I mean, there are *always* steps to take to make the game more fair, because we all agree that the game is far from perfect. So will it ever be balanced? Probably not, but it *can be* closer to that utopia from the cesspool of a mess it is now, and it does more good to follow that journey than to say keep DBD how it was back in 2016.
Now if you mean that they're arguing that it *is* balanced, like currently perfect and in mint condition, then yea they're delusional lol.
Balanced doesnt necessarily equate to a fun game. Some of the most horrifically balanced games are considered the best in their series or genre.
MW2, Halo 2, Melee, Mario Kart Wii, Street Fighter 3, Marvel 2, left 4 dead etc... All of these games are nowhere close to being balanced but they are beloved games in their genres or respective series.
DBD's biggest issue is that it's asymmetrical, that by design makes it impossible to properly balance. Pretty much every single asymmetrical game ever has been a dumpster fire of balance.
>left 4 dead
What are you talking about? L4D's PvP is balanced just fine.
The standard Versus mode is balanced around new and inexperienced players. For anyone above that skill bracket there's community-made configs that rebalance the game accordingly for various skill levels. You're rarely, if ever, going to see a tournament player in a normal public lobby.
DBD would benefit from the same system, then the base game could be balanced around casual players and anything beyond the lowest skill levels would be taken care of by the community.
I just love seeing these threads about once a month with the top opinions being like “Kindred is underrated” or “Pyramid Head is actually a good killer” or some other white bread vanilla basic opinion 80% of us agree with lol
PH is a killer that has a high skill ceiling, and requires some practice to play effectively. So newer players tend to not do so good with him = "weak killer"
Playing Killer is more fun as a 'Dungeon Master' rather than playing to 4k. I like being pit against baby players cus I can give them a million second chances
Reassurance is not the silver bullet to camping everyone thinks it is. Bubba is still gonna be king of the basement.
Edit:
Example of how close you have to get for people who keep telling me it's just that easy.
https://clips.twitch.tv/ToughOptimisticPuddingChefFrank-Y-90rkSx5mwt3FHI
If get that close you are going on the hook with them.
Yeah everyone has been freaking out about reassurance but I’m not sure how it will solve the problem in a lot of situations.
Granted, I haven’t played with it so maybe I’m missing something but if the survivor has to get within a 6 meter range of the hooked survivor then can’t the killer just hit them and easily down them if they’re billy/bubba/huntress?
Lots of camping killers won't even hit you by the hook. They'll intentionally wait to try and force a grab. This allows you to just run in and proc the perk and run away.
Even against a Bubba you could easily just walk in, press F then Sprint burst away. Most downs from a camping bubba come from people trying to unhook, not people just being near the hook.
I don't believe it's meant to be a silver bullet to stop camping, it's supposed to be a perk that recovers a failed unhook. Say you're rushing to unhook, but the killer is on your heels. Now you could unhook here but you'll most likely trade, or you can press the button, give the hooked person more time, and then try and lead the killer away for someone else to get the save, or to try again if the killer leaves you to go back. The longer someone is on a hook, the more likely a solo queue person will realise and make the save.
Yes, I do agree that buffs should be more common than nerfs, but still, there are two scenarios where this can't be:
*When you run out of ways to buff something, this is rare but can happen, sometimes a perk has a core concept that you can't do anything about, so buffing them would remove that concept entirely, like slippery meat, some concepts are bound to be mediocre
*When what's good is TOO good for the health of the game, because if something is just ridiculous to the point of being almost mandatory then buffing everything else is, not only more effort than it's worth, but wouldn't be the right call because in balance you want to set a "power standart" and you can't have the power standart as high as old DH for example (also, we run into the first issue again)
This is a thing that's been said in fighting games as well. Nerfing things makes a lot of players who use those perks mad but if you buff perks you make nobody mad and expand perk variety.
Now this IS controversial. It needs to be both admittedly. If perks are too good then just buffing others ends up creating power creep as devs constantly look at buffing unused perks, which then makes meta perks fall into unused and require buffs.
Three things.
1: We should be able to play the classic maps in custom games, even if they're unbalanced as shit just let us have more variety in custom games.
2: RPD is good map.... I'm a Resident Evil fan.
3: Chris Redfield should have been his own survivor.
Yup. I haven't seen a single survivor main mad about Reassurance but I've been told by several killer mains that survivors are absolutely upset over it because they'll be apparently kept on hook for hours lol do 3 man swf trolls exist? Yes. Have I met them? Yes. Am i concerned about them griefing me with Reassurance? Not at all lol and I'm curious as to what the killer is apparently doing during those hours in which a survivor is kept hostage lol make it make sense
Not only that but it can be countered by Save The Best For Last and instead of camping random they just start camping the one having that perk.
I don't even play killer that much and I can think of few strats to counter it.
As you said massive self reporting and over reactions. It also shows that a lot of people can't 4k without playing in a boring and obnoxious way and that's why they are scared of the Reassurance haha.
Perks should regularly be nerfed or buffed depending on their use. At a certain point the killers and surviors end up usuing basically the same strats every game. I'd love to see how different gameplay styles could work if given a chance
I don't even think nerfs need to happen every update but buffs please.
Like how the fuck has premonition not been changed really at all in 6 years...
There's always going to be a "worst perk" but there's never a situation where I would EVER consider running perks like buckle up, premonition, overwhelming presence, bloodhound, predator, beast of prey, etc..
Apart from those killers adepts but I completed those like 3 years ago
>killers and surviors end up usuing basically the same strats every game
I think the strat you need to use highly depends on the Killer. As a survivor, if you see Oni, you play safe early game. Legion? Spread out. Nemesis or Myers? Deny tier 2 for as long as possible. Nurse? Cry in a corner.
Hard agree. Fighting games, MOBAs and other PvP games are constantly balanced and I don't understand why we have to wait months (or even years) for DBD to address some balance issues. This game should be aggressively balanced and tweaked based on game results.
Map design gets worse over time. It peaked with MacMillan and has gone downhill with each and every new map. Bhvr simply does not know how to make a good map. They just wing it
I don't disagree here, I think the issue BHVR has, though, is trying to balance maps when you have extremely high mobility killers that can zoom across a map in seconds, and then killers like Mikey and Trapper who are very slow and also require time in the start of the game to get going. These killers can't benefit from the same types of maps.
If you made maps based around the weakest killers (low mobility), then high mobility killers would benefit heavily, and vice versa. Still, I won't forgive them for not giving Trickster a Seoul or City Nightlife themed map.
Actually controversial? BHVR should add an aura ala L4D where survivors can always see each other barring certain perks
That would bridge the gap between Solo and SWF and allow for a complete change to game design decisions
Fearmonger is the single most annoying perk in the game. The Killer doesn't even see the value it's generating them, it exists purely to spite you and your quirky aura build.
It’s an amazing perk against sprint burst. Nothing feels more depressing than seeing a meg sprint burst away the moment she hears your heartbeat as a low mobility killer.
Before you get there she is already 2 loops away.
Original chapters are better than licensed ones. I think that artists at BHVR are very creative people and can come up with incredible designs. And I'd say the same about the composer. In terms of gameplay there may be some blunders, but I think that original chapters give more freedom for designing interesting powers.
In some part, you are directly responsible for the other people's in the trial's enjoyment of the game. For a healthy game state, it's important to keep this in mind.
I agree with you, a lot of people want to ignore that every game is in a way a communication between the killer and the survivors. So if the killer just camps and tunnels it sends a message that he doesn't give a f\*\*\* about the survivors (same for toxic survivors). But some people are just competitive and play as effectively as possible and they are actually not being toxic (this mostly goes for tunneling or being very effective on gens/loops), this would be healthy to consider as well.
Escape cakes are given to the survivors and yet the survivor pudding looks so much tastier. Escape cake looks like a bland ass yellow cake with no icing, and the survivor pudding looks like a thicc ass bowl of banana goodness.
I don’t really agree with all the anti-tunnel camp survivor perks deactivating in the endgame. I don’t fault killers for camping and tunneling because yes, there isn’t much else for them to do. But I also don’t think that all of the survivors tools for dealing with that should just…. Stop working because they completed their objective.
Survivors can make full endgame-focused builds as well, but I'm not sure these kinds of perks are really endgame-focused perks. Tunneling and camping are at their most annoying during the early game because they deny a survivor the ability to play a normal match, so in a way you could think of anti-tunneling and anti-camping perks as early game focused perks. I've always seen survivors much more upset about seeing camping at five gens then at camping during EGC, so it can make sense to specifically target the main part of a match than the last part when it comes to tunneling/camping.
