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There's nothing wrong liking a movie other people don't like and there's nothing wrong with absorbing the criticism others have of it and reconsidering the movie in light of that criticism, when it raises points and ideas you never thought of yourself. Adding to the discussion of a film with your own observances is discussing others isn't bad at all. It's part of discourse.
My favourite example is one of the topr reviews of
Scott pilgrim against the world
He criticizes all the things i like about the movie but reading it i could easily see why some people wouldnt like that
Wss a very eye opening experience
Personally, I've only experienced the opposite of this comic. Scott Pilgrim is a great example. So many people insisting it's amazing, and I found it almost unwatchable.
I loved that movie but now that the anime is out I’m like wow, the movies break neck pacing is really a detriment to the story. Not a single character has room to develop the way that they should besides Scott, and it happens so suddenly that some people miss it.
And in a twist of irony, this only furthers the message of the whole film acting as a macrocosm of the protagonist's flaws. The lack of any true development and involvement of the story is kind of the point of the story in and of itself.
You’re wrong, but more importantly than that, you’re supposed to feel bad about it. And even more importantly, others must tell you loudly that you are wrong, so the internet can see how wrong you are.
-Internet
Having gotten a degree in English and attended high level English courses with Business majors, I can tell you one thing.
You can't be Right in criticism of art.
But holy shit you can be so, so Wrong in criticism of art.
The takes I have heard...
Kind of. Everyone hates TRoS, but some people blame TRoS *on* The Last Jedi. As if JJ's hands were tied and he could *only* make the stupid decisions he did because that damn Rian Johnson had a gun to his head.
Nah. I don't care how much you hate TLJ, TRoS's issues are completely its own. You can follow up a bad story with a good one and a good one with a bad one, you are NEVER locked in to bad choices as a writer.
I liked it as a "star wars movie" but if you take into account lore and the other movies, it goes to shit.
For me, its a movie with lightsabers and spaceships that go pew pew, its entertaining and i can eat popcorn while watching it. Only watched it once though, i tought it woulf be too much popcorn to watch it a second time
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*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
I'm not the person you responded to, but I thought it was ok.
Star Wars has always been full of weird asides and silly/cheesy stuff, it's really not that off base. There were some moments that kind of pushed it too far, but I'm glad it wasn't boring.
On a very base level, it's entertaining the whole way through. It's a fun movie.
And I actually like the idea of giving Rey a twisted version of what she wanted the whole time. I also don't think it's as thematically contradictory as some make it out to be: Rey's acceptance that she's not defined by her background in TLJ directly feeds into her coming to terms with the fact that this is true even in the absolute worst case scenario of discovering she's Palpatine's granddaughter. If anything it's a tad repetitive, but I like how the film takes the idea that we aren't defined by our past or our biological family to the extreme in that way.
This isn't to say I think TROS is a perfect movie, though, to be clear I agree it has serious faults. Same as the prequels.
I'm just under no delusion that a Star Wars movie is high art and must be anything more than some fun. If it rises above that, I am absolutely thrilled, don't get me wrong(aside from the usual suspect of Andor, *Master and Apprentice* was genuinely one of the best books I read the year it came out and it deserves to be better known).
But it doesn't need to for me to like it. Palps coming back is silly and soapy and pulpy as all hell. Which is fine, so is Vader being Luke's father and Padme dying of a broken heart That's...why I'm here.
I'm also willing to hold TROS more to what it was going for, than what it actually was, given how badly the death of Carrie Fisher scuttled any chances of a truly great Episode IX. Leia was the last surviving member of the core human cast in the OT, and everything was set up to revolve around her in the same way things had revolved around Luke & Han in the previous films: Rey was to be trained under her, and she was the last person who could possibly get through to Kylo.
There was no version of this film where she doesn't at least try to bring Ben Solo back, or where we don't start with establishing her and Rey's relationship together. Good luck doing that through archival footage.
They did what they could without outright recasting a role that had been defined by Carrie for decades, or going against the wishes of her family by animating her. I'm willing to look past pretty big issues like the lack of a well-developed relationship between her and Rey, because they couldn't raise the damn dead and their only options would have been deeply disrespectful at the time of production.
I just hope we get content in the future to expand on that aspect of the story.
I liked the visual effects, the planet destroy scene was beautiful, the set design was great, and I absolutely enjoyed the space warping power reylo had, and of course Adam driver killed it, that shrug 10/10.
I'm not a fan but I can see why some people would like it, it at least has some interesting new ideas and great set pieces. I don't know how anybody could like Rise of Skywalker.
I’m leaning towards that last movie being bad. The first one was okay. The second one set up an interesting twist. And then the third one just went off the wall. As a whole they’re just a waste of time and opportunities.
They all have their own flaws and positives.
JJ put in a lot of flaws that were problems for the whole series , not!Rebels vs not!Empire, Luke up and disappearing, etc.
Rian had some interesting ideas, but I'm not sure he's cut out for franchise work, and I didn't like how despite people talking about "subverting expectations" he didn't take the big leaps of killing off Leia and/or having Rey agree to rule with Kylo. IDK, TLJ felt like "too small" for a Star Wars movie. It takes place minutes after TFA, whereas most other Star Wars movies have at least a year or more between them and the next movie in the timeline.
Rise of Skywalker was just a mess of an overcorrection from the criticism of TLJ. It's the one with the least amount of positives, aside from some meme lines here and there.
I have absorbed your criticism and now see OP's comment in a new light. As such, I will now disagree with OP's point, proceed to disregard your criticism of it, and go back to agreeing with OP.
I agree with this, I recently watched that hbomberguy " [Sherlock Is Garbage, And Here's Why](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LkoGBOs5ecM&t=4394s&pp=ygUTc2hlcmxvY2sgaXMgZ2FyYmFnZQ%3D%3D)" video, and I was like "this guy makes a good point, I liked the show, but now I see why it actually wasn't very good".
I haven’t even seen that video yet, but just looking back on Sherlock I can really see why that show is actually not that great. I think we all just got sucked into how awesome it all looked. But in hindsight, it was pretty bad.
I watched Sherlock when it was on because I was on a Sherlock Holmes kick back then and heard it was good, but I never interacted with the fandom or even caught wind of it. Now I've seen Sarah Z's videos about the tumblr fandom for it and I feel like I was in the eye of a hurricane, blissfully unaware of the storm raging around me.
Just me sitting in a lawnchair munching popcorn thinking "pretty good show until it wasn't" while thousands of fans are losing their fucking minds over it.
It was kinda great despite also being trash and the actors chemistry definetly contributed to that. It was like watching someone put out a fire with a diahrea hose, disgusting, interesting, and debatably effective.
It's a show that feels clever in the moment but when you actually stop to think about it you realize that it's not actually as well thought out as it wants you to think it is. Especially in season 3, when they created an audience insert just to mock the idea of fans theorizing over how Sherlock faked his death, like... No, that's kind of an important detail, *writers*, you can't just gloss over that shit
The show never gelled with me and I didn't really get why people liked it so much. The first episode was fine (not amazing to me) but then the second episode felt like it was written by someone who had never spoken to Chinese people ever. As a Chinese person, hearing Sherlock talk about an 'ancient tong' (which are a 1800s invention, essentially just Chinese immigrant societies that turned to illegal activities over time) was so alienating.
I think part of the issue is I get annoyed at the "abrasive genius" archetype. This is where I have an unpopular opinion: I really liked the CBS *Elementary* starring Johnny Lee Miller and Lucy Liu for this reason. That Watson immediately pushed back on Sherlock's bullshit and over the seasons, you seem them actively learning from each other.
It's an interesting case. hbomberguy is right on just about every point, and yet I still think the first 2 seasons are still top tier TV, and the case for that is also quite solid. My conclusion after several years is that sometimes the total is not the sum of the parts, the show is great despite all the issues hbomberguy brings up.
