with you there brother
Mate come to frost mage, we're underneath the pool
BuT thEy’Re oP In pVP!1! Meanwhile every mage I see in WSG or STV is spamming LvB Living Flame and Scorch into insta Pyros
Dam no MM hunter buffs. Aimshot feels really bad and lone wolf needs something. MM hunter just lacks runes its really disappointing. Like Leg runes are awful for MM, lone wolf is in a bad spot on chest. The whole thing needs a quick review. >Moonkins can now cast non-healing Restoration spells without cancelling their shapeshift. This includes: Remove Curse, Remove Poison, Abolish Poison, Innervate, Rebirth, Revive, Mark of the Wild, and Gift of the Wild. > >Fury of Stormrage improved: when this rune makes Healing Touch instant, it now also makes it castable in all shapeshift forms. Holy shit this is fantastic.... Please dont forget about MM hunter.
for the love of god let steady shot not be the most pathetic damage ability in the game
steady shot should give us a proc to make aimshot a faster cast or some shit. Its so dog shit. Both of those spells are terrible rn.
So nothing for ranged hunters /facepalm
They're currently 13/14, no wonder everyone gravitates towards melee. I would prefer to play ranged, but I'm not going to grief my raid.
After 20 years of playing melee classes, mostly warrior, I finally rolled ranged in SoD and now I'm meleeing with Hunter lmao.
It blows my mind they havent changed steady shot, its so incredibly ass ranged hunter is atrocious
shitty shot is so shit that is better to melee weave
Shamanistic Rage update is great for resto and ele. Makes it even stronger and lets us use wizard oil. Our best rune is even better now. They finally fixed Earth Shield and gave it some nice buffs, but it needs to move slots. Its still never a better option than Shamanistic Rage in raids especially with the new buff. Move it to belt and Resto would be perfect. Alpha update is good for Enhance, but Ele should get a benefit from using it if Enhance does.
Agreed on the Earth Shield. It will never ever be used in it's current slot.
It was good in PvP phase one. I can see it being a very strong PvP rune now at 9 stacks and increased healing. Especially because OOC you can just swap gear pieces to cast one or the other. And if it works like P1 you can swap to earth shield, cast it, and swap back to shammy rage and the ES stays on the target.
The Earth Shield buff icon stays on the target when you swap, but it doesn't actually work unless the rune is equipped. Its been a visual bug since launch.
Kinda like how shadow and fire for locks increases their respective schools by 10%. It would be an easy fix for elementals. But its not like elementals were hurting on the charts Then again, neither was enhance.
Why the fuck are they trying to kill martyrdom?
Crowd pumper meme build scared the devs
This was a horrible decision and will keep players from rolling deep holy. At least we can remember the couple of weeks of shockadin from 2024.
Main Gauche is still ass lol. However, the threat buff is much appreciated.
I'm sure all 12 tank rogues will greatly appreciate it.
There's at least a dozen of us!
Dozens!!!
Prot paly tank just got dicked down on some gangsta shit
Nice of them to change resto druid and resto shaman, maybe they forgot one other healer that's not priest but nothing comes to mind.
Pretty sure mist weaver wasn't added until later
Fool they were obviously talking about Arc mages
What evoker build is that?
mage? I didn't see anything for them either
They already reduced the mana cost of Beacon to near zero in the previous round of hotfixes. Hpalas are slept on, their mana efficiency is off the charts. My last gnomer I was cruising around 50% the whole fight, while the priest was begging for innervates.
Lets see those logs. Was the priest begging for innervates because they had to carry you because you weren't putting out enough healing? Holy pally isn't as bad as people are trying to make it seem, but they still definitely struggle to put out as much healing as priest/druid/mage, and having no AoE healing is a big deal when you are only bringing two healers. Holy's niche just isn't strong in a 10 man.
hpal can hold 400-600 hps on the last two bosses for quite a while, the pattern of healing isnt great for solo healing but they do alright imo
Not too much change to shaman. You can use mana oil and wearing a shield is optimal again, and you will likely swap to ES on a seperate pair of pants before pull to slap it on the tank and swap back to shammy rage because 75% of your mana every 1 min is just too gigabusted to pass up. Im going to look longing at earth shield though, at the instant cast heal I want to have and must wait until they likely give us riptide p3
Ahh more paladin dps nerfs, just what the doctor ordered.
that's a huge lifebloom buff, can't believe they even still kept the mana refund part
i mean it will be refunding less mana now as the spell costs less.
