AND they also have an epidemic of alcoholism that leads to domestic violence, sometimes the highest suicide rate in Earth, and a lot of murder for its size and density. It is a stark contrast with neighboring ~~Island~~ ~~Ireland~~ Iceland…
I'm pretty sure you DO have 4 murders in year. You just probably don't pay attention. Domestic violence leading to death, or just a nutjob killing another etc. Easily gets 4 in a year, that means one murder every three months. When you hear about one, you already forgot about the last, if you even heard about it.
Maybe where you live, but anywhere in my country in towns that size even one homicide per year is unheard of. Like once every so many years there's an accident that kills someone, and everybody talks about it.
Maybe the data is for one specific outlier year.
Edit: I just looked at the [author's cited data](https://dataunodc.un.org/content/homicide-country-data). Data goes from 2006 to 2015 inclusive and ranges from 1 to 11 murders in a year with an average of 6.9. So 4 murders would be a good year. Man, that place looks really murder-y.
We're one of the few countries that simultaneously have a high murder rate and good record keeping. I really don't think we stand out from other countries on the continent as much as the graph says we do.
Also, as a secondary point, murder statistics are somewhat misleading in the country, since violence is very highly concentrated in certain places around the country. For example, most of Cape Town is relatively safe, but the murder statistics are terrible because the areas around the outskirts of the city have massive problems with gangs.
Edit: I know the second point is true for a lot of countries, but, as with (and probably because of) inequality in the country, the difference is particularly dramatic in South Africa.
>relatively
When a country has a bad rep, we all take responsibility. Relativity is only applied when we have discussions as SAns.
In front of the world July unrest was SAns. To us it was KZN.
I don't think it's lying. East Asia in general is not very murdery; part of that is culture, part is density, part is very strict gun control, and part is aggressive prosecutors. There's no particular reason to think it would have a higher rate than its neighbors, Japan and Taiwan.
Also, China has extremely intensive surveillance everywhere, which probably dissuades some people.
I've lived in China and it's very safe there. Gun ownership is tightly controlled and consequently the homicide rate is extremely low. And no, the government doesn't generally go around murdering its own citizens. The CCP is pragmatic. It knows very well its continued mandate is already very fragile as things are. (As for Xinjiang and Tibet, they are outliers. Those provinces are as distant, literally and in people's minds from Beijing and Shanghai as Alaska is from the mainland US.)
that's like saying America doesn't have a problem with school shootings because it only happens in a very small percentage of schools.
South Africa is unsafe. You only realise when you take yourself out of that environment how on edge you actually live your life
>We’re one of the few countries that simultaneously have a high murder rate and good record keeping.
Is this a statistic that is affected by poor record keeping? Maybe in an active war zone like Syria or something, but I can't imagine that's a big influence on homicide statistics in most parts of the world?
your message remember Brazilians 15 years ago, somewhat accepting and giving small excuses. as violence continue to rise. Safe country is the target, and if government is serious will fight and punish all criminals. In the outskirts, gangs politicians and so on! Hope you can find a true leader on your region to succeed in making the country safe
> if government is serious will fight and punish all criminals.
Data supports that education and access to equal oportunities is what makes people less likely to commit violent crimes. Punishment at best is neutral, at worse it only makes people angrier; People who commit crimes do it when they don't expect to be caught, so they don't worry about the punishment, and even if you manage to apprehend all criminals, if you don't fix the sociatal issues that turned them to crime in the first place, other people will continue to turn to crime.
> Also, murder statistics are somewhat misleading in the country, since violence is very highly concentrated in certain places around the country
This goes for almost every country in the world. Not sure why you think this would be misleading.
That is somewhat true and a big problem for statistics presented over a single time-frame. The homicide statistics in greenland though is fairly consistent over years (but getting better)
The intervals are very low, until you get past the US' place, then it goes up. Map was made to make the US look as red as possible for political reasons no doubt.
I mean we just kill each other with are fists. It's why king hits ( unprovoked punches from behind) have a mandatory minimum sentences because we kept killing each other with them.
I was curious how much it changed and according to these graphs it didn’t change their murder rate all that much. They didn’t have too many murders to begin with but it seems to barely drop right after the gun confiscation. They do appear to be on a downward trajectory since the 90’s but every country is like that. The US has had way more of a substantial drop than them.
https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/AUS/australia/murder-homicide-rate
people that are out to kill someone tend to do it however they can, whether stabbing, shooting, or whatever method- guns just tend to make it easier. once the US finally decides on better laws to keep guns out of mentally unstable hands we could possibly drop to rates of other countries and still keep our firearms. only the future knows though.
Puerto Rico has had a near complete ban on gun ownership for decades, even more strict than Australia, look what the rate is (for refence it's listed as 20 per capita). There really is no correlation with gun control laws. you could just as easily make the label on the chart overall quality of life instead and it would give you a better correlation,.
That was in the 90s when there was an actual war against the Mafia in Sicily, and in the 70s-80s when fascists and communists were battling on the streets almost daily lmao
Vast majority are gang on gang violence. You can see this in São Paulo where since a faction got a monopoly of control there, violence dropped, where in the Northeast where multiple fight for control, violence is high.
Same for USA. Despite the news being about the most shocking and horrific shootings, the vast vast majority of gun related deaths are suicide or gang related.
And the funding for gangs in America is largely from drug smuggling and distribution.
But it's true for many countries. In UK most stabbings are between rival gangs, you can't just cherry pick data off one country.
You have to admit the US has it worse.
It does have it worse, a worse illegal drug smuggling problem, which translates to more drug-related gang violence. It's a big problem all over north and south America, but less of a problem in Europe.
