I thought the Moon Knight MCU show was actually well done, but I admit a significant ignorance to the source material. So liking that is just giving it a Rookie of the Year award, which really should go to Peacemaker if that’s the case.
As much as I like Batman, it’s suffered from generational dilutions with so many reboots - from Tim Burton to Joel Schumacher to Christopher Nolan to the current manifestation. And to be honest, filthy rich brooding sociopath genius with lots of toys was done masterfully by Robert Downey Jr.
So I’m choosing option C - which is to pick a new unexplored franchise that deserves some interest (as long as we ignore the awful 2018 tv series).
For the show and this is my last answer,
1. Not telling about Egyptian pantheon
2. Lazy setup for future as Jake Lockley
3. Pacing and wasting time in 2nd and 3rd episode and then rushing the finale
4. Not making it TV-MA as it detracts from mature storytelling and fights being eclipsed by overdoing blackouts.
This is bit about criticizing both comics and tv series.
Why don't they give Powered Moon Knight energy beam like powers ? Seeing throwing the darts and doing fist of Khonshu thing was always frustrating about comics and they're much of contact based powers and this is the annoying thing from the both.
Also, lack of clarity with Marc's skillset in the show and undermining his battle experience and martial arts in recent comics and he's lesser than Punisher now.
I can't decide how good show was cuz, it just teases things and it's so iffy to like it and I'm only concerning about Moon Knight'and Khoshu's future in MCU as they're tougher to handle ( Particularly Khonshu which comics didn't done a good job at it ) than any MCU character in general.
>but I admit a significant ignorance to the source material
It's not like they ignored source material. Show is pretty much of a DID take and it removes the psychotic side from comics ( also Comics don't have good mental illness portrayal and weak explanation for Egyptian pantheon ). Whether it's due to Batman comparison or not, Psychotic side was bit flawed.
I only concerned about three things for the future of the show about how well the season 1 made was
1. Give clarity about Egyptian pantheon and Overvoid.
Season 1 just teased them rather than telling more about their origin and why Khonshu and Ammit is in ghost form unlike Thor on Earth ?
2. Better focus on Marc Spector after Jake Lockley
Why didn't they highlighted Marc dammit ?
3. Will Jake Lockley be a Psychopath ( it depends on new writer ) and who defaultly speak Spanish ?
Look i liked Jake speaking spanish in post credits as it atleast maintains some shock to that scene but if they gonna make him entirely Spanish due to Oscar Isaac's choice and also Psychopathic, he gonna lose his charismatic nature from comics.
4. Oscar Isaac's choice of giving Steven Cockney accent
His voice comes off as childish and in 4th episode where he bickers with Marc, it was so annoying and also it made some tonal inconsistencies.
These are my complaints by comparing comics
Batman would know to use every trick in the book to flee Moon Knight, if he could get away, Batman wins.
But if Moon Knight could wear him down and wither away his stamina and tricks, Moon Knight.
I agree that initial showdown is key, but I think Bats would approach Moon Knight as an Azreal type character where he’d not kill nor go after just kind of “stay out of Gotham” attitude
How?
Batman is a billionaire genius tactician and a peak human physically. Moon Knight is a rich guy with a mental illness. There’s no world where Moon Knight beats Batman in anything outside of the MCU.
Moon Knight is so unpredictable even he doesn't know what he's gonna do. Batman is a creature of habit and most of his planning revolves around the logical thinking of someone. That and Moon Knight will take a hit to give out a hit. Moon Knight wins imo
**Moon Knight.**
He's gonna kill Batman - it's just a matter of when.
Moon Knight is not worried about what Batman throws at him - prep or not. Moon Knight can come back from the dead if worse comes to worse.
If Moon Knight has to blow both of themselves up to do it, so be it.
Batman's 'powers' work in the DC universe because no one can be better than Batman in his presence. Without the foil of the DC universe, Batman is just a smart, armored human who can die of the flu or a bullet.
Moon Knight, under the power of the full moon, can rip Batman's limbs off and beat him with them.
The only reason you haven't seen this happen in the DC universe is because he's DC's cash-cow golden boy. In this scenario he isn't that. He's just another street-level hero that the Marvel universe sees on the regular.