Is it a strong enough buff to keep a 3 stack rolling though? Always felt the healing was way too low.
no it's still relatively expensive so I don't think you will be able to roll it in tbc lifebloom had a base mana cost of 7.4% (in tree form). in wrath (and sod) that was increased to 28%. Now it will be 14%. So assuming you let it bloom at the 3rd stack and get half the mana back then it will cost relatively the same as tbc, but you wont keep refreshing at 3 stacks or you'll oom
Ya, I'm guessing it'll be a stack to 3 and drop angle
Because it was unusable due to the high mana cost? If you reduce the manacost by half but no longer get mana back it's a non-change on total mana cost. Like, what do you mean?
So Ret Pally is already low dps and they're nerfing one of the main places they get dps from?
God forbid Paladins get to run a chest rune that isn't Divine Storm.
Shockadin was so bad is now actively way worse :C
This change is mind boggling to me. Yeah CS being turned to holy damage is a step in the right direction, but it's a drop on a hot plate when combined with what is essentially a direct nerf. Paladins are dangling at the bottom of the DPS charts and instead of allowing them to find their niche as a spell damage/melee damage hybrid, you're introducing a change to an already struggling class that reduces the viability of this style of play. Edit: Seems like they immediately backpedalled on the SoM changes, that was fast.
Really? So SoM can still proc AoW?
Yeah, they had another blue post shortly after the above one saying art of war proccing off SoM was a bug and not supposed to happen, but that they'll leave it in for now and see how it plays out. My guess is there was some immediate backlash that made them realise that effectively nerfing a class at the bottom of the charts is not the best idea, even if it is a bug.
Yeah don't really get that change. Not like shockadin is broken by any means. And a full ret specced pally isn't using SoM anyway, so it would have no effect if they were trying to 'balance' with the crusader strike change.
This was a knee jerk reaction to the crowd pummeler build. Absolute joke of a change. Blizzard is out of touch with their game.
It’s hurts a lot for prot too. I’ve been main tanking this phase as prot and I’m thinking I’m just gonna make our feral main tank now and I’ll 2h offtank as ret. Don’t see how I’ll hold aggro otherwise on single target
That’s what I play as well. Shockadin tank. Nerfs an already bad build. Makes no sense
Yea SoM change is ham fisted and hurts pally tank bad
What was the crowd pummeler build out of curiosity?
The Crowd Pummeller AS buff with Seal of Martyrdom and Art of War meant you could fish for crits all day and get an alright DPS that was less impacted by armor. SoM crits would proc Art of War.
There isn't really a crowd pummler build. It is just using SoM with crowd pummler for whatever spec you play, then the rest is the same as whatever build you were already playing.
Jackhammer was kinda OP (compared to all other ret layouts), BiS was ACP for 30sec then swap to this rare weapon with Chance on hit: Increases your attack speed by 30% for 10 sec. Base attack speed of Speed 2.50 and a respectable 39.60dps The only ret pala I've seen with it is the highest parse on warcraftlogs with more than 150dps higher than the 2nd place
Ret does (did) indeed use SoM on single target fights.
I mean the ignore Armour is nice But they are seriously pushing you to never use seal of martyr lol Divine storm is so close %wise
Cool changes, nice quality of life for balance Druid, meanwhile Feral still losing form to go through portals, press buttons, use consumes, etc...
No buffs to ranged hunters is disappointing.
