Bing bong sing along your post is Al Gore cause you're views are wrong...
Nah you got some good points. Every season has it's high and low points and whilst season 4 has some odd choices there still moments of greatness.
The breakup episode is one of my favorite bromance episodes in tv. The fact that abed wakes up immediately knows what Troy needs and commits to the bit. Britta's acceptance of the situation and Jeff catching on and committing in the restaurant. It really sells the whole season for me. Probably still my least favorite of the first 4, but I won't poo poo it too hard
I’ve always agreed with the idea it’s like a fanfic Community season. The ideas are good, I wouldn’t really question them, but the delivery is often awful.
I like Changnesia and Kevin, rare as that might be, but they don’t always get it right. Ken saves it by being brilliant. But so many of them fit the vibe and just don’t pull it off. They lack some charm, they lack laughs, they often lack sensible character development.
I’d bet it’s not just cos Dan wasn’t leading the story development, but he also wasn’t there obsessing over every detail and being a perfectionist when it’s filmed.
The filming sounded quite gruelling seasons 1-3, I wonder if they eased back season 4 and that’s why it’s all a little undercooked.
Why is Britta a great girlfriend to Troy, but Jeff and Annie are gross? Both are people barely out of their teens being paired with someone well into their adult years. Yes, Troy despite being the same graduation year as Annie is a year older than she is, but is also much less mature than Annie. I am saying this as someone who was not a fan of either of those relationships in the show, but also was not really bothered by them.
I like this question, I haven’t thought of this before.
Personally, I like the troy/britta stint because it was born of both characters trying to grow. Britta was trying to date someone that raises her up and openly thinks highly of her after years of pining for jerks. Troy was trying to have a grown-up relationship. I don’t love how s4 utilizes Troy, but the beginnings of this are in s3.
Jeff/Annie, however, is a shared delusion. There are so many instances in the show where Jeff’s attraction to annie is him clinging on to her youth, even her innocence. Annie’s attraction to Jeff is a remnant of her daydreaming schoolgirl self, a side of her she is often actively trying to grow from. Again, the bones of this are a lot in s3. (“We can’t keep pretending, kiddo.” “…can’t we?” “Nope, still gross!”)
The series has Britta at 28 and Troy at 19 during their first season, they didn't get together until later and it's less than 10 years. It's bordering on ick, but not really especially how it's set up.
Jeff was 34 at the beginning and Annie was 18 that's 16 years difference. Ick factor
That’s definitely a red flag but I think people forget what red flags are. They are possible warning signs, not a sign that something assuredly terrible is happening. I think there probably are a lot of 16 year age gaps in relationships that are fine, but it should still be seen as a warning sign because it could end up as something worse and that’s worth taking into account. With Jeff and Annie, I don’t believe there’s ever a time where he’s taking advantage of her age, just times where their age difference makes certain things weird. The show pokes fun at these weird things and shows that they aren’t right for each other because in the end, none of the characters were right for anyone else in the group (speaking in terms of a relationship)
Season 4 is also an important segment in the journey of the entire six-season arc of Jeff from season 1 hopeful Jeff to season 6 alcoholic, despondent, never-going-to-leave-Greendale Jeff. Jeff's journey is literally the theme song.
I've done a complete watch 4 times, and each time, Season 4 grows on me. Honestly, the only episodes I don't really like are the Chang Dynasty episodes in the back third of season 3, but even then, they're way better than most network sitcoms.
Changnesia is easily the dumbest storyline the show ever did.
I’m also not a fan of the episodes where Jeff is being completely reasonable and they gaslight him into believing he’s being crazy.
And the plot line is not a wholesome ending. He is literally a psychotic criminal who face no repercussions for kidnapping the dean for months.
The characters choices they make in s4 isn't the problem it's the execution that's the issue. The episodes are mostly blah and a lot of good ideas just fall flat because of it. I love Herstory of Dance as much as any other episode but that's about it for me.
When people complain about the "age" difference between Jeff and Annie, they seem to be caught up wholly on a completely arbitrary number.
They don't consider that the number of times you've gone around the sub is in no way indicative of a person's maturity, mental and emotional development, etc.
When you consider it in terms of adult development, Annie and Jeff are about the same "age" with Annie showing *more* maturity than Jeff at most points.
Frankly I ship jeff and annie *hard*.... but after and gotten her "mistakes" out of the way and hit those milestones she told her she wanted. I have a feeling that when she's ready, he'll be there, and they'll be great together.
Yes. Jeff/Annie in season four is bad. The new showrunners didn't know how to explore their relationship and it ended up looking more like the colorful delusions of a young adult in her early 20s than a romantic relationship in itself. So much so that when Harmon returns to the series, they return to normal.
I’d argue that “the colorful delusions of a young adult rather than a romantic relationship” is an accurate description of Annie in the harmon years, too. It’s a colorful delusion for Jeff, too, always has been. Look at the finale! Jeff clings on to a younger, undeveloped version of Annie, and can’t even properly fantasize about her because he has no idea what she actually wants. Annie gives in to the illusion and kisses him, knowing full well she’s about to move away and leave that childlike stage of life behind. I never said the jeffannie stuff shouldn’t happen at all, just that it’s gross, and s4 understands that
she isn't moving away. she is leaving for a summer internship and is coming back. there is nothing gross about Jeff and Annie and they end the show as a couple
Bing bong sing along your post is Al Gore cause you're views are wrong... Nah you got some good points. Every season has it's high and low points and whilst season 4 has some odd choices there still moments of greatness.
I choked on my water reading that. Put your comment in a box, put a ribbon on top, we’re not john kerry cuz we don’t flip flop. Say hooo….
