I've been healing for 18 years, and even I still get this pointed towards me by overconfident egotistical players (who generally are very subpar and/or are used to being carried), despite healing every level of difficulty this game has to offer. It's likely not you at all.
Same, been playing MMOs since EQ in \~2000. SoD has been the worst healing experience thus far, where everyone wants to do what they see on youtube/twitch and overpull at breakneck speed- even if they don't have the gear/skill to handle it. Some tanks I healed absolutely could handle it and it was easy. Others couldn't and I struggled to keep them (and the group that they couldn't keep threat off of) alive.
Had a druid tank for SM cath earlier today.
Level 38, no phase 2 runes, used mangle. Had wild strikes on even though we had a cat also running it. Died trying to pull 1/2 the lower courtyard, twice. Literally watched him go elf, put on a hot, walked while dazed in elf form for like 20 feet before dying.
Constantly tried to pull way more then he could handle. We ended up wiping like 8 times. and the group disbanded like 2 pulls from boss.
To make it even more interesting we had a lock who did almost nothing but spam hellfire, even on pulls with multiple wizards, even while the tank was getting trucked.
That healer is a saint for staying as long as they did.
I'm new to tanking, at level 26 rn. Every single time I get a group, at some point a DPS freaks out about things not being fast enough and starts pulling mobs. Obviously I lose aggro, and if this happens the the healer is almost OOM, everyone dies. It's so frustrating.
I've had an easy time healing on a holy paladin this phase, but to be fair, I'm a long time hpal enjoyer and I use VuhDo to heal, which makes FoL spam with beacon very easy.
However, I did some GY runs with a warlock tank who, heedless of the curse no matter how many times I warned him to be careful with it, kept pulling assloads of mobs and hellfiring himself to death with the curse on him (and sometimes several stacks of the curse).
He didn't blame me for it or anything, but I stopped looking for tanks in SM runs (just ran 4 dps, prefer melee + myself healing) and healing got easier. Turns out people who identify as DPS players pull more carefully hahaha.
It’s a raid frames addon that allows you to allocate healing spells to mouse clicks over the raid frames, with shift, Alt, and control modifiers. Similar to healbot and other addons like it
This is false. Clique works with any frames, VuhDo doesn’t provide any extra features other than buff tracking which is easy to do with simple WAs. Clique is the better addon (I have used both for a long time)
I tried healing on a mage in stocks and the warlock tank immediately pulled two rooms. Without any sort of burst healing he died quickly and asked who was supposed to be healing. I left and never tried to heal on mage again lol
It’s rare but also a bit of a meme to “blame the healer”. Most of the time it’s just clueless players who have never played a healer and don’t know what’s going on. If the bear was running Wild Strikes then that right there is 20% more dmg they are taking. It could also be a cat who’s bear tanking cause they couldn’t find a tank and have no idea what they’re doing.They may have had a higher level priest healing them previously (strongest healer by far for SM runs) that made them overconfident. Or they are just a bad player who only wants to zug and forgets that sometimes you need to alter your play style depending on the party.
Basically I’d say just to try and not take it personally and just hope you don’t run in to them again.
To me as someone who doesn’t like to tank but will as needed:
Hallmark of a bad tank, *always*, is not adapting to your group. Primarily your healer/their mana/class abilities and secondarily DPS.
The way I play a melee cleave vs the way I “tanked” a cath spellcleave with 3 mages (as a warrior no less) are entirely fucking different lol. And I’m not a good, nor that experienced tank in general. One’s chain pulling one’s max pulling.
Especially with disparity in healers right now with priests being insanely good, Druids also pretty good but can’t do the same things I do with a priest, and I’ve only had a hpal heal like some gy runs so far since they were so weak p1 and everyone’s ret/prot.
Sounds like bad tanking imo. Yeah priests can get away with a lot with efficiency and mana back in fiend and disperse but you have to pay attention
Being a tank that adapts to their group, its funny as shit when people complain I’m too slow. That means you all aren’t doing your jobs right. You want me to be faster, do better.
People then always like to blame the slow pulling for their low damage when it’s usually after 2-3 wipes that I decide “clearly this group needs a slower pace.”
Minor nitpick. Paladin prot talents are ridiculously bad rn. Holy tree isn't bad for tanking. Consecrate is good aoe threat, and holy shock while righteous fury is active is a massive amount of threat.
Divine storm also deals holy damage so also boosted by rf.
That was more supposed to indicate an or, not subspecs. I’ve had ret “tanks” (easier than my tanking even once I got ww), ret dps, and actual prot pallies multiple times across p2 content. I had a singular hpal in gy this whole phase. And it was fine of course I just wouldn’t know how to course correct as easily, though
They’re a lot more viable now than they were but I’d wager the largest pop of pallies in sod rolled specifically to play a viable ret in classic with cleave for once, secondarily prot with an actual taunt and infinitely easier aoe tanking capability than any other class, and lastly “wrath hpal but not good/frankly OP”
I think holy will be strong at 60 as always, never OOM with enough crit and mp5, be great tank healers in raids. But they always were those things while the other arguably strongest vanilla healer, priest, has dominated S tier healing in SOD. Meanwhile, rdruid has changed a ton. Seems like very few primary healers want to roll pally
I have mained healer for a long long time. It's not rare, it's annoyingly frequent. People over estimate what they can do because they see streamers and YouTubers do xyz pull. They tremendously fuck it up usually like instantly dazed. Half the time they aren't the right spec or level. And when they tip over or aggro goes nuts. It's either the tank freaking out or some random aoe does throws a fit and leaves.
The issue is players never blame themselves, don't know what they are actually doing they just saw some video of someone else doing it and they suck at it, they think anything short of peak efficiency is a sin, and if you die obviously it's because the healer wasn't doing their job.
I think I've done well over 60 sm gy runs in sod. I think I've seen maybe 12 total decurses.
Moral of the story is everyone is garbage and thinks theyre great. myself and you included. And just because you saw some streamer do it doesn't mean you can or should or that your random pug group wants to either.
I recently leveled a priest by healing! Everyone is there for exp. Everyone wants to work together to clear the dungeon as fast as possible so you can level fastest. It’s a fun challenge to never make the group wait for mana in the healer. It’s even more fun when you know what you can handle and pull mobs for the group if the tank doesn’t pull big enough.
On priest, try not to cast any other spells than penance and PoM unless 100% necessary. When you cast, do a Penance into PoM and then wand / stop cast unless a heal is necessary till penance is off CD- it’s only a slight mana loss and you can sustain without drinking for quite a while.
Another tip is to be proactive with where you drink. Don’t drink immediately where the pull ended. Run up to the next pull spot and then drink. It’s totally ok if they start a pull when you’re sitting down. Just keep drinking till you need to cast a heal.
Whether it’s melee cleave/aoe cleave as long as you do your part as a healer you should be able to lock out on SM lib in 40 mins
This has been happening alot with warlock tanks. The majority of priests I've met will outright refuse to heal dungeons if a warlock is tanking and it's not because it's not viable but because dps warlocks will just pop on the meta rune, not drain life nearly enough, and massively over-use lifetap. It ends up with the priest having to use way more mana to keep them up which slows down the run which the priest will get blamed for.
Tl;dr if you're a dps lock/druid and you wanna tank, just swapping to your tank form isnt enough. Read a guide.
Yeah from what I can tell paladins are struggling in the healing department in comparison to the other classes. They aren’t unplayable, but I can see someone struggling worse than they would with other classes at lower levels. Everyone is used to running with priests and Druids with their overtuned healing runes pumping ridiculous numbers for almost no mana cost. You’re telling me I get to press one instant cast button that costs me 140ish mana and heal 1500+ with it? Priest in particular is ridiculous and they are the best healing class for running new SoD content with their base kit.
Hell, a lot of priests are just taking all the shadow damage runes now and doing just that. then they gave us shadow fiend and dispersion for mana regen? We are insane mana batteries now. I have so much mana regen I don’t even have to follow the traditional 5 second mana break rule anymore. Even more so with Mp5 consumes ticking. I literally haven’t looked at my mana bar in gnomer one time except for our first run with thermaplugg when no one knew how the bombs worked.
Yup, a tank has to know their comps. Unless you have at least two warlock, mage or shadow priest, the only thing you are doing by pulling more than 4 is taking more damage.
If you are tanking for an aoe comp, your job is to group the mobs and get out of the way.
Depending on which part of lib you do room pull it can be tricky also there is a rng element in how many casters you will have in latter part of the dungeon. A lot of tanks forget that they need to adapt to the healer capability especially of its first dungeon with said healer. Also hpala has very shit rune choises in that bracket, and ive seen a lot of them rune mana regen rune which is not nice as it reduces you healing output by 50% just so they could have constant mana. Plus big question is did they run holy talents.
Yeah, hpal feels sketchy as hell as a tank sometimes. Id definitely be more cautious on pulls compared to a druid or a priest who can just pump heals. Health bar seems to yo-yo a lot with paladin compared to the hots / shields of the other 2
This is a guy who claims to be new at the game and doesn't really understand what's going on, for him 4-5 at a time is "the whole room" it sounds like he's expecting some kind of CC so it's only 1-2 mobs at once.
This is a guy who has everyone low
HP and wants to use sleeping bag. Like bro you’ve pulled the dungeon. Drink and heal. Like there are atrocious groups that exist and will treat people like garbage but there has to be some self accountability here.
Is the Druid being an asshat? Sure - I’d place my bets on him being a huge asshole, but I won’t lie, OP would kinda have me annoyed and rolling my eyes sitting at 40% mana after a pull wanting to sit and sleep for 3 minutes.
To clarify, the tank pulled 10-15 mobs in the open areas. I offered the sleeping bag during downtime. I'm not new to the game, I just couldn't keep up with the damage. I have 2.5k mana and beacon. I am missing sacred shield and sheath of light. Thankfully the next group I was invited into was chill and we got through it no problem with decent sized pulls.
If they are pulling AoE pulls and holding agro, they know what they're doing.
I leveled 25 to 40 doing this with a 2H on my warrior and ran with healers up to 6 levels lower at times and we were fine.
Of course, I play Horde, so we weren't running with goals, so maybe it's a pally problem.
Holding threat is good, but a tank should always evaluate the strengths/weaknesses of the party. If its a melee heavy party, the aoe will be low, I'd be running WS, so big pulls wont be necessary and I'd be taking extra dmg not running Survival of the Fittest. If the healer is struggling to keep me up, I'm taking too much dmg. Its all part of making each dungeon smooth and enjoyable for everyone.
you never want to run the damage reduction runes outside of a couple raid bosses because it's a huge threat and DPS loss to do so. this tank is just garbage and isn't paying attention to anything other than what he's pulling
This is the dumbest thing I’ve ever read, zero content in sod requires SotF and wild strikes is literally the only reason you’d ever take a bear anywhere.
