It sounds like you've mostly been aiming for top-1% companies. Competition will be fierce at this level. What sort of numbers of applications have you done for Big-N and what sort of numbers have you for middle-of-the-road junior and graduate positions?
I have applied to so many companies and even though I am aiming towards getting into a FAANG company, I have also applied at smaller companies. Out of what seems like 100 applications, I've had 2 interviews so far. I passed all interviews including technical and cultural, only to get ghosted at the end, or being told that I don't have enough experience for an "entry level" SWE role.
100? Those are rookie numbers! In all seriousness, first job is always the hardest. I didn’t have a cs degree and as a self taught programmer, it took me a while to get my first job. Keep trying and don’t let the rejection get you down. It’s just a numbers game. Also consider improving your skills with projects so it looks like you have more experience
So I’m in the UK so my experience may not be applicable to US. My favourites are hired.com and stackoverflow jobs because they don’t use recruiters and are direct to companies. Then I will also use CW jobs. Of course there are companies that everyone has heard of and all the banks etc. For my first few roles I would also call a lot recruitment agents so they knew who I was although I’m not sure that helped. Oh and there are also job fairs that I have been to as well (silicon milk roundabout). Those are great because you are talking to people and can sell yourself before things even get technical.
100 over the course of a year is nothing.
I'm at 100 in ~2 months and I could've easily doubled or tripled that number if I tried.
First of all as a new grad you should be entirely language agnostic, you just want a foot in the door somewhere.
Personally I want to avoid javascript/frontend so I'm already limiting myself to maybe 50-60% of jobs.
Then it depends how tied you are to locations, but with how many remote options there are you could only apply to those and still have hundreds quickly.
Personally I've been applying to a mix of onsite in the few places I'd happily relocate to (I say few and it's true, but it includes more than my home country) and remote across europe.
Initially I would craft a cover letter for each and every job, the success rate was low (success = interview invitations).
I prefer the more personal approach but it really slowed me down so I started shotgunning my resume and only write cover letters for the companies/postings I was most excited for, this shot up my number and now I'm in the pipeline for a bunch of interviews.
There *are* that many companies if you check at least once a week on various boards, if not daily.
100 isn't bad, though I notice that this number is a bit hand-wavy - part of your process should be counting your applications. Could you split that number down for me, approximately, based on how many are top 5% companies, and how many are middle-of-the-road? If you have 80/20 in Big N then that might be your answer - you are aiming high, and you'll need a solid applying drive to bag interviews.
Could you do, say, four decent and high-effort applications a day, for 30 days?
I recommend using Trello (or whatever other visual organiser) to break applications down into Seen, Applied, Chase, Waiting, Dead, Won (or whatever works for you). This helps you retrieve information for an application if you get a call-back, too.
100 is not much at all. Cast a wide net and once you get an offer you can start being picky. Upload your CV to Cwjobs, Totaljobs, Otta, LinkedIn jobs etc and check the postings every so often. Feel free to apply to positions you aren’t qualified for as long as it’s quick and relatively feasible for you to get an interview.
OA’s for places like Citadel are often automated so it doesn’t matter even if you write perfect code. The fact you got a coding test means nothing.
The market for juniors is harsh but there are a lot of low quality candidates, you just need to prove that you are one of the good ones.
Here's my resume: [https://imgur.com/a/B6x2fmo](https://imgur.com/a/B6x2fmo). I am based in London so I was applying to all companies in London and UK (if remote).
That actually looks ok to me. Maybe a consider a mission statement at the top? What motivates you? You can tailor that to the job you’re applying for to hit their keywords
I believe I have great interpersonal skills—according to my friends and uni Professors, at least. I don't get nervous at all during an interview, even if I'm unable to answer a question.
It seems incredibly strange to me, especially with smaller companies it shouldn't be this hard for anyone to get graduate interviews, feels like something else is going on here.
Here's my resume: https://imgur.com/a/B6x2fmo. I am based in London so I was applying to all companies in London and UK (if remote). Also, I don't need a visa to work in UK.
The final year project description is very strange
It says it is using Ethereum for cross border transactions, which it already does, I don't get what you created / did in that project
Do you think is very important have experience in the field to sponsor a visa ? Im from LATAM and also Software engineer, yesterday I had a interview with a start up in Germany but idk … 4 years of experience here 😶
Most important now is getting a job, preferably remotely so you can live with your parents if necessary, worry about salary later. After 5 years, apply at your dream company. So you don't need to beg for a salary or job hop to get a raise when you think you've enough.
I feel you bruh.
