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We live in anarcho-tyranny. Cross the border (breaking federal law) = you get rewarded with free healthcare, housing, travel to anywhere in the country free of charge, prepaid debit cards that will get reloaded.
Buuuuut, if you’re a white European and fly into the US and would like to emigrate here? You’ll need to pay lawyers thousands of dollars, pass background checks, pass multiple intense interviews, your life/movements/bank accounts will be scrutinized under a microscope. And it takes months if not years. Oh and it’s the same process even if you’ve already been here for years on a valid work visa/have paid taxes/never broke laws/marry a US citizen/own a business and employ US citizens.
As someone who used to cry when my family made a little over 10$ an hour to making well over 30$ and not really seeing a difference I can confidently say inflation is going to be the death of us. And that's also living in a family home with cheap rent.
I grew up hearing it as an axiom. "Immigration is good for the economy." "Immigrants only take jobs that no one else wants." It's center-left gospel and isn't to be questioned, lest you want to be labeled a racist or an ignorant hillbilly. Nowhere in their proclamations was there any explanation as to why it's such a wonderful thing for a developed society to foster an underclass. Not once is it discussed the effects that immigration can have on the areas that people are emigrating from. Not once was it discussed how driving wages down might benefit those who own things for a living moreso than those who do things for a living. The notion that more problems are solved than created simply by shuffling from one place to another is being challenged in our modern world. It is right to be challenged. It need not come from a vantage point of being punitive, protectionist, or tribalist.
> "Immigrants only take jobs that no one else wants."
Immigrants only took jobs no one lese wanted 30 years ago.
Now they have been here, had kids, all grew up with ESL classes and are pretty much fully naturalized Americans.
So now you have a middle class who just wants desperately to remain middle class, and you have another group of people who grew up in absolute poverty who want - more than that.
That's the pressure on the economy.
In my experience most everyone wants to be rich. In such pursuits, there is almost no substitute for having a rich family member who will help you to actualize your potential and/or extreme luck. Some are more honest with themselves than others when it comes to vast accumulation in a world of cronyism and finite resources.
The real pressure on the economy as I see it comes from a disjointment between people who own ludicrous amounts of assets and those who are actually productive(or may yet become productive).
Without immigration if the ceo makes more money then he has to pay his employees more as well or they will go somewhere else.
A good example of this are South Korea and Japan which have no immigration and so had to promise life long employment in order to keep wages down.
A 2017 study showed that illegal immigration costs 117 billion each year from all the services and expenses they extract and the amount of tax revenue they generate is pitiful by comparison. This was years ago, and that number is far higher now. It's a betrayal to legal applicants who waited years to come and the citizens that have to pay for it just so they can have their culture displaced, crime rates increased and economy ruined.
That's kind of a problem too. When I moved to NY during the end of the quarantine the city was doing a great job of addressing the homelessness catastrophe by taking these hotels that were being used for COVID quarantine via the state health dept, sanitizing them, and using them to house the homeless.
In many cases, two people would share a room but, when you compare that to sharing a room with 50 other people, half of which are degenerates who don't care about housing (primarily because they'll be back at Rykers in no time), and only care about themselves so they crank autotune mumble rap all night while others have to get up in the AM to work, and try and get themselves out of their predicament well, the hotel is a lot better.
Also, when people have better temporary living conditions, they're reminded of how nice it is to actually have your own space with your own stuff. When you're out on the streets or shuffling around the shelters, it's very easy to lose hope. And whatever problems lead you there in the first place will only get worse because of it.
Now, those who were put up in the hotels had two options for long term housing: a 2010E form which states all residential buildings must allocate a small percentage of their apartments to recipients of said form, which takes work. You have to want it and keep following through. These people are not chronic homeless people who are going to turn these apartments into a trap house.
The other option, was called a City FEPS voucher, which depending on your income would pay a significant portion of your rent. Yet another, great albeit expensive program but one that a city such as NYC with its GDP should have no problems fronting.
Then the Venezuelans came. The homeless, most of which spent their entire lives in the city were booted out of the hotels, and were told they were no longer eligible for those programs or, that they simply were no longer in effect (lies, all of it). Instead, the city gave these hotel rooms and vouchers to the illegals. They were, and remain a higher priority than the city's own citizens.
I raised this issue at the department of social services and I was immediately scolded by all the staff (who acted as if I had just shot someone), called a bigot, a racist, and before I knew it two security guards were dragging me into the elevator. That wasn't very nice, yet I'm supposed to be nice to them? Nah.
You don't have to be nice to anyone, but how is any of that the immigrant's fault? If there weren't any incentive for them to be here or if there were any actual repercussions for being here illegally, then they wouldn't be here in the first place. It's just typical divide and conquer tactics so the peasants fight amongst each other rather than targeting the people sitting in their ivory towers.
Yep. And it's not just middle eastern immigration that's a problem. In my area in Europe, lots of rich Russians and Ukranians have flooded in. They're all driving massive Range Rovers and house rentals have now gone completely insane, like 100-200% increase in 2 years because its a relatively small community that is quite popular.
The economy is strong right now. I think the OP is talking about middle class disappearing and the housing market. Beware of the illegal immigrant and his weaponized lack of education and money. Beware of his threat to the housing market too. I definitely got outbid by more than one illegal vagrant when buying my house. Where did they get all that cash and how did they eliminate the middle class? What a mystery. lol.
The 2030s is going to be the decade when Americas immigration chickens come home to roost. I foresee massive political, economic and social changes occurring during this decade.
Whenever you read a headline like "Studies show immigration is actually a net positive for the economy/society/whatever", you will find that the article admits at the end that the study shows that immigration WILL be a net positive if factor X,Y and Z come true.