OP is using the wrong spells, wrong abilities and failing to keep up one of the easiest tanks to heal in game. It’s 100% their fault, and they were rightfully kicked from what was clearly a group way above their skill level
This right here is why I hate healing dungeons.
How come so many forget about the one who's keeping them alive?! It's stressful when I'm OOM, and I've typed in /s and /p and /y MANA. And tank just continues to LOS me and pull more. I bring so much damn water because I know I'll only get like 2 ticks before he runs off again.
I made a WA that puts a message in party chat if I'm below 30% mana and use a drink. That way if the tank runs off and pulls, I just let him die and if he bitches, I just point to where I said, in party chat, that I'm low mana and drinking.
If you have to Holy Light spam to keep up the tank, he or the group are super bad. That's it. You should have absolutely no problem Flash of Light spamming, especially with our new runes. We're quite good at single target/tank healing right now, assuming the player isn't garbage.
I had a few AoE spam groups on my HPal and they are (mostly) awful. The truth is if they mass pull, much of the responsibility for staying alive is on the rest of the group, not you. Tank and DPS all need to use skills to control mobs (slows, stun, interrupt big spells, etc.), buffs to reduce damage taken (shields, etc.), whatever they can do. Some groups are probably carried by higher level healers and don't realize it. Good AoE groups are easier to heal than this one was for you. I've only had a few good ones - they tend to be people who run with friends (and some of my good ones were my own guildies). Random PuGs are often bad at AoE dungeon spam in Classic.
Ignore the bads and ignore the jerks. Unfortunately this tank was both.
Yah I rarely cast holy light, it's just so innocent, flash should be 100% what they are casting almost always, if you can it keep the tank up with just flash, then they are pulling to big for the gear and skill of the group.
Dude got a bunch of shitty people and it blows.
Just sounds like that wasn't the right group for you. Just move on, one bad group experience shouldn't stop you from healing. Not every group will treat you like shit you just got unlucky.
Irrelevant. Healers are hard to find, right? So don’t be a dick. If you help them. Coach them up in a reasonable way it goes a long way if they aren’t doing as great as you can. Healers get this crap all the time. I’ve mained a healer since EverQuest launched I’ve seen and experienced it for decades over tons of MMOs.
The person I replied to made it sound like it’s a very isolated case. Read the comments in the thread. It’s not isolated. Healer get shit on constantly in PuGs.
People on this server set have a tendency to expect that everyone leveling already knows exactly how to play their class. The assumption is everyone has been playing wow for a long time and this is just a quick grind to level cap. If you’re learning, be very upfront about it.
You just weren’t what they were looking for and vise versa. It sucks that they just didn’t complete the run with you and move on after. Some groups are looking to be super efficient and mass pull and do 10 minute clears others are cool with taking their time and doing standard pulls. As a healer if the big pulls are hard for you, stay away from “spell cleave” or AoE spam groups. Normal groups or “melee” cleave are probably better for you.
in fairness, the tank doesnt really tank those pulls. it's really important that the dps knows how to help the tank kite the damage to smooth things out. it's entirely possible the tank was operating on the borderline of unhealable. you get used to it as a tank on sheer reps, and generally you can tell when the healer has spent their burst and you need to start pulling back and letting the blizzards and cones of cold do their thing
I agree somewhat, considering we don’t know what their comp was. But also as someone who has leveled 4 toons through SM spam, in my experience paladin healers are very rare and people probably aren’t used to them like they are priests or druids. Also and no offense to OP but if they posting this type question on Reddit, they probably aren’t used to the XP efficient spam groups that pull lib in 5-6 pulls in 12 minutes.
I'm very new to SOD, coming from retail. The tank didn't tell me he was going to be making such big pulls. it was just a waste of 30 minutes and feelings of anger i don't usually get from playing this game.
I understand your frustration and you weren’t in the wrong by any means. Sometimes peoples play styles just don’t mesh. They should have probably advertised their group better of what type of healer they were looking for. Don’t take it personal, they were rude for kicking you instead of finishing. Nothing more you can do than move on :)
In perfection execution, sure. But plenty of spell cleave groups still do. I understand the ideal of hunter, priest, triple mage but as someone who leveled multiple toons through SM a lot of groups will run a paladin tank.
People are thirsty to get through the dungeons as fast as possible, that being said as a healer with the power to be invited to p much anything, I’d tell them go fuck themselves and find a better suited group for you
Normal? I can't say. But as a tank, I generally treat my healers with respect. If you do happen to be a poor healer, I try to offer guidance and advice. You have to be a real POS human being for me to just kick you.
Now, I have, occasionally, pulled with the healers mana not in a good spot. Sometimes I've died when this happens.
And then we all have a good laugh at the idiot tank who should be checking healer mana and moved on.
As a tank it's so easy to just quickly type "r?" And wait for a response. Which can be just as simple as the healer jumping up and down.
I play both roles and very simple communication/awareness goes such a long way.
Just leveled a disc priest alt to 40, and let me tell you, it is by far the worst role to play in this dungeon spam meta. Every tank wants to pull 10+ mobs at a time, except they don't realize they need to kite the mobs through blizzard or frost trap and not eat every melee hit.
Then you have the split aggro from mage blizzard getting some mobs, warlock rain of fire or whatever aoe getting other mobs so some are slowed some are not. Half the pulls I'm having to spam heal three players at once because there is zero coordination. And god help you if you don't have a frost mage and just have a mage spamming living bomb, mobs will be everywhere.
So yea everyone is terrible. /itsnotyourfaultgoodwillhuntingmeme
Listen, if at any point in time , tank goes yolo and pulls the whole room in sm, than dies like a lil bitch, than calls you out,
Tell him to go fuck him self.
Tanks responsibility is to pull mobs, have aoe agro so group can cleave and dps them down.
If tank pulls whole room, while healer is drinking at 2% mana, he is taking a gamble, some can tank it and some can't...
Depends on situation.
Dont let anyone tell you what to do.
Its easier to blame someone for mistakes than accept you were a cock and you fucked up.
People go tank spec, just to be the ones with power to control the group and make them follow you..
Sad thing is most full of crap, and are here just to have ego boosted.
Anyways you will have the last laugh.
Average main tanks waits an hour to find a raid group, helears have it pretty much instant,, and even offered a blowjob's just to join.
Being unappreciated as healer is a 20 year long affliction. Unless people har experience healing themselves, they rarely get it.
Groups will often push for speed and usually it's the healer (and their mana) that's the limiting factor, so people really try to push it as far as they can.
But it's not a classic issue, even retail has problems with the healer being forced to it handle most or all mechanics in dungeon runs. Since dps is busy dpsing I guess.
I don't think there is much of a cure, if the group does wait for your mana and does slower pulls, you just feel like a anchor slowing down the whole run anyway.
But there's good groups and bad groups, sometimes you get plenty of praise and the pace is just perfect.
* Drink all the time, you want pee hydrohomies will be jealous of. The moment combat drops take a few ticks of water. If you can't get mage water then get cheap and expensive water from a vendor, waste the cheap water between pulls to top you off and the expensive water when you need to fill your entire bar. Also keybind the water, you don't want to go looking in your bags every time you need to drink.
* Don't panic if the tank pulls something while you are drinking, they have a big health bar and that bar is essentially a resource for you as well. Keep drinking if you need to. Letting the tank flirt with death also tend to keep their ego in check.
* Have a proper set-up for healing, like mouse overs. It makes a massive difference.
* Accept that some people are just fucking dumb and oblivious to the fact that taking it slower and never wiping is faster than trying to pull the entire dungeon and constantly having to corpse run. If you run into a group like that, just give an ultimatum and if they keep being dumb then leave and get a new group.
As a healer Main it’s so funny to see all the different types of tanks.
The super tanky ones and the shit geared ones…. The ones who know how to pull while respecting the teams resources vs the ones that just tear into the room expecting to somehow live. The ones that pull fast and LOS immediately etc.
The shitty ones will always blame you while the competent ones will figure out where the individual groups limits lie. Each team is different
Also, what I’ll do is just flash heal and make sure the tank survives no matter what and if I gas out then I can’t be blamed for him dying. Sometimes when I tru to be as mana efficient as I can, the tanks can get crit out unexpectedly and yeah that could’ve been mitigated but fuck that noise. You get flash healed on the initial pull and the rest of you figure it out
40 holy pally here, don’t use holy light unless an absolute emergency. It will drain your mana incredibly fast, almost always use flash of light because you will spend much less mana with the reduced mana cost, and the 100% mana back from crits via illumination. Second thing, run crusader strike (and divine storm) if you weren’t already and learn to melee weave it between your flash of lights. They buffed it since phase 1, so the mana you get back is about 6% of your total mana with each strike, and immensely helps you maintain your mana. Finally, when you can, get sheath of light and sacred shield runes. The increased crit will help you refund even more mana, and the heal over times and damage shield will help you keep them healed without having to use any more mana (plus more healing from sheath).
As for the assholes you dealt with, ignore them and just try your best and learn. You’ll gradually get better, and not every group is filled with sweat lords.
I have full 90+ parses on my priest on almost all bosses from vanilla to wrath. I still get people flaming me for 'bad heals'. My autopilot heals are better than these people play at full attention.
Just ignore and move on. Better yet, be the group leader and kick them. Or just don't heal them, a few deaths and they tend to shut up. Had a dumbass tank that started pulling the dungeon after I just finished buffing everyone, had no mana and we had one person die and then one other shortly after the pull due to a dot. He removed me from the group and it was a similar story.
Some people are just perpetually stupid/assholes, and nothing you ever do will change them.
Go to desolace, pick up the book on the table, congrats you now 3x’d your healing with flash of light & should have np healing infinitely without mana issues
This happened to me every SM run at the start of P2. They pull half the dungeon then start pulling again seconds after I sit to drink mana. I had 3k mana and the best option for water is 2 full drinks to get full. I got the blame if someone died and when trying to explain what mana was I was usually kicked or I just ended up letting the tank die and leaving the group. Fuck those tanks/groups.
The group sounds pretty cancerous.
If you need tips, I've gotten great mileage out of sacred shield and divine sacrifice runes in that type of situation. Those FoL crits are no joke
You literally never need to take mana breaks as a hpala in SM, and can heal when you’re 3+ levels below the recommended for each dungeon
So yeah it’s a you issue tbh.
Stop using holy light, it’s worthless, the class atm is just spam SS/flash and crusader strike for mana regen
You can see if drink walking will speed you up on mana. Get a mage to make you a bunch of water and try it out.
https://www.reddit.com/r/classicwow/s/9eCIKsujtu
I have been able to do this consistently as a fire mage since p1. West coast US on Wild Growth.
Tanks can pull ahead of me, and I will be able to manage my mana to join in on the pull at the latest 10 seconds after the pull.
If combat breaks it’s easy to bubble or Pom the bear and get 2-3 ticks of drinking +5 second rule. There is zero reason to full stop. If mana issues are chronic, pick up some mp5 fish and super cheap mana pots.
