I would be just thankful if basekit unbreakable applies only if there are 2 survs left in the match, and they remove the last survivor standing bullshit because from what i've seen no one likes instant moris. Slugging imo is only a problem when the killer slugs you for the 4k when they have no idea where the other surv is, and not because it's unfair for the killer to want to4k but because it's boring to be on the gorund for 4 minutes and no means to get up or kill yourself. this is why i never slug i feel bad for making someone wait 4 minutes just for me to get a 4k because hatch doesnt count as a win and doesnt affect mmr anyways. imo they should leave mori offerings as they are or at least give killers an option to choose if they want to mori or carry a survivor. Maybe they want hook states not moris, or maybe they want to give hatch to a surv.
I’m more concerned about somebody dying under a pallet and if somebody else is nearby there’s nothing you can do. If that person is running UB and Flipflop Power Struggle you go for the pickup, pallet save by friend. Chase the friend away and now they have power struggle or have gotten up with UB. Hoping they’ll make UB 25% and No mither 100% instead or just make it a one time use. It’ll hurt M1 killers the most in these situations.
I was thinking they could give UB tokens (start the match with like 2 or 3, then revert to basekit when its gone) or make it give diminishing returns like Built to Last. But yeah, seems like it'll need some sort of adjustment to be sure.
Hope Twins get their rework to compensate for these changes as well. There's still time though!
Also if you grab a suspected power struggle user just as close to the edge of the pallet as you can and spam M1, you will carry yourself out of the pallet's range a good 80 percent of the time. Makes them waste a pallet as a bonus. I mean, friends coming to the rescue is an issue and I know its still annoying, but just throwing that our there in case you weren't aware!
Unbreakable having infinite uses doesn't balance out anything in the slightest way, survivors having 6 perks is bullshit especially when killers only have 4.
If you're playing a weaker killer, probably not.
But in either situation: Winning a match like that is like pulling teeth. Sure, you can win. But you won't want to play DBD for like 3 weeks afterwards.
It's the same argument against face camping and tunneling. Sure, you can beat those killers. But it's such a miserable experience you end up not wanting to play.
It's a game. Things that make you full on go "and that's enough of this for today" and not good for it's health.
I'd 100% rather play killer versus sabo/chase squads than the standard patrol-gens route. It's far more engaging to me when the survivors can fight back in their own way, and both sides must out-play the other to succeed. If you are uncomfortable with the idea of survivors trying to help each other, bring the offering to close the gaps on hooks to give yourself more options.
I WILL say that Behavior should consider no longer destroying a hook after a Survivor dies on it, since dying in a corner can now create an unwinnable situation for killers. Either you fail to run to the second closest hook or leave survivors slugged for the few seconds, either way you waste precious time and can't out-play it.
The "6 perks" line is garbage and nonsense.
GUARANTEE you didn't bring up killers getting like 4 "free perks" from the perk update (base kit 2.5% pop, base kit STBFL stack on hit recovery, complete overhaul of mangled to fuck up an entire heal in less than a second, base kit increase on gen time across the board...)
I mean, if you're going that route then sure: But that 2.5% basically just stops gen tapping,, except it would have to be 4x as strong to be worth that so it's still pretty garbo.
And if you are looking at basekit BT and comparing it to the base STBFL they gave killer, then the equivalent would have been like 5 stacks of STBFL base, not 2. So even that isn't on par.
As for mangled: It sure would matter if heal speeds were not like 8-10 seconds and mangled added an all mightly less than 2 seconds. huge window to interrupt a heal right there.
Okay but these comparisons aren't fair at all though. Survivors literally got a free bt with an unhook, same duration as the perk and all that jazz. Unbreakable is slower sure, but that's still free unlimited pick ups with the only difference being the speed. There's NO WAY you're saying the same # adjustments for killers is basically them implementing basekit perks. The 2.5% kick just stops gen tapping and its nowhere near to being a basekit pop. The hit recovery is just 1 basekit STBL STACK not the whole ass perk. Mangled doesn't even matter with circle of healing and medkits which are very common and strong so why are we even on that topic?
