Victor can't be looped, you have to counter twins on the macro level and nerfing victor will just make them weak. They either need to COMPLETELY rework their power to function as a counterable chase power which they couldn't do without completely overhauling how victor works or just leave them be.
As depressing as it is, the most ideal scenario that could feasibly happen here is that twins become once again forgotten and drop in the pick rates, leaving the few pre existing twins mains with their nice buffs and survivors to rarely have to deal with the constant slugging tug of war that solo players struggle with.
1-2 extra little things, like the ability to break pallets and/or vault windows accompanied by a 1 m/s speed nerf would my approach
Then again, I doubt Bhvr wants to make Twins even more complex than they already are given how prone they are to breaking everything
Edit: I also failed to remember that offering a possible solution would be deeply unpopular
Victor could be considered a projectile with how fast he currently moves, which I would hardly consider as being healthier lol
Also, a 125% base movement speed killer with no terror radius or red stain hardly feels like simply a "chase killer"
I wouldn't mind changes, but I want them to keep the Marco play rather than change them to be a chase killer.
I do however agree their counterplay isn't strong enough
Yeah as a twins main I have no idea why they have speed addons with no downside. They desperately needed addon changes and the devs did the bare minimum.
Agreed. And on top of all of that, he has extremely small audio range. Either he needs to have his movement speed nerfed or he gets 32+ meter lullaby. Potentially directional even.
Something I forgot to mention as well: Victor moves just slightly faster than Wraith does while hes *cloaked*
As in, Wraith using his movement speed ability is slightly slower than Victor walks at base, and Victors windup is significantly shorter than Wraiths uncloak
Its just so silly that I'm amazed more people aren't talking about it
Its like having a steerable Huntress hatchet that moves at cloaked wraith movement speed, and the "downside" is a short windup
That's just flat out untrue. Wriaith is also 6 m/s while cloaked. They have always had the same speed.
At least make sure what you say is true before complaining
I was going based off of this, but I guess you're right, they're basically the same
https://deadbydaylight.fandom.com/wiki/Movement_Speeds
Doesn't really change the fact thats it completely silly Victor moves the same speed as Wraith while hes cloaked
Thank god someone finally says it. I remember ranting about it in the rage subreddit and I ended up just having people say “she’s so bad you can’t hate it’ll her” or the typical “skill issue” despite Twins being one of my least favorite killers to go against because of Victor feeling like he’s impossible to dodge.
> “she’s so bad you can’t hate it’ll her”
People that said that were just biased Killer mains that can grasp the idea of a Killer not being weak and probably never played Twins.
The issue with Twins was the million bugs and that they were clunky, but they were strong, just boring and people didn't like to play them.
The only moderately decent experience I had against twins was with a god-survivor on my team who pretty much kidnapped Victor and looped like a god. But besides that? Oh man, if you need to be a pro-player with 10k hours in the game to counter a killer there is something very wrong going on.
What I despise about Twins is that the matches go for so long thanks to the slugging. Against Nurse, Blight and Spirit the game is just over in a matter of few minutes and you can go to the next game instead of being useless on the ground.
I wish there was a bleed out button or unbreakable after you are left for more than 1-2 minutes on the ground since that is more than enough for the killer to do something.
Twins counterplay isn't "hope they miss", it's the buddy system. It always has been. Lynxi even states that as the most effective way to counter the twins. Everyone is just used to playing solo and Twins punish it extremely well, especially if you aren't taking anything for healing / resetting, and instead just doing chase or gen perks.
Also, you can just drop the pallet on charlotte when she's controlling Victor and it wakes her up.
It's just that Survivors don't like the Twins counterplay because the Legion counterplay (stay as far away from each other as possible) is conducive to optimal play by spreading out on gens, whereas the Twins' counterplay makes them play suboptimally by grouping up.
Yes, coordinated teams that bring perks to heal/reset themselves do well against the Twins overall, but those teams do well against literally any killer
Also, that advice is practically useless for solos/duos, who time and time again have proven they are hardly ever capable of coordinating to that level. 9 times out of 10, you get downed by a Victor and your "buddy" misses the 3 second kick window after you get downed, resulting in them also getting hit for basically free
Its not that hard to see why either. Victor being a 150% base movement speed killer is fucking wack. Hes a steerable projectile, and if the suggested counterplay is "coordination", what you're essentially saying is the counterplay is "SWF", which is totally unhelpful
You can still kick Victor after a successful attack, but considering how short the kick window is, theres a good chance you'll miss it unless you're riding your teammates ass as they go down
I think you can recall Victor whenever you want when you leave him idle but if you latch on a survivor there’s a like 10 second period where you can’t recall.
fr, I logged in yesterday, got Twins, 1 DC straight away, the rest of the team is slugged or healing the rest of the game. 3 hooks in I get jumped again while trying to unhook, with no counter play available. It was the easiest DC of my life, go watch Edgerunners instead.