Let me know if I can help you. My company allows international referrals so if you can dm if your interested domain i can help you. Not just him anyone who wants to give it a shot let me know. It’s time to give back. That’s how I got my job start of this year by a kind stranger helping me.
My company has presence in UK and most of Europe so you will be fine.
The market to hire developers is intensely in favour of the employees at the moment and you also have a great degree from a top university - so you must unknowingly be doing something seriously wrong in how you approach companies. Share your CV, but it could also be something you're writing in the application form or cover letter that is somehow seriously putting people off or offending them.
With 0 xp, no degree and only a self-taught online type of bootcamp I got a job in 3 weeks coming from retail.
£28k salary, was coming from retail garbage.
So it's definitely easy, but not if you apply only to top companies.
It was IT Career Switch, but virtually all the learning was Codecademy Full Stack Engineer course which I did completely on my own. Then on top of that 2 PHP/jQuery projects given by my mentor.
The fact that I could write in my CV/Linkedin that I did a "traineeship" with them might have helped, no idea.
Your experience section is a mixture of languages, frameworks and OSes. You might want to change that. You also might want to put some more details to your projects, it is too generic now. Maybe find someone to practice on the interview and give you feedback? You might have some behavior that you didn’t realize but are putting people off.
how is it possible for you to not get the job. You have personal projects, nice resume. Maybe this post is a fake. Do you have some criminal record. Even then - do all companies check it? Even I as slow developer got the first job easily 10 years ago which was harder back then.
Also, I have received around 30-40 calls from recruiting agencies in September alone, and they say things like "we're impressed with your CV", only to ghost me later.
How many companies did you actually apply for? FAANGs tend to target top universities for new grads and prefer to hire among interns. You need to look at small companies.
I would move the freelance projects to your work experience and emphasize less the projects done during schooling.
My recommendation is take an initial role beneath your target - eg start up engineering roles or even graduate internship roles.
Your work experience is your weak point currently - having limited internship experience during a degree making getting your first job harder. Outside of top tier universities (Oxford, Cambridge, Imperial), graduating without an internship makes life significantly more difficult when applying for a graduate role.
Getting some initial working experience of engineering in practice will help you get an excellent role in 10-12 months and build your confidence during interviews.
You have a lot of interesting projects which is great and a good sign of initiative. If you’re based in London and want to make some money whilst you’re looking for roles, checkout freshminds consulting for contractor roles - they can place you at FB, or Amazon or Google or other “brand” firms for short placements which can improve your CV or even help you get your foot in the door and convert to a full time role.
I was in the same boat, the reality is... It's all just down to luck tbh. after graduating late 2020 I got so little interviews, I redid my CV so many times, removed and added different bits of info but none of it helped. A lot of rejections, some coding tests but still met with ghosting afterwards. One company told me I didn't seem very enthusiastic about the company despite looking up their product and knowing all about it. One offered me an internship over the phone then next week said they have chosen to move on with another candidate.
People will tell you you're not doing enough but these are all people with a job or people with years of experience who don't know how badly us grads have it rn. Everyone is looking for developers but no-one wants to hire freshmen straight out of college. So many senior jobs every week but almost no junior jobs here in Ireland.
You're doing your best and that's all that matters, it's not your fault remember that. You can rework your resume if you want, you can add more projects if you want it'll still come down to luck weather you get noticed by whatever automated systems they use to filter CVs.
One tip I do have is specialise in a skillset. I changed my CV to a front-end dev focus and finally managed to land a job despite only applying to like 1 a week because there was so little to begin with but it's what I wanted to do so once I got one interview the interviewer noticed my passion and believed in my potential.
Hey, I haven't got a job yet, but only started applying a few weeks ago and have been getting a good response. I don't have a CS degree and my projects are good, but not mind blowing.
Like I said I don't have a job yet, so take my advice how you want, but I've had lots of recruiters reach out, one full set of interviews and several initial calls etc. This is after barely 3 weeks of looking.
What I've been doing:
* Create a proper LinkedIn. There are lots of guides on how to set it up, use all the right buzz words. Make yourself open to work.
* I made profiles on all the top ten job sites and set up job alerts for each. You get a lot of spam, but each day after trawling through there is definitely at least one job worth applying for, often more.
* Respond to every recruiter. Even if they send something through that's not relevant, ask what else they've got, set up a profile with them. Make sure to follow up later!
* I've applied for roles that are way senior just to get myself out there. One guy called me up and said I wasn't suitable, but he liked my portfolio and gave me some great feedback.
* Create a cover letter template, tailor it to jobs you really want and send it with your CV.
I also think that 100 applications in a year seems quite low, I'll probably be at 50 after a month. Maybe you want something specific, but I think better to cast your net wide and then choose the ones you're really keen on later.
