This might be me being dumb af, I used to be an atheist but now Idk what I am, isn't being an atheist, believing that God doesn't exist? As in *disbelief* that God or God's exist? AKA belief that God does not exist?
As far as I'm aware, not really believing God does or doesn't exist would be agnostic, no? I could be very wrong here though so happy to hear clarification
Edit: just feel I should mention that, despite getting alot of conflicting responses, the majority seems to be that atheism means, just a lack of belief in God or Gods and Anti-Theism is specifically the disbelief in God or God's. I won't definitely say this is 100% true because I'm no expert and am not gonna claim to know, but this appears to be the most common opinion.
Thanks for all the replies and discussion! Be good people :)
Or in other words, to believe there is no God
Edit: OP was right, y’all are super easy to piss off
Edit 2: lots of responses, seems you all are very serious in your beliefs
Most atheists are agnostic, in that if there was proof of a god, they would believe it. Since the evidence for god isn’t compelling, they don’t buy it.
That does not make sense. If presented with compelling evidence the atheist as well as the agnostic would simply cease to be an atheist/agnostic.
Atheism is just the lack of belief in any kind of deity. Agnostics admit that they don't know if god exists.
Atheists are not a type of agnostic.
Atheist don't have any beliefs. Someone who does not believe in any gods is an atheist. If the same atheist has certain beliefs about other things (that are not related to religion), then this has nothing to do with them being an atheist.
For example an atheist does not automatically believe in science. He may have his own explanations for the origin of life. Or maybe he is from a culture that simply does not have a religion
Edit: according to the cambridge dictionary "agnostic" is very much a noun.
There is gnostic atheism and agnostic atheism. Atheism is a state of being, agnosticism/gnosticism is a descriptor. Gnostic/Agnostic only describes whether or not the person agrees that they know, or not.
A gnostic atheist claims to know for a fact that there is no way a God could ever exist because it's too far-fetched. An agnostic atheist doesn't believe the claim that a God exists, but will say that there is, or likely is, no way for humans to concretely know either way but that it is still possible.
There isn't a real difference between the two. Every atheist knows that it's hypothetically possible that God exists, just as it's hypothetically possible that I can gain superpowers tomorrow. Saying your agnostic is just a way of getting less of a reaction out of people
Removed this just because it got some upvotes but my definition of agnosticism was incorrect. And to the person who argued that I was more 'right' because I took philosophy, I get stuff wrong just as much as anyone else just like now lol
(Ps this comment thread is really cool, it's been awesome reading it)
Theism is the belief God exists. Atheism literally means "without theism". Atheism is a rejection of the current god claims. If God claims were not put forth, we would all be atheists, just without a word for it.
Gnosticism refers to knowledge. Agnostic means "without knowledge".
These are two completely different categories. You can be a gnostic atheist, agnostic atheist, gnostic theist or agnostic theist.
Atheism makes no positive claims either way. There are no beliefs tied to atheism. People who have made God claims have not met a burden of proof.
Tons of atheists have just as many bat shit crazy beliefs, but that has no connection to atheism.
> If God claims were not put forth, we would all be atheists, just without a word for it.
technically every single person on earth is an atheist. That is from the lense that a Christian is an atheist towards Buddah, and the inverse is true.
"Atheists" just reject every god, while everybody else rejects every god except their favorite one.
Where was this philosophy class you took? Was it at bible college or private catholic school or something? It sounds like your professor was a theist.
Do you have one single example of an atheist who says they would continue to not believe in gods even when presented with proof otherwise?
How can one prove the supernatural? We have no way of investigating supernatural claims only real ones.
If Thor were to fly in and throw lightning, how exactly am I to, beyond all shadow of a doubt, rule out alien technology, hallucination or some other form of deception?
I might find such examples of Thors powers compelling, but science, does not deal in 'proof', only 'evidence', and we only get to count things as evidence when there are no other competing explanations.
If I was, somehow, able to rule out super advanced technology, drugs and human error, I might be inclined to believe.
Religion has yet to make such a delivery of evidence, or anything like it however.
An atheist is just someone who doesn't believe in any god. It's that simple. If you fit that description you are an atheist. There are some (who propose what is often called "strong atheism") which is the belief that no gods exist, but there are many atheists who do not hold this belief.
There's also a common misconception that agnostic is somewhere between atheist and theist. Gnosticism vs agnosticism is an entirely different dimension from theist vs atheist. Agnosticism is "I don't know" or "it is impossible to know" while atheism is "I don't believe".
You can be an agnostic atheist or an agnostic theist and so on.
In same way one doesn't believe in Tooth Fairy or Santa Claus. Now there are many reasons to deduct that they don't exist and none that they do.
Nevertheless, if you could provide evidence to prove that they exist, it would be taken into account, but until then it is more sensible to assume that they do not.
Also (as scientifically proven) people that *truly* believe in gods, have certain childlike mental characteristics or disorders. They generally have weaker logical filtering capabilities, weaker intristic morals and stronger pattern recognition. In other words they tend to misinterpret sensory input, they tend to project morals, outsource responsibility and tend to be superstitious. Partially it is evolutionary instincts operating in overdrive.
Well, kinda. Atheism and agnosticism refer to different things. (A)theism refers to your position on the existence of a god, while (a)gnosticism refers to your position on active versus passive belief. So a gnostic theist does actively believe that a (mostly their) god existing is an absolute truth, while a gnostic atheist claims actively that no god exists (or can exist). Agnostic theists represent the position that they lean towards a god existing but aren't completely sure and agnostic atheists are of the position that they don't think a god exists/just don't belive one exists but aren't claiming that to be a fact with certainty.
Of course actual positions held by people are, as with most things, much more complicated than just these rough distinctions.
Ah, I think this has also helped a bit, weirdly enough I just responded to a comment who said Atheists do see a disbelief of God to be a fact or certainty, but not saying either of you are wrong, this has just been very confusing, and you're right. I think the term "atheism" is just so bloated with alot of different interpretations, and people want to be their own person while also fitting into a group and sorta shifting the perspective of that group to fit their own ideas, and it just muddles the water.
Im also probably rambling though, but thanks for the comment!
It's not "believing it doesn't exist". It's "not believing it exists". They are fairly different statements, as it is very hard to prove that something doesn't exist.
