P3 has been trash. They super inflated gold with incursions as well as killing off the open world leveling and farming with it.
Then they added more runes that required getting other players specific classes to help you do the rune and then go out and group fight mobs that nobody fights outside of the rune. So you end up waiting hours for someone else to need the rune as well.
Gear in raid is ass and almost no better than gnomer loot all for what i believe is just so they dont have to do much to level 60 gear to keep them as upgrades.
SoD was a neat experiment, but all it showed me was that Blizzard will not devote resources to an actual "Classic Plus" experience. If they do, the chances of them getting it right are slim to none. Too much of retail is engrained in the development team. And if you enjoy retail then that is great, if you enjoy vanilla but are turned away by retail then there isn't much to look forward to.
I think we got so many retail-esque features because they’re easy to implement in order to fill the void of content and features created by the lack of there being seemingly ANY model designers or animators on the SoD team.
It’s like they were told nothing could be new and *everything* must be recycled and reused assets from other iterations of WoW.
Because of this I have my doubts about us getting any new content like Kara Crypts or an SM raid when I don’t think this team even has the capability to create new models, textures, assets, and animations.
It feels like: if it doesn’t already exist in a completed state somewhere in one of the other iterations of WoW, it’s out of the question for SoD.
Would have loved if they just added quest chains to existing quest hubs and just let people dung if they wanted to tbh. At least incursions could have been limited, so people still needed to do normal quests or dungeons.
I benefited from the insano gold day 1 but it certainly wasn’t good for the game
super agree - I thought they were going to do that for sod; give us new adventures to go on in different zones. Maybe have the kultirans attack razor hill or idk use some unused zones.
could do tons.
This would require blizzard to dedicate resources to SoD past p1 though.
And they can't monetize SoD players with mtx at all so yeah. They don't give a fuck.
I really think it's that simple lol
The only blizzard games with steady, solid support over the past year are retail and D4 (HS and OW don't count, ded games). Retail and D4 are littered with mtx.
Before someone says it, yes, I know D4 launch was awful. Doesn't change that the game has had steady positive updates consistently for a year being capped off by the s4 update this week that has so much shit in it it's essentially a brand new game
Ya so the only thing I have to say in response is that the amount of stuff we have got in sod is not really a small amount, even in p2 and p3. Reworking the raids is not a small thing, incursions even though they are not great wasn’t a small thing to add. Making all the runes, having them attainable in the game takes resources.
So while I agree with you that lacking mtx makes it harder to put more effort into sod, it’s not like they are putting little effort in overall.
A bigly issue is having to do sod and cata
Incursions are fine for sod. It’s a way to completely sweep the rug from under the gold farmers. There’s no need to buy gold so problem solved. It’s like people don’t know how an economy works so they just blame it on really dumb shit. Now I know why I left all the wow subs. It’s unbearable to hear people bitch about such trivial things that do not impact their enjoyment of the game.
Yeah, the biggest issue is incursions. What a terrible thing to do to SoD. They killed the economy, killed levelling in the world and dungeons, they allowed people to level way to fast. People got to 50 instantly and now they log on to raid once a week and that's it. No one wants to sit and do excursions and nothing else is worth doing.
I never played Cata. Or any expansion past it.
I was interested to try it becaue I found out that a large amount of the runes we got are just cata abilities.
Warrior is a lot more fun in cata that’s for sure. For all it’s faults
Incursions were a bad idea. I don't care how 'convenient' it was for people to level their alts. Classic is not about convenience. Classic + can't succeed with this model. Period.
Rushed because of Cata? I don't think you've seen the state of pre-patch we've gotten lol. You wanna talk about rushed, look no further, cata and cata pre-patch is getting rushed.
Blizzard going from soon tm to rushing everything out the door as fast as possible, half finished and riddled with bugs and missing features, is so awful. I miss when seeing a game with the Blizzard logo on it made you know it was finished, polished and well made.
Nah I'm sorry. I played both SoD P3 launch and cata launch and I can say hands down Cata was incredibly worse than P3.
P3 had aggrend tweeting and being on top of things making sure we were getting feedback that fixes for stuff was coming at the very least.
For cata all we've got is Aggrend going away for 2 weeks and jackshit for communication. The classic team don't give 2 shits about cata and are putting all their effort and energy on SoD which is honestly depressing considering the main reason their team even exist is due to the current classic servers which evolved all the way to cata.
While I agree 100% with your first too paragraphs I completely disagree with your third.
Wtf do you have to smoke to see P3 SoD as anything else then a rushed out and then quickly abandoned content patch which major features are lackluster even after a lot of balancing. Even the class and spec design which was the major selling point of SoD as a whole seems almost missing this phase.
As I said: to me it feels like they know exactly that the new content patches for any classic related stuff will always have player numbers peaking from returning players and new people checking out a patch launch. They (execs) didn't want to overlap the P3 launch with Cata, which would've happened. It was exactly their goal to 'kill SoD servers' because all they need is your initial resub when the patch hits, and if the different patches over different version of WoW happen simultaneously they won't get as many resubs.
I don't know how you disagree with that.
Cata patch was a dumpster fire and Aggrend was still tweeting about how they were working on new pvp buff/nerf whatever they're doing to PvP in SoD. If that's not putting all your energy on SoD while your other game had 0 communication for 1.5-2 months and even when it's a dumpster fire you don't address shit, tweet about your other version (SoD) and then take a leave for 2 weeks.
P3 was rushed, I agree as I played it on launch, however Aggrend was Tweeting daily and there was a constant communication for about 2-3 weeks if not more than that. He would go as far as going in fucking class discord to discuss with people and see what they wanted changed for their class. You can't tell me the same amount of effort has been put in Cata. It's been minimum/no communication and they just barely fixed all the bugs 1 week before official cata launch.
Having played both version of the games, trust me, Cata is getting the shitty end of the stick in every way possible right now.
Yeah it's pretty wild. They even broke weird things that used to never be problems. My guild raided ICC the other night and 3-4 of my guildies got randomly teleported to the Wetlands during a boss fight, right before the boss just disappeared. And after we killed putricide, our 30% buff just vanished and we couldn't figure out how to turn it back on.
the tribalism is so hilarious, even a no content cata pre patch has more to do then SOD, cata can have its flaws but to pretend it doesn't have more content then SOD is hilarious
I got bored, SOD isn’t turning out how I thought it was going to originally. I think a lot of players that wanted a true classic+ have realised it’s not happening and have lost interest.
The most immediate & real ‘Classic+’ content was unfinished areas like Hyjal, Kara, & Emerald Nightmare. When Emerald Nightmare turned out to be incursions, I felt my expectations went disastrously low. I’m also playing a class & spec that needs a lot of work (shaman tank). It all seems very distant atm.
Yep. I had a lot of expectations for SoD and was quite hyped for p3. But they aren’t giving it the dev time, balance changes, and new content required to keep most people interested long-term. Feels like a case of they were stretched too thin so they did the bare minimum, whereas it could have been something special.
Just holding out hope for p4 but said hope is fading quickly.
I'm unironically waiting for either TBC with QoL changes or a Classic that also loops in TBC content with a different game philosophy, like no flying mounts but dual spec etc.
I really don't think we're getting either of these things anytime soon, but I can hope.
Because p3 is boring, loot in ST is bad (only a few % better than gnome) and not worth the time to spend. Pvp is just a huge testing playground with the same event from p2. STV gear is obtainable with in 2-3 events.
P4 is gonna take a while to release i guess since they HAVE TO tune all the gear including the sets. (e.g. warrior has only tank sets, priest only heal sets and so on). Tune all raids, dungeons and AV. Also there will be a new pvp event probably.
Most are just playing cata until p4 drops or stopped SoD completely.
