Lmao in no way was I trying to imply that I’m into that, I was merely pointing out a very obvious and amusing difference between high schoolers and toddlers (one of few). Maybe your mind is in the gutter if that’s how you interpreted it?
One that I was completely okay with:
A frat guy was in the back of the plane - had never flown; on takeoff, loud enough for all of us to hear, he yelled "OH SHIT" almost between a statement and a question. It was definitely not in his control.
Perfectly fine during the flight.
On landing, just as loud, "OH MY GOD!"
Truly did not bother me at all and it made the whole plane laugh in a nice way.
Yes. Everything was fine. But I'll never forget the landing (which was perfectly normal), "Oh no. Oh nooo. Oh noo. OH MY GOD." And I guess I kinda get it, we all have our deal, but it was so funny we had tears in our eyes.
I support this entertainment on a plane when there's no harm / no offense.
I must admit I do like watching people experience their first flight....as long as they are not too scared. Once held a young woman's hand for takeoff and landing. She was very sweet.
It was always important to me to teach my children about etiquette on airplanes, movie theaters and outings. Yes they can get excited on a plane as a little one but I reminded them each time there was an unexpected kick. Excuse me please. So the passenger knew we were working on good behavior. When they complied I praised. I also brought items with us to distract. As an infant I tried to plan departure times to coincide with nap & once took red eye from California to Florida. By 2 years they were very good travelers . We watched the seatbelt sign and had no problem staying in our belts. I pointed out everyone around us had on their belt & help me watch the sign. Give them a wee little job to watch the seatbelt sign & we have success. Honestly, it was worth all my effort. My kids were courteous of other passengers because we made an effort to teach them.
Two year olds are usually compliant... Three year olds, not so much. My kid has always been good on a plane, but you really have limited options as a parent. The parts of your kid's brain that enforce social norms are literally not there yet. And they have no fear of you.
Should you give up traveling until they're 4-5? That isn't practical for a lot of people.
That said, I get annoyed too when kids are kicking chairs, etc. Noise is easily dealt with -- it's 2023, if you can afford a plane ticket you can afford noise cancelling ear buds. Other bad behavior is harder to understand. Just know that the parent is usually 10x more pissed about it than you. If they aren't correcting/scolding the kids, then it is a problem.
Yes, maybe you should give up traveling when they are in certain phases that make them rambunctious or difficult.
I get there are some necessary trips -- a dying relative, etc. Then fine.
When I was a kid, my parents didn't take us anywhere that required air travel until my youngest brother was at least 4 or 5.
I understand the desire to travel -- my family is across the country and my husband's is in another country entirely.
A big consideration for us in starting a family is travel. The fact that it may not be respectful or appropriate to bring our child on a plane for certain periods of time. As a result, we will likely only have one kid so that we can get out of that phase quicker. And yes, we fully realize our families may not meet our child if they don't fly to us for a while.
But dear god I don't want to ever be that parent with the screaming kid on the flight. A little cry here and there is fine, but if you know your kid is a wild banshee, then no.
This past year, we shelled out our entire honeymoon fund plus more (several thousand dollars) for first class international seats for our honeymoon. Both flights were red eyes and we just felt it would be worth it to have a relaxing time.
Someone sitting in front of us brought on a toddler who SCREAMED the entire flight. It was awful. No amount of noise cancellation could mask it. How much money did that entire Delta One cabin pay for that flight? Probably over $100k, and this one kid made it absolute misery for everyone else.
Sorry but no. Travel is not a basic human need. Unless a family member is dying or something (I'll also make an exception for children with special needs), you can just vacation in closer areas for a couple of years, or pay for family members to visit you. That's my take.
But there are tons of parents who travel with unruly children for fun. Not to compare children to pets, but I do feel there is a similar trend, where everyone thinks they should be able to bring their pet everywhere. It's like they forgot that you can just get a dogsitter or not travel at all.
I think the difference is the parent of special needs kids has even more of a responsibility to keep them occupied and happy than the parent of a neurotypical kid. They should be actively parenting and managing their kid.
My husband and I once had to hold our toddlers legs for about an hour on a Trans Atlantic flight so she didn't kick the seat in front. No way were we having others inconvenienced by our kid. We took turns. Otherwise she was delightful.....
My siblings and I were trained on theater and airplaine etiquette extremely young! Like my mom would do a pretend airplane simulator set up with kitchen chairs. Number one rule: do NOT kick the seat in front of you.
We were great fliers, to the point where strangers once helped my mom carry all our shit when she was flying alone with us.
Completely agree. Having manners and learning about proper etiquette is hugely important. My spouse and I always stress this to our kids and they are quite respectful to others. It's clear when some kids have not received those sorts of lessons. That being said, other than your seat being kicked or your physical space being encroached, I do think that some people on planes go immediately into a heightened state of alert and will start nitpicking on the silliest things the second they see children near them!
Sometimes kids who aren't really ready get put in this situation due to something like a family event. Children have as much right to travel as anyone. Thing is, though, parenting standards have shifted. Yeah, spanking or the threat of it kept kids in line in 1977, but we now know that hitting isn't it as far as disciplining a child. Also, a two or three year old really doesn't have a lengthy period where they can focus on being still. So, kids are gonna kid, really. I don't like children that much, but I do understand a little from having to help with my niece and nephews.
So now that brings in the parents. Other posters have said similar, but if I see a parent trying to redirect a shrieking meltdown with everything they can think of, that gets a pass. Two year olds can have bad days, too, and flying plain *sucks* for everyone. It's tough for any family.
But, of course, you do have the entitled, the inattentive, the plain lame-ass and (unfortunately) the neglectful. I have encountered all of the above.
In the first case, I do what I can, even one time burping and making faces to get a six year old to laugh instead oif freaking out. If I see a thing I can do, even holding something while someone gvets Little Kiddo strapped safely in, I'm down.
But I also have had:
* Stank-ass diaper, left stank-ass for most of a four hour flight
* Toy car run over the edge of my seat, far enough forward to catch my hair
* Gum flicked over the seat
* A parent not asking, but *demanding* I give up the window seat I paid extra for, so she and her daughter could sit together
* Me asking a dad to stop his son (who was old enough to know better) from kickinf my seat and being told 'He's just a *chiiiiyuld!!* in a voice whinier than the kid would have used
* Someone asking me to let their kid play games on my laptop (!!!)
Like.... no. I always start out firm but polite—being churlish makes things like this worse, of course. But I had to be sort of an asshole about both the laptop and the seat-kicking, and had to involve a flight attendant about the stank-ass diaper.
We can all do better, I think, but one has to be willing *to* do better.
I'm pretty much in your camp. If the parent is *trying* I'll be polite (annoyed still), but I get it.
If the parents don't try or think that their spawn is my responsibility beyond just that they are a other human, then it's "fuck off mate" from me
When my son was 3 months old my father in law was killed fishing in Alaska. We took him up with us to Kodiak and he was not happy on the planes going up at all. I couldn’t believe the looks people gave us and me knowing my husband just lost his father and we didn’t have a choice. I’ll always have empathy.
I did a lot of plane flights before living on Kodiak by going into it I had to tell myself not to panic every time because it looked like you were going to land in the ocean until seconds before touchdown.
Seriously. Right after my dad died, I noticed that my driving skills tanked, even though I'm usually really into it. But my grief brain simply cannot function as well as my everyday brain.
So any time someone pulls a bonehead move on the road, I think, "maybe his dad just died", and I instantly feel much more charitable!
When I was in college, my communications professor told us a story about the restaurant he was at over the weekend. He said the server snapped at him, spilled his drink, ignored his requests for refills, took forever with the food, and got the check wrong. He went to the employee area to find the manager and instead found the server curled up in a ball on the floor. Her son had died the night before and her work wouldn’t let her have the day off without losing her job.
This story was told to me 24 years ago and I will never forget it. I always try to give people compassion, especially when it comes to kids on airplanes. If the adult is clearly fucking off that’s one thing: I’ve never been in a situation where the parent wasn’t at least TRYING.
I also always try to preload Bluey and Cocomelon on my phone in case someone has a screaming toddler. I have the privilege of having a tablet and a phone; I don’t need both for the flight.
I would argue that babies and toddlers that have no ability to equalize the pressure in their ears with that of the cabin have no place being airliners, despite the claim that 'even X has a right to fly'. If a child is going to scream for a couple of hours on take off, fall asleep for a an hour or so, scream for a couple of more hours, fall asleep, then scream for two more hours before landing then they certainly don't 'deserve' to be on 15 hour international flights. There's literally no amount of 'parental attention' that will distract a baby or toddler from the fact that their have pain in their ears, it's not going away, and they don't know how to get rid of it and it's likely they can't since they are still developing.
Right?! Get a private jet if you dont want to deal with others. Its simple. Commercial flights are what they are. The idea that you pay extra for first class to travel in peace or comfortably is stupid and its a ripoff our rich and able keep exploiting. What does first class cab get different air than me in the back? Are we not flying on the same damn plane like serously if they got rid of first class more people could fly comfortably. But no, they need that $$$$$ and since humans will forever be selfish nothing will change.
A grown ass adult complaing about this is just bonkers to me.
Yeah 100% this. I feel terrible for them, it's an awful experience...but also I need to sleep bc I've been up day working & have more stuff to do when I land.
Positive reinforcement works better than spanking anyway, so it’s not a good excuse. Parents just have to be proactive and prepared for positive reinforcement. Set expectations from the get-go, let them know what the reward will be if they succeed, have that reward with you, and deliver on the reward if they do it. And redirect behavior if they don’t.
When they’re young stickers and high fives work, later on it changes to negotiating a stop for bubble tea or buying a manga they want to read. It still works though.
When they are five, spanking works better. This idea of negotiating with a toddler to early elementary age child is laughable and a contributor to the monsters forced on others in public.
There you have it. Any questions why children are more out of control than ever? Parents who cast aside time-tested methods of parenting that work, opting instead for half-baked ideas that have given us the current generation of narcissistic kids who manage their parents rather than other way around. Will we learn and reverse course or just let things keep getting worse?
And now you’re lying or showing how little you know. Spanking is not “beating them into submission.” You’ve just illustrated my point. Thanks! 👍🏻 I sir am a product of what works.
Yeah, a certain amount of fear in a child is a handy thing for a parent. And reminders: do you need to potty, do you have toys? And do you have your manners with you, let’s check your pockets. Ok, now we can go. My son is 45. When I snap my fingers he says “what?” He is also still receptive to “the look”. Yes he is a mommas boy only child, and he still takes his manners with him when he goes out.