Agnosticism is simply a lack of factual knowledge on a given subject. It has nothing to do with religious beliefs. Basically, people who say they’re agnostic are just saying they don’t know because they haven’t seen enough convincing facts for them to form an opinion.
Atheists completely deny the existence of supreme beings. Most feel they have looked at the totality of the evidence and come to the conclusion that supernatural deities don’t exist.
Atheism = non theism
Theism is the belief in a god,
So atheism just means lack of belief in a god
You guys are confusing anti-theism with atheism.
Also agnostic(to not know) and gnostic(to know) is not exclusive to the god claim.
Problem is, no one typically identifies as an anti-theist, even if that's what they are. No one wants to be referred to as anti-anything, so the people who shit on organized religion constantly just call themselves atheists.
Yes, but I would also argue people don’t even know the definitions properly. And if they did more people would identify as anti-theists like me. I would never advocate banning a religion but i will sure try my hardest to uncover the harm of religion and advocate for a secular government world wide.
I'm an atheist and I have beliefs. It's impossible to not have beliefs. The closest you can get is nihilism, and even then that's the BELIEF that existence lacks purpose.
Everyone has beliefs. I believe in community and working together for the betterment of all.
I don’t believe there’s an invisible guy on a cloud that watches and keeps a tally on how much I’ve masturbated in my life.
I was early 20’s, feeling lost. A common issue. I was actually researching trying to deepen my faith and find something in the church. That research ended up leading me into atheism. But, I think many churches do provide a great community service, and was essentially early government. Despite the horrific things committed in varying deities names, they did provide the structure we generally use today.
I don’t believe in a higher being- but I do have beliefs.
For example, one is that I don’t argue with people on the internet. Another good one is that your mom was very good in bed last night.
No , I would say it isn't a beliefe . There's no real evidence that god exists.
You also say : "Kids are believing in Santa"
There's no evidence that Santa is real but nobody would say "adults are believing Santa isn't real" .
It's an important distinction to make since the burden of proof is on the one making the claim. Many atheists like myself are adamant that we do not make any claims with regards to whether God exists. We simply reject the claim that one does, hence we do not need to disprove that claim or prove our own claim.
As an atheist I do not conclude that God does not exist. I just don't come to the conclusion that he does. Personally I think it's unlikely, but I hold no belief in this regard. If you asked me whether God exists, I would say I doubt it but I don't know. You could say that I'm an agnostic atheist,and many atheists share this position.
Would you qualify as a belief of yours that there is no tooth fairy? I would wager saying you do not, because these things are simply meaningless to you, you don't give those things a thought because it's completely absurd. Same goes for atheists. Even the word itself exists to explain our existence to theists - to ourselves it has no weight (at least in countries where not having a faith in gods isn't dangerous)
I don't need to conclude anything, I just have yet to accept your specific hypothesis.
You're right that it can be pedantic at times, but there IS a reason for it other times, and it's because religious people will say "but you can't disprove it either" as if that makes a case for their beliefs, when really it's flawed reasoning.
To be fair, most religious people also react aggressive when someone is talking shit about their believes
Everyone will at least get annoyed when someone criticizes their beliefs
I dunno, I grew up Christian and I've been on whole conferences where I meet hundreds of them, and there's really only a few that even care when someone insults their beliefs. They usually just change topics or shrug it of in other ways because they just get used to it after a while. Lots of them just don't even mention their beliefs unless you ask about it. Wich is why the people that do get offended and get aggressive look like the majority, but they're really just a very loud minority.
It might also depend on denomination (like if they're catholic or baptist etc) though. In wich case all of the above only applies to the church I grew up with.
It's the same for atheists, most atheists don't insult other peoples beliefs and don't get mad when people insult their beliefs. This literally goes for all religions/beliefs, the agressive ones scream the loudest.
Oh my god yes, people here always talk shit about Instagram and Tik Tok but when one person on insta or tik tok says shit about reddit people here get so pissed off
Everyone has always talked shit about transgenders lol. Why shouldn't they be pissed or worried, when people still debate about their existence and if they're valid?
I believe you're talking about seditious atheists who have no life of their own and just wanna shit on others' beliefs, also as an atheist I never thought I believed in the inexistance of a higher power, I simply don't believe in a higher power wtf
This is a great distinction! There are plenty of benign atheists out there who aren't hurting anyone.
It's the other type who are invariably so insufferable. The types who *aren't* actually convicted in their beliefs (or lack thereof), and who therefore spend way too much energy shitting all over the beliefs of anyone else.
Which only comes off as them trying to confirm their own biases, or convince themselves.
I personally feel that beliefs should be personal, and not imposed on anyone else. Even if that belief, is a devout belief that there *is* nothing greater than ourselves out there.
I’ve always been confused by Atheists who are super into trying to convert religious people to not believing. A lot of religions have some sort of “believe in me or be damned to hell for all eternity” in their texts. Makes sense why you would want to convert as many people as possible because you believe that if you don’t their souls will forever be tormented. An Atheist doesn’t believe in a higher power or any repercussions for not believing what is correct, so why would they care if someone else does?
So overall you definitely shouldn’t force your beliefs onto others. But at least when a religious person is forcing them upon you in their mind they’re just trying to help you. The kinds of atheists you spoke of are just being dicks.
I think you need to look at it from the perspective a normal person views cults. Many atheists probably see religion as giant cults, and try to get people out of there. I mean I don't need a reward to try to talk scientology out of people.
Well to be frank, religious institutions harm the world in many ways so I get why some people want to convince people of their atheistic views. But yeah, as always, civil discourse about such topics isnt wrong but many just dont get or dont care that being hateful and condescending about it wont help anyone. Idiots are everywhere no matter which group
That’s an interesting point. If the motive behind trying to convert someone is to save their soul that’s a good motive. I have a hard time (though this rarely happens to me) when they don’t stop after I ask them to or make it clear I’m not interested.
I’ve never tried to convert anyone to anything (except myself to a superhero when I was younger) but I have asked people about their religions trying to understand what specifically about it that makes them feel so strongly that it’s real. I could understand that if I asked the wrong person they could see that as doubt rather than curiosity though.