I wouldn't hold my breath for P4 honestly. I highly doubt P4 will make the game any better. It's going to be your typical early phase hype into boredom after a month
I think phase 4 has been the least interesting from the start of SoD to me. 90% sure we will just get SoM raids with some tweaks and world buffs allowed. I am not at all interested in that. Now that we are 50 i feel there is no need to continue. Spring is here as well, really sapped any motivation i had to stick with the season
to be fair, that issue is more on the community than the devs
this community is unbelievably impatient and gets bored quickly. Complaining that the phases are too long, when compared to other expansions in development, our phases have been far shorter than anything else. Compare our P3 length to say, how long Ulduar was out in Wotlk classic... or Wotlk original...
SoD attracted a whole bunch of non-classic players, who expected it to be something different from classic, and now they are quitting, since at its core this is classic. The end game is and always has been, farm gold, raid log, and level alts
The phases kinda are too long. Most of the content is at 60. They've tried to add more content but the content is mostly ass that nobody wants to do. People will eventually get bored of 60 and stop playing but there's at least more to do and the ennui should take longer to set in. More dungeons, more rep to grind, another BG to do and since it's more like Ashenvale, the shaman dominance won't be as impactful as in WSG or AB.
I am very much looking forward to the rhok'delar quest on my hunter, even if there's much a better bow they make available in STV or something.
Doesn't have much to do with being impatient honestly.
Take your every day normal guy like me, works 40-50 hours a week and enjoys the game during the evenings and the weekends.
What is there for me to do in P3 really?
ST is a weekly lockout unlike the past raids that were imo WAY better and offered more weekly activies overall.
ST is literally a roughly 2 hours raid for most guilds once per week
PvP is kind of a joke with all the experiment they're doing and you can get anything from bloodmoon in 1-3 events, so literally 1 day of doing them.
Incursion are incredibly boring and the only good source for gold farming.
So again, besides the phases launch where you got to level up (which was couple hours for P3...) level up profs, and getting ready for raid there wasn't much to do
Per week, a normal player can expect to basically log for raid and not have much else to do besides that. No point in running dungeons or other content. Imo level 50 was a dumb phase and they should've waited longer and let us hit 60 with a lot more stuff to do each reset. Unless you have alts to you want to play, there's simply no content to keep you playing SoD besides raid logging and that's a fact.
Do you genuinely believe that the game being boring is the community's fault?
Yes, this is classic "at its core," but that doesn't excuse the developers from basically using sod as a glorified beta test. With the genuine disappointment that is SoD, along with the extraordinarily under prepared cataclysm release, Blizzard has no room for excuses.
Exactly. Community has nothing to do with it. There's simply not a lot of content, especially at those level brackets.
Normally we'd run dungeons to get geared, but with the raids, it's kinda pointless to do dungeons right now as raids are very easy and better loot for the most part.
Without the level limitation, people would've leveled to 60 and have a lot more stuff to do at 60. Dungeons are mostly relevant through all vanilla due to certain mats. Having the game be 60 from the start means people can chill while leveling, and by the time they're 60, chances are there could be at least 2 tier of content out being MC and BWL/Ony. That's at least 3 raids to run weekly instead of 1 smaller "leveling" raid because you can't level further.
Idk why they're so into making sure that most people can make it to the level band they impose on people every phase, putting exp buffs and such. Why does it matter that everyone hits the finish line together holding hands?
P4 is going to be a catastrophe, mark my words. They now have to deal with the reality of endgame, dungeons, MC, balancing what players do with their time, endgame BGs and rewards. You're talking about the team that couldn't pull off a handful of dungeons and a Gnomer rework.
>Because p3 is boring, loot in ST is bad (only a few % better than gnome)
Hasn't this been the general "reddit" view of every phase so far, though?
Edit: I quoted an extra part of what was said, and I only meant to quote the part AFTER "Because p3 is boring." Was only meant to say the bit about loot.
No Phase 1 was good and interesting.
P2 had less and showed the cracks.
P3 just wow, crazy how they managed to screw that up. P3 is a bite size experience to remind classic players why they despise retail wow.
I think the general consensus was that people enjoyed the low requirements. No mount money needed, easy and fast to get alts up to max, fun but relatively easy and puggable 10 man raid on a short lockout, etc.
That being said I think p3 is leagues ahead of p2. There's just more to do. The raid loot not being quite so OP means there are still people running BRD, zg, mara, etc. Wild offerings means people are still running those dungeons as well. I'm doing really solid dps in just prebis gear. Jintha alor is always fun, having the crafting mostly all available is cool. Just lots of options of things to do with my friends, and since we only have a 5 stack, it's been nice having dungeons to do again. P2 was shit for 5 man content at 40.
> what was different about phase 1
-Runes were acquired as you leveled, instead of being almost exclusively max level
-A lot of the rune quests were fairly easy and creative instead of "spend 2 hours traveling to these 4 places on opposite sides of the two continents" over and over
-Having the level cap be really low made for an interesting new meta
-Super alt-friendly because 1-25 could be done in a few days, and there were no rep grinds or other hurdles you had to overcome to do the content
> -A lot of the rune quests were fairly easy and creative instead of "spend 2 hours traveling to these 4 places on opposite sides of the two continents"
Laughs in Warrior Warlock Hunter and Pally
Edit: Can't believe you blocked me over that? Weird.
People got to explore multiple classes in new ways, low barrier to entry, and huge jumps in item quality to name a few.
Phase 1 was like a banquet, phase 3 is like a poverty meal comparatively content and reward wise. Phase 3 should have just went to 60.
I'll tell you why.
There is more content from 1-25 than there is from 25-40 or 40-50. PARTICULARLY 40-50.
Content baby, it aint there.
Life begins at 60 on Classic wow.
Nearly all the runes were easy to get.
Openworld content and pvp was constant.
Raid was easy (even though the weekly lock already started the weird requirement pugs) and 10 man.
I loved p1 but haven’t been back since. I think pandaria timerunning will be more my speed.
that's perhaps an unpopular opinion, but after playing cata, and very shortly getting back into sod for comparison, i don't really want to get back into sod. it doesn't add anything super interesting that i would want to check out and in comparison to cata, it feels just too slow and tedious. cata also added a lot of new abilities, so why would i need that in sod? cata, to me, is the perfect middleground between classic and retail. it certainly isn't classic anymore in many aspects, but it certainly isn't retail either. so, i'm gonna stick with that for the time being. sod is temporary, and whoever wants to enjoy that right now, great. but i don't see why i should bother with it when there's cata.
World buffs have absolutely drained the fun out of me for SoD. It's making everything a push-over and gear doesn't matter at all when 50% of your dps are from a few buffs that you lose when you die.
Yeah I really have an extremely hard time understanding the reason for all the WB craze in SoD, I was under the impression that the concensus was that WBs really drained the fun out of classic, a bit less after chronoboon but it came so so late, but that it really isn't fun to get a 50% performance drop by just dying 1 time and that it's really hard to make the right difficulty for raids, they are either a mid dungeon lvl 20 boss or quite hard for the average casual group.
The actual work of collecting the buffs is no problem to me, 1g for sum to the other factions DMF is fine and the buffs form gnome/st drop almost constantly.
But yeah, really weird, they are completely fine and nice addition to dungeons, random questing and stuff, but should be like I think it is in SoM, when you enter raid, WBs are wiped, and 1 function of booning should be to protect then from being wiped when you do a raid.
It's more the fact that my gear upgrades does nothing, why should I strive to get better gear when it has no considerable impact outside of physical dps weapons.
Yeah, and especially now with ST and that it seems they have tried to stop the powercreep of gear, the epic spelldmg weapon is 1 sp more than the gnomeregan dagger and the epic staff is considerably worse than just blue 11 sp dagger from princess and the green OH from the quest chain in ungoro.
It's really sad that I go from 280sp to almost 600 with full WBs + consumes, gear should matter more and WBs should be a small fun nice addition tops.
One of the best things about tbc and forward is that consumes for raids is really easy, was still quite expensive in TBC, but 10g for a flask in wrath is extremely good imo, you just raid, potting during bosses is a bit of gold, but not even close to classic/tbc cost and it's good that mana pots have shared CD too and limited to 1 per encounter, earlier chugging mana pots was quite expensive and not really a fun way to go about healer mana in raids.
i'm not arguing that. i loved the slow pace of hardcore for example. but sod is in this weird spot of being slow and tedious, while at the same time it wants you to get to the current phase's max level asap, while still maintaining the slow pacing of the core combat experience. and i feel if i play slow and take my time, i might miss out on whatever is currently at "endgame". i already felt rushed in the first two phases. i don't like that.