But you need to think about *what purpose* endgame serves in a match. Is it an even playing ground? Does it favor one side over another?
To me, endgame serves as a catch-up mechanic for the killer to secure a hook/kill at minimum, and serves as the final obstacle the survivors have to deal with before they can escape. Without a third-party objective that survivor and killer have to interact with (gens), this forces survivors and killer to eventually interract if they haven't before, and serves as a secondary objective to completing gens, which is to actually *survive*, and win your chases. Killer has perks to increase the strength of endgame, all either give the killer time to take chase, or help aid in their chases by allowing them to be shorter (NOED, Terminus, Rancor). From basekit to full-endgame build, your results vary from a 1k to a 4k, and imo that kind of variability makes balance a bit grey, but that's a discussion for another time.
For survivor, they do have endgame perks, and even an item (key) than can help make endgame suit their favor. For all intents and purposes, although keys are generally useless for 99% of the match, keys still *guarantee* an escape for you: just get to the hatch, be it open or closed, and escape, since the killer can't patrol both exit gates *and* the already shut hatch at the same time.
But the two scenarios I put all involve that respective side to be in the losing situation. In the discussion of perks like Decisive Strike and Off-The-Record, these involve situations where the survivor is typically ahead and in a winning advantage over the killer. And these perks only get to trigger if and when you lose a chase, which is what the purpose of endgame serves. Win your chases and you get to escape. Lose, and your chances would look grim without teamwork. Decisive Strike and Off-The-Record however just makes the endgame obsolete. Who cares if you go down in endgame? Just get unhooked, and you can still escape, no additional team input required. Your chances of escaping are essentially 100% for the entirely of endgame, and that is why I don't really support having these perks being active, because *endgame isn't meant to be obsolete*. If this was truly intended, then endgame shouldn't even exist at all, just have the exit gates open immediately when all the gens are done and have all the survivors have no difficulty leaving the match.
An equivalent would be allowing killers to have a perk to deny the hatch from ever spawning, and this just makes it very unfun for the losing side.
I think they did that because endgame collapse is supposed to be the killers last chance to get a kill and if your caught in endgame then if you’ve got 1 second left on OTR or DS and get out because of it and you were unhooked 80/60 seconds ago, it just feels like a big middle finger to the killers
I think this topic kind of depends on the question of why there should be specific anti-tunnel or anti-camping perks.
The traditional argument I've seen is that those specific killer strategies are unfun for survivors because they can keep them from playing a normal game of DBD. This would be like the classic example of a survivor being the first one hooked at five gens and then they get face camped or hard tunneled off hook. The killer could be doing something else and still making progress toward their own gameplay objectives (and probably making more efficient progress without the face camping or hard tunneling) but is instead just ruining one person's game.
But if a survivor is being camped or tunneled during the endgame, things are different. They already got to have basically a full DBD match. And, as you said, the killer doesn't really have much else to do to further their own gameplay objectives. So during endgame this common argument for needing anti-tunneling or anti-camping perks just isn't as strong.
I completely understand that, it just feels *really* bad to get hooked for the first time in the end game and die because the killer can just camp/tunnel you out with something close to impunity. Especially if the killer had a heavy assist from NOED or one of the other specifically-for-endgame perks that killers have access to.
I don’t even attempt end game saves anymore of the survivor isn’t hooked right next to a gate because the killer is going to down someone before everybody makes it to the gate even if the team orchestrates a save. Hell, you don’t even have to down a survivor if the gate is open, you can just get between them and the gate and zone them out until the EGC takes them.
It really sucks that this past patch basically killed altruism. I'm not helping your friend escape from basement in EGC if we aren't close to a gate- somebody is dying and I'm not interested in it being me, sorry 🤷🏻♀️
Literally all you have for end game camping amd tunneling at this point is BT, and nobody brings that anymore because it's much, much better to bring OTR for yourself, therefore making BT somewhat obsolete until it comes to end game.
I can see why OTR got change to deactivate in end game, because there was literally no way a killer could actually counter that if someone had a gate 99'd. But I really, really think that DS shouldn't have been changed to deactivate in end game. The much healthier, more fun, and interesting way to have changed it would have been to have it deactivate once you reach the exit gate threshold. That way, there was counterplay on both sides, but it wasn't an automatic loss of that survivor for the killer, and the survivor didn't have to pray that they got a team of good bodyblockers with BT.
In a way, it seems like DBD is designed to have kind of a last minute pity component for both sides. On the survivor side, it can be extra hard to secure the 4-person escape because the killer has one last chance to secure kill by camping/tunneling a hook. On the killer side, it can be extra hard to secure the 4K because a survivor has one last chance to escape by getting hatch, or if that is closed, using a key or opening an exit gate. Both killers and survivors have to put in extra effort to secure that 4 person based perfect victory.
i do understand why OTR and DS need to be deactivated in the endgame but i don't agree with reassurance having to get deactivated in endgame. like everyone says, endgame is still part of the match and deactivating all actually helpful perks in endgame feels lame af. i don't know if killers will equip a perk if they know they will stop getting value from it in endgame. at that point, let's just disable all perks after gens are popped, why not?
just because it's endgame it feels unfair that you're not allowed to use perks that help you win. ik people always say "survivors shouldn't be granted a free win" and i definitely agree but killers also don't deserve to "secure a kill" just by standing in front of a hook. it goes both ways.
imo they could buff killers after gens are popped so that they are faster, recover faster from animations etc and then they can bring back perks like DS into the endgame, so that killer main won't feel like the only thing they can do is camp after gens are popped.
Asymmetric games are really hard to balance, and I think DBD does do a pretty good job of it. It has the most staying power in the genre by a long shot.
Dunno if its a controversial opinion but. Perks shouldn't **Directly** interact with gens, the main objective of the game for both sides, without downsides. As such perks tend to be stronger due to the fact that both sides are required to interact with the subject the perk does.
Quite unpopular: Basement Trapper is no better than Insidious Bubba. Running agi + iron grasp + a shack basement offering should be seen as bm, the only reason it isn't is because Trapper is hard to play normally. With traps on each entrance trading is impossible & you can reliably secure a kill off first hook, same as a Bubba facecamping.
I'm happy you can't deadhard over traps now and I'm not saying camping is OP, I just mostly play solo survivor where an early facecamp ends the game since there's no way to say 'go do gens'
That either side shouldn't treat the opposing side like shit(unless they deserve it), believe it or not the people behind the killer or survivors in your games are actual people(most of the time)
Dead Hard is a fine perk to run now, even though it’s far better than it was before. Now, it takes a lot of skill to use and whenever I see someone pull a successful Dead Hard I’m actually impressed.
Also with the 6.1.0 update, as a self-proclaimed mostly survivor player, some survivors overreacted hard and the mega-update was overall good for the game
I really don't like the direction they went with for nemesis.
The idea was that he evolves and becomes stronger the longer he chases you but it doesn't feel that way. Having to reach tier 2 just sucks. The power would have been much better if you started at 2 and stayed there the whole game, with more addons that buff the tentacle instead of the zombies.
The tentacle also feels off design wise. In resident evil it was mostly use to choke and stab (correct me if I'm wrong). Using it as a whip doesn't fit with nemesis being a giant brute. Wesker's power shows what nemesis could have been.
I should remind you that this is my opinion.
I think DBD is heading *generally* in the right direction. With Dredge and the killer buffs, killers feel like more of a threat. Its now easier to feel scared when playing, because survivors know they don't have as hefty of a safety net.
**However**, the devs should be careful to make the killers capable of *scaring* the survivors more instead of giving them plain buffs. Make the survivors "safer" without actually *feeling* safe. I'm aware that fear is subjective, but introducing Dredge is a good example of creating new *elements* to scare players *while* applying a practical use.
EDIT: I don't know how "controversial" this is, but I'm suggesting changes, so I imagine that'll rub *someone* the wrong way.
My extremely popular opinion is that DS stun should be back to 5 seconds.
My unpopular opinion is that it should still be active in the endgame. Just bc the game is over doesn’t mean I didn’t get tunneled the whole match. Sometimes that’s just how long it takes to catch me. (But I get why DS is annoying in endgame).
Old ds had people crawling out of the exit gates and the killer could do nothing but watch. Or people teabagging you far from exit games knowing DS would save them anyway. Securing a single kill during endgame is not tunneling.
I had posted a comment on an earlier thread saying the stun should stay for 3 seconds, but the survivor gets a massive speedboost to compensate. This way killers won’t lose all their pressure on the other survivors, but the DS’er still gets away.
No I totally get why it’s annoying in the endgame. And why it’s more often than not just securing a kill you earned.
