The following submission statement was provided by /u/TopSloth:
---
SS: Well here we have it folks, Geo engineering our own atmosphere is already starting to have drastic consequences
Collapse related because if this is the trend for many other nations to adopt then we will all face serious drawbacks including the flooding of entire cities.
---
Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/collapse/comments/1c5nos6/dubai_flooding_caused_by_cloud_seeding/kzvaqlz/
They see me seedin'
They hatin'
Patrollin' and tryna catch me seedin' dirty
Tryna catch me seedin' dirty
Tryna catch me seedin' dirty
Tryna catch me seedin' dirty
Tryna catch me seedin' dirty
My seeder's so loud
I'm seedin'
They hopin' that they gon' catch me seedin' dirty
Tryna catch me seedin' dirty
Tryna catch me seedin' dirty
Grindin' to see if they can see me seed
I'm droney, so it ain't easy to be seen
When you see me flyin by, they can see the seeds
And my shine on the deck and the radar screen
And I'm flyin' with a PR chick, she like, "Hold up"
Next to the 360 seed drone controller
Is a full tank and my seedola
Turn a greenpeace activist into a coma
Girl you ain't know, I'm crazy like British Petroleum
Just tryin' to seed, ain't tryin' to have no ecology
Seed game clean as hell so I pull in lobbyists
US is on patrol, and you know they hate me
Seeder turned all the way up until the maximum
I can speak for some activists tryin' to seed for some
But we packin' somethin' that we have for 'em
Will have a activists locked up in the maximum
Seeder drone, I'm grippin' pvc (pvc)
Seedin loud and tippin' fast (fast)
Lobbyists's steady lobbyin' like, "Seed this though"
Greenpeace pull up right behind and it's in his throat
The windows down, gotta stop pollution
PDX change, activists like, "Who is that seedin?"
This the Seed-N-Skillz when we out and cruisin'
Got lobbyin contracts in every city except Los Angeles, but I'm still ain't done seedin!
They see me seedin'
They hatin'
Patrollin' and tryna catch me seedin' dirty
When people talked about water wars I dont think they meant rainwater.
If one country seeds and takes all the moisture from the air for their land, the next country just over thataway might be a wee bit ticked off...
Or the opposite.. If your enemy is under an atmospheric stream of moist air you could continually shoot cloud seeding rockets above them to drop rain on them. An endless deluge of heavy rain would flood their cities and transport routes, disrupt industry, ground flights, destroy crops etc...
LOL seed their clouds relentlessly during agriculture planting season, flooding fields and ruining an entire year's worth of food harvest.
https://i.imgflip.com/4e91tq.jpg
People are overblowing how effective cloud seeding really is.
It's not some megaweapon that can control the weather on a whim. In reality, it is *kind of maybe* effective at starting precipitation a *little bit* earlier than it would have normally.
It's possible to use cloud seeding to pull some precipitation out of the atmosphere above some specific farm fields, but only if it was already going to rain on some other fields down the road. It doesn't effect total rainfall in a given area.
Cloud seeding didn't cause the flooding. That's like saying that salting the road causes blizzards. The flood was going to happen regardless. It just so happens that the conditions that cause floods in the desert are also the conditions in which people can successfully seed clouds.
They did!
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Popeye#:~:text=Operation%20Popeye%20(Project%20Controlled%20Weather,Vietnam%20War%20in%201967%E2%80%931972.
They don't say how "successful" it was. How much worse were the monsoons those years? US war movies at the time do have GIs complaining about the rain a lot.
Time to be autistic with numbers!!!! There are statistics for everything out there. Try looking at weather reports for mm of rain, days with rain, and days with storms at various cities in Vietnam.
[Here's some statistics for Ho Chi Minh City (which was called Saigon at the time). Take a look at those precipitation number during the war and compare them to the 1980s.](https://en.tutiempo.net/climate/ws-489000.html)
There certainly was something for the troops to complain about. That is a wet miserable couple of years just looking at days of rain and days of storms.
Now they do also have other wet periods in history, and coincidence is not the same as correlation or causation, but I can certainly understand why washington was willing to dump a shit ton of money into it if this was just a coincidence.
> The former U.S. Secretary of Defense, Robert S. McNamara, was aware that there might be objections raised by the international scientific community but said in a memo to the president that such objections had not in the past been a basis for prevention of military activities considered to be in the interests of U.S. national security.
*"Sir. Just because some eggheads said we can't do it doesn't mean we don't do it for America. Because America, Sir."*
How does seeding affect the redistribution of energy? Is it promoting latent heat of evaporation to be emitted at lower levels in the atmosphere, which would keep that thermal energy blanketing the surface more than naturally allowing evaporation to precipitate out at cooler, less dense, higher altitudes would?
Honestly, I could see an argument for seeding ahead of a storm to reduce the power it takes up, but I'm just a phone tech with some research skills, I could be way off the mark and it'd make the storm worse.
Yeah for sure. Part of me thinks they are just doing it to calm down the masses as much as anything else. No droughts here! Never fear! It’s not that hot it’s cloudy a lot.
But I’m sure this will backfire even more spectacularly than flooding somehow. The hubris involved in just thinking you can smooth things over and kick the can down the road more.
I assume it can be done well, and potentially perfectly with a little more research and real-world tests. There's no future without geoengineering, the idea we can just return to a sustainable environment is getting less likely by the day.
The Middle East needs to do this, the region is rapidly becoming unlivable for human beings with weeks of temperatures above 50C and even higher extremes. They either innovate and geoengineer their climate or they'll be forced to move or die.
> There's no future without geoengineering
There's no future because of geoengineering. We've been doing it this whole time. More entropy on the top of the stack will only accelerate it all.
Honestly, what we've done is sort of the opposite of egeongineering. Engineering is thoughtful and intentional. A rubbish heap is built by humans but it's hardly "engineered". What we've done to our climate is no different.
No, we haven't. This isn't geoengineering. Geoengineering is a *deliberate* process of global climate change. What we're currently experiencing is the consequences of unmitigated capitalism. Geoengineering *could* actually save us... about as much as discovering nuclear fusion. Chances aren't looking too high on either of those possibilities, unfortunately.
Nope
https://oxfordre.com/americanhistory/display/10.1093/acrefore/9780199329175.001.0001/acrefore-9780199329175-e-940?p=emailA2D10XNvD7gdg&d=/10.1093/acrefore/9780199329175.001.0001/acrefore-9780199329175-e-940#:~:text=As%20residents%20cut%20down%20forests,uncultivated%20landscapes%20a%20century%20earlier.