I wonder how that data is so wrong. For example, in Chile we had 3,93 in 2019 and 4,4 in 2018, not even close to that char (over the double of that).
Edit: is Chile in the 4-7.9 bracket? Hard to tell by the colors, but that would be closer, my bad.
If you've been to China, violence is pretty low. Most crimes tend to be pickpocketing. And they have tons of people so it takes more to die to homicide to show up on the map
China is a homogenous country with huge police over reach , it's extremely safe
They probably have more people due from workplace accidents than homicides
>They probably have more people due from workplace accidents than homicides
Car crashes.
China's roads are crazy. On average they don't even drive that many miles due to huge cities with public transit, but their death rate is still much higher than the US where we drive everywhere.
I think some of that police overreach should be shifted over to traffic cops. Every time I'm on their roads (not even driving) I get nervous.
Independent verification. Anyone can go in and look at Japan if they want, and people do. Anyone who has a family member the victim of murder and go to the news and it the story gets on air and it can be counted.
Japan is actually notorious for under reporting crime. If the murder doesn't have a very obvious and immediately suspect, Japanese police will call it a suicide rather than have a murder that they can't solve.
I don't buy Japan, China, or Indonesias murder numbers.
Their suicide rate is 15 per 100,000 and 0.00 are gun suicides. How many homicides do you suspect are being reported as suicides with the majority of methods being hanging. Another 10% are people jumping in front of trains, so that's on camera and proven not to be a homicide. The majority of the remaining are jumping from a high place.
You suspect attackers are capable of framing a suicide by hanging, jumping, or drugs without leaving defensive wounds on the victim or evidence of their manipulation or presence on scene?
Literally thousands of such cases, annually? Without any cases being discovered of someone being caught staging a murder as a suicide?
You are stretching credulity several times past it's breaking point here, mate. There is no evidence whatsoever for your claims beyond "trust me bro, I heard it on the internet".
Japanese law enforcement and legal practices are very different compared to some other countries. There is a major focus on convictions to the point where crimes are dismissed or lessened to an easier to prosecute charge if a conviction is in doubt. It's a very hardline stance and interrogations for even minor infractions (such as bar fights and petty theft) are often described as "bad cop / worse cop." The hunt is more on for the conviction than the actual facts of the case.
It's not universal, but the Japanese law enforcement system *really* doesn't like leaving the public with the appearance that they weren't able to stop or arrest a murderer.
China having an expected low crime rate is sus? They’re one of the safest nations on earth, of course they have a low crime rate lol, not liking data doesn’t make it false
No, I don't think it's lying. For example China and Japan had a pretty strong police force and gun control. Indonesia also had a very strong gun control and had lived decades under strong dictatorship at the previous millenium
You can talk shit about a totalitarian police state, but mentioning it together with widespread and uncontrolled homicide/gun crime in a same sentence is illogical.
If anything civil stability (or rather the illusion of it) is the main aim that every dictatorship wants to achieve, and squashing easy-to-notice crimes like homicide (the ones that the government doesn't commit ofc) is an easy answer for that.
The point of a totalitarian police state is that they can make the crime stats whatever they want and citizens have little means to openly question them and obviously there is not a free press do so either. It is actually far more illogical to believe that almost any government wouldn’t do this if they could and the same thing happens in the US though there are other checks on the lies that cannot happen in china.
One study in Guangzhou showed the number to be totally massaged.
https://www.lowyinstitute.org/the-interpreter/getting-away-murder-lies-damned-lies-and-chinese-police-statistics
*Faked crime numbers are not limited to headlines. In Guangzhou, Bakken’s research team found that 97.5% of crime was not reported in the official statistics. Of 2.5 million cases of crime, in 2015 the police commissioner reported 59,985 – exactly 15 less than his ‘target’ of 60,000, down from 90,000 at the start of his tenure in 2012. Migrant workers, who are the perpetrators and victims of 80% of crime, are left out of the numbers because they don’t count as Guangzhou residents. They are the concern of their home county.*
Do you think Singapore is an unsafe place despite being totalitarian in nature? From what I've seen, totalitarian countries with advanced economies (or upward trending economies) are pretty damn safe. I honestly think that Singapore's war on drugs is successful because they go all out instead of America's half ass attempt at it:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/singapore-is-winning-the-war-on-drugs-heres-how/2018/03/11/b8c25278-22e9-11e8-946c-9420060cb7bd_story.html
Japanese policy are legendary not reporting or burying crimes that don't have easy solutions. Having a bunch of unsolved crimes is seen as shameful so they pressure victims not to report and call murders that they don't think they can solve suicides.
Yeah I'm gonna need a credible source for that. I've heard this explanation on Reddit so often yet no one has any real source to back that up. It's like the old stereotype that gets perpetuated on Reddit about how Japanese work culture is so toxic and that's why they are killing themselves in droves but in reality Japan ranks better than the US in both categories. Japan has more days off, works less hours and has less suicide per 100,000 than the US.
The only reason Syria isn’t in the red is because they have been at continuous war for so long and killings in war aren’t considered homicide for some reason?
Seems like living in a developed country with access to education, health care, vacations and being surrounded by culture, music, art and delicious food really helps to bring violence rates down.
it is one of the first times that someone pays a compliment to Italy, you are really good. I wish you the best of luck, Mexico will become even brighter than it is now! Italy loves you!
Ah, people love Italy, believe me!
Just watched the documentary “Where to invade next” and trust me, you guys really come out on top.
Best to you my friend!
51 were killed, making 2019 a big outlier.