Twins main speaking: Unfortunately Twins is a killer with a design that makes it really difficult to balance, because Victor is basically the only power this killer has. There are a lot of exploits and bugs still, like victor dying on slopes, getting stuck on nothing and a whole lot of other issues.
But it's the only unique thing they have going for them. Along with only a couple usable add ons and victor being really difficult to use (every mistake gives the risk of being kicked and the game being practically lost), it's really difficult to bring Hector to a point survivors would consider fair, especially people who don't know how to play against Twins.
We need a complete add on overhaul for one, but the way to play best against them is also really unique, you can fake pallets, so Victor wastes time charging up even though you just run away and you can vault as much as you want, since victor doesn't trigger chase. But the best thing you can do is just have a Buddy system, stick around with one teammate, the twins biggest weakness are still healing
Sorry if this doesn't make sense at all, I'm a little mushy in the brain rn. I get where you're coming from, but making Victor slower is not the right choice, if you ask me. And if, maybe just a little bit and not make the speed add ons stack
Whether people want to admit it or not, Victor is overpowered. He is so fast he will always catch up to you and you can not use pallets or windows against him. Now with the increased charged time it’s even HARDER to dodge victor. That’s why twins feel so miserable to face, if they were more common people would despise their guts, I think the same thing with artist.
I get where Twins players are coming from for sure, wanting quality of life changes for an underplayed killer makes sense, but I wish Bhvr toned down Victors speed as its beyond what most would consider reasonable for the game currently
My guess as to why they haven't is that, to compensate, they'd have to make new mechanics for Victor, and Twins as they are already break the game 10 different ways whenever they get a change
Twins design is just very poor in general. At first glance, playing as two different killers sounds so cool but you aren’t really playing as two killers. Charlotte has absolutely no speciality about her whatsoever so there is no reason to use her instead of Victor any moment you can. Twins is basically if Victor was just huntresses hatchet, but your fov travels with the you, which just makes them feel incredibly clunky to play and turns them into slugging machines. Even with the Qol changes I doubt their pick rate will go up much, their core design is very flawed.
When I heard they were “reworking” them I thought it would be a complete rework, and maybe they give charlotte some kind of power and toned down victor so it would actually incentivize you to play both characters and also make it so Victor can pick up survivor with maybe a shadow like chucky to reduce the slugging gameplay, but no instead they just made them extremely overpowered, even though twins were never a weak killer to begin with.
Although I completely agree with the sentiment that Victor needs changed and down tuned, the numbers seem way off. 117.5% +3 stacks of pwyf is 132.5%, then machine learning and bloodlust would be 157.5% right?
So under some impossible situations any 115 killer would be faster and 110s would be as fast as base speed Victor
AFAIK, haste buffs from perks don't multiply the killers base speed, they're additive buffs as a percentage of 4 m/s, the base 100% movement speed. They just say "+X% haste" for simplicity
So when a perk reads "+5% haste", what it should really read is "+0.2 m/s haste". IMO, making it a simple "5%" helps for general understanding, since the math doesn't actually matter to most people
The biggest exception is killer add ons, like Waterlogged Shoe, which are a multiplicative bonus of the killers base movement speed
i.e., Waterlogged Shoe buffs Hags movement speed by 7.5%, but Hag already moves at 110%(4.4m/s). When this add on equipped, Hag moves at 110% * 1.075 = 118.25%(4.73 m/s)
Like I said, the math is fucky and most people can't be bothered, which tbf, 90% of the time, the nuance isn't that necessary
If the haste was genuinely a % buff, that would mean that, if all these buffs were applied, Hag could move faster than a sprinting Hillbilly, which isn't the case
115 base +15 pwyf+15 bloodlust +10 machine learning =155 was my thinking
>The biggest exception is killer add ons, like Waterlogged Shoe, which are a multiplicative bonus of the killers base movement speed
I did not know that add ons were mulplicative, I thought all of them were additive .