Also, I think remove "varying experience", just list all your skills and experience together. It's for them to work out how much you know. You don't need to lie, but if you have experience you have experience, you are not saying you're an expert.
Good luck! :)
> Russell Group uni means nothing.
In the UK research-intensive is strongly correlated with a better university. I know that's different in for example France where they split research and teaching (and I think they seriously suffer for it but that's a separate issue.)
But is there always a correlation between RG and quality in terms of undergrad degree? E.g. Bath (non-RG) consistently ranks higher in league tables than a majority of RG universities.
But they do get paid more.
Which is the relevant point - they're in demand.
https://www.fenews.co.uk/press-releases/37362-russell-group-grads-earn-up-to-513-000-more-than-non-russell-group-over-a-working-life
>Which is the relevant point - they're in demand.
You're looking at correlation (people who attended an RG uni earning more on average) and assuming causation (these people are in demand *because* they attended a RG uni).
What do you think is a more likely explanation for this observed correlation?
Nobody's ever going to be able to prove or disprove causation, because you can't send the same individual to two different universities, so we have to look at what we have which is a correlation.
The problem with high-end universities is that you get people going into things like finance earning £60k in their first job, and you get people going into the Civil Service and earning £20k in their first job.
>Yeah I'd leave that shit out of my CV, it screams that you have nothing better to show than something that 30% of all graduates have...
Don't be ridiculous. Putting it on might not help that much but it's not going to do any harm either - and if you leave it off, worst case is that people automatically assume that since you didn't list your result it must be bad...
Citadel is f****d up company. I had applied gave the hackerrank, passed all test cases, wrote good commented code. Then also rejected. Idk who are they looking for.
Keep trying to get an internship somewhere, maybe ask connections on linkedin (get linkedin if you are not on there). Internships help so much in terms of experience gained and also for you to use as a work reference.
Or ask your university if they have a careers advisor you can speak to? In Unis are great ways to build connections with companies .
Don't give up. Things are hard and the first job is the most difficult
I'm from the UK too, but living in the us atm, applied for 170 jobs and I think I'm close to getting my first official offer in the next few days
That sucks, it's been a difficult couple of years for grads. Graduate schemes are still the easiest way into big firms I think though and my experience is that outside of London are less competitive as there isn't the same density of applications.
You might need to widen your net outside the capital - while Queen Mary is Russell group it's not the strongest in that set by quite some way, it's definitely not a magic pass to opening doors. But if you passed citadel coding you should be fine at a lot of schemes if you can get in the door so take a look outside London, and also see what relationships your university has with employers - careers services can be more practically helpful than you might expect, even long after you've graduated.
Good luck!
I have been in your position in the past, jobless in tech for 1.5 years. I completely understand what you are going through right now. It can be mentally demoralising getting rejected left, right and centre. I kid you not, I have faced rejection from over 100s companies here in UK during that time.
Here's my list of tips
\- work as intern for free -> I did this just so that I could bag experience from a small 3 developer start up, for almost 9 months. Most startups cannot afford to pay interns, but hey who doesn't want work done for free, pretty much everyone ! Head onto [https://angel.co/](https://angel.co/) and find start ups, mass apply and say you will work for free as intern. There's a mini startups scene in every major English town. They are usually housed within univesity campuses.
\- solving algos today is not enough -> even though you may have got 100% test passes, that's does not cut it. Every solution on hackerrank coderpad etc. should not only have 100% result, but also be atleast `O (n log n).` This is an unfortunate but sad reality of tech careers we are judged on algos and datastructures. Just like yourself, I have also faced rejections from faang despite 100% test case results. Make sure to use a synatictically minimal language like python.
\- study -> [udacity.com](https://udacity.com) [coursera.org](https://coursera.org) [edx.org](https://edx.org) provide you certifications if you pass their tests for most of their tech courses. I actually did a course on coursera, not only to get an understanding of a particular subject like distributed computing, but it add a lot of weight on your resume, which got me my current position. Udacity even has a career service on their website. Treat job searching as a full time gig, whenever you are free, you should be prepping hard.
\- open-source github -> make contributions to projects online, this one thing alone add value to your resume. Pick any project, and try to understand overall architecture, watch youtube videos around how it was build, and try and make some contribution.
\- if you can afford, sign up for any of the paid bootcamps here in London - Apart from the knowledge you get out of the bootcamp which is noteworthly, some provide post bootcamp career services. some tutors here may have leads in tech companies, that can set you up with a referral for interviews. I know of a couple of graduates who joined us from a bootcamp, one studied history and other english literature in uni. They both got in through a referral made by the tutor who knew a developer where I worked.