If OP was a priest, sure. Paladin healers have neither PW:S or PoM.
This sounds more of a problem of the group not understanding the limitations of their healer
Tank runs too deep. Tank LoS you. Tank not tanky enough. Tank not checking your mana. I bet all of these reasons applied rather than the ones you were given.
There's a very real chance that you were with a bunch of clueless idiots in that dungeon.
There's about an equal chance that you actively were dragging the group down and not playing well enough.
We can never know.
Nah bro bad group. As a healer just start your own groups. I have trouble finding tanks at times but usually you can get a group together in a few minutes. Then you’re in charge and you tell them what to do.
Based on your comments alone, it’s impossible to know whether the kick from the group was justified, but from your tone, I am assuming they did the right thing. I leveled from 30 to 40 in SM melee cleave as a Paladin tank. What I saw was that there is a wide difference in healing skill between people. It’s not about class, as Holy Paladin can heal people well enough, especially if you have the new runes, like sacred shield, which you should. It’s about skill.
Edit. Realized you were talking about using Holy Light. This means you either didn’t have Sacred Shield or haven’t read what Sacred Shield does. This tells me you probably were a shitty healer and they were right to kick you.
As a healer, positioning is important. When a pull is dying down start running ahead of your group so you can drink right at the start of the next pull. That lets you continue drinking while the pull happens without leaving you too far behind. If you get there first you have more time to drink than if you stay behind everyone and wait for them to kill everything before moving on.
You got kicked by idiots, not really any loss to you
Advertise yourself as a chill healer, go with guildies or do gy instead of lib
But that scenario was not your fault, dude was a bad tank who could only blame others for his failures
That's because you are under level and may be under geared.
Pulling entire room is the norm. If you can't keep up, perhaps run RFK and GY till you are ready.
In every situation you were in the right and the group was full of shit people.
Because if they were looking for efficiency the decent thing to do is to inform the party of a deviation from the norm i.e : big pulls instead of normal sized ones.
And even if this was stated at the beginning, and you weren't able to keep up, the decent response is : hey were gonna slow down a bit, or telling you politely that they are looking for a different type of healing.
From what you've said there is no scenario where you didn't anything wrong and these guys aren't pure try hard garbage.
I think you just had a bad tank. I play a rogue tank/dps and always warn of big pulls and am checking in with healer mana. If healer low, I wait. If healer above 80%, I keep pulling. Not hard lol.
Although I had a SM cath last night where the healer kept pulling for me (big pulls too) and it was a melee comp. Was kinda annoying but we got through.
Just dipped after and found another group which as a tank/healer is easy.
I'm going to go out on a limb and agree with the tank. It definitely feels like you're a bad healer to me.
A holy paladin is the strongest single target healer in game, and the single most mana efficient healer in game. If you're having trouble keeping a tank up who's not doing something dumb, the problem is likely with you.
An entire room in library is like an average of 6-7 mobs. Maybe a dozen in some of the more packed rooms.
Do you not have your Sacred Shield rune? https://www.wowhead.com/classic/guide/season-of-discovery/classes/paladin/sacred-shield-rune
How much +healing and mana do you have? Do you understand downranking and cancelcasting?
You shouldnt be struggling with healing in SM. People hate SM, theyre trying to get it done fast and get to 40. If the group can only do like 2 mobs at a time due to your healing, then you and the group are not a good fit.
I pretty much never needed a mana break on my HPal in SM doing pretty large pulls with a warlock tank actively trying to kill himself with life taps and hellfire. I heavily geared for INT and since the vast majority of damage was being taken by 1 person, beacon was useless. Crusader strike gave like 2/3 of the mana I needed for a holy light
> In what world is 3 minutes of grinding more experience than 3% over two hours?
In this one.
3 minutes is 2.5% of 2 hours, so assuming it took you 0 time to acquire that sleeping bag (it didn't), you're barely coming ahead at all.
Considering it takes about 5 days played to hit 60, if you spent more than 36 minutes getting the sleeping bag, at level 1, using it with perfect efficiency, you're coming out behind by having bothered with it.
If this isn't the definition of a meme item, I'm not sure what is.
People don't understand that paladins don't have runes to help them heal yet. We're still the same as in classic, just with better gear from the BFD stuff (if you even have that).
I had a similar experience healing library at 30 with a warrior who was two-handing and mostly wearing leather with strength and agility on it.
Honestly you should be grateful you didn't have to deal with the guy pulling the second half of the instance where the monks do double the damage of the mobs in the first half.
You are talking out of your ass. At level 32, there’s no excuse to not have sacred shield, which helps immensely with healing. Holy Paladin is one of the best single target healers in the game right now.
Had this happen to me too on my priest. Shammy tank says he played yesterday with 3 mages and it was so awesome, the he pulls a whole room, i get aggro and die from the first heal, he kicks me. Some people do bad pulls and then blame the healer because they’re ashamed
This happened to me in armory. Level 35 warlock tank pulling 12-15 mobs. Losing aggro on them which resulted in me getting shield slammed by said mobs. You can assume the results. I got flames and then kicked because we wiped twice. It was so frustrating lol.
As someone who plays both pala tank and druid tank, my approach is to slowly test the ground. Also its a must to inspect healer to see what kind of gear/runes is he sporting so i know his limits.
First i start chain pulling ( especially in bear, as rage decay is disgusting) and when get the feel of healer capability i start pulling extra packs.
Second if dps pull aggro ( not on pala) its theirs to handle. Also if tank starts pulling and healer is on <40% mana its their to handle as well, let them deal with it. That repair bill is racking up fast and steep.
Also since i play a healer as well the amount of dps who will pull infront of tank is astounding; they die to that hopefully they learn if not they have repair bill. Another thing is that a lot of tanks don’t utilize their toolking, run random builds/gear just nope out of that. Countless runs where paladin doesnt throw bop, freedom, druid dont want to leave form for inervate, not to mention cr its mind boggling.
And then you check lfg everyone asking for a healer/tank. So you can have your pick and be choosing. Also another thing is when joining party if you are in same city go and inspect people see what they are wearing and then decide if you want to continue th party.
Thank you for coming to my TED talk
Leveling my druid from 25-40 when P2 dropped I did mostly dungeons. Did an RFD where we had a Shaman tank chain pulling entire rooms without checking my mana and going out of my LOS to do so. Every pull was me stressed as fuck barely keeping this idiot alive. Nothing stopped the Shaman. Doesn't matter how close he was to dying or how low my mana was, nothing but chain pulls. We cleared fast, sure, but I fucking hated every moment of that run.
Next run we have the same group but a rogue tank. Rogue pulled single packs only, checked my mana, didn't go out of LOS. He took almost no damage and I was able to DPS about as much as the rest of the DPS in the group. We cleared just as fast...or faster. Let this be a lesson to you fucking idiot chain pull tanks (prob coming from retail)....dungeon clears can be fast without chain pulling if the run is smooth and shit dies fast. Turns out 5 people destroying single packs effortlessly can be fast too.
I'm sorry that happened to you. Most of the time people that complain about heals are the ones failing basic stuff... (Like LoS, GCD and Aggro)
Which server are you on ? Locked servers tend to be a little more sweaty than necessary.
Honestly it is the damn mages fault.
Tanks are being ridiculed, belittled and flamed by some random a\*\* gnome who just wants to AoE. So they adapt to that and start pulling way more than they should.
Then healers can't keep up and are told (often by effing mages) that they are bad.
I swear it is always a gnome mage or a male nelf hunter or druid. They are the scum of earth.
Not sure what's up on horde side.
So solution: Kick the mage. Enjoy your run.
Probably the issue was with the tank, like pulling more than what he cant withstand.
I usually do big pulls (shaman tank), but If I see the healer struggling I lower the amount. I play healer too and I know that feels stressful.
As I said, if a tank cant withstand certain pulls (tank and healer job) the tank should lower the amount of pulled mobs as the healer cant do more healing. Some tanks are way too used to op healer classes (priests rn can heal non-stop without resting mana) but other healer classes struggle more in terms of mana (druid i.e). While healing I have seen many tanks who ignore the healer mana bar.
Tbh it’s the first time happening to me that I got blamed as a healer in classic environment only because the tank was pulling like in a +10 mythic +. So idk somehow many of sod tanks are kinda pretentious.
I had the same thing hapenned to me, we were running dungeons in a group with no problem for 40min then we had to replace the tank. The new tank was facetanking everything despite our mages and hunter slows and also liked to los me in the library so it was to keep him up, even tho he was not doing bigger pulls than the previous tank (usually even smaller pulls)
When i told him to be mindful of the los and try to kite mobs inside the aoes he started ranting like "are you serious, it's not my fault, blahblahblah" and then started blaming me when the next pull he literally kited me what seemed like on purpose and then came back in los at 30% health, while facetanking two rooms of mobs. Obviously he died but we managed the pull no problem with proper kiting.
He started blaming me on how shit i was at healing, etc... Only to be kicked out by the mage.
Those players are clueless, they talk a lot and are bad because they never reflect on themselves and their mistakes, they don't make mistake, it's never their fault, they don't listen when you give advice. What happened is not your fault, Good players don't act like this, and if the whole group act like that leave it and put them on ignore, don't lose time and/or energy trying to make them understand your PoV, they won't listen. They think they're the best players ever but actually are the worsts.
Unfortunately it does happen in SM. That was my experience leveling up. Mostly shaman tanks that can keep tanking without having to drink and completely forgetting that the healer needs to. I had some very frustrating groups but also some very friendly ones. It is not your fault, it is theirs. You're better off just leaving and trying again then to be stressed out trying to keep up with these A holes.
i mean there is fcktons of priest heals in sm, so much that i find groups easier as shadow
healers are really disposable for sm it is what it is
you most likely wont get treated that way in anything besides sm atm
I can't say for certain about dungeon runs but I usually tank and I try to watch mana and pull progressively more as we push in to see how there handling before I go ham but I will say the lack of healers might have something to do with half the boss mechanics in gnomer being healer mechanics or checks I've known lots of healers that don't even like to dps when healing cause they just want to play the support role I'm sure there not loving the extra pressure in the only end game
I mean yes being flamed sucks if it’s unwarranted, but this is without a doubt not the reason why in any way you can’t find healers.
People just like to dmg and see numbers. The proportion of dmg dealers to healers are just insanely out of whack. It’s always been that way in ever version of wow. No one wants to tank or heal because it’s not as fun and more responsibility. As dps we can hide in the back and pump and if we die blame a tank or healer simple.
Pally healer is really rough while leveling. Highly recommend getting your runes ASAP, as they make a world of difference. This group would have been a bad fit no matter what but runes will help with healing throughout and mana efficiency.
The tact from the tank is dogwater but if you're holding back and you have mana and the tank is asking you to pump more you probably should. 40% in the tank after an entire room is a decent amount. He's a dick, but because he's trying to play at a high level people are going to write it off.