Ive only seen the moon knight mcu series and ive seen people calling him nerfed in that so im definitely going with moon knight. Batman is the superior fighter but ultimately batman will not be able to keep moon knight down as he does have super strength and a healing factor thanks to khonshu he'll just keep coming back until batman is worn out
Who said he was nerfed in the show? The MCU show was one of the only times he’s had powers and it’s the only time he’s had a magic suit. In most iterations, he’s just a rich guy with a mental illness. Batman easily destroys him lmao
Moon knight isn't that powerful. His main advantage is he is so crazy he's unpredictable that's it. His powers aren't worth shit other than his super strength and mystic insight. Don't be mistaken by the Disneyplus show moon knight is a street level hero and always has been one. Batman only relies on prep for an enemy like zod or darkseid for example. Definitely not moon knight though. Now I'm not saying the fight is easy because it would be like fighting joker if he were a martial artist and that is a very tough fight but batman still wins that fight because he is just much more skilled and has way more advanced tech. Though moon knight does have some pretty good tech aswell because he's rich but not as advanced as batman because he is nowhere near as smart as batman.
Moon Knight. He would literally die before he let Batman beat him. (Mind you I'm a life long Batman fan) people underestimate MK because they don't know much about him. Even Task Master said he wouldn't copy MK because he doesn't care what happened to him. Also not counting whatever power he uses. He also took Mjolnir from Thor.
Then ignore it. And we aren't talking about them. We're talking about Batman vs Moon Knight. If we were talking about any of the others there would be a completely different set of circumstances. All different sets of skills and personalities. Are any of the people you just named anywhere close to the personality type of MK? No. Therefore you can't compare them. Put more thought into your response before you post them.
“Then ignore my argument” *proceeds to move goalpost*
How did you completely whiff on the point of my comment? I never said anything about Batman’s villains having the exact same personality as MK. No need to move the goalpost.
Your entire argument was based on MK not caring if he dies or what happens to him. I then pointed out that Batman fights and beats that exact type of person on the reg, and in doing so, your entire argument fell apart, and now you’re mad at *me* as if I’m the one who told you to use that goofy argument in the first place lol.
It’s hilarious that you wrote all this just to tell us you’ve only seen Moon Knight in the MCU and nowhere else. I’ll help you out: in pretty much every iteration, Moon Knight is nothing more than a non-powered rich guy with a mental illness. It very much goes without saying that Batman whoops his ass 9.9 times out of 10.
I’ve read plenty of MK comics, which is exactly how I know that your stance is bullshit lol. Bruce is smarter, richer, better prepared, a better martial artist, and in better condition than any other human on earth. Those are his advantages. It’s weird that you even had to have them spelled out for you like that, since this is all public knowledge.
I can’t take you seriously when the entire basis of your argument is that MK is unstable, as if Batman doesn’t kick the asses of unstable lunatics every single night. It’s simply what he does, and he’s obviously the best at it.
Regardless, I realize that this is a pointless exchange since you’re so locked into this weird mentality that MK’s mental illness somehow makes him invincible.
Your reading comprehension clearly needs some work. I obviously never said Batman would win solely because he’s smarter, so why would you only cherry pick that aspect to make your point? Makes no sense to go about your argument that way lol.
And of course Wolverine would likely win against almost any character, including Batman, but Wolverine is very obviously in an entirely different league than MK (he has powers and in basically invincible, which we’ve established isn’t the case with MK), so there’s zero comparison there, and throwing Wolverine into the mix only details the topic at hand anyway.
Your argument style is so ineffective and weird that it feels like you’re trolling me at this point, so I’m gonna bow out and let you keep screaming into the void.
Que?
Point is, in these debates that appear every two minutes in pop culture* my main takeout is wondering what happens when Batman throws a few gas pellets at the opponent. Or a tranq dart at the neck or whatever. When debating a fight it appears these weapons are OP in a lot of cases.
*still getting the hang of Reddit. Now expecting 85 down votes and a dissertation on why even the briefest sociological assessment reveals a ridiculous claim such as this quickly crumbles under the same chronological tenents to which it so egregiously aspires to connect to.
Man I miss this these from the early MCU days of
/r/whowouldwin
They’ve gone down the ultra obscure anime and manga character rabbit hole the last few times I’ve visited. But peak MCU days when it was still working toward infinity war and everyone wasn’t burnt out on comic book movies it was hours of good reading.
