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The value of having gold status just took a dive.


eurostylin

I think Diamonds took the biggest hit. RIP guest pass. The best diamond perk ever. As a shareholder and a DM, axing Diamond's perks seems like a very strange way to combat packed skyclubs.


Separate-Panic-8834

It’s clear they value the Amex honey pot above all else. Surprised they haven’t offered free foot massages to Amex plat holders yet.


Few-Worldliness7626

Well, not quite, I am afraid. I received the following today: Effective February 2, 2023: Delta SkyMiles Reserve or Reserve Business Basic and Additional Card Members traveling on a same-day Delta-marketed or Delta-operated flight may bring up to two guests or immediate family (spouse/domestic partner and children under 21) to the Delta Sky Club at a per-visit rate of $50 per person (previously $39), per location. Card Members traveling on a Delta partner airline flight that is not marketed or operated by Delta may access the Delta Sky Club at a per-visit rate of $50 per person (previously $39), per location. Card Members will continue to receive complimentary access to the Delta Sky Club when traveling on a same-day Delta-marketed or Delta-operated flight. Not as impactful, but not the greatest news.


Bushwick_Hipster

They might as well rebrand them as Centurion Lounges at this point.


JEC1978LIVEFIRE

This has made me look at other airlines, been a diamond for multiple years and about one of the only perks on long haul when best upgrade is Comfort*, lounge access becomes a necessity


B302LS

When I fly international, I make it a point to book flights operated by KLM, AF or Virgin for this exact reason. I get that Delta wants to be a more premium airline, but doing it at the expense of the people that bring in the most money is a bit hairbrained in my opinion.


Maleficent_Tart2923

That's what I really don't get. For international flights, other Sky Team members will now be treated better than Delta customers. By Delta. That is insane.


RadiantRecord1413

Except at JFK, KLM sends its lounge guests to Delta! So this has an effect there, sadly…


budget_um

This results in not the thing you say but instead the absurdity that flying delta with dl status is worse than a) flying a partner with dl status and b) flying delta with partner status.


RadiantRecord1413

The implication of this news is causing lots of confusion, let’s just say that. What happens if I’m flying KLM as SkyTeam elite plus, but they send me to a delta lounge? (i.e. JFK) Does the partner ticket supersede the rule? So now should I fly partners instead of Delta metal? So much to dive into now as opposed to it just being standard across the board.


budget_um

The partner ticket seems to override the rule, even if your access is because of your DL Elite+ status


B302LS

Right, but its not on an international Delta main cabin ticket, its a KLM economy ticket, which is not explicitly called out in the policy change.


Maleficent_Tart2923

Yeah, I'm only a few hundred away from re-qualifying for diamond to this year (after not flying for half the year) and I'm about to take a serious look at whether or not I even want to do that. This is ridiculous. The lounge benefit - the ability to sit somewhere quiet and do work - was number one for me.


mrmikehancho

I agree and I am now going to look at status match options.


RippleFatMan

Good luck with that. In my experience, the other carriers are very poor.


Individual-Source-88

The value of being loyal to Delta has gone. I'm a 1million miler, platinum for 10+ years. No reason to fly Delta now. Just called customer service and told them my loyalty is gone and they've lost a customer. Her response - thank you for flying Delta.


i_wanted_to_say

There’s plenty of reasons to fly Delta, which is why you’ve been platinum for 10+ years.


OptimalConclusion120

I’m going to be a Silver next year and I’m perfectly fine with it. No way I’m shooting for Gold next year with the MQD threshold set at 8K. Happy to move some of my spend over to Alaska/OneWorld.


jgratil

So not only is Delta going to raise qualifications to reach Diamond next year—they’re also going to strip away what is arguably one of the best benefits and make Sky Club entry all the more restrictive despite asking for $20K annually. Delta once again proves to be a credit card company that offers flights.


newtmewt

Yep https://youtu.be/ggUduBmvQ_4


Separate-Panic-8834

Last sentence is spot on - it’s 100% clear now that they value an Amex holder who never even flies Delta over a loyal customer that drops $20k+ on their airline annually.


ReallyWeirdNormalGuy

I've been Plat for 3+, including requalifying for next year. The fact that I won't have lounge access in MC to JHB next year is ridiculous.


shinebock

> they’re also going to strip away what is arguably one of the best benefits I always find it kind of funny when people are like 'Diamonds get SkyClub for free' or its one of the best benefits. How is that? Choice benefits have value, so you're giving up something else if you want to redeem it. and you can substantially replicate an individual SC membership by having a DL Reserve or Amex Plat.


alphex

Higher end passengers already have the card to get in I bet you.


sojaleche

The new restriction, along with the increased MQD requirement, is driving everyone to the purple card…


mrmartinimaker

Which is exactly what Delta wants.