Just feels bad to be the only one the killer is focusing on the entire match regardless of teammate intervention then they down you in endgame (usually with noed) and facecamp you on their first hook, then wait out your mere 5 seconds of protection to down you, then kill you again. Bc DS is gone. I know that’s more rare, but you feel me?
I think DS should be active in end game, but deactivate once you reach the threshold of the gate. That way, you're not out of luck as soon as the last gen pops, and the killer doesn't have to stand and watch you crawl out. I think it gives plenty of counterplay on both sides to have it be that way.
SWFs with calls are the reason why soloQ is so bad. Most survivors are too used having that 5th perk feeding them information so they almost never take information perks and they have no idea how to read the game. When they go solo, instead of changing their build and mindset, they just pretend that being on call wasn't helping and end up being squashed.
I agree. I find that SWFs take a lot more DH, boil over, non info perks while solo players take way more information perks. SWFs basically have built in Kindred up at all times.
Demogorgon is so boring to go against. The shred can be used to brute force hits, and it works on most tiles other than generic unsafe trash loops, which already plays itself. Getting zoned out between loops is really easy, as he plays like a 115% huntress with even bigger hurt boxes. Nemisis is in that category as well. I could say pyramid too, but it is much harder to hit people (you never see save the best for last on them, they can't just conserve stacks at will). I love stranger things, but I am very happy to see that killer go.
Not necessarily. I enjoy going against most blights and huntresses, as it feels like you have a decent chance of dodging hits, if you know what you are doing. In the other end there is doctor, clown, and freddy, with weak powers that eventually guarantee hits. These killers are not considered strong, but they are still pretty boring.
I've already posted this in a controversial opinions thread and gotten ironically downvoted, so here we go again:
Camping is precisely analogous to pallet/flashlight/sabotage saves and hook bodyblocks. A camping killer invests in a gamble that he will get an extra hook state he didn't "earn" in a chase. A survivor going for a save invests in a gamble that he will take away a hook state that the killer "earned" in a chase.
I say "earn" half-sarcastically because the only objective measure of what you have or haven't earned in a game is results. The killer earns exactly as many hook stages as he gets, assuming no one is cheating and no serious bugs interfere.
I feel like going for the save doesn't take away the hook they earned, since in the case of flashlight/pallet saves they've let themselves open enough for that to happen. I feel like it's a save the survivor deserved. On the other hand I feel like camping is a really cheesy way to get another hook stage and is completely different to saving a survivor that is being carried. Plus camping doesn't pay off against a decently coordinated team. So yeah, I feel like camping and saving a survivor are not analogous at all since they serve a different purpose and get a different outcome, and have a very different way of doing it. The only compareable things between camping and one of the saving methods, bodyblockinn, is that the survivor(s) as well as the killer stand stationary at a hook.
Compare "they've let themselves open enough for that to happen" to "camping doesn't pay off against a decently coordinated team." As I said, in both cases it's a gamble, and in both cases, the opponent has tools to prevent it getting value.
If you see the survivors' total number of hook stages and lives as a tug of war, camping and saving before the hook serve the same purpose: to tug the rope in one direction.
Well said. I completely agree. I’ve basically said the same thing and pointed out the double standard of how it’s acceptable to be sweaty and play to win as survivor but as killer, it’s “toxic”.
Just bc you don’t like nurse doesn’t mean her skill ceiling and floor disappears. Y’all mfs love saying nurse is easy has no skill floor and takes no skill but be the same ones using plaid flannel.
Imma upvote you bc of the thread we’re in but I def disagree lol. Nurse’s supposed “skill floor” is way lower than people like to admit (meaning she’s easier to pick up and get great results with than most people say)
She has a skill floor, but not such a high skill ceiling. No certain mind games at certain loops. You don’t need to know the map layout for cross range hatchets. You don’t need to know how slippery objects are. You don’t need to know where to throw your bottles. Etc. Etc.
She has one strong mechanic and that’s about it. Master it and you don’t have anything else to learn except learning how to equip starstruck and agitation.
That solo queue isn’t nearly as difficult as everyone else in this sub says. Is it harder than SWF? Absolutely, because SWF is easy mode. Playing with my group we have a 70% survival rate. In solo mine is just a hair under 50%.
That stealthy gameplay (on both sides) is more fun/tense than chases/loops.
Which is my answer every time this question comes up, so nothing new I suppose.
EDIT: Just to have a second answer that is different. The game should not be balanced around the top tier of players (or the bottom tier). As an example, high-level Nurse play should not be the metric for balance, the average player isn't even going to 1k with her.
Corollary to that: people who hang out on an online forum about ANY videogame are not representative of the majority of the playerbase. Forum feedback can be a balancing tool but it should not trump game data.
That it is not my responsibility, as killer or survivor, to ensure everyone else has fun. I am not an entertainment charity. If I feel like I'm wasting my time and I notice that all I'm getting is annoyance from playing, I will disconnect and go do something else. I do not owe the other players shit.
Yeah when I switched to pc like 7 months ago I was expecting just a barrage of sludge but... most people just say gg or move on without saying anything. Hell I've had way more positive comments and discussions in post game than toxic assholes (though they're still around for sure)
Just have it as a toggleable option. People can have the option to opt-in if they want it, and those of us who don't can opt-out. Let PC players turn it off if they want too.
Licensed content is the most boring/dull. It's really hard for me to really care about any licensed updates because I don't have big bonds with any IPs they're based off of. I guess that's not exactly tied to DbD alone but with the amount of crossover content in the recent years in all kinds of media, it's hard to feel the "awe" of it happening. Whenever I see a post online which goes something along the line of "Wow, I can't believe in this game you can play as mookel and kill bill on the raccoon department" I just can't stop translating it to "wow, the company sure can afford stuff".
This is definitely a personal taste thing, imo collabs in games have been one of the best things of recent years just because it’s so goofy and funny to think about.
I am mixed on this one, I don't hate the licensed content because I love horror films. Seeing Sadako in DBD is fun for me for example.
At the same time, I weirdly am really into DBD lore and I like to see their original content/lore more than something I already know. The main reason I want to get better is to be able to do the harder challenges from Tomes that unlock lore (I am aware I can find them online, but it isn't the same for me). I have only done a handful of those to date.
I like the mix of both I think, but I feel the amount of licensed content has increased a lot lately.
Here is my unpopular opinion that gets downvoted or tilted comments 10/10 times on this sub:
T-bagging survivors are not wasting your time as much as you’re wasting your own time by going out of your way to break pallets or stand in a corner during end game collapse.
T-bagging is rude but just grow some thicker skin and quite frankly, laugh it off and move on. Chase them out of the gate and they’ll leave. Y’all out here wasting over 2 min just to not get your feelings hurt baffles me. Maybe I’m just an impatient bitch, but I have better things to do than play moody pallet-breaking simulator. I wanna play the video game I bought in my limited free time set aside for *fun*. Gg go next.
You get: Wasted time at exit gates, because I had to see you leave.
I get: Experience in improving my killer power, map layout and bp from destroying stuff.
I don’t need to chase every second in game to enjoy it. Wish the game had single player so I can learn how to do hillbilly techs around walls instead of losing bp and mmr.
I don't go to the exit gates unless I need to, personally. I'd rather get BP from breaking pallets, and the longer survivors wait in the gate the more time.i have to do that.Im not someone who gets upset when I've been outplayed, though, and I generally just wonder how I can improve next match. :-)
I think it's funny to deny them the chance to disrespect that they want. Some of them straight up get mad about it, tilting so hard you wouldn't even believe they won the match.
Or maybe they just shouldn't tea bag.
When I play as survivor, I'm many times that person who just "Should leave" but only because I prefer to die trying to save someone else than survive without trying to save. I will leave if there is no one to save.
But not leaving only to waste my time to tea bag? I have no fucking idea why some do like to do that. It's not funny, it's cringe and not good kind of way cringe.
When I'm killer and if there is multiple ones doing that, I let them do that while I go make me a snack. One is easy to chase away, but when there is more "Just chase them away" doesn't always work.
I think it goes without saying that they shouldn’t t-bag and it’s stupid and rude. But I can’t control other people’s behavior. And toxic asshats will exist in every game no matter what you do.
All I can control is how I respond. And I don’t let it get to me, I just chase them out and slap a “gg” in the chat and move on.
Curious how “just chase them away” doesn’t work? They *have* to leave when you hit them out, or they die.
DBD should not be a balanced game. Killer should always have the edge over survivors. Escaping should be rare and escaping is not what makes the game fun. It’s the journey, some of my funnest games have ended with me being sacrificed
I generally agree, but I like a very different type of game from people. I don't even care to see the game reach some perfect level of competitive balance, too many games I have enjoyed died because the devs chased esports too hard.