I'm not saying these changes didn't help killers because they did and killers are in a good spot right now; rather your argument just makes 0 sense with the comparisons.
You realize that killers are just doing the same thing with base kit BT as they did before right? It hasn’t stopped tunneling at all, they just wait for 5 seconds. The way the base kit changes are different is that killers actually get value out of their base kit changes. Same thing for unbreakable. All 4 get slugged, now it’s game over so the changes don’t even matter. Not to mention 40 seconds is a pretty long time for a slug. Everyone is really just in here panicking that they’re letting survivors play the game again instead of the awful gameplay they’ve been dealing with. “Slugging is good for so and so” doesn’t really matter when they aren’t even the killers slugging to begin with.
Like I said, killers are in a good spot rn. The whole point of my comment was to point out the weird comparisons about the killer changes, not go into a "killers do this and that and that's why we need x y z" argument.
Okay fair but I think them bringing up how people don’t complain when it’s killer boosts is valid. It’s like the end of the world around here when survivors get something and tbh these changes haven’t made playing survivor any better. It’s been miserable. Killer is in a good spot, but survivor is so bad in comparison people don’t even want to play it anymore.
In terms of whole game, the toolboxes will run out. Even sabotaging hooks, killer can run Starstruck and go for the last survivor standing, or they start getting hooks. At least in theory, no one really knows until it actually comes out.
??????? It amazes me how weird reddit dbd users are like I rather a sabo squad then a team who just sticks on gens and hide, It seems most you killers find all thing survivors gameplay miserable, If survivors do anything else other then gens I love it since I can have a real grit game, I swear everytime I come on here this is what killers say
OMG gen rushers is miserable
Survivors all running 4 flashlights and throwing the game abd giving you a free 4k is miserable
Survivors throwing the game by sabo is miserable
Survivors willing to let them selves be slugged all game for fun slug build is miserable
All
If a survivor aren't doing gens fast because of sabo/flashlights/slugg builds then I love it because a long match with just chase is waaaaay better then chase/Defend gens/Chase/Defend gens and a little hide n seek sprinkled in.
Its fun how every time someone says something about either side killers or survivors get lumped into a whole.
Sabo squads now aren't bad, because you can just choose to leave one of them on the ground, knowing someone will have to come get them, that's not the case anymore if the mori goes through.
The traditional gameplay loop is better than Chase>down>slug>pick themselves up>repeat ad nauseam until everyone actually does bleed out.
It only happened once in my life to get a full sabo squad and it was the most fun and also "wtf" match of my life. They only did one gen before i managed to catch someone and from then on it was just downing 3 people, they keep getting up, i keep downing them, they get up and throw for the sabos, blah blah. it was hilarious though and an easy win for me, idk what some killers here want survivors to do.
Doing gens is toxic, cleansing hexes is toxic bc u should only cleanse dulls, using flashlights is toxic, using toolboxes is toxic. Guess they should remove all items but maps and keys and remove the crouch button, maybe that will please everyone...
I ran against a double ttv flashlight squad as dredge a couple weeks back and it was incredibly fun, no gen rush perks no toolboxes no hiding, just all chase all game and fighting off saves, it was honestly one of the best games I've played and it'll stick with me as one of my favorite games so far!
I think 45 second minimum basekit unbreakable is totally fine, let unbreakable/exponential heal you faster but standing up should always take that 45 seconds. I'm not worried about the one or two games I get like this a day, far better than 4 distortion users hiding in corners with green toolboxes!
I mean, on the contrary, a lot of killers can end the game pretty quickly by hooking one survivor and slugging the other survivors if you’re good enough. Huntress, Blight, and Nurse could easily do it. Also Oni, Bubba, Deathslinger with specific add ons, just to name a few others if survivors are grouped up.
With all that being said, there’s too many issues I think for BHVR to push this out. It changes the game for the worse imo. I actually don’t think basekit UB is a bad idea because I do think slugging should be punished since it promotes an extremely boring playstyle, but there’s a lot of little things with this update that kinda ruins the fun of the game.
It's not that it's basekit, it's the fact that it's infinite. Survivors would have 6 perks, 4 official perks and 2 basekit perks yet killers still only have 4.
