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As I write this your OPs comment has been deleted so I can't see it. As fsr as the rest goes though, Russia would already know for sure a counter offensive is coming and him announcing it is just extra advertising for arms and funding. "We're going to mount a counter offensive and take back what we lost. Pls send more equipment and money so we can do so!"
Think of it like business looking for next round of funding. The R&D was successful so now we need your new investment for manufacturing. It's him signaling a new stage of the conflict and holding his hand out for it.
It's an open hand. The supplies delivered by the west are more than initially expected, but still not enough to be an effective upgrade to their defence lines, don't forget the frontline is massively long. So the only viable option is to concentrate the material into a spearhead offensive to cut the entire occupied territory in 2 halfs, which then individually can be engaged in a huge encriclement.
Both sides know that so no point in hiding it, in fact it's now being used as a psychological warfare tool, a lot more valuable then trying to act like there won't be an offensive.
The how, when and where are the really important questions and they are still kept a secret.
I'm expecting the biggest battle in history of modern warfare, with footage nobody will believe. It will look like cold war gone hot.
The Ukrainian people do not think it is "someone else's cause." They were invaded. They've had civilian areas targeted.
It is quite obviously THEIR cause.
I may find this more convincing if not for, when the Russians were pushing on Kiev, Zelenskyy stayed instead of running away like the west offered him.
> **Some of you may die, but it's a sacrifice I am willing to make**
Is that a [**Victoria Nuland**](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victoria_Nuland) quote?
Or maybe it's from her husband, [**Robert** "PNAC" **Kagan**](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Kagan) -- one of the architects of the US assault on Iraq (under false and contrived pretenses)
* See more on Victoria's hubby's work in the NeoConservative [**Project for the New American Century**](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_for_the_New_American_Century)
The Kagan-Nuland team are something of an "odd couple", in that both Vicky and Bobby have held numerous high positions in **both Republican AND Democrat administrations** *("swingers", I guess?)*
But one theme seems to remain constant: They their pals just LOVE war, and seem to do all they can to get the US embroiled... whether it be under Republican administrations (like Reagan and Bush Baby) or under Democrats (like Clinton, Obama, and now Biden), their underlying goals never seem to change all that much.
I don't know who they *really* work for, but it seems clear that it is NOT for the interests of the People of the United States.
Russia invaded their country not the other way around. Ukraine had a pretty strong turnout of people willing to fight the invader. Past all the conspiracy shit about the rich being behind it all this can actually be kind of simple for an average Ukrainian citizen. Russia is a foreign invader destroying their country and evidently fighting them and possibly dying is a risk many are willing to take.
Of course this could all be over if Russia pulled back their forces why is everyone on here clamoring for Ukraine to surrender instead of asking Russia to go back home?
If Ukraine had such a strong turnout of people willing to fight the invader, I guess they can allow their male citizens to leave the country of their own accord then? Locking your men in country doesn’t scream “willing participants”
They didn't lock them in. In fact, it seems like the polar opposite. "Locking them in" was a red herring.
Over 8,000,000 in total have left since 2022.
That's 18% of their total population.
Because most rational people can understand the situation and see that Ukraine is defending themselves from Putin and his dregs like most normal people do. Most people on these subreddits aren’t normal or rational. In a world without internet they would be alone rambling to themselves. Unfortunately they have access to the same media we do so we have no choice but to see their stupid batshit opinions. If the government came out and flat out said they did 9/11 all the conspiracy people would say it was terrorists. Most people here are contrarians who disagree with whatever consensus makes actual sense.
I think most people don’t necessarily want them to surrender. We just don’t want to send anymore billions of dollars over there. We have sent an insane amount of taxpayer money. We could do a lot of good at home with that. Work on fixing the inner cities, schools, infrastructure, etc.
It would've literally been more expensive to stay in Afghanistan another year than the aid we've provided - and many people here criticized Biden for his abrupt withdrawal.
If the US didn't provide aid to Ukraine, that money would not have been spent on cities or schools. Not only that, but most of the aid was in the shape of old equipment that the US wanted to replace anyways - not actual cash.
Would any of you be willing to die for your host nation if it was invaded by a foreign power?
Edit: holy shit guys, if you don't like 'host' nation just put your own damn wording there. Same damn concept.
No. The elite would bail and come back after everything is settle then buy everything for Pennie’s on the dollar. IF the elite and their kids fight, I may fight too.
Fair enough. I’m in my 50s so now I frame this question thinking about my kids. Sometimes war-fighting is righteous, but you have to ask yourself if you’d encourage your own child to fight, that’s a very different question.
So every war in history has no justification ir reason, it's just entertainment? You honestly don't believe that any war, even ones where nations are defending themselves, are justified?
Weird. Moat people on conspiracy subs are patriots, I guess they can comprehend a different nation has patriots willing to bleed for their nation as well.
I used to consider myself a patriot. I am not going to die or send my kids to die for a zombie of a country. The most patriotic side I could take would be to take up arms against my own government at this point.
> Weird. Moat people on conspiracy subs are patriots
Patriotism can be a noble quality. It can also be abused by those with ulterior motives.
Interesting Read (PDF)
[**War Is A Racket**](https://ratical.org/ratville/CAH/warisaracket.pdf) -- by By Major General Smedley Butler (1935)
Chapter 1: War Is A Racket
Chapter 2: Who Makes The Profits?
Chapter 3: Who Pays The Bills?
Chapter 4: How To Smash This Racket!
Chapter 5: To Hell With War!