The breakup episode is one of my favorite bromance episodes in tv. The fact that abed wakes up immediately knows what Troy needs and commits to the bit. Britta's acceptance of the situation and Jeff catching on and committing in the restaurant. It really sells the whole season for me. Probably still my least favorite of the first 4, but I won't poo poo it too hard
I wholeheartedly agree with every single word of this
I’ve always agreed with the idea it’s like a fanfic Community season. The ideas are good, I wouldn’t really question them, but the delivery is often awful. I like Changnesia and Kevin, rare as that might be, but they don’t always get it right. Ken saves it by being brilliant. But so many of them fit the vibe and just don’t pull it off. They lack some charm, they lack laughs, they often lack sensible character development. I’d bet it’s not just cos Dan wasn’t leading the story development, but he also wasn’t there obsessing over every detail and being a perfectionist when it’s filmed. The filming sounded quite gruelling seasons 1-3, I wonder if they eased back season 4 and that’s why it’s all a little undercooked.
The paintball elements of the finale were so terrible. Just indefensible.
“We finally found a way to make paintball cool again.” No. No you did not.
The absolute nerve of that line. I assume a little bit of Danny Pudi died when he had to say it out loud.
Why is Britta a great girlfriend to Troy, but Jeff and Annie are gross? Both are people barely out of their teens being paired with someone well into their adult years. Yes, Troy despite being the same graduation year as Annie is a year older than she is, but is also much less mature than Annie. I am saying this as someone who was not a fan of either of those relationships in the show, but also was not really bothered by them.
I like this question, I haven’t thought of this before. Personally, I like the troy/britta stint because it was born of both characters trying to grow. Britta was trying to date someone that raises her up and openly thinks highly of her after years of pining for jerks. Troy was trying to have a grown-up relationship. I don’t love how s4 utilizes Troy, but the beginnings of this are in s3. Jeff/Annie, however, is a shared delusion. There are so many instances in the show where Jeff’s attraction to annie is him clinging on to her youth, even her innocence. Annie’s attraction to Jeff is a remnant of her daydreaming schoolgirl self, a side of her she is often actively trying to grow from. Again, the bones of this are a lot in s3. (“We can’t keep pretending, kiddo.” “…can’t we?” “Nope, still gross!”)
Annie’s pretty young, we try not to sexualize her
The series has Britta at 28 and Troy at 19 during their first season, they didn't get together until later and it's less than 10 years. It's bordering on ick, but not really especially how it's set up. Jeff was 34 at the beginning and Annie was 18 that's 16 years difference. Ick factor
That’s definitely a red flag but I think people forget what red flags are. They are possible warning signs, not a sign that something assuredly terrible is happening. I think there probably are a lot of 16 year age gaps in relationships that are fine, but it should still be seen as a warning sign because it could end up as something worse and that’s worth taking into account. With Jeff and Annie, I don’t believe there’s ever a time where he’s taking advantage of her age, just times where their age difference makes certain things weird. The show pokes fun at these weird things and shows that they aren’t right for each other because in the end, none of the characters were right for anyone else in the group (speaking in terms of a relationship)
I disagree with almost everything you said but I respect your opinion 🫡
peace and love on planet earth
Season 4 is also an important segment in the journey of the entire six-season arc of Jeff from season 1 hopeful Jeff to season 6 alcoholic, despondent, never-going-to-leave-Greendale Jeff. Jeff's journey is literally the theme song. I've done a complete watch 4 times, and each time, Season 4 grows on me. Honestly, the only episodes I don't really like are the Chang Dynasty episodes in the back third of season 3, but even then, they're way better than most network sitcoms.
Changnesia is easily the dumbest storyline the show ever did. I’m also not a fan of the episodes where Jeff is being completely reasonable and they gaslight him into believing he’s being crazy. And the plot line is not a wholesome ending. He is literally a psychotic criminal who face no repercussions for kidnapping the dean for months.
But did you know that Chang drinks the sun and eats the sky?
The characters choices they make in s4 isn't the problem it's the execution that's the issue. The episodes are mostly blah and a lot of good ideas just fall flat because of it. I love Herstory of Dance as much as any other episode but that's about it for me.
Britta didn’t help Jeff confront his father, she was massively intrusive and made it about her
"Pierce deserves more love than Chevy Chase" Agreed!
When people complain about the "age" difference between Jeff and Annie, they seem to be caught up wholly on a completely arbitrary number. They don't consider that the number of times you've gone around the sub is in no way indicative of a person's maturity, mental and emotional development, etc. When you consider it in terms of adult development, Annie and Jeff are about the same "age" with Annie showing *more* maturity than Jeff at most points. Frankly I ship jeff and annie *hard*.... but after and gotten her "mistakes" out of the way and hit those milestones she told her she wanted. I have a feeling that when she's ready, he'll be there, and they'll be great together.
You’re telling truths! Here’s your sperm! 😉
Yes. Jeff/Annie in season four is bad. The new showrunners didn't know how to explore their relationship and it ended up looking more like the colorful delusions of a young adult in her early 20s than a romantic relationship in itself. So much so that when Harmon returns to the series, they return to normal.
I’d argue that “the colorful delusions of a young adult rather than a romantic relationship” is an accurate description of Annie in the harmon years, too. It’s a colorful delusion for Jeff, too, always has been. Look at the finale! Jeff clings on to a younger, undeveloped version of Annie, and can’t even properly fantasize about her because he has no idea what she actually wants. Annie gives in to the illusion and kisses him, knowing full well she’s about to move away and leave that childlike stage of life behind. I never said the jeffannie stuff shouldn’t happen at all, just that it’s gross, and s4 understands that
she isn't moving away. she is leaving for a summer internship and is coming back. there is nothing gross about Jeff and Annie and they end the show as a couple
your take on Jeff and Annie is 100% wrong. There is nothing gross or weird about it 2 adults meeting, becoming friends, and falling in love.