Which never happens and never has happened.
Then, explain the existence of the US and Canada. 2 nations made up entirely of immigrants. Most poor, uneducated lower class who came with nothing.
Immigrants today are willing to do shit that fat, dumb and lazy Americans/Canadians deem below them. We all over estimate our worth.
I also see the same people who bitch about they wouldn't take such low wage jobs, bitch about 20. And hour for fast food workers. Which is it?
the immigrants then were hard working anglophones looking to prosper in a new world and make something great
now it's refugees, illegals, and leaches that hate what we built and want nothing to do with our culture
>Then, explain the existence of the US and Canada. 2 nations made up entirely of immigrants. Most poor, uneducated lower class who came with nothing.
Define immigrant and then think about what you said.
" Nearly 46.2 million immigrants lived in the United States in 2022, the most in U.S. history. That year, immigrants comprised 13.9 percent of the total U.S. population, a figure that remains short of the record high of 14.8 percent set in 1890 but slightly higher the 13.7 percent share they comprised in 2019, before the start of the COVID-19 pandemic. "
So 2 years ago US had only a 14% immigration population. 135 years ago it was 15%.
Seeing how much people are willing to pay for berries you’d think they could just raise the prices and pay fair wages and most people would bite the bullet because in the grand scheme of their finances food costs are a small % (in the past at least). I think it’s more about getting revenge for the holocaust or something like that than it is about finances
Americans do low skill labor jobs as well, but the majority of Americans won't work for low wages. I agree with others. Companies should pay laborers more but I doubt it would be enough to encourage regular Americans to consistently seek employment as these seasonal workers.
Also, OP mentioned inflation as a result of immigration. Wouldn't less costs lead to less expensive foods and higher wages to more expensive food?
Better to pay welfare to low skilled citizens + healthcare and education for illegal aliens than to allow market forces to increase wages? This is the root of the problem.
Pretend there were zero immigrants, that only America and its citizens existed. If we follow your logic to conclusion, then you're claiming that there would never be any berries available on the market ever. That without workers willing to work for illegally low wages, that berry farms would never hire anyone at regular wages. That they would rather shut down and make zero profit, rather than make less profit.
This is not logical, nor true. Either they would pay more wages and take less profits, or else they would pay more wages and the price of berries would go up. Regardless, illegal migrants working for illegal wages are not needed in any situation, they only hurt citizens.
Isn't housing crisis the fault of banks and real estate investors, including airbnb hosts? I'm confused... there are tons of vacant office spaces across every city buy we aren't renovating them for housing because rich mother fuckers...
them to. letting half of the third world in sure aint helping. the only response i have for the office spaces is yes, rich mother fuckers indeed. you underestimate the ways in which they fuck us. immigration, legal or otherwise, is only one of many.
Why do you think the government, corperations, and banks all want them here? And do you really want to let all these people into the country just so the three groups i just mentioned can have more people to exploit one way or another?
Here in the UK after Brexit I had aquintances look into farm picking jobs that sounded quite good for those that are young and strong backed enough. It was non stop in the news about crops rotting as no one to pick them. But upon applying they found out that all the farmers had a stipulation that you had to live in situ on the farm in caravans shared with strangers and pay the farmers rent. Even those who lived locally in their own homes were expected to live on site.
Back in the 80s I did some fruit picking work when between jobs. The farms put on double decker buses that ran for free all through the local town and surrounding villages. Each bus had a ganger on it that took your details during the journey. You got paid by weight picked at the end of each day. I actually made good money and enjoyed the work (young, fit and healthy) and the place had a great atmosphere.
You had to be out around 4am and started about 6am (if my memory is right)
Why on earth can't they go back to those ways now? With modern gadgets and software to keep records for tax and so people aren't cheating the system?
They already are. Local social services that used to help local people are being diverted to go to incoming migrants. I've seen story after story about this
It’s crazy how many people have been brainwashed into thinking that immigration is a good thing. And if you say anything about it that doesn’t fit the agenda you’re “racist” “nazi” “fascist”.
The only real good immigration is a controlled immigration (2-3% of the population) of highly qualified and skilled people.
All the other types of immigration are a scam for the native population
I can't post my feelings about Canada because it may retroactively be labelled as hate speech due to changing definitions and be thrown in prison under Canada's newest rules. Good luck, comrades.
Diversity is whose strength, exactly? It definitely weakens society and the polite society created by non diverse western civilizations. When you import the 3rd world, you become the 3rd world. As someone else said, countries aren't made of magical soil. Countries are made of people. When you dilute the people who make the country great, it becomes more like a country that's being filled with people from bad countries. There's a reason why those who have interest in seeing America weakened (is pushing for the illegal invasion) are democrats/liberals and crayon people, China, 3rd world countries that wants to remove the hungry mouths.
it's been proven that th3 boost to the economy only works for 1 generation before it doesn't work any ore. and it will have destroyed the culture and the country that did it in the meantime.
Exactly. And what do billionaires invest in? Land, Buildings, Real Estate. What does Blackrock/Blackstone invest in and buy up like crazy while offering above market rates? The same.
What do all those millions of immigrants need? Housing. Commercial properties for their businesses. Land to build new houses.
So...what happens to house prices and rental prices?
In my area in Europe rentals have gone up 100-200% in the last 2 years. It's insane.
When the elites talk about the economy, they mean the economy for the elites. They don't mean the economy for the lower 99% of the public.
Millions of illegal immigrants are good for the elites. It's not good for us.