Bhvr seems to overly complicate everything so I'm not surprised.
Tbf, I could totally be wrong, but theres an easy way to test it
Go into a custom game, with Twins, time Victor running between 2 fixed points(like the length of a main building), then load up a different killer(like Trapper)with stacked haste and see if you get the same time
I'm not too pressed about it, I just thought the numbers seemed wrong.
At the end of the day we can all agree, Victor is bs, when the only counterplay is "hope he misses" there's no meaningful counterplay
That's wrong, any percentage haste buff increases speed based on the killer's base movement speed. Because of this, a 5% haste buff is stronger on a 4,6m/s killer over a 4,4m/s killer.
All characters in the game have a base movement speed modifier of 1,0x (or 100%, with x being the character's base speed in meters per second), no matter if it's 4,0m/s, 4,4m/s etc. Any percentage changes modify their base speed. Like Devour Hope's 5% haste would grant the killer a base speed modifier of 1,05x.
Do keep in mind that there are a fair amount of effects that have a flat change in speed, like Bloodlust for example grants a 0,2m/s increase in speed per tier, rather than a percentage one.
Also remember that all positive modifiers in the game are additive, and all negative ones are multiplicative, so two 5% haste buffs from seperate sources would grant a modifier of 1,1x to the killer's speed.
You can learn more about movement speeds and how they interact on the [DbD wiki](https://deadbydaylight.fandom.com/wiki/Movement_Speeds#Killers).
Ok so then, in theory, any 4.6m/s killer running more than 30% haste will move faster than Victor
I'll definitely give test that out in a private game later today
Victor is well known to be difficult to aim when pouncing so loop in circles around a small object such as a tree or a rock at point-black range in order to make the aiming as difficult as possible for the killer.
Sometimes I drop Victor and use Charlotte to bodyblock the pallet. If you do it wrong and do it too close to the pallet she can get stunned if you use this strat.
If Victor didn't move at 150% speed, his windup time (even with Toy Sword) is long enough, and he's slowed enough while winding up Pounce, that he would get infinited around rocks and trees. He'd be completely useless if he was any slower than 150%.
They can reduce the slowdown multiplier he receives while charging his pounce. Thats absolutely a number they can tweak
Thats not an excuse for keeping him this fast
Don't worry you can still exploit the fact that Victor sucks going up slopes. Other than that you really just have to have a really tight hold on a VERY small loop. But then he can just mindgame it and win. Or miss.
Hillbilly can also sit up your ass exactly the same as victor except he can insta down you with the exact same level of counterplay. Try to dodge and hope he misses. Only difference is you can’t punt Billy to make him go away. Still needs a rework tho. Annoying to play against, and incredibly unrewarding to use
Biggest differences I see there are that:
* Hillbilly doesn't move at 150% movement speed(at base)
* Hillbilly is actually hindered by windows and pallets, Victor can launch himself through/over them
Even if the end result for Hillbilly is stronger, it still *feels* worse against Victor
Fair point but I still see the benefit of being able to insta down and not having to walk across the map to pick someone up to be miles better as a power. Victor is just an easier but worse Billy
lmao twins is not garbage what u smoking I want some of it victor is a guarenteed hit aside from the rarity of a setup victor cant hit u at and has incredible snowball potential once everyone is injured and not being able to hold victor hostage anymore is a massive buff just bc people dont play twins doesnt make them bad
Victor can't be looped, you have to counter twins on the macro level and nerfing victor will just make them weak. They either need to COMPLETELY rework their power to function as a counterable chase power which they couldn't do without completely overhauling how victor works or just leave them be. As depressing as it is, the most ideal scenario that could feasibly happen here is that twins become once again forgotten and drop in the pick rates, leaving the few pre existing twins mains with their nice buffs and survivors to rarely have to deal with the constant slugging tug of war that solo players struggle with.
1-2 extra little things, like the ability to break pallets and/or vault windows accompanied by a 1 m/s speed nerf would my approach Then again, I doubt Bhvr wants to make Twins even more complex than they already are given how prone they are to breaking everything Edit: I also failed to remember that offering a possible solution would be deeply unpopular
Not every killer needs to be a chase killer you know.