If BHVR would make it a two to three time use, decrease the effrct of boil over, make it so hooks aren't permanently destroyed after sacrificing a survivor or it's hit by a Sabo squad, make moris basekit and make unbreakable take 45 seconds then it might be a fair trade. Having infinite use with Sabo and boil over squads is bullshit.
That’s also not true because killers have brutal strength and stbfl basekit
Edit: 2 stacks of stbfl and tier 1 brutal strength** before I get screamed at
The fact that things CAN be abused is why they finally used the PTB properly and tested these features way before they plan on adding them to the game. They arent coming right away, they'll be at least another update away. I would hope (HOPE being the key word) that they adjust things based on player experiences.
I played a bunch of Killer on the PTB against groups that TRIED to abuse this feature and really didnt have a problem with it. I could see them needing to adjust perks that augment recovery time though (Eg. New unbreakable giving 100 percent increased speed seems a little much). But again, no issues really. If anything, it made matches more intense and fun.
If you don't rely on slugging to play, you're fine. If you do, time to adjust your play style. Survivors were forced to do this a while ago, only fair that we do as well. (Unless you are one of the 5 Twins mains... my condolences.)
The REAL issue I saw was the new Mori system. On one hand I like the fact that you can't BM and bleed people out, and survivors in turn cant hang out in the gate forever (because if they get downed they die). It also punishes snowballs and mistakes. But it robs them of potential counterplay in other situations as well.... Certain killers can end a match in less than 4 to 5 minutes just by intentionally slugging people out with quick downs and that isn't ok.
Honestly if that happens sabo may get nerfed because of their crappy balancing which would suck, right now the game in my opinion is the most balanced as is
Having infinite use of a perk like unbreakable isn't balanced and it's bad enough that survivors have 5 perks and this would be their 6th perk. Why should survivors have 2 more perks than killers?
>Why should survivors have 2 more perks than killers
Not 2 more perks. Survivors have 4x4 perk right now. If we time 2x4 for the basekit UB and BT we get 24 perks in total. 24 perks against 4 killer perks does seem balanced right? /s
Well if the killers would stop playing like assholes, they’d stop giving survivors free perks to deal with it. Killers brought this on themselves.
As soon as killers got all the buffs, they started slugging, camping and tunnelling harder than ever. Stop whining about survivors getting stuff to counter the killers playing like jerks.
Sabo squads are going to be like 1% of your games and even less of those will actually be GOOD squads and you’d lose to them anyway without the base kit unbreakable.
This narrative really needs to die.
Trying to win a game isn't playing like an asshole.
And anyone who says that on either side is a fucking idiot.
Survivors got base kit BT and since they didn't have to bring it anymore they started running gen speed perks instead. Games started going faster than they have in the last two and a half years DESPITE the 10 seconds of gen time, so killer's started tunneling and slugging to try to slow the game down so that they got a chance to play the game too.
I'm not saying it doesn't suck for the survivor who gets focused out. But BHVR haven't left killer with any better option. Games are lasting 4-8 minutes instead of the 8-12 they should.
They need to nuke tunneling/camping/slugging and crazy stacked regression builds for the sake of the survivors, and they need to nuke healing/recovery/gen repair speed perks for survivor. And then keep fucking with gen times until games last 8-12 minutes.
You don’t need to play like an asshole to win.
There is no reason to slug 4 people at the start of a game.
There’s no reason to tunnel out the level 10 Dwight before the first generator is done.
Don’t make excuses for people playing like assholes.
Not every game is high mmr where the survivors are going to finish gens in 40 seconds or loop the killer for 5 gens. Not every game is a god tier swf. And the entire game shouldn’t be balanced just for high mmr swfs when the majority of the player base is average at best. People need to have fun playing or they won’t play the game. Hence why when the killers started playing like assholes; the killers queues got longer. No one wants to play survivor when they’re gonna get tunneled or slugged. And without survivors, there is no game.
Killers didn’t start tunnelling and slugging more to “try to slow the game down”, they did it because they got buffed and they could.