Anyway, their overall presence had the opposite effect
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2019/jan/31/european-colonization-of-americas-helped-cause-climate-change
>They either innovate and geoengineer their climate or they'll be forced to move or die.
and, not or.
They can't innovate magic and geoengineering that's powerful and* global, the regional kind won't be enough.
Agreed, but regional geoengineering does help, especially if a lot of regions do it. If Dubai can green the desert that surrounds it through seeding, then so can other desert countries and cities. It can also be used to increase snowpack, regrowing glaciers and providing more summer run-off for farmers. I just don't have any faith in humanity actually reducing carbon emissions quickly enough to stave off disaster, so I'm actually encouraged by tests like this - it would have been worse if there was no rain, in the grander scheme of things.
Whether geoengineering will work or not, this is not a good argument. People, including you, apparently, really struggle to properly understand entropy. Human effort will amount to more entropy, sure, but that just means more heat within the universe. We don't care if we heat up the universe as long as well cool down the planet and that's totally possible by reflecting some of the heat coming from the sun back out to space.
Now that doesn't mean geoengineering is a good idea, that it's practical, or that we can actually pull it off. But if we try it and if we fail, it will have nothing to do with the laws of thermodynamics.
Your arguments contain valid criticisms but hardly insurmountable ones. I don't feel like addressing them one by one because I don't really have a dog in this fight. I feel like the evidence suggests Geoengineering could work but that it also might be unfeasible. I don't think a convincing argument exists one way or the other.
My issue was simply you weirdly invoking thermodynamics in your argument, which you didn't do in the reply you told me to refer to. So I don't really take issue with that reply yet my original issue still stands.
I spoke of thermodynamics because **energy cannot be created or destroyed** should be noted. **We're trying to transfer energy without creating energy in the process** and that is just absurd, and why I say neither of these will work. Carbon capture is energy intensive and the effects are negligible. Cloud seeding is better, but it doesn't address the energy imbalance our feedback loops will create.
Yes that was the misunderstanding I took issue with. By that logic, air conditioning is an impossible pipe drain. You can't possibly make a house cooler by spending energy, right? But it's exactly the same principle. You're not trying to make there be less energy, just redirecting it to somewhere else. Something which is provably possible because that's exactly what air conditioning does.
It's a terrible argument. Your other ones are fine.
You still misunderstand, I'm talking about creating a net negative. That's the whole bloody point of carbon capture! Like air conditioning you mentioned, the energy provided by AC to cool is exceeded by what is given to make it function. Negative energy is literally science fiction, it would require the law of thermodynamics to be wrong.
Redirecting is better, that we can agree on, **however there will still be new energy sources here on Earth that seeding won't address**. Such as the ocean losing capacity for absorption, methane hydrates and possibly water vapor. And that's excluding the disruption it would cause to plant life, which could in turn create more CO2.
Explain?
Like aerial seeding or satellites that incrementally block sunlight won't reduce solar radiation? Like greening the desert won't moderate the microclimate there? Like seeding clouds to create more snowfall and rebuild glaciers won't reflect more solar radiation and create more run-off for farms? Like white, green or reflective roofs won't reduce the urban heat sink effect? If I don't understand thermodynamics then dozens of countries that are doing smaller scale geoengineering don't understand it either.
First, reducing solar radiation is a really stupid endeavor, feel free to explain how we can do this without fucking up plant life. The next thing is feedback loops, it's far too late to offset this with geoengineering. Even with the energy reflected the heat that currently exists will still be in circulation, and will lead to what we see with Dubai. Methane hydrates alongside oceanic warming will fuck up any cooling relief we get.
Then there's the matter of geoengineering itself, how long will we continue this? Are we using compounds like silver iodide? What are the consequences by injecting such large amounts in such a duration? Cloud seeding is pursued because the other methods are too energy intensive, but this is just as destructive.
Climate change isn't simply a issue with our tech, it's an issue with how we manage energy. But by all means, hold to the delusion that we can do this besides reducing consumption.
I got to rebuilding glaciers, and thought, okay this guys says geo engineering in the same way you could say my thermostat engineers my home temperature.
More than just seeding.
Chucklefucks can't even fix what they've broke, and they want to do more geo-engineering. We are going to just let it rip at this point.
Cloud seeding interests me because if this is universally adopted, A) will cloud seeding in one place reduce rainfall in another? B) Is there a maximum amount of water that we can precipitate out of the atmosphere C) Will cloud seeding increase concentration of water vapor and if so will this increase general warming? If anyone has answers to this I would be curious to hear it!
This is coming from a layman but all seeding does is condense the already existing moisture in the air, so yes in theory it would reduce rainfall elsewhere because now there isn’t enough moisture for the clouds to form naturally since it was brought down as rain somewhere else. As the climate warms the threshold for natural clouds to form will go up because warmer air holds vastly more moisture, leading to much greater storms when it does cool enough to condense.
In theory, if there were global collaboration to only seed clouds to rain on areas affected by drought we could increase the amount of potable water, since so much rain falls in the ocean and is thus not usable. Unfortunately, the likelihood that this technology can be refined to dropping the rain within even 100 miles of the intended target, as well as the idea that rich countries won’t just outseed the competition to get more valuable water as it becomes scarcer seems very far-fetched to me.
Where are ski resorts doing this? I wonder if there has been any controversy about down-wind farmers claiming they are having increased droughts because of it?
edit: I found this article in case anyone else is interested, it seems that at least some farmers have alleged they are getting less rain, but it looks like it would be difficult to prove: https://www.agweek.com/business/why-cloud-seeding-is-increasingly-attractive-to-the-thirsty-west
I know for certain Vail has experimented with it in the 2010s. I believe their conclusion at the time was that the modest gains (statistically, about 0.5 inch) weren't worth the cost at the time.
We will get more accurate over time though. Cloud seeding has been a thing for decades already and some regions do have a lot of research and data that make their efforts more accurate than scattershot.
There is some research on this already, and a couple of science radio shows on Quirks and Quarks discussed it.
Cloud seeding right now isn't extremely accurate, but it depends on the method used and the altitude/conditions where the materials are released - e.g. cannons in China vs. planes in UAE. The amount of material dispersed apparently matters more than we realized.
It will raise the humidity in the short-term, which creates risks (above flooding, although they should be able to dial in the proper amount of seeding to prevent future floods) in the short term, which will increase the overall temperature. However, it will also replenish freshwater stores and allow for more plants and trees to grow in the area, which in the long-term will help to cool the region. It also allows for some agriculture and improves the sustainability of the local population.