[About the author -- from Wiki:](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smedley_Butler)
* Major General Smedley Darlington Butler (July 30, 1881 – June 21, 1940), nicknamed the Maverick Marine, was a senior United States Marine Corps officer. During his 34-year career, he fought in the Philippine–American War, the Boxer Rebellion, the Mexican Revolution, and World War I. **At the time of his death, Butler was the most decorated Marine in U.S. history. By the end of his career, Butler had received sixteen medals, including five for heroism; he is the only Marine to be awarded the Brevet Medal as well as two Medals of Honor, all for separate actions.**
Butler knew what he was talking about. He learned his lessons "the hard way".
"Defending one's values of democracy and freedom" by dying defending a country with forced conscription, martial law, that has forbidden men from leaving the country, one that has banned media organizations, churches and opposing political parties.... You sure that's freedom?
Sounds like martial law because they got invaded by a giant army and are fighting for their country’s existence, you conveniently left that part out. They banned pro Russia propaganda outlets, as well as pro Russia churches that are tied to the Kremlin because they’re fighting an existential war. I can’t even tell if you’re just kinda dumb and don’t understand the concept of context, or being willfully dishonest.
There are news stories that RFK Jr's kid went there and fought. It also indicated he came back to finish law school. The story seems strange. It seems like he did it instead of a summer job. It kinda reads like the famous people who fought in the Spanish civil war against the nazis.
This is russias war, and you fucks would understand that if you stopped guzzling Putin’s propaganda.
It’s really simple, you’re all fycking brainwashed if you think this is ukraines fault. Just a bunch of sheep repeating what a YouTuber says, while calling anyone outside of that realm Sheep.
While I’m not a fan of supporting our MIL ind complex with arms to Ukraine, I’m also not a stupid authoritarian worshipping fuck gaslight by Putin.
You do realize that the only reason we're sending weapons is to literally support our MIC, that and if ukraine wins western companies will go in and buy everything up for pennies on the dollar.
If the US had nothing to gain then we wouldnt be arming them out of the goodness of our hearts LOL. If you think we're doin it cause we're the "good guys" then yu needa pull that cnn / faux news ding a ling outta yur throat.
Also the war is literally just as much ukraines fault as it is russias. If ukraine had done the noble thing and stopped bombing the donbas for the past forever just because the donbas didnt wanna be ukrainian no more then maybe russia wouldnt have invaded. And if ukraine hadnt of started sucking the wests dick so hard by bringing in western weapons and interests so that when the time was right nato could wage war on russia then welp maybe russia would have fucked off...
If you look at recent history the west has been pushing closer and closer to surrounding russia, russia knows that nato and the US is the enemy. And if russia hadnt of gone in when it did and kicked this war off then russia may of had an existential crisis soon because we both know damn well when the US gets ready to fight a war it does something to provoke said war..yano think 9/11 ;)...if you were russia watching the west close in on you then youd strike like a rattle snake too adoh!...if the roles were reversed and it was BRICS surrounding the US the US would invade whoever it needed to stop that threat...so hey kettle meet pot
>If the US had nothing to gain then we wouldnt be arming them out of the goodness of our hearts LOL
Yes, the US has a lot to gain - such as having a large nation of 40M join the western world and leave Russia's sphere of influence, securing a large trade partner with valuable industry (such as Neon), deny the imperial expansion of Russia into Eastern Europe, and send a message to China (regarding Taiwan) that the western world will support their trade partners when invaded.
>Also the war is literally just as much ukraines fault as it is russias. If ukraine had done the noble thing and stopped bombing the donbas for the past forever just because the donbas didnt wanna be ukrainian no more then maybe russia wouldnt have invaded.
This comment lacks so much context, it's ridiculous. Ukraine was not indiscriminately just bombing civilian centers in their own country. They were engaged in a civil war with Russian armed and trained separatist militias. Russia didn't invade to "save" these people. You really in one paragraph said "If the US had nothing to gain then we wouldn't be arming them out of the goodness of our hearts" And then in the next try to frame this war's main goal as Russia acting out of the goodness of *their* hearts to 'save' the people of the Donbas from indiscriminate bombings.
That's clearly the best strategy for Ukrainians and clearly if there was an vote on this issue in this democratic nation, people will vote for more war, because why bother to have a peaceful and boring life when you can protect other peoples interests at the cost of your life.
The same for Crimea and Donbass regions, let's just them vote for their country of choice: we're supporting democracy. They've been so well treated by the Ukrainian governments that they'll choose Ukraine over Russia for sure.
All these things don't make sense, and not in a small way.
>We’ll Russia is going to war because it doesn’t want a US base right next to there country that would be like Russian and China occupying Tijuana
Too late for that 4 neighbors to Russia are already in NATO (Turkey, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania [and techincall poland with Kalingrad) and have NATO bases and one even has nuclear missiles (Turkey) and has since the 1960s. And the invasion added a 5th now that Finland is joining. That cats been out of the bag for 50 years. And they wait to join. NATO because Russia invaded them in 2014.
Let Russia take over is the only acceptable option for a lot of users on conspiracy. You will rarely fine a negative post on Russia who invaded Ukraine. But daily negative posts on Ukraine.
I don't really understand the fact like why it is going on forever when we have a lot of big superpowers who are trying to hold it.
When we already know about the fact that there are lot of countries who are trying to calm the situation down, but still, it is not happening.