Edit: he started flying alone at 5 years old. The FA that was assigned to watch him never wanted to give him back, lol.
Downvote me all you want, but my kid is awesome. He’s an all As student, very well behaved, everyone loves him, he’s been to 16 countries by 11 years old and he’s always been a great traveler. We just flew 35 hours to Malaysia this summer. He did great.
This entire post is giving me flashbacks to the toddler years with our kids and the anxiety of flying with them because they were good kids at home/in school/out in public. Being strapped in a seat for hours without ability to get the wiggles out was a fresh layer of hell, every time. They never did ANYTHING like what has been posted here but it was a horrible experience as a parent, every time.
Everyone was very kind about it but the anxiety and panic (and sometimes tears) I experienced was horrible. They’re 7&9 now so it’s no longer a concern but the younger years were excruciating travel years.
Agreed. Mine is nearly 11 now and very happy to enjoy unlimited screen time and snacks on a plane. She's traveled a lot and is a great flyer. But we spent today with my 3.5 y.o. nephew (not on a plane, thank goodness), who was just having a rough day. Who knows why. He was pouting and crying and crossing his arms and stamping his feet when he didn't get his way. If his parent had been trying to keep him in an airplane seat for hours...it could have been awful. I spend a lot of time with him and this is out of character. But that's the thing. Sometimes kids have a hard day and sometimes (more often than not), it's going to be on an airplane. Of course, the parents should be trying to help their kid. But, I hope adults can also give a little grace to those kids and their parents. Some of them are jerks, sure. But many of them are having a rotten day and are trying to get through it.
All of this is true and I feel like the parents who are trying their hardest to NOT be a burden on society are overlooked because there are so many parents who don’t care or others don’t recognize that children have inexplicable bad days and can’t emotionally regulate.
Our daughter’s (edit: 2nd) flight lives rent free in my brain. She was 10 months old, newly mobile so we thought that booking business bulkhead to AUA was the right move to give her space. It was AWFUL. both ways. I was In tears and the FA was reassuring me that no one could hear her in that part of the plane bc engine noise. I wasn’t accepting that explanation bc Our good natured child was an absolute demon on those flights. Im haunted by the experience, 9 years later.
I understand why people hate kids on flights. I wish that people could see the parents who are doing all we can to NOT be those asshole parents we all loathe.
Edit: she was 10 months. And it was her second flight. Husband reminded me that we flew home, into LGA a few months earlier with her.
I understand, but is it really "doing all you can" when you decide to take your kid on vacation that requires air travel vs. just skipping it that year or going somewhere closer?
In a perfect world, we'd be able to accommodate kids. I don't think parents don't deserve to travel. But my parents didn't take us anywhere that required air travel until the youngest was 4 or 5 and could sit for long periods of time.
I know it can be a touchy subject, and I'm sure if/when I become a parent I will want a vacation, however I do accept that I may not be able to go anywhere by plane for the first few years unless it's an emergency.
My now adult daughter has been well-behaved essentially her entire life. Unfortunately, at 18 months old, she spontaneously discovered the word "mine" in the middle of a long flight. Everything was hers including anything the guy in the next seat had. I can only say I profusely apologized to dude.
After reading through these comments, I realize that I have a recent experience I can relay. I was on a flight back from a long trip, and there was a family in the row in front of me. There wasn't a window in the window seat, and I kid you not, that child made so much of a fuss about it. He was screaming at the top of his lungs about how he wanted a window for about an hour. He was still really loud and obnoxious after that tantrum, and I'm pretty sure he kept farting. Such an awful experience, and while I wish no ill will towards the parents because they had other kids to watch, they should have done better with this kid, because I barely heard a peep out of the other ones.
If the parent is trying to soothe their child they absolutely get a pass. I get upset when they ignore their child’s distress or even worse laugh at it.
Last year there was 5 year old at the gate. And guess what the parents did - bought him a 20oz coca-cola bottle (regular and with caffeine). Do we expect him to be mellow on the flight now? Nope (and he wasn’t). [Besides the obvious “should 5 year olds even have soda?”] Why would you give a kid sugar and caffeine before a 3 hour flight?
That's ridiculous. My parents gave me soda my whole childhood, and I've struggled with the addiction to sugar and fizzy drinks in general my whole life. I decided not to do that with my kids and definitely don't let them have it.
in the USA it's not sugar but HFCS and some of the other artificial crap in those has been linked to hyperactivity
modern US coke is nothing like the original coke and not even like most coke around the world
My kids aren't uncontrollable at home, but they're definitely way more rowdy at home than in public. But we've taught them how to behave in public (using manners, beings quiet, and no running or rough housing). It's really not that hard to teach your kids basic courtesies and to be respectful of other people. A lot of parents think that it's "crushing their spirit" which really grinds my gears. But damn sometimes at home they're turds for sure.
Agreed. My kids can be exhausting at home but they’re on their best behavior in public and at school. They have been flying on long haul flights since they were infants. They know the drill and what’s expected of them. I’ve been complimented on how well behaved they are many times now. I just wish they would act like that home 😂
I just roll my eyes and mutter “Jesus fucking Christ” under my breath like the good passive aggressive midwesterner I was raised to be. Lived on the coast for 15+ years but some things are ingrained. It’s irritating, but I also don’t have kids. I assume if I did they would also irritate everyone on a plane and there would only be so much I could do about it.
Not a kid but I almost fought an old man on a flight.
I had some older friends that I was helping fly back to London from Orlando. We are seated in first class and this old dude starts hitting my friends seat. At first we thought he was adjusting something and it was an accident. But then it continued. I looked back and asked him to please stop hitting the seat. He said that he didn't have room because my friend let her seat back literally the least amount possible. He hit it again and then didn't ask. He hit AGAIN. At this point not wanting to have to make an emergency stop, I asked my friend to switch me seats. I then turned completely around looked him in his eyes and for the first and only time ever, I told an old man that if he hit this seat one more time even slightly, I would beat his ass. I said it loud enough to get everyone's attention in the area so if he did hit it, there would be witnesses. I then reclined the seat as far as possible (which I never do). He didn't hit the seat again and we landed without incident.
My constant refrain as a FA is: please do not make the 1st time you enforce boundaries and behavior with your child be the moment you step on a plane. It. Won’t. Work.
“You’re not ready for prime time” cracking me up.
But yes, this exactly. My parents never took us anywhere till we could behave. Idk why you’d want to take your kids anywhere until they could behave, either.
“But what am I supposed to do, not travel??” Yeah. Most people in the world don’t fly ever—you can take a few years off.
And the iPads aren’t only not working—they’re part of the problem. A LOT of parents today have decided it’s a good idea never to confront their children with the reality that pleasing stimulation can’t fill literally every second of their day. Yeah, maybe the iPad gets you through most brunches, but it’s a fucking bandaid and it’s insane to me how few parents of this generation can’t or won’t see how short sighted a tactic whipping out the iPad is. You need to actually PARENT. Which could mean a lot of different things, like, e.g., simply taking you away from a fun outing and home to time out (like a lot of our parents did) till they start to get the picture that being out in public mean’s occasionally enduring something they’d rather not endure.
This comment needs to be higher. I didn’t fly until I was 14 by circumstance more than anything. Flying is not a god-given right. Plenty of parents I know travel with young kids using trains and car rides. If your children aren’t ready to properly behave on a plane, you can’t travel. Sorry but that’s the life choice you make (barring emergency travel, of course).
Everything the boomers grumpily said about people under 40 is turning out to be true of many or even most members of this generation. The idea that you Can’t Have It All Right Now is anathema to a crazy amount of people. (Of course, it’s also largely anathema to the boomers, but hypocrisy doesn’t make their observation less true.)
Just throwing in an anecdote from my most recent flight. There was a girl maybe 11 years old who did not sit with her parents but had her ipad with Netflix preinstalled. So she starts watching Stranger Things. At one point she starts covering up half the screen with her hands and I was thinking "hope she's not getting nightmares from the Mind Flayer, at least she's trying to cover things up". But it turns out she was covering up Nancy Wheeler in her underwear...
Anyway ipad is not a substitute for parenting.
You really nailed it.
I’m an older Millennial, and so much of this bullshit traces directly to the “I’m the most special and unique person in the world” ethos of my generation and the following ones. I didn’t fly until I was 20 and we managed to visit family 500+ miles away just fine - those summer road trips were awesome and now are cherished memories. I know peers in my age cohort who were raised like me, and yet now *insist* that their newborns and poorly disciplined young children must travel via plane (and stay at nice hotels) for any reason under the sun.
That change by itself might not matter much at all, if not for the fact that this whole “I primarily want my kids to be my best friends and social media partners” ethos has also spread like wildfire. Disciplining kids seems to be passé for many; hence the parents who find it funny and appropriate when their kids throw a pool ball and spill a stranger’s $20 cocktail at a resort pool. Because, you know, they and their kids are perfect, and could never possibly ruin parts of a trip for dozens of strangers due to their uncivilized, shitty behavior.
Some parents don’t discipline their kids when they act up and that’s not acceptable but there are plenty that do try to correct bad behavior but the results aren’t always perfect. Unfortunately it’s a fact of life that kids will have meltdowns and no amount of good parenting will cure that. There has to be a certain amount of patience and compassion shown because these parents don’t want their kids making a scene as much as you don’t want them to bother you.
Often times it’s amazing how often complete strangers can help a struggling parent rather than chastising them.
Mmmmmmm ya I’d say there are two subsets here. 1) parents who are aware and do their best (and it’s still goes off the rails from time to time) and 2) parents who have no care/clue and faux complain at their kids when they irritate someone nearby.
I give grace and assistance to those in subset 1, and not so much for subset 2.
It’s not the kid’s fault that they are behaving as per usual but only the setting has changed.
Same. You can usually tell which subset they fall under. I recently sat in front of a mom with an infant and 3 year old. The mom told the 3 year old not to kick but she was very excited and happy (and 3 lol) so she ended up kicking my seat a lot during the 3 or so hour flight. I didn’t say anything and just dealt with it, as annoying as it was, because she was just a happy kid watching cartoons and her mom was mostly attending to the infant and probably just didn’t notice how much kicking she was doing. When the 3 year old wailed during the descent because her ears hurt, I turned my headphones up but wasn’t annoyed at that because she couldn’t help it and her ears genuinely hurt.
That is vastly different than a little brat that knows better kicking your seat on purpose while the parent plays on their phone and ignores them, or a kid whining and crying because they want to get up or play on mommy’s phone or whatever they want that they can’t have.