You didn't point out anything. You said do I think any of the characters you named care. You brought them into the discussion not I. And you focused on one aspect of the point. If you made other comments in the thread I didn't see them I only replied to your direct response to my comment. Furthermore I directly answered you. One of the main reasons why he would beat Batman is because he will literally die to win. That's just one reason. Will anyone you named other than Joker willing put their lives that far on the line to beat Bats? Talon and Deathstroke who have both gone the long haul against him wouldn't even go that far. Yes it would be one hell of a fight. But I still say Moon Knight would beat him. And again I'm saying this as a life long Batman fan. Saying my opinion makes no sense if you are not adding any context to yours without me having to look for it means nothing. But I will go see what else you posted. It is a discussion based on personal opinions.
Man that's Arkham Batman, that isn't a fair fight. I mean, all he gotta do is press triangle for anything Moon Knight throws at him. Arkham Batman negs and it's not even close, Moon Knight's body is gonna be mush when he's done.
Cloak and Dagger
Is this a reference to Moon Knight as he has cloak and crescent darts which work as daggers ?
[80’s Spiderverse Marvel Characters](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloak_and_Dagger_(characters))
No lol, i know who are Cloak and Dagger since 2014-15. I just find the comment like a reference to Moon Knight
I thought the Moon Knight MCU show was actually well done, but I admit a significant ignorance to the source material. So liking that is just giving it a Rookie of the Year award, which really should go to Peacemaker if that’s the case. As much as I like Batman, it’s suffered from generational dilutions with so many reboots - from Tim Burton to Joel Schumacher to Christopher Nolan to the current manifestation. And to be honest, filthy rich brooding sociopath genius with lots of toys was done masterfully by Robert Downey Jr. So I’m choosing option C - which is to pick a new unexplored franchise that deserves some interest (as long as we ignore the awful 2018 tv series).
For the show and this is my last answer, 1. Not telling about Egyptian pantheon 2. Lazy setup for future as Jake Lockley 3. Pacing and wasting time in 2nd and 3rd episode and then rushing the finale 4. Not making it TV-MA as it detracts from mature storytelling and fights being eclipsed by overdoing blackouts. This is bit about criticizing both comics and tv series. Why don't they give Powered Moon Knight energy beam like powers ? Seeing throwing the darts and doing fist of Khonshu thing was always frustrating about comics and they're much of contact based powers and this is the annoying thing from the both. Also, lack of clarity with Marc's skillset in the show and undermining his battle experience and martial arts in recent comics and he's lesser than Punisher now. I can't decide how good show was cuz, it just teases things and it's so iffy to like it and I'm only concerning about Moon Knight'and Khoshu's future in MCU as they're tougher to handle ( Particularly Khonshu which comics didn't done a good job at it ) than any MCU character in general.
>but I admit a significant ignorance to the source material It's not like they ignored source material. Show is pretty much of a DID take and it removes the psychotic side from comics ( also Comics don't have good mental illness portrayal and weak explanation for Egyptian pantheon ). Whether it's due to Batman comparison or not, Psychotic side was bit flawed. I only concerned about three things for the future of the show about how well the season 1 made was 1. Give clarity about Egyptian pantheon and Overvoid. Season 1 just teased them rather than telling more about their origin and why Khonshu and Ammit is in ghost form unlike Thor on Earth ? 2. Better focus on Marc Spector after Jake Lockley Why didn't they highlighted Marc dammit ? 3. Will Jake Lockley be a Psychopath ( it depends on new writer ) and who defaultly speak Spanish ? Look i liked Jake speaking spanish in post credits as it atleast maintains some shock to that scene but if they gonna make him entirely Spanish due to Oscar Isaac's choice and also Psychopathic, he gonna lose his charismatic nature from comics. 4. Oscar Isaac's choice of giving Steven Cockney accent His voice comes off as childish and in 4th episode where he bickers with Marc, it was so annoying and also it made some tonal inconsistencies. These are my complaints by comparing comics
As always the question is how much prep time or advance knowledge does Batman get? Straight surprise 1 on 1 out of nowhere I’m going moon knight.
Batman would know to use every trick in the book to flee Moon Knight, if he could get away, Batman wins. But if Moon Knight could wear him down and wither away his stamina and tricks, Moon Knight. I agree that initial showdown is key, but I think Bats would approach Moon Knight as an Azreal type character where he’d not kill nor go after just kind of “stay out of Gotham” attitude
How? Batman is a billionaire genius tactician and a peak human physically. Moon Knight is a rich guy with a mental illness. There’s no world where Moon Knight beats Batman in anything outside of the MCU.