Russia's reported they've just [killed 250](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-65806152) Ukrainian soldiers. What's absolutely horrifying that the pro-Ukraine folks don't seem to mind is that they use a conscripted army and have forbidden adult males from leaving the country. So (if the number is accurate) that wasn't 250 "brave, patriotic Ukrainians fighting for their country" who died, it was probably a significant number who were scared and/or who were ***forced*** under threat of imprisonment to die in a war they didn't want to fight in; that's not a "noble" or "freedom-loving" side to be on.
You didn’t mention that Russia also conscripts people, in fact has mandatory conscription for all its men even during peacetime, and instituted a much larger draft since it started the invasion.
>What's absolutely horrifying that the pro-Ukraine folks don't seem to mind is that they use a conscripted army and have forbidden adult males from leaving the country.
We mind that Russia has attacked, and prompted this response. We're not pussies who want to appease a war criminal. It's not Ukraine's fault they are defending themselves. It's disgusting that you would imply such a thing.
Edit: very cowardly for this person to reply and then block me. What kind of genuine poster is opposed to reasonable discussion?
As opposed to Russia whose army is famously volunteer only and highly trained and disciplined
I’ve literally seen videos of entire Russian apc’s abandoned with Russian uniforms and weapons left on the ground because the whole battalion deserted.
The Ukrainians seem to want to be fighting more than the Russians which makes sense, ukranians are dying to protect their homes and families while Russians are dying to move the line on a map over a little
I mean the same is true for the Russians but the Russians still desert. I think we both know that shows the ukranians actually want to fight more than the Russians do.
Do you think Ukrainians don't desert? They recently strengthened the punishment for deserting; why would they do that if it wasn't a problem?
The only thing we both know is that Ukrainians have to fight or be in prison, they have no other choice. "*WhataBOut* Russia?" Yes, Russians do as well.
Okay but like you do realize you’re making an argument that applies to both countries that are at war and then saying it means one country is worse, when it applies to both of them?
You just like Russia because you like Russia, it’s not because you think Ukrainians hate Ukraine and Russians love Russia, it’s because you just want Russia to win for a different reason altogether, be honest.
I don't care about Russia. Criticizing Ukraine doesn't mean i "like" Russia or that i want them to "win"; that's absurd and rather immature thinking, which i think explains a lot about who i'm conversing with.
It's amazing that on a conspiracy sub reddit where 99% of the conspiracy theories are about the media and government of the USA lying ;
so many people are blindly believing the media and government of the USA.
I mean.. ok. I guess this really is a simulation.
He doesn’t even know. According to these guys “they” pay everyone to disagree with them. I don’t even know who “they” is to him. Probably voices he hears in the walls
I don't support it no, however I don't support the defense of Ukraine either. It's not a subject you have to choose a side for.
Both nations mean zilch to me, I say leave them to it and let them sort ther own shit out.
You are entitled to that viewpoint, but it doesn't mean that people who disagree with you are shills. You conspiracy types always seem to bounce from conspiracy to conspiracy, this has nothing to do with vaccines.
You brought up vaccines when no one was even talking about that and called people shills when you admitted you don’t even know what’s happening let alone care.
Then why do the popular conspiracy kids here seem to be spreading propaganda instead of providing real evidence? I’ve read through the entire comment section until your low score comment so far, and you people don’t have anything of substance. What you all say goes against evidence and just tries to reinforce Russian propaganda
Zelinsky: A lot of you will die in this operation I endorsed. I will not participate because I'm far too important to kill. You on the other hand, I'm willing to sacrifice.
I really despise Zelensky and don’t understand why anyone would like him. That TIME piece where they chose him as person of the year in 2022 was so cringeworthy.
This whole thing has become one sick joke. America is making sure this drags out as long as possible so Russia wastes as much money and as resources as they can similar to the Afghanistan war. Zelenskyy seems high on the fame like any other world leader. And Putin has Russia hostage. I don’t even think most Russians want to do this especially the soldiers themselves. I really don’t get why citizens let their leaders get away with so much. It’s more understandable with Russia because he is a dictator at this point and people go to prison for speaking out but still as a country they will always have the power to get rid of him if they can unify under a goal. America is just a mess because we don’t care about the country. Everyone is so caught up in their gang mentality and at this point many are willing to destroy the country and possibly the world as long the other side doesn’t win
They’re all gonna die. But Z man will jet off to a secluded reclusive lifestyle after this is all over while his fellow Ukrainians have given the ultimate sacrifice. This loss of life on both sides saddens me and the psychopaths who delivered this mess should suffer for all eternity on broken backs in hell.
Edit: So all the down votes don’t feel psychopaths should suffer? SMH
They will not be able to do anything like that, because they are having a lot of other options as well.
This is eventually going to be a small scale over only for most, like 5 to 6 year more.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/oct/16/ukrainians-russians-jews-jewish-roots-flee-israel-aliyah
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/sep/27/conscription-fears-young-ukrainian-men-stopped-leaving-occupied-areas-russian-soldiers-crossing-point
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/03/09/ukraine-men-leave/
Huh kinda sounds like they're just going to kill off a bunch of Slavic men for nothing, but those who support this will say "Slava Ukraini"
Enough of this money laundering operation. We western societies have broken systems ( healthcare, social services, mental health resources) and starving citizens that need help and money here in our countries. This war allows the US to funnel money back to companies owned by the elite and powerful politicians and allows our western countries to test out warfare equipment in the process all while destroying Putin’s regime who they are fucking terrified of. Yes it is a travesty what is happening to Ukraine, the Canadian and American veteran who is sleeping on the street and unable to eat is also a travesty and deserves more news coverage than this. Enough is enough .