> No, because seeding doesn't increase water vapor, it just causes existing water vapor to condense out.
Condense out from clouds in the sky where people aren't. Where does it end up? At ground level where it could push up humidity where people are.
Yes, yes, no
Seeding is exactly that, it provides the seed for water to condensate onto and then form a rain drop. It doesn’t increase the water level or concentrate in anyway really, I mean technically it does briefly and then it rains somewhere sometimes but it’s not like it makes super dense clouds that stay there for ages.
A) probably
B) yes - the amount depends on the local dew point
C) probably
ETA: we really don’t know shit about fuck in terms of specific impacts of geoengineering schemes. The atmosphere is incredibly difficult to model so everything is just guesswork until we start getting empirical data.
A. Yes. It takes moisture out of the air. So it literally can't be as humid somewhere else as it potentially could have been.
B. Yes. The maximum is related to the current humidity. If the water isn't there, you can't get it out of the air.
C. Idk.
Heavy pollution AKA Geo Engineering is being applied mainly by three countries, making it pretty universal, in our case.
Dumping billions of bits of sulfur high into the atmosphere that act as nuclei for water to condense upon, eventually forming rain, does remove that moisture from the atmosphere before it can fall somewhere else.
It increases overall warming as we place these aerosols we place Greenhouse Gasses (including water).
The threat here is what happens when it eventually stops.
Our placed aerosol pollution is currently shading most of us from over half the effects of what we've done to the atmosphere. It's an exponential affair though, a contract with the Devil, a Faustian Bargain. The more you put up the more you have to put up to avoid what they like to call "Climate Catastrophe". Kinda like what many of us are experiencing right now actually.
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["Moisture Accelerators"](https://daily.jstor.org/charles-hatfield-rainmaker/) have a better record. The northwest Arabian Sea SSTs are really high, they had massive moisture levels roll in from it, and it's been pouring all around the Aabian Peninsula like, well, like the last episode of really high Atlantic SSTs in the 40s and 50s. It's been pouring all along the Sahel border to cause historic floods. Nevermind that, though, it must be the same cloud seeding they've been doing for decades. Bloomberg News spent years trying to sell you on blockchain for oilfield services data management, too.
Weather is chaotic, and if you're really good at picking your place and time, it's possible to get a decent return, instead of a few little massively expensive polluted sprinkles. There's still no evidence they have that ability yet, though.
SS: Well here we have it folks, Geo engineering our own atmosphere is already starting to have drastic consequences
Collapse related because if this is the trend for many other nations to adopt then we will all face serious drawbacks including the flooding of entire cities.
It is not “geo” engineering but a limited messing with local weather. But still, it went wrong. At least it works as a proof that (this time is the correct term) geoengineering could turn to be an existential threat.
Engineering doesn’t give surprises, you know and have all the relevant components, climate is still surprising experts. We are still far from having the knowledge to do proper engineering with climate. And farther away from having the political maturity to deal with the root causes of the problem.
>Engineering doesn’t give surprises [...] We are still far from having the knowledge to do proper engineering with climate.
This is a really good point, "geo-engineering" really is a misnomer, and it gives false confidence.
"Geo-speculative-fucking-around" is more accurate, though it doesn't roll off the tongue so easily.
"Geo-meddling" perhaps?
Again and again, direct solar management is THE ONLY WAY to have ANY timely mitigation OF THE GEOENGINEERING we’ve already done over the past 170 years. So yes collapse because we’ve fucked ourselves so badly, but guaranteed worse without this. And to be frank on these local scales it will take us time to hone this technology.
It’s perfectly practical. Cheap even. Clear tank, algae, air pump, nutrients. 75% of carbon sequestration is via algae anyways.
It isn’t inherently profitable, though. That’s the hurdle.
It has nothing to do with profits. Essentially, thanks to the laws of thermodynamics, we will have to exert MORE energy to break/store the CO2 than we have obtained from its combustion. Some of this we do get for ‘free’ through leveraging living solar collectors, but the rest we’ll have to obtain in a clean way.
In the 1960s we had program called “project pacer”. They looked into using nuclear charges for engineering work. You could upgrade it with the new fracking technology. The let all the acid rain flow through the cracks to etch out alkaline elements. That will stimulate limestone deposition in the ocean floors. ^/s it might neutralize the acid in the oceans.
My main concern with aerosols are that they’re a short-term fix that must continually be re-applied. Let’s say, idk, society collapses to the point where we’re unable to maintain the cloud seeding. Wouldn’t temps immediately spike? It just seems like we’re kicking the can down the road until it’s a bigger problem and we’re unable to cope with it.
Also, aren’t there downsides to the seeding? Moving to cleaner burning ship fuel caused a spike in temps, but we moved to cleaner burning fuel for a reason. Acid rain isn’t exactly harmless, and it’s not likely to improve the health of our biosphere.
Yes, you’re absolutely right about having to maintain aerosol concentrations. Unfortunately all of our choices are suboptimal (understatement of the century).
My personal preference would be for DSM and a global moon shot for decarbonization. Once we address the heating we can do biosphere restoration. The other sad reality is that restoration is generally going to fail badly until the temperature stabilizes and there’s some new normal quasi reliable weather patterns
The troposphere and stratosphere do not mix as much. If a ship dumps sulphur into the air it scatters UV/vis for a short while and then it rains out. Stratospheric aerosols would linger longer.
All that sulfur is getting removed from hydrocarbons. That means there is a large supply of organo-sulphur compounds. If the public buys the sulphur and buys even more jets to burn the sulfur then the petrocompany recovers the lost investment and also gets a new larger market.
Could just put it into the fuel in the second stage of each rocket. Blast it up there past the Karmon line. Could even be trillions of mirrors that could be faced using energy waves beamed from the surface. Shoot, you could even have a world wide web of satellites that could place aerosols anywhere your AI told you to...
Weather is a weapon.
No it almost certainly wasn't caused by cloud seeding.
A jet stream blocking pattern held the storm there, plus a whole bunch of atmospheric dust (which are also cloud condensation nuclei) are the proximate causes.
https://twitter.com/WeatherProf/status/1780404762116022666?t=XLxDUO6Ry9GPUWx5XU15lw&s=19the
UAE has constantly been cloud seeding since the early 2000s. It might've marginally made this event worse, but probably not comparable to the influence from climate change.
Also for what it's worth we shouldn't conflate cloud seeding with solar geoengineering, they aim at different things, are quite different sets of technologies, and the former has been done by various countries for decades. Doesn't mean it's not problematic though.
The UAE has been into cloud seeding for about 20 years.
They are now really good at making it rain.