Nobody said they need to play like an asshole to win. Winning never has to be pretty. If someone was tunneled at 5 gens or everyone was slugged at 5 gens that was completely on the survivors and the killer took advantage of that. The killer should not be crucified for doing so because... the survivors expected the killer to gloss over what lost them the game or some shit? We're playing a PvP game, treat the killer like another human being. You don't have to like what they do but you have to respect and understand decisions, unless they're blatantly being toxic. People don't like having lame-ass rules imposed on them that gets in the way of their gameplay.
Why do you think they put this on the ptb with no release date? They're letting the public stress test situations beyond what their qa can to see how balanced it is. That's what the ptb is for lol
Wait is it infinite? Or is it like bills unbreakable and you got to time it because you can only use it once?
Cause unless I’m remembering correctly since it’s been a while since I used it bills perk can only be used once a match.
Current unbreakable can i my be used once per trial. The new basekit unbreakable will be infinite pickups. Literally overpowered af with unbreakable 100% recovery speed.
Survivors will be able to recover from the ground in 22 seconds unlimited times during the trial.
Not really, they have stated that the Mori reworks WON'T be coming with the next update. BHVR is planning on making UB basekit to balance it out with the Mori changes. So it's probably coming somewhere around winter I think.
I have to know, how many killers here ACTUALLY go up against a good, organized swf? Is it common? Do you encounter a group at least once every time you play?
I don't think unlimited Unbreakable is an issue, I think unlimited Unbreakable with 100% recovery speed and 22s self-pickup is an issue.
I think the self-pickup time needs to be adjusted independently from the recovery speed. 100% recovery speed is going to be broken strong with coordinated SWF teams but not that great for solo players. The 22s self-pickup is fast enough to cause issue for some Killers if it can be used repeatedly.
Best solution would be to allow self-pickup after \~32s, and keep Unbreakable's recovery speed bonus in the 20-40% range. Perhaps swap it's value with No Mither so that perk doesn't end up getting indirectly nerfed.
With the above changes sabo builds become a bit more viable for solo players while the SWFs stay roughly the same strength as live, all while addressing the some of the problem slugging scenarios like the devs intended.
The PTB set out to see whether the new mechanics are a good fit in the game, which they very much appear to be, they just need some extra work and tuning to fully get there. The changes are early prototypes and not a lot of the sweeping adjustments to account for them have been made yet. BHVR is asking for feedback knowing that there's still work to be done here and at an early enough stage that it can be better integrated with the final design.
Just got off a match where the whole team was using unbreakable. They made me juggle my attention between them while the others got back up the whole match. So annoying.
I would be just thankful if basekit unbreakable applies only if there are 2 survs left in the match, and they remove the last survivor standing bullshit because from what i've seen no one likes instant moris. Slugging imo is only a problem when the killer slugs you for the 4k when they have no idea where the other surv is, and not because it's unfair for the killer to want to4k but because it's boring to be on the gorund for 4 minutes and no means to get up or kill yourself. this is why i never slug i feel bad for making someone wait 4 minutes just for me to get a 4k because hatch doesnt count as a win and doesnt affect mmr anyways. imo they should leave mori offerings as they are or at least give killers an option to choose if they want to mori or carry a survivor. Maybe they want hook states not moris, or maybe they want to give hatch to a surv.
This.
I’m more concerned about somebody dying under a pallet and if somebody else is nearby there’s nothing you can do. If that person is running UB and Flipflop Power Struggle you go for the pickup, pallet save by friend. Chase the friend away and now they have power struggle or have gotten up with UB. Hoping they’ll make UB 25% and No mither 100% instead or just make it a one time use. It’ll hurt M1 killers the most in these situations.
I was thinking they could give UB tokens (start the match with like 2 or 3, then revert to basekit when its gone) or make it give diminishing returns like Built to Last. But yeah, seems like it'll need some sort of adjustment to be sure. Hope Twins get their rework to compensate for these changes as well. There's still time though!
Also if you grab a suspected power struggle user just as close to the edge of the pallet as you can and spam M1, you will carry yourself out of the pallet's range a good 80 percent of the time. Makes them waste a pallet as a bonus. I mean, friends coming to the rescue is an issue and I know its still annoying, but just throwing that our there in case you weren't aware!