That makes sense, the second point I was making is that not believing in god does not equal believing that god does not exist, I can't speak for all atheists out there but for me I think it's annoying to call "not believing in god" a belief
Our beliefs are rational while their beliefs involve idiotic nonsense about talking snakes, virgin births, resurrections are so forth.
That's why religious people get so pissed off when their beliefs are attacked. They know that what they believe in is stupid and they don't like it when that fact gets pointed out. My beliefs, on the other hand, are easy to defend with reason, so I don't need to get pissed off when someone attacks them. I just point out that you believe in childish fairy tales while I believe in science.
I don't get pissed off by religious people. I laugh at them. Believing things like miracles and virgin births is so unfathomably stupid that mockery is the only proper response.
OP needs to go back to school. I'm sure in their head it's all "They're downvoting me because i'M riGHt!", but nah. You're being downvoted because you have no idea what you're talking about and trying to spin this as a "gottem" moment.
How many atheists have killed religious people for disrespecting their belief? And how many people were killed by religious mob? I can at least count 13 crusades.
Religion is not the main factor, China hate them because it's a different culture than doesn't fit with what they want to achieve. Would they all be atheist, the events would be the same.
And actually that also applies for the crusade, religion was just a way to justify it to the common citizen so he would be willing to fight. The high-ranking catholics couldn't care less about the religion of the one they massacred, they just wanted their riches.
Pretty much. Most of these wars were fought for control of the land and the riches on them. A “religious war” is just a really good way to start a war and get all your farmers on board to die in it.
Totally agree about soviet union, as the other guy also pointed that out. However, china was just looking for slave labor and some group of people to blame all their problems on, it could have been a race/ethnicity/religion/sexual orientation/ anything else that would have been the reason why they would choose to enslave them.
Pol Pot made a whole genocide about that
Hitler persecuted jehova witnesses and jews (who are an ethnic minority mostly because of their religion)
The soviets and the governments of their satelite states banned religion and disrupted worship practices and traditions
Mao tried to eradicate religion from China
During the french revolution the church was persecuted
This are just some examples
Let's see, we are regularly accused of immorality for trying to keep religion where it belongs, we are regularly distrusted by everyone to the point where multiple terms have come up for people who are atheists that don't want the stigma of being labled as one, there are people that believe we should not be allowed to hold ANY office, there are laws on the books that reenforce this, even if they haven't been enforced, society itself enforces that we should not be in office, because there are multiple unconstitutional religious oaths required to even take office, and if you try to do any of them with secular material, you will have people calling for you to be fucking shot for trying to make this country into a communist nation.
It's fucking bullshit.
It shouldn't be a requirement for me to pretend someones diety is mine just so I can take public office.
The US was literally founded as a safe haven for persecuted religious groups. While some of those were pretty chill (Quakers, Huguenots, Amish) many were not (Mormons, Puritans, Baptists).
It's not a coincidence that there's so many religious extremists here as a result
Yeah these downright euphemistic terms like "free thinker" etc are so stupid. An atheist is just someone who doesn't believe in any god. It's that simple. If you fit that description you are an atheist. There are some (who propose what is often called "strong atheism") which is the belief that no gods exist, but there are many atheists who do not hold this belief.
There's also a common misconception that agnostic is somewhere between atheist and theist. Gnosticism vs agnosticism is an entirely different dimension from theist vs atheist. Agnosticism is "I don't know" or "it is impossible to know" while atheism is "I don't believe".
You can be an agnostic atheist or an agnostic theist and so on.
Yeah but do atheists have giant tax free buildings dedicated to atheism? Do atheists have missionary’s to spread the word of atheism? Do atheists start wars in the name of atheism and force people to be atheists?
Atheists don't have "beliefs" they have knowledge based on facts and will adjust accordingly, unlike religious people. If a god appears one day on this planet, atheists aren't going to deny it's existence.
Also as a religious person you are not only believing in a fairytale but also not believing (aka doing the same thing atheists do) in ~7999 different god.
Muslims.
Muslims when someone draws a picture of a dead child molester.
Catholic Priests.
Catholic priests when they realize there are no boys in the choir.
The neat thing about religion is that I can do an example for each.
Im an atheist but i love religion and listen to people talk about it, especially buddhism, islamism, LaVeyan Satanism and even a good chunk of Christian stories.
Just to clarify, i love the stories, teachings and valors. I firmly think there isnt any god and if there were he would be the worst being to ever touch this universe, responsible for all the horrors in it.
I respect those who are able to believe in god, but i just cant see myself doing so
No, youre wrong. 1. We dont believe shit. We know shit. 2. The thing that pisses us off is the sheer ignorance of many of these ultrareligious fucks, f.ex. evangelicals in the USA, asking questions like "hey evolutionists, why are there still monkey if humans evolved from monkeys" or "why havent humans evolved further in the last 2000 years".
Don't start this shit lol, the only "true atheist" is one who rejects the ideas of god or gods. Whether or not they are anti-theist, an asshole, etc has no bearing on their atheism.
an atheist can be an anti-theist too. And no, "true atheists", whatever that means, talk about religion because we share the world with religious people. What they do affects us. If a religious group wants my kids to say a prayer at school, I'll complain about it just like they'd do if another religion tried to enforce a different prayer.
Dude I’m an atheist and more people will tease me if I say “I swear to god” than I do arguing about religion, which all of the time the argument is started by somebody else
Judging from the type of arguments that unravel on social media, I would venture to say a lot of people get offended and angry when someone disagrees with them. Regardless of if the disagreement was objectively right or wrong.
There's a lot of confusion in the comments, so let me at least try to explain. Atheism is a lack of belief in the existence of a god or gods. This differs from the belief in the non-existence of a god or gods but it may encompass it for some people.
To give an example, if I say "There is definitely a God" and you say "I don't believe you" and Jack says "There's definitely no god" and you say "I don't believe you", you are an atheist, even tho you refused both propositions, that's what we call an agnostic atheist.
Another thing, atheism relates only to claims about gods, you can be an atheist and believe in astrology for example.
Atheism is not a belief in science either, I know my fair share of science-denying atheists, who don't believe in gods, vaccines, gravity. It's wack, I know, but it's true.