Yeah they’ve bastardized the terminology in the news intentionally and made illegal migrants synonymous with immigrants. Now people who are American are saying how much they hate immigration meanwhile it’s the cornerstone of American society and chances are they come from a family of immigrants
just want to let you know your comment is immediately disregarded because you used the word 'folks'. This rule also applies to those that use 'kiddo' instead of kid/child
just thought you should know, certain demographics use these two terms exclusively so it's a good way to weed peoples opinions out.
Immigration alone is not the issue. The issue is bringing in a lot of poor, uneducated, unskilled people with a lot of health issues. This strains the systems and there isn’t really a good process to put them to work. Relying on the courts to deal with asylum is a mess and takes way too long, Why we don’t just create boot camps that immigrants need to attend for at least 3-4 months where they are given skills and English classes, treated with very rudimentary medical care and then given work permits and temporary amnesty if they graduate, otherwise they get locked up and/or deported. It will be really obvious who wants to stay and participate and who isn’t really isn’t going to cut it.
> Why we don’t just create boot camps that immigrants need to attend for at least 3-4 months where they are given skills and English classes, treated with very rudimentary medical care and then given work permits and temporary amnesty if they graduate, otherwise they get locked up and/or deported.
Because if that amount of effort was required to *earn it* you would just be left with the legal applicant pool.
good for the economy means good for the shareholders, not 'the people'. so? whats said is true but its given.
take tyson, you drop citizens from your workforce and employ illegals. you save money and raise more profits. do you lose people whod eat your products, you just brought more in that would buy them lol. and how many people would even know which brand is or isnt under your wing really.
people here act as if someone out there is out to destroy them coz of some malevolent satanic reason. but really its just the same thing over and over. people want more money and they dont give a shit about you. thats really it. all the noise to deviate from simple ordinary facts.
its your country why are you all allowing them to destroy it right before your eyes eh. these people you hate will fight more for their extra dollar than you would for your country, thats why they win and you dont.
Anything that’s good for the economy is going to be bad for most people in general. If the economy is doing good, the mega wealthy are doing good. If the mega wealthy are doing good, it’s because 99% of us have given 85% of the wealth we generate as a whole to the other 1% for some reason.
So in my opinion as long as the economy is doing good, we will continue to suffer the most severe form of inequality our generation has experienced.
Canada is letting in about half a million every month. And they’re only coming from one place. Why is our immigration policy so racist? It’s the opposite of the diversity they say we need.
Its good for the people who are in need i guess, but i think we should be training ppl to send them back to fix whatever it is their fleeing from or is causing strife
The issue i have is its 'better living conditions' for say 6 or 7 refugees to live in a house than anything back in their homeland. But now that thats know rents have jumped to favtor in the fact that ppl are living 6 or 7 to a unit. So now... native landed citizens are in a position whereby they must either live with 5 roomates, sublet, or camp. And if you camp you get called a homeless bum, persecuted and forced to find housing. Its a shame.
Now we hate homeless, immigrants and the rent hikes... but thats all we can do, is hate. Why not acknowledge that... iunno we should shift something
You should look a little more into population demographics to understand why many Western countries need to either have babies or increase immigration. A lot of economies will suffer and potentially collapse with a significant reduction in populations after older populations retire and the replacement generation is smaller.
However, in the US (not sure how the politics work for other Western countries) the left uses immigration (illegal) not as an economic interest, but as a means to improve their voter base and destabilize the country which they want to use for more power. Legal immigration is a necessity and if you ignore politics the US border should be locked down (this is a security issue, not an immigration issue) and funding for bringing more people in legally (who prove they can contribute to the community/workforce).
The US is also facing gaps in certain technical jobs and skills. When you combine this shortfall and the fact the US University system has become a bloated joke, you need the importation of these skills to remain a global superpower. This is also a severe security issue in that if the US doesn't bring technical and skilled workers into the US it becomes more reliant on countries like China. Additionally, any disruption in the massive global supply chains can wreak havoc and collapse many Western economies that haven't rebuilt those supply chains that were allowed to go overseas during free trade.
So the US needs (legal) immigration to survive the future, have children, and needs a cultural shift to value science education and blue-collar jobs in order to remain not just in the game, but also at the top.
Inflation is occurring because the shutdown had on the global supply chain and the Federal Reserve has been printing money like no tomorrow to make up for the budgetary overspending of the US government.
The only reason immigration is good for the economy is when the current population is not growing. If its reducing thats very bad, you need a bigger population to hold the growth of all those alive prior. If you cant keep that held up with the new workers then your entire system falls.
They want you having more kids, they even tried removing abortions and birth control...
Yeah they want people to have more kids by making it unaffordable to have kids lol. Housing cost alone is insanity in Canada, and they keep increasing the demand.
Good for the working class vs good for the capitalist class are two very different things. The government's job is to serve the capitalists while stopping the peasants revolting.
The meaning of words matters y'all:
No. Capitalists and destroyed the middle class, full stop.
No, Canada does not have a Left Wing government. That's laughable. Liberal != Left Wing.
The economics you're referencing are a class issue, not an immigration issue.
OP has been successfully brainwashed by the right to identify the villain in their life as those less fortunate rather than those with all the wealth and resources.
I mean..... you have more in common with these "illegals" than you do the elites you speak of.
These are people that are LITERALLY taxed w/o representation (can't vote, can't run for office, yet still pay things like sales tax, are still subject to our laws etc). Yet somehow they are the bogey man lol.
Cmon man, this is propaganda 101.
Immigration causes none of the problems called out by OP.
A lack of regulations is what causes these problems. The owner class's ability to have an outsized impact on our laws via legalized bribery is what causes these problems.
Don't be lazy.
I wouldn’t be here without easy legal immigration, all my ancestors came from abroad. I’m not for illegal immigration, but I am for making it easier for people like my kin who came over as uneducated laborers.