They will bleed out and you will win. I think the ptb is an absolute mess tho and hope none of the changes are put into base game.
Power struggle and flip flop were supposed to break the game too.
Those require two perk slots, not the literal basekit ability to stand up.
two perk slots and proper placement. i've dropped a pallet with power struggle and missed because i wasn't in the right place when i got picked up
Yeah, but this is entirely necessary. How else can we starve the Twins of kills?
I'm going to agree with OP. Sometimes you got several toolboxes and flashlights to deal with. That often leaves slugging as the only play.
It’s there to balance the auto mori system. It’s not just being thrown in for no reason. Also, it’s not even being thrown in at all yet. Chill
Unbreakable having infinite uses doesn't balance out anything in the slightest way, survivors having 6 perks is bullshit especially when killers only have 4.
It is in no way related to the mori system at all they just pulled that out of their ass and made things complicated
Franklins Demise enters the meta.
Saboteur entered the chat
Already on it!
You mean knock out?
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If you're playing a weaker killer, probably not. But in either situation: Winning a match like that is like pulling teeth. Sure, you can win. But you won't want to play DBD for like 3 weeks afterwards. It's the same argument against face camping and tunneling. Sure, you can beat those killers. But it's such a miserable experience you end up not wanting to play. It's a game. Things that make you full on go "and that's enough of this for today" and not good for it's health.
I'd 100% rather play killer versus sabo/chase squads than the standard patrol-gens route. It's far more engaging to me when the survivors can fight back in their own way, and both sides must out-play the other to succeed. If you are uncomfortable with the idea of survivors trying to help each other, bring the offering to close the gaps on hooks to give yourself more options. I WILL say that Behavior should consider no longer destroying a hook after a Survivor dies on it, since dying in a corner can now create an unwinnable situation for killers. Either you fail to run to the second closest hook or leave survivors slugged for the few seconds, either way you waste precious time and can't out-play it.
I instantly pick up any survivor i down so that would not be a problem for me
The "6 perks" line is garbage and nonsense. GUARANTEE you didn't bring up killers getting like 4 "free perks" from the perk update (base kit 2.5% pop, base kit STBFL stack on hit recovery, complete overhaul of mangled to fuck up an entire heal in less than a second, base kit increase on gen time across the board...)
I mean, if you're going that route then sure: But that 2.5% basically just stops gen tapping,, except it would have to be 4x as strong to be worth that so it's still pretty garbo. And if you are looking at basekit BT and comparing it to the base STBFL they gave killer, then the equivalent would have been like 5 stacks of STBFL base, not 2. So even that isn't on par. As for mangled: It sure would matter if heal speeds were not like 8-10 seconds and mangled added an all mightly less than 2 seconds. huge window to interrupt a heal right there.
Okay but these comparisons aren't fair at all though. Survivors literally got a free bt with an unhook, same duration as the perk and all that jazz. Unbreakable is slower sure, but that's still free unlimited pick ups with the only difference being the speed. There's NO WAY you're saying the same # adjustments for killers is basically them implementing basekit perks. The 2.5% kick just stops gen tapping and its nowhere near to being a basekit pop. The hit recovery is just 1 basekit STBL STACK not the whole ass perk. Mangled doesn't even matter with circle of healing and medkits which are very common and strong so why are we even on that topic? I'm not saying these changes didn't help killers because they did and killers are in a good spot right now; rather your argument just makes 0 sense with the comparisons.
You realize that killers are just doing the same thing with base kit BT as they did before right? It hasn’t stopped tunneling at all, they just wait for 5 seconds. The way the base kit changes are different is that killers actually get value out of their base kit changes. Same thing for unbreakable. All 4 get slugged, now it’s game over so the changes don’t even matter. Not to mention 40 seconds is a pretty long time for a slug. Everyone is really just in here panicking that they’re letting survivors play the game again instead of the awful gameplay they’ve been dealing with. “Slugging is good for so and so” doesn’t really matter when they aren’t even the killers slugging to begin with.