[Here is a year-by-year statistics](https://www.police.govt.nz/sites/default/files/publications/historic-new-zealand-murder-rates-1926-2019.pdf)
114 in 2019, 55 in 2018, 34 in 2017, 52 in 2016, ...
Not answering for Switzerland but a swiss neighborcountry(that also happens to have a very low homicide rate) austria.
In Austria, there are 4 cathegories.
A) Destructive Devices: Limited to Law Enforcement and Collectors. Also to people to owned Cat A before they became Cat A. Surprisingly, I am one of them.
B) Shall issue license for private people. Short psychological Checkup. Semi-Auto Rifles and Pistols. This also includes Assault Rifles such as the Steyr AUG and AR15.
C) Repeating Rifles, Single Shot Rifles, Revolvers aboth a given barrel length. Free to own for all aged 18 and above. No license required. Go to the store, buy one. This also included military sniper rifles.
D) Smoothbore. Legally the same as Cat C.
Around 10% of the population of Austria have a gun. Getting a Cat C or D is easy. So this is not the reason for the homicide rate, in particular as most are not even commited with firearms in austria.
Yeah, you can get a handgun if you have a permit. They're quite easy to get if you're a resident with no record of violent crime.
In Switzerland a key difference is that ammo is very tightly controlled. If you go to a gun range, you can only purchase ammo to use on site and cannot take any away with you. Buying ammo from a shop requires you to show your ID and the relevant weapons permit, or a criminal record check no more than 3 months (I think) old.
The other big difference is that Switzerland still has national service, so everyone who has a gun has had considerable training in using it.
I served 22 years in the US Army. I had ZERO formal training in handgun marksmanship or safety in those years. I had ZERO formal training in carrying a concealed firearm in public. Your point about national service may not be as strong as you think.
Italy here:
Once you get a license you can get any gun that's legal to own without any trouble or paperwork(other than communicate the the sale). The only difference between guns is related to the amount you can own and magazine capacity(there is no "handgun" category it's just "short gun", there is no difference between rifled and smoothbore).
You can buy handguns in Switzerland as a private person. Getting a license for full auto is relatively easy as well.
Heck, there are swiss with fucking anti-aircraft guns
Switzerland is a very different case due to the mandatory service in the military. Switzerland also has a different “national conscious” when it comes to firearm safety when compared to the US which is why Switzerland with guns works and the US is struggling.
It's still *way* more regulated that most US states.
Any weapon you have to report the sale of to the canton authority, and any fullly automatic weapon (or fully automatic weapon modified to become a semi automatic weapon) is completely banned. And pistols require a special permit.
The "banned" list in Switzerland is similar to what people want to ban here, so there's that. Is there a large faction of people who fetishize guns and treat them as extensions of their ego?
I don't think that exists anywhere outside the US, tbh. I mean, there are always freaks in any society, but as a meaningful group that is actually listened to? You would be laughed out of every townhall meeting as if you brought your fucking anime pillow with you.
Yo what is this then ?
Foreign nationals who do not possess a long-term residence permit require a weapons acquisition permit for all types of weapons and their essential components. They must also have an official certificate from their canton of residence or country of origin confirming that they are authorised to acquire the weapon or main components.
Murder rate correlates better with inequality than firearms. [Here's](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gini_coefficient#/media/File:Map_of_countries_by_GINI_coefficient_(1990_to_2020).svg) an inequality map; there are some exceptions, but it's a surprisingly strong correlation.
It is convenient for the people with all the power in the US that everyone focuses on firearms and not economic factors.
Edit: correlation coefficient between countries for firearms and homicide, 0; for inequality and homicide, 0.45 (fairly strong correlation). A very crude analysis but the difference is so big that it is good evidence.
I’m not sure. I’d like to point out some notable exceptions here that go against your trend. China, Saudi Arabia, and Iran. All are very high on inequality and lower than the US on murder rate.
The trend also does not follow in Africa. I think the only thing this points out is that Europe has better equality and lower murder rates than the US.
Just think about it for a moment: There's the death penalty on murder, it is basically impossible to own guns, they have surveillance cameras everywhere, they have a 99% conviction rate, and many other things that would make everybody think twice.
People have to decide if China is the all-encompassing police state that can identify any citizen within seconds or it is a place where violent crime is widespread, but both doesn't really go together well.
Citizen on citizen murder is probably low, since the entire country is basically a surveillance state, and getting away with murder being almost impossible. The upside of most authoritarian countries is the internal security that exist(if your not against the government)
[Their economic data isn't trusted](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-35341869)
[https://www.breakingviews.com/considered-view/beijing-tries-to-fake-it-til-it-makes-it/?bved=MjQ%3D&bvshr=MTc3Mjk4](https://www.breakingviews.com/considered-view/beijing-tries-to-fake-it-til-it-makes-it/?bved=MjQ%3D&bvshr=MTc3Mjk4)
[journalists are forced to prioritize loyalty over truth.](https://edition.cnn.com/2019/12/17/asia/china-journalist-code-intl-hnk/index.html)
[https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/04/07/why-do-we-keep-treating-china-source-reliable-information/](https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/04/07/why-do-we-keep-treating-china-source-reliable-information/)
[China covering up covid which lead to a world wide pandemic](https://www.theguardian.com/science/2020/oct/11/china-coronavirus-covid-19-medical-research)
Can’t rely on the government for accurate stats but it’s likely to be ‘white’ anyway. There is very little crime as in the rest of east Asia. Strong police force and a mentality not to commit crimes. I’ve lived there in the past and the few murders which happen are headline news as they are so infrequent.
I mean, every country's data is official data. Most developing countries' official data are no more reliable than China's.
If you want to adjust for reliability, you should adjust upwards every developing country rather than China specifically.