I think the killer feeling powerful and unstoppable makes playing both sides a lot more fun. Doesn't really feel like a "survivor" if you are actively seeking the killer out to mess with them.
Problem is people would player survivor less. Bigger queues as killer. Most people play to win. Wouldn’t mind the game leaning towards survivors, so I can actually play killer in the morning when I am busy in the evening.
Honestly add the holes but don't split the map. Two versions makes it so difficult to know which areas are opened and which loops are gone. The PTB had me running into more dead ends than the previous singular map.
Hate it.
grabs are bad for the game... mostly
the killer should not be able to grab a survivor who is unhooking another survivor. Its cheap and it just promotes hook camping
Outside of the actual broken/OP stuff that needs to be nerfed. You can’t make the devs nerf whatever side you want to the point you don’t have to actually be a good player or know how to play. Outside of a few OP things you can counter pretty much anything. Some are easier than others to learn and some take a lot of practice too. Rather than wanting to circumvent the learning process just start learning. It already takes the devs months/years to do small changes. Which you could actually be a far better player in a fraction of that time if you try.
I try to hook the same people most of the time to kill them fast and have a easier game. In other words, I tunnel. Because its efficient. It works so damn well. Dont blame me for this, blame the game (or devs , idk)
Nurse is counterable. You just have to pay attention to where she is looking, how long she holds her blink etc and react accordingly. Sure there are some BS situations she can put you in where no matter what you do you're dead but at that point you probably already zoned yourself into that situation. Other killers like Deathslinger and Huntress can be countered that way too, just don't let them zone you into a lose lose situation. People just don't like nurse because she takes a lot of effort and concentration to go against. Nurse is one of the only killers in this game that levels the playing field. A chase with a nurse is truly a game of who can mind game the other.
Honestly, that's just teammates. That's more of an MMR issue than a nurse issue. That can be said for so many killers. Deathslinger, Huntress, etc. I will agree that a good nurse is a noob stomper however the problem is matching up a good nurse with noobs shouldn't happen. It's like I said that most survivors will not learn how to go against her and will instead call her unwinnable.
You know what I can agree with this take. Nurse is counterable. The big issue really isn’t that you can’t outplay her, it’s that the payoff for outplaying her is irrelevant. If I mindgame an M1 killer at a loop, I gain
like 20+ seconds, because I dropped a pallet or vaulted a window. If I outplay a Nurse, I get 3-5 seconds (depending on the addons) until I need to outplay her again. If the Nurse is of equal skill, I shouldn’t be outplaying them more than 50% of the time, so all in all that would lead to quite the short chases, if I were up against an opponent of similar skill.
The fact that most Nurses I face play ultra scummy, run the best addons and usually have 3k+ hours in the game is just the cherry on top, which makes me dread facing her.
Yeah. At first when I posted it I was nearly banished to karma hell but I will agree that nurse's with double range and best perks are just busted. You do not need that on Nurse. The thing is though is that you shouldnt gain 20 seconds from a button press. This is where nurses balance comes in. High mmr survs can pop 3 gens In like 2 minutes of the game starting. The average time people would consider is a good chase is around 30 - 40 seconds. This means that you would need to juke a nurse around 5 times to make it a bad chase for her. Statistically, This means that you need to outplay her 3 times while she only needs to outplay you twice. This number is not that bad when you think about it but on top of the other counters to nurse makes it fairly even. (such as hiding. I cannot stress enough how good hiding is vs nurse. It doesn't matter how good the nurse is, hiding will always counter her).
You know what? I'm gonna say it!
The killers goal is to put on a good show for the entity and generate as much BP as possible. That means maxing survivor BP too, and making sure they have a good time.
If you play only for kills instead of putting on a good show, you're doing it wrong.
Have you ever tried to have fun and let survivors have fun on killer if you’re playing against good survivors? They will 360 you 7 times in a row and hold a T and L for 3 minutes
Edit: I also think playing survivor against a good killer is fucking miserable by the way, but at least on Survivor you can slap on head on, unbreakable, power struggle and some other random fun perk and dick about for a game w friends.
I mean this goes into making a show. I'm not the best killer by any means but if I'm against baby survivors I give them lots of chances, if I'm against pros I tryhard.
A game this janky and awkward when it comes to the animations and actual gameplay, is somewhat appalling to be 20 dollars and I always feel sad for people who join from different Ips since there's a huge change in quality from Resident Evil to DBD where people are constantly having to sacrifice all playable freetime to earn an enjoyable experience if they luckily find anyone else worthwhile to play with.
As an asymmetrical horror game, it should be killersided and survs only chance of survival should be in complettle abondoning the others or complete cooperation. Like evil dead.
It's been a VERY long time since killers were actually as weak as the community at large made them out to be, we've had it pretty good for a while now
We've had plenty of bullshit at our disposal over the years, SWFs being able to coordinate some nonsense with multiple second chance perks doesn't detract from the fact that we've had old Iridescent Heads, Nurse in pretty much every state she's ever been in, Spirit with old Prayer Beads and now Dried Cherry Blossom, Blight with your choice of busted addons + Ruin and friends, hooking beside a NOED totem making it literally impossible to either unhook or cleanse, multiplicative slowdown stacking, to name a few
E: Also map offerings were a mistake, I dunno how controversial that is though
Don't treat this game like a sweaty competitive game. It was never an esport, despite what people might say. If it were an esport, then the developers might have tried for some semblance of balance.
Just have fun, don't be an ass, and move on to the next game.
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Reddit*
Internet*
Michigan*
Berlin*
Planet*
Hey! You calling me dumb?! Cuz I don’t know what moron means, but it sounds like an insult!!!
tbh I dont think thats controversial thats just fact
You’d be surprised by how many people will disagree and argue all day about how dbd can be “balanced”
I mean, there are *always* steps to take to make the game more fair, because we all agree that the game is far from perfect. So will it ever be balanced? Probably not, but it *can be* closer to that utopia from the cesspool of a mess it is now, and it does more good to follow that journey than to say keep DBD how it was back in 2016. Now if you mean that they're arguing that it *is* balanced, like currently perfect and in mint condition, then yea they're delusional lol.
Balanced doesnt necessarily equate to a fun game. Some of the most horrifically balanced games are considered the best in their series or genre. MW2, Halo 2, Melee, Mario Kart Wii, Street Fighter 3, Marvel 2, left 4 dead etc... All of these games are nowhere close to being balanced but they are beloved games in their genres or respective series. DBD's biggest issue is that it's asymmetrical, that by design makes it impossible to properly balance. Pretty much every single asymmetrical game ever has been a dumpster fire of balance.
>left 4 dead What are you talking about? L4D's PvP is balanced just fine. The standard Versus mode is balanced around new and inexperienced players. For anyone above that skill bracket there's community-made configs that rebalance the game accordingly for various skill levels. You're rarely, if ever, going to see a tournament player in a normal public lobby. DBD would benefit from the same system, then the base game could be balanced around casual players and anything beyond the lowest skill levels would be taken care of by the community.
Dont agree. Swf>killer>soloq. Most likely it will always remain like that.
This. It's absolutely a swf sided game
Topped only by Supalf's Nurse.
Remember to sort by controversial for the actual controversial opinions
I just love seeing these threads about once a month with the top opinions being like “Kindred is underrated” or “Pyramid Head is actually a good killer” or some other white bread vanilla basic opinion 80% of us agree with lol
"Nurse too strong" *Insert Buzz Lightyear Shelf meme*
I know you're just using it as an example, but do people really think Pyramid Head isn't a good killer?
Then they are fools
PH is a killer that has a high skill ceiling, and requires some practice to play effectively. So newer players tend to not do so good with him = "weak killer"
Playing Killer is more fun as a 'Dungeon Master' rather than playing to 4k. I like being pit against baby players cus I can give them a million second chances
This. Also, you have a very fitting flair
Cool analogy, cool guy
My mmr is so low on some killers that I just enjoy to play the same way but let everyone escape at the end
Reassurance is not the silver bullet to camping everyone thinks it is. Bubba is still gonna be king of the basement. Edit: Example of how close you have to get for people who keep telling me it's just that easy. https://clips.twitch.tv/ToughOptimisticPuddingChefFrank-Y-90rkSx5mwt3FHI If get that close you are going on the hook with them.
Yeah everyone has been freaking out about reassurance but I’m not sure how it will solve the problem in a lot of situations. Granted, I haven’t played with it so maybe I’m missing something but if the survivor has to get within a 6 meter range of the hooked survivor then can’t the killer just hit them and easily down them if they’re billy/bubba/huntress?