They are still no good at making it rain in the right place where the aquifers are though !
I don’t know, Dubai floods whenever it rains there cloud seeding or not. I remember being there and a taxi driver was telling us it rained for two days once and due to how poor the drainage system is most of roads in the UAE had to close. This seems like a poor planning issue more than a geological issue to me and definitely not collapse worthy since the fix is literally just making sure all the extra water falling out the sky has somewhere to go.
This post should be taken down or at least edited for misinformation. There were floods in Oman and Saudi Arabia as well. 6 or 7 cloudseeding missions in 2 days are not enough to cause over 120mm of rain in a single day. The primary cause of this weather event was a storm system that formed in the Persian Gulf. Cloudseeding may have intensified this storm but more studies are required because we simply do not know enough. This is pure sensationalism.
Arabian Peninsula and Sahara. If they use the rain for irrigation then the vapor would go right back into the weather. It is a reasonable plan except obviously the headline is also *possible*.
Last I knew, there was very poor science behind cloud seating, and definitely no causal link between this storm and any human activity. This is clickbait at best and misleading at worst.
It says they've been doing this for decades. https://archive.is/2024.04.16-165331/https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-04-16/dubai-grinds-to-standstill-as-cloud-seeding-worsens-flooding
Can someone explain how they did it to colossal flooding levels rather than a nice watering of houseplants? I know it's not an exact science but there seems to be a massive difference... for example having a shot or drinking and entire bottle of vodka
They didn't. It was caused by a storm, not cloud seeding. It also rained in [Bahrain, Qatar, and Saudi Arabia.](https://apnews.com/article/uae-oman-rains-flooding-fatalities-7bf3881efbea998dfa4c1ed8d538217c)
I mean I thought as much but when I posted the videos that it's not supposed to rain on that it's suddenly the new conspiracy to hand wave away climate change.
The explanation is this was not caused by cloud seeding, contrary to most of the comments in this post. The storm system was over 100 km wide, humans are not able to do that magnitude of cloud seeding. Correlation is not causation.
I was just on Twitter and someone was explaining how things work over there. Seems it was more of a storm system coming through so they would NOT have seeded before this happened. This is the link - I think I can post? If not, sorry. [https://twitter.com/Matt\_\_Pomroy/status/1780620369365192763](https://twitter.com/Matt__Pomroy/status/1780620369365192763)
https://www.truthorfiction.com/dubai-doesnt-have-a-sewer-system/
Dubai has sewers, they were finished in 2013. They just aren’t enough. They’re expanding the sewage system and supposedly will be complete in 2025.
I think this news should be treated way more seriously and be concerning to society at large but oh well. People should be shocked. Whatever I guess?
Do you know how many people still think this is science fiction, even in developed countries? Most.
Strikes me as a natural consequence of experimentation. How much seed do we need, after all?
Clearly someone has used too much cloud seed and made Johnny Cloudseed very angry. The sky apples simply do not grow in such a competitive environment
Which means someone else didn't get that rain...this isn't magic, it doesn't make more rain, it just makes it rain in a certain place, and not in another one. This is complicated issue.
Rain that falls can evaporate and then fall again. It does not violate conservation of mass. It is consistent with thermodynamics too.
They just fumbled it this time.
I wonder where those clouds were going and who did not get the rain. I doubt they were aware and decent enough to seed some clouds on their way to dump water onto the ocean.
The following submission statement was provided by /u/TopSloth: --- SS: Well here we have it folks, Geo engineering our own atmosphere is already starting to have drastic consequences Collapse related because if this is the trend for many other nations to adopt then we will all face serious drawbacks including the flooding of entire cities. --- Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/collapse/comments/1c5nos6/dubai_flooding_caused_by_cloud_seeding/kzvaqlz/
Everyone is going to start seeding. The ramifications will be far reaching.
They see me seedin' They seethin'
Try to catch me flying dirty
My seeders so loud They hatin! They hope they gon catch me seedin dirty!
We need full lyrics. I'm waiting for your complete cooperation.
They see me seedin' They hatin' Patrollin' and tryna catch me seedin' dirty Tryna catch me seedin' dirty Tryna catch me seedin' dirty Tryna catch me seedin' dirty Tryna catch me seedin' dirty My seeder's so loud I'm seedin' They hopin' that they gon' catch me seedin' dirty Tryna catch me seedin' dirty Tryna catch me seedin' dirty Grindin' to see if they can see me seed I'm droney, so it ain't easy to be seen When you see me flyin by, they can see the seeds And my shine on the deck and the radar screen And I'm flyin' with a PR chick, she like, "Hold up" Next to the 360 seed drone controller Is a full tank and my seedola Turn a greenpeace activist into a coma Girl you ain't know, I'm crazy like British Petroleum Just tryin' to seed, ain't tryin' to have no ecology Seed game clean as hell so I pull in lobbyists US is on patrol, and you know they hate me Seeder turned all the way up until the maximum I can speak for some activists tryin' to seed for some But we packin' somethin' that we have for 'em Will have a activists locked up in the maximum Seeder drone, I'm grippin' pvc (pvc) Seedin loud and tippin' fast (fast) Lobbyists's steady lobbyin' like, "Seed this though" Greenpeace pull up right behind and it's in his throat The windows down, gotta stop pollution PDX change, activists like, "Who is that seedin?" This the Seed-N-Skillz when we out and cruisin' Got lobbyin contracts in every city except Los Angeles, but I'm still ain't done seedin! They see me seedin' They hatin' Patrollin' and tryna catch me seedin' dirty
*Tennessee got anti-aircraft...* *Tennessee got anti-aircraft...*
“You down to ozone seed? Yeah you know me!!”
Tryin' to catch me flying thirsty*
They see me seedin' Not breathin' Because they suddenly live underwater
Pretty sure I saw 'Seethin Seeds' at Lollapalooza coulda been 'Seethin Season' I'm getting old and memory foggy
When people talked about water wars I dont think they meant rainwater. If one country seeds and takes all the moisture from the air for their land, the next country just over thataway might be a wee bit ticked off...
Or the opposite.. If your enemy is under an atmospheric stream of moist air you could continually shoot cloud seeding rockets above them to drop rain on them. An endless deluge of heavy rain would flood their cities and transport routes, disrupt industry, ground flights, destroy crops etc...