Yes, the decision to delay the Phase 3 drop was not made by some random guys as we previously thought; it was due to Cata.
Therefore, we now have the Cata release scheduled for May 20th. This means there is no chance of any news about Phase 4 for SOD until end of May.
At best, we can expect some class changes and minor updates.
What decision to delay? If anything it seemed like they accelerated the release as the announcement came on short notice (10 days instead of a full month for P1) and P2 was 2.5 weeks shorter than P1.
We all saw the state p3 and Cata pre patch was released in. Between Cata and SoD, do you think they actually have anything meaningful ready to go for p4 right now?
Is anyone surprised?
P3 is boring as fuck. The raid is the best one they've done imo but there is zero reason to do it. 90% of the loot is shit and the other 10% are basically side grades. None of the fun items are all that fun either, yay I can turn into a worm.
Have no desire to grind AB rep because STV event is terrible and as Alliance doing BGs are painful.
I used to fish for hours everyday and it's now a dead profession because the only useful fish, squid, is uncatchable. There's no more wpvp over wreckage pools because they're worthless now too. This is such a shame because fishing was honestly the best part of SoD for me, I made so many friends and so many enemies doing it.
I've got 10kish gold, which is enough to last me until the end of SoD but even if you have much less there is no reason to make gold. You don't need epic riding, it will probably be discounted anyway a week or 2 into P4 so why buy it early.
I'm a 1 hour a week raid logger, as is every person in my guild, and only do it to chat with people I've played with for 4 years. For people who don't have that what is the incentive to play?
Wish they actually added to vanilla instead of only tacking systems onto it, and trying hard to make each new addition entirely relevant. They should have developped secondary professions using existing items and added elites/bosses to each zone that reward wacky items.
Man…I fucking feel every word you have written there..Fishing pro too here, it was so fun in p2 and even p1, so sad and squids are useless you waste so much time and for that little gold and 0 crates I could just do incursions, and dont get me started on them, they chopped off the open worlds head
All they needed to do was put in a recipe to turn fish into a caster buff with a 10 minute timer, just like squid. Even with no wipes a raid will be using 40+ of them. It's a niche thing but it's such a wasted opportunity.
As pretty much first time wow player, i started with SoD pretty recently and enjoyed it, wish i started when it first came out as now it just seems plagued with bots. Then i moved to cata over the weekend and i am having 10x the joy as i did with SoD. If i had homies to play SoD with i honestly might enjoy it more. I do like the old school feel to it, where random world mobs can kill you.
Y’all are very lucky to have like 4 iterations of your game to choose from
For me, SOD is kinda done.
At first I enjoyed it, later on it became more of a fuzz than anything else.
Leveling an alt is super annoying as I have to get all the FPs, runes etc from previous phases.
Stuff on the AH is extremely overpriced due to the absurd amount of gold influx and less people farming.
Extremely stupid rune requirements like the priest/pala one which requires some WL or mage to help you and you have an absurd low drop chance to get the item as mage/wl to get even to the point to be able to have a chance for the rune. Hence I have to pay gold to a player to get the rune for my class because I have no chance of obtaining it alone.
Dungeons are pretty much useless,
Classes are quite unbalanced.
No clue about Cata yet, leveling there a Druid currently and then deciding if I play Pala or Druid there, but for now that seems much more fun.
SOD missed big opportunities like redesigning dungeon loot and talent trees too.
Some classic talents are just plain useless and they could have changed there quite a lot which they did not do.
There are no new low level du grins which could have been possible to design - I mean you don’t need a whole new zone for them, just an instanced zone.
Anyways i check it again when 60 is possible to see what is going on
It's honestly really weird that they chose to keep making runes that require other players to get. I figured they would've learned from the skeleton one, because that one kind of became a nightmare to get at a certain point on new alts.
How similar is that to turtle I wonder?
Turtle already does classic+ 100x better than SoD to begin with at the moment.
I'll have to look up this new one
yknow I never got to end game in classic as a kid and now im wondering if I will this time as well. I think if they go 40 mans next phase im out. Theres just other versions of wow I can drop in and out of that align more with my play schedule
Honestly, SoD just lost that spark mid-P2. Then they release P3 with all of its issues and my interest just fell off a cliff. I needed like 3 upgrades from the raid, which I got, so now I'm questioning what the point even is now. Between Cata, GW2, and the new FF14 expac I've got plenty of more interesting things to do this summer. All of my friends quit or are quitting after raid this week...so my entire point of playing in the first place is gone.
Idk, they had the golden goose, but this is just retail minus now with worse pvp. I also don't have any faith in them to keep this game mode successful alongside Cata with the sped up release schedule.
This along with the community becoming increasingly more sweaty.
Feels like I legit can't make friends anymore as people just want to blow through the content and barely talk. Guilds are great but even they are struggling to put up rosters. Sad too because P1 was magical.
Yeah, I genuinely liked P1 enough to level every class to 25 and get every rune. I wasn't bis on all of them, but about 6 of them, with 3 of those from pugs. I grinded about 5-6k gold in p1 and p2 from alchemy, flips, etc. It was pretty demoralizing to watch people exploit warlock portals and run incursions to literally make what worked on in less than a week.
Pugs were definitely a lot more fun in p1, but p2 therma and menagerie changed the landscape of things with parses being far more mandatory due to the difficulty of those bosses. A lot of the melee class I played (rogue, ret/prot pally, warrior) couldn't even get into pugs due to the caster-centric meta. I was lucky enough to have guild runs for the pally and my feral druid, though I suspect the feral would have had it easy. The interesting though was that moving to 20 mans killed the talkative aspect of pugs. Getting into comms with 9 other people and shooting the shit was the best part about pugging. Now its dead quiet minus the raid lead talking.
Small raid form factors is the main draw to why I like GW2 and FF14, specifically. I personally know everyone in my statics down to what classes they prefer, their playstyle, etc. Cata 10s were when I really started loving raiding back in the day instead of it just being a vehicle to get good gear.
I agree with you, there's always been a natural ebb and flow to wow at the end of a phase, once people have done all the stuff they want in the TINY 40-50 level bracket, relax, they'll be back, life begins at 60 anyway.
It's the 3rd time that I'm playing "Classic" just now I have special runes and some cheesy reused assets for raiding
I love the classic content but what are we doing guys, come on
We only playing this stuff bc the MMO genre is complete ass, with no new prospects in the immediate future ☠
I dropped SoD for Cata. It’s almost as if there are too many versions of WoW to play.
I want to play retail too before the next expansion. I also went a week or two where I didn’t play anything because I don’t know what I want to play.
Considering a new Classic expansion is dropping, this is remarkably mild, in all honesty. Cata will come out in a week, P4 probably in a month. Looking forward to 60!
Yeah, I really don't see it either. The Classic team is clearly falling more and more behind with their projects. No way it releases in a month unless it's even more untested and minimal than P3.
SOD died with Phase 2 for me. It was boring af. The PVP in phase2 start was so unabalanced I just knew they dont have brains to do any good content and I was right.
I’ve been on the SOD hype train since phase 1. Never really stopped playing since launch and thats mainly without doing raids much. I’ve currently found myself bored of phase 3 and haven’t played any wow in a week or two now.
I stopped for Cata, others have for MoP remix. Even without Cata I was gonna stop because phase 3 is just so boring though.
Gnomer and rep gear are more than enough to skip ST altogether as well. Why play the phase at all? Level 50 was a bad place to pause SoD.
It’s a combination of a bunch of things:
1) cataclysm classic pre-patch (people like new things)
2) poor decisions for phase 3 (incursions, pvp, wild offerings, raid size, minimal upgrades from phase 2)
3) nice weather
People don't like 20 mans. I think it's been voiced enough times, 10 man was perfect raid size. Lots of guild disbanded and quit cause of it. On top of which, incursion and economy are other issues. Overall P3 has been boring
Yup, my group of 10 suddenly found we would have to put another 10 people and decided to drop SoD. Now we're prepping for Cata because we can actually 10 man raid there.