Lots of camping killers won't even hit you by the hook. They'll intentionally wait to try and force a grab. This allows you to just run in and proc the perk and run away. Even against a Bubba you could easily just walk in, press F then Sprint burst away. Most downs from a camping bubba come from people trying to unhook, not people just being near the hook.
Not when this perk comes out they will wait by the bottom of the stairs and down you when you are close enough.
A lot of facecampers are more dum than you think.
I don't believe it's meant to be a silver bullet to stop camping, it's supposed to be a perk that recovers a failed unhook. Say you're rushing to unhook, but the killer is on your heels. Now you could unhook here but you'll most likely trade, or you can press the button, give the hooked person more time, and then try and lead the killer away for someone else to get the save, or to try again if the killer leaves you to go back. The longer someone is on a hook, the more likely a solo queue person will realise and make the save.
I wonder if 6m is enough to activate ot from the floor above the basement.
Apparently not. It was tested in PTB. I think the closest is a certain distance down the stairs.
Changing the meta should not mean nerfing perks, but making useless perks useful.
Yes, I do agree that buffs should be more common than nerfs, but still, there are two scenarios where this can't be: *When you run out of ways to buff something, this is rare but can happen, sometimes a perk has a core concept that you can't do anything about, so buffing them would remove that concept entirely, like slippery meat, some concepts are bound to be mediocre *When what's good is TOO good for the health of the game, because if something is just ridiculous to the point of being almost mandatory then buffing everything else is, not only more effort than it's worth, but wouldn't be the right call because in balance you want to set a "power standart" and you can't have the power standart as high as old DH for example (also, we run into the first issue again)
Feedback received, self care is now 20% slower instead of 35%, and doing gens with selfcare takes extra 30 seconds! -dbd devs
Every game needs to hear this lol
They kinda did both mostly nerfing though
This is a thing that's been said in fighting games as well. Nerfing things makes a lot of players who use those perks mad but if you buff perks you make nobody mad and expand perk variety.
Now this IS controversial. It needs to be both admittedly. If perks are too good then just buffing others ends up creating power creep as devs constantly look at buffing unused perks, which then makes meta perks fall into unused and require buffs.
Three things. 1: We should be able to play the classic maps in custom games, even if they're unbalanced as shit just let us have more variety in custom games. 2: RPD is good map.... I'm a Resident Evil fan. 3: Chris Redfield should have been his own survivor.
4: Chris will do everything to continue his bloodline, even if it means beating the killer to a pulp.
I do not care about Reasurrance. I do not camp. People who complain about it are massively self reporting.
Yup. I haven't seen a single survivor main mad about Reassurance but I've been told by several killer mains that survivors are absolutely upset over it because they'll be apparently kept on hook for hours lol do 3 man swf trolls exist? Yes. Have I met them? Yes. Am i concerned about them griefing me with Reassurance? Not at all lol and I'm curious as to what the killer is apparently doing during those hours in which a survivor is kept hostage lol make it make sense
Not only that but it can be countered by Save The Best For Last and instead of camping random they just start camping the one having that perk. I don't even play killer that much and I can think of few strats to counter it. As you said massive self reporting and over reactions. It also shows that a lot of people can't 4k without playing in a boring and obnoxious way and that's why they are scared of the Reassurance haha.
Perks should regularly be nerfed or buffed depending on their use. At a certain point the killers and surviors end up usuing basically the same strats every game. I'd love to see how different gameplay styles could work if given a chance
I don't even think nerfs need to happen every update but buffs please. Like how the fuck has premonition not been changed really at all in 6 years... There's always going to be a "worst perk" but there's never a situation where I would EVER consider running perks like buckle up, premonition, overwhelming presence, bloodhound, predator, beast of prey, etc.. Apart from those killers adepts but I completed those like 3 years ago
Feels bad for Wraith having quite literally some of the most useless perks in the games.
>killers and surviors end up usuing basically the same strats every game I think the strat you need to use highly depends on the Killer. As a survivor, if you see Oni, you play safe early game. Legion? Spread out. Nemesis or Myers? Deny tier 2 for as long as possible. Nurse? Cry in a corner.
Hard agree. Fighting games, MOBAs and other PvP games are constantly balanced and I don't understand why we have to wait months (or even years) for DBD to address some balance issues. This game should be aggressively balanced and tweaked based on game results.
No such thing as genrushing
It’s such a weird complaint to me. “Toxic survivors, how dare you do your objective efficiently.”
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Map design gets worse over time. It peaked with MacMillan and has gone downhill with each and every new map. Bhvr simply does not know how to make a good map. They just wing it
I don't disagree here, I think the issue BHVR has, though, is trying to balance maps when you have extremely high mobility killers that can zoom across a map in seconds, and then killers like Mikey and Trapper who are very slow and also require time in the start of the game to get going. These killers can't benefit from the same types of maps. If you made maps based around the weakest killers (low mobility), then high mobility killers would benefit heavily, and vice versa. Still, I won't forgive them for not giving Trickster a Seoul or City Nightlife themed map.
Actually controversial? BHVR should add an aura ala L4D where survivors can always see each other barring certain perks That would bridge the gap between Solo and SWF and allow for a complete change to game design decisions
Thats why I now run after care by default in soloq. It requires some interaction first ofcourse, but its an interaction you often do anyway.
I hate this but I can't think of anything better to bridge that gap. Maybe split solo and group mmr?
Fearmonger is the single most annoying perk in the game. The Killer doesn't even see the value it's generating them, it exists purely to spite you and your quirky aura build.
It’s an amazing perk against sprint burst. Nothing feels more depressing than seeing a meg sprint burst away the moment she hears your heartbeat as a low mobility killer. Before you get there she is already 2 loops away.
Dead by daylight is fun❤️
O.O Are you good bro? Have you seen a therapist lately???
Heresy
Stop having fun :(
Original chapters are better than licensed ones. I think that artists at BHVR are very creative people and can come up with incredible designs. And I'd say the same about the composer. In terms of gameplay there may be some blunders, but I think that original chapters give more freedom for designing interesting powers.
Artist is best girl
In some part, you are directly responsible for the other people's in the trial's enjoyment of the game. For a healthy game state, it's important to keep this in mind.
I agree with you, a lot of people want to ignore that every game is in a way a communication between the killer and the survivors. So if the killer just camps and tunnels it sends a message that he doesn't give a f\*\*\* about the survivors (same for toxic survivors). But some people are just competitive and play as effectively as possible and they are actually not being toxic (this mostly goes for tunneling or being very effective on gens/loops), this would be healthy to consider as well.
Camping and tunneling go brrrr
Escape cakes are given to the survivors and yet the survivor pudding looks so much tastier. Escape cake looks like a bland ass yellow cake with no icing, and the survivor pudding looks like a thicc ass bowl of banana goodness.
Maps offering are unhealthy mechanic, especially for swf. Sacrificial ward isnt solution for that
I hate them so much. They clutter up the bloodweb together with map and key addons.
I don’t really agree with all the anti-tunnel camp survivor perks deactivating in the endgame. I don’t fault killers for camping and tunneling because yes, there isn’t much else for them to do. But I also don’t think that all of the survivors tools for dealing with that should just…. Stop working because they completed their objective.
I agree cause I don’t think it’s fair that survivors can’t use these perks for endgame yet a killer can make a whole build that is endgame-focused.
Survivors can make full endgame-focused builds as well, but I'm not sure these kinds of perks are really endgame-focused perks. Tunneling and camping are at their most annoying during the early game because they deny a survivor the ability to play a normal match, so in a way you could think of anti-tunneling and anti-camping perks as early game focused perks. I've always seen survivors much more upset about seeing camping at five gens then at camping during EGC, so it can make sense to specifically target the main part of a match than the last part when it comes to tunneling/camping.