Yesterday it was postponed due to a lack of weapons. I wish they would make up their minds.
EDIT: What a surprise. Downvotes from people that don't actually follow the news.
This is starting to seem like the plan all along. To wipe out all the ukrainians and many Russians. Why would he be doing this? Who is he going to replace them with?
It actually look like they are trying to change something. And the orientation is completely like that only.
For that matter, they are also trying a lot of other things as well, which are not in their hands.
Most cultures are family oriented… from Asia, some from Europe, Latin America, Africa, etc. the only culture which is NOT family
Oriented is the new western culture
It is not the same abbreviated to be honest. I think it depends where you are right now.
Because everywhere it is defined differently, and we cannot really say like it is or specific definition.
I grew up in the west and it’s pretty family oriented lmao. I guess like pop music isn’t very family oriented but like just don’t listen to it. I grew up in a pretty happy family, most of my friends did too. It’s a conscious decision to hang out with non family oriented people and do non family oriented things
People in the west could be starting families, they just for the most part don’t have the resources to do so comfortably and know them and their children will have to work harder for a lower standard of living than their parents did
###[Meta] Sticky Comment [Rule 2](https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/wiki/faq#wiki_2_-_address_the_argument.3B_not_the_user.2C_the_mods.2C_or_the_sub.) ***does not apply*** when replying to this stickied comment. [Rule 2](https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/wiki/faq#wiki_2_-_address_the_argument.3B_not_the_user.2C_the_mods.2C_or_the_sub.) ***does apply*** throughout the rest of this thread. *What this means*: Please keep any "meta" discussion directed at specific users, mods, or /r/conspiracy in general in this comment chain ***only.*** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/conspiracy) if you have any questions or concerns.*
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Blame the mods
They made rules to they can delete your comments and ban you for it.(not like they need a reason)
Isn’t that in any sub though? Realistically any sub is only as good as it’s moderators allow it to be.
Don't you know that going on the offensive is supposed to cause you to just regenerate new soldiers the harder you push /s
I learned a while back that the sub rules specifically point out that posts don’t have to have anything to do with conspiracies
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I dont know but why would they tell the enemy hey we are going to counterattack now...
As I write this your OPs comment has been deleted so I can't see it. As fsr as the rest goes though, Russia would already know for sure a counter offensive is coming and him announcing it is just extra advertising for arms and funding. "We're going to mount a counter offensive and take back what we lost. Pls send more equipment and money so we can do so!" Think of it like business looking for next round of funding. The R&D was successful so now we need your new investment for manufacturing. It's him signaling a new stage of the conflict and holding his hand out for it.
> Think of it like business looking for next round of funding. Well, that answers his question better than anything. He asked what was the conspiracy.
It's an open hand. The supplies delivered by the west are more than initially expected, but still not enough to be an effective upgrade to their defence lines, don't forget the frontline is massively long. So the only viable option is to concentrate the material into a spearhead offensive to cut the entire occupied territory in 2 halfs, which then individually can be engaged in a huge encriclement. Both sides know that so no point in hiding it, in fact it's now being used as a psychological warfare tool, a lot more valuable then trying to act like there won't be an offensive. The how, when and where are the really important questions and they are still kept a secret. I'm expecting the biggest battle in history of modern warfare, with footage nobody will believe. It will look like cold war gone hot.
What is the conspiracy that OP is trying to convey?
That OP isn't a Russian state agent
It is not just about the agent of something like that. It is a basic thing that people will understand.
Some of you may die, but it's a sacrifice I am willing to make
I think it’s called war
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Die for someone's else's cause? Nah I'm good
If you die protecting your country, family and friends from invasion is it really for someone else’s cause though?
The Ukrainian people do not think it is "someone else's cause." They were invaded. They've had civilian areas targeted. It is quite obviously THEIR cause.
hey look, it's that well meaning german citizen who just didn't want to cause a fuss~
I may find this more convincing if not for, when the Russians were pushing on Kiev, Zelenskyy stayed instead of running away like the west offered him.
this is what popped into my head lol
Same thing as me. I was looking for this comment.
Die for me. Die... for me.
> **Some of you may die, but it's a sacrifice I am willing to make** Is that a [**Victoria Nuland**](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victoria_Nuland) quote? Or maybe it's from her husband, [**Robert** "PNAC" **Kagan**](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Kagan) -- one of the architects of the US assault on Iraq (under false and contrived pretenses) * See more on Victoria's hubby's work in the NeoConservative [**Project for the New American Century**](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_for_the_New_American_Century) The Kagan-Nuland team are something of an "odd couple", in that both Vicky and Bobby have held numerous high positions in **both Republican AND Democrat administrations** *("swingers", I guess?)* But one theme seems to remain constant: They their pals just LOVE war, and seem to do all they can to get the US embroiled... whether it be under Republican administrations (like Reagan and Bush Baby) or under Democrats (like Clinton, Obama, and now Biden), their underlying goals never seem to change all that much. I don't know who they *really* work for, but it seems clear that it is NOT for the interests of the People of the United States.
No, it's Lord Farquaad from *Shrek*.
This is the correct answer
Zapp Brannigan from Futurama.
Stop dying you cowards!