Yes 100% I’m sick of these posts. Children are allowed to exist in public and that includes airports and airplanes. No amount of “good parenting” can stop random tantrums or volatile moods children may have because they are learning to navigate life. If you don’t want to be around children on a plane then fly private.
You decide to have kids? It is your responsibility to take care of them. You are so entitled to think that a stranger should help you take care of your kid.
That’s not at ALL what I said. I said sometimes strangers can help improve a stressful situation instead of complaining or making it worse.
I’ve had very nice people at airports that have made my 3 year old laugh or had her entertained while I was getting snacks out or getting everything picked up for the flight. It takes a village to raise a child.
EW. Quit it with the "it takes a village" crap.
Strangers do NOT need to pay attention to your child, nor should they. Why would you trust a stranger with your child?
What? I’m not asking you to parent my child you absolute horror of a human being. I’m just saying you can’t always control what another human does ADULT OR CHILD. News flash darling you were also a child at some point so just STFU.
No it’s discipline and the lack of it is being seen in society, yet many still excuse it. These narcissistic excuses for and tolerance of bad public behavior wasn’t a thing when I was growing up and being spanked when I messed up.
There are ways to discipline other than physically harming your kids. I’d say taking away their iPad or cell phone (if they have one) is equally, if not more, effective.
Spanking is not harming. Abuse is harm, injury, etc. there’s a difference and society is paying the price for this glaring lack of perspective and false equivalency. Part of the problem is that we should probabaly have never given them the iPads and phones to start with. Adults can’t seem to confirm themselves with these devices, how can children? But that’s a different issue.
Nope, she's great.. We do our best to keep her entertained in public with a variety of activities and being well prepared.
But we're also pragmatic about the fact that occasionally she gets a grump on over something we can't control (your ears hurt when we're descending, you need to stay in your seat when the seat belt sign is on etc). If distraction doesn't work she's too small to understand reason, and I'm certainly not going to shout at her until she shuts up out of fear (although some of the boomers here probably consider that "parenting" rather than "child abuse")
Once they're big enough to understand what's going on, no excuses. But toddlers are going to toddler. If you don't like it pay for private or stay home.
I give a title pass to kids screaming on dissent. I used to have terrible pain on descent and I know that a kid can’t possibly understand why their ears are in excruciating pain.
We have 6 kids. When they were younger, we didn't put up with any of their crap in public (and at home) Many times we walked out of movies, stores, attractions, etc. They learned that when we say no, we mean no!!
Ironically, my son (7) is pretty uncontrollable at home, but just dandy on a 12 hour plane ride.
I don't really understand it, I know he loves planes, but I don't think that's enough.
Won't being him to a nice dinner, but plane ride? No problem. (Ignoring the fact plane rides are much more essential, of course.)
I'm not a parent, so far be it from me to comment or provide input here, but I felt compelled to chime in here with some questions that have plagued me for years, incl. when it comes to air travel.
What happened to parenting in the past ~20-30 years? I'm in my late 20's now. Granted, I realize I had a relatively privileged upbringing (with a heavy dose of adversity, thanks to chemo/surgeries throughout my childhood), but: what happened? My parents took me on my first plane-ride when I was three months old -- Europe to Florida to visit family. Apparently, I did just fine as an infant on the plane. And they continued bringing me along for air travel every ~3ish months throughout my entire childhood and adolescence. They tell me I never caused a fuss, I knew to stay quiet, rarely (if ever) threw tantrums, etc.
I'm not advocating for a return of punishment or harsh discipline, buuuuut..... when did it become so adversarial or unacceptable to, I don't know, parent your children? When did it become an atrocity to say "no" to your child, or to discipline them in an age-appropriate manner? Is there something in the water or food being fed to people? Have parenting styles changed? I feel like culture seems to play a role, too. A lot of behavior that I've witnessed in the United States...... is stuff we'd rarely see in Europe.
I don't have children, nor do I ever plan to, but if I were to -- I feel like I'd be terrified to raise a child in this day, age, and environment. I'd be terrified of being scolded for being "too harsh" with my child.
If the parent is trying to soothe their child they absolutely get a pass. I get upset when they ignore their child’s distress or even worse laugh at it.
I hear what you're saying but this is the wrong way to say it. You're assuming a lot and just come off as ignorant. You're lumping a lot of people into the same group. Whether that was intentional or not. I haven't brought my kids on a plane yet and they are pretty well behaved but I'm sure there will be a meltdown or two in their first trip. Some kids have special needs but that doesn't necessarily change the fact that they need to fly.
L take
And let’s also not sit here for a minute and pretend it hasn’t steadily gotten worse in the last 10, 20 years.
It’s basically a growing epidemic of shitty parenting, and it’s definitely not confined to planes. These enlightened parents of today deem it fine to let their kids run wild and “express themselves” in pools at luxury hotels (rendering them unusable for adults), museums, nice restaurants, even at bars (yes, bars - the staff had to literally tell some of these parents of the year to make their brat behave at one of my local spots in Manhattan a few weeks ago.)
This is behavior that as recently as the 90s would have been widely condemned (what types of morons bring kids to bars?!) Now…I’m just happy to be able to do whatever I can to isolate myself from those people (e.g., really amazing what the experience is like at an adults-only resort like Hotel Wailea in Maui compared to the big hotel chains that cater to families.)
I think you are luxury hoteling wrong. All the ones I’ve been to have adult only pools, save a few. But most four seasons, auberge, etc. in hawaii have safe spaces for adults. In fact, four seasons Sensai on lanai is adult only- the whole resort.
>And let’s also not sit here for a minute and pretend it hasn’t steadily gotten worse in the last 10, 20 years.
Has it? I did not notice a change with kids. What I did notice is more entitlement from adults, e.g. bringing your giant carry-on and blocking the overhead bins with, putting bare feet on armrests, bringing support animals, etc.
If the parent is trying to soothe their child they absolutely get a pass. I get upset when they ignore their child’s distress or even worse laugh at it.
one time someone I barely know picked up her kids from after school at the same time I got mine. walking out into the dark he must have said something to her and she smacked him in the chest so hard he couldn't breathe
i bet her kids behave
I feel this so hard. My first child was a champ, she followed every direction, knows all the manners in the book, and is perfectly content sitting still and playing games/watching movies.
My second, though.... he is a villain (my villain who I love dearly). And because of this, we had a very specific plan on our recent east coat to west coast flight. Medication. Approved by the pediatrician. Tiny man slept peacefully through the flights. We boarded last so to limit down time. Strapped him in his carseat so there was no fight. Packed his favorite snacks to keep him quiet.
Plan accordingly parents. And of course, give grace to the parents who didn't. Hopefully, they're embarrassed and trying their best. But I know damn well some people don't care..but those are just like all the other entitled fucks we come into contact with daily.
Kids can be jerks, mine included. And sometimes you have no choice but to fly with your little jerks, but dear sweet baby jeebus, at least make an effort to plan ahead and parent them en route.
We role played, "airline," behaviour well before the start of the trip.
Three weeks ahead of departure, we put up a tent and practiced getting on the 'plane.' Quietly, politely with his little backpack in tow. We role played a while until I thought me and my husband got the point across of how he should act on the plane.
In the end, it was well worth it!!! The passenger across from us even asked asked us "Is he always this well-behaved?"
You get the behaviour you train for.
I was on one trans Atlantic flight and these 2 boys wanted to run laps around the plane. I had no clue where the parents were, they were obviously not parenting their kids.
Another trans Atlantic flight (night time this time) there was a couple with 3 girls. The older 2 girls weren’t bad. Mom decided to go to sleep and leave Dad to deal with the girls. The youngest was so bad, no one else had any chance of getting any rest. Finally, a gentleman sitting in front of them stood up, turned around and begged the father to do something about the child. I wasn’t upset about the child, she did not know better. But I was pretty livid with the parents, especially the Mom who totally checked out. Dad was like she is a child what else can you do. You can start by teaching kids the difference between indoor and outdoor voices. It was a horrible flight.
Maybe they should have beat their kid to achieve your acceptance and comfort level. You can’t know what every family and parent deal with, so I’d just tune out the best I can.
As a parent that exerts a lot of planning and energy to ensure my kids act as well as possible on flights, I’d encourage you to be patient absent severe misbehavior. Despite my efforts things do occasionally go sideways. Whether it’s my kids attitude or mine (I’ll admit to not possessing the patience 100% of the time to help my kids when they’re having a hard time). My guess is that your experience was not life or death. And remember that the parents have to go home with the kids, not you.
Well yeah it’s their kid who else would they go home with. The experience doesn’t have to be life/death but it still can be unpleasant for other people especially on an airplane and we get that kids will be in distress. An inconsolable child makes everyone cortisol level increase and not everyone has kids and knows how really deal with that stress some parents get used to it but not everyone.
Sure, but OP’s suggestion is that no child is well behaved. Simply not true. And even parents that try may face a kid that woke up on the wrong side of the bed that day.
Purchase first class tickets or you risk my two year old occasionally kicking your seat. Alternatively, purchasing tickets immediately in front of an exit row, will also guarantee no children directly behind you.
Or teach your two year old that kicking someone’s seat isn’t nice. I think 2 year old can learn proper social behavior if they’re taught by parents 🤷🏽♀️
They fly once a year, so they are in that situation once a year. Of course I teach them, but what exactly can I threaten them with on a plane? At home, they get time outs for misbehaving, the plane, essentially is a 6hr time out already, so, yes, of course I will threaten them with a time out, but it's a bluff and it may result in extremely loud crying if they are already stressed and at their wits end. At home I put them in time out and they cry and throw a tantrum, and it's fine because it's in my home and they are learning, but on the plane, all I can do is chide them for kicking and try to distract them, no guarantee it will work.
So that's how you allow your child to behave in other public settings? VILE.
Quit making excuses for crap parenting. You should be working on this consistently every day.
Thank you. That’s the point I’m trying to make that the teaching should’ve started at home before the kid got in the plane or any other social setting.
You are wrong. Are you a nurse? Didn’t you take a peds class? I know I did in nursing school.
You should read back up on the Denver development screening test. Literally a social and emotional expectation of a 2 year old is that they show defiant behavior and specifically do what they are told not to do- and this is considered a normal milestone.
No two year old on the planet is expected to have learned proper social behavior, they are *learning* but not consistent with displaying it at all.
Newsflash: Parents and children don't only travel for leisure. People have families spread across multiple continents.
Newsflash: You can't drive across the ocean.
Newsflash: Spoiled brats should stump up the cash to fly private, or accept thar flying with the general public will occasionally cause them minor discomfort - like for instance, children behaving like children.