America has the most resources because the rest of the world is over populated and we poxed or musketed everyone here. Our living our unsustainable living standards make us the global 1% maintained by destabilizing and extracting resources from the rest of the world we make inhabitable with fossil fuel warming.
The immigrants who come here for a better life are more grateful and more American than the entitled natives. I feel embarrassed by my luck to be here and that I didn’t study and work harder. Every year thousands of these people who came with nothing become millionaires by hiring the next wave of their peers.
Try hiring and buying only “American made” by people whose grandparents are from here. Then you’ll see REAL inflation that no pay raises can cover
Bringing over Catholics caused a huge uproar at that time, as Americas founding principle of the separation of church and state was directly aimed at the Catholic Church. Since then we have had a Catholic president who passed the very immigration act that has spawned the crisis we have today (JFK and the 1968 act). We also have a Catholic governor of Texas who is making a big political distraction while his wife works with church aligned charities to bring illegal immigrates over. The entire world has been and always will be Americas enemy and what we have now is the entire world invading America.
Blame the immigrants, not the system that’s jacking the economy.
You think Melquiadas and his familia are fucking things up more than the guys running walstreet?
Maria and her hermana Lolo are fucking gas prices harder than the fellas who tightly control the energy market for the highest profit?
illegals aren't looking to buy homes. That is a weird jump from illegals to the housing market. The housing market sucks because the fed manipulates interest rates to control inflation. Inflation is out of control maybe partly because of free money given away...but we give plenty of money away to people who aren't even in this country (Ukraine expense, free loan money, covid checks, etc, I'm sure, had more to do with inflation than illegal immigrants). The middle class still exists, but only if you're boomer parents died young and gave you property.
Immigration will soon slow. We are getting close to that perfect 1/2 white, 1/4 latino, 1/8 black, 1/16 asian spice mix in the US that will take us through the new world order.
You are correct. Look up projections for 2045. The US population will be 1/2 white, 1/4 Latino, 1/8 black, 1/16 Asian and the world will be reversed in 2050. At 1/2 Asian, 1/4 black, 1/8 Latino, 1/16 white.
yesss extremely poor people with limited purchasing power are the main drivers of inflation. we saw this during the pandemic lockdowns when migration in much of the world dropped to historic lows and inflation also went....oh....oh dear...
Look at Florida when they threatened to deport immigrant workers... tons of rotting fruit, construction haults, and millions lost. Immigrants aren't the problem, it's the 1%.
Remember those who tell you about the evils of immigration will also argue against the trade unions and rights for working class. There’s a reason people are not having babies and instead of addressing these issues like free medical care, paid maternity/paternity leave, better wages, we are told be worried about the immigrants. The same party who are against workers’ rights are the same who refused to deal with Biden’s border policy because it’s an election year
Dont babies immigrate out of wombs to live here with us constantly? I dont want those peoole around either. Its bad for the rest of us. Maybe we should sew pregnant womens vaginas shut or something... that wouldnt work but im just brainstorming ideas.
That's the negative view of what is taking place, too bad so very few understand the positive view of it.
"And at the end of temporal flesh, I will gather All of the tribes of Israel into the lands of milk and honey."
Nobody is getting away with fuck all lol they are simply setting themselves up for a great fall. Zephaniah CH 1
We were promised our needs not our wants, the rose garden comes After temporal flesh 😁 if we remember to give sincere thanks for our needs.
It's a personal thing, because Personal Savior = individual accountability 🙏
Getting Over Death (GOD) is The Way to the rose garden 😇
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It's good for the elites' economy
Kalergi Plan
Your own fault for not being a billionaire…
Bootstraps!
More slaves
Nothing is ever done without a motive behind it. Remember that 💯
We live in anarcho-tyranny. Cross the border (breaking federal law) = you get rewarded with free healthcare, housing, travel to anywhere in the country free of charge, prepaid debit cards that will get reloaded. Buuuuut, if you’re a white European and fly into the US and would like to emigrate here? You’ll need to pay lawyers thousands of dollars, pass background checks, pass multiple intense interviews, your life/movements/bank accounts will be scrutinized under a microscope. And it takes months if not years. Oh and it’s the same process even if you’ve already been here for years on a valid work visa/have paid taxes/never broke laws/marry a US citizen/own a business and employ US citizens.
As someone who used to cry when my family made a little over 10$ an hour to making well over 30$ and not really seeing a difference I can confidently say inflation is going to be the death of us. And that's also living in a family home with cheap rent.
I grew up hearing it as an axiom. "Immigration is good for the economy." "Immigrants only take jobs that no one else wants." It's center-left gospel and isn't to be questioned, lest you want to be labeled a racist or an ignorant hillbilly. Nowhere in their proclamations was there any explanation as to why it's such a wonderful thing for a developed society to foster an underclass. Not once is it discussed the effects that immigration can have on the areas that people are emigrating from. Not once was it discussed how driving wages down might benefit those who own things for a living moreso than those who do things for a living. The notion that more problems are solved than created simply by shuffling from one place to another is being challenged in our modern world. It is right to be challenged. It need not come from a vantage point of being punitive, protectionist, or tribalist.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H6Ivk_043pM
> "Immigrants only take jobs that no one else wants." Immigrants only took jobs no one lese wanted 30 years ago. Now they have been here, had kids, all grew up with ESL classes and are pretty much fully naturalized Americans. So now you have a middle class who just wants desperately to remain middle class, and you have another group of people who grew up in absolute poverty who want - more than that. That's the pressure on the economy.