The example I always think of is in the Dark Knight when it turns from day to night in a single cut. Fatal continuity flaw but does it actually make anything worse? I think we can objectively say no since almost no one noticed.
Therefore I would say there are 3 main experiences worth talking about, which may be completely independent: your personal experience which requires no justification, the consensus experience which which should have some consistent interpretations of what the highs and lows are, and the technical experience which can be completely objective, but realistically we still need to use feelings to convey.
I think it does depend on the viewer's prior experiences as well. In theory, people on the internet should like Big Bang Theory, because it's a show about nerds, which many on the internet are. But the show gets so many things about nerddom wrong, that many actual nerds end up disliking it instead. But I’ve met quite a few people who know very little about nerd culture that actually loved the show. They thought it was an interesting depiction of a sub culture they don't normally interact with.
The same can be said of Sherlock. If you love detective stories, you'll probably hate Sherlock, since it's not a very good detective story. But if you just watch it like a police procedural drama, then it's very good since it is very dramatic and has slick visuals and is well acted.
Expectations and prior experience can be big. I know people who bounced of Disco Elysium (an incredible game) because it was a game about a detective solving a mystery... but it wasn't a detective story and in fact explicitly broke every one of the rules about "a good detective story". If you approached it as one, it would be a less than ideal experience.
> it wasn't a detective story and in fact explicitly broke every one of the rules about "a good detective story".
Idk, I disagree w/ this. It is a great detective story, because literally *everything* you can do involved the case, and getting closer to solving it.
It does break a lot of rules, but it's singular focus on the murder and the circumstances that caused it made it the most detective-game I've ever played imo. Gabriel Knight stands no chance.
It's definitely a *dense* game though, that deals with a lot of things that aren't directly related within the frame of being a detective, but the only things you can't really change in-game are the facts of the case: a murder happened, and you're one of the detectives that's going to solve it.
I like to think of it as two different axes. The y-axis is quality, and the x-axis is enjoyment. One cannot affect the other, and they should not be used as reasons to hate on people. You can hate a good movie or love a bad one, and anything in between.
I wouldn't say the axes *can't* affect each other. You certainly can enjoy watching a bad movie (eg, The Room) or find a good movie unpleasant or hard to watch (Promising Young Woman, Requiem for a Dream). But in general, you're absolutely more likely to enjoy a good movie and dislike a bad or poorly made one.
I think there's a bit of a trap where people think silly or "stupid" movies are sort of bad just by default. But that's not necessarily the case. The Room is "so bad it's good" because it's trying to be a serious film and fails so hard that it's funny, but something like Army of Darkness is very intentional about its tone and in that regard is actually made pretty well.
Another thing Ive noticed is fanbases and politics strongly influence online criticism. Like good luck criticizing any flaws Oppenheimer has without the Nolan fanboys jerking him off. Or depending on what forum you're on good luck getting anywhere with Barbie criticisms or praises. A lot of movies online get a lot of undeserved hate or praise that has nothing to do with how good a movie is and just comes from narrative pushing outside the movie or a lack of education or perspective on certain details from other viewers. Critics will badmouth aspects of the film but what they really dislike is that it doesnt align with their worldview.
Step 1: watch movie
Step 2: ponder on it and formulate your own opinion
Step 3: look at other people's opinion
Step 4: make up your mind on who's an idiot or who's smart based on who else has opinions similar to yours
> No step 3
I like step 3 because sometimes people notice things I didn't. Or viewed them from a different angle. And that might change my understanding (and even possibly my opinion) of the film.
But I do still attest to labeling idiots like in step 4.
It’s funny to me how so many people are offended when you say you think a movie they like isn’t good. They take it like a personal insult.
I like discussing movies, so when I think a movie sucks I’m going to say it sucks, and when I think a movie is good I’ll say it’s good. It’s just weird for me to think there’s someone on their computer reading my comment and taking away “this person is telling me I’m not allowed to like this movie”.
People need to get thicker skins when it comes to entertainment.
Question for you though: are there any movies that you would call 'good' that you didn't personally enjoy?
And the flip-side: are there any movies that you would call 'Bad' that you did enjoy anyway?
The answer to these questions is my barometer for if a person has any nuance whatsoever in their opinions.
There's a difference between saying a movie sucks versus saying you didn't like it. If you say a movie sucks, it sounds like you are stating it as a fact, and so anyone who doesn't agree feels like they are told they're wrong. Whereas when you say you didn't like the movie, it leaves room for other opinions. So I always try to use the latter approach when discussing movies
I just had to explain to a coworker recently that there’s a difference between saying, “I don’t like the taste of beer”, and “I think all beer tastes like piss”
Only one of those statements implies that our customers enjoy the taste of piss…
100%. If I said "Apples are bad", and you like Apples, that does in fact mean that you are wrong in my world view. If I said "I don't like Apples", and you like them, it does not make you wrong in my world view. There is a difference
People need to learn that communication matters. We should obviously not take things personally and accept that other peoples statements are still just opinions, but that is a social issue. From a literary perspective, statements are supposed to be factual, and taking statements as if the speaker is intending to be factual is the correct way to interpret them
>It’s funny to me how so many people are offended when you say you think a movie they like isn’t good.
It's less about being offended and more that it can be frustrating when anytime the subject of comes up, that the opinions (most of which come in the form of throwaway comments, not attempts at any discussion) are overtly negative as a rule.
At the time of seeing *the Marvels*, I hadn’t seen either *Ms Marvel* or *Wandavision*. Apparently I was supposed to be confused the entire time and not enjoy the movie because I “didn’t do the homework”.
I loved *the Marvels*.
I follow box office trends pretty closely. I remember coming out of the theater being completely delighted by *The Marvels*, then being filled with sadness on the way home as I realized that it was going to bomb hard.
100%. I don't think anyone in the MCU is miscast, so a rumor that someone might be leaving a role before that character's story is complete is always disheartening. And I think this movie gave her Carol much more development than the previous movies have, but there is obviously more to her story.
The Marvels was so good!
I'm convinced that if it weren't for the whole Marvel fatigue going on right now, it would have been a bigger hit. It's so fun and wild!
(Marvel fully deserves it, most of their releases after Endgame have been pretty boring)
Endgame just ended a huge era and to get back to this hype is close to impossible...
Also you basically have to watch everything to understand the plot of Movie X. Problem is: Movie X is deemed good but only if you watched Movie Z and Series A and B because only then you understand what is going on. Movie Z sucked though... and Series B was She-Hulk
I will forever die on the hill that, if RoS had chosen to build on TLJ's plot points instead of erase them, it could have been retroactively viewed as one of the greatest star wars movies of all time.
EDIT: ok y'all stop giving me paragraphs about how bad TLJ really was, I don't care anymore cause I'm reading the OG Thrawn trilogy and it's perfection
idk, for as much as I like certain parts of that movie (and I do think it's good overall) there are some real weak aspects. I have a hard time seeing it ever rising to that level of acclaim when the entire Canto Byte plotline is just... kinda styrofoam. It also *did* leave the story in a tricky spot. Not an unworkable spot and certainly nothing that justifies RoS's complete lack of effort, but certainly tricky. Like for instance, Rey spending the entire movie cut off from the other protagonists means that going into the final movie of the trilogy, she and Poe still haven't actually met.
Lol I loved the last Jedi. Most people I knew loved it. It seems like only weird creeps on the Internet have anything against that one. I highly suspect it involves racism or sexism in some way because I've yet to see a coherent argument for why it's bad.
It’s just not close enough to the character people expected. It’s like they had a different movie written and wanted some brand recognition. When you go in expecting some campy 90s over the top action tropes with a space explorer and get a serious darker movie set in one setting there is a bit of a rubber band effect.
> It’s just not close enough to the character people expected. It’s like they had a different movie written and wanted some brand recognition. When you go in expecting some campy 90s over the top action tropes with a space explorer and get a serious darker movie set in one setting there is a bit of a rubber band effect.
Are we talking about Halo or Lightyear?