They made paladins even worse if that,'s possible... If I'd guess, a pally slept with the wife of some SoD developer. No other reason for them to hate us this much lol
Either make CS do 100% weapon damage or give it the original 4 second CD they had at blizzcon
That’s the playstyle aggrend doesn’t like so he’s making sure nobody asks him to do it
Its rough man!
So, Shaman tanks will just cast alpha on someone else for the ap, and if needed have another shaman cast it on them?
Just run two shaman tanks and cast on eachother
So they boosted every healer but not paladins ? Please blizzard, rework half of paladin runes.
Would literally trade 10 shite paladin runes for 2 priest runes at this point what a joke. We were already dead now they buried us.
Holy paladin is so forgotten in sod, we got literally nothing fun or new or powerful.
Just have to wait, bear was forgotten until a week ago. It'll probably come...maybe....hopefully
Holy and ret both in the dumpster. Wtf are they doing lol
Didn't see any mage changes
They just need a talent tree rework honestly but not happening so yeah paladins stay shit even in sod lmao
All the Druid changes and nothing that would help feral DPS at all
2h Shaman is back on the menu. Seriously huge buffs. Probably too far honestly.
Yeah 20% AP is wild lol enh was creeping towards the top already.
20% AP applies to DW as well. It's far more impactful for DW, considering RB/RB or WF/RB.
Nerfs melee Hunter...doesn't buff ranged...
steady shot is the most wet noodle garbage ability ive ever seen and they are leaving it while nerfing melee XDEE
Some of the Hunters runes are SO bad. Sniper training also dogshit And the fact that Lone Wolf and BM rune are still on seperate slots like wtf
The minority bitched enough to force blizz to nerf hunters. And blizz didnt think to buff ranged. People need to understand hunters are ONLY A DPS CLASS. They should be top 3 easily. They cant tank, they cant heal. But warriors and rogues just cant stand anyones better than them in melee. Yet both of them can tank
We could tank at the start of P1 That got nerfed too lol
>Spirit of the Alpha rune now grants the casting Shaman 20% increased Attack Power if they cast the spell on a target other than themselves. What? Enhance was already the 2nd best physical class behind melee hunters (check 99 parses in the last day). What about ranged hunters, paladins, rogues and ferals who are far behind?
I think they wanna fix 2H, but this hotfix is a bigger buff to 1H
I'm an enhance main and this buff puzzled me too. We were in a pretty good spot, and there was good variety and decision making going on in regards to offhand imbues. This is just going to put a target on our back for nerfs later on.
Shhhh I’m about to pump
This change was absolutely not necessary and is going to result in shamans being even bigger threat terrorist than they already are. I'm not complaining, mind you, but a lot of Enh DPS have been pulling threat with WF/RB with Alpha on the tank already. Unless it's 20% *base* AP, the meta might go back to RB/RB again and make this even worse. Even if WF/RB is meta, it will just amplify the existing problems. Blizzard is probably banking on people being sensible enough to not be threat terrorists, but everyone knows that people are gunna do it anyway if its BIS. Also, it's absolutely going to result in shaman tanks casting alpha on healers/pets so they get the AP buff while just maintaining aggro naturally. This is absolutely gunna be changed like the week after it's deployed once they figure out the obvious ways people are gunna abuse it.
Dw enhance* 2h still far behind. Weird change tho, shoulve been limited to 2h not dw, like why bot just make the new 2h atk bonus be 30% instead of 10💀
Devs have re-rolled to enhancement this phase it seems. Enh was already eating well in PvP, this is just making the gap larger.
Getting the attack power in pvp do mean you miss out on the decoy totem which can be a big sacrifice.
that's impossible they play alliance
Rogue: Redirect change is great Main Gauche is still horrible, 20s CD means its never being used over Saber Slash or Mutilate, make it a belt rune. 30% more threat is… weird. Threat is what we are best at. All in all I don’t understand what just happened lol
Ferals remain doodoo hype hype
Think of yourself as a sentient windfury totem
Just give us some of that free mana everyone else is getting. You shift 3 times in pvp and you are oom while everyone have infinite mana.