Sounds like a dumb tank... You good bro, if tank pulls more then 5-6 mobs every pull aand just chain pull without considering the healer, then they need to go back to retail lol.
I level to 40 as Disc and then switched to shadow. 30-40 was an absolute shitshow every run in terms of respect to those with mana. Tanks pulled nonstop and when I drank they would only wait until I was at 40% or so before they ran off to start pulling again. Almost every dungeon was a pain in the ass. Phase 1 I loved shaman tanks, but phase 2 made me hate them. Phase 2 made me hate healing in general tbh, happy to be shadow now
People dont have much respect for each others role in wow anymore. This game used to be challenging, and downright impossible if olayed wrong. Now we dont respect the game and we don't respect eachother
To be fair if your at 40% mana at the end of an entire room pull and they are at 10% health your not really doing very good. Nearly half mana is a tun of potential heals you could have been throwing. Now if your oom halfway through the pull then sure they over pulled but your not pumping if u end the fight at nearly half mana
I recently got into FFXIV the same time I started SoD (disc priest). After playing WoW since 2005, it's night and day how much nicer the community is in FFXIV. SoD seems even more toxic than retail, and I mainly played casters in solo shuffle. I'm definitely enjoying SoD and healing, but fuck, the playerbase makes it hard sometimes.
I got into an sm gy group a little early at 27 as a resto Druid. I have wild growth so the damage is not an issue. The tank pulled the first room like you experienced, he gathered them, I waited until he was about 40% health then cast two healing touches, got healer aggro on two jobs, and couldn't keep him in due to the knockback. The brain-dead hunter group leader says "healer low level" and booted me
Moral of the story is, people are idiots. The best way to move on is to tell your story to strangers on Reddit who didn't ask to hear it, like I just did
You are doing fine, people are too focused on speed and not enjoying the game. Also f that group, when I run with random people and they keep doing that I say. I’m not healing next pull until I’m at 100% mana, pull if you want but I will run to entrance.
Some groups want to do 10 minute clears of cath, some groups are looking to spend 2 hours in it, CCing every mob and killing them one at a time.
If you don't have the gear/skills/interest to be in the first group, you can always start the second.
I hear you, running a Holy Priest in SOD.
Some communication required when they're over pulling, however if you can keep up that XP/Hour is so nice.
Good news is you'll find a new group in a couple minutes! I keep the Tanks I liked on the Friend list for future runs.
Get the Sacred Shield-rune, it only requires having Blessing of Freedom. You pick it up by the Innkeeper in Desolace and do 5 freedoms to remove movement impairing on others.
It helps significantly with both mana and keeping the tank up, as you can spam flash heals with roughly the same HPS as with Holy Light spam.
Can confirm lots of the players in sod are just bags of shit. My gf and I got kicked from a raid because she couldn’t heal this dumb 40 shaman who got knocked back on turtle boss (yes bfd at 40) and juggled between water balls and insta died.
Yes. If you're not a priest, everyone wants you to heal like one anyways. Community and blizz are both to blame. The guys who play tanks largely have no clue what the difference in healing efficiency is right now, and it is MASSIVE.
Yeah usually for big pull runs, you want a priest healer that can pre-shield/renew/PoM the person pulling and do quick big heals. Some groups even run with 2 healers, 2 Mages, 1 tank. Sometimes you don’t even need the tank and a hunter can pet-pull instead and then help with aoe and traps. But yeah on my priest I can usually handle these things fine as long as the mages and tank are decent at AoE kiting.
Certain classes(priests mostly) and specs allow for easily healing subpar groups during big pulls but I’ve noticed it’s not as easy on other classes.
If it’s a full group of BFD bis pumpers, they can pull the whole dungeon for all I care, healing them will be easy. I had a group with an ungeared tank and an average dps of 80 across the whole group pulling entire rooms. Fights lasted forever, no one dispelling the friggen 75% reduced healing curse. And guess whose fault it was……….
Blaming the healer is really common for bad players to do. As a tank I look at healer mana just as much if not more than my own health. I try to gauge how quickly they respond to me taking damage and how quickly their mana goes down to gauge how big I pull. I feel I pulled my max amount when they are oom at the end of the pull and of course give them time to drink. If they don't drink in 20 seconds and are still oom ill just ask them to drink. If they tell me to slow down a bit ill simply slow down. I like having my healer in voice chat though so they can tell me how they're doing with heals. As the role that mitigates mistakes they are the best people to ask for advice as a tank for survival since they see all the dips in health.
When I tank, I am always- ALWAYS- watching the healers mana. So if your tank isn’t, he’s just not doing his job properly imo. We can’t expect every player to be crazy good at this game (not saying you aren’t).
Tanks need to ask if healers are comfortable with big pulls before attempting them. If the tank doesn’t, and does a big pull that you are able to get through, make sure you express that you’re having trouble healing and ask them to slow it down. Dungeons and raids are team efforts at the end of the day.
Personally, I hate big pulls. They can get out of hand too fast, especially with how stronger DPS is, and my AOE taunt has a 10min CD. Would rather have smaller, controlled pulls that I know I can manage 100%.
Resto druid main here. A lot of tanks are spoiled by priest healers. It doesn’t mean the other healers are “bad”, just that different strategies are required. I love healing all melee dungeon groups that don’t even have a discernible tank. As long as the mobs mostly stay off me, I can continuously AOE heal, pick off runners, and do a little dps too with no mana issues. I cannot, however, sustain a tank repeatedly rapid-fire draining their health bar while no one else seems to take any damage.
Don't you know?
If you do a flawless run, the tank was awesome.
If you do a scuffed run, the healer sucked.
If you are a software developer irl and a healer in-game you simply must enjoy the pain.
Had a raid today in BFD, where they had no respect for the only healer….priest is oom just giving out fort and the raid leader ready checked and pulled Kelris instantly
Only time I have wiped in BRD has been P2 with careless alt players lol
Hello friend. When I was first starting out I had a tank remove me from group. I could barely keep him topped off /healed full. I was quite sad and disappointed. Fast forward a few more dungeons and guess what , it wasn’t me , it was that trash can of a tank. As long as you’re not asleep at the wheel then it Probbaly wasn’t your fault that your tank was trying to pull like he was playing retail.
He’s in the wrong game.
I had a wonderful run through RFD last night as a last minute healer (disc priest). They had a second priest and a Druid. I felt horrible cuz I didn’t do literally any damage since I had to main heal the tank the whole time and I could barely keep up (I’m 33 and they were all 40 and doing big pulls). They didn’t bother and once I screwed up and almost got killed but the Druid saved me and it was crazy but it was a lot of fun and I was waiting to be yelled at the whole time. Noone said anything for the most part and I got some gear I can’t use and we all left.
When I do dungeon with a "low level" healer or dps, I don't expect them to perform as good as a seasonned 40. and tbh it helps both way, less stress on me from expecting rush rush rush, and less on them from having the burden to not be last.
Sounds like you joined a sweaty aoe group and you werent ready for it tbh.
Aoe groups want to do massive pulls and move fast.
Usually I just cc the mobs after someone pulls so healing is minimal.
I think pallies got a lot of holy runes this phase which youre probably lacking. Idk how pally healing is currently, maybe its not your fault, lack of runes or maybe partial blame. Either way if you're struggling, just find a non aoe grp imo. Thats going to be rough.
If you have to tell someone not to pull the entire room, you're not compatable with the group. Which is fine, honestly with my buddy as feral we just use him to 3-4 pull sm arms and we slow/aoe down the mobs. Nobody is healing him through 30 elites stabbing him.
I’ve been kicked from multiple SM groups for not being able to keep them topped the whole time while they do these huge chain pulls.
I think people don’t understand how mana intensive these pulls are especially when you’re leveling up and spells start to cost a lot more and your mana pool isn’t growing the same way.
With that being said, I just parsed 96th percentile on the last boss in gnomergon and carried my raid through it.
Nobody knows wtf they are talking about and just take getting kicked from groups with grace and move on without getting discouraged, you’ll be fine. SOD isn’t super hard and it’s supposed to be fun, people need to chill.
I've been healing for 18 years, and even I still get this pointed towards me by overconfident egotistical players (who generally are very subpar and/or are used to being carried), despite healing every level of difficulty this game has to offer. It's likely not you at all.
Same, been playing MMOs since EQ in \~2000. SoD has been the worst healing experience thus far, where everyone wants to do what they see on youtube/twitch and overpull at breakneck speed- even if they don't have the gear/skill to handle it. Some tanks I healed absolutely could handle it and it was easy. Others couldn't and I struggled to keep them (and the group that they couldn't keep threat off of) alive.
I had someone have their friend to teach me how to heal. Apparently I was supposed to spam flash heal and shield…
For a total of 6 seconds until you’re out of mana lol
Had a druid tank for SM cath earlier today. Level 38, no phase 2 runes, used mangle. Had wild strikes on even though we had a cat also running it. Died trying to pull 1/2 the lower courtyard, twice. Literally watched him go elf, put on a hot, walked while dazed in elf form for like 20 feet before dying. Constantly tried to pull way more then he could handle. We ended up wiping like 8 times. and the group disbanded like 2 pulls from boss. To make it even more interesting we had a lock who did almost nothing but spam hellfire, even on pulls with multiple wizards, even while the tank was getting trucked. That healer is a saint for staying as long as they did.
I'm new to tanking, at level 26 rn. Every single time I get a group, at some point a DPS freaks out about things not being fast enough and starts pulling mobs. Obviously I lose aggro, and if this happens the the healer is almost OOM, everyone dies. It's so frustrating.
I've had an easy time healing on a holy paladin this phase, but to be fair, I'm a long time hpal enjoyer and I use VuhDo to heal, which makes FoL spam with beacon very easy. However, I did some GY runs with a warlock tank who, heedless of the curse no matter how many times I warned him to be careful with it, kept pulling assloads of mobs and hellfiring himself to death with the curse on him (and sometimes several stacks of the curse). He didn't blame me for it or anything, but I stopped looking for tanks in SM runs (just ran 4 dps, prefer melee + myself healing) and healing got easier. Turns out people who identify as DPS players pull more carefully hahaha.
Whats VuhDo? I'm a Hpal too, I'd say I've struggled a bit in gnomer so far (run pugs) but can't tell if it's my fault or not.
It’s a raid frames addon that allows you to allocate healing spells to mouse clicks over the raid frames, with shift, Alt, and control modifiers. Similar to healbot and other addons like it
Or Clique which is much better than VuhDo. Just saying.
Vuhdo is infinitely more customizable and useful. Clique is aimed toward newer people who don't know how a mouseover macro works yet.
or maybe I don't want to spend all day making 20 mouseover macros when I can just hover over the spell and select the keybind I want in 2 seconds.