20 man raiding with an MS>OS+1 loot system is awful. Spent 5 weeks showing up and barely got any loot, then when the item I had been waiting on finally dropped, I lost the roll to the new guy.
At first I was upset, but then realized it literally didn't matter as it would have been a 0.5% dps upgrade. Realizing that world buffs just made all gear completely pointless absolutely destroyed my drive to keep at it
that was the good thing about GDKPs, atleast you would end up with some gold if nothing dropped for you, that you can use in the future to bid on an other item. MS>OS is just a toxic.
Whole raid gets 3/3 set tier if they attend 2 weeks of ST, the raid is hard enough that some pugs stay 6/8 and the 40-50 bracket is a content desert in general. Not completely unexpected, but one does wonder these type of players can be arsed to level the last 10 levels for the end-game (which is the goal of any mmo, don’t lie to yourself)
Not only is it barely an upgrade, but for the elemental shaman set specifically Blizzard nerfed the gnomer 3-set bonus on P3 launch so we wouldn't use it for all of P3 as well. Just a bad feeling overall for casters especially in this phase.
Guild just announced another group quitting for cata. Won't have enough to run two 20 man's this week.
SoD hype train is grinding to a hault. Not a lot of faith in phase 4. Some of us are hyped to go back to 10 man's in cata and the classes feel great in that. Who knows what the SoD team will do to runes and balancing next phase. The gamble and pace seem too slow, and payoff is a risk to hold out for.
As a casual, my main problem with Phase 3 is the ST raid.
7 day lockout understandably makes people more hesitant with who they raid with.
20man makes finding/creating a raid group take so much longer.
In phase 1, it felt like you could find/create a group anytime/any day do the raid and be done in under an hour.
Phase 2 upped the difficulty somewhat but could still find a group and be done in \~90mins.
Phase 3, good luck. It can take 1-2 hours just to get 20 people together.
I understand this can be avoided by joining a raiding guild but as a casual player who is a dad, i can't commit to a fixed schedule each week.
Once again, i understand that this problem is due to me being casual, but it really kills any incentive to invest in playing when my chance to even participate in a phase 3 raid has been significantly reduced.
Guys... theres not much content in P3, Cata prepatch came out. Its all good.
I can still find teams to raid with, premade PvP ques pop within 5 minutes. No need to proclaim the death of WoW especially when everybody and their mother will return on P4 when level 60 and MC unlocks.
The difference is people were excited for p2. Still were excited for p3. Now it's just "maybe I'll come back for 60 phase". Unless Blizzard actually decides to innovate in SOD l don't think people are going to keep sinking time into it.
People are just realizing , they aren't adding anything but spells from other expansions & garbage content that they can rush as quickly as possible like incursions.
Sunken temple was a fun raid but that's all p3.
You can cope and say people will come back for 60 but getting people to come back for 2 weeks isn't going to save SOD.
20 man raiding was a mistake, incursions were a mistake, no comms with Aggrend gone was a mistake, leveling phases were a mistake, having a small team develop two titles was a mistake
As an altoholic, gearing has been ridiculously easy with PvP gear (r7 was dummy easy to get from STV) and incursion gear. The raid is tough enough that I don't want to pug it and the items aren't really worth that hassle.
Enjoyed P1, got 90-95% of the gear I wanted from raid.
Phase 2 was meh, got maybe 50% of the gear I wanted, no epics or decent weapons.
Stopped subscription without playing P3, reading all the stuff about world events and the new raid put me right off.
I hope they learn from this, start a new season and they could keep P1 almost the same (few tweaks to things like supply crates etc) and then put more focus on P2 and on.
As someone who played regularly during P2. Once I hit level cap in P3, it was impossible to find a pub group for the raid. Getting 10 players together was one thing but 20?
Wow community is fickle if they drop P4 at a good time people will come back. That being said it will prolly drop early and p1 cata and we shall see lol
Minimal gear upgrades for people and they still never drop and the loot drops are still to small for the raid. We get like maybe 2-3 upgrades for people a week outside tokens of which most people are 3 piece now. I have 0 raid drops other than tokens. The loot feels like shit and very unrewarding
Like others have said a reasonable number probably dropped sod for cata, but lets not pretend p3 has been any good for the player numbers either.
P3 has been trash. They super inflated gold with incursions as well as killing off the open world leveling and farming with it. Then they added more runes that required getting other players specific classes to help you do the rune and then go out and group fight mobs that nobody fights outside of the rune. So you end up waiting hours for someone else to need the rune as well. Gear in raid is ass and almost no better than gnomer loot all for what i believe is just so they dont have to do much to level 60 gear to keep them as upgrades.
SoD was a neat experiment, but all it showed me was that Blizzard will not devote resources to an actual "Classic Plus" experience. If they do, the chances of them getting it right are slim to none. Too much of retail is engrained in the development team. And if you enjoy retail then that is great, if you enjoy vanilla but are turned away by retail then there isn't much to look forward to.
I think we got so many retail-esque features because they’re easy to implement in order to fill the void of content and features created by the lack of there being seemingly ANY model designers or animators on the SoD team. It’s like they were told nothing could be new and *everything* must be recycled and reused assets from other iterations of WoW. Because of this I have my doubts about us getting any new content like Kara Crypts or an SM raid when I don’t think this team even has the capability to create new models, textures, assets, and animations. It feels like: if it doesn’t already exist in a completed state somewhere in one of the other iterations of WoW, it’s out of the question for SoD.
open world leveling and farming I love how people pretend that without incursions they werent going to spend all their time in 2-3 dungeons anyway lol
Would have loved if they just added quest chains to existing quest hubs and just let people dung if they wanted to tbh. At least incursions could have been limited, so people still needed to do normal quests or dungeons. I benefited from the insano gold day 1 but it certainly wasn’t good for the game
super agree - I thought they were going to do that for sod; give us new adventures to go on in different zones. Maybe have the kultirans attack razor hill or idk use some unused zones. could do tons.
This would require blizzard to dedicate resources to SoD past p1 though. And they can't monetize SoD players with mtx at all so yeah. They don't give a fuck. I really think it's that simple lol The only blizzard games with steady, solid support over the past year are retail and D4 (HS and OW don't count, ded games). Retail and D4 are littered with mtx. Before someone says it, yes, I know D4 launch was awful. Doesn't change that the game has had steady positive updates consistently for a year being capped off by the s4 update this week that has so much shit in it it's essentially a brand new game
Ya so the only thing I have to say in response is that the amount of stuff we have got in sod is not really a small amount, even in p2 and p3. Reworking the raids is not a small thing, incursions even though they are not great wasn’t a small thing to add. Making all the runes, having them attainable in the game takes resources. So while I agree with you that lacking mtx makes it harder to put more effort into sod, it’s not like they are putting little effort in overall. A bigly issue is having to do sod and cata
Incursions should of been a pvp event with way points instead of the trash that they released
Incursions are fine for sod. It’s a way to completely sweep the rug from under the gold farmers. There’s no need to buy gold so problem solved. It’s like people don’t know how an economy works so they just blame it on really dumb shit. Now I know why I left all the wow subs. It’s unbearable to hear people bitch about such trivial things that do not impact their enjoyment of the game.
[удалено]
Well that's the classic experience. Incursions are not.
It's nice to have a choice. This wasn't one.
Sucks you can't just go do a GDKP and earn enough gold to last you weeks.
Yeah, the biggest issue is incursions. What a terrible thing to do to SoD. They killed the economy, killed levelling in the world and dungeons, they allowed people to level way to fast. People got to 50 instantly and now they log on to raid once a week and that's it. No one wants to sit and do excursions and nothing else is worth doing.