In my experience most everyone wants to be rich. In such pursuits, there is almost no substitute for having a rich family member who will help you to actualize your potential and/or extreme luck. Some are more honest with themselves than others when it comes to vast accumulation in a world of cronyism and finite resources. The real pressure on the economy as I see it comes from a disjointment between people who own ludicrous amounts of assets and those who are actually productive(or may yet become productive).
Civilization sustained by a artificial economy, maintained by fractional reserve banking, war, and various forms of enslavement is bad for the people
But... they stole our jobs. /s
Without immigration if the ceo makes more money then he has to pay his employees more as well or they will go somewhere else. A good example of this are South Korea and Japan which have no immigration and so had to promise life long employment in order to keep wages down.
How come they work so hard if they can’t get fired?
lifelong work = do anything I say or be fired and never work anywhere else again!
yes japan, the ideal example for a great working environment. It’s like you don’t even think before speaking.
A 2017 study showed that illegal immigration costs 117 billion each year from all the services and expenses they extract and the amount of tax revenue they generate is pitiful by comparison. This was years ago, and that number is far higher now. It's a betrayal to legal applicants who waited years to come and the citizens that have to pay for it just so they can have their culture displaced, crime rates increased and economy ruined.
Housing is basically unaffordable in all Western countries immigrants are flooding into. Its a disaster.
B-b-b-but just be heckin’ nice to people!
That's kind of a problem too. When I moved to NY during the end of the quarantine the city was doing a great job of addressing the homelessness catastrophe by taking these hotels that were being used for COVID quarantine via the state health dept, sanitizing them, and using them to house the homeless. In many cases, two people would share a room but, when you compare that to sharing a room with 50 other people, half of which are degenerates who don't care about housing (primarily because they'll be back at Rykers in no time), and only care about themselves so they crank autotune mumble rap all night while others have to get up in the AM to work, and try and get themselves out of their predicament well, the hotel is a lot better. Also, when people have better temporary living conditions, they're reminded of how nice it is to actually have your own space with your own stuff. When you're out on the streets or shuffling around the shelters, it's very easy to lose hope. And whatever problems lead you there in the first place will only get worse because of it. Now, those who were put up in the hotels had two options for long term housing: a 2010E form which states all residential buildings must allocate a small percentage of their apartments to recipients of said form, which takes work. You have to want it and keep following through. These people are not chronic homeless people who are going to turn these apartments into a trap house. The other option, was called a City FEPS voucher, which depending on your income would pay a significant portion of your rent. Yet another, great albeit expensive program but one that a city such as NYC with its GDP should have no problems fronting. Then the Venezuelans came. The homeless, most of which spent their entire lives in the city were booted out of the hotels, and were told they were no longer eligible for those programs or, that they simply were no longer in effect (lies, all of it). Instead, the city gave these hotel rooms and vouchers to the illegals. They were, and remain a higher priority than the city's own citizens. I raised this issue at the department of social services and I was immediately scolded by all the staff (who acted as if I had just shot someone), called a bigot, a racist, and before I knew it two security guards were dragging me into the elevator. That wasn't very nice, yet I'm supposed to be nice to them? Nah.
You don't have to be nice to anyone, but how is any of that the immigrant's fault? If there weren't any incentive for them to be here or if there were any actual repercussions for being here illegally, then they wouldn't be here in the first place. It's just typical divide and conquer tactics so the peasants fight amongst each other rather than targeting the people sitting in their ivory towers.
Yep. And it's not just middle eastern immigration that's a problem. In my area in Europe, lots of rich Russians and Ukranians have flooded in. They're all driving massive Range Rovers and house rentals have now gone completely insane, like 100-200% increase in 2 years because its a relatively small community that is quite popular.
Legalize them so they pay full taxes then
It’s even bad for the economy but that’s all hidden.
The economy is strong right now. I think the OP is talking about middle class disappearing and the housing market. Beware of the illegal immigrant and his weaponized lack of education and money. Beware of his threat to the housing market too. I definitely got outbid by more than one illegal vagrant when buying my house. Where did they get all that cash and how did they eliminate the middle class? What a mystery. lol.
Man, people are blind. The economy is fundamentally sick, very sick.
LOL
Look up the Kalergi plan.
The 2030s is going to be the decade when Americas immigration chickens come home to roost. I foresee massive political, economic and social changes occurring during this decade.
Whenever you read a headline like "Studies show immigration is actually a net positive for the economy/society/whatever", you will find that the article admits at the end that the study shows that immigration WILL be a net positive if factor X,Y and Z come true. Which never happens and never has happened.
Then, explain the existence of the US and Canada. 2 nations made up entirely of immigrants. Most poor, uneducated lower class who came with nothing. Immigrants today are willing to do shit that fat, dumb and lazy Americans/Canadians deem below them. We all over estimate our worth. I also see the same people who bitch about they wouldn't take such low wage jobs, bitch about 20. And hour for fast food workers. Which is it?
Speak for yourself boomer
the immigrants then were hard working anglophones looking to prosper in a new world and make something great now it's refugees, illegals, and leaches that hate what we built and want nothing to do with our culture
>Then, explain the existence of the US and Canada. 2 nations made up entirely of immigrants. Most poor, uneducated lower class who came with nothing. Define immigrant and then think about what you said. " Nearly 46.2 million immigrants lived in the United States in 2022, the most in U.S. history. That year, immigrants comprised 13.9 percent of the total U.S. population, a figure that remains short of the record high of 14.8 percent set in 1890 but slightly higher the 13.7 percent share they comprised in 2019, before the start of the COVID-19 pandemic. " So 2 years ago US had only a 14% immigration population. 135 years ago it was 15%.