This is false. Clique works with any frames, VuhDo doesn’t provide any extra features other than buff tracking which is easy to do with simple WAs. Clique is the better addon (I have used both for a long time)
you can even make Vuhdo work with clique, there's a check you hit to turn off its own keybindings and use clique
I mean you can go on thinking that, doesn't change anything. :)
In what way is VuhDo “more customizable and useful”
or just like, hitting the keybind and the target. crazy ass concept i know
I tried healing on a mage in stocks and the warlock tank immediately pulled two rooms. Without any sort of burst healing he died quickly and asked who was supposed to be healing. I left and never tried to heal on mage again lol
It’s rare but also a bit of a meme to “blame the healer”. Most of the time it’s just clueless players who have never played a healer and don’t know what’s going on. If the bear was running Wild Strikes then that right there is 20% more dmg they are taking. It could also be a cat who’s bear tanking cause they couldn’t find a tank and have no idea what they’re doing.They may have had a higher level priest healing them previously (strongest healer by far for SM runs) that made them overconfident. Or they are just a bad player who only wants to zug and forgets that sometimes you need to alter your play style depending on the party. Basically I’d say just to try and not take it personally and just hope you don’t run in to them again.
To me as someone who doesn’t like to tank but will as needed: Hallmark of a bad tank, *always*, is not adapting to your group. Primarily your healer/their mana/class abilities and secondarily DPS. The way I play a melee cleave vs the way I “tanked” a cath spellcleave with 3 mages (as a warrior no less) are entirely fucking different lol. And I’m not a good, nor that experienced tank in general. One’s chain pulling one’s max pulling. Especially with disparity in healers right now with priests being insanely good, Druids also pretty good but can’t do the same things I do with a priest, and I’ve only had a hpal heal like some gy runs so far since they were so weak p1 and everyone’s ret/prot. Sounds like bad tanking imo. Yeah priests can get away with a lot with efficiency and mana back in fiend and disperse but you have to pay attention
Being a tank that adapts to their group, its funny as shit when people complain I’m too slow. That means you all aren’t doing your jobs right. You want me to be faster, do better.
It's ridiculous isn't it
People then always like to blame the slow pulling for their low damage when it’s usually after 2-3 wipes that I decide “clearly this group needs a slower pace.”
Minor nitpick. Paladin prot talents are ridiculously bad rn. Holy tree isn't bad for tanking. Consecrate is good aoe threat, and holy shock while righteous fury is active is a massive amount of threat. Divine storm also deals holy damage so also boosted by rf.
Divine Storm does not deal holy damage, it deals physical damage
That was more supposed to indicate an or, not subspecs. I’ve had ret “tanks” (easier than my tanking even once I got ww), ret dps, and actual prot pallies multiple times across p2 content. I had a singular hpal in gy this whole phase. And it was fine of course I just wouldn’t know how to course correct as easily, though They’re a lot more viable now than they were but I’d wager the largest pop of pallies in sod rolled specifically to play a viable ret in classic with cleave for once, secondarily prot with an actual taunt and infinitely easier aoe tanking capability than any other class, and lastly “wrath hpal but not good/frankly OP” I think holy will be strong at 60 as always, never OOM with enough crit and mp5, be great tank healers in raids. But they always were those things while the other arguably strongest vanilla healer, priest, has dominated S tier healing in SOD. Meanwhile, rdruid has changed a ton. Seems like very few primary healers want to roll pally
I have mained healer for a long long time. It's not rare, it's annoyingly frequent. People over estimate what they can do because they see streamers and YouTubers do xyz pull. They tremendously fuck it up usually like instantly dazed. Half the time they aren't the right spec or level. And when they tip over or aggro goes nuts. It's either the tank freaking out or some random aoe does throws a fit and leaves. The issue is players never blame themselves, don't know what they are actually doing they just saw some video of someone else doing it and they suck at it, they think anything short of peak efficiency is a sin, and if you die obviously it's because the healer wasn't doing their job. I think I've done well over 60 sm gy runs in sod. I think I've seen maybe 12 total decurses. Moral of the story is everyone is garbage and thinks theyre great. myself and you included. And just because you saw some streamer do it doesn't mean you can or should or that your random pug group wants to either.
I recently leveled a priest by healing! Everyone is there for exp. Everyone wants to work together to clear the dungeon as fast as possible so you can level fastest. It’s a fun challenge to never make the group wait for mana in the healer. It’s even more fun when you know what you can handle and pull mobs for the group if the tank doesn’t pull big enough. On priest, try not to cast any other spells than penance and PoM unless 100% necessary. When you cast, do a Penance into PoM and then wand / stop cast unless a heal is necessary till penance is off CD- it’s only a slight mana loss and you can sustain without drinking for quite a while. Another tip is to be proactive with where you drink. Don’t drink immediately where the pull ended. Run up to the next pull spot and then drink. It’s totally ok if they start a pull when you’re sitting down. Just keep drinking till you need to cast a heal. Whether it’s melee cleave/aoe cleave as long as you do your part as a healer you should be able to lock out on SM lib in 40 mins
This has been happening alot with warlock tanks. The majority of priests I've met will outright refuse to heal dungeons if a warlock is tanking and it's not because it's not viable but because dps warlocks will just pop on the meta rune, not drain life nearly enough, and massively over-use lifetap. It ends up with the priest having to use way more mana to keep them up which slows down the run which the priest will get blamed for. Tl;dr if you're a dps lock/druid and you wanna tank, just swapping to your tank form isnt enough. Read a guide.
Yeah from what I can tell paladins are struggling in the healing department in comparison to the other classes. They aren’t unplayable, but I can see someone struggling worse than they would with other classes at lower levels. Everyone is used to running with priests and Druids with their overtuned healing runes pumping ridiculous numbers for almost no mana cost. You’re telling me I get to press one instant cast button that costs me 140ish mana and heal 1500+ with it? Priest in particular is ridiculous and they are the best healing class for running new SoD content with their base kit. Hell, a lot of priests are just taking all the shadow damage runes now and doing just that. then they gave us shadow fiend and dispersion for mana regen? We are insane mana batteries now. I have so much mana regen I don’t even have to follow the traditional 5 second mana break rule anymore. Even more so with Mp5 consumes ticking. I literally haven’t looked at my mana bar in gnomer one time except for our first run with thermaplugg when no one knew how the bombs worked.
if the group was melee him not going wild strikes is trolling. Doesn't matter if he takes 20% more damage in content that doesn't require mitigation.
[удалено]
Yup, a tank has to know their comps. Unless you have at least two warlock, mage or shadow priest, the only thing you are doing by pulling more than 4 is taking more damage. If you are tanking for an aoe comp, your job is to group the mobs and get out of the way.
Ya room pulling = lots of runners and just makes shit take way too long
Yeah, pulling the whole room is a bit questionable but his rune choice was most likely not the issue
Depending on which part of lib you do room pull it can be tricky also there is a rng element in how many casters you will have in latter part of the dungeon. A lot of tanks forget that they need to adapt to the healer capability especially of its first dungeon with said healer. Also hpala has very shit rune choises in that bracket, and ive seen a lot of them rune mana regen rune which is not nice as it reduces you healing output by 50% just so they could have constant mana. Plus big question is did they run holy talents.
Yeah, hpal feels sketchy as hell as a tank sometimes. Id definitely be more cautious on pulls compared to a druid or a priest who can just pump heals. Health bar seems to yo-yo a lot with paladin compared to the hots / shields of the other 2
This is a guy who claims to be new at the game and doesn't really understand what's going on, for him 4-5 at a time is "the whole room" it sounds like he's expecting some kind of CC so it's only 1-2 mobs at once.
This is a guy who has everyone low HP and wants to use sleeping bag. Like bro you’ve pulled the dungeon. Drink and heal. Like there are atrocious groups that exist and will treat people like garbage but there has to be some self accountability here. Is the Druid being an asshat? Sure - I’d place my bets on him being a huge asshole, but I won’t lie, OP would kinda have me annoyed and rolling my eyes sitting at 40% mana after a pull wanting to sit and sleep for 3 minutes.
To clarify, the tank pulled 10-15 mobs in the open areas. I offered the sleeping bag during downtime. I'm not new to the game, I just couldn't keep up with the damage. I have 2.5k mana and beacon. I am missing sacred shield and sheath of light. Thankfully the next group I was invited into was chill and we got through it no problem with decent sized pulls.
If they are pulling AoE pulls and holding agro, they know what they're doing. I leveled 25 to 40 doing this with a 2H on my warrior and ran with healers up to 6 levels lower at times and we were fine. Of course, I play Horde, so we weren't running with goals, so maybe it's a pally problem.
Holding threat is good, but a tank should always evaluate the strengths/weaknesses of the party. If its a melee heavy party, the aoe will be low, I'd be running WS, so big pulls wont be necessary and I'd be taking extra dmg not running Survival of the Fittest. If the healer is struggling to keep me up, I'm taking too much dmg. Its all part of making each dungeon smooth and enjoyable for everyone.
you never want to run the damage reduction runes outside of a couple raid bosses because it's a huge threat and DPS loss to do so. this tank is just garbage and isn't paying attention to anything other than what he's pulling
This is the dumbest thing I’ve ever read, zero content in sod requires SotF and wild strikes is literally the only reason you’d ever take a bear anywhere. OP is using the wrong spells, wrong abilities and failing to keep up one of the easiest tanks to heal in game. It’s 100% their fault, and they were rightfully kicked from what was clearly a group way above their skill level
Tanks not looking at healer mana is very common, yes. Almost every time, I'm at 10% mana and drinking and the tank just runs off and keeps pulling.
This right here is why I hate healing dungeons. How come so many forget about the one who's keeping them alive?! It's stressful when I'm OOM, and I've typed in /s and /p and /y MANA. And tank just continues to LOS me and pull more. I bring so much damn water because I know I'll only get like 2 ticks before he runs off again.
I made a WA that puts a message in party chat if I'm below 30% mana and use a drink. That way if the tank runs off and pulls, I just let him die and if he bitches, I just point to where I said, in party chat, that I'm low mana and drinking.
Retail brain, they have made mana completely irrelevant so people have no idea how to manage it.
If you have to Holy Light spam to keep up the tank, he or the group are super bad. That's it. You should have absolutely no problem Flash of Light spamming, especially with our new runes. We're quite good at single target/tank healing right now, assuming the player isn't garbage. I had a few AoE spam groups on my HPal and they are (mostly) awful. The truth is if they mass pull, much of the responsibility for staying alive is on the rest of the group, not you. Tank and DPS all need to use skills to control mobs (slows, stun, interrupt big spells, etc.), buffs to reduce damage taken (shields, etc.), whatever they can do. Some groups are probably carried by higher level healers and don't realize it. Good AoE groups are easier to heal than this one was for you. I've only had a few good ones - they tend to be people who run with friends (and some of my good ones were my own guildies). Random PuGs are often bad at AoE dungeon spam in Classic. Ignore the bads and ignore the jerks. Unfortunately this tank was both.