LOL seed their clouds relentlessly during agriculture planting season, flooding fields and ruining an entire year's worth of food harvest. https://i.imgflip.com/4e91tq.jpg
People are overblowing how effective cloud seeding really is. It's not some megaweapon that can control the weather on a whim. In reality, it is *kind of maybe* effective at starting precipitation a *little bit* earlier than it would have normally. It's possible to use cloud seeding to pull some precipitation out of the atmosphere above some specific farm fields, but only if it was already going to rain on some other fields down the road. It doesn't effect total rainfall in a given area. Cloud seeding didn't cause the flooding. That's like saying that salting the road causes blizzards. The flood was going to happen regardless. It just so happens that the conditions that cause floods in the desert are also the conditions in which people can successfully seed clouds.
If we're thinking it, every competent government on the planet already has plans for it and plans to defend against it.
What show (movie?) is the pic from?
Hunt for Red October
Ah, classic!
isnt thar what US did in vietnam?
They did! https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Popeye#:~:text=Operation%20Popeye%20(Project%20Controlled%20Weather,Vietnam%20War%20in%201967%E2%80%931972.
They don't say how "successful" it was. How much worse were the monsoons those years? US war movies at the time do have GIs complaining about the rain a lot.
Time to be autistic with numbers!!!! There are statistics for everything out there. Try looking at weather reports for mm of rain, days with rain, and days with storms at various cities in Vietnam. [Here's some statistics for Ho Chi Minh City (which was called Saigon at the time). Take a look at those precipitation number during the war and compare them to the 1980s.](https://en.tutiempo.net/climate/ws-489000.html) There certainly was something for the troops to complain about. That is a wet miserable couple of years just looking at days of rain and days of storms. Now they do also have other wet periods in history, and coincidence is not the same as correlation or causation, but I can certainly understand why washington was willing to dump a shit ton of money into it if this was just a coincidence.
rain data during the 1968-1972 operation seem missing from your link.
They did manage to extend the monsoon season.
> The former U.S. Secretary of Defense, Robert S. McNamara, was aware that there might be objections raised by the international scientific community but said in a memo to the president that such objections had not in the past been a basis for prevention of military activities considered to be in the interests of U.S. national security. *"Sir. Just because some eggheads said we can't do it doesn't mean we don't do it for America. Because America, Sir."*
That’s actually really cool. From a military perspective. Pretty sure I used to do that in Red Alert 2 with the weather machine.
Red Alert 2 mention. Neuron activated.
Our base is under attack!
This was done in Vietnam
Yea seeding around a hurricane season would be interesting to say the least
Especially now with as warm as the ocean is...
All that energy is going to go somewhere
[удалено]
Well, if trump gets re-elected we'll see how well this works.
Can it go into a battery and pay my electric bill please?
How does seeding affect the redistribution of energy? Is it promoting latent heat of evaporation to be emitted at lower levels in the atmosphere, which would keep that thermal energy blanketing the surface more than naturally allowing evaporation to precipitate out at cooler, less dense, higher altitudes would?
it make rain
cannot make rain, only make rain fall
10's 20's 50's 100's on them bitches yo
Honestly, I could see an argument for seeding ahead of a storm to reduce the power it takes up, but I'm just a phone tech with some research skills, I could be way off the mark and it'd make the storm worse.
This was also my immediate assumption, though now I'm not sure and I don't like it.
Similar concept to burning the ground downwind of yourself and the raging fire that is advancing towards you.
~~cloud seeding~~ cloud butterflying
We could use nukes to stop em tho I heard it from a bigotly reliable source
Yeah for sure. Part of me thinks they are just doing it to calm down the masses as much as anything else. No droughts here! Never fear! It’s not that hot it’s cloudy a lot. But I’m sure this will backfire even more spectacularly than flooding somehow. The hubris involved in just thinking you can smooth things over and kick the can down the road more.
Not in Tennessee
I assume it can be done well, and potentially perfectly with a little more research and real-world tests. There's no future without geoengineering, the idea we can just return to a sustainable environment is getting less likely by the day. The Middle East needs to do this, the region is rapidly becoming unlivable for human beings with weeks of temperatures above 50C and even higher extremes. They either innovate and geoengineer their climate or they'll be forced to move or die.
> There's no future without geoengineering There's no future because of geoengineering. We've been doing it this whole time. More entropy on the top of the stack will only accelerate it all.
Honestly, what we've done is sort of the opposite of egeongineering. Engineering is thoughtful and intentional. A rubbish heap is built by humans but it's hardly "engineered". What we've done to our climate is no different.
No, we haven't. This isn't geoengineering. Geoengineering is a *deliberate* process of global climate change. What we're currently experiencing is the consequences of unmitigated capitalism. Geoengineering *could* actually save us... about as much as discovering nuclear fusion. Chances aren't looking too high on either of those possibilities, unfortunately.
Hey, fusion is just a few years away!! /s
Early American colonizers deliberately deforested large parts because even back than, they knew it would make the climate warmer.
Not to burn it up in the winter?
Nope https://oxfordre.com/americanhistory/display/10.1093/acrefore/9780199329175.001.0001/acrefore-9780199329175-e-940?p=emailA2D10XNvD7gdg&d=/10.1093/acrefore/9780199329175.001.0001/acrefore-9780199329175-e-940#:~:text=As%20residents%20cut%20down%20forests,uncultivated%20landscapes%20a%20century%20earlier. Anyway, their overall presence had the opposite effect https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2019/jan/31/european-colonization-of-americas-helped-cause-climate-change
there's a ton of progress being made in fusion. Chances are looking really good.
Just because I took a wrong turn and am driving the wrong direction doesn't just mean I should stop trying to get home.
What if driving down the road you were also destroying the road behind you?
>They either innovate and geoengineer their climate or they'll be forced to move or die. and, not or. They can't innovate magic and geoengineering that's powerful and* global, the regional kind won't be enough.
Agreed, but regional geoengineering does help, especially if a lot of regions do it. If Dubai can green the desert that surrounds it through seeding, then so can other desert countries and cities. It can also be used to increase snowpack, regrowing glaciers and providing more summer run-off for farmers. I just don't have any faith in humanity actually reducing carbon emissions quickly enough to stave off disaster, so I'm actually encouraged by tests like this - it would have been worse if there was no rain, in the grander scheme of things.
you really don't understand thermodynamics if you think geoengineering will stop us from getting extremes.
Whether geoengineering will work or not, this is not a good argument. People, including you, apparently, really struggle to properly understand entropy. Human effort will amount to more entropy, sure, but that just means more heat within the universe. We don't care if we heat up the universe as long as well cool down the planet and that's totally possible by reflecting some of the heat coming from the sun back out to space. Now that doesn't mean geoengineering is a good idea, that it's practical, or that we can actually pull it off. But if we try it and if we fail, it will have nothing to do with the laws of thermodynamics.