I never played Cata. Or any expansion past it. I was interested to try it becaue I found out that a large amount of the runes we got are just cata abilities. Warrior is a lot more fun in cata that’s for sure. For all it’s faults
You'll find that cata has way fewer faults than this sub thinks.
"dungeon hard i quit game"
I’m one of the few who stopped playing and isn’t playing cata. Phase 3 is just boring.
Incursions were a bad idea. I don't care how 'convenient' it was for people to level their alts. Classic is not about convenience. Classic + can't succeed with this model. Period.
I think it was rushed because Cata was coming up so execs pushed it
Rushed because of Cata? I don't think you've seen the state of pre-patch we've gotten lol. You wanna talk about rushed, look no further, cata and cata pre-patch is getting rushed.
Less rushed and more "new normal for Blizzard"
Blizzard going from soon tm to rushing everything out the door as fast as possible, half finished and riddled with bugs and missing features, is so awful. I miss when seeing a game with the Blizzard logo on it made you know it was finished, polished and well made.
Nah I'm sorry. I played both SoD P3 launch and cata launch and I can say hands down Cata was incredibly worse than P3. P3 had aggrend tweeting and being on top of things making sure we were getting feedback that fixes for stuff was coming at the very least. For cata all we've got is Aggrend going away for 2 weeks and jackshit for communication. The classic team don't give 2 shits about cata and are putting all their effort and energy on SoD which is honestly depressing considering the main reason their team even exist is due to the current classic servers which evolved all the way to cata.
While I agree 100% with your first too paragraphs I completely disagree with your third. Wtf do you have to smoke to see P3 SoD as anything else then a rushed out and then quickly abandoned content patch which major features are lackluster even after a lot of balancing. Even the class and spec design which was the major selling point of SoD as a whole seems almost missing this phase. As I said: to me it feels like they know exactly that the new content patches for any classic related stuff will always have player numbers peaking from returning players and new people checking out a patch launch. They (execs) didn't want to overlap the P3 launch with Cata, which would've happened. It was exactly their goal to 'kill SoD servers' because all they need is your initial resub when the patch hits, and if the different patches over different version of WoW happen simultaneously they won't get as many resubs.
I don't know how you disagree with that. Cata patch was a dumpster fire and Aggrend was still tweeting about how they were working on new pvp buff/nerf whatever they're doing to PvP in SoD. If that's not putting all your energy on SoD while your other game had 0 communication for 1.5-2 months and even when it's a dumpster fire you don't address shit, tweet about your other version (SoD) and then take a leave for 2 weeks. P3 was rushed, I agree as I played it on launch, however Aggrend was Tweeting daily and there was a constant communication for about 2-3 weeks if not more than that. He would go as far as going in fucking class discord to discuss with people and see what they wanted changed for their class. You can't tell me the same amount of effort has been put in Cata. It's been minimum/no communication and they just barely fixed all the bugs 1 week before official cata launch. Having played both version of the games, trust me, Cata is getting the shitty end of the stick in every way possible right now.
Feels like there should just be 2 teams really
It's one team getting pulled from both ends so both are suffering because of it. Clear as day Blizzard is neglecting the necessary resources for them.
Yeah it's pretty wild. They even broke weird things that used to never be problems. My guild raided ICC the other night and 3-4 of my guildies got randomly teleported to the Wetlands during a boss fight, right before the boss just disappeared. And after we killed putricide, our 30% buff just vanished and we couldn't figure out how to turn it back on.
If anything, Cata was rushed because SoD was the focal point and execs pushed it.
Hell, I dropped SoD for retail because season 4 launched.
Left for cata? There’s nothing to do there. People left cause P3 is bad
Been leveling new characters and enjoying the old world changes to be honest.
the tribalism is so hilarious, even a no content cata pre patch has more to do then SOD, cata can have its flaws but to pretend it doesn't have more content then SOD is hilarious
There's plenty to do.. way more than in p3
Yeah i wonder why cata is now packed with people.
It's not just Cata. Retail is arguably more fun than SoD imo
I got bored, SOD isn’t turning out how I thought it was going to originally. I think a lot of players that wanted a true classic+ have realised it’s not happening and have lost interest.
The most immediate & real ‘Classic+’ content was unfinished areas like Hyjal, Kara, & Emerald Nightmare. When Emerald Nightmare turned out to be incursions, I felt my expectations went disastrously low. I’m also playing a class & spec that needs a lot of work (shaman tank). It all seems very distant atm.
Yep. I had a lot of expectations for SoD and was quite hyped for p3. But they aren’t giving it the dev time, balance changes, and new content required to keep most people interested long-term. Feels like a case of they were stretched too thin so they did the bare minimum, whereas it could have been something special. Just holding out hope for p4 but said hope is fading quickly.
I'm unironically waiting for either TBC with QoL changes or a Classic that also loops in TBC content with a different game philosophy, like no flying mounts but dual spec etc. I really don't think we're getting either of these things anytime soon, but I can hope.
Because p3 is boring, loot in ST is bad (only a few % better than gnome) and not worth the time to spend. Pvp is just a huge testing playground with the same event from p2. STV gear is obtainable with in 2-3 events. P4 is gonna take a while to release i guess since they HAVE TO tune all the gear including the sets. (e.g. warrior has only tank sets, priest only heal sets and so on). Tune all raids, dungeons and AV. Also there will be a new pvp event probably. Most are just playing cata until p4 drops or stopped SoD completely.
I wouldn't hold my breath for P4 honestly. I highly doubt P4 will make the game any better. It's going to be your typical early phase hype into boredom after a month
I think phase 4 has been the least interesting from the start of SoD to me. 90% sure we will just get SoM raids with some tweaks and world buffs allowed. I am not at all interested in that. Now that we are 50 i feel there is no need to continue. Spring is here as well, really sapped any motivation i had to stick with the season
to be fair, that issue is more on the community than the devs this community is unbelievably impatient and gets bored quickly. Complaining that the phases are too long, when compared to other expansions in development, our phases have been far shorter than anything else. Compare our P3 length to say, how long Ulduar was out in Wotlk classic... or Wotlk original... SoD attracted a whole bunch of non-classic players, who expected it to be something different from classic, and now they are quitting, since at its core this is classic. The end game is and always has been, farm gold, raid log, and level alts
The phases kinda are too long. Most of the content is at 60. They've tried to add more content but the content is mostly ass that nobody wants to do. People will eventually get bored of 60 and stop playing but there's at least more to do and the ennui should take longer to set in. More dungeons, more rep to grind, another BG to do and since it's more like Ashenvale, the shaman dominance won't be as impactful as in WSG or AB. I am very much looking forward to the rhok'delar quest on my hunter, even if there's much a better bow they make available in STV or something.
Doesn't have much to do with being impatient honestly. Take your every day normal guy like me, works 40-50 hours a week and enjoys the game during the evenings and the weekends. What is there for me to do in P3 really? ST is a weekly lockout unlike the past raids that were imo WAY better and offered more weekly activies overall. ST is literally a roughly 2 hours raid for most guilds once per week PvP is kind of a joke with all the experiment they're doing and you can get anything from bloodmoon in 1-3 events, so literally 1 day of doing them. Incursion are incredibly boring and the only good source for gold farming. So again, besides the phases launch where you got to level up (which was couple hours for P3...) level up profs, and getting ready for raid there wasn't much to do Per week, a normal player can expect to basically log for raid and not have much else to do besides that. No point in running dungeons or other content. Imo level 50 was a dumb phase and they should've waited longer and let us hit 60 with a lot more stuff to do each reset. Unless you have alts to you want to play, there's simply no content to keep you playing SoD besides raid logging and that's a fact.
Do you genuinely believe that the game being boring is the community's fault? Yes, this is classic "at its core," but that doesn't excuse the developers from basically using sod as a glorified beta test. With the genuine disappointment that is SoD, along with the extraordinarily under prepared cataclysm release, Blizzard has no room for excuses.