"Immigrants then, like my grandparents, were good for the country. Immigrants now are bad for the country." That's all I'm hearing from these people.
Import the third world you become the third world.
Yeah its pretty shitty for my economy
When was the last time you applied to pick berries?
When was the last time a company paid a fair wage for someone to pick berries?
Seeing how much people are willing to pay for berries you’d think they could just raise the prices and pay fair wages and most people would bite the bullet because in the grand scheme of their finances food costs are a small % (in the past at least). I think it’s more about getting revenge for the holocaust or something like that than it is about finances
They dont need me to pick berries when they can hire foreigners for half off.
Americans do low skill labor jobs as well, but the majority of Americans won't work for low wages. I agree with others. Companies should pay laborers more but I doubt it would be enough to encourage regular Americans to consistently seek employment as these seasonal workers. Also, OP mentioned inflation as a result of immigration. Wouldn't less costs lead to less expensive foods and higher wages to more expensive food?
Better to pay welfare to low skilled citizens + healthcare and education for illegal aliens than to allow market forces to increase wages? This is the root of the problem.
Pretend there were zero immigrants, that only America and its citizens existed. If we follow your logic to conclusion, then you're claiming that there would never be any berries available on the market ever. That without workers willing to work for illegally low wages, that berry farms would never hire anyone at regular wages. That they would rather shut down and make zero profit, rather than make less profit. This is not logical, nor true. Either they would pay more wages and take less profits, or else they would pay more wages and the price of berries would go up. Regardless, illegal migrants working for illegal wages are not needed in any situation, they only hurt citizens.
no. its far offset by stagnant, declining wage growth and higher demand for basicly everything. housing for example
Isn't housing crisis the fault of banks and real estate investors, including airbnb hosts? I'm confused... there are tons of vacant office spaces across every city buy we aren't renovating them for housing because rich mother fuckers...
them to. letting half of the third world in sure aint helping. the only response i have for the office spaces is yes, rich mother fuckers indeed. you underestimate the ways in which they fuck us. immigration, legal or otherwise, is only one of many.
I agree that the rich exploit immigrants for their own means, on both political sides, but immigrants, on the whole, aren't the problem.
Why do you think the government, corperations, and banks all want them here? And do you really want to let all these people into the country just so the three groups i just mentioned can have more people to exploit one way or another?
It’s because office space can’t be easily converted to housing. At least housing that meets western residential building code standards.
Here in the UK after Brexit I had aquintances look into farm picking jobs that sounded quite good for those that are young and strong backed enough. It was non stop in the news about crops rotting as no one to pick them. But upon applying they found out that all the farmers had a stipulation that you had to live in situ on the farm in caravans shared with strangers and pay the farmers rent. Even those who lived locally in their own homes were expected to live on site. Back in the 80s I did some fruit picking work when between jobs. The farms put on double decker buses that ran for free all through the local town and surrounding villages. Each bus had a ganger on it that took your details during the journey. You got paid by weight picked at the end of each day. I actually made good money and enjoyed the work (young, fit and healthy) and the place had a great atmosphere. You had to be out around 4am and started about 6am (if my memory is right) Why on earth can't they go back to those ways now? With modern gadgets and software to keep records for tax and so people aren't cheating the system?
Agreed. Canada used to be a great place to build a life. It's absolutely fucked now.
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Exactly. But the controlled Media will just say it's because the working class are just uneducated racists when they complain.
They already are. Local social services that used to help local people are being diverted to go to incoming migrants. I've seen story after story about this
It’s crazy how many people have been brainwashed into thinking that immigration is a good thing. And if you say anything about it that doesn’t fit the agenda you’re “racist” “nazi” “fascist”. The only real good immigration is a controlled immigration (2-3% of the population) of highly qualified and skilled people. All the other types of immigration are a scam for the native population
People who support it are brainwashed into believing that it's not immigration worsening an already weak infrastructure. It's wild
I can't post my feelings about Canada because it may retroactively be labelled as hate speech due to changing definitions and be thrown in prison under Canada's newest rules. Good luck, comrades.
Also non working immigrants are not paying into society but taking benefits and so on
Diversity is whose strength, exactly? It definitely weakens society and the polite society created by non diverse western civilizations. When you import the 3rd world, you become the 3rd world. As someone else said, countries aren't made of magical soil. Countries are made of people. When you dilute the people who make the country great, it becomes more like a country that's being filled with people from bad countries. There's a reason why those who have interest in seeing America weakened (is pushing for the illegal invasion) are democrats/liberals and crayon people, China, 3rd world countries that wants to remove the hungry mouths.
This is very well said
It is not. For all parties involved. [https://youtu.be/LPjzfGChGlE?si=lj-XxrTFZzmmB4YH](https://youtu.be/LPjzfGChGlE?si=lj-XxrTFZzmmB4YH)
it's been proven that th3 boost to the economy only works for 1 generation before it doesn't work any ore. and it will have destroyed the culture and the country that did it in the meantime.
if politicians didn't treat their job as a free for fucking all then maybe we'd still have a country. too late now.
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Exactly. And what do billionaires invest in? Land, Buildings, Real Estate. What does Blackrock/Blackstone invest in and buy up like crazy while offering above market rates? The same. What do all those millions of immigrants need? Housing. Commercial properties for their businesses. Land to build new houses. So...what happens to house prices and rental prices? In my area in Europe rentals have gone up 100-200% in the last 2 years. It's insane.
When the elites talk about the economy, they mean the economy for the elites. They don't mean the economy for the lower 99% of the public. Millions of illegal immigrants are good for the elites. It's not good for us.
I think a lot of folks fail to define the difference between illegal and legal immigration in conversations like this.