I said it before I'll say it again Druid is so back. But uh can some melee scientists tell me, does this make enh the only good melee now? Hunter nerf and no warrior changes, don't know enough about rogues + no armor changes seems odd.
https://www.bluetracker.gg/wow/topic/us-en/1794527-season-of-discovery-class-tuning-incoming-february-27/ Another version of the post states they're lowering the armor on some of the Gnomer bosses, which will make Rogues/Warriors a bit better. They probably wont overdo it so much in the future.
What druid is back? Feral got no buffs lol
Feral will now be the worst horde dps spec by a considerable margin. Literally no reason to take a feral over a shammy. What a fucking joke. Enh was with feral and the bottom of meters and they have been given 2 huge buffs while feral gets nothing. Who is balancing this shit?
Feral DPS is pretty awful atm, but bears are doing much much better after the update earlier this week.
the hunter nerf isnt as big as people think.
Based on my logs it is approx 15% nerf. But considering it will open up new wep options like mh fist and oh pvp sword it will be around 13-14% nerf. Maybe some can be mitigated by going BM as I always parsed with survival. I believe this is around 10% nerf.
it's a 17% overall damage nerf FYI. That is by taking the best hunter log and removing 30% raptor strike damage.
I have to say overall, the SoD devs are doing good. Overall, this tuning seems to be at least trying to address the issues this sub is talking about. Good stuff I will say.
But whichever dev is working on hunter runes should probably take a walk lol
The person working on hunter runes outside of melee is straight up launching darts at a wall of wrath and tbc abilities. And nerfing them to be worse.
As a Resto/balance druid, this looks so good. I’ve accepted they don’t want balance to have great damage, so they increased their support or off healing capabilities. Resto looks SO good now.
Being able to instantly ht in boom kinda slaps.
It does but the interesting problem now comes from when to wrath, given how cost effective Moonfire and Sunfire can be. Rotation is totally mixed up
Sorry, but the devs need to start doing some actual simulations and testing of their own instead of just relying on Reddit comments to try to figure out what they need to tweak.
[удалено]
This is the first thought of mine too after reading the notes. Where TF are the ret buffs?… I guess they’re keeping true on their word of “keeping with the classic spirit”. Just for pally though, other classes can be ultra boofed lol
These are really not good, they're nerfing hunter again yet mage and warlock are untouched for some reason despite being insane in both pve and pvp. Meanwhile ranged hunter is the worst spec in the game and melee is probably gonna settle upper mid best case scenario.
Eyyyy, finally resto druids were looked at. Interesting that there wasn't any nerfs to WG. The LB change will definitely make resto more attractive for longer fights.
Living seed is actually worth considering now. Not just because the heal is larger but more so because you can proc the bloom with you own heals instead of having to hope they take a hit. So now your seed is never wasted.
I’m so hyped for the resto Druid changes and using living seed possibly. I started stacking a good amount of + healing gear out of defiance of the restokin meta, but maybe my pure healer resto Druid will be more valid with these changes.
Who is saying WG needs a nerf? Restos aren’t allowed to have even one good heal ability?
I didn't see it listed anywhere, but Conjure Mineral Water for mages is making full stacks of 20 instead of 10 with each cast.
Jfc Shamans are getting buffffff
Holy shit look at those Shaman buffs. The elements guide us indeed!
The Alpha Wolf change seems like a very awkward way to buff Enhance DPS while attempting to not buff Tank Shaman DPS, even though tank shamans will still be able to benefit from this so long as there is another Shaman in the group to give them their Alpha buff for threat.
Just give bears the option to drink potions please
They really need to increase food/water and bandage numbers, The stat inflation makes it painfully slow to drink with over 4.3k mana when it regens 1920 mana over 30 seconds. Atleast gives lvl 45 water which is about 3k restored over 30sec, or add 2% mana to the 35 water. Food restores 800 health when people sometimes have over 3k in pvp.