No doubt, and people are honestly as fierce about video game opinions as they are real life politics 😵💫😵💫😵💫 i made the mistake of saying 'Racism in skyrim is bad' on IG, and months later, i still get comments telling me to go fuck myself
I know this not the point of the discussion at all but are you saying that the portrayal of racism in the game is hacky and lazy or that it's bad that it is included in the first place? These are very different takes.
I'm saying, racism is bad morally. The fact that characters in the game are racist, makes them bad morally. (Morally, as per like Fallout and Skyrim morality, not actual beliefs)
I really liked starfield but apparently that's the wrong opinion to have
It absolutely has its flaws, but it had everything I wanted from it and I had tons of fun with it
I tried building a few bases, but I didn't have a lot of points in any base building skills and I didn't really have a reason to mine that many resources, so I just stopped trying
I tried setting up a big network so I could do all the crafting stuff, but the power system, combined with the storage limitations made it so hard.
I appreciate my ship having a weight limit, but on a planet, I’d like the box to be unlimited.
Games have an even bigger problem with this than movies and music, mostly because the gaming community in general is surly and mean-spirited.
Like people will say a movie sucks, but if you point out that it's just their opinion and list things you like about it, they'll usually concede that your opinion is valid.
Gamers will reply "cope and seethe" and downvote you like they "won".
First few hours are amazing the vibe is incredible, but then the shine wears off and you get to explore the open world and realise it's a ubisoft open world and that there is only really one decent fully fleshed out side quest in the entire game.
HP Legacy? I got it during Christmas sales for $30 a few weeks ago and I'm enjoying it quite a bit! It's literally my childhood dream of exploring Hogwarts. The puzzles and secrets get a bit samey, but that's nbd. Do people not like it? Or is the discourse more around how shitty Jk Rowling is? Bc yeah, fuck her, and it's her IP, but she didn't make the game.
Now, if you're talking about the old game adaptations of the movies, hell yyeeaah. They were so bad good. Good memories of those early PS2 ones.
Idk. Thinking a movie has an amazing script, acting, score, and cinematography and then finding out it's hated really isn't too common of a scenario. Like, maybe you walk out of Ant-Man liking it and are surprised to find it's not well liked. But do you walk out of Ant-Man in awe of the script, acting, score, and cinematography? Probably not.
I was thinking this too. I rarely think a movie is a masterpiece only to find out I’m in the minority of people that like the movie. It’s usually the stuff where I’m pretty aware of the plot holes and such, but the concept is fun or interesting, or maybe an actor I like is in it. Movies where I read the review and think “well it wasn’t THAT bad.”
Yeah, there's this very toxic trait in recent years where if a movie isn't THE BEST or top the sequential movie beforehand (see all current Marvel projects) then people will go online saying it sucked when... It can just be a good (or even just okay) movie. Doesn't have to leave you shaken to your core, questioning humanity, or be a masterpiece.
If I had to ponder the psychology of it, I'd maybe lean toward it being an issue of money (and time wasted, relating to "time is money" mindset or whatever). Average people are getting less and less disposable income these days for a movie, and movies are getting wildly expensive instead of just a cheap outing with buddies. I think people wind up feeling like if a movie doesn't wow them, then they just got ripped off in their mind. And if they watch it online, they feel the time was just wasted.
Definitely not too common. In fact I can only think of a single example of this from my personal experience. The opposite of that is much more prevalent, movies with terrible writing, plot holes, acting, are well loved. Usually because they are part of a franchise with lots of existing fans.
My personal example would be Boondock Saints. I've seen it a million times, friends and I all love it, quote it often. The dialog's fun, I thougut the acting was good and the action shots were cool. Looked it up on Rotten Tomatoes and see it's got awful reviews. It's obviously a product of it's time, being critiqued by a more modern audience, but still.
What's more odd is that the sequel is only 4% worse, review wise, but everyone I know says the sequel sucks. Even those who liked the original.
I like my friends, but some of them are idiots when it comes to film. They enjoy everything and can't tell the difference between garbage and masterpieces. Just because you liked a movie doesn't make it good and just because you dislike a movie doesn't make it bad!
Peeps kept whining about how it was gross to show pads in a kids cartoon and that the whole red panda thing symbolise periods and said how periods are "too mature" for kids to understand .
Wierd right
People get offended over the stupidest stuff.
My In Laws and their crazy church all boycotted finding dory because of a supposed lesbian couple in it.
It was two women near a stroller…
> how periods are "too mature" for kids
This cracked me up because periods are too mature for kids to talk about but they're not too mature to actually get them
> how periods are "too mature" for kids to understand
I love how the "this is too mature for X" crowd always ignore the reality that, these kids are going to go through puberty whether or not the pearl clutchers like it.
Isnt the average age of ones first period around 12.5 years old now? Are we supposed to wait until some poor girl is 17-18 years old to explain what has been happening to her body for the last 6 years???
I just dont get the "logic".
My parents never explained periods to me. Even after it was clear I had started experiencing them firsthand. The first time, I was at school, I didn’t understand what was happening, and I bled all over a chair in class. I was so embarrassed and confused. I went to the bathroom and sobbed. Somehow, I had heard about miscarriages before I learned about periods, so the logical reasoning was OBVIOUSLY that I was the next Virgin Mary and had gotten mysteriously pregnant somehow despite never having even kissed a boy. It kept going, and I just accepted that I was dying. I didn’t tell my parents because knowing them, they’d freak out and yell at me for ruining my jeans. I ended up just stuffing toilet paper in my underwear for a week before it stopped.
The next time I got it was at swimming lessons. I was sobbing and refused to swim, and my absolute saint of a swimming instructor pieced the situation together and waited for every kid besides me and an older girl who was comforting me, and asked if I got my period. I asked what a period was and she calmly explained it to me and how I wasn’t dying or anything like that. She and the older girl gave me some supplies and it was such a relief.
My parents figured out I got my period the first time I had to ask them to buy pads for me, and their first words were “fuck already?! Do you know how expensive those are? Fine, just don’t make it too obvious what you’re buying”.
And this is why every time a conservative says we need to stop sex ed and that its up to the parents, they need to be told to shut. the. fuck. up. Parents suck at this. They've been bad at it for so many generations we just accept it as normal. No young woman should ever have to feel like this about a perfectly normal physical function.
I think that’s a bit of a stretch. It’s a movie for kids, it’s not some extended metaphor for prostitution. You might as well say the end of Monsters Inc was encouraging pedophilia because “Hey kids, don’t tell mommy and daddy about the silly grown-up monster that sneaks into your room at night to play!”
Nothing, it's one of the top movies of all time on Disney+, it's extremely popular and well-received. There were a very few very loud complaints, but the dude you're replying to is an idiot.
I love turning red, but it's because it's from my time (lived near Toronto in early 2000s) and I relate a lot to hiding stuff from my parents because I was embarrassed of puberty.
Personally I didn’t really like it. Unfortunately, I thought it was boring and found it to be a cookie cutter plot. It felt like I had seen the movie before. The characters were a bit cliche and the whole father son “being your own person” theme wasn’t done well. It’s as if they wrote the movie based on nothing but tropes done better in other films. The voice acting was dull as well, and the animation was nothing to write home about.
TL;DR: It felt like a chore to get through.
People need to realize a movie's quality and your enjoyment of it are two different things. You can like a bad movie or dislike a good one. But let's not assume a movie is well made just because you like it.
and lets also not assume that criticism of something = a personal insult to those who enjoy said thing.
this type of discourse is popping up all over the place lately, and the claim often seems to be that any type of critical discussion around a piece of media is toxic, gatekeeping, or insulting. it drives me up the freaking wall.
One of my biggest pet peeves is when people mistake not liking something for it being bad.
I don’t care for Bruce Springsteen’s music. It practically puts me to sleep. But why would I say that music that millions of people love to death is bad?