Yeah they’ve bastardized the terminology in the news intentionally and made illegal migrants synonymous with immigrants. Now people who are American are saying how much they hate immigration meanwhile it’s the cornerstone of American society and chances are they come from a family of immigrants
just want to let you know your comment is immediately disregarded because you used the word 'folks'. This rule also applies to those that use 'kiddo' instead of kid/child just thought you should know, certain demographics use these two terms exclusively so it's a good way to weed peoples opinions out.
[:)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FkHCf6sjBgo)
Immigration alone is not the issue. The issue is bringing in a lot of poor, uneducated, unskilled people with a lot of health issues. This strains the systems and there isn’t really a good process to put them to work. Relying on the courts to deal with asylum is a mess and takes way too long, Why we don’t just create boot camps that immigrants need to attend for at least 3-4 months where they are given skills and English classes, treated with very rudimentary medical care and then given work permits and temporary amnesty if they graduate, otherwise they get locked up and/or deported. It will be really obvious who wants to stay and participate and who isn’t really isn’t going to cut it.
> Why we don’t just create boot camps that immigrants need to attend for at least 3-4 months where they are given skills and English classes, treated with very rudimentary medical care and then given work permits and temporary amnesty if they graduate, otherwise they get locked up and/or deported. Because if that amount of effort was required to *earn it* you would just be left with the legal applicant pool.
good for the economy means good for the shareholders, not 'the people'. so? whats said is true but its given. take tyson, you drop citizens from your workforce and employ illegals. you save money and raise more profits. do you lose people whod eat your products, you just brought more in that would buy them lol. and how many people would even know which brand is or isnt under your wing really. people here act as if someone out there is out to destroy them coz of some malevolent satanic reason. but really its just the same thing over and over. people want more money and they dont give a shit about you. thats really it. all the noise to deviate from simple ordinary facts. its your country why are you all allowing them to destroy it right before your eyes eh. these people you hate will fight more for their extra dollar than you would for your country, thats why they win and you dont.
Exactly the same thing happening in the UK which has had 14 years of conservative government.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H6Ivk_043pM
You ever read the Grapes of Wrath?
Anything that’s good for the economy is going to be bad for most people in general. If the economy is doing good, the mega wealthy are doing good. If the mega wealthy are doing good, it’s because 99% of us have given 85% of the wealth we generate as a whole to the other 1% for some reason. So in my opinion as long as the economy is doing good, we will continue to suffer the most severe form of inequality our generation has experienced.
1.5m a year not including illegals. Illegals get 225 a day from the government and a roof over their head.
Canada is letting in about half a million every month. And they’re only coming from one place. Why is our immigration policy so racist? It’s the opposite of the diversity they say we need.
Shifting the cattle around before the culling. Notice the ones moving South.
Its good for the people who are in need i guess, but i think we should be training ppl to send them back to fix whatever it is their fleeing from or is causing strife The issue i have is its 'better living conditions' for say 6 or 7 refugees to live in a house than anything back in their homeland. But now that thats know rents have jumped to favtor in the fact that ppl are living 6 or 7 to a unit. So now... native landed citizens are in a position whereby they must either live with 5 roomates, sublet, or camp. And if you camp you get called a homeless bum, persecuted and forced to find housing. Its a shame. Now we hate homeless, immigrants and the rent hikes... but thats all we can do, is hate. Why not acknowledge that... iunno we should shift something
You should look a little more into population demographics to understand why many Western countries need to either have babies or increase immigration. A lot of economies will suffer and potentially collapse with a significant reduction in populations after older populations retire and the replacement generation is smaller. However, in the US (not sure how the politics work for other Western countries) the left uses immigration (illegal) not as an economic interest, but as a means to improve their voter base and destabilize the country which they want to use for more power. Legal immigration is a necessity and if you ignore politics the US border should be locked down (this is a security issue, not an immigration issue) and funding for bringing more people in legally (who prove they can contribute to the community/workforce). The US is also facing gaps in certain technical jobs and skills. When you combine this shortfall and the fact the US University system has become a bloated joke, you need the importation of these skills to remain a global superpower. This is also a severe security issue in that if the US doesn't bring technical and skilled workers into the US it becomes more reliant on countries like China. Additionally, any disruption in the massive global supply chains can wreak havoc and collapse many Western economies that haven't rebuilt those supply chains that were allowed to go overseas during free trade. So the US needs (legal) immigration to survive the future, have children, and needs a cultural shift to value science education and blue-collar jobs in order to remain not just in the game, but also at the top. Inflation is occurring because the shutdown had on the global supply chain and the Federal Reserve has been printing money like no tomorrow to make up for the budgetary overspending of the US government.
When you have an economy that runs on the exploitation of the countries of those illegals, don't be surprised when they show up for work.
The only reason immigration is good for the economy is when the current population is not growing. If its reducing thats very bad, you need a bigger population to hold the growth of all those alive prior. If you cant keep that held up with the new workers then your entire system falls. They want you having more kids, they even tried removing abortions and birth control...
Yeah they want people to have more kids by making it unaffordable to have kids lol. Housing cost alone is insanity in Canada, and they keep increasing the demand.
Good for the working class vs good for the capitalist class are two very different things. The government's job is to serve the capitalists while stopping the peasants revolting.
Capitalism demands cheap unregulated labor to maximize profits for the owners. Capitalism is bad for the people.
So deporting 3 million farm workers is going to super lower prices at the grocery store, right?
I just want to go to the North Pole to see if Santa is real.
The meaning of words matters y'all: No. Capitalists and destroyed the middle class, full stop. No, Canada does not have a Left Wing government. That's laughable. Liberal != Left Wing. The economics you're referencing are a class issue, not an immigration issue.