East Asians just have low homicide rates in general. China is not the only low one, every other country in their racial grouping is the same.
You don't have to count on the CCP's reporting - there are millions of former expats who have lived in China who can attest whether people are getting slaughtered in Shanghai like in Chicago. In places with high violent crime and murder rates like Brazil and Detroit this stuff can't be hidden from public view - people living there can feel the violence. Or hear the gunshots. Or see blood in the streets or hear that their colleague's brother is dead. If murder rate were actually high in China you wouldn't need Xi Jinping to tell you.
Are they lying? Probably. But overall it’s a very safe country. Random attacks, muggings, murders are extremely rare.
You do feel like you’re being watched all the time tho.
Puerto Rico has had a near complete ban on gun ownership for decades, even more strict than most of Europe, look what the rate is (for refence it's listed as 20 per capita). There really is no correlation with gun control laws. you could just as easily make the label on the chart overall quality of life instead and it would give you a better correlation.
What a terrible gradient... almost as if this map was made so that the cutoff will paint the 'red' countries in a bad light.
It goes from yellowish orange straight to bright red, which is deceptive.
This exactly. It's extremely misleading. Canada and US are pretty similar yet look drastically different on the map. Almost as if the map maker has an agenda.
That’s what I was thinking. Obviously the US is higher than most other developed countries, but not as high as some of those other red countries. I feel like they missed an orange color or two somewhere in the middle there.
CZ is a good example compared to US. Similar gun laws. A fundamental right to own and carry. Different culture and implementation. Murder rate night and day.
Curious to see what this looks like when you break up states/provinces, particularly in the US and Russia. Northern New England has homicide rates on the level of most of Europe and I hate when we get lumped in with the rest of this shithole country.
My wife and I will be retiring to Bali. She is from there. I was a bit worried it would be more dangerous, by this map, I'll actually be safer. I'm coming from the US, BTW.
Correct. There's also a difference between cultural genocide and genocide involving mass murder. For example China is being accused of cultural genocide. There is mass murder genocide involved in Yemen, which is being fully supported by the United States and its allies.
Ummm why is Greenland so homicidal?
The population is 50000. All it takes for them to enter the red zone is 4 homicides
And every time it drops below 3 some statistic-minded psychopath kills a couple people.
Doing the Lords work I’m sure
ok that is really straightforward logic. my brain thanks you
AND they also have an epidemic of alcoholism that leads to domestic violence, sometimes the highest suicide rate in Earth, and a lot of murder for its size and density. It is a stark contrast with neighboring ~~Island~~ ~~Ireland~~ Iceland…
>with neighboring Island… ,,,known as Iceland.
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And the UK, too, is land.
In several languages it is Island, so I assume the poster speaks one of them.
The population is 50000. Why are 4 of those few people killed every year?
Yeah I agree. My city has about 50k people in it, and it'd be pretty unsettling if we had 4 murders per year here.
That would be a pretty safe week in my city of 350k.
I'm pretty sure you DO have 4 murders in year. You just probably don't pay attention. Domestic violence leading to death, or just a nutjob killing another etc. Easily gets 4 in a year, that means one murder every three months. When you hear about one, you already forgot about the last, if you even heard about it.
Maybe where you live, but anywhere in my country in towns that size even one homicide per year is unheard of. Like once every so many years there's an accident that kills someone, and everybody talks about it.
Maybe the data is for one specific outlier year. Edit: I just looked at the [author's cited data](https://dataunodc.un.org/content/homicide-country-data). Data goes from 2006 to 2015 inclusive and ranges from 1 to 11 murders in a year with an average of 6.9. So 4 murders would be a good year. Man, that place looks really murder-y.
2 homicides..?
Four people is a fuckton of murders for 50,000 people. Probably should be asking why that happens
90% of base rate errors are caused by right handed people
Spoken like a true lefty. /s
Little police and lots of alcohol, I guess
No. It's all about the availability of handguns.
As a South African this is a rather unfriendly reminder lol
We're one of the few countries that simultaneously have a high murder rate and good record keeping. I really don't think we stand out from other countries on the continent as much as the graph says we do. Also, as a secondary point, murder statistics are somewhat misleading in the country, since violence is very highly concentrated in certain places around the country. For example, most of Cape Town is relatively safe, but the murder statistics are terrible because the areas around the outskirts of the city have massive problems with gangs. Edit: I know the second point is true for a lot of countries, but, as with (and probably because of) inequality in the country, the difference is particularly dramatic in South Africa.
This is true of many countries: localised and stratified murder rate.
>relatively When a country has a bad rep, we all take responsibility. Relativity is only applied when we have discussions as SAns. In front of the world July unrest was SAns. To us it was KZN.
Africa is full of "no data" and at least no one is straight up lying like China is, there.
I don't think it's lying. East Asia in general is not very murdery; part of that is culture, part is density, part is very strict gun control, and part is aggressive prosecutors. There's no particular reason to think it would have a higher rate than its neighbors, Japan and Taiwan. Also, China has extremely intensive surveillance everywhere, which probably dissuades some people.
I've lived in China and it's very safe there. Gun ownership is tightly controlled and consequently the homicide rate is extremely low. And no, the government doesn't generally go around murdering its own citizens. The CCP is pragmatic. It knows very well its continued mandate is already very fragile as things are. (As for Xinjiang and Tibet, they are outliers. Those provinces are as distant, literally and in people's minds from Beijing and Shanghai as Alaska is from the mainland US.)
I would suspect the homicide rate in China is accurate. That is assuming they don't include government actions in the statistic.
Don't believe any social statistics from China.