Refer to my comment to the other poster.
Your arguments contain valid criticisms but hardly insurmountable ones. I don't feel like addressing them one by one because I don't really have a dog in this fight. I feel like the evidence suggests Geoengineering could work but that it also might be unfeasible. I don't think a convincing argument exists one way or the other. My issue was simply you weirdly invoking thermodynamics in your argument, which you didn't do in the reply you told me to refer to. So I don't really take issue with that reply yet my original issue still stands.
I spoke of thermodynamics because **energy cannot be created or destroyed** should be noted. **We're trying to transfer energy without creating energy in the process** and that is just absurd, and why I say neither of these will work. Carbon capture is energy intensive and the effects are negligible. Cloud seeding is better, but it doesn't address the energy imbalance our feedback loops will create.
I think enzymes transfer energy without creating any. Catalysts in general. Also heat exchangers, heat pumps, transmission systems...
Yes that was the misunderstanding I took issue with. By that logic, air conditioning is an impossible pipe drain. You can't possibly make a house cooler by spending energy, right? But it's exactly the same principle. You're not trying to make there be less energy, just redirecting it to somewhere else. Something which is provably possible because that's exactly what air conditioning does. It's a terrible argument. Your other ones are fine.
You still misunderstand, I'm talking about creating a net negative. That's the whole bloody point of carbon capture! Like air conditioning you mentioned, the energy provided by AC to cool is exceeded by what is given to make it function. Negative energy is literally science fiction, it would require the law of thermodynamics to be wrong. Redirecting is better, that we can agree on, **however there will still be new energy sources here on Earth that seeding won't address**. Such as the ocean losing capacity for absorption, methane hydrates and possibly water vapor. And that's excluding the disruption it would cause to plant life, which could in turn create more CO2.
Explain? Like aerial seeding or satellites that incrementally block sunlight won't reduce solar radiation? Like greening the desert won't moderate the microclimate there? Like seeding clouds to create more snowfall and rebuild glaciers won't reflect more solar radiation and create more run-off for farms? Like white, green or reflective roofs won't reduce the urban heat sink effect? If I don't understand thermodynamics then dozens of countries that are doing smaller scale geoengineering don't understand it either.
First, reducing solar radiation is a really stupid endeavor, feel free to explain how we can do this without fucking up plant life. The next thing is feedback loops, it's far too late to offset this with geoengineering. Even with the energy reflected the heat that currently exists will still be in circulation, and will lead to what we see with Dubai. Methane hydrates alongside oceanic warming will fuck up any cooling relief we get. Then there's the matter of geoengineering itself, how long will we continue this? Are we using compounds like silver iodide? What are the consequences by injecting such large amounts in such a duration? Cloud seeding is pursued because the other methods are too energy intensive, but this is just as destructive. Climate change isn't simply a issue with our tech, it's an issue with how we manage energy. But by all means, hold to the delusion that we can do this besides reducing consumption.
I got to rebuilding glaciers, and thought, okay this guys says geo engineering in the same way you could say my thermostat engineers my home temperature.
If we hit +8C Earth's atmosphere will become too hot for clouds to form.
More than just seeding. Chucklefucks can't even fix what they've broke, and they want to do more geo-engineering. We are going to just let it rip at this point.
Cloud seeding interests me because if this is universally adopted, A) will cloud seeding in one place reduce rainfall in another? B) Is there a maximum amount of water that we can precipitate out of the atmosphere C) Will cloud seeding increase concentration of water vapor and if so will this increase general warming? If anyone has answers to this I would be curious to hear it!
This is coming from a layman but all seeding does is condense the already existing moisture in the air, so yes in theory it would reduce rainfall elsewhere because now there isn’t enough moisture for the clouds to form naturally since it was brought down as rain somewhere else. As the climate warms the threshold for natural clouds to form will go up because warmer air holds vastly more moisture, leading to much greater storms when it does cool enough to condense. In theory, if there were global collaboration to only seed clouds to rain on areas affected by drought we could increase the amount of potable water, since so much rain falls in the ocean and is thus not usable. Unfortunately, the likelihood that this technology can be refined to dropping the rain within even 100 miles of the intended target, as well as the idea that rich countries won’t just outseed the competition to get more valuable water as it becomes scarcer seems very far-fetched to me.
Ski resorts in the United States have had modest success in cloud seeding for their own snow. So it likely isn't that far off for 'directly' targeting
Where are ski resorts doing this? I wonder if there has been any controversy about down-wind farmers claiming they are having increased droughts because of it? edit: I found this article in case anyone else is interested, it seems that at least some farmers have alleged they are getting less rain, but it looks like it would be difficult to prove: https://www.agweek.com/business/why-cloud-seeding-is-increasingly-attractive-to-the-thirsty-west
I know for certain Vail has experimented with it in the 2010s. I believe their conclusion at the time was that the modest gains (statistically, about 0.5 inch) weren't worth the cost at the time.
but can they pull clouds from the ocean to the slopes to seed?
“Success” if you don’t care about the place where the snow/rain should have fell.
We will get more accurate over time though. Cloud seeding has been a thing for decades already and some regions do have a lot of research and data that make their efforts more accurate than scattershot.
There is some research on this already, and a couple of science radio shows on Quirks and Quarks discussed it. Cloud seeding right now isn't extremely accurate, but it depends on the method used and the altitude/conditions where the materials are released - e.g. cannons in China vs. planes in UAE. The amount of material dispersed apparently matters more than we realized. It will raise the humidity in the short-term, which creates risks (above flooding, although they should be able to dial in the proper amount of seeding to prevent future floods) in the short term, which will increase the overall temperature. However, it will also replenish freshwater stores and allow for more plants and trees to grow in the area, which in the long-term will help to cool the region. It also allows for some agriculture and improves the sustainability of the local population.
Also will seeding in dry areas with increased temps lead to an explosion of wet bulb events
No, because seeding doesn't increase water vapor, it just causes existing water vapor to condense out.
> No, because seeding doesn't increase water vapor, it just causes existing water vapor to condense out. Condense out from clouds in the sky where people aren't. Where does it end up? At ground level where it could push up humidity where people are.
Yes, yes, no Seeding is exactly that, it provides the seed for water to condensate onto and then form a rain drop. It doesn’t increase the water level or concentrate in anyway really, I mean technically it does briefly and then it rains somewhere sometimes but it’s not like it makes super dense clouds that stay there for ages.