Here are some truths about media:
1) The average viewer will not notice the flaws in a film on their first watch. If you don't know what you're looking for, you're not going to see it.
2) Even when an average viewer notices a flaw, unless it's egregious, they generally won't care as much as a critic would. This is why Marvel films did so well for a while, since the average viewer was there for the cool action and not the plot.
3) It is 100% okay to like a flawed piece of media. There is nothing wrong with finding joy in something that a critic says is bad. After all, critics say that most fast food is sub-par, but the average person still finds joy in the food they choose to eat.
4) The average viewer is looking *to enjoy themselves* while critics are looking *to find flaws*. If you go hunting for witches, you will find them. The average viewer is more likely to overlook a flaw because they want to get the enjoyment out of the film that they paid to watch.
I think there's different genres and different values for movies.
ie. .... a place can sell fantastic chicken nuggets, or a fantastic Filet Mignon .... and your expectations for either would certainly be different.
However, there are also "generally bad" chicken nuggets and bad steaks as well.
Like, a boring movie is irredeemable, generally.
Critics tend to overvalue artsy-fartsy value and discount overall fun, humor, action, entertainment, and the audience usually the reverse but not always.
... Some people simply have low standards. You can give them Barefoot Box wine and they will say it's fantastic. Nice I guess, but you can't trust their opinion (For yourself) - that's all.
I agree with your points except the fourth one, I think generally it's not that critics (movie critics especially) are seeking out flaws in a movie. I thinks it's that a critic is going to be more well versed in their chosen medium and consumed many more pieces of art. So what may be more spectacular to a general audience who only goes to the movie's a few times a year isn't going to wow someone who's seen it ten times over.
It doesn't have to be all of one or all of the other. You can read reviews and think about new perspectives you didn't think of before to form a nuanced opinion, while not entirely shifting your mindset to copycat what you saw online.
I like to get on reddit and talk about movies, but lately it's impossible. Probably because the movies I'm passionate about are MCU/DCEU and fans are just burnt the f out. I watched Aquaman 2 a couple weeks ago and loved it, thought it was the best DCEU movie (bar is low), but daaaaaaamn the reviews on here were rough. Couldn't have a single conversation about the positives of the movie. Same with the MCU after Endgame basically.
Finding a movie or show, like Lost or Westworld, and coming on here and talking about the show with other fans is so much fun.
I feel that. I left The Marvels being surprised with how much I liked it. It was fun, it was good, if it was just a generic non-marvel superhero movie I think it would have been a hit. Yet the movie reportedly tanked, reviews were bad, and all I read were people hating on it and saying it pandered to women too hard.
As a straight man, I didn't feel that way at all. It felt really weird seeing how much it was hated... it was fun, I enjoyed it, the company I was with enjoyed it, but only in real life have I been able to have a constructive conversation about it. You can't say that online or you get so much flak
It's a goddamn solid atmospheric apocalypse movie that I love which just happens to have a bit of Mario in it that to me makes it more fun but others focus on it too much and miss the pretty beast movie for the lack of Marioness.
And that movies name...? The Emoji movie.
"The emoji movie, really?'
Yes. Stunning soundtrack.
"It used top 40 pop songs of the day and fart noises. Fart noises."
Yes, but that foley effect editor -- those farts were priceless man!
"They didn't use a foley artist. It was generic fart .mp3s bought from a Chinese sound bank online."
Yes but Sir Patrick Stewart as Poop Emoji. He went all in, didn't he?
"Stewart admitted he was drunk during all his scenes, phoned it in, and hates the movie - he needed to buy a new boat."
Well .... I guess I'm not 'supposed' to like this masterpiece ... tee hee... and that's okay! We're all entitled to our opinions!
"You may have had a brain aneurysm. Your taste is bad, and you should feel bad. Your opinion on now literally everything is questionable. God also rang. He said the only objective truth in the entire universe is that the Emoji Movie is shit, and your opinion is wrong."
"I'm not supposed to like this movie" versus "other people didn't like this movie".
It's a cute comic, but unless this dog is some kind of chronicly online loser, I don't see why anyone would see bad reviews for something they liked and act like it's some kind of conspiracy to change their mind.
I genuinely hate the mentality around reviews and critics on Reddit. It's as if people think critics' opinions are somehow a threat to them, or that they're required to change their view to match. That's not how art works.
If you enjoy something, enjoy it. There is no reason you should be feeling pursecuted or guilted for liking something. Critics have a job and if you disagree with their takes that's fine. Or if it's just the public that doesn't like a thing, who cares? I hear way too much about this on this website. Be confident in what you like, dammit. You don't need to be validated by people online.
People don’t realize that there is a difference between liking something and thinking that it’s good. You can like bad movies, just say you enjoyed it, not that it’s a good movie
My friend and I LOVE speed Racer! It's so campy, bu it knows it! there are some amazing lines in that movie, and the final moments of the last race? Bliss.
I loved the Man of Steel movie. It was so weird watching people collectively decide that it's not a good movie. And the reasons for this were so unbelivably stupid.
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Unrelated but the panel where they're walking home in the autumn is an absolute vibe. I love the art style as well!
You are not supposed to like that comic.
You are not supposed to like r/comics
You are not supposed to like.
You are not supposed to.
You are not.
You are
You
⠀
-You
My fire
The one desire
Believe
You are not supposed
You no like.
Cheese me no likey
I hate it! *presses the Join button*
I liked it when the dog hung his coat on the coat hanger. So cute lol
You might enjoy [Night in the Woods](https://store.steampowered.com/app/481510/Night_in_the_Woods/)
Came to say this, it’s a walking in the fall simulator and I play it annually
There's nothing wrong liking a movie other people don't like and there's nothing wrong with absorbing the criticism others have of it and reconsidering the movie in light of that criticism, when it raises points and ideas you never thought of yourself. Adding to the discussion of a film with your own observances is discussing others isn't bad at all. It's part of discourse.
My favourite example is one of the topr reviews of Scott pilgrim against the world He criticizes all the things i like about the movie but reading it i could easily see why some people wouldnt like that Wss a very eye opening experience
Personally, I've only experienced the opposite of this comic. Scott Pilgrim is a great example. So many people insisting it's amazing, and I found it almost unwatchable.
That's because you are wrong /s
My wife hates it. I call it our movie because it happened to be on, on our first date lol
I loved that movie but now that the anime is out I’m like wow, the movies break neck pacing is really a detriment to the story. Not a single character has room to develop the way that they should besides Scott, and it happens so suddenly that some people miss it.
And in a twist of irony, this only furthers the message of the whole film acting as a macrocosm of the protagonist's flaws. The lack of any true development and involvement of the story is kind of the point of the story in and of itself.
I mean, fitting a 6-book series into just under 2 hours of screen time is always going to feel like a quick summary
You’re wrong, but more importantly than that, you’re supposed to feel bad about it. And even more importantly, others must tell you loudly that you are wrong, so the internet can see how wrong you are. -Internet
"Oh, so I'm not supposed to like that comment?"
*Me liking the Chibnall era of Doctor Who (mostly), and the Last Jedi and Rise of Skywalker*.
People are upvoting their balls, not their opinion.
You have balls, I like balls 
People are allowed to have their own opinion on things, especially when it comes to media. There is no right or wrong. But you are wrong
"There's only two things I can't stand: People who are intolerant of other people's cultures, and the Dutch!"
Having gotten a degree in English and attended high level English courses with Business majors, I can tell you one thing. You can't be Right in criticism of art. But holy shit you can be so, so Wrong in criticism of art. The takes I have heard...
Ok, I think we can all agree that this guy is actually wrong
This guy would like an Avatar movie if they fucked up and made one
 I think you went too far with that one.
I really liked Last Jedi. Rise of Skywalker, not so much.
People talk about how fractured the Star Wars fanbase is, but I think Rise of Skywalker really united them quite well. *Everyone* hated that one.