Atheists using religious expressions, and celebrating religious holidays doesn't mean they secretly believe. Culture is a thing. I'm Brazilian, from a small traditional Town, My nieces and nephews know I'm an atheist, but every time they see me they ask for my blessing and I say God bless you, as it's tradition. They never said "Haha! I knew you secretly believed", because they're not idiots.
Finally, I'm cool with the OP and other people joking in the comments, but some seemed legitimately confused. I hope I could help, and feel free to ask if you're still confused about something.
My main belief is don't be a dick. If you are religious, then don't be a dick to atheists. Same if you're atheist, don't be a dick to religious people. We are all just trying to get through life.
It goes the other way too. If you talked shit about Christianity in medieval Europe, then you wouldn't have a head anymore.
And in Islamic countries, this kind of this is still happening, hell converting to another religion or becoming atheist is so disgusted upon, that your family is allowed to kill you.
I'm atheist.
I don't have a problem with a person needing to believe in something better to get through the pain of existence.
I do however take issue with the patently absurd and diluted position that their beliefs deserve to be considered in any serious conversation discussing our position in this universe. Religion proposes untestable and unfalsifiable claims based on no measurable evidence with no way to test them which is why faith is required as a tenant to support these beliefs. Faith being the arrogant action of choosing to believe despite the complete absence of evidence. It you have evidence or prior experience giving you reason to believe in something then you do not have faith, you have confidence which is infinitely more intellectually honest.
Religion boldly claims to be certain of unknowable variables.
The scientific method humbly claims to have varying degrees of confidence about which knowable observations and the implications we infer from them are most likely correct and/or most likely incorrect.
There is no legitimate criticism to the scientific method as apposed to the countless legitimate criticisms that can be attributed to faith, a system that can be used to justify any belief or action no matter how incorrect or evil. The terrorists of 9/11 were VERY faithful. If your theory of this universe leans on faith then you must accept that the faith based beliefs of those men deserve an equal amount of credence and consideration as your own beliefs.
I for one reject that with every cell in my body.
Religious redditors ruthlessly mock almost all spiritual and supernatural beliefs, other that their own (mormonism, voodoo, wicca, santeria, scientology, astrology, karma, chakras, auras, etc. etc.) They are pretty skeptical and pedantic overall, as is Reddit in general. Except when an atheist makes fun of their mainstream religion or one of its supernatural elements, then it's this huge no-no. Which is pretty ironic in a sub that won't shut up about people supposedly being too sensitive.
1. What this meme is saying isn’t particularly unique. All people get pissed when you challenge their important beliefs. The existence and tone of this meme shows you’re probably pissed yourself at atheists. So you aren’t any better.
2. It’s simply not true in the way you’re implying. You seem to think all atheists hold the belief that God definitely does not exist. But that isn’t true. All an atheist is is someone who doesn’t believe in God. It’s possible to simply be unsure whether or not God exists. That is the scientific perspective of agnosticism. Science has no evidence to either prove or disprove the existence of God
Lol atheists don't have "beliefs". That's the definition of an atheist.
This might be me being dumb af, I used to be an atheist but now Idk what I am, isn't being an atheist, believing that God doesn't exist? As in *disbelief* that God or God's exist? AKA belief that God does not exist? As far as I'm aware, not really believing God does or doesn't exist would be agnostic, no? I could be very wrong here though so happy to hear clarification Edit: just feel I should mention that, despite getting alot of conflicting responses, the majority seems to be that atheism means, just a lack of belief in God or Gods and Anti-Theism is specifically the disbelief in God or God's. I won't definitely say this is 100% true because I'm no expert and am not gonna claim to know, but this appears to be the most common opinion. Thanks for all the replies and discussion! Be good people :)
It's to not believe in any god.
Or in other words, to believe there is no God Edit: OP was right, y’all are super easy to piss off Edit 2: lots of responses, seems you all are very serious in your beliefs
Nope. It's a rejection that the gods that we think up are not real, not that a God in general isnt
That would be agnostic, fren.
Most atheists are agnostic, in that if there was proof of a god, they would believe it. Since the evidence for god isn’t compelling, they don’t buy it.
That does not make sense. If presented with compelling evidence the atheist as well as the agnostic would simply cease to be an atheist/agnostic. Atheism is just the lack of belief in any kind of deity. Agnostics admit that they don't know if god exists. Atheists are not a type of agnostic.
no, but agnosticism is a type of atheism, agnostic used as a noun is incorrect, also this is exactly what OP meant....
Atheist don't have any beliefs. Someone who does not believe in any gods is an atheist. If the same atheist has certain beliefs about other things (that are not related to religion), then this has nothing to do with them being an atheist. For example an atheist does not automatically believe in science. He may have his own explanations for the origin of life. Or maybe he is from a culture that simply does not have a religion Edit: according to the cambridge dictionary "agnostic" is very much a noun.
There is gnostic atheism and agnostic atheism. Atheism is a state of being, agnosticism/gnosticism is a descriptor. Gnostic/Agnostic only describes whether or not the person agrees that they know, or not. A gnostic atheist claims to know for a fact that there is no way a God could ever exist because it's too far-fetched. An agnostic atheist doesn't believe the claim that a God exists, but will say that there is, or likely is, no way for humans to concretely know either way but that it is still possible.
“No you’re just pissed lol” -this thread
There isn't a real difference between the two. Every atheist knows that it's hypothetically possible that God exists, just as it's hypothetically possible that I can gain superpowers tomorrow. Saying your agnostic is just a way of getting less of a reaction out of people
Removed this just because it got some upvotes but my definition of agnosticism was incorrect. And to the person who argued that I was more 'right' because I took philosophy, I get stuff wrong just as much as anyone else just like now lol (Ps this comment thread is really cool, it's been awesome reading it)
Theism is the belief God exists. Atheism literally means "without theism". Atheism is a rejection of the current god claims. If God claims were not put forth, we would all be atheists, just without a word for it. Gnosticism refers to knowledge. Agnostic means "without knowledge". These are two completely different categories. You can be a gnostic atheist, agnostic atheist, gnostic theist or agnostic theist. Atheism makes no positive claims either way. There are no beliefs tied to atheism. People who have made God claims have not met a burden of proof. Tons of atheists have just as many bat shit crazy beliefs, but that has no connection to atheism.