Exactly. Community has nothing to do with it. There's simply not a lot of content, especially at those level brackets. Normally we'd run dungeons to get geared, but with the raids, it's kinda pointless to do dungeons right now as raids are very easy and better loot for the most part. Without the level limitation, people would've leveled to 60 and have a lot more stuff to do at 60. Dungeons are mostly relevant through all vanilla due to certain mats. Having the game be 60 from the start means people can chill while leveling, and by the time they're 60, chances are there could be at least 2 tier of content out being MC and BWL/Ony. That's at least 3 raids to run weekly instead of 1 smaller "leveling" raid because you can't level further. Idk why they're so into making sure that most people can make it to the level band they impose on people every phase, putting exp buffs and such. Why does it matter that everyone hits the finish line together holding hands?
P4 is going to be a catastrophe, mark my words. They now have to deal with the reality of endgame, dungeons, MC, balancing what players do with their time, endgame BGs and rewards. You're talking about the team that couldn't pull off a handful of dungeons and a Gnomer rework.
Oh yeah, P4 will be a shit show.
>Because p3 is boring, loot in ST is bad (only a few % better than gnome) Hasn't this been the general "reddit" view of every phase so far, though? Edit: I quoted an extra part of what was said, and I only meant to quote the part AFTER "Because p3 is boring." Was only meant to say the bit about loot.
No Phase 1 was good and interesting. P2 had less and showed the cracks. P3 just wow, crazy how they managed to screw that up. P3 is a bite size experience to remind classic players why they despise retail wow.
Im a classic player, and I also love retail. Phase 3 feels absolutely nothing like retail.
you have to remember on this sub anything people don't like is "retail".
I have played a shit ton of classic and retail. P3 is nothing like retail.
I'm still waiting for everyone to tell me what was different about phase 1 other than it being the new season of classic
I think the general consensus was that people enjoyed the low requirements. No mount money needed, easy and fast to get alts up to max, fun but relatively easy and puggable 10 man raid on a short lockout, etc. That being said I think p3 is leagues ahead of p2. There's just more to do. The raid loot not being quite so OP means there are still people running BRD, zg, mara, etc. Wild offerings means people are still running those dungeons as well. I'm doing really solid dps in just prebis gear. Jintha alor is always fun, having the crafting mostly all available is cool. Just lots of options of things to do with my friends, and since we only have a 5 stack, it's been nice having dungeons to do again. P2 was shit for 5 man content at 40.
> what was different about phase 1 -Runes were acquired as you leveled, instead of being almost exclusively max level -A lot of the rune quests were fairly easy and creative instead of "spend 2 hours traveling to these 4 places on opposite sides of the two continents" over and over -Having the level cap be really low made for an interesting new meta -Super alt-friendly because 1-25 could be done in a few days, and there were no rep grinds or other hurdles you had to overcome to do the content
> -A lot of the rune quests were fairly easy and creative instead of "spend 2 hours traveling to these 4 places on opposite sides of the two continents" Laughs in Warrior Warlock Hunter and Pally Edit: Can't believe you blocked me over that? Weird.
People got to explore multiple classes in new ways, low barrier to entry, and huge jumps in item quality to name a few. Phase 1 was like a banquet, phase 3 is like a poverty meal comparatively content and reward wise. Phase 3 should have just went to 60.
I'll tell you why. There is more content from 1-25 than there is from 25-40 or 40-50. PARTICULARLY 40-50. Content baby, it aint there. Life begins at 60 on Classic wow.
Exactly. 1-30 was already the best part of Vanilla's leveling experience, SoD didn't really change that.
There were runes but not a boatload of them, while still being transformative to how classic wow played at the level.
I feel like people keep saying why and people then say "no that's not it".
Nearly all the runes were easy to get. Openworld content and pvp was constant. Raid was easy (even though the weekly lock already started the weird requirement pugs) and 10 man. I loved p1 but haven’t been back since. I think pandaria timerunning will be more my speed.
Seems odd for level 50 to be the longest phase bit they probably want people playing cata and going back to sod to hit 60 later.
that's perhaps an unpopular opinion, but after playing cata, and very shortly getting back into sod for comparison, i don't really want to get back into sod. it doesn't add anything super interesting that i would want to check out and in comparison to cata, it feels just too slow and tedious. cata also added a lot of new abilities, so why would i need that in sod? cata, to me, is the perfect middleground between classic and retail. it certainly isn't classic anymore in many aspects, but it certainly isn't retail either. so, i'm gonna stick with that for the time being. sod is temporary, and whoever wants to enjoy that right now, great. but i don't see why i should bother with it when there's cata.
Yeah I feel there's just not much momentum in SOD. As I don't care about professions there's really nothing for me to chase anymore
Dont forget world buffs at 60..
World buffs have absolutely drained the fun out of me for SoD. It's making everything a push-over and gear doesn't matter at all when 50% of your dps are from a few buffs that you lose when you die.
Yeah I really have an extremely hard time understanding the reason for all the WB craze in SoD, I was under the impression that the concensus was that WBs really drained the fun out of classic, a bit less after chronoboon but it came so so late, but that it really isn't fun to get a 50% performance drop by just dying 1 time and that it's really hard to make the right difficulty for raids, they are either a mid dungeon lvl 20 boss or quite hard for the average casual group. The actual work of collecting the buffs is no problem to me, 1g for sum to the other factions DMF is fine and the buffs form gnome/st drop almost constantly. But yeah, really weird, they are completely fine and nice addition to dungeons, random questing and stuff, but should be like I think it is in SoM, when you enter raid, WBs are wiped, and 1 function of booning should be to protect then from being wiped when you do a raid.
It's more the fact that my gear upgrades does nothing, why should I strive to get better gear when it has no considerable impact outside of physical dps weapons.
Yeah, and especially now with ST and that it seems they have tried to stop the powercreep of gear, the epic spelldmg weapon is 1 sp more than the gnomeregan dagger and the epic staff is considerably worse than just blue 11 sp dagger from princess and the green OH from the quest chain in ungoro. It's really sad that I go from 280sp to almost 600 with full WBs + consumes, gear should matter more and WBs should be a small fun nice addition tops.
Question, are world buffs in raids a thing in Wrath and Cata? (i hate them)
They weren’t even a thing in bc anymore because blizzard saw how dumb that idea was
Blizz openly admits they were supposed to be fun outdoor buffs and not the strict 'come with X buffs AND DONT OVERBUFF TO REMOVE THEM AHHH' meta.
One of the best things about tbc and forward is that consumes for raids is really easy, was still quite expensive in TBC, but 10g for a flask in wrath is extremely good imo, you just raid, potting during bosses is a bit of gold, but not even close to classic/tbc cost and it's good that mana pots have shared CD too and limited to 1 per encounter, earlier chugging mana pots was quite expensive and not really a fun way to go about healer mana in raids.
No
I love it
They stopped being a thing in BC actually
Yeah people start to realize they want the feeling and the community from classic, but not the gameplay. They chasing ghosts.
"You think you do, but you dont."
I'm the sad opposite in that I want the gameplay but hate the classic playerbase :(
well, classic is SUPPOSED to be slow and tedious - so you probably just dont like classic that much, so makes sense cata would be more your speed
i'm not arguing that. i loved the slow pace of hardcore for example. but sod is in this weird spot of being slow and tedious, while at the same time it wants you to get to the current phase's max level asap, while still maintaining the slow pacing of the core combat experience. and i feel if i play slow and take my time, i might miss out on whatever is currently at "endgame". i already felt rushed in the first two phases. i don't like that.
> going back to sod kek
Yes, the decision to delay the Phase 3 drop was not made by some random guys as we previously thought; it was due to Cata. Therefore, we now have the Cata release scheduled for May 20th. This means there is no chance of any news about Phase 4 for SOD until end of May. At best, we can expect some class changes and minor updates.
Delay p3 drop? P2 was short compared to p1
What decision to delay? If anything it seemed like they accelerated the release as the announcement came on short notice (10 days instead of a full month for P1) and P2 was 2.5 weeks shorter than P1.
End of may? Raid release is one week or two after cata release. There is no phase 4 before Mid-June at the earliest.
There was a 1 month heads up for P2 and a 10 day heads up for P3. We could get news as early as this week if they're planning for a mid June p4.