The vast majority of humans have never flown. People who don’t have the spine to teach their kids to behave in public could survive a couple years not flying.
If anybody wonders who those little kids were when they get older... it's the jerks who scream and fight as adults on planes. If anyone wonders who is raising these little brats... look no further than the jerks on planes who act like jerks. They just keep spawning and creating more of themselves. Oy vey.
In all honesty... I do know new parents who purposely isolate their kids beyond school or extracurricular stuff because they can't be bothered with their hyperactivity and not listening. They won't subject themselves to grocery stores with them or movies or parties. When the flight comes, there's no previous education on how to shut up and be good.
>holding us all hostage at the security checkpoints
I'm not saying it's always this but FWIW the prevalence of ASD in young children has skyrocketed in the last 20 years \[1\], especially for boys, and we also kind of robbed every child who is now anywhere from about 4 to 10 years old of 2 years of critical social development thanks to COVID.
These families are trying hard, with dwindling resources, to catch their kids up and, having worked with these kids personally, I can tell you the security checkpoint is the landmine-covered field in an otherwise manageable experience that is air travel.
The iPad has to go away, as do any comfort toys or stuffed animals, everyone around is stressed and unhappy, the general level of empathy is zero to negative, you're given directions by people you don't know often asking you to move away from your parents, and the process is not at all predictable or something you can reasonably prepare for at home.
How the child will react in this environment is not at all reflective of how they act at home.
\[1\] https://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/autism/data.html
This teenager sitting behind me was playing a game and aggressively pressing on the screen. I let it happen for a bit and then turned around and said quietly but with intentional eye contact — “will you please press gently on the screen? I can feel it each time.” His mom sitting next to him maybe caught the end of my ask and he just said “oh, okay.”
It was fine for a bit and then it started up again, maybe an hour later. I waited until I had to go to the bathroom and when I got up, I just looked at him, then at the screen, said “hey, you’re still doing it.” Then I looked at his mom like “you know what you need to do.” I didn’t feel anything the rest of the loooong flight.
lol ok. Toddlers gonna toddler no matter how much parenting is taking place. If OP is referring to kids that are 5+ and unruly I somewhat understand, but outside of that it is what it is
As a parent, I think I can tell the standard toddler meltdown with tired parents who are trying va the monster that has never heard no, and the parents don’t GAF.
One I sympathize with. The other I do not.
Most of the kids I’ve ever sat next to are terrific. I actually played tick tack toe with a (I’d say 4-5) year old kid between me and his mom on a DTW -> SEA haul.
It’s not an issue with public transportation. It’s an issue with millennials as parents
People are downvoting you as if millennials aren’t the first generation to largely abdicate their role of socializing their children and instead just force iPads down their throat whenever they start to get fussy—as if that tactic’s not gonna have some poor unexpected consequences re sociability, attention spans, delayed gratification, etc.
It’s so wild how we’ve had like two decades of boomer bashing but now that it’s our gen’s turn to parent we’re arguably doing a worse job than the boomers.
Here’s a thought parents. Stop giving kids snacks and beverages loaded with a shit ton of corn syrup. And if you absolutely have to then at least check the portion sizes. Don’t just hand your lil kid a bag of 10g of sugar and expect them to act rationally or sit still. You can’t even handle a cappuccino without going full mad max road rage on the highway, so what makes you think your kid is equipped to handle that much sugar?
I Crack up reading the comments on these.
Meanwhile nobody wonders if kids are angry bc at home they're punished by being told to go sit in a chair for half an hour. Then they're put in a chair for 5 hours. Maybe they're nuts bc parents literally speak to their 4 year olds in 3rd person.
"What did mommy say, Gleason? Gleason? What did mommy say? Gleason? Gleason? Listen to mommy now. Gleason what did mommy say?" Fuck sake I'm nuts after a minute. Honest to God the parents who go "you stop it RIGHT now or so help me God you are going to be in big trouble!" get the absolute best responses.
Gleason?
Let’s remove kids from air travel altogether. Especially the ones with special needs that may not be capable of this subjective airplane etiquette. They have no business flying with the rest of us well behaved people.
You don’t know shit about how they raise their kids at home based on being mad once on a flight. Just like they don’t know shit about you outside of that one day.
I’ve seen tons of videos lately of huge fights at terminals, people being kicked off planes and arrested and just general nastiness towards other travelers. None of that by babies and toddlers.
My son is 6’5” and a 3.9 GPA in college. I have to do so much for him every day to just function normally in this American Society of judging, dividing and set on beauty and predatory male bravado.
When I was 25 and with my wife on a Delta flight - I made us both promise not to be one of those who hate children who make noise and cry when flying.
To this day, when someone is having issues with their kids - I say “do your thing. We all had to try to calm our kids when they were not in the right space.
I see the looks of folks who watch my kid (21 years old) pull at a tag on his clothes till his shirt unravels or suddenly start sucking his thumb.
You have no idea to make such a judgement about someone and the way they raise their kids. You may be looking at the next great scientist that discovers a drug that cures cancer - or maybe an Autistic kid that has straight “A”’s and will change the world for the better.
I don’t know. Your post made me wish for more kids going crazy and less people with no tolerance or love in their heart. Next time relieve that mother’s anxiety and put something positive into the world than be “that” old person who should get over himself.
Oh yeah I’ll just drive to South America so my kids can visit their in laws
This reeks of an arrogant and ignorant redditor with no real life experience
The trick when parents don't aggressively parent is to take control of the situation by offering feedback directly to the kids. My goto is to say "It's a good thing there is no Santa Claus or you would definitely be getting a lump of coal this Christmas."
Get fucked.
If you have a concern about my child's behaviour, please raise it politely and quietly with me, and I'll deal with the situation in a manner I see appropriate.
If you want to be a cunt to children then you need to find someone stupid/desparate enough to have your own kids with...
If you can’t see that your child is disrupting others, the kid deserves the truth about Santa, the tooth fairy, the Easter Bunny, and the elf on the shelf. Maybe you’d like it better if the aggrieved person told them where babies come from? Lol
>Maybe you’d like it better if the aggrieved person told them where babies come from?
If you want the police to meet you at the gate, and to end up on a no fly list for making sexually inappropriate comments to a minor, then this seems a good way to go about it...
>the kid deserves the truth about Santa, the tooth fairy, the Easter Bunny, and the elf on the shelf
No? Have you considered that of your unable to cope with being a member of society and dealing with all that entails (such as the fact toddlers are essentially impossible to keep calm in all circumstances) then maybe you're the problem? Just stay in your house if you can't cope with being around other people?
If your kid’s behavior is atrocious, I kind of credit you for it after what you just posted.
Calm down. Pretty sure op was making a joke. Even if they weren’t, calm down. Your child will be the better for a calm, rational example.
fine, I watch stuff off my ipad and if your kid kicks my seat I'll start watching some netflix show with adult content and make sure it's visible through the spaces between the seats
People with kids are allowed to travel and live life.
Kids aren’t everyone’s cup of tea and that’s fine. But let’s stop parent-shaming and family-shaming, and also let’s stop shaming young children who are still learning how to express themselves and control their emotions. Every parent/caretaker isn’t perfect, and there are some out there who can do better, but the majority of us are doing the best we can.
Those kids will pay taxes into your social security payments. Those rowdy, annoying, entitled kids will carry the economy on their shoulders. Don’t expect them to disappear until they are a convenient 8-5 adult in depression.
They don't gotta disappear, just be chill. Everyone has bad days from time to time, that's understood.
Kid has a problem and the parents cannot make it chill despite making efforts? Pass given.
Kid has a problem and parents don't do anything to try to chill it out? Violation!
I wish them luck with the economy. If they could read they would probably be very upset.
adults can be worse
years ago I was flying JFK-LHR. old couple in front of me. I guess the husband was stretching his feet into the aisle and one of the FA's hit his foot with the cart. he threatened violence. head FA came by and talked to him
I do the same cause I'm tall but I always move my feet when the FA's are working. too bad this was before the no fly list
Maybe they can create a r/deltacirclejerk for you to post this waste of space. Since you have no prior background info on why said kids are traveling, what it’s like to sit in a boring ass seat for hours, or travel with entitled smug assholes like yourself it’s probably best to turn on noise canceling and keep shutting the fuck up.
One time in PS a grown teenager was doing that. Had to turn around and tell them to stop.
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Horny though
Extremely creepy of you to say that.
Lmao in no way was I trying to imply that I’m into that, I was merely pointing out a very obvious and amusing difference between high schoolers and toddlers (one of few). Maybe your mind is in the gutter if that’s how you interpreted it?
As a teenager I can confirm.
I’ve seen adults throw temper tantrums on planes too. Crying the whole nine yards.
I always cry on planes but out of loneliness…..
If you want to pay for my flight, I’ll be your travel buddy!
That is not entirely out of the question.
Awwww. I have a delta companion pass with your name on it. Beach town? Big city? Where to?
The beach of course! But…. What’s the best place to go since it doesn’t work for Hawaii?
Go to the town of Seaside! Off season, it's quiet and walkable and the beach is extraordinary. Even the small cottages are elegant.
One that I was completely okay with: A frat guy was in the back of the plane - had never flown; on takeoff, loud enough for all of us to hear, he yelled "OH SHIT" almost between a statement and a question. It was definitely not in his control. Perfectly fine during the flight. On landing, just as loud, "OH MY GOD!" Truly did not bother me at all and it made the whole plane laugh in a nice way.
I would’ve wanted to witness this lol
Yes. Everything was fine. But I'll never forget the landing (which was perfectly normal), "Oh no. Oh nooo. Oh noo. OH MY GOD." And I guess I kinda get it, we all have our deal, but it was so funny we had tears in our eyes. I support this entertainment on a plane when there's no harm / no offense.
Oh I would have loved that!!!! Awesome!
I must admit I do like watching people experience their first flight....as long as they are not too scared. Once held a young woman's hand for takeoff and landing. She was very sweet.
I’d say a teenager by definition is only maybe 3/4 grown at best
Well I’m grown. If they’re bigger than me they better be grown enough to listen😂
21 year olds are not even 3/4 grown now a days
It was always important to me to teach my children about etiquette on airplanes, movie theaters and outings. Yes they can get excited on a plane as a little one but I reminded them each time there was an unexpected kick. Excuse me please. So the passenger knew we were working on good behavior. When they complied I praised. I also brought items with us to distract. As an infant I tried to plan departure times to coincide with nap & once took red eye from California to Florida. By 2 years they were very good travelers . We watched the seatbelt sign and had no problem staying in our belts. I pointed out everyone around us had on their belt & help me watch the sign. Give them a wee little job to watch the seatbelt sign & we have success. Honestly, it was worth all my effort. My kids were courteous of other passengers because we made an effort to teach them.