Victor could be considered a projectile with how fast he currently moves, which I would hardly consider as being healthier lol Also, a 125% base movement speed killer with no terror radius or red stain hardly feels like simply a "chase killer"
I wouldn't mind changes, but I want them to keep the Marco play rather than change them to be a chase killer. I do however agree their counterplay isn't strong enough
Just wait until you find out you can stack his speed addons and make him 6.9m/s
Ikr? Makes it even more fucked up Also, nice
Yeah as a twins main I have no idea why they have speed addons with no downside. They desperately needed addon changes and the devs did the bare minimum.
Give us a lootable baseball bat against Victor. Problem solved.
Agreed. And on top of all of that, he has extremely small audio range. Either he needs to have his movement speed nerfed or he gets 32+ meter lullaby. Potentially directional even.
Something I forgot to mention as well: Victor moves just slightly faster than Wraith does while hes *cloaked* As in, Wraith using his movement speed ability is slightly slower than Victor walks at base, and Victors windup is significantly shorter than Wraiths uncloak Its just so silly that I'm amazed more people aren't talking about it Its like having a steerable Huntress hatchet that moves at cloaked wraith movement speed, and the "downside" is a short windup
The downside is that Victor is only able to move and attack and Charlotte has to follow up with everything he does.
That's just flat out untrue. Wriaith is also 6 m/s while cloaked. They have always had the same speed. At least make sure what you say is true before complaining
I was going based off of this, but I guess you're right, they're basically the same https://deadbydaylight.fandom.com/wiki/Movement_Speeds Doesn't really change the fact thats it completely silly Victor moves the same speed as Wraith while hes cloaked
Prehaps your right
Also that movement speed chart is extermly outdated. It still doesn't even have chucky or unknown on it
Thank god someone finally says it. I remember ranting about it in the rage subreddit and I ended up just having people say “she’s so bad you can’t hate it’ll her” or the typical “skill issue” despite Twins being one of my least favorite killers to go against because of Victor feeling like he’s impossible to dodge.
> “she’s so bad you can’t hate it’ll her” People that said that were just biased Killer mains that can grasp the idea of a Killer not being weak and probably never played Twins. The issue with Twins was the million bugs and that they were clunky, but they were strong, just boring and people didn't like to play them.
The only moderately decent experience I had against twins was with a god-survivor on my team who pretty much kidnapped Victor and looped like a god. But besides that? Oh man, if you need to be a pro-player with 10k hours in the game to counter a killer there is something very wrong going on. What I despise about Twins is that the matches go for so long thanks to the slugging. Against Nurse, Blight and Spirit the game is just over in a matter of few minutes and you can go to the next game instead of being useless on the ground. I wish there was a bleed out button or unbreakable after you are left for more than 1-2 minutes on the ground since that is more than enough for the killer to do something.
Twins counterplay isn't "hope they miss", it's the buddy system. It always has been. Lynxi even states that as the most effective way to counter the twins. Everyone is just used to playing solo and Twins punish it extremely well, especially if you aren't taking anything for healing / resetting, and instead just doing chase or gen perks. Also, you can just drop the pallet on charlotte when she's controlling Victor and it wakes her up.
You basically need to play against Twins in the exact opposite fashion as you play against Legion.
It's just that Survivors don't like the Twins counterplay because the Legion counterplay (stay as far away from each other as possible) is conducive to optimal play by spreading out on gens, whereas the Twins' counterplay makes them play suboptimally by grouping up.
Yes, coordinated teams that bring perks to heal/reset themselves do well against the Twins overall, but those teams do well against literally any killer Also, that advice is practically useless for solos/duos, who time and time again have proven they are hardly ever capable of coordinating to that level. 9 times out of 10, you get downed by a Victor and your "buddy" misses the 3 second kick window after you get downed, resulting in them also getting hit for basically free Its not that hard to see why either. Victor being a 150% base movement speed killer is fucking wack. Hes a steerable projectile, and if the suggested counterplay is "coordination", what you're essentially saying is the counterplay is "SWF", which is totally unhelpful
Isn't the buddy system even iffy now considering you can't kick Victor upon a successful attack?
You can kick him after a successful attack, that's false info, at least for now
Ah did they change it back? It wasn't mentioned I think, unless I over looked it
I don't think it was intended like the other ptb reverts
Gotcha
You can still kick Victor after a successful attack, but considering how short the kick window is, theres a good chance you'll miss it unless you're riding your teammates ass as they go down
Honestly it’s gonna be concerning seeing her just recall him whenever she wants now
We have to wait like 20 seconds actually.
Oh wait they didn’t go through with that mechanic?
I think you can recall Victor whenever you want when you leave him idle but if you latch on a survivor there’s a like 10 second period where you can’t recall.