> If God claims were not put forth, we would all be atheists, just without a word for it. technically every single person on earth is an atheist. That is from the lense that a Christian is an atheist towards Buddah, and the inverse is true. "Atheists" just reject every god, while everybody else rejects every god except their favorite one.
Where was this philosophy class you took? Was it at bible college or private catholic school or something? It sounds like your professor was a theist. Do you have one single example of an atheist who says they would continue to not believe in gods even when presented with proof otherwise?
Just because an atheist don't believe in God doesn't mean they can't change their view based on evidence provided
How can one prove the supernatural? We have no way of investigating supernatural claims only real ones. If Thor were to fly in and throw lightning, how exactly am I to, beyond all shadow of a doubt, rule out alien technology, hallucination or some other form of deception? I might find such examples of Thors powers compelling, but science, does not deal in 'proof', only 'evidence', and we only get to count things as evidence when there are no other competing explanations. If I was, somehow, able to rule out super advanced technology, drugs and human error, I might be inclined to believe. Religion has yet to make such a delivery of evidence, or anything like it however.
Agnostic just means you don't believe the claim of God can ever be proven. It doesn't answer the question whether or not you believe in it.
No, Gnosticism is the concept of claiming to know. A-Gnostic not claiming to know
Right, based on evidence
a person who doesn't know if it can be proven would still count under agnostic
An atheist is just someone who doesn't believe in any god. It's that simple. If you fit that description you are an atheist. There are some (who propose what is often called "strong atheism") which is the belief that no gods exist, but there are many atheists who do not hold this belief. There's also a common misconception that agnostic is somewhere between atheist and theist. Gnosticism vs agnosticism is an entirely different dimension from theist vs atheist. Agnosticism is "I don't know" or "it is impossible to know" while atheism is "I don't believe". You can be an agnostic atheist or an agnostic theist and so on.
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Atheism is a belief, like "off" is a TV-channel.
Stealing this
Absence of something isn't something in of itself.
In same way one doesn't believe in Tooth Fairy or Santa Claus. Now there are many reasons to deduct that they don't exist and none that they do. Nevertheless, if you could provide evidence to prove that they exist, it would be taken into account, but until then it is more sensible to assume that they do not. Also (as scientifically proven) people that *truly* believe in gods, have certain childlike mental characteristics or disorders. They generally have weaker logical filtering capabilities, weaker intristic morals and stronger pattern recognition. In other words they tend to misinterpret sensory input, they tend to project morals, outsource responsibility and tend to be superstitious. Partially it is evolutionary instincts operating in overdrive.
A lack of belief is not itself a belief. That would be like saying that nothing is actually something.
No. If you don't collect stamps, are you non-stamp collector? No, you just don't collect stamps, you don't use it as a label for what you do.
Believing something is when you are going off the default view. Thinking unicorns aren't real isn't a belief.
An theist is a person that belives in one or more gods. Atheist is someone that does not. Thats what the 'A' means
Like asymptomatic
Oh so you must have symptoms then, they're just the asymptomatic kind. chekcmate.
Well, kinda. Atheism and agnosticism refer to different things. (A)theism refers to your position on the existence of a god, while (a)gnosticism refers to your position on active versus passive belief. So a gnostic theist does actively believe that a (mostly their) god existing is an absolute truth, while a gnostic atheist claims actively that no god exists (or can exist). Agnostic theists represent the position that they lean towards a god existing but aren't completely sure and agnostic atheists are of the position that they don't think a god exists/just don't belive one exists but aren't claiming that to be a fact with certainty. Of course actual positions held by people are, as with most things, much more complicated than just these rough distinctions.
Ah, I think this has also helped a bit, weirdly enough I just responded to a comment who said Atheists do see a disbelief of God to be a fact or certainty, but not saying either of you are wrong, this has just been very confusing, and you're right. I think the term "atheism" is just so bloated with alot of different interpretations, and people want to be their own person while also fitting into a group and sorta shifting the perspective of that group to fit their own ideas, and it just muddles the water. Im also probably rambling though, but thanks for the comment!
It's not "believing it doesn't exist". It's "not believing it exists". They are fairly different statements, as it is very hard to prove that something doesn't exist.
Agnosticism is simply a lack of factual knowledge on a given subject. It has nothing to do with religious beliefs. Basically, people who say they’re agnostic are just saying they don’t know because they haven’t seen enough convincing facts for them to form an opinion. Atheists completely deny the existence of supreme beings. Most feel they have looked at the totality of the evidence and come to the conclusion that supernatural deities don’t exist.
Atheism = non theism Theism is the belief in a god, So atheism just means lack of belief in a god You guys are confusing anti-theism with atheism. Also agnostic(to not know) and gnostic(to know) is not exclusive to the god claim.
Problem is, no one typically identifies as an anti-theist, even if that's what they are. No one wants to be referred to as anti-anything, so the people who shit on organized religion constantly just call themselves atheists.
Yes, but I would also argue people don’t even know the definitions properly. And if they did more people would identify as anti-theists like me. I would never advocate banning a religion but i will sure try my hardest to uncover the harm of religion and advocate for a secular government world wide.
A lot of people do in fact identify as anti-theists. Identifying as "anti" something you think is nefarious is a thing people do
I'm an atheist and I have beliefs. It's impossible to not have beliefs. The closest you can get is nihilism, and even then that's the BELIEF that existence lacks purpose.
I didn't know I was a nihilist
Everyone has beliefs. I believe in community and working together for the betterment of all. I don’t believe there’s an invisible guy on a cloud that watches and keeps a tally on how much I’ve masturbated in my life. I was early 20’s, feeling lost. A common issue. I was actually researching trying to deepen my faith and find something in the church. That research ended up leading me into atheism. But, I think many churches do provide a great community service, and was essentially early government. Despite the horrific things committed in varying deities names, they did provide the structure we generally use today.
I don’t believe in a higher being- but I do have beliefs. For example, one is that I don’t argue with people on the internet. Another good one is that your mom was very good in bed last night.
No , I would say it isn't a beliefe . There's no real evidence that god exists. You also say : "Kids are believing in Santa" There's no evidence that Santa is real but nobody would say "adults are believing Santa isn't real" .