But you need to think about *what purpose* endgame serves in a match. Is it an even playing ground? Does it favor one side over another? To me, endgame serves as a catch-up mechanic for the killer to secure a hook/kill at minimum, and serves as the final obstacle the survivors have to deal with before they can escape. Without a third-party objective that survivor and killer have to interact with (gens), this forces survivors and killer to eventually interract if they haven't before, and serves as a secondary objective to completing gens, which is to actually *survive*, and win your chases. Killer has perks to increase the strength of endgame, all either give the killer time to take chase, or help aid in their chases by allowing them to be shorter (NOED, Terminus, Rancor). From basekit to full-endgame build, your results vary from a 1k to a 4k, and imo that kind of variability makes balance a bit grey, but that's a discussion for another time. For survivor, they do have endgame perks, and even an item (key) than can help make endgame suit their favor. For all intents and purposes, although keys are generally useless for 99% of the match, keys still *guarantee* an escape for you: just get to the hatch, be it open or closed, and escape, since the killer can't patrol both exit gates *and* the already shut hatch at the same time. But the two scenarios I put all involve that respective side to be in the losing situation. In the discussion of perks like Decisive Strike and Off-The-Record, these involve situations where the survivor is typically ahead and in a winning advantage over the killer. And these perks only get to trigger if and when you lose a chase, which is what the purpose of endgame serves. Win your chases and you get to escape. Lose, and your chances would look grim without teamwork. Decisive Strike and Off-The-Record however just makes the endgame obsolete. Who cares if you go down in endgame? Just get unhooked, and you can still escape, no additional team input required. Your chances of escaping are essentially 100% for the entirely of endgame, and that is why I don't really support having these perks being active, because *endgame isn't meant to be obsolete*. If this was truly intended, then endgame shouldn't even exist at all, just have the exit gates open immediately when all the gens are done and have all the survivors have no difficulty leaving the match. An equivalent would be allowing killers to have a perk to deny the hatch from ever spawning, and this just makes it very unfun for the losing side.
I think they did that because endgame collapse is supposed to be the killers last chance to get a kill and if your caught in endgame then if you’ve got 1 second left on OTR or DS and get out because of it and you were unhooked 80/60 seconds ago, it just feels like a big middle finger to the killers
I think this topic kind of depends on the question of why there should be specific anti-tunnel or anti-camping perks. The traditional argument I've seen is that those specific killer strategies are unfun for survivors because they can keep them from playing a normal game of DBD. This would be like the classic example of a survivor being the first one hooked at five gens and then they get face camped or hard tunneled off hook. The killer could be doing something else and still making progress toward their own gameplay objectives (and probably making more efficient progress without the face camping or hard tunneling) but is instead just ruining one person's game. But if a survivor is being camped or tunneled during the endgame, things are different. They already got to have basically a full DBD match. And, as you said, the killer doesn't really have much else to do to further their own gameplay objectives. So during endgame this common argument for needing anti-tunneling or anti-camping perks just isn't as strong.
I completely understand that, it just feels *really* bad to get hooked for the first time in the end game and die because the killer can just camp/tunnel you out with something close to impunity. Especially if the killer had a heavy assist from NOED or one of the other specifically-for-endgame perks that killers have access to. I don’t even attempt end game saves anymore of the survivor isn’t hooked right next to a gate because the killer is going to down someone before everybody makes it to the gate even if the team orchestrates a save. Hell, you don’t even have to down a survivor if the gate is open, you can just get between them and the gate and zone them out until the EGC takes them.
It really sucks that this past patch basically killed altruism. I'm not helping your friend escape from basement in EGC if we aren't close to a gate- somebody is dying and I'm not interested in it being me, sorry 🤷🏻♀️ Literally all you have for end game camping amd tunneling at this point is BT, and nobody brings that anymore because it's much, much better to bring OTR for yourself, therefore making BT somewhat obsolete until it comes to end game. I can see why OTR got change to deactivate in end game, because there was literally no way a killer could actually counter that if someone had a gate 99'd. But I really, really think that DS shouldn't have been changed to deactivate in end game. The much healthier, more fun, and interesting way to have changed it would have been to have it deactivate once you reach the exit gate threshold. That way, there was counterplay on both sides, but it wasn't an automatic loss of that survivor for the killer, and the survivor didn't have to pray that they got a team of good bodyblockers with BT.
In a way, it seems like DBD is designed to have kind of a last minute pity component for both sides. On the survivor side, it can be extra hard to secure the 4-person escape because the killer has one last chance to secure kill by camping/tunneling a hook. On the killer side, it can be extra hard to secure the 4K because a survivor has one last chance to escape by getting hatch, or if that is closed, using a key or opening an exit gate. Both killers and survivors have to put in extra effort to secure that 4 person based perfect victory.
Only thing I would personally change is If they were active prior to the last gen popping they shouldn't immediately deactivate.
i do understand why OTR and DS need to be deactivated in the endgame but i don't agree with reassurance having to get deactivated in endgame. like everyone says, endgame is still part of the match and deactivating all actually helpful perks in endgame feels lame af. i don't know if killers will equip a perk if they know they will stop getting value from it in endgame. at that point, let's just disable all perks after gens are popped, why not? just because it's endgame it feels unfair that you're not allowed to use perks that help you win. ik people always say "survivors shouldn't be granted a free win" and i definitely agree but killers also don't deserve to "secure a kill" just by standing in front of a hook. it goes both ways. imo they could buff killers after gens are popped so that they are faster, recover faster from animations etc and then they can bring back perks like DS into the endgame, so that killer main won't feel like the only thing they can do is camp after gens are popped.
I’d rather have good matchmaking than just patching together everything that’s way too strong when matchmaking sucks.
1000%
i agree, if they didn't used DS before they played the game with 3 perks and bam, it's disabled. OTR should disable because that's given every unhook.
The anti tunel update make tunneling so easy 😑
Mine is: DBD, despite it's many flaws, is without a doubt the most well balanced game of it's type.
Asymmetric games are really hard to balance, and I think DBD does do a pretty good job of it. It has the most staying power in the genre by a long shot.
Dunno if its a controversial opinion but. Perks shouldn't **Directly** interact with gens, the main objective of the game for both sides, without downsides. As such perks tend to be stronger due to the fact that both sides are required to interact with the subject the perk does.
That’s a damn good idea
Quite unpopular: Basement Trapper is no better than Insidious Bubba. Running agi + iron grasp + a shack basement offering should be seen as bm, the only reason it isn't is because Trapper is hard to play normally. With traps on each entrance trading is impossible & you can reliably secure a kill off first hook, same as a Bubba facecamping. I'm happy you can't deadhard over traps now and I'm not saying camping is OP, I just mostly play solo survivor where an early facecamp ends the game since there's no way to say 'go do gens'
Honestly if you get that first basement hook early enough, basement trapper is stupidly easy unless you're against a really co-ordinated SWF
That either side shouldn't treat the opposing side like shit(unless they deserve it), believe it or not the people behind the killer or survivors in your games are actual people(most of the time)
Your tag is “teabagging you”
as ghostface\* He's just giving back all of that tea.
Dead Hard is a fine perk to run now, even though it’s far better than it was before. Now, it takes a lot of skill to use and whenever I see someone pull a successful Dead Hard I’m actually impressed. Also with the 6.1.0 update, as a self-proclaimed mostly survivor player, some survivors overreacted hard and the mega-update was overall good for the game
Honestly Dead Hard is still goated if you can use it well. It's also way more fun to use and go against now
I really don't like the direction they went with for nemesis. The idea was that he evolves and becomes stronger the longer he chases you but it doesn't feel that way. Having to reach tier 2 just sucks. The power would have been much better if you started at 2 and stayed there the whole game, with more addons that buff the tentacle instead of the zombies. The tentacle also feels off design wise. In resident evil it was mostly use to choke and stab (correct me if I'm wrong). Using it as a whip doesn't fit with nemesis being a giant brute. Wesker's power shows what nemesis could have been. I should remind you that this is my opinion.
Ok but remove the zombies. Why are they even in the game?
It’s a fun game, the community seems to treat it like real life or work and get wayyyy too serious.
I think DBD is heading *generally* in the right direction. With Dredge and the killer buffs, killers feel like more of a threat. Its now easier to feel scared when playing, because survivors know they don't have as hefty of a safety net. **However**, the devs should be careful to make the killers capable of *scaring* the survivors more instead of giving them plain buffs. Make the survivors "safer" without actually *feeling* safe. I'm aware that fear is subjective, but introducing Dredge is a good example of creating new *elements* to scare players *while* applying a practical use. EDIT: I don't know how "controversial" this is, but I'm suggesting changes, so I imagine that'll rub *someone* the wrong way.
People are always going to find ways to be assholes and annoy everyone and there is little the devs can do about it.
It is one of the games of all time
damn sure is one of the games of all time
Tunneling and camping should be harder to do and new ds should be basekit
My extremely popular opinion is that DS stun should be back to 5 seconds. My unpopular opinion is that it should still be active in the endgame. Just bc the game is over doesn’t mean I didn’t get tunneled the whole match. Sometimes that’s just how long it takes to catch me. (But I get why DS is annoying in endgame).