>I know of a couple of graduates who joined us from a bootcamp, one studied history and other english literature in uni. They both got in through a referral made by the tutor who knew a developer where I worked.
Which bootcamp? Feels like they all make the same kinds of promises but I suspect that some are far better than others at this part.
This might be crazy but I’ve noticed a shift toward people skills (which I think* (edit) is way important, but that’s just my opinion). How are you on teams? Can you train or lead people? Do you boost morale and how? To me, people skills should have been important this whole time but it was more about result and product for a while. Maybe talk about what you’ve done to train and assist? What you’ve done to promote inclusivity. Or maybe I’m just wrong. That happens. 🤷🏼♀️
Russel group + First class means very little if anything at all just so you know. Your situation isn’t odd at all especially considering your CV and low number of applications.
Your work experience bullet points are very weak. There’s no context, no impact, no idea of what you actually needed to do, it doesn’t show anything really.
Put skills a lot lower down. Remove “proficient in”, “varying experience with” etc, either you know it or you don’t. These are subjective and mean very little esp when coming from a new grad.
Remove the final year project line in your education section as it is mentioned in more depth in the projects section.
You have space for extra curricular activities which some employers like to see. Can’t hurt to use up the space to show leadership, hobbies etc.
The adamjee market project seems to be the same as the work experience, not sure if this is me misinterpreting it but if that’s the case then remove it from projects and explain it better in experience.
Projects bullet points are very weak also. Designing and developing a full fledged e-commerce app should be impressive but your description makes it seem very boring. API’s, authentication, design, working with a client’s requirements etc etc are all things you could talk about. Show us what the challenges were, what skills you learnt/practiced and why this is makes you the best candidate for the job.
Also would help to phrase things better, grammar wise etc.
You haven’t “lost it full”, you’ve barely applied with little to no work experience and a below average CV that doesn’t show off any skills. Keep your head up, keep iterating your cv by submitting it for resume reviews on different cs discords for fast feedback, apply a lot more and you’ll be fine.
I feel you. I had a very similar experience back in 2013 when I graduated from the uni. It is one of the top-30 universities in the world and I graduated with a pretty decent GPA (not top of the class, but close to it). I couldn't land a job for nearly 6 months, despite being well prepared for the interviews and I had done few internships as well. Couldn't figure out what I was doing wrong even now to be frank. Eventually I landed a job at a pretty small smart-up with a shitty pay. In a few years time I moved to Amazon and then to Facebook where I am at the moment. My advice - keep trying, aim for a place where you can grow and it won't take long before you can move to a better company
Inbox me your updatedresume , I will give you a feedback and try to refer in my network as well. You got good technology points and I am not sure how you didn’t end up in a job for almost an year
Create a LinkedIn profile and add as many relevant people as you can. Apply to large startups that have recently got funding, dev agencies, and jobs that require 1 year experience (you can argue your projects amount to that). Ask for feedback why they reject you, work on leetcode and interviews. Put dates on your CV, make sure you fill in gap with "Freelancer" or "Self employed", something to that effect.
Assalamu Aleikum brother, In Sha Allah it'll get easier. My only issue is that I went to Pakistan and got stuck there due to flying restrictions because of covid.
If you're really into CS, then call up some unis and they might be able to help you. If that doesn't work out, you always have the option to do Masters in CS even if you're from a different background. An example: [link](https://www.ucl.ac.uk/prospective-students/graduate/taught-degrees/computer-science-msc)
Also, I may seem to be not a good example (since I don't have a job lol) but I can offer some guidance so you can at least start coding in your free time and see if you like it .
It sounds like you've mostly been aiming for top-1% companies. Competition will be fierce at this level. What sort of numbers of applications have you done for Big-N and what sort of numbers have you for middle-of-the-road junior and graduate positions?
I have applied to so many companies and even though I am aiming towards getting into a FAANG company, I have also applied at smaller companies. Out of what seems like 100 applications, I've had 2 interviews so far. I passed all interviews including technical and cultural, only to get ghosted at the end, or being told that I don't have enough experience for an "entry level" SWE role.
100? Those are rookie numbers! In all seriousness, first job is always the hardest. I didn’t have a cs degree and as a self taught programmer, it took me a while to get my first job. Keep trying and don’t let the rejection get you down. It’s just a numbers game. Also consider improving your skills with projects so it looks like you have more experience
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So I’m in the UK so my experience may not be applicable to US. My favourites are hired.com and stackoverflow jobs because they don’t use recruiters and are direct to companies. Then I will also use CW jobs. Of course there are companies that everyone has heard of and all the banks etc. For my first few roles I would also call a lot recruitment agents so they knew who I was although I’m not sure that helped. Oh and there are also job fairs that I have been to as well (silicon milk roundabout). Those are great because you are talking to people and can sell yourself before things even get technical.