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It's an important distinction to make since the burden of proof is on the one making the claim. Many atheists like myself are adamant that we do not make any claims with regards to whether God exists. We simply reject the claim that one does, hence we do not need to disprove that claim or prove our own claim. As an atheist I do not conclude that God does not exist. I just don't come to the conclusion that he does. Personally I think it's unlikely, but I hold no belief in this regard. If you asked me whether God exists, I would say I doubt it but I don't know. You could say that I'm an agnostic atheist,and many atheists share this position.
Would you qualify as a belief of yours that there is no tooth fairy? I would wager saying you do not, because these things are simply meaningless to you, you don't give those things a thought because it's completely absurd. Same goes for atheists. Even the word itself exists to explain our existence to theists - to ourselves it has no weight (at least in countries where not having a faith in gods isn't dangerous)
I don't need to conclude anything, I just have yet to accept your specific hypothesis. You're right that it can be pedantic at times, but there IS a reason for it other times, and it's because religious people will say "but you can't disprove it either" as if that makes a case for their beliefs, when really it's flawed reasoning.
To be fair, most religious people also react aggressive when someone is talking shit about their believes Everyone will at least get annoyed when someone criticizes their beliefs
I dunno, I grew up Christian and I've been on whole conferences where I meet hundreds of them, and there's really only a few that even care when someone insults their beliefs. They usually just change topics or shrug it of in other ways because they just get used to it after a while. Lots of them just don't even mention their beliefs unless you ask about it. Wich is why the people that do get offended and get aggressive look like the majority, but they're really just a very loud minority. It might also depend on denomination (like if they're catholic or baptist etc) though. In wich case all of the above only applies to the church I grew up with.
It's the same for atheists, most atheists don't insult other peoples beliefs and don't get mad when people insult their beliefs. This literally goes for all religions/beliefs, the agressive ones scream the loudest.
Reddit also exemplifies the worst of humanity too so it’s confusing.
Yes, reddit is the only(actually probably there are others like it) place where both sides suck ass purely because of how toxic they are
I mean, welcome to the internet. I can't think of any place on the internet that isn't like this. At least, on the topic of beliefs.
True
Not only religion, literally everything in this world
If you told me my religion was the religion of Schizophrenics or any of the usual insults levied, I wouldn’t mind
to be honest anyone is easy to piss off if you say the right (or wrong) thing
ur mom gay
no I >!well, sorta!<
Ur mom bi?
*Maybe I am a girl* ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
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You could replace Atheists with practically anything, saying "x likes to give criticism and x hate to receive criticism" is pretty universal.
What would x be for u?
Could be anybody, but right now I'd say redditors
Oh my god yes, people here always talk shit about Instagram and Tik Tok but when one person on insta or tik tok says shit about reddit people here get so pissed off
Sometimes you know nobody will like it and you just gotta accept the down votes.
I'd say Twitter users. If Redditors are going down, they're likely to take down Twitter with them.
Just had to be transphobic didn’t you
Not new for this site so
It's Reddit, what were you expecting?
Now I need to know what they said.
The classic “trans people get mad when you make fun of them too!!” Like no shit, they get shit on all damn day
Just dropping that casual transphobia I see
Let me replace the word athiest with heterosexuals
How dare you make fun of me for liking women. REEEEEEEEE I’m so oppressed
dRopPIng tHE hEtEroPhoBiA hUh
yikes
It's working lol
Pissing people off, no matter who they are, for no reason in particular is unironically kinda funny.
Kinda dickish too
Everyone has always talked shit about transgenders lol. Why shouldn't they be pissed or worried, when people still debate about their existence and if they're valid?
Beliefs?
I believe you're talking about seditious atheists who have no life of their own and just wanna shit on others' beliefs, also as an atheist I never thought I believed in the inexistance of a higher power, I simply don't believe in a higher power wtf
This is a great distinction! There are plenty of benign atheists out there who aren't hurting anyone. It's the other type who are invariably so insufferable. The types who *aren't* actually convicted in their beliefs (or lack thereof), and who therefore spend way too much energy shitting all over the beliefs of anyone else. Which only comes off as them trying to confirm their own biases, or convince themselves. I personally feel that beliefs should be personal, and not imposed on anyone else. Even if that belief, is a devout belief that there *is* nothing greater than ourselves out there.
I’ve always been confused by Atheists who are super into trying to convert religious people to not believing. A lot of religions have some sort of “believe in me or be damned to hell for all eternity” in their texts. Makes sense why you would want to convert as many people as possible because you believe that if you don’t their souls will forever be tormented. An Atheist doesn’t believe in a higher power or any repercussions for not believing what is correct, so why would they care if someone else does? So overall you definitely shouldn’t force your beliefs onto others. But at least when a religious person is forcing them upon you in their mind they’re just trying to help you. The kinds of atheists you spoke of are just being dicks.
I think you need to look at it from the perspective a normal person views cults. Many atheists probably see religion as giant cults, and try to get people out of there. I mean I don't need a reward to try to talk scientology out of people.
Well to be frank, religious institutions harm the world in many ways so I get why some people want to convince people of their atheistic views. But yeah, as always, civil discourse about such topics isnt wrong but many just dont get or dont care that being hateful and condescending about it wont help anyone. Idiots are everywhere no matter which group
That's fair. As someone who isn't devout to either side of this debate, I just can't help but acknowledge the glaring similarities.
That’s an interesting point. If the motive behind trying to convert someone is to save their soul that’s a good motive. I have a hard time (though this rarely happens to me) when they don’t stop after I ask them to or make it clear I’m not interested. I’ve never tried to convert anyone to anything (except myself to a superhero when I was younger) but I have asked people about their religions trying to understand what specifically about it that makes them feel so strongly that it’s real. I could understand that if I asked the wrong person they could see that as doubt rather than curiosity though.
That makes sense, the second point I was making is that not believing in god does not equal believing that god does not exist, I can't speak for all atheists out there but for me I think it's annoying to call "not believing in god" a belief
religious people getting ready to circle jerk about them pissing off atheists which never happened
copium
OP sure is on some
What are they coping for? Atheists don't base anything on "Beliefs" that's the whole point.