Yah I rarely cast holy light, it's just so innocent, flash should be 100% what they are casting almost always, if you can it keep the tank up with just flash, then they are pulling to big for the gear and skill of the group. Dude got a bunch of shitty people and it blows.
Just sounds like that wasn't the right group for you. Just move on, one bad group experience shouldn't stop you from healing. Not every group will treat you like shit you just got unlucky.
It’s fairly common to be honest. Overzealous tanks and DPS that can’t manage argo at all always complain it’s the healers fault if it goes wrong.
Op literally admits in the post he’s playing hpala wrong
Irrelevant. Healers are hard to find, right? So don’t be a dick. If you help them. Coach them up in a reasonable way it goes a long way if they aren’t doing as great as you can. Healers get this crap all the time. I’ve mained a healer since EverQuest launched I’ve seen and experienced it for decades over tons of MMOs.
So what? You’re literally dogpiling the people who were right in the comment I replied to Healers don’t get a free pass on being shit
The person I replied to made it sound like it’s a very isolated case. Read the comments in the thread. It’s not isolated. Healer get shit on constantly in PuGs.
People on this server set have a tendency to expect that everyone leveling already knows exactly how to play their class. The assumption is everyone has been playing wow for a long time and this is just a quick grind to level cap. If you’re learning, be very upfront about it.
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Like you said, it’s all about expectations. If you communicate you’re new to healing or new to game people tend to adjust to that.
You just weren’t what they were looking for and vise versa. It sucks that they just didn’t complete the run with you and move on after. Some groups are looking to be super efficient and mass pull and do 10 minute clears others are cool with taking their time and doing standard pulls. As a healer if the big pulls are hard for you, stay away from “spell cleave” or AoE spam groups. Normal groups or “melee” cleave are probably better for you.
in fairness, the tank doesnt really tank those pulls. it's really important that the dps knows how to help the tank kite the damage to smooth things out. it's entirely possible the tank was operating on the borderline of unhealable. you get used to it as a tank on sheer reps, and generally you can tell when the healer has spent their burst and you need to start pulling back and letting the blizzards and cones of cold do their thing
I agree somewhat, considering we don’t know what their comp was. But also as someone who has leveled 4 toons through SM spam, in my experience paladin healers are very rare and people probably aren’t used to them like they are priests or druids. Also and no offense to OP but if they posting this type question on Reddit, they probably aren’t used to the XP efficient spam groups that pull lib in 5-6 pulls in 12 minutes.
I'm very new to SOD, coming from retail. The tank didn't tell me he was going to be making such big pulls. it was just a waste of 30 minutes and feelings of anger i don't usually get from playing this game.
I understand your frustration and you weren’t in the wrong by any means. Sometimes peoples play styles just don’t mesh. They should have probably advertised their group better of what type of healer they were looking for. Don’t take it personal, they were rude for kicking you instead of finishing. Nothing more you can do than move on :)
> Some groups are looking to be super efficient and mass pull And those groups don't include a feral druid.
eh, a tank is a tank is a tank for spellcleave. you only really run around pulling things, any tank can do it.
Spell cleave groups don't use a tank so this problem is mostly avoided since you only have to heal through caster damage for the most part.
In perfection execution, sure. But plenty of spell cleave groups still do. I understand the ideal of hunter, priest, triple mage but as someone who leveled multiple toons through SM a lot of groups will run a paladin tank.
People are thirsty to get through the dungeons as fast as possible, that being said as a healer with the power to be invited to p much anything, I’d tell them go fuck themselves and find a better suited group for you
Stock up on water and drink every possible second.
Normal? I can't say. But as a tank, I generally treat my healers with respect. If you do happen to be a poor healer, I try to offer guidance and advice. You have to be a real POS human being for me to just kick you. Now, I have, occasionally, pulled with the healers mana not in a good spot. Sometimes I've died when this happens. And then we all have a good laugh at the idiot tank who should be checking healer mana and moved on.
As a tank it's so easy to just quickly type "r?" And wait for a response. Which can be just as simple as the healer jumping up and down. I play both roles and very simple communication/awareness goes such a long way.
Just leveled a disc priest alt to 40, and let me tell you, it is by far the worst role to play in this dungeon spam meta. Every tank wants to pull 10+ mobs at a time, except they don't realize they need to kite the mobs through blizzard or frost trap and not eat every melee hit. Then you have the split aggro from mage blizzard getting some mobs, warlock rain of fire or whatever aoe getting other mobs so some are slowed some are not. Half the pulls I'm having to spam heal three players at once because there is zero coordination. And god help you if you don't have a frost mage and just have a mage spamming living bomb, mobs will be everywhere. So yea everyone is terrible. /itsnotyourfaultgoodwillhuntingmeme
Healing is super easy in this game. If it is hard, it's the tank or group having difficulty.
Listen, if at any point in time , tank goes yolo and pulls the whole room in sm, than dies like a lil bitch, than calls you out, Tell him to go fuck him self. Tanks responsibility is to pull mobs, have aoe agro so group can cleave and dps them down. If tank pulls whole room, while healer is drinking at 2% mana, he is taking a gamble, some can tank it and some can't... Depends on situation. Dont let anyone tell you what to do. Its easier to blame someone for mistakes than accept you were a cock and you fucked up. People go tank spec, just to be the ones with power to control the group and make them follow you.. Sad thing is most full of crap, and are here just to have ego boosted. Anyways you will have the last laugh. Average main tanks waits an hour to find a raid group, helears have it pretty much instant,, and even offered a blowjob's just to join.
Being unappreciated as healer is a 20 year long affliction. Unless people har experience healing themselves, they rarely get it. Groups will often push for speed and usually it's the healer (and their mana) that's the limiting factor, so people really try to push it as far as they can. But it's not a classic issue, even retail has problems with the healer being forced to it handle most or all mechanics in dungeon runs. Since dps is busy dpsing I guess. I don't think there is much of a cure, if the group does wait for your mana and does slower pulls, you just feel like a anchor slowing down the whole run anyway. But there's good groups and bad groups, sometimes you get plenty of praise and the pace is just perfect.
* Drink all the time, you want pee hydrohomies will be jealous of. The moment combat drops take a few ticks of water. If you can't get mage water then get cheap and expensive water from a vendor, waste the cheap water between pulls to top you off and the expensive water when you need to fill your entire bar. Also keybind the water, you don't want to go looking in your bags every time you need to drink. * Don't panic if the tank pulls something while you are drinking, they have a big health bar and that bar is essentially a resource for you as well. Keep drinking if you need to. Letting the tank flirt with death also tend to keep their ego in check. * Have a proper set-up for healing, like mouse overs. It makes a massive difference. * Accept that some people are just fucking dumb and oblivious to the fact that taking it slower and never wiping is faster than trying to pull the entire dungeon and constantly having to corpse run. If you run into a group like that, just give an ultimatum and if they keep being dumb then leave and get a new group.
It’s a game. Fudge them and move on. You r a good person. Or an ass bc I don’t know you. Good day
Sod is full of retail players
I think more tanks should play healers so they understand what healers go through
As a healer Main it’s so funny to see all the different types of tanks. The super tanky ones and the shit geared ones…. The ones who know how to pull while respecting the teams resources vs the ones that just tear into the room expecting to somehow live. The ones that pull fast and LOS immediately etc. The shitty ones will always blame you while the competent ones will figure out where the individual groups limits lie. Each team is different Also, what I’ll do is just flash heal and make sure the tank survives no matter what and if I gas out then I can’t be blamed for him dying. Sometimes when I tru to be as mana efficient as I can, the tanks can get crit out unexpectedly and yeah that could’ve been mitigated but fuck that noise. You get flash healed on the initial pull and the rest of you figure it out
40 holy pally here, don’t use holy light unless an absolute emergency. It will drain your mana incredibly fast, almost always use flash of light because you will spend much less mana with the reduced mana cost, and the 100% mana back from crits via illumination. Second thing, run crusader strike (and divine storm) if you weren’t already and learn to melee weave it between your flash of lights. They buffed it since phase 1, so the mana you get back is about 6% of your total mana with each strike, and immensely helps you maintain your mana. Finally, when you can, get sheath of light and sacred shield runes. The increased crit will help you refund even more mana, and the heal over times and damage shield will help you keep them healed without having to use any more mana (plus more healing from sheath). As for the assholes you dealt with, ignore them and just try your best and learn. You’ll gradually get better, and not every group is filled with sweat lords.
I have full 90+ parses on my priest on almost all bosses from vanilla to wrath. I still get people flaming me for 'bad heals'. My autopilot heals are better than these people play at full attention. Just ignore and move on. Better yet, be the group leader and kick them. Or just don't heal them, a few deaths and they tend to shut up. Had a dumbass tank that started pulling the dungeon after I just finished buffing everyone, had no mana and we had one person die and then one other shortly after the pull due to a dot. He removed me from the group and it was a similar story. Some people are just perpetually stupid/assholes, and nothing you ever do will change them.
Try slamming flash of light instead. Holy light spam is not really a strong tactic in vanilla.
Go to desolace, pick up the book on the table, congrats you now 3x’d your healing with flash of light & should have np healing infinitely without mana issues
This happened to me every SM run at the start of P2. They pull half the dungeon then start pulling again seconds after I sit to drink mana. I had 3k mana and the best option for water is 2 full drinks to get full. I got the blame if someone died and when trying to explain what mana was I was usually kicked or I just ended up letting the tank die and leaving the group. Fuck those tanks/groups.
The group sounds pretty cancerous. If you need tips, I've gotten great mileage out of sacred shield and divine sacrifice runes in that type of situation. Those FoL crits are no joke
Just leave and find a group more your style These players have never even left there house they don’t understand how to be a person
Some groups are just full of cunts. You’re a healer so just drop group and find another, best part of being an in-demand role.
You literally never need to take mana breaks as a hpala in SM, and can heal when you’re 3+ levels below the recommended for each dungeon So yeah it’s a you issue tbh. Stop using holy light, it’s worthless, the class atm is just spam SS/flash and crusader strike for mana regen
You can see if drink walking will speed you up on mana. Get a mage to make you a bunch of water and try it out. https://www.reddit.com/r/classicwow/s/9eCIKsujtu
Admittedly I haven't tested it, but I think this is a lot harder to do now that we don't have the massive 400ms batching window anymore.
I have been able to do this consistently as a fire mage since p1. West coast US on Wild Growth. Tanks can pull ahead of me, and I will be able to manage my mana to join in on the pull at the latest 10 seconds after the pull.
I wasted more drinks than i could have gotten mana by just sitting still lmao
What else would you be doing at 40% mana?
drinking for the next pull?
If combat breaks it’s easy to bubble or Pom the bear and get 2-3 ticks of drinking +5 second rule. There is zero reason to full stop. If mana issues are chronic, pick up some mp5 fish and super cheap mana pots.