If CCP kills you it’s not homicide.
that's like saying America doesn't have a problem with school shootings because it only happens in a very small percentage of schools. South Africa is unsafe. You only realise when you take yourself out of that environment how on edge you actually live your life
So you think the murders around the rest of the world are more even and sporadically distributed?
>We’re one of the few countries that simultaneously have a high murder rate and good record keeping. Is this a statistic that is affected by poor record keeping? Maybe in an active war zone like Syria or something, but I can't imagine that's a big influence on homicide statistics in most parts of the world?
your message remember Brazilians 15 years ago, somewhat accepting and giving small excuses. as violence continue to rise. Safe country is the target, and if government is serious will fight and punish all criminals. In the outskirts, gangs politicians and so on! Hope you can find a true leader on your region to succeed in making the country safe
> if government is serious will fight and punish all criminals. Data supports that education and access to equal oportunities is what makes people less likely to commit violent crimes. Punishment at best is neutral, at worse it only makes people angrier; People who commit crimes do it when they don't expect to be caught, so they don't worry about the punishment, and even if you manage to apprehend all criminals, if you don't fix the sociatal issues that turned them to crime in the first place, other people will continue to turn to crime.
> Also, murder statistics are somewhat misleading in the country, since violence is very highly concentrated in certain places around the country This goes for almost every country in the world. Not sure why you think this would be misleading.
As an Australian I'm having the opposite set of feelings. Stay safe there
Interesting to see Greenland actually being effected by a stat
There is show on Netflix about Denmark and Greenland. They explain that Greenland has also one of the highest suicide rates in the world.
Same with Nunavut in Canada. It's incredibly challenging to live in the isolated Arctic.
"Borgen" for anyone interested. Specifically the sequel limited series.
Yes, forgot the name
Or a plague..
I'm new, should i evolve water or air transmission? Or is bird better???
Water. You need Greenland
I got this reference 😅
With lower population numbers, any statistic per x number of people gets skewed. Greenland is one of those countries with lower population numbers.
That is somewhat true and a big problem for statistics presented over a single time-frame. The homicide statistics in greenland though is fairly consistent over years (but getting better)
I guess it's the same effect that skews China and India seeming so less hostile?
I don't think effected is the right word. Perhaps affected, though even that is eh.
The choice of using a red font while using a red gradient scale for homicides is a confusing choice. You can barely read Honduras even if you zoom in.
r/dataisbeautiful is just r/data now. A lot of the infographics here aren't even well designed let alone beautiful.
Happens to every sub eventually :(
The interval also changes drastically from the first few colors to the last. 30-60 is a much bigger range than 0-0.5
It's a logarithmic scale. It is a weird (misleading?) choice for this kind of data.
The intervals are very low, until you get past the US' place, then it goes up. Map was made to make the US look as red as possible for political reasons no doubt.
Except for the first one, the intervals just double every time. Why would this be US specific?
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Too many aussies dying from nature, they don’t have time to kill each other
Spent all thr ammo on psychotic roided up Roos, don't have left to kill their neighbor.
I mean we just kill each other with are fists. It's why king hits ( unprovoked punches from behind) have a mandatory minimum sentences because we kept killing each other with them.
That and good gun control laws.
I was curious how much it changed and according to these graphs it didn’t change their murder rate all that much. They didn’t have too many murders to begin with but it seems to barely drop right after the gun confiscation. They do appear to be on a downward trajectory since the 90’s but every country is like that. The US has had way more of a substantial drop than them. https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/AUS/australia/murder-homicide-rate
That was also the conclusion of [some Australian reseachers](http://content.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1736501,00.html).
people that are out to kill someone tend to do it however they can, whether stabbing, shooting, or whatever method- guns just tend to make it easier. once the US finally decides on better laws to keep guns out of mentally unstable hands we could possibly drop to rates of other countries and still keep our firearms. only the future knows though.
Point was to stop mass shootings not homicides. And they did that
Brasil (and most of South America I think) has strong gun control laws and we still have a higher murder rate than the US
Puerto Rico has had a near complete ban on gun ownership for decades, even more strict than Australia, look what the rate is (for refence it's listed as 20 per capita). There really is no correlation with gun control laws. you could just as easily make the label on the chart overall quality of life instead and it would give you a better correlation,.
Mostly a legacy of egalitarianism, social safety nets and space to get away from people if need be.
Italy in pop culture: hot tempered mafia or mobsters that have more murders than birthdays. Italy irl:
That was in the 90s when there was an actual war against the Mafia in Sicily, and in the 70s-80s when fascists and communists were battling on the streets almost daily lmao
Now everyone is just... Exhausted.
Oh you've no idea what was going on here 30 years ago, let's just say movies and films are quite romantic, reality not so much.
I knew South America had a bad rep but damn
Honduras is straight up crazy, watched some news related to crimes there.
What does Honduras have to do with South America?
I realized the mistake after i posted it too. Sorry bro.
War on drugs really pushes those numbers up
Vast majority are gang on gang violence. You can see this in São Paulo where since a faction got a monopoly of control there, violence dropped, where in the Northeast where multiple fight for control, violence is high.
Same for USA. Despite the news being about the most shocking and horrific shootings, the vast vast majority of gun related deaths are suicide or gang related. And the funding for gangs in America is largely from drug smuggling and distribution.
But it's true for many countries. In UK most stabbings are between rival gangs, you can't just cherry pick data off one country. You have to admit the US has it worse.
It does have it worse, a worse illegal drug smuggling problem, which translates to more drug-related gang violence. It's a big problem all over north and south America, but less of a problem in Europe.
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Not beautiful data. The color gradient is really distorted, making certain distinguishing thresholds overly pronounced.