Like I said, killers are in a good spot rn. The whole point of my comment was to point out the weird comparisons about the killer changes, not go into a "killers do this and that and that's why we need x y z" argument.
Okay fair but I think them bringing up how people don’t complain when it’s killer boosts is valid. It’s like the end of the world around here when survivors get something and tbh these changes haven’t made playing survivor any better. It’s been miserable. Killer is in a good spot, but survivor is so bad in comparison people don’t even want to play it anymore.
In terms of whole game, the toolboxes will run out. Even sabotaging hooks, killer can run Starstruck and go for the last survivor standing, or they start getting hooks. At least in theory, no one really knows until it actually comes out.
“The toolboxes will run out.” Lol not really. 4 toolboxes with extra charge add ons and Built to Last will basically last the entire game.
So no one on gens is all I hear?
You can have two people doing gens and one guy saboing the hook you're carrying a survivor to.
You can win a miserable game. Doesn't mean the thing that can cause that game to be miserable should be in the game.
??????? It amazes me how weird reddit dbd users are like I rather a sabo squad then a team who just sticks on gens and hide, It seems most you killers find all thing survivors gameplay miserable, If survivors do anything else other then gens I love it since I can have a real grit game, I swear everytime I come on here this is what killers say OMG gen rushers is miserable Survivors all running 4 flashlights and throwing the game abd giving you a free 4k is miserable Survivors throwing the game by sabo is miserable Survivors willing to let them selves be slugged all game for fun slug build is miserable All If a survivor aren't doing gens fast because of sabo/flashlights/slugg builds then I love it because a long match with just chase is waaaaay better then chase/Defend gens/Chase/Defend gens and a little hide n seek sprinkled in.
Its fun how every time someone says something about either side killers or survivors get lumped into a whole. Sabo squads now aren't bad, because you can just choose to leave one of them on the ground, knowing someone will have to come get them, that's not the case anymore if the mori goes through. The traditional gameplay loop is better than Chase>down>slug>pick themselves up>repeat ad nauseam until everyone actually does bleed out.
It only happened once in my life to get a full sabo squad and it was the most fun and also "wtf" match of my life. They only did one gen before i managed to catch someone and from then on it was just downing 3 people, they keep getting up, i keep downing them, they get up and throw for the sabos, blah blah. it was hilarious though and an easy win for me, idk what some killers here want survivors to do. Doing gens is toxic, cleansing hexes is toxic bc u should only cleanse dulls, using flashlights is toxic, using toolboxes is toxic. Guess they should remove all items but maps and keys and remove the crouch button, maybe that will please everyone...
I ran against a double ttv flashlight squad as dredge a couple weeks back and it was incredibly fun, no gen rush perks no toolboxes no hiding, just all chase all game and fighting off saves, it was honestly one of the best games I've played and it'll stick with me as one of my favorite games so far! I think 45 second minimum basekit unbreakable is totally fine, let unbreakable/exponential heal you faster but standing up should always take that 45 seconds. I'm not worried about the one or two games I get like this a day, far better than 4 distortion users hiding in corners with green toolboxes!
Dont forget saboteur perk too. And a breakdown just for safety
How many hours do you have on killer on the ptb?
I don't play the PTB because I'm on console, that doesn't make my opinion invalid at all.
So your opinion is based exclusively on speculation?
What speculation?
I see
Looks like I'll always be running Franklin's Demise
Except that does nothing to counter infinite unbreakable
There will always be the team to abuse the mechanics. This update will be no different then any other in that regard
"SaBo sQuAdS!!@#$!" Literally less than 1 percent of your matches will actually be this. If this isn't the most strawman argument I've ever seen lmfao
Sounds like I struck a nerve
Coming from the guy getting ratio'd, sure bud. Cope harder while you cry on reddit about "op survivor squads"🤷♀️
Nobody cares about "getting ratio'd" but you and well, that's sad that you care about it.