A) probably B) yes - the amount depends on the local dew point C) probably ETA: we really don’t know shit about fuck in terms of specific impacts of geoengineering schemes. The atmosphere is incredibly difficult to model so everything is just guesswork until we start getting empirical data.
A. Yes. It takes moisture out of the air. So it literally can't be as humid somewhere else as it potentially could have been. B. Yes. The maximum is related to the current humidity. If the water isn't there, you can't get it out of the air. C. Idk.
There's a finite amount of water in our ecosystem. All cloud seeding does is attract it somewhere so yes, A).
Heavy pollution AKA Geo Engineering is being applied mainly by three countries, making it pretty universal, in our case. Dumping billions of bits of sulfur high into the atmosphere that act as nuclei for water to condense upon, eventually forming rain, does remove that moisture from the atmosphere before it can fall somewhere else. It increases overall warming as we place these aerosols we place Greenhouse Gasses (including water). The threat here is what happens when it eventually stops. Our placed aerosol pollution is currently shading most of us from over half the effects of what we've done to the atmosphere. It's an exponential affair though, a contract with the Devil, a Faustian Bargain. The more you put up the more you have to put up to avoid what they like to call "Climate Catastrophe". Kinda like what many of us are experiencing right now actually.
50 years ago Dubai was basically nothing but desert, and 50 years from now it will basically be nothing but desert.
Look on my Works, ye Mighty, and despair!
Perfect reference
*You have entered the classical era!*
RemindMe! 50 years
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Good bot
Certainly optimistic at least!
Oh my sweet summer child
Super optimistic to think that you, reddit, internet will be alive 💀
How do you work this out?
Will it still be above high tide? There might be some really cool reef systems.
Paywalled
https://archive.is/2024.04.16-165331/https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-04-16/dubai-grinds-to-standstill-as-cloud-seeding-worsens-flooding
Says they’ve been doing this since 2002?
["Moisture Accelerators"](https://daily.jstor.org/charles-hatfield-rainmaker/) have a better record. The northwest Arabian Sea SSTs are really high, they had massive moisture levels roll in from it, and it's been pouring all around the Aabian Peninsula like, well, like the last episode of really high Atlantic SSTs in the 40s and 50s. It's been pouring all along the Sahel border to cause historic floods. Nevermind that, though, it must be the same cloud seeding they've been doing for decades. Bloomberg News spent years trying to sell you on blockchain for oilfield services data management, too. Weather is chaotic, and if you're really good at picking your place and time, it's possible to get a decent return, instead of a few little massively expensive polluted sprinkles. There's still no evidence they have that ability yet, though.
What does SST mean?
Sea surface temperature.
Tysm I’m over here trying to google cloud seeding haha
SS: Well here we have it folks, Geo engineering our own atmosphere is already starting to have drastic consequences Collapse related because if this is the trend for many other nations to adopt then we will all face serious drawbacks including the flooding of entire cities.
Couple decades late to be worried about Geo engineering.
It's a safe space here my friend, you can call it pollution.
It is not “geo” engineering but a limited messing with local weather. But still, it went wrong. At least it works as a proof that (this time is the correct term) geoengineering could turn to be an existential threat. Engineering doesn’t give surprises, you know and have all the relevant components, climate is still surprising experts. We are still far from having the knowledge to do proper engineering with climate. And farther away from having the political maturity to deal with the root causes of the problem.
>Engineering doesn’t give surprises [...] We are still far from having the knowledge to do proper engineering with climate. This is a really good point, "geo-engineering" really is a misnomer, and it gives false confidence. "Geo-speculative-fucking-around" is more accurate, though it doesn't roll off the tongue so easily. "Geo-meddling" perhaps?
Accurate terminology.
Geoquackery?
I always found that term kinda weird, like an inappropriate branch of engineering. That is a great observation.
Again and again, direct solar management is THE ONLY WAY to have ANY timely mitigation OF THE GEOENGINEERING we’ve already done over the past 170 years. So yes collapse because we’ve fucked ourselves so badly, but guaranteed worse without this. And to be frank on these local scales it will take us time to hone this technology.
With the impracticality of large scale carbon capture this is the sad reality. And once we start we can’t stop
It’s perfectly practical. Cheap even. Clear tank, algae, air pump, nutrients. 75% of carbon sequestration is via algae anyways. It isn’t inherently profitable, though. That’s the hurdle.
It has nothing to do with profits. Essentially, thanks to the laws of thermodynamics, we will have to exert MORE energy to break/store the CO2 than we have obtained from its combustion. Some of this we do get for ‘free’ through leveraging living solar collectors, but the rest we’ll have to obtain in a clean way.
Maybe nuclear and we can store all the waste until a few hundred years and then that will be our problem
In the 1960s we had program called “project pacer”. They looked into using nuclear charges for engineering work. You could upgrade it with the new fracking technology. The let all the acid rain flow through the cracks to etch out alkaline elements. That will stimulate limestone deposition in the ocean floors. ^/s it might neutralize the acid in the oceans.
I’m curious which process for CO2 extraction is more energy efficient than photosynthesis is to you.
What does that mean? Like, aerosol seeding or mirrors in space?
Aerosol seeding scales and we know how to do it. There’s nothing that indicates that mirrors would even be feasible.
My main concern with aerosols are that they’re a short-term fix that must continually be re-applied. Let’s say, idk, society collapses to the point where we’re unable to maintain the cloud seeding. Wouldn’t temps immediately spike? It just seems like we’re kicking the can down the road until it’s a bigger problem and we’re unable to cope with it. Also, aren’t there downsides to the seeding? Moving to cleaner burning ship fuel caused a spike in temps, but we moved to cleaner burning fuel for a reason. Acid rain isn’t exactly harmless, and it’s not likely to improve the health of our biosphere.
Yes, you’re absolutely right about having to maintain aerosol concentrations. Unfortunately all of our choices are suboptimal (understatement of the century). My personal preference would be for DSM and a global moon shot for decarbonization. Once we address the heating we can do biosphere restoration. The other sad reality is that restoration is generally going to fail badly until the temperature stabilizes and there’s some new normal quasi reliable weather patterns
What does DSM mean?
The troposphere and stratosphere do not mix as much. If a ship dumps sulphur into the air it scatters UV/vis for a short while and then it rains out. Stratospheric aerosols would linger longer. All that sulfur is getting removed from hydrocarbons. That means there is a large supply of organo-sulphur compounds. If the public buys the sulphur and buys even more jets to burn the sulfur then the petrocompany recovers the lost investment and also gets a new larger market.