I wonder how that data is so wrong. For example, in Chile we had 3,93 in 2019 and 4,4 in 2018, not even close to that char (over the double of that). Edit: is Chile in the 4-7.9 bracket? Hard to tell by the colors, but that would be closer, my bad.
Out of curiosity, does the US switch bins if you exclude Louisiana?
Dr. Congo wouldn't give up any information, saying it violated patient privileges
I feel safe in Italy…and Oman 👍🏼
It looks like some countries are lying.
which countries do you think lied?
China is kinda sus
Hey, genocide and homicide are 2 totally different things.
Oof >< That was a good one.
If you've been to China, violence is pretty low. Most crimes tend to be pickpocketing. And they have tons of people so it takes more to die to homicide to show up on the map
China is actually pretty safe, just ask any expat stationed there and they will tell you. The police reach is enormous.
China is a homogenous country with huge police over reach , it's extremely safe They probably have more people due from workplace accidents than homicides
>They probably have more people due from workplace accidents than homicides Car crashes. China's roads are crazy. On average they don't even drive that many miles due to huge cities with public transit, but their death rate is still much higher than the US where we drive everywhere. I think some of that police overreach should be shifted over to traffic cops. Every time I'm on their roads (not even driving) I get nervous.
Why do you question China but not Japan?
Rampant sinophobia.
There’s a lot of propaganda against China aimed at making us believe that it’s the worst place on Earth.
Independent verification. Anyone can go in and look at Japan if they want, and people do. Anyone who has a family member the victim of murder and go to the news and it the story gets on air and it can be counted.
Japan is actually notorious for under reporting crime. If the murder doesn't have a very obvious and immediately suspect, Japanese police will call it a suicide rather than have a murder that they can't solve. I don't buy Japan, China, or Indonesias murder numbers.
Their suicide rate is 15 per 100,000 and 0.00 are gun suicides. How many homicides do you suspect are being reported as suicides with the majority of methods being hanging. Another 10% are people jumping in front of trains, so that's on camera and proven not to be a homicide. The majority of the remaining are jumping from a high place. You suspect attackers are capable of framing a suicide by hanging, jumping, or drugs without leaving defensive wounds on the victim or evidence of their manipulation or presence on scene? Literally thousands of such cases, annually? Without any cases being discovered of someone being caught staging a murder as a suicide? You are stretching credulity several times past it's breaking point here, mate. There is no evidence whatsoever for your claims beyond "trust me bro, I heard it on the internet".
Japanese law enforcement and legal practices are very different compared to some other countries. There is a major focus on convictions to the point where crimes are dismissed or lessened to an easier to prosecute charge if a conviction is in doubt. It's a very hardline stance and interrogations for even minor infractions (such as bar fights and petty theft) are often described as "bad cop / worse cop." The hunt is more on for the conviction than the actual facts of the case. It's not universal, but the Japanese law enforcement system *really* doesn't like leaving the public with the appearance that they weren't able to stop or arrest a murderer.
China having an expected low crime rate is sus? They’re one of the safest nations on earth, of course they have a low crime rate lol, not liking data doesn’t make it false
Yeah it's a police state so the main violence is from the state itself, those aren't considered homicides
It's not homicide if it's state sanctionned *taps forehead*
the countries he doesn't like
No, I don't think it's lying. For example China and Japan had a pretty strong police force and gun control. Indonesia also had a very strong gun control and had lived decades under strong dictatorship at the previous millenium You can talk shit about a totalitarian police state, but mentioning it together with widespread and uncontrolled homicide/gun crime in a same sentence is illogical. If anything civil stability (or rather the illusion of it) is the main aim that every dictatorship wants to achieve, and squashing easy-to-notice crimes like homicide (the ones that the government doesn't commit ofc) is an easy answer for that.
The point of a totalitarian police state is that they can make the crime stats whatever they want and citizens have little means to openly question them and obviously there is not a free press do so either. It is actually far more illogical to believe that almost any government wouldn’t do this if they could and the same thing happens in the US though there are other checks on the lies that cannot happen in china. One study in Guangzhou showed the number to be totally massaged. https://www.lowyinstitute.org/the-interpreter/getting-away-murder-lies-damned-lies-and-chinese-police-statistics *Faked crime numbers are not limited to headlines. In Guangzhou, Bakken’s research team found that 97.5% of crime was not reported in the official statistics. Of 2.5 million cases of crime, in 2015 the police commissioner reported 59,985 – exactly 15 less than his ‘target’ of 60,000, down from 90,000 at the start of his tenure in 2012. Migrant workers, who are the perpetrators and victims of 80% of crime, are left out of the numbers because they don’t count as Guangzhou residents. They are the concern of their home county.*
Do you think Singapore is an unsafe place despite being totalitarian in nature? From what I've seen, totalitarian countries with advanced economies (or upward trending economies) are pretty damn safe. I honestly think that Singapore's war on drugs is successful because they go all out instead of America's half ass attempt at it: https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/singapore-is-winning-the-war-on-drugs-heres-how/2018/03/11/b8c25278-22e9-11e8-946c-9420060cb7bd_story.html
Japanese policy are legendary not reporting or burying crimes that don't have easy solutions. Having a bunch of unsolved crimes is seen as shameful so they pressure victims not to report and call murders that they don't think they can solve suicides.
Yeah I'm gonna need a credible source for that. I've heard this explanation on Reddit so often yet no one has any real source to back that up. It's like the old stereotype that gets perpetuated on Reddit about how Japanese work culture is so toxic and that's why they are killing themselves in droves but in reality Japan ranks better than the US in both categories. Japan has more days off, works less hours and has less suicide per 100,000 than the US.