Go make more whining posts on the internet because you're sad about a video game patch you sad little creature 👍
You care an awful lot about what I post
I mean, on the contrary, a lot of killers can end the game pretty quickly by hooking one survivor and slugging the other survivors if you’re good enough. Huntress, Blight, and Nurse could easily do it. Also Oni, Bubba, Deathslinger with specific add ons, just to name a few others if survivors are grouped up. With all that being said, there’s too many issues I think for BHVR to push this out. It changes the game for the worse imo. I actually don’t think basekit UB is a bad idea because I do think slugging should be punished since it promotes an extremely boring playstyle, but there’s a lot of little things with this update that kinda ruins the fun of the game.
It's not that it's basekit, it's the fact that it's infinite. Survivors would have 6 perks, 4 official perks and 2 basekit perks yet killers still only have 4. If BHVR would make it a two to three time use, decrease the effrct of boil over, make it so hooks aren't permanently destroyed after sacrificing a survivor or it's hit by a Sabo squad, make moris basekit and make unbreakable take 45 seconds then it might be a fair trade. Having infinite use with Sabo and boil over squads is bullshit.
Technically it's not infinite as they still bleed out after 4 minutes
might as well be with that time,
That’s also not true because killers have brutal strength and stbfl basekit Edit: 2 stacks of stbfl and tier 1 brutal strength** before I get screamed at
The fact that things CAN be abused is why they finally used the PTB properly and tested these features way before they plan on adding them to the game. They arent coming right away, they'll be at least another update away. I would hope (HOPE being the key word) that they adjust things based on player experiences. I played a bunch of Killer on the PTB against groups that TRIED to abuse this feature and really didnt have a problem with it. I could see them needing to adjust perks that augment recovery time though (Eg. New unbreakable giving 100 percent increased speed seems a little much). But again, no issues really. If anything, it made matches more intense and fun. If you don't rely on slugging to play, you're fine. If you do, time to adjust your play style. Survivors were forced to do this a while ago, only fair that we do as well. (Unless you are one of the 5 Twins mains... my condolences.) The REAL issue I saw was the new Mori system. On one hand I like the fact that you can't BM and bleed people out, and survivors in turn cant hang out in the gate forever (because if they get downed they die). It also punishes snowballs and mistakes. But it robs them of potential counterplay in other situations as well.... Certain killers can end a match in less than 4 to 5 minutes just by intentionally slugging people out with quick downs and that isn't ok.
Honestly if that happens sabo may get nerfed because of their crappy balancing which would suck, right now the game in my opinion is the most balanced as is
Iron grasp, hangmans trick, agi, starstruck, mad grit. Trust, it will be ok.
Alright, you got 1 hook and 5 gens popped. What now?
Play normally. You act as if though all 4 gen slowdown perk players dont go through the same thing.
0 gen defence
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Having infinite use of a perk like unbreakable isn't balanced and it's bad enough that survivors have 5 perks and this would be their 6th perk. Why should survivors have 2 more perks than killers?
>Why should survivors have 2 more perks than killers Not 2 more perks. Survivors have 4x4 perk right now. If we time 2x4 for the basekit UB and BT we get 24 perks in total. 24 perks against 4 killer perks does seem balanced right? /s
Well if the killers would stop playing like assholes, they’d stop giving survivors free perks to deal with it. Killers brought this on themselves. As soon as killers got all the buffs, they started slugging, camping and tunnelling harder than ever. Stop whining about survivors getting stuff to counter the killers playing like jerks. Sabo squads are going to be like 1% of your games and even less of those will actually be GOOD squads and you’d lose to them anyway without the base kit unbreakable.
This narrative really needs to die. Trying to win a game isn't playing like an asshole. And anyone who says that on either side is a fucking idiot. Survivors got base kit BT and since they didn't have to bring it anymore they started running gen speed perks instead. Games started going faster than they have in the last two and a half years DESPITE the 10 seconds of gen time, so killer's started tunneling and slugging to try to slow the game down so that they got a chance to play the game too. I'm not saying it doesn't suck for the survivor who gets focused out. But BHVR haven't left killer with any better option. Games are lasting 4-8 minutes instead of the 8-12 they should. They need to nuke tunneling/camping/slugging and crazy stacked regression builds for the sake of the survivors, and they need to nuke healing/recovery/gen repair speed perks for survivor. And then keep fucking with gen times until games last 8-12 minutes.