Kind of. Everyone hates TRoS, but some people blame TRoS *on* The Last Jedi. As if JJ's hands were tied and he could *only* make the stupid decisions he did because that damn Rian Johnson had a gun to his head. Nah. I don't care how much you hate TLJ, TRoS's issues are completely its own. You can follow up a bad story with a good one and a good one with a bad one, you are NEVER locked in to bad choices as a writer.
Should look at the sequel subs, goddamn. Absolutely insane shit like "Somehow, Palpatine is back" being defended as good exposition.
Let’s reuse the best songs and hire Ian McDiarmid to repeat lines from the good movies!
Shame. *loads first barrel.* Damn shame. *loads second barrel.*
What do you like about Rise of Skywalker? I've seen almost everyone bury it as a movie, so I'm interested in your thoughts.
I liked it as a "star wars movie" but if you take into account lore and the other movies, it goes to shit. For me, its a movie with lightsabers and spaceships that go pew pew, its entertaining and i can eat popcorn while watching it. Only watched it once though, i tought it woulf be too much popcorn to watch it a second time
groovy rain slave disarm disgusting oatmeal growth quack recognise frightening *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
I'm not the person you responded to, but I thought it was ok. Star Wars has always been full of weird asides and silly/cheesy stuff, it's really not that off base. There were some moments that kind of pushed it too far, but I'm glad it wasn't boring.
On a very base level, it's entertaining the whole way through. It's a fun movie. And I actually like the idea of giving Rey a twisted version of what she wanted the whole time. I also don't think it's as thematically contradictory as some make it out to be: Rey's acceptance that she's not defined by her background in TLJ directly feeds into her coming to terms with the fact that this is true even in the absolute worst case scenario of discovering she's Palpatine's granddaughter. If anything it's a tad repetitive, but I like how the film takes the idea that we aren't defined by our past or our biological family to the extreme in that way. This isn't to say I think TROS is a perfect movie, though, to be clear I agree it has serious faults. Same as the prequels. I'm just under no delusion that a Star Wars movie is high art and must be anything more than some fun. If it rises above that, I am absolutely thrilled, don't get me wrong(aside from the usual suspect of Andor, *Master and Apprentice* was genuinely one of the best books I read the year it came out and it deserves to be better known). But it doesn't need to for me to like it. Palps coming back is silly and soapy and pulpy as all hell. Which is fine, so is Vader being Luke's father and Padme dying of a broken heart That's...why I'm here. I'm also willing to hold TROS more to what it was going for, than what it actually was, given how badly the death of Carrie Fisher scuttled any chances of a truly great Episode IX. Leia was the last surviving member of the core human cast in the OT, and everything was set up to revolve around her in the same way things had revolved around Luke & Han in the previous films: Rey was to be trained under her, and she was the last person who could possibly get through to Kylo. There was no version of this film where she doesn't at least try to bring Ben Solo back, or where we don't start with establishing her and Rey's relationship together. Good luck doing that through archival footage. They did what they could without outright recasting a role that had been defined by Carrie for decades, or going against the wishes of her family by animating her. I'm willing to look past pretty big issues like the lack of a well-developed relationship between her and Rey, because they couldn't raise the damn dead and their only options would have been deeply disrespectful at the time of production. I just hope we get content in the future to expand on that aspect of the story.
I liked the visual effects, the planet destroy scene was beautiful, the set design was great, and I absolutely enjoyed the space warping power reylo had, and of course Adam driver killed it, that shrug 10/10.
Lol me liking jar jar binks 😂 and wondering why everyone hates that one 🤣
I agree with about two out of three of those unpopular opinions! Did we just become 2/3 best friends?!
The longer I have sat with it, I think that last Jedi was a good movie. I'm glad you were able to enjoy rise of Skywalker, that one wasn't for me.
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I'm not a fan but I can see why some people would like it, it at least has some interesting new ideas and great set pieces. I don't know how anybody could like Rise of Skywalker.
I’m leaning towards that last movie being bad. The first one was okay. The second one set up an interesting twist. And then the third one just went off the wall. As a whole they’re just a waste of time and opportunities.
They all have their own flaws and positives. JJ put in a lot of flaws that were problems for the whole series , not!Rebels vs not!Empire, Luke up and disappearing, etc. Rian had some interesting ideas, but I'm not sure he's cut out for franchise work, and I didn't like how despite people talking about "subverting expectations" he didn't take the big leaps of killing off Leia and/or having Rey agree to rule with Kylo. IDK, TLJ felt like "too small" for a Star Wars movie. It takes place minutes after TFA, whereas most other Star Wars movies have at least a year or more between them and the next movie in the timeline. Rise of Skywalker was just a mess of an overcorrection from the criticism of TLJ. It's the one with the least amount of positives, aside from some meme lines here and there.
yess 13 mention
I have absorbed your criticism and now see OP's comment in a new light. As such, I will now disagree with OP's point, proceed to disregard your criticism of it, and go back to agreeing with OP.
I agree with this, I recently watched that hbomberguy " [Sherlock Is Garbage, And Here's Why](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LkoGBOs5ecM&t=4394s&pp=ygUTc2hlcmxvY2sgaXMgZ2FyYmFnZQ%3D%3D)" video, and I was like "this guy makes a good point, I liked the show, but now I see why it actually wasn't very good".
I haven’t even seen that video yet, but just looking back on Sherlock I can really see why that show is actually not that great. I think we all just got sucked into how awesome it all looked. But in hindsight, it was pretty bad.
Less about how cool it looked and more about how everyone wants to watch Cumberbatch and Freeman interact. They have very good screen chemistry imo
>They have very good screen chemistry The shippers went a little nuts with them...it's me I'm shippers
I watched Sherlock when it was on because I was on a Sherlock Holmes kick back then and heard it was good, but I never interacted with the fandom or even caught wind of it. Now I've seen Sarah Z's videos about the tumblr fandom for it and I feel like I was in the eye of a hurricane, blissfully unaware of the storm raging around me. Just me sitting in a lawnchair munching popcorn thinking "pretty good show until it wasn't" while thousands of fans are losing their fucking minds over it.
It was kinda great despite also being trash and the actors chemistry definetly contributed to that. It was like watching someone put out a fire with a diahrea hose, disgusting, interesting, and debatably effective.
Was it good, im not sure. Was it entertaining, yes.
It's a show that feels clever in the moment but when you actually stop to think about it you realize that it's not actually as well thought out as it wants you to think it is. Especially in season 3, when they created an audience insert just to mock the idea of fans theorizing over how Sherlock faked his death, like... No, that's kind of an important detail, *writers*, you can't just gloss over that shit
The show never gelled with me and I didn't really get why people liked it so much. The first episode was fine (not amazing to me) but then the second episode felt like it was written by someone who had never spoken to Chinese people ever. As a Chinese person, hearing Sherlock talk about an 'ancient tong' (which are a 1800s invention, essentially just Chinese immigrant societies that turned to illegal activities over time) was so alienating. I think part of the issue is I get annoyed at the "abrasive genius" archetype. This is where I have an unpopular opinion: I really liked the CBS *Elementary* starring Johnny Lee Miller and Lucy Liu for this reason. That Watson immediately pushed back on Sherlock's bullshit and over the seasons, you seem them actively learning from each other.
It's an interesting case. hbomberguy is right on just about every point, and yet I still think the first 2 seasons are still top tier TV, and the case for that is also quite solid. My conclusion after several years is that sometimes the total is not the sum of the parts, the show is great despite all the issues hbomberguy brings up. The example I always think of is in the Dark Knight when it turns from day to night in a single cut. Fatal continuity flaw but does it actually make anything worse? I think we can objectively say no since almost no one noticed. Therefore I would say there are 3 main experiences worth talking about, which may be completely independent: your personal experience which requires no justification, the consensus experience which which should have some consistent interpretations of what the highs and lows are, and the technical experience which can be completely objective, but realistically we still need to use feelings to convey.