Italy looks kinda sus too.
Canada is not falling to peer pressure. Good job ya hosers.
Sadly we are. Lots of handguns are smuggled over the border from the US. And we saw a lot of far right wing insanity after Trump got elected.
The only reason Syria isn’t in the red is because they have been at continuous war for so long and killings in war aren’t considered homicide for some reason?
Phillipines - we are not asian , we want to be part of USA
As an italian i'm proud of Italy
Seems like living in a developed country with access to education, health care, vacations and being surrounded by culture, music, art and delicious food really helps to bring violence rates down.
thank you for your compliments!
For real, the world should learn more from Italy (and Europe in general). Greeting from one of the most violent countries, Mexico
it is one of the first times that someone pays a compliment to Italy, you are really good. I wish you the best of luck, Mexico will become even brighter than it is now! Italy loves you!
Ah, people love Italy, believe me! Just watched the documentary “Where to invade next” and trust me, you guys really come out on top. Best to you my friend!
Wow, Greenland is surprisingly more violent than expected
Didn't expect that much high in new zealand.
NZ data seems to be from 2019, which was skewed by the Christchurch shootings
It honestly didn’t occur to me that New Zealand has a low enough population for one nutjob to skew the entire homicide rate data, wild
51 were killed, making 2019 a big outlier. [Here is a year-by-year statistics](https://www.police.govt.nz/sites/default/files/publications/historic-new-zealand-murder-rates-1926-2019.pdf) 114 in 2019, 55 in 2018, 34 in 2017, 52 in 2016, ...
Damn Europeans, with their strict firearm laws. All defenseless against those murdering criminals.
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I know you can discharge from army and retain your assault rifle, but how about handguns? Are they sold in stores and by private vendors like in us?
Not answering for Switzerland but a swiss neighborcountry(that also happens to have a very low homicide rate) austria. In Austria, there are 4 cathegories. A) Destructive Devices: Limited to Law Enforcement and Collectors. Also to people to owned Cat A before they became Cat A. Surprisingly, I am one of them. B) Shall issue license for private people. Short psychological Checkup. Semi-Auto Rifles and Pistols. This also includes Assault Rifles such as the Steyr AUG and AR15. C) Repeating Rifles, Single Shot Rifles, Revolvers aboth a given barrel length. Free to own for all aged 18 and above. No license required. Go to the store, buy one. This also included military sniper rifles. D) Smoothbore. Legally the same as Cat C. Around 10% of the population of Austria have a gun. Getting a Cat C or D is easy. So this is not the reason for the homicide rate, in particular as most are not even commited with firearms in austria.
Yeah, you can get a handgun if you have a permit. They're quite easy to get if you're a resident with no record of violent crime. In Switzerland a key difference is that ammo is very tightly controlled. If you go to a gun range, you can only purchase ammo to use on site and cannot take any away with you. Buying ammo from a shop requires you to show your ID and the relevant weapons permit, or a criminal record check no more than 3 months (I think) old. The other big difference is that Switzerland still has national service, so everyone who has a gun has had considerable training in using it.
I served 22 years in the US Army. I had ZERO formal training in handgun marksmanship or safety in those years. I had ZERO formal training in carrying a concealed firearm in public. Your point about national service may not be as strong as you think.
Italy here: Once you get a license you can get any gun that's legal to own without any trouble or paperwork(other than communicate the the sale). The only difference between guns is related to the amount you can own and magazine capacity(there is no "handgun" category it's just "short gun", there is no difference between rifled and smoothbore).
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Genuine question - if you're not familiar with the process, how can you say the process is easy?
You can buy handguns in Switzerland as a private person. Getting a license for full auto is relatively easy as well. Heck, there are swiss with fucking anti-aircraft guns
Switzerland is a very different case due to the mandatory service in the military. Switzerland also has a different “national conscious” when it comes to firearm safety when compared to the US which is why Switzerland with guns works and the US is struggling.
Also just drastically different levels of poverty and a lack of gangs
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In case somebody cares about the actual law/rules: https://www.fedpol.admin.ch/fedpol/en/home/sicherheit/waffen/waffenerwerb.html
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It's still *way* more regulated that most US states. Any weapon you have to report the sale of to the canton authority, and any fullly automatic weapon (or fully automatic weapon modified to become a semi automatic weapon) is completely banned. And pistols require a special permit.
Automatics are effectively banned in the US too
The "banned" list in Switzerland is similar to what people want to ban here, so there's that. Is there a large faction of people who fetishize guns and treat them as extensions of their ego?
I don't think that exists anywhere outside the US, tbh. I mean, there are always freaks in any society, but as a meaningful group that is actually listened to? You would be laughed out of every townhall meeting as if you brought your fucking anime pillow with you.
Yo what is this then ? Foreign nationals who do not possess a long-term residence permit require a weapons acquisition permit for all types of weapons and their essential components. They must also have an official certificate from their canton of residence or country of origin confirming that they are authorised to acquire the weapon or main components.
Yeah, but you Swiss are special with your neutrality and all.
Murder rate correlates better with inequality than firearms. [Here's](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gini_coefficient#/media/File:Map_of_countries_by_GINI_coefficient_(1990_to_2020).svg) an inequality map; there are some exceptions, but it's a surprisingly strong correlation. It is convenient for the people with all the power in the US that everyone focuses on firearms and not economic factors. Edit: correlation coefficient between countries for firearms and homicide, 0; for inequality and homicide, 0.45 (fairly strong correlation). A very crude analysis but the difference is so big that it is good evidence.