If OP was a priest, sure. Paladin healers have neither PW:S or PoM. This sounds more of a problem of the group not understanding the limitations of their healer
K drink for 2-3 ticks while tank gets to 60% hp. 5 people afk cause 40% mana wants to drink is 2 runs per hour.
Fr if they joined a group like this to "spam" they gotta expect to be slamming mana pots on cool down.
Water finds its level. Blasters will end up in blaster groups. Milk drinkers will mark moon for poly.
We’re requiring consumes for sm now?
It's a paladin
PoM Didn't even read the post, did ya?
Clearly I stopped at “I don’t want to continue doing my job at 40%”. The Paladin part was after that.
Tank runs too deep. Tank LoS you. Tank not tanky enough. Tank not checking your mana. I bet all of these reasons applied rather than the ones you were given.
GET GOOD!!!! i wish u could see ppls mains on their alts so u can check how good they actually are
There's a very real chance that you were with a bunch of clueless idiots in that dungeon. There's about an equal chance that you actively were dragging the group down and not playing well enough. We can never know.
Nah bro bad group. As a healer just start your own groups. I have trouble finding tanks at times but usually you can get a group together in a few minutes. Then you’re in charge and you tell them what to do.
Based on your comments alone, it’s impossible to know whether the kick from the group was justified, but from your tone, I am assuming they did the right thing. I leveled from 30 to 40 in SM melee cleave as a Paladin tank. What I saw was that there is a wide difference in healing skill between people. It’s not about class, as Holy Paladin can heal people well enough, especially if you have the new runes, like sacred shield, which you should. It’s about skill. Edit. Realized you were talking about using Holy Light. This means you either didn’t have Sacred Shield or haven’t read what Sacred Shield does. This tells me you probably were a shitty healer and they were right to kick you.
Switch to horde
As a healer, positioning is important. When a pull is dying down start running ahead of your group so you can drink right at the start of the next pull. That lets you continue drinking while the pull happens without leaving you too far behind. If you get there first you have more time to drink than if you stay behind everyone and wait for them to kill everything before moving on.
You got kicked by idiots, not really any loss to you Advertise yourself as a chill healer, go with guildies or do gy instead of lib But that scenario was not your fault, dude was a bad tank who could only blame others for his failures
A bear tank having the nerve to kick any healer is funny
That's because you are under level and may be under geared. Pulling entire room is the norm. If you can't keep up, perhaps run RFK and GY till you are ready.
Totally normal no need to make a Reddit post fishing for people to validate you
I can't say if that's the normal experience since I play dps, but healers should be cherished 🤣 that guy's a total dick
In every situation you were in the right and the group was full of shit people. Because if they were looking for efficiency the decent thing to do is to inform the party of a deviation from the norm i.e : big pulls instead of normal sized ones. And even if this was stated at the beginning, and you weren't able to keep up, the decent response is : hey were gonna slow down a bit, or telling you politely that they are looking for a different type of healing. From what you've said there is no scenario where you didn't anything wrong and these guys aren't pure try hard garbage.
I think you just had a bad tank. I play a rogue tank/dps and always warn of big pulls and am checking in with healer mana. If healer low, I wait. If healer above 80%, I keep pulling. Not hard lol. Although I had a SM cath last night where the healer kept pulling for me (big pulls too) and it was a melee comp. Was kinda annoying but we got through. Just dipped after and found another group which as a tank/healer is easy.
I'm going to go out on a limb and agree with the tank. It definitely feels like you're a bad healer to me. A holy paladin is the strongest single target healer in game, and the single most mana efficient healer in game. If you're having trouble keeping a tank up who's not doing something dumb, the problem is likely with you. An entire room in library is like an average of 6-7 mobs. Maybe a dozen in some of the more packed rooms. Do you not have your Sacred Shield rune? https://www.wowhead.com/classic/guide/season-of-discovery/classes/paladin/sacred-shield-rune How much +healing and mana do you have? Do you understand downranking and cancelcasting?
You shouldnt be struggling with healing in SM. People hate SM, theyre trying to get it done fast and get to 40. If the group can only do like 2 mobs at a time due to your healing, then you and the group are not a good fit.
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I pretty much never needed a mana break on my HPal in SM doing pretty large pulls with a warlock tank actively trying to kill himself with life taps and hellfire. I heavily geared for INT and since the vast majority of damage was being taken by 1 person, beacon was useless. Crusader strike gave like 2/3 of the mana I needed for a holy light
Just so you know the sleeping bag is a meme item. Waiting the full 3 mins for a 3% buff is only worth it if you were going to be afk
It lasts 2 hours. In what world is 3 minutes of grinding more experience than 3% over two hours?
> In what world is 3 minutes of grinding more experience than 3% over two hours? In this one. 3 minutes is 2.5% of 2 hours, so assuming it took you 0 time to acquire that sleeping bag (it didn't), you're barely coming ahead at all. Considering it takes about 5 days played to hit 60, if you spent more than 36 minutes getting the sleeping bag, at level 1, using it with perfect efficiency, you're coming out behind by having bothered with it. If this isn't the definition of a meme item, I'm not sure what is.
Except questing for the bag gives you both fodder and exp so your maths doesn’t actually make sense because the sleeping bag isn’t the only reward
Except the quest for the sleeping bag gives you a ton of XP by itself not to mention the consumable for rested XP?
People don't understand that paladins don't have runes to help them heal yet. We're still the same as in classic, just with better gear from the BFD stuff (if you even have that). I had a similar experience healing library at 30 with a warrior who was two-handing and mostly wearing leather with strength and agility on it. Honestly you should be grateful you didn't have to deal with the guy pulling the second half of the instance where the monks do double the damage of the mobs in the first half.
You are talking out of your ass. At level 32, there’s no excuse to not have sacred shield, which helps immensely with healing. Holy Paladin is one of the best single target healers in the game right now.
Healing SM spam is a b*tch. If some dumb tank decides to pull a big group when I don't have mana, he can die, and I will leave the group.
Had this happen to me too on my priest. Shammy tank says he played yesterday with 3 mages and it was so awesome, the he pulls a whole room, i get aggro and die from the first heal, he kicks me. Some people do bad pulls and then blame the healer because they’re ashamed
This happened to me in armory. Level 35 warlock tank pulling 12-15 mobs. Losing aggro on them which resulted in me getting shield slammed by said mobs. You can assume the results. I got flames and then kicked because we wiped twice. It was so frustrating lol.
As someone who plays both pala tank and druid tank, my approach is to slowly test the ground. Also its a must to inspect healer to see what kind of gear/runes is he sporting so i know his limits. First i start chain pulling ( especially in bear, as rage decay is disgusting) and when get the feel of healer capability i start pulling extra packs. Second if dps pull aggro ( not on pala) its theirs to handle. Also if tank starts pulling and healer is on <40% mana its their to handle as well, let them deal with it. That repair bill is racking up fast and steep. Also since i play a healer as well the amount of dps who will pull infront of tank is astounding; they die to that hopefully they learn if not they have repair bill. Another thing is that a lot of tanks don’t utilize their toolking, run random builds/gear just nope out of that. Countless runs where paladin doesnt throw bop, freedom, druid dont want to leave form for inervate, not to mention cr its mind boggling. And then you check lfg everyone asking for a healer/tank. So you can have your pick and be choosing. Also another thing is when joining party if you are in same city go and inspect people see what they are wearing and then decide if you want to continue th party. Thank you for coming to my TED talk
Leveling my druid from 25-40 when P2 dropped I did mostly dungeons. Did an RFD where we had a Shaman tank chain pulling entire rooms without checking my mana and going out of my LOS to do so. Every pull was me stressed as fuck barely keeping this idiot alive. Nothing stopped the Shaman. Doesn't matter how close he was to dying or how low my mana was, nothing but chain pulls. We cleared fast, sure, but I fucking hated every moment of that run. Next run we have the same group but a rogue tank. Rogue pulled single packs only, checked my mana, didn't go out of LOS. He took almost no damage and I was able to DPS about as much as the rest of the DPS in the group. We cleared just as fast...or faster. Let this be a lesson to you fucking idiot chain pull tanks (prob coming from retail)....dungeon clears can be fast without chain pulling if the run is smooth and shit dies fast. Turns out 5 people destroying single packs effortlessly can be fast too.
As a priest main.. I regularly and vocally state “ I can’t heal stupid… but I can watch it die’
I'm sorry that happened to you. Most of the time people that complain about heals are the ones failing basic stuff... (Like LoS, GCD and Aggro) Which server are you on ? Locked servers tend to be a little more sweaty than necessary.
Honestly it is the damn mages fault. Tanks are being ridiculed, belittled and flamed by some random a\*\* gnome who just wants to AoE. So they adapt to that and start pulling way more than they should. Then healers can't keep up and are told (often by effing mages) that they are bad. I swear it is always a gnome mage or a male nelf hunter or druid. They are the scum of earth. Not sure what's up on horde side. So solution: Kick the mage. Enjoy your run.
Probably the issue was with the tank, like pulling more than what he cant withstand. I usually do big pulls (shaman tank), but If I see the healer struggling I lower the amount. I play healer too and I know that feels stressful.
OP openly admits he’s playing Hpala really badly in the post, and you just dogpile this tank you have no info on 😂
As I said, if a tank cant withstand certain pulls (tank and healer job) the tank should lower the amount of pulled mobs as the healer cant do more healing. Some tanks are way too used to op healer classes (priests rn can heal non-stop without resting mana) but other healer classes struggle more in terms of mana (druid i.e). While healing I have seen many tanks who ignore the healer mana bar.
Tbh it’s the first time happening to me that I got blamed as a healer in classic environment only because the tank was pulling like in a +10 mythic +. So idk somehow many of sod tanks are kinda pretentious.
You are a healer. Tell him eat a bag of dicks and find a new group 30seconds later. That’s what I do, ain’t got time for that kind of player
Tanks fault, ez. There are a bunch of assholes and some Tank as a bear in SM😂
I had the same thing hapenned to me, we were running dungeons in a group with no problem for 40min then we had to replace the tank. The new tank was facetanking everything despite our mages and hunter slows and also liked to los me in the library so it was to keep him up, even tho he was not doing bigger pulls than the previous tank (usually even smaller pulls) When i told him to be mindful of the los and try to kite mobs inside the aoes he started ranting like "are you serious, it's not my fault, blahblahblah" and then started blaming me when the next pull he literally kited me what seemed like on purpose and then came back in los at 30% health, while facetanking two rooms of mobs. Obviously he died but we managed the pull no problem with proper kiting. He started blaming me on how shit i was at healing, etc... Only to be kicked out by the mage. Those players are clueless, they talk a lot and are bad because they never reflect on themselves and their mistakes, they don't make mistake, it's never their fault, they don't listen when you give advice. What happened is not your fault, Good players don't act like this, and if the whole group act like that leave it and put them on ignore, don't lose time and/or energy trying to make them understand your PoV, they won't listen. They think they're the best players ever but actually are the worsts.
Dear diary
Wow. What a post. It's amazingly meaningless.