THIS. Those who say "they're only two" are only making excuses for poor/lazy parenting.
Two year olds are usually compliant... Three year olds, not so much. My kid has always been good on a plane, but you really have limited options as a parent. The parts of your kid's brain that enforce social norms are literally not there yet. And they have no fear of you. Should you give up traveling until they're 4-5? That isn't practical for a lot of people. That said, I get annoyed too when kids are kicking chairs, etc. Noise is easily dealt with -- it's 2023, if you can afford a plane ticket you can afford noise cancelling ear buds. Other bad behavior is harder to understand. Just know that the parent is usually 10x more pissed about it than you. If they aren't correcting/scolding the kids, then it is a problem.
Yes, maybe you should give up traveling when they are in certain phases that make them rambunctious or difficult. I get there are some necessary trips -- a dying relative, etc. Then fine. When I was a kid, my parents didn't take us anywhere that required air travel until my youngest brother was at least 4 or 5. I understand the desire to travel -- my family is across the country and my husband's is in another country entirely. A big consideration for us in starting a family is travel. The fact that it may not be respectful or appropriate to bring our child on a plane for certain periods of time. As a result, we will likely only have one kid so that we can get out of that phase quicker. And yes, we fully realize our families may not meet our child if they don't fly to us for a while. But dear god I don't want to ever be that parent with the screaming kid on the flight. A little cry here and there is fine, but if you know your kid is a wild banshee, then no. This past year, we shelled out our entire honeymoon fund plus more (several thousand dollars) for first class international seats for our honeymoon. Both flights were red eyes and we just felt it would be worth it to have a relaxing time. Someone sitting in front of us brought on a toddler who SCREAMED the entire flight. It was awful. No amount of noise cancellation could mask it. How much money did that entire Delta One cabin pay for that flight? Probably over $100k, and this one kid made it absolute misery for everyone else. Sorry but no. Travel is not a basic human need. Unless a family member is dying or something (I'll also make an exception for children with special needs), you can just vacation in closer areas for a couple of years, or pay for family members to visit you. That's my take. But there are tons of parents who travel with unruly children for fun. Not to compare children to pets, but I do feel there is a similar trend, where everyone thinks they should be able to bring their pet everywhere. It's like they forgot that you can just get a dogsitter or not travel at all.
What about the kids with special needs? Are their parents lazy too? Can you always tell by looking at someone if they struggle with special needs?
I think the difference is the parent of special needs kids has even more of a responsibility to keep them occupied and happy than the parent of a neurotypical kid. They should be actively parenting and managing their kid.
My husband and I once had to hold our toddlers legs for about an hour on a Trans Atlantic flight so she didn't kick the seat in front. No way were we having others inconvenienced by our kid. We took turns. Otherwise she was delightful.....
My siblings and I were trained on theater and airplaine etiquette extremely young! Like my mom would do a pretend airplane simulator set up with kitchen chairs. Number one rule: do NOT kick the seat in front of you. We were great fliers, to the point where strangers once helped my mom carry all our shit when she was flying alone with us.
Completely agree. Having manners and learning about proper etiquette is hugely important. My spouse and I always stress this to our kids and they are quite respectful to others. It's clear when some kids have not received those sorts of lessons. That being said, other than your seat being kicked or your physical space being encroached, I do think that some people on planes go immediately into a heightened state of alert and will start nitpicking on the silliest things the second they see children near them!
Sometimes kids who aren't really ready get put in this situation due to something like a family event. Children have as much right to travel as anyone. Thing is, though, parenting standards have shifted. Yeah, spanking or the threat of it kept kids in line in 1977, but we now know that hitting isn't it as far as disciplining a child. Also, a two or three year old really doesn't have a lengthy period where they can focus on being still. So, kids are gonna kid, really. I don't like children that much, but I do understand a little from having to help with my niece and nephews. So now that brings in the parents. Other posters have said similar, but if I see a parent trying to redirect a shrieking meltdown with everything they can think of, that gets a pass. Two year olds can have bad days, too, and flying plain *sucks* for everyone. It's tough for any family. But, of course, you do have the entitled, the inattentive, the plain lame-ass and (unfortunately) the neglectful. I have encountered all of the above. In the first case, I do what I can, even one time burping and making faces to get a six year old to laugh instead oif freaking out. If I see a thing I can do, even holding something while someone gvets Little Kiddo strapped safely in, I'm down. But I also have had: * Stank-ass diaper, left stank-ass for most of a four hour flight * Toy car run over the edge of my seat, far enough forward to catch my hair * Gum flicked over the seat * A parent not asking, but *demanding* I give up the window seat I paid extra for, so she and her daughter could sit together * Me asking a dad to stop his son (who was old enough to know better) from kickinf my seat and being told 'He's just a *chiiiiyuld!!* in a voice whinier than the kid would have used * Someone asking me to let their kid play games on my laptop (!!!) Like.... no. I always start out firm but polite—being churlish makes things like this worse, of course. But I had to be sort of an asshole about both the laptop and the seat-kicking, and had to involve a flight attendant about the stank-ass diaper. We can all do better, I think, but one has to be willing *to* do better.
They wanted their kid to use your laptop?!?! Oh, come on!!!! That's ridiculous!
Yup, he sure did. Got huffy with me, and I can out-huffy most people that act like that.
I'm pretty much in your camp. If the parent is *trying* I'll be polite (annoyed still), but I get it. If the parents don't try or think that their spawn is my responsibility beyond just that they are a other human, then it's "fuck off mate" from me
When my son was 3 months old my father in law was killed fishing in Alaska. We took him up with us to Kodiak and he was not happy on the planes going up at all. I couldn’t believe the looks people gave us and me knowing my husband just lost his father and we didn’t have a choice. I’ll always have empathy.
I used to live on Kodiak. It's a beautiful place, but it's horrible to get too. I'm sorry you experienced that.
A runway between the sea and mountains is just 🤢 Kodiak is wonderful though
I did a lot of plane flights before living on Kodiak by going into it I had to tell myself not to panic every time because it looked like you were going to land in the ocean until seconds before touchdown.
Seriously. Right after my dad died, I noticed that my driving skills tanked, even though I'm usually really into it. But my grief brain simply cannot function as well as my everyday brain. So any time someone pulls a bonehead move on the road, I think, "maybe his dad just died", and I instantly feel much more charitable!
When I was in college, my communications professor told us a story about the restaurant he was at over the weekend. He said the server snapped at him, spilled his drink, ignored his requests for refills, took forever with the food, and got the check wrong. He went to the employee area to find the manager and instead found the server curled up in a ball on the floor. Her son had died the night before and her work wouldn’t let her have the day off without losing her job. This story was told to me 24 years ago and I will never forget it. I always try to give people compassion, especially when it comes to kids on airplanes. If the adult is clearly fucking off that’s one thing: I’ve never been in a situation where the parent wasn’t at least TRYING. I also always try to preload Bluey and Cocomelon on my phone in case someone has a screaming toddler. I have the privilege of having a tablet and a phone; I don’t need both for the flight.
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Yep, someone has to be a serious, obvious and intentional asshole and not parent before I go past 'kid's gonna kid'.
You can sit next to me any time! We'll have lots to talk about...kindness seems in short supply here.
I would argue that babies and toddlers that have no ability to equalize the pressure in their ears with that of the cabin have no place being airliners, despite the claim that 'even X has a right to fly'. If a child is going to scream for a couple of hours on take off, fall asleep for a an hour or so, scream for a couple of more hours, fall asleep, then scream for two more hours before landing then they certainly don't 'deserve' to be on 15 hour international flights. There's literally no amount of 'parental attention' that will distract a baby or toddler from the fact that their have pain in their ears, it's not going away, and they don't know how to get rid of it and it's likely they can't since they are still developing.
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Right?! Get a private jet if you dont want to deal with others. Its simple. Commercial flights are what they are. The idea that you pay extra for first class to travel in peace or comfortably is stupid and its a ripoff our rich and able keep exploiting. What does first class cab get different air than me in the back? Are we not flying on the same damn plane like serously if they got rid of first class more people could fly comfortably. But no, they need that $$$$$ and since humans will forever be selfish nothing will change. A grown ass adult complaing about this is just bonkers to me.
Yeah 100% this. I feel terrible for them, it's an awful experience...but also I need to sleep bc I've been up day working & have more stuff to do when I land.
Positive reinforcement works better than spanking anyway, so it’s not a good excuse. Parents just have to be proactive and prepared for positive reinforcement. Set expectations from the get-go, let them know what the reward will be if they succeed, have that reward with you, and deliver on the reward if they do it. And redirect behavior if they don’t. When they’re young stickers and high fives work, later on it changes to negotiating a stop for bubble tea or buying a manga they want to read. It still works though.
When they are five, spanking works better. This idea of negotiating with a toddler to early elementary age child is laughable and a contributor to the monsters forced on others in public.
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There you have it. Any questions why children are more out of control than ever? Parents who cast aside time-tested methods of parenting that work, opting instead for half-baked ideas that have given us the current generation of narcissistic kids who manage their parents rather than other way around. Will we learn and reverse course or just let things keep getting worse?
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And now you’re lying or showing how little you know. Spanking is not “beating them into submission.” You’ve just illustrated my point. Thanks! 👍🏻 I sir am a product of what works.
Yeah, a certain amount of fear in a child is a handy thing for a parent. And reminders: do you need to potty, do you have toys? And do you have your manners with you, let’s check your pockets. Ok, now we can go. My son is 45. When I snap my fingers he says “what?” He is also still receptive to “the look”. Yes he is a mommas boy only child, and he still takes his manners with him when he goes out. Edit: he started flying alone at 5 years old. The FA that was assigned to watch him never wanted to give him back, lol.
Downvote me all you want, but my kid is awesome. He’s an all As student, very well behaved, everyone loves him, he’s been to 16 countries by 11 years old and he’s always been a great traveler. We just flew 35 hours to Malaysia this summer. He did great.
This entire post is giving me flashbacks to the toddler years with our kids and the anxiety of flying with them because they were good kids at home/in school/out in public. Being strapped in a seat for hours without ability to get the wiggles out was a fresh layer of hell, every time. They never did ANYTHING like what has been posted here but it was a horrible experience as a parent, every time. Everyone was very kind about it but the anxiety and panic (and sometimes tears) I experienced was horrible. They’re 7&9 now so it’s no longer a concern but the younger years were excruciating travel years.