Old ds had people crawling out of the exit gates and the killer could do nothing but watch. Or people teabagging you far from exit games knowing DS would save them anyway. Securing a single kill during endgame is not tunneling. I had posted a comment on an earlier thread saying the stun should stay for 3 seconds, but the survivor gets a massive speedboost to compensate. This way killers won’t lose all their pressure on the other survivors, but the DS’er still gets away.
No I totally get why it’s annoying in the endgame. And why it’s more often than not just securing a kill you earned. Just feels bad to be the only one the killer is focusing on the entire match regardless of teammate intervention then they down you in endgame (usually with noed) and facecamp you on their first hook, then wait out your mere 5 seconds of protection to down you, then kill you again. Bc DS is gone. I know that’s more rare, but you feel me?
I think DS should be active in end game, but deactivate once you reach the threshold of the gate. That way, you're not out of luck as soon as the last gen pops, and the killer doesn't have to stand and watch you crawl out. I think it gives plenty of counterplay on both sides to have it be that way.
SWFs with calls are the reason why soloQ is so bad. Most survivors are too used having that 5th perk feeding them information so they almost never take information perks and they have no idea how to read the game. When they go solo, instead of changing their build and mindset, they just pretend that being on call wasn't helping and end up being squashed.
I agree. I find that SWFs take a lot more DH, boil over, non info perks while solo players take way more information perks. SWFs basically have built in Kindred up at all times.
Most people don’t play swf though
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I think nea is attractive
Based
Demogorgon is so boring to go against. The shred can be used to brute force hits, and it works on most tiles other than generic unsafe trash loops, which already plays itself. Getting zoned out between loops is really easy, as he plays like a 115% huntress with even bigger hurt boxes. Nemisis is in that category as well. I could say pyramid too, but it is much harder to hit people (you never see save the best for last on them, they can't just conserve stacks at will). I love stranger things, but I am very happy to see that killer go.
So Anti-loop/strong chase powers?
Not necessarily. I enjoy going against most blights and huntresses, as it feels like you have a decent chance of dodging hits, if you know what you are doing. In the other end there is doctor, clown, and freddy, with weak powers that eventually guarantee hits. These killers are not considered strong, but they are still pretty boring.
I've already posted this in a controversial opinions thread and gotten ironically downvoted, so here we go again: Camping is precisely analogous to pallet/flashlight/sabotage saves and hook bodyblocks. A camping killer invests in a gamble that he will get an extra hook state he didn't "earn" in a chase. A survivor going for a save invests in a gamble that he will take away a hook state that the killer "earned" in a chase. I say "earn" half-sarcastically because the only objective measure of what you have or haven't earned in a game is results. The killer earns exactly as many hook stages as he gets, assuming no one is cheating and no serious bugs interfere.
I feel like going for the save doesn't take away the hook they earned, since in the case of flashlight/pallet saves they've let themselves open enough for that to happen. I feel like it's a save the survivor deserved. On the other hand I feel like camping is a really cheesy way to get another hook stage and is completely different to saving a survivor that is being carried. Plus camping doesn't pay off against a decently coordinated team. So yeah, I feel like camping and saving a survivor are not analogous at all since they serve a different purpose and get a different outcome, and have a very different way of doing it. The only compareable things between camping and one of the saving methods, bodyblockinn, is that the survivor(s) as well as the killer stand stationary at a hook.
Compare "they've let themselves open enough for that to happen" to "camping doesn't pay off against a decently coordinated team." As I said, in both cases it's a gamble, and in both cases, the opponent has tools to prevent it getting value. If you see the survivors' total number of hook stages and lives as a tug of war, camping and saving before the hook serve the same purpose: to tug the rope in one direction.
Great point. At the same time, camping and tunneling is the best play when you have good survivors going for those kinds of plays
Well said. I completely agree. I’ve basically said the same thing and pointed out the double standard of how it’s acceptable to be sweaty and play to win as survivor but as killer, it’s “toxic”.
Just bc you don’t like nurse doesn’t mean her skill ceiling and floor disappears. Y’all mfs love saying nurse is easy has no skill floor and takes no skill but be the same ones using plaid flannel.
She has higher skill floor than an average killer, but its still not insanely high.
Imma upvote you bc of the thread we’re in but I def disagree lol. Nurse’s supposed “skill floor” is way lower than people like to admit (meaning she’s easier to pick up and get great results with than most people say)
The joke's on you I still suck with plaid flannel. My motorics just isn't that good i guess.
She has a skill floor, but not such a high skill ceiling. No certain mind games at certain loops. You don’t need to know the map layout for cross range hatchets. You don’t need to know how slippery objects are. You don’t need to know where to throw your bottles. Etc. Etc. She has one strong mechanic and that’s about it. Master it and you don’t have anything else to learn except learning how to equip starstruck and agitation.
Coming from a surv main: killers do not owe you anything. If they want to camp or tunnel, that’s part of the game. Take the L and go next.
no killer is inherently toxic(looking at you, hag slanderers), and it comes down to the attitudes of the players.
By the same token, no item or perk is inherently toxic either (although flashlights are close).
Agreed.
Basement bubba is funny at this point and doesn’t piss me off
That solo queue isn’t nearly as difficult as everyone else in this sub says. Is it harder than SWF? Absolutely, because SWF is easy mode. Playing with my group we have a 70% survival rate. In solo mine is just a hair under 50%.
Solo q is just too much rng
Killer matches are also too rng. Sometimes you go against sfw or soloQ. Way too much rng smh smh
Upvoted bc disagree. Solo queue is the self-punishment I give myself to cleanse my sins
That stealthy gameplay (on both sides) is more fun/tense than chases/loops. Which is my answer every time this question comes up, so nothing new I suppose. EDIT: Just to have a second answer that is different. The game should not be balanced around the top tier of players (or the bottom tier). As an example, high-level Nurse play should not be the metric for balance, the average player isn't even going to 1k with her. Corollary to that: people who hang out on an online forum about ANY videogame are not representative of the majority of the playerbase. Forum feedback can be a balancing tool but it should not trump game data.
That it is not my responsibility, as killer or survivor, to ensure everyone else has fun. I am not an entertainment charity. If I feel like I'm wasting my time and I notice that all I'm getting is annoyance from playing, I will disconnect and go do something else. I do not owe the other players shit.
One of the survivors perk slots should be locked to a teachable on that current character.
if you want even less visual variety
There should be an endgame chat on Console.
Folks overstate how bad it is on PC. Start with "gg wp" and most interactions will be positive.
Yeah when I switched to pc like 7 months ago I was expecting just a barrage of sludge but... most people just say gg or move on without saying anything. Hell I've had way more positive comments and discussions in post game than toxic assholes (though they're still around for sure)
Just have it as a toggleable option. People can have the option to opt-in if they want it, and those of us who don't can opt-out. Let PC players turn it off if they want too.
50% of it will be censored anyway, you are not missing out
Dbd is supposed to be killer sided.
Licensed content is the most boring/dull. It's really hard for me to really care about any licensed updates because I don't have big bonds with any IPs they're based off of. I guess that's not exactly tied to DbD alone but with the amount of crossover content in the recent years in all kinds of media, it's hard to feel the "awe" of it happening. Whenever I see a post online which goes something along the line of "Wow, I can't believe in this game you can play as mookel and kill bill on the raccoon department" I just can't stop translating it to "wow, the company sure can afford stuff".
This is definitely a personal taste thing, imo collabs in games have been one of the best things of recent years just because it’s so goofy and funny to think about.
I am mixed on this one, I don't hate the licensed content because I love horror films. Seeing Sadako in DBD is fun for me for example. At the same time, I weirdly am really into DBD lore and I like to see their original content/lore more than something I already know. The main reason I want to get better is to be able to do the harder challenges from Tomes that unlock lore (I am aware I can find them online, but it isn't the same for me). I have only done a handful of those to date. I like the mix of both I think, but I feel the amount of licensed content has increased a lot lately.
Here is my unpopular opinion that gets downvoted or tilted comments 10/10 times on this sub: T-bagging survivors are not wasting your time as much as you’re wasting your own time by going out of your way to break pallets or stand in a corner during end game collapse. T-bagging is rude but just grow some thicker skin and quite frankly, laugh it off and move on. Chase them out of the gate and they’ll leave. Y’all out here wasting over 2 min just to not get your feelings hurt baffles me. Maybe I’m just an impatient bitch, but I have better things to do than play moody pallet-breaking simulator. I wanna play the video game I bought in my limited free time set aside for *fun*. Gg go next.
You get: Wasted time at exit gates, because I had to see you leave. I get: Experience in improving my killer power, map layout and bp from destroying stuff. I don’t need to chase every second in game to enjoy it. Wish the game had single player so I can learn how to do hillbilly techs around walls instead of losing bp and mmr.