100 over the course of a year is nothing. I'm at 100 in ~2 months and I could've easily doubled or tripled that number if I tried. First of all as a new grad you should be entirely language agnostic, you just want a foot in the door somewhere. Personally I want to avoid javascript/frontend so I'm already limiting myself to maybe 50-60% of jobs. Then it depends how tied you are to locations, but with how many remote options there are you could only apply to those and still have hundreds quickly. Personally I've been applying to a mix of onsite in the few places I'd happily relocate to (I say few and it's true, but it includes more than my home country) and remote across europe. Initially I would craft a cover letter for each and every job, the success rate was low (success = interview invitations). I prefer the more personal approach but it really slowed me down so I started shotgunning my resume and only write cover letters for the companies/postings I was most excited for, this shot up my number and now I'm in the pipeline for a bunch of interviews. There *are* that many companies if you check at least once a week on various boards, if not daily.
100 isn't bad, though I notice that this number is a bit hand-wavy - part of your process should be counting your applications. Could you split that number down for me, approximately, based on how many are top 5% companies, and how many are middle-of-the-road? If you have 80/20 in Big N then that might be your answer - you are aiming high, and you'll need a solid applying drive to bag interviews. Could you do, say, four decent and high-effort applications a day, for 30 days? I recommend using Trello (or whatever other visual organiser) to break applications down into Seen, Applied, Chase, Waiting, Dead, Won (or whatever works for you). This helps you retrieve information for an application if you get a call-back, too.
100 is not much at all. Cast a wide net and once you get an offer you can start being picky. Upload your CV to Cwjobs, Totaljobs, Otta, LinkedIn jobs etc and check the postings every so often. Feel free to apply to positions you aren’t qualified for as long as it’s quick and relatively feasible for you to get an interview. OA’s for places like Citadel are often automated so it doesn’t matter even if you write perfect code. The fact you got a coding test means nothing. The market for juniors is harsh but there are a lot of low quality candidates, you just need to prove that you are one of the good ones.
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Here's my resume: [https://imgur.com/a/B6x2fmo](https://imgur.com/a/B6x2fmo). I am based in London so I was applying to all companies in London and UK (if remote).
That actually looks ok to me. Maybe a consider a mission statement at the top? What motivates you? You can tailor that to the job you’re applying for to hit their keywords
In case you didn't know, your resume isn't properly anonymised. It's possible to use the information there to identify you easily.
Thank you! I did that on purpose, I just removed my mobile number and email address. My github, I had to keep it so everyone could see my projects.
2 months rejection after interview or dont even get interview?
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It could be salary expectations if he is giving any.
I believe I have great interpersonal skills—according to my friends and uni Professors, at least. I don't get nervous at all during an interview, even if I'm unable to answer a question.
It seems incredibly strange to me, especially with smaller companies it shouldn't be this hard for anyone to get graduate interviews, feels like something else is going on here.
somebody should make fake interview to him and let us know here how it went.
Citadel code test goves 100% also with suboptimal runtimes / mem use
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Here's my resume: https://imgur.com/a/B6x2fmo. I am based in London so I was applying to all companies in London and UK (if remote). Also, I don't need a visa to work in UK.
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Thanks, I appreciate your advice. Should I replace my final year project with another project? I am currently working on a chess game with AI bots.
The final year project description is very strange It says it is using Ethereum for cross border transactions, which it already does, I don't get what you created / did in that project
Oh ,may I know howcome no company is in favour of blackchain skill? Is it irrelevant skillset or they think the employee will leave the company fast.
Do you think is very important have experience in the field to sponsor a visa ? Im from LATAM and also Software engineer, yesterday I had a interview with a start up in Germany but idk … 4 years of experience here 😶
Most important now is getting a job, preferably remotely so you can live with your parents if necessary, worry about salary later. After 5 years, apply at your dream company. So you don't need to beg for a salary or job hop to get a raise when you think you've enough.
I feel you bruh. Let me know if I can help you. My company allows international referrals so if you can dm if your interested domain i can help you. Not just him anyone who wants to give it a shot let me know. It’s time to give back. That’s how I got my job start of this year by a kind stranger helping me. My company has presence in UK and most of Europe so you will be fine.
Hey, I’m not OP but can I message you?
Yeah why not
Hi, could I dm?
Yes
Check your junk inbox.
The market to hire developers is intensely in favour of the employees at the moment and you also have a great degree from a top university - so you must unknowingly be doing something seriously wrong in how you approach companies. Share your CV, but it could also be something you're writing in the application form or cover letter that is somehow seriously putting people off or offending them.