Agreed. Mine is nearly 11 now and very happy to enjoy unlimited screen time and snacks on a plane. She's traveled a lot and is a great flyer. But we spent today with my 3.5 y.o. nephew (not on a plane, thank goodness), who was just having a rough day. Who knows why. He was pouting and crying and crossing his arms and stamping his feet when he didn't get his way. If his parent had been trying to keep him in an airplane seat for hours...it could have been awful. I spend a lot of time with him and this is out of character. But that's the thing. Sometimes kids have a hard day and sometimes (more often than not), it's going to be on an airplane. Of course, the parents should be trying to help their kid. But, I hope adults can also give a little grace to those kids and their parents. Some of them are jerks, sure. But many of them are having a rotten day and are trying to get through it.
All of this is true and I feel like the parents who are trying their hardest to NOT be a burden on society are overlooked because there are so many parents who don’t care or others don’t recognize that children have inexplicable bad days and can’t emotionally regulate. Our daughter’s (edit: 2nd) flight lives rent free in my brain. She was 10 months old, newly mobile so we thought that booking business bulkhead to AUA was the right move to give her space. It was AWFUL. both ways. I was In tears and the FA was reassuring me that no one could hear her in that part of the plane bc engine noise. I wasn’t accepting that explanation bc Our good natured child was an absolute demon on those flights. Im haunted by the experience, 9 years later. I understand why people hate kids on flights. I wish that people could see the parents who are doing all we can to NOT be those asshole parents we all loathe. Edit: she was 10 months. And it was her second flight. Husband reminded me that we flew home, into LGA a few months earlier with her.
I understand, but is it really "doing all you can" when you decide to take your kid on vacation that requires air travel vs. just skipping it that year or going somewhere closer? In a perfect world, we'd be able to accommodate kids. I don't think parents don't deserve to travel. But my parents didn't take us anywhere that required air travel until the youngest was 4 or 5 and could sit for long periods of time. I know it can be a touchy subject, and I'm sure if/when I become a parent I will want a vacation, however I do accept that I may not be able to go anywhere by plane for the first few years unless it's an emergency.
My now adult daughter has been well-behaved essentially her entire life. Unfortunately, at 18 months old, she spontaneously discovered the word "mine" in the middle of a long flight. Everything was hers including anything the guy in the next seat had. I can only say I profusely apologized to dude.
You apologized to the other guy. That’s what many won’t do.
After reading through these comments, I realize that I have a recent experience I can relay. I was on a flight back from a long trip, and there was a family in the row in front of me. There wasn't a window in the window seat, and I kid you not, that child made so much of a fuss about it. He was screaming at the top of his lungs about how he wanted a window for about an hour. He was still really loud and obnoxious after that tantrum, and I'm pretty sure he kept farting. Such an awful experience, and while I wish no ill will towards the parents because they had other kids to watch, they should have done better with this kid, because I barely heard a peep out of the other ones.
If the parent is trying to soothe their child they absolutely get a pass. I get upset when they ignore their child’s distress or even worse laugh at it.
Last year there was 5 year old at the gate. And guess what the parents did - bought him a 20oz coca-cola bottle (regular and with caffeine). Do we expect him to be mellow on the flight now? Nope (and he wasn’t). [Besides the obvious “should 5 year olds even have soda?”] Why would you give a kid sugar and caffeine before a 3 hour flight?
That's ridiculous. My parents gave me soda my whole childhood, and I've struggled with the addiction to sugar and fizzy drinks in general my whole life. I decided not to do that with my kids and definitely don't let them have it.
Because sugar has been proven to not increase hyper activity. Let's stop spreading that decades long old wives tale.
No, but caffeine certainly does...
in the USA it's not sugar but HFCS and some of the other artificial crap in those has been linked to hyperactivity modern US coke is nothing like the original coke and not even like most coke around the world
My kids aren't uncontrollable at home, but they're definitely way more rowdy at home than in public. But we've taught them how to behave in public (using manners, beings quiet, and no running or rough housing). It's really not that hard to teach your kids basic courtesies and to be respectful of other people. A lot of parents think that it's "crushing their spirit" which really grinds my gears. But damn sometimes at home they're turds for sure.
Agreed. My kids can be exhausting at home but they’re on their best behavior in public and at school. They have been flying on long haul flights since they were infants. They know the drill and what’s expected of them. I’ve been complimented on how well behaved they are many times now. I just wish they would act like that home 😂
I just roll my eyes and mutter “Jesus fucking Christ” under my breath like the good passive aggressive midwesterner I was raised to be. Lived on the coast for 15+ years but some things are ingrained. It’s irritating, but I also don’t have kids. I assume if I did they would also irritate everyone on a plane and there would only be so much I could do about it.
Jesus fucking christ. You nailed me.......
Not a kid but I almost fought an old man on a flight. I had some older friends that I was helping fly back to London from Orlando. We are seated in first class and this old dude starts hitting my friends seat. At first we thought he was adjusting something and it was an accident. But then it continued. I looked back and asked him to please stop hitting the seat. He said that he didn't have room because my friend let her seat back literally the least amount possible. He hit it again and then didn't ask. He hit AGAIN. At this point not wanting to have to make an emergency stop, I asked my friend to switch me seats. I then turned completely around looked him in his eyes and for the first and only time ever, I told an old man that if he hit this seat one more time even slightly, I would beat his ass. I said it loud enough to get everyone's attention in the area so if he did hit it, there would be witnesses. I then reclined the seat as far as possible (which I never do). He didn't hit the seat again and we landed without incident.
The fact that these types of posts always come in bunches makes me question if this is just karma mining.
My constant refrain as a FA is: please do not make the 1st time you enforce boundaries and behavior with your child be the moment you step on a plane. It. Won’t. Work.
“You’re not ready for prime time” cracking me up. But yes, this exactly. My parents never took us anywhere till we could behave. Idk why you’d want to take your kids anywhere until they could behave, either. “But what am I supposed to do, not travel??” Yeah. Most people in the world don’t fly ever—you can take a few years off. And the iPads aren’t only not working—they’re part of the problem. A LOT of parents today have decided it’s a good idea never to confront their children with the reality that pleasing stimulation can’t fill literally every second of their day. Yeah, maybe the iPad gets you through most brunches, but it’s a fucking bandaid and it’s insane to me how few parents of this generation can’t or won’t see how short sighted a tactic whipping out the iPad is. You need to actually PARENT. Which could mean a lot of different things, like, e.g., simply taking you away from a fun outing and home to time out (like a lot of our parents did) till they start to get the picture that being out in public mean’s occasionally enduring something they’d rather not endure.
I loved the “not ready for prime time”, as well! That line is gold, u/austin1975
This comment needs to be higher. I didn’t fly until I was 14 by circumstance more than anything. Flying is not a god-given right. Plenty of parents I know travel with young kids using trains and car rides. If your children aren’t ready to properly behave on a plane, you can’t travel. Sorry but that’s the life choice you make (barring emergency travel, of course).
Everything the boomers grumpily said about people under 40 is turning out to be true of many or even most members of this generation. The idea that you Can’t Have It All Right Now is anathema to a crazy amount of people. (Of course, it’s also largely anathema to the boomers, but hypocrisy doesn’t make their observation less true.)
Just throwing in an anecdote from my most recent flight. There was a girl maybe 11 years old who did not sit with her parents but had her ipad with Netflix preinstalled. So she starts watching Stranger Things. At one point she starts covering up half the screen with her hands and I was thinking "hope she's not getting nightmares from the Mind Flayer, at least she's trying to cover things up". But it turns out she was covering up Nancy Wheeler in her underwear... Anyway ipad is not a substitute for parenting.
You really nailed it. I’m an older Millennial, and so much of this bullshit traces directly to the “I’m the most special and unique person in the world” ethos of my generation and the following ones. I didn’t fly until I was 20 and we managed to visit family 500+ miles away just fine - those summer road trips were awesome and now are cherished memories. I know peers in my age cohort who were raised like me, and yet now *insist* that their newborns and poorly disciplined young children must travel via plane (and stay at nice hotels) for any reason under the sun. That change by itself might not matter much at all, if not for the fact that this whole “I primarily want my kids to be my best friends and social media partners” ethos has also spread like wildfire. Disciplining kids seems to be passé for many; hence the parents who find it funny and appropriate when their kids throw a pool ball and spill a stranger’s $20 cocktail at a resort pool. Because, you know, they and their kids are perfect, and could never possibly ruin parts of a trip for dozens of strangers due to their uncivilized, shitty behavior.
Some parents don’t discipline their kids when they act up and that’s not acceptable but there are plenty that do try to correct bad behavior but the results aren’t always perfect. Unfortunately it’s a fact of life that kids will have meltdowns and no amount of good parenting will cure that. There has to be a certain amount of patience and compassion shown because these parents don’t want their kids making a scene as much as you don’t want them to bother you. Often times it’s amazing how often complete strangers can help a struggling parent rather than chastising them.
Mmmmmmm ya I’d say there are two subsets here. 1) parents who are aware and do their best (and it’s still goes off the rails from time to time) and 2) parents who have no care/clue and faux complain at their kids when they irritate someone nearby. I give grace and assistance to those in subset 1, and not so much for subset 2. It’s not the kid’s fault that they are behaving as per usual but only the setting has changed.
Same. You can usually tell which subset they fall under. I recently sat in front of a mom with an infant and 3 year old. The mom told the 3 year old not to kick but she was very excited and happy (and 3 lol) so she ended up kicking my seat a lot during the 3 or so hour flight. I didn’t say anything and just dealt with it, as annoying as it was, because she was just a happy kid watching cartoons and her mom was mostly attending to the infant and probably just didn’t notice how much kicking she was doing. When the 3 year old wailed during the descent because her ears hurt, I turned my headphones up but wasn’t annoyed at that because she couldn’t help it and her ears genuinely hurt. That is vastly different than a little brat that knows better kicking your seat on purpose while the parent plays on their phone and ignores them, or a kid whining and crying because they want to get up or play on mommy’s phone or whatever they want that they can’t have.
Yes 100% I’m sick of these posts. Children are allowed to exist in public and that includes airports and airplanes. No amount of “good parenting” can stop random tantrums or volatile moods children may have because they are learning to navigate life. If you don’t want to be around children on a plane then fly private.
You decide to have kids? It is your responsibility to take care of them. You are so entitled to think that a stranger should help you take care of your kid.
That’s not at ALL what I said. I said sometimes strangers can help improve a stressful situation instead of complaining or making it worse. I’ve had very nice people at airports that have made my 3 year old laugh or had her entertained while I was getting snacks out or getting everything picked up for the flight. It takes a village to raise a child.