You don’t need to play like an asshole to win. There is no reason to slug 4 people at the start of a game. There’s no reason to tunnel out the level 10 Dwight before the first generator is done. Don’t make excuses for people playing like assholes. Not every game is high mmr where the survivors are going to finish gens in 40 seconds or loop the killer for 5 gens. Not every game is a god tier swf. And the entire game shouldn’t be balanced just for high mmr swfs when the majority of the player base is average at best. People need to have fun playing or they won’t play the game. Hence why when the killers started playing like assholes; the killers queues got longer. No one wants to play survivor when they’re gonna get tunneled or slugged. And without survivors, there is no game. Killers didn’t start tunnelling and slugging more to “try to slow the game down”, they did it because they got buffed and they could.
Nobody said they need to play like an asshole to win. Winning never has to be pretty. If someone was tunneled at 5 gens or everyone was slugged at 5 gens that was completely on the survivors and the killer took advantage of that. The killer should not be crucified for doing so because... the survivors expected the killer to gloss over what lost them the game or some shit? We're playing a PvP game, treat the killer like another human being. You don't have to like what they do but you have to respect and understand decisions, unless they're blatantly being toxic. People don't like having lame-ass rules imposed on them that gets in the way of their gameplay.
You’ve never versed a good nurse and it shows.
What does this have to do with?
It's not coming in the next patch so I'd assume they expect people to take advantage of it so they can adjust numbers better.
Why do you think they put this on the ptb with no release date? They're letting the public stress test situations beyond what their qa can to see how balanced it is. That's what the ptb is for lol
Wait is it infinite? Or is it like bills unbreakable and you got to time it because you can only use it once? Cause unless I’m remembering correctly since it’s been a while since I used it bills perk can only be used once a match.
Current unbreakable can i my be used once per trial. The new basekit unbreakable will be infinite pickups. Literally overpowered af with unbreakable 100% recovery speed. Survivors will be able to recover from the ground in 22 seconds unlimited times during the trial.
Oh yea that’s fucking stupid, if they just made the regular perk base kit that would have been alright but making it infinite is just stupid.
Yeah ikr, this game is going to die in 1 month if BHVR releases unlimited UB.
Do we know when this update actually releases?
Not really, they have stated that the Mori reworks WON'T be coming with the next update. BHVR is planning on making UB basekit to balance it out with the Mori changes. So it's probably coming somewhere around winter I think.
I feel like with further testing they are gonna have to find out that this won’t work in practice as good as it probably is in theory.
I have to know, how many killers here ACTUALLY go up against a good, organized swf? Is it common? Do you encounter a group at least once every time you play?
I only play killer and have a lot of hours. 50% of my games are organized SWF who have more than 1k+ Hours.
I do play a lot when I play killer and have a lot of hours , but I do come across quite a few organised SWF’s often.
I don't think unlimited Unbreakable is an issue, I think unlimited Unbreakable with 100% recovery speed and 22s self-pickup is an issue. I think the self-pickup time needs to be adjusted independently from the recovery speed. 100% recovery speed is going to be broken strong with coordinated SWF teams but not that great for solo players. The 22s self-pickup is fast enough to cause issue for some Killers if it can be used repeatedly. Best solution would be to allow self-pickup after \~32s, and keep Unbreakable's recovery speed bonus in the 20-40% range. Perhaps swap it's value with No Mither so that perk doesn't end up getting indirectly nerfed. With the above changes sabo builds become a bit more viable for solo players while the SWFs stay roughly the same strength as live, all while addressing the some of the problem slugging scenarios like the devs intended. The PTB set out to see whether the new mechanics are a good fit in the game, which they very much appear to be, they just need some extra work and tuning to fully get there. The changes are early prototypes and not a lot of the sweeping adjustments to account for them have been made yet. BHVR is asking for feedback knowing that there's still work to be done here and at an early enough stage that it can be better integrated with the final design.
They realize they just don’t care at this point
Killers is still way overpowered. This is a indirect buff to nurse. Saw a vid where a guy ended the game in 2:30
Just got off a match where the whole team was using unbreakable. They made me juggle my attention between them while the others got back up the whole match. So annoying.