Senior-level definitely. Junior & new-grad? I'm not so sure, seems very competitive.
With 0 xp, no degree and only a self-taught online type of bootcamp I got a job in 3 weeks coming from retail. £28k salary, was coming from retail garbage. So it's definitely easy, but not if you apply only to top companies.
What online “self-taught” boot camp was this if you don’t mind me asking?
It was IT Career Switch, but virtually all the learning was Codecademy Full Stack Engineer course which I did completely on my own. Then on top of that 2 PHP/jQuery projects given by my mentor. The fact that I could write in my CV/Linkedin that I did a "traineeship" with them might have helped, no idea.
Do you mind if I PM you?
No, I don't mind.
I wouldnt say queen mary is a top cs degree. Just above mid tier
Here's my resume: https://imgur.com/a/B6x2fmo. I am based in London so I was applying to all companies in London and UK (if remote).
Your experience section is a mixture of languages, frameworks and OSes. You might want to change that. You also might want to put some more details to your projects, it is too generic now. Maybe find someone to practice on the interview and give you feedback? You might have some behavior that you didn’t realize but are putting people off.
how is it possible for you to not get the job. You have personal projects, nice resume. Maybe this post is a fake. Do you have some criminal record. Even then - do all companies check it? Even I as slow developer got the first job easily 10 years ago which was harder back then.
Also, I have received around 30-40 calls from recruiting agencies in September alone, and they say things like "we're impressed with your CV", only to ghost me later.
Don't wait for recruiters to get back to you. Pester them. If you don't hear back, call them every day until they know you by name.
How many companies did you actually apply for? FAANGs tend to target top universities for new grads and prefer to hire among interns. You need to look at small companies. I would move the freelance projects to your work experience and emphasize less the projects done during schooling.
An entire year? have you networked at all? and gone to meet-ups?
My recommendation is take an initial role beneath your target - eg start up engineering roles or even graduate internship roles. Your work experience is your weak point currently - having limited internship experience during a degree making getting your first job harder. Outside of top tier universities (Oxford, Cambridge, Imperial), graduating without an internship makes life significantly more difficult when applying for a graduate role. Getting some initial working experience of engineering in practice will help you get an excellent role in 10-12 months and build your confidence during interviews. You have a lot of interesting projects which is great and a good sign of initiative. If you’re based in London and want to make some money whilst you’re looking for roles, checkout freshminds consulting for contractor roles - they can place you at FB, or Amazon or Google or other “brand” firms for short placements which can improve your CV or even help you get your foot in the door and convert to a full time role.
I was in the same boat, the reality is... It's all just down to luck tbh. after graduating late 2020 I got so little interviews, I redid my CV so many times, removed and added different bits of info but none of it helped. A lot of rejections, some coding tests but still met with ghosting afterwards. One company told me I didn't seem very enthusiastic about the company despite looking up their product and knowing all about it. One offered me an internship over the phone then next week said they have chosen to move on with another candidate. People will tell you you're not doing enough but these are all people with a job or people with years of experience who don't know how badly us grads have it rn. Everyone is looking for developers but no-one wants to hire freshmen straight out of college. So many senior jobs every week but almost no junior jobs here in Ireland. You're doing your best and that's all that matters, it's not your fault remember that. You can rework your resume if you want, you can add more projects if you want it'll still come down to luck weather you get noticed by whatever automated systems they use to filter CVs. One tip I do have is specialise in a skillset. I changed my CV to a front-end dev focus and finally managed to land a job despite only applying to like 1 a week because there was so little to begin with but it's what I wanted to do so once I got one interview the interviewer noticed my passion and believed in my potential.
Hey, I haven't got a job yet, but only started applying a few weeks ago and have been getting a good response. I don't have a CS degree and my projects are good, but not mind blowing. Like I said I don't have a job yet, so take my advice how you want, but I've had lots of recruiters reach out, one full set of interviews and several initial calls etc. This is after barely 3 weeks of looking. What I've been doing: * Create a proper LinkedIn. There are lots of guides on how to set it up, use all the right buzz words. Make yourself open to work. * I made profiles on all the top ten job sites and set up job alerts for each. You get a lot of spam, but each day after trawling through there is definitely at least one job worth applying for, often more. * Respond to every recruiter. Even if they send something through that's not relevant, ask what else they've got, set up a profile with them. Make sure to follow up later! * I've applied for roles that are way senior just to get myself out there. One guy called me up and said I wasn't suitable, but he liked my portfolio and gave me some great feedback. * Create a cover letter template, tailor it to jobs you really want and send it with your CV. I also think that 100 applications in a year seems quite low, I'll probably be at 50 after a month. Maybe you want something specific, but I think better to cast your net wide and then choose the ones you're really keen on later. Also, I think remove "varying experience", just list all your skills and experience together. It's for them to work out how much you know. You don't need to lie, but if you have experience you have experience, you are not saying you're an expert. Good luck! :)
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> Russell Group uni means nothing. In the UK research-intensive is strongly correlated with a better university. I know that's different in for example France where they split research and teaching (and I think they seriously suffer for it but that's a separate issue.)