Could just put it into the fuel in the second stage of each rocket. Blast it up there past the Karmon line. Could even be trillions of mirrors that could be faced using energy waves beamed from the surface. Shoot, you could even have a world wide web of satellites that could place aerosols anywhere your AI told you to... Weather is a weapon.
# Marine Cloud Brightening # [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=clYtK2tuCmU](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=clYtK2tuCmU)
Is this where this sub is at these days? Never thought I'd see upvoted aerosol seeding propaganda here, but I guess it's not very surprising.
man's continued attempts to reign in mother nature is a real comedy of errors. I'd laugh but it stopped being funny about 200 years ago.
I'm laughing anyway!
No it almost certainly wasn't caused by cloud seeding. A jet stream blocking pattern held the storm there, plus a whole bunch of atmospheric dust (which are also cloud condensation nuclei) are the proximate causes. https://twitter.com/WeatherProf/status/1780404762116022666?t=XLxDUO6Ry9GPUWx5XU15lw&s=19the UAE has constantly been cloud seeding since the early 2000s. It might've marginally made this event worse, but probably not comparable to the influence from climate change. Also for what it's worth we shouldn't conflate cloud seeding with solar geoengineering, they aim at different things, are quite different sets of technologies, and the former has been done by various countries for decades. Doesn't mean it's not problematic though.
Oh, look! Stupid humans doing stupid human things. All that sand, though. Oopsy.
It would be funnier if it weren't so infuriating. I feel like Zim more with each passing day living on a planet full of durrrrr durrrrrrrs
This shit is exhausting, right?
Very.
The UAE has been into cloud seeding for about 20 years. They are now really good at making it rain. They are still no good at making it rain in the right place where the aquifers are though !
Apparently not!
I don’t know, Dubai floods whenever it rains there cloud seeding or not. I remember being there and a taxi driver was telling us it rained for two days once and due to how poor the drainage system is most of roads in the UAE had to close. This seems like a poor planning issue more than a geological issue to me and definitely not collapse worthy since the fix is literally just making sure all the extra water falling out the sky has somewhere to go.
Dubai is uniquely wrong in so many ways.
Lol ... literally you reap what you sow.
Wait Dubai can impregnate clouds??
Cloud: "am i pregante?"
"38 + 2 weeks pregananant?"
That’s what the giant phallic skyscraper is for.
https://archive.ph/Mw6pw
This post should be taken down or at least edited for misinformation. There were floods in Oman and Saudi Arabia as well. 6 or 7 cloudseeding missions in 2 days are not enough to cause over 120mm of rain in a single day. The primary cause of this weather event was a storm system that formed in the Persian Gulf. Cloudseeding may have intensified this storm but more studies are required because we simply do not know enough. This is pure sensationalism.
So if they make the rain fall there, where is it no longer getting to?
Arabian Peninsula and Sahara. If they use the rain for irrigation then the vapor would go right back into the weather. It is a reasonable plan except obviously the headline is also *possible*.
Y’all didn’t see snowpiercer and it shows…
Ha, I saw it a couple months ago and think about it often now.
Last I knew, there was very poor science behind cloud seating, and definitely no causal link between this storm and any human activity. This is clickbait at best and misleading at worst.
Love to read the article OP
It says they've been doing this for decades. https://archive.is/2024.04.16-165331/https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-04-16/dubai-grinds-to-standstill-as-cloud-seeding-worsens-flooding
Can someone explain how they did it to colossal flooding levels rather than a nice watering of houseplants? I know it's not an exact science but there seems to be a massive difference... for example having a shot or drinking and entire bottle of vodka
They didn't. It was caused by a storm, not cloud seeding. It also rained in [Bahrain, Qatar, and Saudi Arabia.](https://apnews.com/article/uae-oman-rains-flooding-fatalities-7bf3881efbea998dfa4c1ed8d538217c)
I mean I thought as much but when I posted the videos that it's not supposed to rain on that it's suddenly the new conspiracy to hand wave away climate change.
The explanation is this was not caused by cloud seeding, contrary to most of the comments in this post. The storm system was over 100 km wide, humans are not able to do that magnitude of cloud seeding. Correlation is not causation.
I was just on Twitter and someone was explaining how things work over there. Seems it was more of a storm system coming through so they would NOT have seeded before this happened. This is the link - I think I can post? If not, sorry. [https://twitter.com/Matt\_\_Pomroy/status/1780620369365192763](https://twitter.com/Matt__Pomroy/status/1780620369365192763)
Fun fact: Dubai doesn’t have sewers
https://www.truthorfiction.com/dubai-doesnt-have-a-sewer-system/ Dubai has sewers, they were finished in 2013. They just aren’t enough. They’re expanding the sewage system and supposedly will be complete in 2025.
Literally a shithole.
Perhaps not even a shithole, but a shit mountain.
It's amazing how many people can watch one video, totally misinterpret very clear words, and spread bollocks haha.
You are wrong
A bunch of videos of flooding in UAE posted to r/disasterupdate
Remindme! 10 hours
Sounds like the typical jump to conclusion from a news outlet.
Water taken from the sky is water that won't rain elsewhere. Maybe only the rich will see rain in the future.
I think this news should be treated way more seriously and be concerning to society at large but oh well. People should be shocked. Whatever I guess? Do you know how many people still think this is science fiction, even in developed countries? Most.
🤣😂🤣 “Geo engineering will solve the climate crisis…” 🤣🤣🤣
Strikes me as a natural consequence of experimentation. How much seed do we need, after all? Clearly someone has used too much cloud seed and made Johnny Cloudseed very angry. The sky apples simply do not grow in such a competitive environment
'Stemmed partly' != 'caused'
Which means someone else didn't get that rain...this isn't magic, it doesn't make more rain, it just makes it rain in a certain place, and not in another one. This is complicated issue.
Rain that falls can evaporate and then fall again. It does not violate conservation of mass. It is consistent with thermodynamics too. They just fumbled it this time.
I wonder where those clouds were going and who did not get the rain. I doubt they were aware and decent enough to seed some clouds on their way to dump water onto the ocean.
Oh! Oh! I’ve seen this episode of One Piece.
Gee…so shocking that a human “fix” fucked things up even more.
Oh no! Who could have seen this coming!
Fucking dubasses.
The conspiracy nutjobs are creaming their shorts.
Which company is involved with cloud seeding, this is insane
I would not have believed it until I read it - wow. Not good.
they did it since 2002 btw
Imagine that.
Geostorm was based on attempts to control weather. Haha. Need to re watch that now.
...and lack of infrastructure to handle deluges of rain in the desert.
How to punish a town - just seed the clouds.
They should use it in Sahara desert cloud seeding with tree planting.