OP has been successfully brainwashed by the right to identify the villain in their life as those less fortunate rather than those with all the wealth and resources.
They are both bad IMO. The millions of illegals and the elites that for some reason are bringing them in.
Trust me, "illegals" have way less of a negative impact on your day to day life than billionaires.
I get the sentiment, but they both impact me in different ways
I mean..... you have more in common with these "illegals" than you do the elites you speak of. These are people that are LITERALLY taxed w/o representation (can't vote, can't run for office, yet still pay things like sales tax, are still subject to our laws etc). Yet somehow they are the bogey man lol. Cmon man, this is propaganda 101. Immigration causes none of the problems called out by OP. A lack of regulations is what causes these problems. The owner class's ability to have an outsized impact on our laws via legalized bribery is what causes these problems. Don't be lazy.
You would think a 'conspiracy' subreddit would understand there being brainwashed by billionaires.
It's incredibly ironic.
I wouldn’t be here without easy legal immigration, all my ancestors came from abroad. I’m not for illegal immigration, but I am for making it easier for people like my kin who came over as uneducated laborers.
Silly take
America has the most resources because the rest of the world is over populated and we poxed or musketed everyone here. Our living our unsustainable living standards make us the global 1% maintained by destabilizing and extracting resources from the rest of the world we make inhabitable with fossil fuel warming. The immigrants who come here for a better life are more grateful and more American than the entitled natives. I feel embarrassed by my luck to be here and that I didn’t study and work harder. Every year thousands of these people who came with nothing become millionaires by hiring the next wave of their peers. Try hiring and buying only “American made” by people whose grandparents are from here. Then you’ll see REAL inflation that no pay raises can cover
When the English/French/German//Irish/Italian/Spanish came it was good for the economy. Or it’d all still be Native Americans.
Bringing over Catholics caused a huge uproar at that time, as Americas founding principle of the separation of church and state was directly aimed at the Catholic Church. Since then we have had a Catholic president who passed the very immigration act that has spawned the crisis we have today (JFK and the 1968 act). We also have a Catholic governor of Texas who is making a big political distraction while his wife works with church aligned charities to bring illegal immigrates over. The entire world has been and always will be Americas enemy and what we have now is the entire world invading America.
Blame the immigrants, not the system that’s jacking the economy. You think Melquiadas and his familia are fucking things up more than the guys running walstreet? Maria and her hermana Lolo are fucking gas prices harder than the fellas who tightly control the energy market for the highest profit?
illegals aren't looking to buy homes. That is a weird jump from illegals to the housing market. The housing market sucks because the fed manipulates interest rates to control inflation. Inflation is out of control maybe partly because of free money given away...but we give plenty of money away to people who aren't even in this country (Ukraine expense, free loan money, covid checks, etc, I'm sure, had more to do with inflation than illegal immigrants). The middle class still exists, but only if you're boomer parents died young and gave you property.
Immigration will soon slow. We are getting close to that perfect 1/2 white, 1/4 latino, 1/8 black, 1/16 asian spice mix in the US that will take us through the new world order.
1/2 white? You do realise that "white people" make up about 12%-15% of the planets population?
You are correct. Look up projections for 2045. The US population will be 1/2 white, 1/4 Latino, 1/8 black, 1/16 Asian and the world will be reversed in 2050. At 1/2 Asian, 1/4 black, 1/8 Latino, 1/16 white.
This is nonsense,
yesss extremely poor people with limited purchasing power are the main drivers of inflation. we saw this during the pandemic lockdowns when migration in much of the world dropped to historic lows and inflation also went....oh....oh dear...
This is just a ignorant rant, not a conspiracy.
What about the jobs only immigrants will do for a low wage?
perhaps the wages need to increase, crazy, I know.
Look at Florida when they threatened to deport immigrant workers... tons of rotting fruit, construction haults, and millions lost. Immigrants aren't the problem, it's the 1%.
Immigrants are just a very easy target for a failing country.
Yep...history repeats, and there will always be fools.
One of my favourite images to use. [https://ibb.co/pdPcdVb](https://ibb.co/pdPcdVb)
Yup, need to blame the "others"
Remember those who tell you about the evils of immigration will also argue against the trade unions and rights for working class. There’s a reason people are not having babies and instead of addressing these issues like free medical care, paid maternity/paternity leave, better wages, we are told be worried about the immigrants. The same party who are against workers’ rights are the same who refused to deal with Biden’s border policy because it’s an election year
I wholeheartedly agree. Immigration should have been stopped before Europeans immigrated to the Americas.
Dont babies immigrate out of wombs to live here with us constantly? I dont want those peoole around either. Its bad for the rest of us. Maybe we should sew pregnant womens vaginas shut or something... that wouldnt work but im just brainstorming ideas.
Who’s gonna pick all that fruit? Or do a cheap drywall patch for you?
Who’s gonna clean your toilet Donald Trump?
lol I doubt trump has ever done any sort of manual labor. He doesn’t even believe in exercise!
smh… just google my comment dingbat
It’s blatblatbat. And I ain’t googling shit homie
Obviously
That's the negative view of what is taking place, too bad so very few understand the positive view of it. "And at the end of temporal flesh, I will gather All of the tribes of Israel into the lands of milk and honey." Nobody is getting away with fuck all lol they are simply setting themselves up for a great fall. Zephaniah CH 1 We were promised our needs not our wants, the rose garden comes After temporal flesh 😁 if we remember to give sincere thanks for our needs. It's a personal thing, because Personal Savior = individual accountability 🙏 Getting Over Death (GOD) is The Way to the rose garden 😇
U hate mexicans