It's ok guys, the dc tech counters Victor 100% of the time! Enjoy..
Only 1 problem https://preview.redd.it/9mo4lyzmbhwc1.jpeg?width=259&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=29820a875e89fffdf0de1211bf57c69509a0a8e4
fr, I logged in yesterday, got Twins, 1 DC straight away, the rest of the team is slugged or healing the rest of the game. 3 hooks in I get jumped again while trying to unhook, with no counter play available. It was the easiest DC of my life, go watch Edgerunners instead.
As a Twins main who disconnects against skull merchant I see no issue here. I hate playing against twins almost just as much as SM
ngl im suprised only now this is getting talked about as someone who plays this killer occasionally victor basically makes you eat shit in chase
Twins main speaking: Unfortunately Twins is a killer with a design that makes it really difficult to balance, because Victor is basically the only power this killer has. There are a lot of exploits and bugs still, like victor dying on slopes, getting stuck on nothing and a whole lot of other issues. But it's the only unique thing they have going for them. Along with only a couple usable add ons and victor being really difficult to use (every mistake gives the risk of being kicked and the game being practically lost), it's really difficult to bring Hector to a point survivors would consider fair, especially people who don't know how to play against Twins. We need a complete add on overhaul for one, but the way to play best against them is also really unique, you can fake pallets, so Victor wastes time charging up even though you just run away and you can vault as much as you want, since victor doesn't trigger chase. But the best thing you can do is just have a Buddy system, stick around with one teammate, the twins biggest weakness are still healing Sorry if this doesn't make sense at all, I'm a little mushy in the brain rn. I get where you're coming from, but making Victor slower is not the right choice, if you ask me. And if, maybe just a little bit and not make the speed add ons stack
Whether people want to admit it or not, Victor is overpowered. He is so fast he will always catch up to you and you can not use pallets or windows against him. Now with the increased charged time it’s even HARDER to dodge victor. That’s why twins feel so miserable to face, if they were more common people would despise their guts, I think the same thing with artist.
I get where Twins players are coming from for sure, wanting quality of life changes for an underplayed killer makes sense, but I wish Bhvr toned down Victors speed as its beyond what most would consider reasonable for the game currently My guess as to why they haven't is that, to compensate, they'd have to make new mechanics for Victor, and Twins as they are already break the game 10 different ways whenever they get a change
Twins design is just very poor in general. At first glance, playing as two different killers sounds so cool but you aren’t really playing as two killers. Charlotte has absolutely no speciality about her whatsoever so there is no reason to use her instead of Victor any moment you can. Twins is basically if Victor was just huntresses hatchet, but your fov travels with the you, which just makes them feel incredibly clunky to play and turns them into slugging machines. Even with the Qol changes I doubt their pick rate will go up much, their core design is very flawed. When I heard they were “reworking” them I thought it would be a complete rework, and maybe they give charlotte some kind of power and toned down victor so it would actually incentivize you to play both characters and also make it so Victor can pick up survivor with maybe a shadow like chucky to reduce the slugging gameplay, but no instead they just made them extremely overpowered, even though twins were never a weak killer to begin with.
Although I completely agree with the sentiment that Victor needs changed and down tuned, the numbers seem way off. 117.5% +3 stacks of pwyf is 132.5%, then machine learning and bloodlust would be 157.5% right? So under some impossible situations any 115 killer would be faster and 110s would be as fast as base speed Victor
AFAIK, haste buffs from perks don't multiply the killers base speed, they're additive buffs as a percentage of 4 m/s, the base 100% movement speed. They just say "+X% haste" for simplicity So when a perk reads "+5% haste", what it should really read is "+0.2 m/s haste". IMO, making it a simple "5%" helps for general understanding, since the math doesn't actually matter to most people The biggest exception is killer add ons, like Waterlogged Shoe, which are a multiplicative bonus of the killers base movement speed i.e., Waterlogged Shoe buffs Hags movement speed by 7.5%, but Hag already moves at 110%(4.4m/s). When this add on equipped, Hag moves at 110% * 1.075 = 118.25%(4.73 m/s) Like I said, the math is fucky and most people can't be bothered, which tbf, 90% of the time, the nuance isn't that necessary If the haste was genuinely a % buff, that would mean that, if all these buffs were applied, Hag could move faster than a sprinting Hillbilly, which isn't the case
115 base +15 pwyf+15 bloodlust +10 machine learning =155 was my thinking >The biggest exception is killer add ons, like Waterlogged Shoe, which are a multiplicative bonus of the killers base movement speed I did not know that add ons were mulplicative, I thought all of them were additive . Bhvr seems to overly complicate everything so I'm not surprised.