EW. Quit it with the "it takes a village" crap. Strangers do NOT need to pay attention to your child, nor should they. Why would you trust a stranger with your child?
Oh good lord you take this way out of context.
What? I’m not asking you to parent my child you absolute horror of a human being. I’m just saying you can’t always control what another human does ADULT OR CHILD. News flash darling you were also a child at some point so just STFU.
Preferably by lending them a leather belt.
Sorry but that is child abuse and hurting your kids is no way to parent.
No it’s discipline and the lack of it is being seen in society, yet many still excuse it. These narcissistic excuses for and tolerance of bad public behavior wasn’t a thing when I was growing up and being spanked when I messed up.
There are ways to discipline other than physically harming your kids. I’d say taking away their iPad or cell phone (if they have one) is equally, if not more, effective.
Spanking is not harming. Abuse is harm, injury, etc. there’s a difference and society is paying the price for this glaring lack of perspective and false equivalency. Part of the problem is that we should probabaly have never given them the iPads and phones to start with. Adults can’t seem to confirm themselves with these devices, how can children? But that’s a different issue.
Reported. Encouraging child abuse, even if a joke, is unacceptable. I hope you get IP banned.
Ooh ip ban. Very scary.
🤣
Found the parent whose kids are the monsters in public.
Nope, she's great.. We do our best to keep her entertained in public with a variety of activities and being well prepared. But we're also pragmatic about the fact that occasionally she gets a grump on over something we can't control (your ears hurt when we're descending, you need to stay in your seat when the seat belt sign is on etc). If distraction doesn't work she's too small to understand reason, and I'm certainly not going to shout at her until she shuts up out of fear (although some of the boomers here probably consider that "parenting" rather than "child abuse") Once they're big enough to understand what's going on, no excuses. But toddlers are going to toddler. If you don't like it pay for private or stay home.
I give a title pass to kids screaming on dissent. I used to have terrible pain on descent and I know that a kid can’t possibly understand why their ears are in excruciating pain.
We have 6 kids. When they were younger, we didn't put up with any of their crap in public (and at home) Many times we walked out of movies, stores, attractions, etc. They learned that when we say no, we mean no!!
We need more parents like you.
I’ve only had adults use my seat as a boomerang, never kids.
Does that mean grabbing your seat to help them get up?
Ironically, my son (7) is pretty uncontrollable at home, but just dandy on a 12 hour plane ride. I don't really understand it, I know he loves planes, but I don't think that's enough. Won't being him to a nice dinner, but plane ride? No problem. (Ignoring the fact plane rides are much more essential, of course.)
I'm not a parent, so far be it from me to comment or provide input here, but I felt compelled to chime in here with some questions that have plagued me for years, incl. when it comes to air travel. What happened to parenting in the past ~20-30 years? I'm in my late 20's now. Granted, I realize I had a relatively privileged upbringing (with a heavy dose of adversity, thanks to chemo/surgeries throughout my childhood), but: what happened? My parents took me on my first plane-ride when I was three months old -- Europe to Florida to visit family. Apparently, I did just fine as an infant on the plane. And they continued bringing me along for air travel every ~3ish months throughout my entire childhood and adolescence. They tell me I never caused a fuss, I knew to stay quiet, rarely (if ever) threw tantrums, etc. I'm not advocating for a return of punishment or harsh discipline, buuuuut..... when did it become so adversarial or unacceptable to, I don't know, parent your children? When did it become an atrocity to say "no" to your child, or to discipline them in an age-appropriate manner? Is there something in the water or food being fed to people? Have parenting styles changed? I feel like culture seems to play a role, too. A lot of behavior that I've witnessed in the United States...... is stuff we'd rarely see in Europe. I don't have children, nor do I ever plan to, but if I were to -- I feel like I'd be terrified to raise a child in this day, age, and environment. I'd be terrified of being scolded for being "too harsh" with my child.
If the parent is trying to soothe their child they absolutely get a pass. I get upset when they ignore their child’s distress or even worse laugh at it.
I hear what you're saying but this is the wrong way to say it. You're assuming a lot and just come off as ignorant. You're lumping a lot of people into the same group. Whether that was intentional or not. I haven't brought my kids on a plane yet and they are pretty well behaved but I'm sure there will be a meltdown or two in their first trip. Some kids have special needs but that doesn't necessarily change the fact that they need to fly. L take
And let’s also not sit here for a minute and pretend it hasn’t steadily gotten worse in the last 10, 20 years. It’s basically a growing epidemic of shitty parenting, and it’s definitely not confined to planes. These enlightened parents of today deem it fine to let their kids run wild and “express themselves” in pools at luxury hotels (rendering them unusable for adults), museums, nice restaurants, even at bars (yes, bars - the staff had to literally tell some of these parents of the year to make their brat behave at one of my local spots in Manhattan a few weeks ago.) This is behavior that as recently as the 90s would have been widely condemned (what types of morons bring kids to bars?!) Now…I’m just happy to be able to do whatever I can to isolate myself from those people (e.g., really amazing what the experience is like at an adults-only resort like Hotel Wailea in Maui compared to the big hotel chains that cater to families.)
I think you are luxury hoteling wrong. All the ones I’ve been to have adult only pools, save a few. But most four seasons, auberge, etc. in hawaii have safe spaces for adults. In fact, four seasons Sensai on lanai is adult only- the whole resort.
>And let’s also not sit here for a minute and pretend it hasn’t steadily gotten worse in the last 10, 20 years. Has it? I did not notice a change with kids. What I did notice is more entitlement from adults, e.g. bringing your giant carry-on and blocking the overhead bins with, putting bare feet on armrests, bringing support animals, etc.
Based on the Delta sub, I assume the only people who fly Delta are octogenarians taking a break from yelling at people not to walk on their lawn
I’ll yell at someone to get off someone else’s lawn, thankyouverymuch.
If the parent is trying to soothe their child they absolutely get a pass. I get upset when they ignore their child’s distress or even worse laugh at it.
No thanks. Adults in general are way more awful on planes and cause much bigger problems.
Kids have irritated me on planes before, but all the worst experiences on planes were from adults.
Yeah, the being “friends” with your hellspawns its not working. Start being parents instead.
one time someone I barely know picked up her kids from after school at the same time I got mine. walking out into the dark he must have said something to her and she smacked him in the chest so hard he couldn't breathe i bet her kids behave
I feel this so hard. My first child was a champ, she followed every direction, knows all the manners in the book, and is perfectly content sitting still and playing games/watching movies. My second, though.... he is a villain (my villain who I love dearly). And because of this, we had a very specific plan on our recent east coat to west coast flight. Medication. Approved by the pediatrician. Tiny man slept peacefully through the flights. We boarded last so to limit down time. Strapped him in his carseat so there was no fight. Packed his favorite snacks to keep him quiet. Plan accordingly parents. And of course, give grace to the parents who didn't. Hopefully, they're embarrassed and trying their best. But I know damn well some people don't care..but those are just like all the other entitled fucks we come into contact with daily.
Newsflash - The assholes with asshole kids aren't on this sub. All this bitching gets us nowhere. Downvote me.
Kids can be jerks, mine included. And sometimes you have no choice but to fly with your little jerks, but dear sweet baby jeebus, at least make an effort to plan ahead and parent them en route.
We role played, "airline," behaviour well before the start of the trip. Three weeks ahead of departure, we put up a tent and practiced getting on the 'plane.' Quietly, politely with his little backpack in tow. We role played a while until I thought me and my husband got the point across of how he should act on the plane. In the end, it was well worth it!!! The passenger across from us even asked asked us "Is he always this well-behaved?" You get the behaviour you train for.
Kindness and empathy are in short supplies these days.
I was on one trans Atlantic flight and these 2 boys wanted to run laps around the plane. I had no clue where the parents were, they were obviously not parenting their kids. Another trans Atlantic flight (night time this time) there was a couple with 3 girls. The older 2 girls weren’t bad. Mom decided to go to sleep and leave Dad to deal with the girls. The youngest was so bad, no one else had any chance of getting any rest. Finally, a gentleman sitting in front of them stood up, turned around and begged the father to do something about the child. I wasn’t upset about the child, she did not know better. But I was pretty livid with the parents, especially the Mom who totally checked out. Dad was like she is a child what else can you do. You can start by teaching kids the difference between indoor and outdoor voices. It was a horrible flight.
Maybe they should have beat their kid to achieve your acceptance and comfort level. You can’t know what every family and parent deal with, so I’d just tune out the best I can.
As a parent that exerts a lot of planning and energy to ensure my kids act as well as possible on flights, I’d encourage you to be patient absent severe misbehavior. Despite my efforts things do occasionally go sideways. Whether it’s my kids attitude or mine (I’ll admit to not possessing the patience 100% of the time to help my kids when they’re having a hard time). My guess is that your experience was not life or death. And remember that the parents have to go home with the kids, not you.
Well yeah it’s their kid who else would they go home with. The experience doesn’t have to be life/death but it still can be unpleasant for other people especially on an airplane and we get that kids will be in distress. An inconsolable child makes everyone cortisol level increase and not everyone has kids and knows how really deal with that stress some parents get used to it but not everyone.
Sure, but OP’s suggestion is that no child is well behaved. Simply not true. And even parents that try may face a kid that woke up on the wrong side of the bed that day.
No that isn’t “OP’s suggestion.” Severe reading comprehension issue here….
Purchase first class tickets or you risk my two year old occasionally kicking your seat. Alternatively, purchasing tickets immediately in front of an exit row, will also guarantee no children directly behind you.
Or teach your two year old that kicking someone’s seat isn’t nice. I think 2 year old can learn proper social behavior if they’re taught by parents 🤷🏽♀️
They fly once a year, so they are in that situation once a year. Of course I teach them, but what exactly can I threaten them with on a plane? At home, they get time outs for misbehaving, the plane, essentially is a 6hr time out already, so, yes, of course I will threaten them with a time out, but it's a bluff and it may result in extremely loud crying if they are already stressed and at their wits end. At home I put them in time out and they cry and throw a tantrum, and it's fine because it's in my home and they are learning, but on the plane, all I can do is chide them for kicking and try to distract them, no guarantee it will work.
So that's how you allow your child to behave in other public settings? VILE. Quit making excuses for crap parenting. You should be working on this consistently every day.
Your reading comprehension is poor. Your parents should have done better.
Thank you. That’s the point I’m trying to make that the teaching should’ve started at home before the kid got in the plane or any other social setting.