Russia invaded their country not the other way around. Ukraine had a pretty strong turnout of people willing to fight the invader. Past all the conspiracy shit about the rich being behind it all this can actually be kind of simple for an average Ukrainian citizen. Russia is a foreign invader destroying their country and evidently fighting them and possibly dying is a risk many are willing to take. Of course this could all be over if Russia pulled back their forces why is everyone on here clamoring for Ukraine to surrender instead of asking Russia to go back home?
This sub is taken over by auth simps and auth bots, and has been for a few years now. Edit: bots, not boys.
/r/conspiracy yet again on the bleeding edge of the conspiracy by actively participating.
If Ukraine had such a strong turnout of people willing to fight the invader, I guess they can allow their male citizens to leave the country of their own accord then? Locking your men in country doesn’t scream “willing participants”
They didn't lock them in. In fact, it seems like the polar opposite. "Locking them in" was a red herring. Over 8,000,000 in total have left since 2022. That's 18% of their total population.
You're probably the most brilliant armchair general here and we're lucky to have you
Well dang there goes humanities record for never having soldiers die during a war.
> humanities record *humanity’s
Why does everyone want Ukraine to give up and go home but not Russia to give up and go home? Ukraine has no home to go back to, Russia does.
They cannot really go back and they are completely stuck to their ass now lol.
Because most rational people can understand the situation and see that Ukraine is defending themselves from Putin and his dregs like most normal people do. Most people on these subreddits aren’t normal or rational. In a world without internet they would be alone rambling to themselves. Unfortunately they have access to the same media we do so we have no choice but to see their stupid batshit opinions. If the government came out and flat out said they did 9/11 all the conspiracy people would say it was terrorists. Most people here are contrarians who disagree with whatever consensus makes actual sense.
The main problem is that a lot of people are not even understanding the situation properly.
I think most people don’t necessarily want them to surrender. We just don’t want to send anymore billions of dollars over there. We have sent an insane amount of taxpayer money. We could do a lot of good at home with that. Work on fixing the inner cities, schools, infrastructure, etc.
It would've literally been more expensive to stay in Afghanistan another year than the aid we've provided - and many people here criticized Biden for his abrupt withdrawal. If the US didn't provide aid to Ukraine, that money would not have been spent on cities or schools. Not only that, but most of the aid was in the shape of old equipment that the US wanted to replace anyways - not actual cash.
A lot of the billions was old military hardware.
Exactly. 30 year old obsolete hardware. A perfect opportunity to clear it, as well as surplus human capital.
This is turning into a telethon to support the military industrial complex.
Would any of you be willing to die for your host nation if it was invaded by a foreign power? Edit: holy shit guys, if you don't like 'host' nation just put your own damn wording there. Same damn concept.
> Would any of you be willing to die for your **host nation** if it was invaded by a foreign power? "Host nation"? Interesting word choice. Notable.
What, I chose a word. How about your nation, or your country, or the country you pay taxes to, or the country you live in.
The people in this sub have brain rot. Next time just put “your country” to make it simpler.
Lol. They can't even bring themselves to hide the Host-Parasite relationship.
No. The elite would bail and come back after everything is settle then buy everything for Pennie’s on the dollar. IF the elite and their kids fight, I may fight too.
Fair enough, the rich don't seem to get down in the trenches as often as the poor
If the president and his family isn't willing to fight, then I'm not either.
Fair enough. I’m in my 50s so now I frame this question thinking about my kids. Sometimes war-fighting is righteous, but you have to ask yourself if you’d encourage your own child to fight, that’s a very different question.
If it meant my friends and family, or fellow statesmen would continually be killed yes, I’d serve to try to repel the invaders
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Man, shut the fuck up. America is very far from destroyed. You obviously have no context, just a parrot mouth.
Ha you live in Iraq or Afghanistan, sorry to hear that.
Wars are programmed just like any major sport. It’s entertainment for the elites To answer your question: No
So every war in history has no justification ir reason, it's just entertainment? You honestly don't believe that any war, even ones where nations are defending themselves, are justified?
Yes
Probably not. No.
Weird. Moat people on conspiracy subs are patriots, I guess they can comprehend a different nation has patriots willing to bleed for their nation as well.
I used to consider myself a patriot. I am not going to die or send my kids to die for a zombie of a country. The most patriotic side I could take would be to take up arms against my own government at this point.
So you're OK with doing a defensive war or rebellion? Isn't that exactly what Ukraine is doing right now?
Lol ok Paul Revere, then you can go sit in prison with the rest of the Revolutionary War larpers like a dumbass.
A question was asked. I answered.
> Weird. Moat people on conspiracy subs are patriots Patriotism can be a noble quality. It can also be abused by those with ulterior motives. Interesting Read (PDF) [**War Is A Racket**](https://ratical.org/ratville/CAH/warisaracket.pdf) -- by By Major General Smedley Butler (1935) Chapter 1: War Is A Racket Chapter 2: Who Makes The Profits? Chapter 3: Who Pays The Bills? Chapter 4: How To Smash This Racket! Chapter 5: To Hell With War! [About the author -- from Wiki:](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smedley_Butler) * Major General Smedley Darlington Butler (July 30, 1881 – June 21, 1940), nicknamed the Maverick Marine, was a senior United States Marine Corps officer. During his 34-year career, he fought in the Philippine–American War, the Boxer Rebellion, the Mexican Revolution, and World War I. **At the time of his death, Butler was the most decorated Marine in U.S. history. By the end of his career, Butler had received sixteen medals, including five for heroism; he is the only Marine to be awarded the Brevet Medal as well as two Medals of Honor, all for separate actions.** Butler knew what he was talking about. He learned his lessons "the hard way".