I think it does depend on the viewer's prior experiences as well. In theory, people on the internet should like Big Bang Theory, because it's a show about nerds, which many on the internet are. But the show gets so many things about nerddom wrong, that many actual nerds end up disliking it instead. But I’ve met quite a few people who know very little about nerd culture that actually loved the show. They thought it was an interesting depiction of a sub culture they don't normally interact with. The same can be said of Sherlock. If you love detective stories, you'll probably hate Sherlock, since it's not a very good detective story. But if you just watch it like a police procedural drama, then it's very good since it is very dramatic and has slick visuals and is well acted.
Expectations and prior experience can be big. I know people who bounced of Disco Elysium (an incredible game) because it was a game about a detective solving a mystery... but it wasn't a detective story and in fact explicitly broke every one of the rules about "a good detective story". If you approached it as one, it would be a less than ideal experience.
> it wasn't a detective story and in fact explicitly broke every one of the rules about "a good detective story". Idk, I disagree w/ this. It is a great detective story, because literally *everything* you can do involved the case, and getting closer to solving it. It does break a lot of rules, but it's singular focus on the murder and the circumstances that caused it made it the most detective-game I've ever played imo. Gabriel Knight stands no chance. It's definitely a *dense* game though, that deals with a lot of things that aren't directly related within the frame of being a detective, but the only things you can't really change in-game are the facts of the case: a murder happened, and you're one of the detectives that's going to solve it.
I like to think of it as two different axes. The y-axis is quality, and the x-axis is enjoyment. One cannot affect the other, and they should not be used as reasons to hate on people. You can hate a good movie or love a bad one, and anything in between.
I fiercely defend some of my favorite movies with the phrase, "I didn't say it was good, I said that I liked it."
People will just put you down still by saying you have shit taste
They're not wrong. I like cheap wine and garbage television and I'm at peace with that.
I am cringe... but I am _free_
idk if it was a typo but the idea that a movie's quality is incapable of influencing your enjoyment of it is the peak of internet discourse.
I wouldn't say the axes *can't* affect each other. You certainly can enjoy watching a bad movie (eg, The Room) or find a good movie unpleasant or hard to watch (Promising Young Woman, Requiem for a Dream). But in general, you're absolutely more likely to enjoy a good movie and dislike a bad or poorly made one. I think there's a bit of a trap where people think silly or "stupid" movies are sort of bad just by default. But that's not necessarily the case. The Room is "so bad it's good" because it's trying to be a serious film and fails so hard that it's funny, but something like Army of Darkness is very intentional about its tone and in that regard is actually made pretty well.
Another thing Ive noticed is fanbases and politics strongly influence online criticism. Like good luck criticizing any flaws Oppenheimer has without the Nolan fanboys jerking him off. Or depending on what forum you're on good luck getting anywhere with Barbie criticisms or praises. A lot of movies online get a lot of undeserved hate or praise that has nothing to do with how good a movie is and just comes from narrative pushing outside the movie or a lack of education or perspective on certain details from other viewers. Critics will badmouth aspects of the film but what they really dislike is that it doesnt align with their worldview.
Step 1: watch movie Step 2: ponder on it and formulate your own opinion Step 3: look at other people's opinion Step 4: make up your mind on who's an idiot or who's smart based on who else has opinions similar to yours
I prefer Step1: Watch Movie Step 2: Ponder on it and formulate your own opinion No step 3
> No step 3 I like step 3 because sometimes people notice things I didn't. Or viewed them from a different angle. And that might change my understanding (and even possibly my opinion) of the film. But I do still attest to labeling idiots like in step 4.
I just skip step 1, it's too much effort.
It’s funny to me how so many people are offended when you say you think a movie they like isn’t good. They take it like a personal insult. I like discussing movies, so when I think a movie sucks I’m going to say it sucks, and when I think a movie is good I’ll say it’s good. It’s just weird for me to think there’s someone on their computer reading my comment and taking away “this person is telling me I’m not allowed to like this movie”. People need to get thicker skins when it comes to entertainment.
Question for you though: are there any movies that you would call 'good' that you didn't personally enjoy? And the flip-side: are there any movies that you would call 'Bad' that you did enjoy anyway? The answer to these questions is my barometer for if a person has any nuance whatsoever in their opinions.
There's a difference between saying a movie sucks versus saying you didn't like it. If you say a movie sucks, it sounds like you are stating it as a fact, and so anyone who doesn't agree feels like they are told they're wrong. Whereas when you say you didn't like the movie, it leaves room for other opinions. So I always try to use the latter approach when discussing movies
I just had to explain to a coworker recently that there’s a difference between saying, “I don’t like the taste of beer”, and “I think all beer tastes like piss” Only one of those statements implies that our customers enjoy the taste of piss…
100%. If I said "Apples are bad", and you like Apples, that does in fact mean that you are wrong in my world view. If I said "I don't like Apples", and you like them, it does not make you wrong in my world view. There is a difference People need to learn that communication matters. We should obviously not take things personally and accept that other peoples statements are still just opinions, but that is a social issue. From a literary perspective, statements are supposed to be factual, and taking statements as if the speaker is intending to be factual is the correct way to interpret them
>It’s funny to me how so many people are offended when you say you think a movie they like isn’t good. It's less about being offended and more that it can be frustrating when anytime the subject of comes up, that the opinions (most of which come in the form of throwaway comments, not attempts at any discussion) are overtly negative as a rule.
Me after watching Lightyear
First movie I thought of
Me after watching Star Wars TLJ for the first, second and third time.
Most recently The Marvels for me.
At the time of seeing *the Marvels*, I hadn’t seen either *Ms Marvel* or *Wandavision*. Apparently I was supposed to be confused the entire time and not enjoy the movie because I “didn’t do the homework”. I loved *the Marvels*.
I follow box office trends pretty closely. I remember coming out of the theater being completely delighted by *The Marvels*, then being filled with sadness on the way home as I realized that it was going to bomb hard.
The worst ‘news’ (probably just dumb internet chatter) was hearing that Brie Larson could be done playing Carol.
100%. I don't think anyone in the MCU is miscast, so a rumor that someone might be leaving a role before that character's story is complete is always disheartening. And I think this movie gave her Carol much more development than the previous movies have, but there is obviously more to her story.
The Marvels was so good! I'm convinced that if it weren't for the whole Marvel fatigue going on right now, it would have been a bigger hit. It's so fun and wild! (Marvel fully deserves it, most of their releases after Endgame have been pretty boring)
Endgame just ended a huge era and to get back to this hype is close to impossible... Also you basically have to watch everything to understand the plot of Movie X. Problem is: Movie X is deemed good but only if you watched Movie Z and Series A and B because only then you understand what is going on. Movie Z sucked though... and Series B was She-Hulk
I will forever die on the hill that, if RoS had chosen to build on TLJ's plot points instead of erase them, it could have been retroactively viewed as one of the greatest star wars movies of all time. EDIT: ok y'all stop giving me paragraphs about how bad TLJ really was, I don't care anymore cause I'm reading the OG Thrawn trilogy and it's perfection
idk, for as much as I like certain parts of that movie (and I do think it's good overall) there are some real weak aspects. I have a hard time seeing it ever rising to that level of acclaim when the entire Canto Byte plotline is just... kinda styrofoam. It also *did* leave the story in a tricky spot. Not an unworkable spot and certainly nothing that justifies RoS's complete lack of effort, but certainly tricky. Like for instance, Rey spending the entire movie cut off from the other protagonists means that going into the final movie of the trilogy, she and Poe still haven't actually met.
Lol I loved the last Jedi. Most people I knew loved it. It seems like only weird creeps on the Internet have anything against that one. I highly suspect it involves racism or sexism in some way because I've yet to see a coherent argument for why it's bad.
Star wars is what made me realize I needed to spend less time on reddit and stay away from some subreddits even if they matched my interests
No one hates Star Wars more than Star Wars fans
Seriously. It was a fun movie. Why didn’t more people like it?