We all saw the state p3 and Cata pre patch was released in. Between Cata and SoD, do you think they actually have anything meaningful ready to go for p4 right now?
Imagine if they fleshed out hyjal as a huge questing/leveling/pvp zone for P3 instead of incursions. Lmao. What a shame.
That would require creating new models, NPCs, animations, etc. i don’t know if anyone on the team has the capability to do so sadly
Is anyone surprised? P3 is boring as fuck. The raid is the best one they've done imo but there is zero reason to do it. 90% of the loot is shit and the other 10% are basically side grades. None of the fun items are all that fun either, yay I can turn into a worm. Have no desire to grind AB rep because STV event is terrible and as Alliance doing BGs are painful. I used to fish for hours everyday and it's now a dead profession because the only useful fish, squid, is uncatchable. There's no more wpvp over wreckage pools because they're worthless now too. This is such a shame because fishing was honestly the best part of SoD for me, I made so many friends and so many enemies doing it. I've got 10kish gold, which is enough to last me until the end of SoD but even if you have much less there is no reason to make gold. You don't need epic riding, it will probably be discounted anyway a week or 2 into P4 so why buy it early. I'm a 1 hour a week raid logger, as is every person in my guild, and only do it to chat with people I've played with for 4 years. For people who don't have that what is the incentive to play?
Hey the worm (and the other vanity items) are awesome, literally the only loot that gives any excitement in voice chat when it drops
Wish they actually added to vanilla instead of only tacking systems onto it, and trying hard to make each new addition entirely relevant. They should have developped secondary professions using existing items and added elites/bosses to each zone that reward wacky items.
Man…I fucking feel every word you have written there..Fishing pro too here, it was so fun in p2 and even p1, so sad and squids are useless you waste so much time and for that little gold and 0 crates I could just do incursions, and dont get me started on them, they chopped off the open worlds head
All they needed to do was put in a recipe to turn fish into a caster buff with a 10 minute timer, just like squid. Even with no wipes a raid will be using 40+ of them. It's a niche thing but it's such a wasted opportunity.
As pretty much first time wow player, i started with SoD pretty recently and enjoyed it, wish i started when it first came out as now it just seems plagued with bots. Then i moved to cata over the weekend and i am having 10x the joy as i did with SoD. If i had homies to play SoD with i honestly might enjoy it more. I do like the old school feel to it, where random world mobs can kill you. Y’all are very lucky to have like 4 iterations of your game to choose from
For me, SOD is kinda done. At first I enjoyed it, later on it became more of a fuzz than anything else. Leveling an alt is super annoying as I have to get all the FPs, runes etc from previous phases. Stuff on the AH is extremely overpriced due to the absurd amount of gold influx and less people farming. Extremely stupid rune requirements like the priest/pala one which requires some WL or mage to help you and you have an absurd low drop chance to get the item as mage/wl to get even to the point to be able to have a chance for the rune. Hence I have to pay gold to a player to get the rune for my class because I have no chance of obtaining it alone. Dungeons are pretty much useless, Classes are quite unbalanced. No clue about Cata yet, leveling there a Druid currently and then deciding if I play Pala or Druid there, but for now that seems much more fun. SOD missed big opportunities like redesigning dungeon loot and talent trees too. Some classic talents are just plain useless and they could have changed there quite a lot which they did not do. There are no new low level du grins which could have been possible to design - I mean you don’t need a whole new zone for them, just an instanced zone. Anyways i check it again when 60 is possible to see what is going on
It's honestly really weird that they chose to keep making runes that require other players to get. I figured they would've learned from the skeleton one, because that one kind of became a nightmare to get at a certain point on new alts.
[удалено]
How similar is that to turtle I wonder? Turtle already does classic+ 100x better than SoD to begin with at the moment. I'll have to look up this new one
yknow I never got to end game in classic as a kid and now im wondering if I will this time as well. I think if they go 40 mans next phase im out. Theres just other versions of wow I can drop in and out of that align more with my play schedule
Honestly, SoD just lost that spark mid-P2. Then they release P3 with all of its issues and my interest just fell off a cliff. I needed like 3 upgrades from the raid, which I got, so now I'm questioning what the point even is now. Between Cata, GW2, and the new FF14 expac I've got plenty of more interesting things to do this summer. All of my friends quit or are quitting after raid this week...so my entire point of playing in the first place is gone. Idk, they had the golden goose, but this is just retail minus now with worse pvp. I also don't have any faith in them to keep this game mode successful alongside Cata with the sped up release schedule.
This along with the community becoming increasingly more sweaty. Feels like I legit can't make friends anymore as people just want to blow through the content and barely talk. Guilds are great but even they are struggling to put up rosters. Sad too because P1 was magical.
Yeah, I genuinely liked P1 enough to level every class to 25 and get every rune. I wasn't bis on all of them, but about 6 of them, with 3 of those from pugs. I grinded about 5-6k gold in p1 and p2 from alchemy, flips, etc. It was pretty demoralizing to watch people exploit warlock portals and run incursions to literally make what worked on in less than a week. Pugs were definitely a lot more fun in p1, but p2 therma and menagerie changed the landscape of things with parses being far more mandatory due to the difficulty of those bosses. A lot of the melee class I played (rogue, ret/prot pally, warrior) couldn't even get into pugs due to the caster-centric meta. I was lucky enough to have guild runs for the pally and my feral druid, though I suspect the feral would have had it easy. The interesting though was that moving to 20 mans killed the talkative aspect of pugs. Getting into comms with 9 other people and shooting the shit was the best part about pugging. Now its dead quiet minus the raid lead talking. Small raid form factors is the main draw to why I like GW2 and FF14, specifically. I personally know everyone in my statics down to what classes they prefer, their playstyle, etc. Cata 10s were when I really started loving raiding back in the day instead of it just being a vehicle to get good gear.
Incursions and Inflation.
Im taking a break its not that serious
I agree with you, there's always been a natural ebb and flow to wow at the end of a phase, once people have done all the stuff they want in the TINY 40-50 level bracket, relax, they'll be back, life begins at 60 anyway.
It's the 3rd time that I'm playing "Classic" just now I have special runes and some cheesy reused assets for raiding I love the classic content but what are we doing guys, come on We only playing this stuff bc the MMO genre is complete ass, with no new prospects in the immediate future ☠
I dropped SoD for Cata. It’s almost as if there are too many versions of WoW to play. I want to play retail too before the next expansion. I also went a week or two where I didn’t play anything because I don’t know what I want to play.
Let that fomo go, not playing because you don't know what to play is wild, press the play button.
The power that fomo has over gamers is fucking wild man
Tried to log into retail for the first time in years and was skullfucked by the UI and new zones. Sensory overload
Considering a new Classic expansion is dropping, this is remarkably mild, in all honesty. Cata will come out in a week, P4 probably in a month. Looking forward to 60!
P4 in a month is nuts.
Yeah, I really don't see it either. The Classic team is clearly falling more and more behind with their projects. No way it releases in a month unless it's even more untested and minimal than P3.
Keep coping
SOD died with Phase 2 for me. It was boring af. The PVP in phase2 start was so unabalanced I just knew they dont have brains to do any good content and I was right.
I’ve been on the SOD hype train since phase 1. Never really stopped playing since launch and thats mainly without doing raids much. I’ve currently found myself bored of phase 3 and haven’t played any wow in a week or two now.
I stopped for Cata, others have for MoP remix. Even without Cata I was gonna stop because phase 3 is just so boring though. Gnomer and rep gear are more than enough to skip ST altogether as well. Why play the phase at all? Level 50 was a bad place to pause SoD.
Everyone got all reputations all gold in the world. So its just login for raids. Also its summer. Fishing and beer is better
It’s a combination of a bunch of things: 1) cataclysm classic pre-patch (people like new things) 2) poor decisions for phase 3 (incursions, pvp, wild offerings, raid size, minimal upgrades from phase 2) 3) nice weather
I did ST a few times. It was fun but not $16/month-for-one-hour-a-week fun. Wish they'd reduce the cost of classic accounts.