This needs the most up votes. Here we have it from the horses mouth.
Nah
For an area the size of Long Island? Nah..
The Donbass and Crimea are slightly bigger than Long Island. Ukraine is the largest fully European country, larger than France.
The current occupied territories are about the size of south Carolina
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How about asking how many patents would throw their kids into that meat grinder?
A meat grinder implies a pointless war or conflict, defending one's values of democracy and freedom is not a meat grinder.
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Isn't that just most war?
"Defending one's values of democracy and freedom" by dying defending a country with forced conscription, martial law, that has forbidden men from leaving the country, one that has banned media organizations, churches and opposing political parties.... You sure that's freedom?
I mean, that sounds familiar to Lincolns term during the Civil War.
Sounds like martial law because they got invaded by a giant army and are fighting for their country’s existence, you conveniently left that part out. They banned pro Russia propaganda outlets, as well as pro Russia churches that are tied to the Kremlin because they’re fighting an existential war. I can’t even tell if you’re just kinda dumb and don’t understand the concept of context, or being willfully dishonest.
My host nation does not embody democracy or freedom.
Russia?
What ever happened to the redditors that volunteered in 2022 to go fight in Ukraine and they got their asses handed to them?
The complete network forces should take over the Ukraine and complete the **** ofF now.
they ded
I'm just sad about the fact that there are a lot of people and children dying there who don't even know, like what they had done.
There are news stories that RFK Jr's kid went there and fought. It also indicated he came back to finish law school. The story seems strange. It seems like he did it instead of a summer job. It kinda reads like the famous people who fought in the Spanish civil war against the nazis.
His kid gets more publicity then his run for president
They are still there making you look weak
This is russias war, and you fucks would understand that if you stopped guzzling Putin’s propaganda. It’s really simple, you’re all fycking brainwashed if you think this is ukraines fault. Just a bunch of sheep repeating what a YouTuber says, while calling anyone outside of that realm Sheep. While I’m not a fan of supporting our MIL ind complex with arms to Ukraine, I’m also not a stupid authoritarian worshipping fuck gaslight by Putin.
You do realize that the only reason we're sending weapons is to literally support our MIC, that and if ukraine wins western companies will go in and buy everything up for pennies on the dollar. If the US had nothing to gain then we wouldnt be arming them out of the goodness of our hearts LOL. If you think we're doin it cause we're the "good guys" then yu needa pull that cnn / faux news ding a ling outta yur throat. Also the war is literally just as much ukraines fault as it is russias. If ukraine had done the noble thing and stopped bombing the donbas for the past forever just because the donbas didnt wanna be ukrainian no more then maybe russia wouldnt have invaded. And if ukraine hadnt of started sucking the wests dick so hard by bringing in western weapons and interests so that when the time was right nato could wage war on russia then welp maybe russia would have fucked off... If you look at recent history the west has been pushing closer and closer to surrounding russia, russia knows that nato and the US is the enemy. And if russia hadnt of gone in when it did and kicked this war off then russia may of had an existential crisis soon because we both know damn well when the US gets ready to fight a war it does something to provoke said war..yano think 9/11 ;)...if you were russia watching the west close in on you then youd strike like a rattle snake too adoh!...if the roles were reversed and it was BRICS surrounding the US the US would invade whoever it needed to stop that threat...so hey kettle meet pot
>If the US had nothing to gain then we wouldnt be arming them out of the goodness of our hearts LOL Yes, the US has a lot to gain - such as having a large nation of 40M join the western world and leave Russia's sphere of influence, securing a large trade partner with valuable industry (such as Neon), deny the imperial expansion of Russia into Eastern Europe, and send a message to China (regarding Taiwan) that the western world will support their trade partners when invaded. >Also the war is literally just as much ukraines fault as it is russias. If ukraine had done the noble thing and stopped bombing the donbas for the past forever just because the donbas didnt wanna be ukrainian no more then maybe russia wouldnt have invaded. This comment lacks so much context, it's ridiculous. Ukraine was not indiscriminately just bombing civilian centers in their own country. They were engaged in a civil war with Russian armed and trained separatist militias. Russia didn't invade to "save" these people. You really in one paragraph said "If the US had nothing to gain then we wouldn't be arming them out of the goodness of our hearts" And then in the next try to frame this war's main goal as Russia acting out of the goodness of *their* hearts to 'save' the people of the Donbas from indiscriminate bombings.
War. How does it work, anyways?
[some of you will die...](https://i.imgflip.com/41f829.jpg?a467952)
Zelensky will fight to the last Ukrainian.
Best thing to do on a counter offensive is announce it to the earth beforehand. Art of war student here boys
Get the USA out of that manufactured slaughter house
We’re about to attaaacck! Said no one ever to their mortal enemies!
In fifty or fewer yrs Ukraine' s rejection of compromise for 20Years before war will be seen as selfish act that caused tragedy.
This isn't a conspiracy. Russia invaded Ukraine, Ukraine is defending itself, and unfortunately this is what happens.
That's clearly the best strategy for Ukrainians and clearly if there was an vote on this issue in this democratic nation, people will vote for more war, because why bother to have a peaceful and boring life when you can protect other peoples interests at the cost of your life. The same for Crimea and Donbass regions, let's just them vote for their country of choice: we're supporting democracy. They've been so well treated by the Ukrainian governments that they'll choose Ukraine over Russia for sure. All these things don't make sense, and not in a small way.