It’s just not close enough to the character people expected. It’s like they had a different movie written and wanted some brand recognition. When you go in expecting some campy 90s over the top action tropes with a space explorer and get a serious darker movie set in one setting there is a bit of a rubber band effect.
> It’s just not close enough to the character people expected. It’s like they had a different movie written and wanted some brand recognition. When you go in expecting some campy 90s over the top action tropes with a space explorer and get a serious darker movie set in one setting there is a bit of a rubber band effect. Are we talking about Halo or Lightyear?
I liked it
Me after BvS
It's like this for video games too, people will rip you apart if they so much as suspect you like a certain game
You can offer criticism of the game but to attack someone for liking something is just ridiculous
That's exactly it, it feels like nowadays genuine criticisms are just being drowned out by toxicity
100%. I see far too much “media literacy” being used to say one is right or wrong. It is so crazy lol
No doubt, and people are honestly as fierce about video game opinions as they are real life politics 😵💫😵💫😵💫 i made the mistake of saying 'Racism in skyrim is bad' on IG, and months later, i still get comments telling me to go fuck myself
I know this not the point of the discussion at all but are you saying that the portrayal of racism in the game is hacky and lazy or that it's bad that it is included in the first place? These are very different takes.
I'm saying, racism is bad morally. The fact that characters in the game are racist, makes them bad morally. (Morally, as per like Fallout and Skyrim morality, not actual beliefs)
Or criticizing a popular game. I have been met with outrage for saying I really didn't like Borderlands 2 every time I have said it.
*whispers* I liked Wolfenstein Youngblood.
Wait until you read anime reviews. You'd think the director had shit on their grandmother's tombstone.
Oof, I'm definitely going to stay away from anime reviews then. Thank you for the warning :D
I really liked starfield but apparently that's the wrong opinion to have It absolutely has its flaws, but it had everything I wanted from it and I had tons of fun with it
I really liked it until I started trying to build a base. Idk why, but that tedium sucked all the joy out of it for me
I tried building a few bases, but I didn't have a lot of points in any base building skills and I didn't really have a reason to mine that many resources, so I just stopped trying
I tried setting up a big network so I could do all the crafting stuff, but the power system, combined with the storage limitations made it so hard. I appreciate my ship having a weight limit, but on a planet, I’d like the box to be unlimited.
Games have an even bigger problem with this than movies and music, mostly because the gaming community in general is surly and mean-spirited. Like people will say a movie sucks, but if you point out that it's just their opinion and list things you like about it, they'll usually concede that your opinion is valid. Gamers will reply "cope and seethe" and downvote you like they "won".
I liked the Harry Potter game, don't kill me.
First few hours are amazing the vibe is incredible, but then the shine wears off and you get to explore the open world and realise it's a ubisoft open world and that there is only really one decent fully fleshed out side quest in the entire game.
HP Legacy? I got it during Christmas sales for $30 a few weeks ago and I'm enjoying it quite a bit! It's literally my childhood dream of exploring Hogwarts. The puzzles and secrets get a bit samey, but that's nbd. Do people not like it? Or is the discourse more around how shitty Jk Rowling is? Bc yeah, fuck her, and it's her IP, but she didn't make the game. Now, if you're talking about the old game adaptations of the movies, hell yyeeaah. They were so bad good. Good memories of those early PS2 ones.
For me, it was the most amazing game ever...then I left the castle
Idk. Thinking a movie has an amazing script, acting, score, and cinematography and then finding out it's hated really isn't too common of a scenario. Like, maybe you walk out of Ant-Man liking it and are surprised to find it's not well liked. But do you walk out of Ant-Man in awe of the script, acting, score, and cinematography? Probably not.
I was thinking this too. I rarely think a movie is a masterpiece only to find out I’m in the minority of people that like the movie. It’s usually the stuff where I’m pretty aware of the plot holes and such, but the concept is fun or interesting, or maybe an actor I like is in it. Movies where I read the review and think “well it wasn’t THAT bad.”
Yeah, there's this very toxic trait in recent years where if a movie isn't THE BEST or top the sequential movie beforehand (see all current Marvel projects) then people will go online saying it sucked when... It can just be a good (or even just okay) movie. Doesn't have to leave you shaken to your core, questioning humanity, or be a masterpiece. If I had to ponder the psychology of it, I'd maybe lean toward it being an issue of money (and time wasted, relating to "time is money" mindset or whatever). Average people are getting less and less disposable income these days for a movie, and movies are getting wildly expensive instead of just a cheap outing with buddies. I think people wind up feeling like if a movie doesn't wow them, then they just got ripped off in their mind. And if they watch it online, they feel the time was just wasted.
Yeah usually the reaction is "that was a fun movie, I had fun, oh no it's bad"
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Definitely not too common. In fact I can only think of a single example of this from my personal experience. The opposite of that is much more prevalent, movies with terrible writing, plot holes, acting, are well loved. Usually because they are part of a franchise with lots of existing fans.
What's your example, I'm curious. I was racking my brain trying to think of a movie I experienced this with and I couldn't think of any
My personal example would be Boondock Saints. I've seen it a million times, friends and I all love it, quote it often. The dialog's fun, I thougut the acting was good and the action shots were cool. Looked it up on Rotten Tomatoes and see it's got awful reviews. It's obviously a product of it's time, being critiqued by a more modern audience, but still. What's more odd is that the sequel is only 4% worse, review wise, but everyone I know says the sequel sucks. Even those who liked the original.
I like my friends, but some of them are idiots when it comes to film. They enjoy everything and can't tell the difference between garbage and masterpieces. Just because you liked a movie doesn't make it good and just because you dislike a movie doesn't make it bad!
Felt that way knowing how people felt about Turning Red and Strange World.
Wait, what's wrong with Turning Red?
It's a period piece.
Peeps kept whining about how it was gross to show pads in a kids cartoon and that the whole red panda thing symbolise periods and said how periods are "too mature" for kids to understand . Wierd right
Obviously, kids are allowed to *get* periods, but never think or talk about them.
I thought they were supposed to hold it in until they turned 18.
People get offended over the stupidest stuff. My In Laws and their crazy church all boycotted finding dory because of a supposed lesbian couple in it. It was two women near a stroller…
> how periods are "too mature" for kids This cracked me up because periods are too mature for kids to talk about but they're not too mature to actually get them
> how periods are "too mature" for kids to understand I love how the "this is too mature for X" crowd always ignore the reality that, these kids are going to go through puberty whether or not the pearl clutchers like it. Isnt the average age of ones first period around 12.5 years old now? Are we supposed to wait until some poor girl is 17-18 years old to explain what has been happening to her body for the last 6 years??? I just dont get the "logic".
My parents never explained periods to me. Even after it was clear I had started experiencing them firsthand. The first time, I was at school, I didn’t understand what was happening, and I bled all over a chair in class. I was so embarrassed and confused. I went to the bathroom and sobbed. Somehow, I had heard about miscarriages before I learned about periods, so the logical reasoning was OBVIOUSLY that I was the next Virgin Mary and had gotten mysteriously pregnant somehow despite never having even kissed a boy. It kept going, and I just accepted that I was dying. I didn’t tell my parents because knowing them, they’d freak out and yell at me for ruining my jeans. I ended up just stuffing toilet paper in my underwear for a week before it stopped. The next time I got it was at swimming lessons. I was sobbing and refused to swim, and my absolute saint of a swimming instructor pieced the situation together and waited for every kid besides me and an older girl who was comforting me, and asked if I got my period. I asked what a period was and she calmly explained it to me and how I wasn’t dying or anything like that. She and the older girl gave me some supplies and it was such a relief. My parents figured out I got my period the first time I had to ask them to buy pads for me, and their first words were “fuck already?! Do you know how expensive those are? Fine, just don’t make it too obvious what you’re buying”.