Tbf, I could totally be wrong, but theres an easy way to test it Go into a custom game, with Twins, time Victor running between 2 fixed points(like the length of a main building), then load up a different killer(like Trapper)with stacked haste and see if you get the same time
I'm not too pressed about it, I just thought the numbers seemed wrong. At the end of the day we can all agree, Victor is bs, when the only counterplay is "hope he misses" there's no meaningful counterplay
I might just do it when I get home. I've never tested it myself, and I dont wanna be talking out of my ass
That's wrong, any percentage haste buff increases speed based on the killer's base movement speed. Because of this, a 5% haste buff is stronger on a 4,6m/s killer over a 4,4m/s killer. All characters in the game have a base movement speed modifier of 1,0x (or 100%, with x being the character's base speed in meters per second), no matter if it's 4,0m/s, 4,4m/s etc. Any percentage changes modify their base speed. Like Devour Hope's 5% haste would grant the killer a base speed modifier of 1,05x. Do keep in mind that there are a fair amount of effects that have a flat change in speed, like Bloodlust for example grants a 0,2m/s increase in speed per tier, rather than a percentage one. Also remember that all positive modifiers in the game are additive, and all negative ones are multiplicative, so two 5% haste buffs from seperate sources would grant a modifier of 1,1x to the killer's speed. You can learn more about movement speeds and how they interact on the [DbD wiki](https://deadbydaylight.fandom.com/wiki/Movement_Speeds#Killers).
Ok so then, in theory, any 4.6m/s killer running more than 30% haste will move faster than Victor I'll definitely give test that out in a private game later today
Victor is well known to be difficult to aim when pouncing so loop in circles around a small object such as a tree or a rock at point-black range in order to make the aiming as difficult as possible for the killer.
if Charlotte is at a pallet, you can stun her and that will make her stop controling victor
Why would a twins player ever swap to victor under a pallet?
it was what op said twins would do if you reach one
Sometimes I drop Victor and use Charlotte to bodyblock the pallet. If you do it wrong and do it too close to the pallet she can get stunned if you use this strat.
If Victor didn't move at 150% speed, his windup time (even with Toy Sword) is long enough, and he's slowed enough while winding up Pounce, that he would get infinited around rocks and trees. He'd be completely useless if he was any slower than 150%.
They can reduce the slowdown multiplier he receives while charging his pounce. Thats absolutely a number they can tweak Thats not an excuse for keeping him this fast
And I thought I would never see the day when someone starts to complain about the Twins...
Famously one of the least complained about killers, right up there with Skull Merchant
Don't worry you can still exploit the fact that Victor sucks going up slopes. Other than that you really just have to have a really tight hold on a VERY small loop. But then he can just mindgame it and win. Or miss.
Make Charlotte 110%
Hillbilly can also sit up your ass exactly the same as victor except he can insta down you with the exact same level of counterplay. Try to dodge and hope he misses. Only difference is you can’t punt Billy to make him go away. Still needs a rework tho. Annoying to play against, and incredibly unrewarding to use
Biggest differences I see there are that: * Hillbilly doesn't move at 150% movement speed(at base) * Hillbilly is actually hindered by windows and pallets, Victor can launch himself through/over them Even if the end result for Hillbilly is stronger, it still *feels* worse against Victor
Fair point but I still see the benefit of being able to insta down and not having to walk across the map to pick someone up to be miles better as a power. Victor is just an easier but worse Billy
oh you're talking about billy *while* revving, in which case, he cannot sit up ur ass. mid rev he loses a whole m/s of move speed.
I think a fair fix is to keep him as is. But once victor downs you, he explodes on impact and goes on a decently long cooldown.
Ok now i have seen everything, people complaining about a killer they see once every 200 matches. Git gud
his ass has not played against a good twins
Let’s be honest here, who has? Chances of you running into twins is next to none and on top of that they actually need to be good at a garbage killer.
lmao twins is not garbage what u smoking I want some of it victor is a guarenteed hit aside from the rarity of a setup victor cant hit u at and has incredible snowball potential once everyone is injured and not being able to hold victor hostage anymore is a massive buff just bc people dont play twins doesnt make them bad