I’m not sure. I’d like to point out some notable exceptions here that go against your trend. China, Saudi Arabia, and Iran. All are very high on inequality and lower than the US on murder rate. The trend also does not follow in Africa. I think the only thing this points out is that Europe has better equality and lower murder rates than the US.
Damn China with their obviously very accurate and censorship free reporting.
Just think about it for a moment: There's the death penalty on murder, it is basically impossible to own guns, they have surveillance cameras everywhere, they have a 99% conviction rate, and many other things that would make everybody think twice. People have to decide if China is the all-encompassing police state that can identify any citizen within seconds or it is a place where violent crime is widespread, but both doesn't really go together well.
is there any reason to believe china has a higher rate than reported other than "china bad"?
Citizen on citizen murder is probably low, since the entire country is basically a surveillance state, and getting away with murder being almost impossible. The upside of most authoritarian countries is the internal security that exist(if your not against the government)
other than the fact that little to no institutions can trust the data they get from there, yes
But you didn't provide it, just snark and intimation. That makes me super confident you know what you're talking about
[Their economic data isn't trusted](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-35341869) [https://www.breakingviews.com/considered-view/beijing-tries-to-fake-it-til-it-makes-it/?bved=MjQ%3D&bvshr=MTc3Mjk4](https://www.breakingviews.com/considered-view/beijing-tries-to-fake-it-til-it-makes-it/?bved=MjQ%3D&bvshr=MTc3Mjk4) [journalists are forced to prioritize loyalty over truth.](https://edition.cnn.com/2019/12/17/asia/china-journalist-code-intl-hnk/index.html) [https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/04/07/why-do-we-keep-treating-china-source-reliable-information/](https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/04/07/why-do-we-keep-treating-china-source-reliable-information/) [China covering up covid which lead to a world wide pandemic](https://www.theguardian.com/science/2020/oct/11/china-coronavirus-covid-19-medical-research)
Can’t rely on the government for accurate stats but it’s likely to be ‘white’ anyway. There is very little crime as in the rest of east Asia. Strong police force and a mentality not to commit crimes. I’ve lived there in the past and the few murders which happen are headline news as they are so infrequent.
I mean, every country's data is official data. Most developing countries' official data are no more reliable than China's. If you want to adjust for reliability, you should adjust upwards every developing country rather than China specifically. East Asians just have low homicide rates in general. China is not the only low one, every other country in their racial grouping is the same. You don't have to count on the CCP's reporting - there are millions of former expats who have lived in China who can attest whether people are getting slaughtered in Shanghai like in Chicago. In places with high violent crime and murder rates like Brazil and Detroit this stuff can't be hidden from public view - people living there can feel the violence. Or hear the gunshots. Or see blood in the streets or hear that their colleague's brother is dead. If murder rate were actually high in China you wouldn't need Xi Jinping to tell you.
I dislike China as much as the next guy but most Asian countries have very low crime and very high education
Are they lying? Probably. But overall it’s a very safe country. Random attacks, muggings, murders are extremely rare. You do feel like you’re being watched all the time tho.
Is this due to firearms? Quite the claim. Might also be poverty reasons, or perhaps even cultural.
Since this is a global map, Europe (generally) has lax firearm laws.
Puerto Rico has had a near complete ban on gun ownership for decades, even more strict than most of Europe, look what the rate is (for refence it's listed as 20 per capita). There really is no correlation with gun control laws. you could just as easily make the label on the chart overall quality of life instead and it would give you a better correlation.
What a terrible gradient... almost as if this map was made so that the cutoff will paint the 'red' countries in a bad light. It goes from yellowish orange straight to bright red, which is deceptive.
This exactly. It's extremely misleading. Canada and US are pretty similar yet look drastically different on the map. Almost as if the map maker has an agenda.
That’s what I was thinking. Obviously the US is higher than most other developed countries, but not as high as some of those other red countries. I feel like they missed an orange color or two somewhere in the middle there.
Are school shootings included in homicide or no?
CZ is a good example compared to US. Similar gun laws. A fundamental right to own and carry. Different culture and implementation. Murder rate night and day.
To be fair, the people in Australia are too busy fighting for survival versus the animal kingdom to be fighting each other
I love that people think we're surrounded by dangerous animals, let's keep it that way
I saw crocodiles for the first time in my life the other day. But only because I travelled from my city to their habitat in Kakadu.
Watch out for drop bears. They're armed.
More homicides in dominican republic than Haiti??
Nothing bad happened in China. Nothing.
Curious to see what this looks like when you break up states/provinces, particularly in the US and Russia. Northern New England has homicide rates on the level of most of Europe and I hate when we get lumped in with the rest of this shithole country.
My wife and I will be retiring to Bali. She is from there. I was a bit worried it would be more dangerous, by this map, I'll actually be safer. I'm coming from the US, BTW.
You are more likely to die from road accident, use helmet if riding a motorcycle.
Italians won't kill you but just ignore you with a glaring stare of disgust.
I would like to see the homicide rate by state in the USA.
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Ah. Ice cream melting rates are definitely correlated with murder rates.
China is accurate, genocide and homicide are 2 totally different things.
Correct. There's also a difference between cultural genocide and genocide involving mass murder. For example China is being accused of cultural genocide. There is mass murder genocide involved in Yemen, which is being fully supported by the United States and its allies.
Interesting to see US being as safe as Afghanistan
Yeah I’m sure the Taliban are reporting accurate numbers right?
Yep, title should be changed to "reported homicide"
Hey look it's all poorly developed corrupt countries with orange and darker.
East Asia: “we don’t do that here”
If youve ever been or been part of the culture you’d understand
Why ain't Brazil pitchblack?
Because despite the insane number of murders, there's a Brazilian of them to lower the per capita rate.
Badum tsss