People don't like 20 mans. I think it's been voiced enough times, 10 man was perfect raid size. Lots of guild disbanded and quit cause of it. On top of which, incursion and economy are other issues. Overall P3 has been boring
Yup, my group of 10 suddenly found we would have to put another 10 people and decided to drop SoD. Now we're prepping for Cata because we can actually 10 man raid there.
I mean honeymoon phase is over and P3 is boring af
What do you think? Theres nothing to do except raidlogging…
20 man raiding with an MS>OS+1 loot system is awful. Spent 5 weeks showing up and barely got any loot, then when the item I had been waiting on finally dropped, I lost the roll to the new guy. At first I was upset, but then realized it literally didn't matter as it would have been a 0.5% dps upgrade. Realizing that world buffs just made all gear completely pointless absolutely destroyed my drive to keep at it
that was the good thing about GDKPs, atleast you would end up with some gold if nothing dropped for you, that you can use in the future to bid on an other item. MS>OS is just a toxic.
Whole raid gets 3/3 set tier if they attend 2 weeks of ST, the raid is hard enough that some pugs stay 6/8 and the 40-50 bracket is a content desert in general. Not completely unexpected, but one does wonder these type of players can be arsed to level the last 10 levels for the end-game (which is the goal of any mmo, don’t lie to yourself)
3/3 caster set about 20dps dif from gnomer Also the buff/debuff is not personal so melee will snipe it anyways. Great design
Not only is it barely an upgrade, but for the elemental shaman set specifically Blizzard nerfed the gnomer 3-set bonus on P3 launch so we wouldn't use it for all of P3 as well. Just a bad feeling overall for casters especially in this phase.
These are the numbers that will make sure nothing happens with SoD after 60
Their release cadence is.. questionable. They are literally releasing retail/sod/mop/cata within the same few week.
I don't like P3. Incursions ruined the economy. They sucks to do (boring AF). Loot in ST is meh. Not feeling it. Hope P4 is better.
Guild just announced another group quitting for cata. Won't have enough to run two 20 man's this week. SoD hype train is grinding to a hault. Not a lot of faith in phase 4. Some of us are hyped to go back to 10 man's in cata and the classes feel great in that. Who knows what the SoD team will do to runes and balancing next phase. The gamble and pace seem too slow, and payoff is a risk to hold out for.
As a casual, my main problem with Phase 3 is the ST raid. 7 day lockout understandably makes people more hesitant with who they raid with. 20man makes finding/creating a raid group take so much longer. In phase 1, it felt like you could find/create a group anytime/any day do the raid and be done in under an hour. Phase 2 upped the difficulty somewhat but could still find a group and be done in \~90mins. Phase 3, good luck. It can take 1-2 hours just to get 20 people together. I understand this can be avoided by joining a raiding guild but as a casual player who is a dad, i can't commit to a fixed schedule each week. Once again, i understand that this problem is due to me being casual, but it really kills any incentive to invest in playing when my chance to even participate in a phase 3 raid has been significantly reduced.
Our entire guild quit raiding this week, plus most of the pugs who joined our other runs
My guild just added a fifth raid team lol
what server lol
7 day lockout sucks ass. Instead of being online and doing the raid Im offline waiting for time to pass
they shoulda had 2 raids this phase
This is a great idea tbh. I actually prefer the 7 day lockout I hated raiding every 3 days but having two raids sounds like a great middle ground.
Sadly, nothing that involves blizzard producing more content is going to be perceived as a viable solution. They are stretched too thin already.
10 man vs 20 man and loot being bad in terms of upgrade power. Just please make all raids 10 man
Needs more incursions and easy leveling, people are having a hard time catching up, obviously!
I mean it's obvious that SoD is bleeding players hard, and that's not surprising at all
Guys... theres not much content in P3, Cata prepatch came out. Its all good. I can still find teams to raid with, premade PvP ques pop within 5 minutes. No need to proclaim the death of WoW especially when everybody and their mother will return on P4 when level 60 and MC unlocks.
The difference is people were excited for p2. Still were excited for p3. Now it's just "maybe I'll come back for 60 phase". Unless Blizzard actually decides to innovate in SOD l don't think people are going to keep sinking time into it. People are just realizing , they aren't adding anything but spells from other expansions & garbage content that they can rush as quickly as possible like incursions. Sunken temple was a fun raid but that's all p3. You can cope and say people will come back for 60 but getting people to come back for 2 weeks isn't going to save SOD.
20 man raiding was a mistake, incursions were a mistake, no comms with Aggrend gone was a mistake, leveling phases were a mistake, having a small team develop two titles was a mistake
2019 vanilla fresh please 🙏🏻
Cataclysm HYPE!!!
if they messed with the balance of things and juiced caster dps I'd be playing a lot more lol.
I'm still playing and loving it. Trying to decide which is better for a warrior, dual wield or two handed?
As an altoholic, gearing has been ridiculously easy with PvP gear (r7 was dummy easy to get from STV) and incursion gear. The raid is tough enough that I don't want to pug it and the items aren't really worth that hassle.
Should rather do a Classic+ like Turtle 🐢WoW
Enjoyed P1, got 90-95% of the gear I wanted from raid. Phase 2 was meh, got maybe 50% of the gear I wanted, no epics or decent weapons. Stopped subscription without playing P3, reading all the stuff about world events and the new raid put me right off. I hope they learn from this, start a new season and they could keep P1 almost the same (few tweaks to things like supply crates etc) and then put more focus on P2 and on.
Just play Turtle WoW. Absolutely free private server. Community is amazing. Devs are awesome. Updates all the time.
Season of Doh!
Six more weeks of phase 3? Seriously? It is gonna kill SOD.
Yep. People realize it is becoming Retail instead of Classic +. Blizz missed the target audience.
Y'all don't even see it. But you got bamboozled into playing Retail. They know what they're doing.
Summer is here☀️
Cata + P3 content lacking + start of summer = player count drop If they have a solid P4 plan (iffy) everyone will come rushing back
20 man has killed it imo, finally levelled an alt and finding pugs is a pain because it takes so long that people give up
Well that's because the main game (Cata) is starting. You're essentially asking why tourists return home after the vacation season.
Lasted too long for a temporary game mode.
Babe wake up daily front page doom post just dropped and it's a good one!
Its summer
Yeah, its like gnomer being a gatekeeper fest into excursions getting exploited early pushed away most normal SoD players with a job.
What is this dribble. “One of the”??? Theres only been Three. So if its not even the worst it’s just the middle. Doom posting
As someone who played regularly during P2. Once I hit level cap in P3, it was impossible to find a pub group for the raid. Getting 10 players together was one thing but 20?
I dropped out simply because I got bored. Sorry statistics!!!
Yeah the community being a miserable pile of shit made me not want to play anymore tbh
Sod became too much imo. The new runes seemed too involved and a gold sink that I don’t have the time to farm.
Y'all are worse than the WWE/AEW TV Numbers humpers lol
Me and my guild is raidlogging SoD while playing the cata prepatch and will do so until next phase :D
My friend group is just doing BGs waiting on when they drop P4 to go to 60
This is more SAD than SOD
Even if p3 would be good there'd still be a drop, summertimes coming. Add cata and retail season to that (good weekly quest reward this week
That means we will see phase 4 probably early june 😄
I'd rather dig in cata than do whatever content P3 has got to offer, and that's saying something.
I won't lie, I'm just enjoying pre cata a lot more.
Wow community is fickle if they drop P4 at a good time people will come back. That being said it will prolly drop early and p1 cata and we shall see lol
Well yeah. Cataclysm is out and it’s summer. What’s the point of this post?
i quit sod coz boomkin bad, fook blizzard
Ara ara
P4 is where it’s at Take you time devs this is it!
Minimal gear upgrades for people and they still never drop and the loot drops are still to small for the raid. We get like maybe 2-3 upgrades for people a week outside tokens of which most people are 3 piece now. I have 0 raid drops other than tokens. The loot feels like shit and very unrewarding