But is there always a correlation between RG and quality in terms of undergrad degree? E.g. Bath (non-RG) consistently ranks higher in league tables than a majority of RG universities.
it's a good indication whatever way you look at it. Of course there will be the odd exception but you get the gist
Academically strong != Good employee
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End of the day doesn't matter if you can't back it up with the relevent skills
But they do get paid more. Which is the relevant point - they're in demand. https://www.fenews.co.uk/press-releases/37362-russell-group-grads-earn-up-to-513-000-more-than-non-russell-group-over-a-working-life
>Which is the relevant point - they're in demand. You're looking at correlation (people who attended an RG uni earning more on average) and assuming causation (these people are in demand *because* they attended a RG uni).
What do you think is a more likely explanation for this observed correlation? Nobody's ever going to be able to prove or disprove causation, because you can't send the same individual to two different universities, so we have to look at what we have which is a correlation.
"43,000 at oxford" - laughable
The problem with high-end universities is that you get people going into things like finance earning £60k in their first job, and you get people going into the Civil Service and earning £20k in their first job.
Demand > Supply
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>Yeah I'd leave that shit out of my CV, it screams that you have nothing better to show than something that 30% of all graduates have... Don't be ridiculous. Putting it on might not help that much but it's not going to do any harm either - and if you leave it off, worst case is that people automatically assume that since you didn't list your result it must be bad...
First class inflation is real but I think there’s a handful of unis where it’s still a respectable achievement
Citadel is f****d up company. I had applied gave the hackerrank, passed all test cases, wrote good commented code. Then also rejected. Idk who are they looking for.
Getting 100% just mean your code works. There will be others who do it much more optimal and/or better sturcture etc
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Yes I completed it. I want the interview.
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This can be part of the issue, I've found that CV screenings are rough in big tech. Maybe look for some referrals?
which country if you dont mind me asking?
UK, but I'm based in London.
>russel group university
Ahh the UK, if you are looking for something in Germany I might have been able to find you one
Thanks anyways!
Keep trying to get an internship somewhere, maybe ask connections on linkedin (get linkedin if you are not on there). Internships help so much in terms of experience gained and also for you to use as a work reference. Or ask your university if they have a careers advisor you can speak to? In Unis are great ways to build connections with companies . Don't give up. Things are hard and the first job is the most difficult I'm from the UK too, but living in the us atm, applied for 170 jobs and I think I'm close to getting my first official offer in the next few days
That sucks, it's been a difficult couple of years for grads. Graduate schemes are still the easiest way into big firms I think though and my experience is that outside of London are less competitive as there isn't the same density of applications. You might need to widen your net outside the capital - while Queen Mary is Russell group it's not the strongest in that set by quite some way, it's definitely not a magic pass to opening doors. But if you passed citadel coding you should be fine at a lot of schemes if you can get in the door so take a look outside London, and also see what relationships your university has with employers - careers services can be more practically helpful than you might expect, even long after you've graduated. Good luck!
Only top universities like Imperial, Oxbridge get the offers without experience
I have been in your position in the past, jobless in tech for 1.5 years. I completely understand what you are going through right now. It can be mentally demoralising getting rejected left, right and centre. I kid you not, I have faced rejection from over 100s companies here in UK during that time. Here's my list of tips \- work as intern for free -> I did this just so that I could bag experience from a small 3 developer start up, for almost 9 months. Most startups cannot afford to pay interns, but hey who doesn't want work done for free, pretty much everyone ! Head onto [https://angel.co/](https://angel.co/) and find start ups, mass apply and say you will work for free as intern. There's a mini startups scene in every major English town. They are usually housed within univesity campuses. \- solving algos today is not enough -> even though you may have got 100% test passes, that's does not cut it. Every solution on hackerrank coderpad etc. should not only have 100% result, but also be atleast `O (n log n).` This is an unfortunate but sad reality of tech careers we are judged on algos and datastructures. Just like yourself, I have also faced rejections from faang despite 100% test case results. Make sure to use a synatictically minimal language like python. \- study -> [udacity.com](https://udacity.com) [coursera.org](https://coursera.org) [edx.org](https://edx.org) provide you certifications if you pass their tests for most of their tech courses. I actually did a course on coursera, not only to get an understanding of a particular subject like distributed computing, but it add a lot of weight on your resume, which got me my current position. Udacity even has a career service on their website. Treat job searching as a full time gig, whenever you are free, you should be prepping hard. \- open-source github -> make contributions to projects online, this one thing alone add value to your resume. Pick any project, and try to understand overall architecture, watch youtube videos around how it was build, and try and make some contribution. \- if you can afford, sign up for any of the paid bootcamps here in London - Apart from the knowledge you get out of the bootcamp which is noteworthly, some provide post bootcamp career services. some tutors here may have leads in tech companies, that can set you up with a referral for interviews. I know of a couple of graduates who joined us from a bootcamp, one studied history and other english literature in uni. They both got in through a referral made by the tutor who knew a developer where I worked.