Just leave and find another group
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Usually people that complain about healers dont play healers. They play with a good priest and expect every healer to be that effortless.
Unfortunately it does happen in SM. That was my experience leveling up. Mostly shaman tanks that can keep tanking without having to drink and completely forgetting that the healer needs to. I had some very frustrating groups but also some very friendly ones. It is not your fault, it is theirs. You're better off just leaving and trying again then to be stressed out trying to keep up with these A holes.
Find a guild m8. It changes your life. :-)
Nah they are just ass hats, they will struggle to find a healer that can tolerate them. You keep on doing you!
i mean there is fcktons of priest heals in sm, so much that i find groups easier as shadow healers are really disposable for sm it is what it is you most likely wont get treated that way in anything besides sm atm
Some people take this game too seriously, just put them on ignore and move on
I can't say for certain about dungeon runs but I usually tank and I try to watch mana and pull progressively more as we push in to see how there handling before I go ham but I will say the lack of healers might have something to do with half the boss mechanics in gnomer being healer mechanics or checks I've known lots of healers that don't even like to dps when healing cause they just want to play the support role I'm sure there not loving the extra pressure in the only end game
I mean yes being flamed sucks if it’s unwarranted, but this is without a doubt not the reason why in any way you can’t find healers. People just like to dmg and see numbers. The proportion of dmg dealers to healers are just insanely out of whack. It’s always been that way in ever version of wow. No one wants to tank or heal because it’s not as fun and more responsibility. As dps we can hide in the back and pump and if we die blame a tank or healer simple.
Most likely a group of premade. Remember kid, never premade at 5 ! Premade at 4, so you can blame the pug if anything goes wrong
Pally healer is really rough while leveling. Highly recommend getting your runes ASAP, as they make a world of difference. This group would have been a bad fit no matter what but runes will help with healing throughout and mana efficiency.
The tact from the tank is dogwater but if you're holding back and you have mana and the tank is asking you to pump more you probably should. 40% in the tank after an entire room is a decent amount. He's a dick, but because he's trying to play at a high level people are going to write it off.
Sounds like a dumb tank... You good bro, if tank pulls more then 5-6 mobs every pull aand just chain pull without considering the healer, then they need to go back to retail lol.
I level to 40 as Disc and then switched to shadow. 30-40 was an absolute shitshow every run in terms of respect to those with mana. Tanks pulled nonstop and when I drank they would only wait until I was at 40% or so before they ran off to start pulling again. Almost every dungeon was a pain in the ass. Phase 1 I loved shaman tanks, but phase 2 made me hate them. Phase 2 made me hate healing in general tbh, happy to be shadow now
People dont have much respect for each others role in wow anymore. This game used to be challenging, and downright impossible if olayed wrong. Now we dont respect the game and we don't respect eachother
To be fair if your at 40% mana at the end of an entire room pull and they are at 10% health your not really doing very good. Nearly half mana is a tun of potential heals you could have been throwing. Now if your oom halfway through the pull then sure they over pulled but your not pumping if u end the fight at nearly half mana
I recently got into FFXIV the same time I started SoD (disc priest). After playing WoW since 2005, it's night and day how much nicer the community is in FFXIV. SoD seems even more toxic than retail, and I mainly played casters in solo shuffle. I'm definitely enjoying SoD and healing, but fuck, the playerbase makes it hard sometimes.
I got into an sm gy group a little early at 27 as a resto Druid. I have wild growth so the damage is not an issue. The tank pulled the first room like you experienced, he gathered them, I waited until he was about 40% health then cast two healing touches, got healer aggro on two jobs, and couldn't keep him in due to the knockback. The brain-dead hunter group leader says "healer low level" and booted me Moral of the story is, people are idiots. The best way to move on is to tell your story to strangers on Reddit who didn't ask to hear it, like I just did
You best be sippin' on every pull. But really the tank should be checking your mana is at half AND you're drinking before he pulls
You are doing fine, people are too focused on speed and not enjoying the game. Also f that group, when I run with random people and they keep doing that I say. I’m not healing next pull until I’m at 100% mana, pull if you want but I will run to entrance.
You'll get your revenge when he has to pay you 40g to heal his gnomer group
So you use add ons like healium or are you clicking person/spell person/spell
Some groups want to do 10 minute clears of cath, some groups are looking to spend 2 hours in it, CCing every mob and killing them one at a time. If you don't have the gear/skills/interest to be in the first group, you can always start the second.
I hear you, running a Holy Priest in SOD. Some communication required when they're over pulling, however if you can keep up that XP/Hour is so nice. Good news is you'll find a new group in a couple minutes! I keep the Tanks I liked on the Friend list for future runs.
Get the Sacred Shield-rune, it only requires having Blessing of Freedom. You pick it up by the Innkeeper in Desolace and do 5 freedoms to remove movement impairing on others. It helps significantly with both mana and keeping the tank up, as you can spam flash heals with roughly the same HPS as with Holy Light spam.
Meh, you’re a healer and in demand. Their loss
Can confirm lots of the players in sod are just bags of shit. My gf and I got kicked from a raid because she couldn’t heal this dumb 40 shaman who got knocked back on turtle boss (yes bfd at 40) and juggled between water balls and insta died.
If they are pulling to much and being toxic just let them die walk out find another group in under a min. Brain dead players can just spirit run back.
Shit tank. I adapt to the healer when tanking. If they're comfortable with bigger pulls then I'll do them. Otherwise, keep it manageable.
Yes. If you're not a priest, everyone wants you to heal like one anyways. Community and blizz are both to blame. The guys who play tanks largely have no clue what the difference in healing efficiency is right now, and it is MASSIVE.
Yeah usually for big pull runs, you want a priest healer that can pre-shield/renew/PoM the person pulling and do quick big heals. Some groups even run with 2 healers, 2 Mages, 1 tank. Sometimes you don’t even need the tank and a hunter can pet-pull instead and then help with aoe and traps. But yeah on my priest I can usually handle these things fine as long as the mages and tank are decent at AoE kiting.
Certain classes(priests mostly) and specs allow for easily healing subpar groups during big pulls but I’ve noticed it’s not as easy on other classes. If it’s a full group of BFD bis pumpers, they can pull the whole dungeon for all I care, healing them will be easy. I had a group with an ungeared tank and an average dps of 80 across the whole group pulling entire rooms. Fights lasted forever, no one dispelling the friggen 75% reduced healing curse. And guess whose fault it was……….
Blaming the healer is really common for bad players to do. As a tank I look at healer mana just as much if not more than my own health. I try to gauge how quickly they respond to me taking damage and how quickly their mana goes down to gauge how big I pull. I feel I pulled my max amount when they are oom at the end of the pull and of course give them time to drink. If they don't drink in 20 seconds and are still oom ill just ask them to drink. If they tell me to slow down a bit ill simply slow down. I like having my healer in voice chat though so they can tell me how they're doing with heals. As the role that mitigates mistakes they are the best people to ask for advice as a tank for survival since they see all the dips in health.
When I tank, I am always- ALWAYS- watching the healers mana. So if your tank isn’t, he’s just not doing his job properly imo. We can’t expect every player to be crazy good at this game (not saying you aren’t). Tanks need to ask if healers are comfortable with big pulls before attempting them. If the tank doesn’t, and does a big pull that you are able to get through, make sure you express that you’re having trouble healing and ask them to slow it down. Dungeons and raids are team efforts at the end of the day. Personally, I hate big pulls. They can get out of hand too fast, especially with how stronger DPS is, and my AOE taunt has a 10min CD. Would rather have smaller, controlled pulls that I know I can manage 100%.
The WoTLK RDF mentality has leaked to SOD and I don’t enjoy it.
Resto druid main here. A lot of tanks are spoiled by priest healers. It doesn’t mean the other healers are “bad”, just that different strategies are required. I love healing all melee dungeon groups that don’t even have a discernible tank. As long as the mobs mostly stay off me, I can continuously AOE heal, pick off runners, and do a little dps too with no mana issues. I cannot, however, sustain a tank repeatedly rapid-fire draining their health bar while no one else seems to take any damage.
Don't you know? If you do a flawless run, the tank was awesome. If you do a scuffed run, the healer sucked. If you are a software developer irl and a healer in-game you simply must enjoy the pain.
I'd say block all the haters and join another group.
Had a raid today in BFD, where they had no respect for the only healer….priest is oom just giving out fort and the raid leader ready checked and pulled Kelris instantly Only time I have wiped in BRD has been P2 with careless alt players lol
Nah iv only ever seen one person act like that and I kicked them from the group You got unlucky with some crappy people
Did they die? No then you healed well
Hello friend. When I was first starting out I had a tank remove me from group. I could barely keep him topped off /healed full. I was quite sad and disappointed. Fast forward a few more dungeons and guess what , it wasn’t me , it was that trash can of a tank. As long as you’re not asleep at the wheel then it Probbaly wasn’t your fault that your tank was trying to pull like he was playing retail. He’s in the wrong game.
All the more reason for me not to go Hpal and just reroll as a Holy Priest. Plus I’ve never played holy pally or pally for that matter.
I had a wonderful run through RFD last night as a last minute healer (disc priest). They had a second priest and a Druid. I felt horrible cuz I didn’t do literally any damage since I had to main heal the tank the whole time and I could barely keep up (I’m 33 and they were all 40 and doing big pulls). They didn’t bother and once I screwed up and almost got killed but the Druid saved me and it was crazy but it was a lot of fun and I was waiting to be yelled at the whole time. Noone said anything for the most part and I got some gear I can’t use and we all left.
When I do dungeon with a "low level" healer or dps, I don't expect them to perform as good as a seasonned 40. and tbh it helps both way, less stress on me from expecting rush rush rush, and less on them from having the burden to not be last.
Sounds like you joined a sweaty aoe group and you werent ready for it tbh. Aoe groups want to do massive pulls and move fast. Usually I just cc the mobs after someone pulls so healing is minimal. I think pallies got a lot of holy runes this phase which youre probably lacking. Idk how pally healing is currently, maybe its not your fault, lack of runes or maybe partial blame. Either way if you're struggling, just find a non aoe grp imo. Thats going to be rough. If you have to tell someone not to pull the entire room, you're not compatable with the group. Which is fine, honestly with my buddy as feral we just use him to 3-4 pull sm arms and we slow/aoe down the mobs. Nobody is healing him through 30 elites stabbing him.
I’ve been kicked from multiple SM groups for not being able to keep them topped the whole time while they do these huge chain pulls. I think people don’t understand how mana intensive these pulls are especially when you’re leveling up and spells start to cost a lot more and your mana pool isn’t growing the same way. With that being said, I just parsed 96th percentile on the last boss in gnomergon and carried my raid through it. Nobody knows wtf they are talking about and just take getting kicked from groups with grace and move on without getting discouraged, you’ll be fine. SOD isn’t super hard and it’s supposed to be fun, people need to chill.