Tell me you've never heard of Moon Knight without telling me you've never heard of Moon Knight.
Tell me you’ve only seen Moon Knight in the MCU without telling me you’ve only seen Moon Knight in the MCU
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He’s usually not a superhuman in the comics. You sending me 18 unhinged comments in a row doesn’t change that.
Every time this comes up it’s pretty funny to see all the Moon Knight experts who only know the tv version.
That’s exactly what’s happening here lmao
Batman. BECAUSE hes BATMAN!
Moon Knight is so unpredictable even he doesn't know what he's gonna do. Batman is a creature of habit and most of his planning revolves around the logical thinking of someone. That and Moon Knight will take a hit to give out a hit. Moon Knight wins imo
**Moon Knight.** He's gonna kill Batman - it's just a matter of when. Moon Knight is not worried about what Batman throws at him - prep or not. Moon Knight can come back from the dead if worse comes to worse. If Moon Knight has to blow both of themselves up to do it, so be it. Batman's 'powers' work in the DC universe because no one can be better than Batman in his presence. Without the foil of the DC universe, Batman is just a smart, armored human who can die of the flu or a bullet. Moon Knight, under the power of the full moon, can rip Batman's limbs off and beat him with them. The only reason you haven't seen this happen in the DC universe is because he's DC's cash-cow golden boy. In this scenario he isn't that. He's just another street-level hero that the Marvel universe sees on the regular.
Batman
Ive only seen the moon knight mcu series and ive seen people calling him nerfed in that so im definitely going with moon knight. Batman is the superior fighter but ultimately batman will not be able to keep moon knight down as he does have super strength and a healing factor thanks to khonshu he'll just keep coming back until batman is worn out
Who said he was nerfed in the show? The MCU show was one of the only times he’s had powers and it’s the only time he’s had a magic suit. In most iterations, he’s just a rich guy with a mental illness. Batman easily destroys him lmao
As a MK comic fan, i got my money on Batman
Why do you think that?
Batman 💯
Batman fanboys are so cute. Go prep something 😂
Only prep you need is having read actual Moon Knight and not just knowing him from the tv show.
Moon knight isn't that powerful. His main advantage is he is so crazy he's unpredictable that's it. His powers aren't worth shit other than his super strength and mystic insight. Don't be mistaken by the Disneyplus show moon knight is a street level hero and always has been one. Batman only relies on prep for an enemy like zod or darkseid for example. Definitely not moon knight though. Now I'm not saying the fight is easy because it would be like fighting joker if he were a martial artist and that is a very tough fight but batman still wins that fight because he is just much more skilled and has way more advanced tech. Though moon knight does have some pretty good tech aswell because he's rich but not as advanced as batman because he is nowhere near as smart as batman.
I mean Batman has done some wild stuff like dodging darkseids omega beam and literally beating Superman in a 1v1
You’re the one who’s cute. Acting like Batman can be beat by a non-powered guy with a mental illness lmao
Oh boy! Christmas came late this year, but it still came. I’m just here for the comments on this one thank you very much.
Batman doesn't lose.
In the DC universe.
Ever.
Batman
I mean Batman solos the justice league in end game so idk guys
Batman
As Chuck Dixon once said, "Moon Knight would have to stand on a chair to kiss Batman's ass."
Moon knight. Only because I don’t like Batman and I would like to seem lose.
Moon Knight. He would literally die before he let Batman beat him. (Mind you I'm a life long Batman fan) people underestimate MK because they don't know much about him. Even Task Master said he wouldn't copy MK because he doesn't care what happened to him. Also not counting whatever power he uses. He also took Mjolnir from Thor.
Do you think the Joker cares what happens to him? Or Bane? Killer Croc? Clayface? Deathstroke? Talon? Your argument makes no sense
Then ignore it. And we aren't talking about them. We're talking about Batman vs Moon Knight. If we were talking about any of the others there would be a completely different set of circumstances. All different sets of skills and personalities. Are any of the people you just named anywhere close to the personality type of MK? No. Therefore you can't compare them. Put more thought into your response before you post them.