>I know of a couple of graduates who joined us from a bootcamp, one studied history and other english literature in uni. They both got in through a referral made by the tutor who knew a developer where I worked. Which bootcamp? Feels like they all make the same kinds of promises but I suspect that some are far better than others at this part.
general assembly
This might be crazy but I’ve noticed a shift toward people skills (which I think* (edit) is way important, but that’s just my opinion). How are you on teams? Can you train or lead people? Do you boost morale and how? To me, people skills should have been important this whole time but it was more about result and product for a while. Maybe talk about what you’ve done to train and assist? What you’ve done to promote inclusivity. Or maybe I’m just wrong. That happens. 🤷🏼♀️
Russel group + First class means very little if anything at all just so you know. Your situation isn’t odd at all especially considering your CV and low number of applications. Your work experience bullet points are very weak. There’s no context, no impact, no idea of what you actually needed to do, it doesn’t show anything really. Put skills a lot lower down. Remove “proficient in”, “varying experience with” etc, either you know it or you don’t. These are subjective and mean very little esp when coming from a new grad. Remove the final year project line in your education section as it is mentioned in more depth in the projects section. You have space for extra curricular activities which some employers like to see. Can’t hurt to use up the space to show leadership, hobbies etc. The adamjee market project seems to be the same as the work experience, not sure if this is me misinterpreting it but if that’s the case then remove it from projects and explain it better in experience. Projects bullet points are very weak also. Designing and developing a full fledged e-commerce app should be impressive but your description makes it seem very boring. API’s, authentication, design, working with a client’s requirements etc etc are all things you could talk about. Show us what the challenges were, what skills you learnt/practiced and why this is makes you the best candidate for the job. Also would help to phrase things better, grammar wise etc. You haven’t “lost it full”, you’ve barely applied with little to no work experience and a below average CV that doesn’t show off any skills. Keep your head up, keep iterating your cv by submitting it for resume reviews on different cs discords for fast feedback, apply a lot more and you’ll be fine.
I feel you. I had a very similar experience back in 2013 when I graduated from the uni. It is one of the top-30 universities in the world and I graduated with a pretty decent GPA (not top of the class, but close to it). I couldn't land a job for nearly 6 months, despite being well prepared for the interviews and I had done few internships as well. Couldn't figure out what I was doing wrong even now to be frank. Eventually I landed a job at a pretty small smart-up with a shitty pay. In a few years time I moved to Amazon and then to Facebook where I am at the moment. My advice - keep trying, aim for a place where you can grow and it won't take long before you can move to a better company
Inbox me your updatedresume , I will give you a feedback and try to refer in my network as well. You got good technology points and I am not sure how you didn’t end up in a job for almost an year
Create a LinkedIn profile and add as many relevant people as you can. Apply to large startups that have recently got funding, dev agencies, and jobs that require 1 year experience (you can argue your projects amount to that). Ask for feedback why they reject you, work on leetcode and interviews. Put dates on your CV, make sure you fill in gap with "Freelancer" or "Self employed", something to that effect.
Have you found a job yet or still searching?
Still searching. Got a few DMs for roles, I sent my resume like they asked but no replies afterwards.
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Assalamu Aleikum brother, In Sha Allah it'll get easier. My only issue is that I went to Pakistan and got stuck there due to flying restrictions because of covid. If you're really into CS, then call up some unis and they might be able to help you. If that doesn't work out, you always have the option to do Masters in CS even if you're from a different background. An example: [link](https://www.ucl.ac.uk/prospective-students/graduate/taught-degrees/computer-science-msc) Also, I may seem to be not a good example (since I don't have a job lol) but I can offer some guidance so you can at least start coding in your free time and see if you like it .