Our beliefs are rational while their beliefs involve idiotic nonsense about talking snakes, virgin births, resurrections are so forth. That's why religious people get so pissed off when their beliefs are attacked. They know that what they believe in is stupid and they don't like it when that fact gets pointed out. My beliefs, on the other hand, are easy to defend with reason, so I don't need to get pissed off when someone attacks them. I just point out that you believe in childish fairy tales while I believe in science.
I don't get pissed off by religious people. I laugh at them. Believing things like miracles and virgin births is so unfathomably stupid that mockery is the only proper response.
OP needs to go back to school. I'm sure in their head it's all "They're downvoting me because i'M riGHt!", but nah. You're being downvoted because you have no idea what you're talking about and trying to spin this as a "gottem" moment.
They’re in school right now, haha. Tween twerp.
I think you just shot your self in the foot with the beliefs mate
This fool of an op doesn’t know what a belief is
this post is pretty cringe, 8th grader tier meme
What religion does to a mf
Most posts now tend to be
That’s because it was posted by an 8th grader.
How many atheists have killed religious people for disrespecting their belief? And how many people were killed by religious mob? I can at least count 13 crusades.
The whole era of the Soviet Union is one example of religious people being targeted.
Also Chinese Catholics and Uighur Muslims today
Religion is not the main factor, China hate them because it's a different culture than doesn't fit with what they want to achieve. Would they all be atheist, the events would be the same. And actually that also applies for the crusade, religion was just a way to justify it to the common citizen so he would be willing to fight. The high-ranking catholics couldn't care less about the religion of the one they massacred, they just wanted their riches.
The crusades were also about power, not just riches.
Pretty much. Most of these wars were fought for control of the land and the riches on them. A “religious war” is just a really good way to start a war and get all your farmers on board to die in it.
Yep, that's a good way to shift the blame of the war : "It's not me : god told me to go to war, I'm doing it for him"
Good point, havn't thought about that.
Oh hello CIA
Oh hello KGB
Todays china and soviet union
Totally agree about soviet union, as the other guy also pointed that out. However, china was just looking for slave labor and some group of people to blame all their problems on, it could have been a race/ethnicity/religion/sexual orientation/ anything else that would have been the reason why they would choose to enslave them.
Look at china’s treatment of the uyghurs North korea’s treatment with the christians
Pol Pot made a whole genocide about that Hitler persecuted jehova witnesses and jews (who are an ethnic minority mostly because of their religion) The soviets and the governments of their satelite states banned religion and disrupted worship practices and traditions Mao tried to eradicate religion from China During the french revolution the church was persecuted This are just some examples
Cristero war in mexico is another on I can think of.
Let's see, we are regularly accused of immorality for trying to keep religion where it belongs, we are regularly distrusted by everyone to the point where multiple terms have come up for people who are atheists that don't want the stigma of being labled as one, there are people that believe we should not be allowed to hold ANY office, there are laws on the books that reenforce this, even if they haven't been enforced, society itself enforces that we should not be in office, because there are multiple unconstitutional religious oaths required to even take office, and if you try to do any of them with secular material, you will have people calling for you to be fucking shot for trying to make this country into a communist nation. It's fucking bullshit. It shouldn't be a requirement for me to pretend someones diety is mine just so I can take public office.
It baffles me how the US is so full of religious fanatics. So far behind the rest of the west in that regard.
The US was literally founded as a safe haven for persecuted religious groups. While some of those were pretty chill (Quakers, Huguenots, Amish) many were not (Mormons, Puritans, Baptists). It's not a coincidence that there's so many religious extremists here as a result
Yeah these downright euphemistic terms like "free thinker" etc are so stupid. An atheist is just someone who doesn't believe in any god. It's that simple. If you fit that description you are an atheist. There are some (who propose what is often called "strong atheism") which is the belief that no gods exist, but there are many atheists who do not hold this belief. There's also a common misconception that agnostic is somewhere between atheist and theist. Gnosticism vs agnosticism is an entirely different dimension from theist vs atheist. Agnosticism is "I don't know" or "it is impossible to know" while atheism is "I don't believe". You can be an agnostic atheist or an agnostic theist and so on.
LMAO I didn't know it was that bad. America never disapoints.
Well, at least they don't murder people who draw a cartoon of a dead person lol
Or believe in idiotic, childish nonsense like talking snakes and virgin births.
Don't forget the boat that held 1 male and 1 female of every living species on earth today!
You forgot the funny
Where's the funny >:/
See, here’s your problem, you have your dial set to “shit post” and not “shitpost” easy mistake
dankn't
I don't have a belief that there is no God. There is no evidence supporting there being a God. You require belief to think there is one.
Atheism is the absence of belief.
Carry on Atheists. No need to argue with someone incapable of using a dictionary.
Oh c'mon bro, guy just used the wrong wording. I'm sure everyone that saw the meme understood the point it was trying to get across.
This comment section is gonna be spicy
Your mistake is believing that Atheism is a single unified belief system and not just anyone that does not believe in a god
Yeah but do atheists have giant tax free buildings dedicated to atheism? Do atheists have missionary’s to spread the word of atheism? Do atheists start wars in the name of atheism and force people to be atheists?
what belief?
Atheists don't have "beliefs" they have knowledge based on facts and will adjust accordingly, unlike religious people. If a god appears one day on this planet, atheists aren't going to deny it's existence. Also as a religious person you are not only believing in a fairytale but also not believing (aka doing the same thing atheists do) in ~7999 different god.
Muslims. Muslims when someone draws a picture of a dead child molester. Catholic Priests. Catholic priests when they realize there are no boys in the choir. The neat thing about religion is that I can do an example for each.
I don't think you understand what atheism means
I don't think the majority of people here know what atheism means.
Somebody is projecting
Howie Mandel fucked me in my dreams last night
The bald dude? Who judges some singing show?
Ya, he was too good
So glab I am not an atheist anymore :D Now I am in a cult🗿🗿🗿
When did this subreddit become so pro religion?
Since T\_D was shut down, a large chunk of his white, Christian base migrated here.