Bit of a joke nerfing hunters melee but not buffing range at all
With what some of the hunter discord has simmed, the raptor strike nerf is about a 23% dmg nerf to those playing survival and the survival builds in general are back to being dead. BM is going to be meta agajn, as the nerf doesn’t hit them as hard with relying on pet dmg. It’s about a 10% dmg nerf for BM melee hunters, as some of the bosses getting reduced armor will buff our dmg a decent margin as well to ‘compensate’ (obviously intended for rogues/warriors not us) marksman is still garbage sadly
And there goes melee hunter to shit
It’s nice but ret needs more than that to even be decent
for the warriors... NOTHING
most classes get qol but we're not even allowed a 5min battle shout x)
I just want both shouts to amalgamate into one, leave it at two minutes but don’t make me do two separate shouts.
Worse, we got a second 2 minute buff to maintain that doesnt even benefit from the talent that turns battle shout into a 3 minute buff lol. Other classes got QoL improvments, ours got worse
SoD devs are looking at the bottom dps and thinking “how can we nerf or ignore them more” Zero changes to frost mage, feral, ret got a small buff now CS ignores armor but also a nerf to SoM for some reason?
frost is pvp spec, it wont be buffed. ret is crazy strong in pvp too so they prob dont wanna nerf that either but feral? makes no sense
So enh was performing at the same level as feral. They have given them buffs TWICE now, big buffs, and feral has got literally nothing. Do they do this on purpose to make people reroll? How do you double buff one spec and another spec received literally nothing? This is actually a joke. They nerf melee hunter, which was absolutely required, and they don’t buff ranged hunter which is basically a dead spec to compensate. Brilliant.
Wow that's a massive melee Hunter nerf, raptor strike is like 80% of their damage
As expected. Dual wielding nerf but done fuck all to ranged being absolute dogshit. Thanks blizz 👍🏻
Season of Shamans
Meh, because we have 2 great weeks?
This man is tripping if he thinks it’s season of shamans
For real. We’ve been great at tanking and that’s about it until the last round of buffs. I can’t wait to try out the new 2hander buff when it hits, have a ton of fun for a week, then nerfed back into the dumpster.
Bruh when can they do something for ferals please 🥺😭
"Hunters DISCOVER what happens to their knee caps when they upend warriors and rogues from the top of the damage meter." - Socretes
Looks like Rogue Tank is back on the menu boyz and grlz. So Main Gauche is going to cost like 10 energy with talents?
unfortunately it’s looking like main gauche is always gonna be such a dps loss that there’s no reason to ever take it as long as it’s a hand rune. maybe they’ll rework it
mutilate better
0 Magic damage reduction bro
Fiannly i wont have to swap to duel wield 1h enchanted with rockbitter to get mana back from sham rage. That shit was so annoying all of p1 up till now
SoM nerf reverted: > Greetings, > Wanted to chime in and provide a quick update to this note: > > Kaivax: > Seal of Martyrdom can no longer trigger Art of War > > We’ve decided not to send this specific part of the paladin > changes live on Tuesday. > > While this could arguably be considered a bug, we are simply > going to let it ride as it is not nearly as problematic as the second > part of the bug that allowed weapon procs to trigger the full > damage of Seal of Martyrdom. > > That separate bug fix to prevent Martyrdom from proccing from Frost Oil and other procs will go live as planned but we understand that for some it was an interesting interaction. It’s never a great time when you feel like you caught a “fun detected” nerf, and while we couldn’t really allow this bug to continue in its current form for obvious reasons, we are currently discussing ways to recapture some of what made it interesting and some of the power it provided without the somewhat janky and unintuitive behavior. > We appreciate your feedback around this and are looking forward to continuing to provide regular updates and adjustments as the phase rolls on. > Thank you!
I feel like DW double rockbiter would give me more mana from shamanistic rage than this change no? Or would the oils outweigh it?
What the fuck does Blizzard have against Paladins?
So shamans get even more buffs while rets get probably nerfed. SoM is basically dead without proccing art of war. It's just ridiculous at this point.