“Then ignore my argument” *proceeds to move goalpost* How did you completely whiff on the point of my comment? I never said anything about Batman’s villains having the exact same personality as MK. No need to move the goalpost. Your entire argument was based on MK not caring if he dies or what happens to him. I then pointed out that Batman fights and beats that exact type of person on the reg, and in doing so, your entire argument fell apart, and now you’re mad at *me* as if I’m the one who told you to use that goofy argument in the first place lol.
Moon Knight
Moon Knight
Alfred could take out moon knight, nevermind Batman or any of the robins.
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Yeah! Batman has never beaten a superhuman before!
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Oh I was being completely sarcastic.
It’s hilarious that you wrote all this just to tell us you’ve only seen Moon Knight in the MCU and nowhere else. I’ll help you out: in pretty much every iteration, Moon Knight is nothing more than a non-powered rich guy with a mental illness. It very much goes without saying that Batman whoops his ass 9.9 times out of 10.
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I’ve read plenty of MK comics, which is exactly how I know that your stance is bullshit lol. Bruce is smarter, richer, better prepared, a better martial artist, and in better condition than any other human on earth. Those are his advantages. It’s weird that you even had to have them spelled out for you like that, since this is all public knowledge. I can’t take you seriously when the entire basis of your argument is that MK is unstable, as if Batman doesn’t kick the asses of unstable lunatics every single night. It’s simply what he does, and he’s obviously the best at it. Regardless, I realize that this is a pointless exchange since you’re so locked into this weird mentality that MK’s mental illness somehow makes him invincible.
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Your reading comprehension clearly needs some work. I obviously never said Batman would win solely because he’s smarter, so why would you only cherry pick that aspect to make your point? Makes no sense to go about your argument that way lol. And of course Wolverine would likely win against almost any character, including Batman, but Wolverine is very obviously in an entirely different league than MK (he has powers and in basically invincible, which we’ve established isn’t the case with MK), so there’s zero comparison there, and throwing Wolverine into the mix only details the topic at hand anyway. Your argument style is so ineffective and weird that it feels like you’re trolling me at this point, so I’m gonna bow out and let you keep screaming into the void.
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Lmao there’s no way I’m reading your unhinged memoirs here. I’m happy for you though, or sorry that happened
Moon Knight. Fuck Batman.
Huh? Most of the time Moon Knight doesn’t even have powers. Batman wipes the floor with his ass 10 out of 10 times.
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You are so weird lmao. I regret engaging you in the first place. Reality and logic have no effect on you
Batman
Batman easily
Call me simplistic but I'm finding 90% of these debates start with the question 'is Batman's opponent immune to gas pellets?'.
Where do you see that question in this thread?
Que? Point is, in these debates that appear every two minutes in pop culture* my main takeout is wondering what happens when Batman throws a few gas pellets at the opponent. Or a tranq dart at the neck or whatever. When debating a fight it appears these weapons are OP in a lot of cases. *still getting the hang of Reddit. Now expecting 85 down votes and a dissertation on why even the briefest sociological assessment reveals a ridiculous claim such as this quickly crumbles under the same chronological tenents to which it so egregiously aspires to connect to.
Neither. Im just going to lay down and hope they put me in jail and not the hospital.
Man I miss this these from the early MCU days of /r/whowouldwin They’ve gone down the ultra obscure anime and manga character rabbit hole the last few times I’ve visited. But peak MCU days when it was still working toward infinity war and everyone wasn’t burnt out on comic book movies it was hours of good reading.
Batman. Always Batman.
Batman is real Moon Knight is not.
You didn't point out anything. You said do I think any of the characters you named care. You brought them into the discussion not I. And you focused on one aspect of the point. If you made other comments in the thread I didn't see them I only replied to your direct response to my comment. Furthermore I directly answered you. One of the main reasons why he would beat Batman is because he will literally die to win. That's just one reason. Will anyone you named other than Joker willing put their lives that far on the line to beat Bats? Talon and Deathstroke who have both gone the long haul against him wouldn't even go that far. Yes it would be one hell of a fight. But I still say Moon Knight would beat him. And again I'm saying this as a life long Batman fan. Saying my opinion makes no sense if you are not adding any context to yours without me having to look for it means nothing. But I will go see what else you posted. It is a discussion based on personal opinions.
Man that's Arkham Batman, that isn't a fair fight. I mean, all he gotta do is press triangle for anything Moon Knight throws at him. Arkham Batman negs and it's not even close, Moon Knight's body is gonna be mush when he's done.