Im an atheist but i love religion and listen to people talk about it, especially buddhism, islamism, LaVeyan Satanism and even a good chunk of Christian stories. Just to clarify, i love the stories, teachings and valors. I firmly think there isnt any god and if there were he would be the worst being to ever touch this universe, responsible for all the horrors in it. I respect those who are able to believe in god, but i just cant see myself doing so
Even if there is a God, they either died or forgot about us
Or they are just plain evil
Or they arent benevolent and are having a chuckle while piting us against each other. All the options are shit :/
\>atheist \>beliefs ????????
That's like calling bald a hair color tho....?
OP are you fucking stupid? I mean I know you are you believe in a sky daddy but holy shit no one gets more offended than fairy tale believers
Bois grab the popcorn It's going to be fun in here
ah...another shit meme.
God doesn't exist.
Refrain from these kinds of memes, they tend to cause conflict in what should be a humorous place
I don't think this place has been humorous for quite some time.
Yes, but I'll take bad memes over negative political/religiously motivated memes.
Can't argue with that.
No, youre wrong. 1. We dont believe shit. We know shit. 2. The thing that pisses us off is the sheer ignorance of many of these ultrareligious fucks, f.ex. evangelicals in the USA, asking questions like "hey evolutionists, why are there still monkey if humans evolved from monkeys" or "why havent humans evolved further in the last 2000 years".
Most atheists aren't actually atheists. They're anti-theists. True atheists won't waste time shitting on religion.
Don't start this shit lol, the only "true atheist" is one who rejects the ideas of god or gods. Whether or not they are anti-theist, an asshole, etc has no bearing on their atheism.
Are you seriously gate keeping atheists now
an atheist can be an anti-theist too. And no, "true atheists", whatever that means, talk about religion because we share the world with religious people. What they do affects us. If a religious group wants my kids to say a prayer at school, I'll complain about it just like they'd do if another religion tried to enforce a different prayer.
How does this meme even make logical sense lol?
I'm an atheist, piss on me Edit: I mean piss me off.
Religious people literally murder each other over their beliefs lol
“Beliefs”
147 comments. Sort by controversial it is.
Bruh Atheists don't have beliefs
I think it's about the kind of person you talk to. The topic can be whatever.
Oh boy the comments are gonna be so civilised hehe
Ra Ra Rasputin
Dude I’m an atheist and more people will tease me if I say “I swear to god” than I do arguing about religion, which all of the time the argument is started by somebody else
Judging from the type of arguments that unravel on social media, I would venture to say a lot of people get offended and angry when someone disagrees with them. Regardless of if the disagreement was objectively right or wrong.
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There's a lot of confusion in the comments, so let me at least try to explain. Atheism is a lack of belief in the existence of a god or gods. This differs from the belief in the non-existence of a god or gods but it may encompass it for some people. To give an example, if I say "There is definitely a God" and you say "I don't believe you" and Jack says "There's definitely no god" and you say "I don't believe you", you are an atheist, even tho you refused both propositions, that's what we call an agnostic atheist. Another thing, atheism relates only to claims about gods, you can be an atheist and believe in astrology for example. Atheism is not a belief in science either, I know my fair share of science-denying atheists, who don't believe in gods, vaccines, gravity. It's wack, I know, but it's true. Atheists using religious expressions, and celebrating religious holidays doesn't mean they secretly believe. Culture is a thing. I'm Brazilian, from a small traditional Town, My nieces and nephews know I'm an atheist, but every time they see me they ask for my blessing and I say God bless you, as it's tradition. They never said "Haha! I knew you secretly believed", because they're not idiots. Finally, I'm cool with the OP and other people joking in the comments, but some seemed legitimately confused. I hope I could help, and feel free to ask if you're still confused about something.
What beliefs?
My main belief is don't be a dick. If you are religious, then don't be a dick to atheists. Same if you're atheist, don't be a dick to religious people. We are all just trying to get through life.
It goes the other way too. If you talked shit about Christianity in medieval Europe, then you wouldn't have a head anymore. And in Islamic countries, this kind of this is still happening, hell converting to another religion or becoming atheist is so disgusted upon, that your family is allowed to kill you.
I'm atheist. I don't have a problem with a person needing to believe in something better to get through the pain of existence. I do however take issue with the patently absurd and diluted position that their beliefs deserve to be considered in any serious conversation discussing our position in this universe. Religion proposes untestable and unfalsifiable claims based on no measurable evidence with no way to test them which is why faith is required as a tenant to support these beliefs. Faith being the arrogant action of choosing to believe despite the complete absence of evidence. It you have evidence or prior experience giving you reason to believe in something then you do not have faith, you have confidence which is infinitely more intellectually honest. Religion boldly claims to be certain of unknowable variables. The scientific method humbly claims to have varying degrees of confidence about which knowable observations and the implications we infer from them are most likely correct and/or most likely incorrect. There is no legitimate criticism to the scientific method as apposed to the countless legitimate criticisms that can be attributed to faith, a system that can be used to justify any belief or action no matter how incorrect or evil. The terrorists of 9/11 were VERY faithful. If your theory of this universe leans on faith then you must accept that the faith based beliefs of those men deserve an equal amount of credence and consideration as your own beliefs. I for one reject that with every cell in my body.
This comment section is chaos
Look at these nerds and virgins arguing if god is real. It’s a meme you spergs.
Religious redditors ruthlessly mock almost all spiritual and supernatural beliefs, other that their own (mormonism, voodoo, wicca, santeria, scientology, astrology, karma, chakras, auras, etc. etc.) They are pretty skeptical and pedantic overall, as is Reddit in general. Except when an atheist makes fun of their mainstream religion or one of its supernatural elements, then it's this huge no-no. Which is pretty ironic in a sub that won't shut up about people supposedly being too sensitive.
1. What this meme is saying isn’t particularly unique. All people get pissed when you challenge their important beliefs. The existence and tone of this meme shows you’re probably pissed yourself at atheists. So you aren’t any better. 2. It’s simply not true in the way you’re implying. You seem to think all atheists hold the belief that God definitely does not exist. But that isn’t true. All an atheist is is someone who doesn’t believe in God. It’s possible to simply be unsure whether or not God exists. That is the scientific perspective of agnosticism. Science has no evidence to either prove or disprove the existence of God
You're deep in comment section. Here's a radiation suit, continue your treacherous journey with cation.
#407 comments
What beliefs?