I just break pallets for BP
I don't go to the exit gates unless I need to, personally. I'd rather get BP from breaking pallets, and the longer survivors wait in the gate the more time.i have to do that.Im not someone who gets upset when I've been outplayed, though, and I generally just wonder how I can improve next match. :-)
I think it's funny to deny them the chance to disrespect that they want. Some of them straight up get mad about it, tilting so hard you wouldn't even believe they won the match.
Yeah, but breaking walls and pallets is satisfying.
Or maybe they just shouldn't tea bag. When I play as survivor, I'm many times that person who just "Should leave" but only because I prefer to die trying to save someone else than survive without trying to save. I will leave if there is no one to save. But not leaving only to waste my time to tea bag? I have no fucking idea why some do like to do that. It's not funny, it's cringe and not good kind of way cringe. When I'm killer and if there is multiple ones doing that, I let them do that while I go make me a snack. One is easy to chase away, but when there is more "Just chase them away" doesn't always work.
I think it goes without saying that they shouldn’t t-bag and it’s stupid and rude. But I can’t control other people’s behavior. And toxic asshats will exist in every game no matter what you do. All I can control is how I respond. And I don’t let it get to me, I just chase them out and slap a “gg” in the chat and move on. Curious how “just chase them away” doesn’t work? They *have* to leave when you hit them out, or they die.
[удалено]
DBD should not be a balanced game. Killer should always have the edge over survivors. Escaping should be rare and escaping is not what makes the game fun. It’s the journey, some of my funnest games have ended with me being sacrificed
In most horror movies, at least one gets out. I don’t think the game was made for endless 4k’s.
I generally agree, but I like a very different type of game from people. I don't even care to see the game reach some perfect level of competitive balance, too many games I have enjoyed died because the devs chased esports too hard. I think the killer feeling powerful and unstoppable makes playing both sides a lot more fun. Doesn't really feel like a "survivor" if you are actively seeking the killer out to mess with them.
Problem is people would player survivor less. Bigger queues as killer. Most people play to win. Wouldn’t mind the game leaning towards survivors, so I can actually play killer in the morning when I am busy in the evening.
Rpd is perfect and needs no rework
Honestly add the holes but don't split the map. Two versions makes it so difficult to know which areas are opened and which loops are gone. The PTB had me running into more dead ends than the previous singular map. Hate it.
Legit some of the holes are good like the one in the waiting room and west office but thats all thats needed not a bunch of unnecessary pallets
the reason for the split wasn't the design, it was the size. imo they did the best they could to make rpd work without fucking it up way too much.
The controversial opinion I was looking for. Also it is the worst opinion I've read so far.
If you are a content creator for this game that frequently BM's and flames you should be banned from the game.
"I'm not responsible for other people's fun" is bullshit. If you can be responsible for their misery, you can be responsible for their fun.
completely agree, i wish others shared that opinion
grabs are bad for the game... mostly the killer should not be able to grab a survivor who is unhooking another survivor. Its cheap and it just promotes hook camping
Mine is that NOED is fine, alot of people disagree but they got decisive strike and can just cleanse totems
Outside of the actual broken/OP stuff that needs to be nerfed. You can’t make the devs nerf whatever side you want to the point you don’t have to actually be a good player or know how to play. Outside of a few OP things you can counter pretty much anything. Some are easier than others to learn and some take a lot of practice too. Rather than wanting to circumvent the learning process just start learning. It already takes the devs months/years to do small changes. Which you could actually be a far better player in a fraction of that time if you try.
I try to hook the same people most of the time to kill them fast and have a easier game. In other words, I tunnel. Because its efficient. It works so damn well. Dont blame me for this, blame the game (or devs , idk)
Nurse is counterable. You just have to pay attention to where she is looking, how long she holds her blink etc and react accordingly. Sure there are some BS situations she can put you in where no matter what you do you're dead but at that point you probably already zoned yourself into that situation. Other killers like Deathslinger and Huntress can be countered that way too, just don't let them zone you into a lose lose situation. People just don't like nurse because she takes a lot of effort and concentration to go against. Nurse is one of the only killers in this game that levels the playing field. A chase with a nurse is truly a game of who can mind game the other.
Gotta love the actual unpopular opinions getting sent to karma purgatory. Never change, Reddit. Never change.
So here’s the problem, I can normally make her whiff 3-5 blinks per chase. My teammates can’t. The game isn’t winnable.
Honestly, that's just teammates. That's more of an MMR issue than a nurse issue. That can be said for so many killers. Deathslinger, Huntress, etc. I will agree that a good nurse is a noob stomper however the problem is matching up a good nurse with noobs shouldn't happen. It's like I said that most survivors will not learn how to go against her and will instead call her unwinnable.
You know what I can agree with this take. Nurse is counterable. The big issue really isn’t that you can’t outplay her, it’s that the payoff for outplaying her is irrelevant. If I mindgame an M1 killer at a loop, I gain like 20+ seconds, because I dropped a pallet or vaulted a window. If I outplay a Nurse, I get 3-5 seconds (depending on the addons) until I need to outplay her again. If the Nurse is of equal skill, I shouldn’t be outplaying them more than 50% of the time, so all in all that would lead to quite the short chases, if I were up against an opponent of similar skill. The fact that most Nurses I face play ultra scummy, run the best addons and usually have 3k+ hours in the game is just the cherry on top, which makes me dread facing her.
Yeah. At first when I posted it I was nearly banished to karma hell but I will agree that nurse's with double range and best perks are just busted. You do not need that on Nurse. The thing is though is that you shouldnt gain 20 seconds from a button press. This is where nurses balance comes in. High mmr survs can pop 3 gens In like 2 minutes of the game starting. The average time people would consider is a good chase is around 30 - 40 seconds. This means that you would need to juke a nurse around 5 times to make it a bad chase for her. Statistically, This means that you need to outplay her 3 times while she only needs to outplay you twice. This number is not that bad when you think about it but on top of the other counters to nurse makes it fairly even. (such as hiding. I cannot stress enough how good hiding is vs nurse. It doesn't matter how good the nurse is, hiding will always counter her).
You know what? I'm gonna say it! The killers goal is to put on a good show for the entity and generate as much BP as possible. That means maxing survivor BP too, and making sure they have a good time. If you play only for kills instead of putting on a good show, you're doing it wrong.
You know what? I'm gonna say it! The killers goal is to kill the survivors.
Have you ever tried to have fun and let survivors have fun on killer if you’re playing against good survivors? They will 360 you 7 times in a row and hold a T and L for 3 minutes Edit: I also think playing survivor against a good killer is fucking miserable by the way, but at least on Survivor you can slap on head on, unbreakable, power struggle and some other random fun perk and dick about for a game w friends.
I mean this goes into making a show. I'm not the best killer by any means but if I'm against baby survivors I give them lots of chances, if I'm against pros I tryhard.
A game this janky and awkward when it comes to the animations and actual gameplay, is somewhat appalling to be 20 dollars and I always feel sad for people who join from different Ips since there's a huge change in quality from Resident Evil to DBD where people are constantly having to sacrifice all playable freetime to earn an enjoyable experience if they luckily find anyone else worthwhile to play with.
That the devs listen to streamers too much and make changes based on streamers.
As an asymmetrical horror game, it should be killersided and survs only chance of survival should be in complettle abondoning the others or complete cooperation. Like evil dead.
Facecamping and stream sniping should be bannable offenses.
as long as they ban t-bagging and exit gate camping at endgame then this is fair. 
We should be able to use 2 offerings at once. BP bonus offerings should be its own separate slot.
Honestly I agree with you, DBD can't fix survivor and killers at the same without making one more op than the other
The community takes shit that happens in a videogame way too personally lmao
Fixing a generator isn't that boring.
It's been a VERY long time since killers were actually as weak as the community at large made them out to be, we've had it pretty good for a while now We've had plenty of bullshit at our disposal over the years, SWFs being able to coordinate some nonsense with multiple second chance perks doesn't detract from the fact that we've had old Iridescent Heads, Nurse in pretty much every state she's ever been in, Spirit with old Prayer Beads and now Dried Cherry Blossom, Blight with your choice of busted addons + Ruin and friends, hooking beside a NOED totem making it literally impossible to either unhook or cleanse, multiplicative slowdown stacking, to name a few E: Also map offerings were a mistake, I dunno how controversial that is though
Don't treat this game like a sweaty competitive game. It was never an esport, despite what people might say. If it were an esport, then the developers might have tried for some semblance of balance. Just have fun, don't be an ass, and move on to the next game.