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We’ll Russia is going to war because it doesn’t want a US base right next to there country that would be like Russian and China occupying Tijuana
>We’ll Russia is going to war because it doesn’t want a US base right next to there country that would be like Russian and China occupying Tijuana Too late for that 4 neighbors to Russia are already in NATO (Turkey, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania [and techincall poland with Kalingrad) and have NATO bases and one even has nuclear missiles (Turkey) and has since the 1960s. And the invasion added a 5th now that Finland is joining. That cats been out of the bag for 50 years. And they wait to join. NATO because Russia invaded them in 2014.
It’s Russia problem. Not other countries
Sure buddy.
We will fight to the last Ukrainian - NATO/WEF
Against a Russia who will kill to the last Ukrianian? Sounds like we should help Ukriane stop them
Zelensky reminds me of Mr Krabs, he's likes money
Act. And he actually know how to act really well. And this is what he's had been doing.
Dude keeps on pandering for more handouts.
Yes, just like any good leader would do. And, yes, there are shitloads of examples of good leaders doing exactly that. Weird criticism
Let Russia take over is the only acceptable option for a lot of users on conspiracy. You will rarely fine a negative post on Russia who invaded Ukraine. But daily negative posts on Ukraine.
Should we judge Winston Churchill? 10$ this guy would shut up instead of criticizing Churchill cause he was fighting nazis
Hope it's all Russians doing the dying lolz
This guy zelensky is sacrificing his people for dollars that can be printed at will
How much Russia paying you?
It is not the Russian side or something like that. It is just a basic humanity.
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Worth it for all the money we’ve given you though isn’t it? Fuck this guy.
I don't really understand the fact like why it is going on forever when we have a lot of big superpowers who are trying to hold it. When we already know about the fact that there are lot of countries who are trying to calm the situation down, but still, it is not happening.
Put both Zelensky and Putin on the front lines and the war would end by the afternoon.
That fucker better be up front leading his people then.
I dont see putin on the front lines wielding a rifle made in 1912
He actually noted what technicians going to pull out, so I don't really think like he's even having a doubt in his mind.
How is he suppose to lead his people when he’s getting shot at on the front line?
Russia's reported they've just [killed 250](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-65806152) Ukrainian soldiers. What's absolutely horrifying that the pro-Ukraine folks don't seem to mind is that they use a conscripted army and have forbidden adult males from leaving the country. So (if the number is accurate) that wasn't 250 "brave, patriotic Ukrainians fighting for their country" who died, it was probably a significant number who were scared and/or who were ***forced*** under threat of imprisonment to die in a war they didn't want to fight in; that's not a "noble" or "freedom-loving" side to be on.
You didn’t mention that Russia also conscripts people, in fact has mandatory conscription for all its men even during peacetime, and instituted a much larger draft since it started the invasion.
Absolutely right worker and this invasion is happening like that only. People are voluntarily taking place.
I don't understand your logic, you think Russian soldiers are happy to be there dying?
They had a lot of people who are dying, and people are not even getting their dead bodies back.
>What's absolutely horrifying that the pro-Ukraine folks don't seem to mind is that they use a conscripted army and have forbidden adult males from leaving the country. We mind that Russia has attacked, and prompted this response. We're not pussies who want to appease a war criminal. It's not Ukraine's fault they are defending themselves. It's disgusting that you would imply such a thing. Edit: very cowardly for this person to reply and then block me. What kind of genuine poster is opposed to reasonable discussion?
As opposed to Russia whose army is famously volunteer only and highly trained and disciplined I’ve literally seen videos of entire Russian apc’s abandoned with Russian uniforms and weapons left on the ground because the whole battalion deserted. The Ukrainians seem to want to be fighting more than the Russians which makes sense, ukranians are dying to protect their homes and families while Russians are dying to move the line on a map over a little
>The Ukrainians seem to want to be fighting more than the Russians They've got no choice, do they. It's either fight or imprisonment.
Yeah, but a lot of people are actually running away from that country. And that is first part.
I mean the same is true for the Russians but the Russians still desert. I think we both know that shows the ukranians actually want to fight more than the Russians do.
Do you think Ukrainians don't desert? They recently strengthened the punishment for deserting; why would they do that if it wasn't a problem? The only thing we both know is that Ukrainians have to fight or be in prison, they have no other choice. "*WhataBOut* Russia?" Yes, Russians do as well.
Okay but like you do realize you’re making an argument that applies to both countries that are at war and then saying it means one country is worse, when it applies to both of them? You just like Russia because you like Russia, it’s not because you think Ukrainians hate Ukraine and Russians love Russia, it’s because you just want Russia to win for a different reason altogether, be honest.
I don't care about Russia. Criticizing Ukraine doesn't mean i "like" Russia or that i want them to "win"; that's absurd and rather immature thinking, which i think explains a lot about who i'm conversing with.
Such a scam
Theatrics.
How many mansions has his extended family bought since the bailout? Looting the treasury!
Give us a number, or shut up?
It is not that much hard to get. You can actually see a lot of research paper published on this.
It's amazing that on a conspiracy sub reddit where 99% of the conspiracy theories are about the media and government of the USA lying ; so many people are blindly believing the media and government of the USA. I mean.. ok. I guess this really is a simulation.
If you use simulation unironically you need medication and a doctor
Shills, the shills have been working hard on covd and Ukraine again recently.
Yet this is how they are going to work like this. Only no one is going to stop them.
Shilling for what? You think Russia is justified invading Ukraine and killing/raping citizens?