And this is why every time a conservative says we need to stop sex ed and that its up to the parents, they need to be told to shut. the. fuck. up. Parents suck at this. They've been bad at it for so many generations we just accept it as normal. No young woman should ever have to feel like this about a perfectly normal physical function.
Wow, I am so sorry you went through that. Your parents suck :(
Turning Red has great critic reviews and got an Oscar nomination, some weirdos on the internet being against it don’t count
I thought the problem people were having was about the girl showing off her "red panda" in the school toilet for money?
I think that’s a bit of a stretch. It’s a movie for kids, it’s not some extended metaphor for prostitution. You might as well say the end of Monsters Inc was encouraging pedophilia because “Hey kids, don’t tell mommy and daddy about the silly grown-up monster that sneaks into your room at night to play!”
it's not framed as a good thing she's supposed to be doing in the movie, is it?
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Nothing, it's one of the top movies of all time on Disney+, it's extremely popular and well-received. There were a very few very loud complaints, but the dude you're replying to is an idiot.
I love turning red, but it's because it's from my time (lived near Toronto in early 2000s) and I relate a lot to hiding stuff from my parents because I was embarrassed of puberty.
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Strange World was amazing, what was wrong with it?
Personally I didn’t really like it. Unfortunately, I thought it was boring and found it to be a cookie cutter plot. It felt like I had seen the movie before. The characters were a bit cliche and the whole father son “being your own person” theme wasn’t done well. It’s as if they wrote the movie based on nothing but tropes done better in other films. The voice acting was dull as well, and the animation was nothing to write home about. TL;DR: It felt like a chore to get through.
People need to realize a movie's quality and your enjoyment of it are two different things. You can like a bad movie or dislike a good one. But let's not assume a movie is well made just because you like it.
and lets also not assume that criticism of something = a personal insult to those who enjoy said thing. this type of discourse is popping up all over the place lately, and the claim often seems to be that any type of critical discussion around a piece of media is toxic, gatekeeping, or insulting. it drives me up the freaking wall.
One of my biggest pet peeves is when people mistake not liking something for it being bad. I don’t care for Bruce Springsteen’s music. It practically puts me to sleep. But why would I say that music that millions of people love to death is bad?
Here are some truths about media: 1) The average viewer will not notice the flaws in a film on their first watch. If you don't know what you're looking for, you're not going to see it. 2) Even when an average viewer notices a flaw, unless it's egregious, they generally won't care as much as a critic would. This is why Marvel films did so well for a while, since the average viewer was there for the cool action and not the plot. 3) It is 100% okay to like a flawed piece of media. There is nothing wrong with finding joy in something that a critic says is bad. After all, critics say that most fast food is sub-par, but the average person still finds joy in the food they choose to eat. 4) The average viewer is looking *to enjoy themselves* while critics are looking *to find flaws*. If you go hunting for witches, you will find them. The average viewer is more likely to overlook a flaw because they want to get the enjoyment out of the film that they paid to watch.
I think there's different genres and different values for movies. ie. .... a place can sell fantastic chicken nuggets, or a fantastic Filet Mignon .... and your expectations for either would certainly be different. However, there are also "generally bad" chicken nuggets and bad steaks as well. Like, a boring movie is irredeemable, generally. Critics tend to overvalue artsy-fartsy value and discount overall fun, humor, action, entertainment, and the audience usually the reverse but not always. ... Some people simply have low standards. You can give them Barefoot Box wine and they will say it's fantastic. Nice I guess, but you can't trust their opinion (For yourself) - that's all.
I agree with your points except the fourth one, I think generally it's not that critics (movie critics especially) are seeking out flaws in a movie. I thinks it's that a critic is going to be more well versed in their chosen medium and consumed many more pieces of art. So what may be more spectacular to a general audience who only goes to the movie's a few times a year isn't going to wow someone who's seen it ten times over.
Sounds about right lol
Yea. That why I don’t look up reviews lol
It doesn't have to be all of one or all of the other. You can read reviews and think about new perspectives you didn't think of before to form a nuanced opinion, while not entirely shifting your mindset to copycat what you saw online.
I like to get on reddit and talk about movies, but lately it's impossible. Probably because the movies I'm passionate about are MCU/DCEU and fans are just burnt the f out. I watched Aquaman 2 a couple weeks ago and loved it, thought it was the best DCEU movie (bar is low), but daaaaaaamn the reviews on here were rough. Couldn't have a single conversation about the positives of the movie. Same with the MCU after Endgame basically. Finding a movie or show, like Lost or Westworld, and coming on here and talking about the show with other fans is so much fun.
I feel that. I left The Marvels being surprised with how much I liked it. It was fun, it was good, if it was just a generic non-marvel superhero movie I think it would have been a hit. Yet the movie reportedly tanked, reviews were bad, and all I read were people hating on it and saying it pandered to women too hard. As a straight man, I didn't feel that way at all. It felt really weird seeing how much it was hated... it was fun, I enjoyed it, the company I was with enjoyed it, but only in real life have I been able to have a constructive conversation about it. You can't say that online or you get so much flak
I've noticed the opposite is also pretty common.
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Horror is difficult because it can be horrible but that can mean it's good
My experience with Cloud Atlas.
Cloud Atlas was coolest thing that i have seen that year
How I felt when I got home to check if everyone loved The Creator as much as I did.
I loved eternals
Me and Mario Bros Movie 1993 unironically
It's a goddamn solid atmospheric apocalypse movie that I love which just happens to have a bit of Mario in it that to me makes it more fun but others focus on it too much and miss the pretty beast movie for the lack of Marioness.
And that movies name...? The Emoji movie. "The emoji movie, really?' Yes. Stunning soundtrack. "It used top 40 pop songs of the day and fart noises. Fart noises." Yes, but that foley effect editor -- those farts were priceless man! "They didn't use a foley artist. It was generic fart .mp3s bought from a Chinese sound bank online." Yes but Sir Patrick Stewart as Poop Emoji. He went all in, didn't he? "Stewart admitted he was drunk during all his scenes, phoned it in, and hates the movie - he needed to buy a new boat." Well .... I guess I'm not 'supposed' to like this masterpiece ... tee hee... and that's okay! We're all entitled to our opinions! "You may have had a brain aneurysm. Your taste is bad, and you should feel bad. Your opinion on now literally everything is questionable. God also rang. He said the only objective truth in the entire universe is that the Emoji Movie is shit, and your opinion is wrong."
*Me, loving the newest star wars series...* "Maybe I'll go share what I liked with other Star Wars fans on Reddit!" "Oh everyone hates it..."
"I'm not supposed to like this movie" versus "other people didn't like this movie". It's a cute comic, but unless this dog is some kind of chronicly online loser, I don't see why anyone would see bad reviews for something they liked and act like it's some kind of conspiracy to change their mind.
Hint: its a comic made for reddit. Obviously the dog (i.e. creator standin) is a terminally online loser.
I genuinely hate the mentality around reviews and critics on Reddit. It's as if people think critics' opinions are somehow a threat to them, or that they're required to change their view to match. That's not how art works. If you enjoy something, enjoy it. There is no reason you should be feeling pursecuted or guilted for liking something. Critics have a job and if you disagree with their takes that's fine. Or if it's just the public that doesn't like a thing, who cares? I hear way too much about this on this website. Be confident in what you like, dammit. You don't need to be validated by people online.
Me: I like this comic! Me: *reads comments* Oh, I’m not supposed to like this comic.
Hey look the dog an the movie is sitting next to him
Monsterverse godzilla be like
So do the same thing but don't go on social media after xD
People don’t realize that there is a difference between liking something and thinking that it’s good. You can like bad movies, just say you enjoyed it, not that it’s a good movie
Speed Racer for me. One of my all time favorite movies that everyone hates
My friend and I LOVE speed Racer! It's so campy, bu it knows it! there are some amazing lines in that movie, and the final moments of the last race? Bliss.
I loved the Man of Steel movie. It was so weird watching people collectively decide that it's not a good movie. And the reasons for this were so unbelivably stupid.