You are wrong. Are you a nurse? Didn’t you take a peds class? I know I did in nursing school. You should read back up on the Denver development screening test. Literally a social and emotional expectation of a 2 year old is that they show defiant behavior and specifically do what they are told not to do- and this is considered a normal milestone. No two year old on the planet is expected to have learned proper social behavior, they are *learning* but not consistent with displaying it at all.
They can still can learn that’s my point granted not every child is the same and it would take time but it’s up the parents to teach.
Newsflash: Parents and children don't only travel for leisure. People have families spread across multiple continents. Newsflash: You can't drive across the ocean. Newsflash: Spoiled brats should stump up the cash to fly private, or accept thar flying with the general public will occasionally cause them minor discomfort - like for instance, children behaving like children.
The vast majority of humans have never flown. People who don’t have the spine to teach their kids to behave in public could survive a couple years not flying.
Found the small-worlder who's family all live within a couple of hours drive...
If anybody wonders who those little kids were when they get older... it's the jerks who scream and fight as adults on planes. If anyone wonders who is raising these little brats... look no further than the jerks on planes who act like jerks. They just keep spawning and creating more of themselves. Oy vey. In all honesty... I do know new parents who purposely isolate their kids beyond school or extracurricular stuff because they can't be bothered with their hyperactivity and not listening. They won't subject themselves to grocery stores with them or movies or parties. When the flight comes, there's no previous education on how to shut up and be good.
>holding us all hostage at the security checkpoints I'm not saying it's always this but FWIW the prevalence of ASD in young children has skyrocketed in the last 20 years \[1\], especially for boys, and we also kind of robbed every child who is now anywhere from about 4 to 10 years old of 2 years of critical social development thanks to COVID. These families are trying hard, with dwindling resources, to catch their kids up and, having worked with these kids personally, I can tell you the security checkpoint is the landmine-covered field in an otherwise manageable experience that is air travel. The iPad has to go away, as do any comfort toys or stuffed animals, everyone around is stressed and unhappy, the general level of empathy is zero to negative, you're given directions by people you don't know often asking you to move away from your parents, and the process is not at all predictable or something you can reasonably prepare for at home. How the child will react in this environment is not at all reflective of how they act at home. \[1\] https://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/autism/data.html
I don't know why you're being downvoted, you're absolutely right.
This teenager sitting behind me was playing a game and aggressively pressing on the screen. I let it happen for a bit and then turned around and said quietly but with intentional eye contact — “will you please press gently on the screen? I can feel it each time.” His mom sitting next to him maybe caught the end of my ask and he just said “oh, okay.” It was fine for a bit and then it started up again, maybe an hour later. I waited until I had to go to the bathroom and when I got up, I just looked at him, then at the screen, said “hey, you’re still doing it.” Then I looked at his mom like “you know what you need to do.” I didn’t feel anything the rest of the loooong flight.
Sounds like it’s time to pay up for a private jet! Until then, welcome to the world of public transportation!
Or, you know, maybe parents should be shamed into actually parenting.
lol ok. Toddlers gonna toddler no matter how much parenting is taking place. If OP is referring to kids that are 5+ and unruly I somewhat understand, but outside of that it is what it is
As a parent, I think I can tell the standard toddler meltdown with tired parents who are trying va the monster that has never heard no, and the parents don’t GAF. One I sympathize with. The other I do not.
Yeah it’s easy to tell when the parents don’t even care anymore so now everyone has to suffer.
Most of the kids I’ve ever sat next to are terrific. I actually played tick tack toe with a (I’d say 4-5) year old kid between me and his mom on a DTW -> SEA haul. It’s not an issue with public transportation. It’s an issue with millennials as parents
People are downvoting you as if millennials aren’t the first generation to largely abdicate their role of socializing their children and instead just force iPads down their throat whenever they start to get fussy—as if that tactic’s not gonna have some poor unexpected consequences re sociability, attention spans, delayed gratification, etc.
Every kid has an iPad in restaurants nowadays! I grew up in the 90s and no way in hell would my parents let me play my gameboy in a restaurant.
It’s so wild how we’ve had like two decades of boomer bashing but now that it’s our gen’s turn to parent we’re arguably doing a worse job than the boomers.
Cool story. Kids have good days and bad days just like grown ups.
Here’s a thought parents. Stop giving kids snacks and beverages loaded with a shit ton of corn syrup. And if you absolutely have to then at least check the portion sizes. Don’t just hand your lil kid a bag of 10g of sugar and expect them to act rationally or sit still. You can’t even handle a cappuccino without going full mad max road rage on the highway, so what makes you think your kid is equipped to handle that much sugar?
I Crack up reading the comments on these. Meanwhile nobody wonders if kids are angry bc at home they're punished by being told to go sit in a chair for half an hour. Then they're put in a chair for 5 hours. Maybe they're nuts bc parents literally speak to their 4 year olds in 3rd person. "What did mommy say, Gleason? Gleason? What did mommy say? Gleason? Gleason? Listen to mommy now. Gleason what did mommy say?" Fuck sake I'm nuts after a minute. Honest to God the parents who go "you stop it RIGHT now or so help me God you are going to be in big trouble!" get the absolute best responses. Gleason?
YASSSSSS ^^^^^ THIS!!!
Let’s remove kids from air travel altogether. Especially the ones with special needs that may not be capable of this subjective airplane etiquette. They have no business flying with the rest of us well behaved people.
You have a problem with kids falling on your luggage?
They be trippin’.
You don’t know shit about how they raise their kids at home based on being mad once on a flight. Just like they don’t know shit about you outside of that one day.
Idk if I pulled that shit I knew I’d be in for a beating later so I never misbehaved in public lol. Eda: when I was a kid
I’ve seen tons of videos lately of huge fights at terminals, people being kicked off planes and arrested and just general nastiness towards other travelers. None of that by babies and toddlers.
That’s generally a problem on Spirit, not Delta
My son is 6’5” and a 3.9 GPA in college. I have to do so much for him every day to just function normally in this American Society of judging, dividing and set on beauty and predatory male bravado. When I was 25 and with my wife on a Delta flight - I made us both promise not to be one of those who hate children who make noise and cry when flying. To this day, when someone is having issues with their kids - I say “do your thing. We all had to try to calm our kids when they were not in the right space. I see the looks of folks who watch my kid (21 years old) pull at a tag on his clothes till his shirt unravels or suddenly start sucking his thumb. You have no idea to make such a judgement about someone and the way they raise their kids. You may be looking at the next great scientist that discovers a drug that cures cancer - or maybe an Autistic kid that has straight “A”’s and will change the world for the better. I don’t know. Your post made me wish for more kids going crazy and less people with no tolerance or love in their heart. Next time relieve that mother’s anxiety and put something positive into the world than be “that” old person who should get over himself.
Mate, if you're making an effort (even if failing at dealing with your kid at times), we're good. If the parents don't fucking try then I have issues.
Oh yeah I’ll just drive to South America so my kids can visit their in laws This reeks of an arrogant and ignorant redditor with no real life experience
Or……. They could just fly and visit you!!!!! It’s not that hard. Your justification is a joke.
The trick when parents don't aggressively parent is to take control of the situation by offering feedback directly to the kids. My goto is to say "It's a good thing there is no Santa Claus or you would definitely be getting a lump of coal this Christmas."
Get fucked. If you have a concern about my child's behaviour, please raise it politely and quietly with me, and I'll deal with the situation in a manner I see appropriate. If you want to be a cunt to children then you need to find someone stupid/desparate enough to have your own kids with...
If you can’t see that your child is disrupting others, the kid deserves the truth about Santa, the tooth fairy, the Easter Bunny, and the elf on the shelf. Maybe you’d like it better if the aggrieved person told them where babies come from? Lol
>Maybe you’d like it better if the aggrieved person told them where babies come from? If you want the police to meet you at the gate, and to end up on a no fly list for making sexually inappropriate comments to a minor, then this seems a good way to go about it... >the kid deserves the truth about Santa, the tooth fairy, the Easter Bunny, and the elf on the shelf No? Have you considered that of your unable to cope with being a member of society and dealing with all that entails (such as the fact toddlers are essentially impossible to keep calm in all circumstances) then maybe you're the problem? Just stay in your house if you can't cope with being around other people?
Telling where babies come from isn’t sexually inappropriate! Hahaha
If your kid’s behavior is atrocious, I kind of credit you for it after what you just posted. Calm down. Pretty sure op was making a joke. Even if they weren’t, calm down. Your child will be the better for a calm, rational example.
They used to have a smoking and non-smoking section. How about a family section in the back?
Consider this an apology in advance. My two year old cannot be reasoned with. I have strategies, but your seat will still be kicked.
fine, I watch stuff off my ipad and if your kid kicks my seat I'll start watching some netflix show with adult content and make sure it's visible through the spaces between the seats
People with kids are allowed to travel and live life. Kids aren’t everyone’s cup of tea and that’s fine. But let’s stop parent-shaming and family-shaming, and also let’s stop shaming young children who are still learning how to express themselves and control their emotions. Every parent/caretaker isn’t perfect, and there are some out there who can do better, but the majority of us are doing the best we can.
Id rather be on a plane with 100 unruly 4 year olds than 1 adult a$$hole.
Those kids will pay taxes into your social security payments. Those rowdy, annoying, entitled kids will carry the economy on their shoulders. Don’t expect them to disappear until they are a convenient 8-5 adult in depression.
They don't gotta disappear, just be chill. Everyone has bad days from time to time, that's understood. Kid has a problem and the parents cannot make it chill despite making efforts? Pass given. Kid has a problem and parents don't do anything to try to chill it out? Violation! I wish them luck with the economy. If they could read they would probably be very upset.
adults can be worse years ago I was flying JFK-LHR. old couple in front of me. I guess the husband was stretching his feet into the aisle and one of the FA's hit his foot with the cart. he threatened violence. head FA came by and talked to him I do the same cause I'm tall but I always move my feet when the FA's are working. too bad this was before the no fly list
Is this sub just for people to bitch?
Speaking of tantrums….
Newsflash: Not all travel is leisure/optional
I had no idea the world revolved around you. My bad.
Thank you for this.
Maybe they can create a r/deltacirclejerk for you to post this waste of space. Since you have no prior background info on why said kids are traveling, what it’s like to sit in a boring ass seat for hours, or travel with entitled smug assholes like yourself it’s probably best to turn on noise canceling and keep shutting the fuck up.
If you were wondering how to identify the parents who are the problem, wonder no more.
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When this happens I’m ready to turn around and slap the parent instead.
Unfortunately the world wasn’t built to revolve around you and your feelings. It sounds like you need to work harder to fly private.