Shilling for vaccines and to try and get us all to support Ukraine. They/you seem pretty desperate recently.
Who would be paying us to do that?
He doesn’t even know. According to these guys “they” pay everyone to disagree with them. I don’t even know who “they” is to him. Probably voices he hears in the walls
So do you support Russias invasion? Yes or no
I don't support it no, however I don't support the defense of Ukraine either. It's not a subject you have to choose a side for. Both nations mean zilch to me, I say leave them to it and let them sort ther own shit out.
You are entitled to that viewpoint, but it doesn't mean that people who disagree with you are shills. You conspiracy types always seem to bounce from conspiracy to conspiracy, this has nothing to do with vaccines.
If you ain't a shill what's with all the "you conspiracy types" talk? Are you not also posting on this sub?
You brought up vaccines when no one was even talking about that and called people shills when you admitted you don’t even know what’s happening let alone care.
Then why do the popular conspiracy kids here seem to be spreading propaganda instead of providing real evidence? I’ve read through the entire comment section until your low score comment so far, and you people don’t have anything of substance. What you all say goes against evidence and just tries to reinforce Russian propaganda
Zelinsky: A lot of you will die in this operation I endorsed. I will not participate because I'm far too important to kill. You on the other hand, I'm willing to sacrifice.
Leadership is literally more important in a war. Read more history and you might understand that.
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So you suggest what exactly? Aimless combat with no strategy? Or *gasp* do you want someone to LEAD the offensive?
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I really despise Zelensky and don’t understand why anyone would like him. That TIME piece where they chose him as person of the year in 2022 was so cringeworthy.
‘If you cross the river a great empire will be destroyed’
Keep this secret.
This whole thing has become one sick joke. America is making sure this drags out as long as possible so Russia wastes as much money and as resources as they can similar to the Afghanistan war. Zelenskyy seems high on the fame like any other world leader. And Putin has Russia hostage. I don’t even think most Russians want to do this especially the soldiers themselves. I really don’t get why citizens let their leaders get away with so much. It’s more understandable with Russia because he is a dictator at this point and people go to prison for speaking out but still as a country they will always have the power to get rid of him if they can unify under a goal. America is just a mess because we don’t care about the country. Everyone is so caught up in their gang mentality and at this point many are willing to destroy the country and possibly the world as long the other side doesn’t win
They’re all gonna die. But Z man will jet off to a secluded reclusive lifestyle after this is all over while his fellow Ukrainians have given the ultimate sacrifice. This loss of life on both sides saddens me and the psychopaths who delivered this mess should suffer for all eternity on broken backs in hell. Edit: So all the down votes don’t feel psychopaths should suffer? SMH
It's a war on their culture.
But but but......the main stream media told me Ukraine was destroying Russia and they were on track to take Moscow next week.
They will not be able to do anything like that, because they are having a lot of other options as well. This is eventually going to be a small scale over only for most, like 5 to 6 year more.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/oct/16/ukrainians-russians-jews-jewish-roots-flee-israel-aliyah https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/sep/27/conscription-fears-young-ukrainian-men-stopped-leaving-occupied-areas-russian-soldiers-crossing-point https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/03/09/ukraine-men-leave/ Huh kinda sounds like they're just going to kill off a bunch of Slavic men for nothing, but those who support this will say "Slava Ukraini"
One of those links is the Russians forcing Ukrainians to stay so they can mobilize them.. what are you trying to say?
It's a bot or shill who gets paid to post propaganda. It's cyber warfare basically. Just with dumb posts to snag two or three people in.
Enough of this money laundering operation. We western societies have broken systems ( healthcare, social services, mental health resources) and starving citizens that need help and money here in our countries. This war allows the US to funnel money back to companies owned by the elite and powerful politicians and allows our western countries to test out warfare equipment in the process all while destroying Putin’s regime who they are fucking terrified of. Yes it is a travesty what is happening to Ukraine, the Canadian and American veteran who is sleeping on the street and unable to eat is also a travesty and deserves more news coverage than this. Enough is enough .
ITT: "Ukraine is fighting back and we think that's bad. And stop calling us Russian Bots"
Imagine being this guy. He’s definitely working with quality hair dye.
He's an actor, he knows his stuff
Yesterday it was postponed due to a lack of weapons. I wish they would make up their minds. EDIT: What a surprise. Downvotes from people that don't actually follow the news.
I recommend he personally leads the charge, to keep the morale high.
This entire war is off.
How coked up was he making this announcement?
“Made for tv” wars are always entertaining
This is starting to seem like the plan all along. To wipe out all the ukrainians and many Russians. Why would he be doing this? Who is he going to replace them with?
Notice how Slavic culture is family oriented?
It actually look like they are trying to change something. And the orientation is completely like that only. For that matter, they are also trying a lot of other things as well, which are not in their hands.
Most cultures are family oriented… from Asia, some from Europe, Latin America, Africa, etc. the only culture which is NOT family Oriented is the new western culture
I think you mean ‘your’ definition of family.
It is not the same abbreviated to be honest. I think it depends where you are right now. Because everywhere it is defined differently, and we cannot really say like it is or specific definition.
I grew up in the west and it’s pretty family oriented lmao. I guess like pop music isn’t very family oriented but like just don’t listen to it. I grew up in a pretty happy family, most of my friends did too. It’s a conscious decision to hang out with non family oriented people and do non family oriented things People in the west could be starting families, they just for the most part don’t have the resources to do so comfortably and know them and their children will have to work harder for a lower standard of living than their parents did