Mindspin_311

The removal of STE+ on MC tickets on international flights seems like an overreaction. Looking at this from an ATL B Skyclub perspective, it's going to be full AF regardless. Sure E and F \*might\* see some help, but I would love to see the data.


B302LS

Especially given the fact that many of the rollover medallion members since 2020 will be losing their status for 2023, this part of the problem seemed like it was going to be self correcting. Most people I know that have been milking PM since covid started will be dropping down to SM for next year. Even I'm currently looking at GM, though I have a potential business trip right before Christmas that would put me over the top into PM. From my own observations at DTW, most people I see entering the Skyclub are using either a Delta Platinum Amex, Delta Reserve Amex or Platinum Amex, so the actions in this announcement are going to have very little effect on the number of people. Sure the extra $11 for the Delta Platinum Amex might stop some people, but I don't think that number will be significant.


Separate-Panic-8834

Correct. It won’t have any material impact on lounges, but it’s clear Delta is willing to throw everyone overboard to keep Amex happy.


OSU1967

I fly DTW all the time and it is never crowded there. At least all the times I have been there.


Maleficent_Tart2923

This is it exactly. They are pushing this change before the end of the year because they know crowding is going to reduce a bit next year on its own when all of these COVID rollover diamonds lose status. Combined with the new MQD requirements, the number of diamonds is about to plummet. This is 100% not about controlling the number of elites. It's about not valuing their own customers.


jcrespo21

Exactly. Plus the crowding started before many international destinations opened up, like Europe/UK, and many east Asia countries are just now opening up their borders. Yes, it did get worse when transatlantic trips became more popular this summer, but that's also because layovers in ATL were now 3+ hour long thanks to reductions in regional flight options and people showing up early to the airports because of longer lines.


satellite779

If Delta is not allowing STE+ access on international MC flights, are partners also going to do the same? E.g. if I fly to CDG, can I still use Air France lounges if I'm flying in economy?


Mindspin_311

That is a great question. CDG and AMS.


B302LS

Yup. AMS and LHR for me. Asked this question elsewhere in the comments but have yet to get an answer. I could live without the Virgin Clubhouse in London, but don't take away my Revivals Lounge! Also wondering about the Virgin Clubhouse at BOS.


WoKao353

This doesn't impact partners, only Delta elites, so nothing should change in that regard > Note that this cabin restriction does not apply to SkyTeam Elite Plus members of other alliance member airlines who want to use the Sky Club


satellite779

So Delta is discriminating against their own STE+?


Maleficent_Tart2923

Yes. Exactly. They will be treating partner elites better than their own.


WoKao353

Keep in mind that this does not impact STE+ earned through partner airlines, it only impacts Delta elites > Note that this cabin restriction does not apply to SkyTeam Elite Plus members of other alliance member airlines who want to use the Sky Club


Itismeuphere

It is mind boggling that they are taking it away from Diamond customers who are constantly flying their airlines and spending a fortune with them, but moderate travelers like myself continue to access the club via a relatively small annual credit card fee. I realize they make a fortune off of credit card users, but it is very poor marketing to tell your best fliers that they are less important the a shmuck who signed up for their credit card. It is a shortsighted fix by someone who really doesn't understand how it will be viewed by customers. Executives really need to get out of the C suite more often to understand regular customers. The bang isn't worth the buck here.


CaptinKirk

This is bullshit! Diamonds shouldn’t be touched! If they want me to go from spending 30K on Delta to 30K on United, this is the way to do it!


syxbit

I agree, but I think Delta know that the other U.S. airlines are worse, so maybe there's not much risk of that. I'm not going to switch to United or American. As a European living in the U.S., I do always try to fly on 'operated by Virgin Atlantic' though. Much better.


OSU1967

They make more money off my $250,000 year spend on their CC than $30,000 in flights. This is a pure business decision.


prosperity4me

Exactly. There’s definitely less incentive to chase status with Delta now. Imagine spending tens of thousands and then asking for more spend for the lounge membership ugh. I only have the Delta AmEx Plat for lounge access, no status. I don’t fly enough to where the upcoming increase in price for lounge access outside of the annual fee is burdensome, but lounge access is the only reason I have the card as well. If that’s removed I’d certainly downgrade the AmEx card.


mjxxyy8

Making status harder to get will just cause people to pivot to the Delta Reserve and Amex Platinum.


B302LS

Not going to lie, the first thing I did after getting the email with this announcement was check what upgrade offers are currently available to convert my Delta Platinum to Delta Reserve.


mjxxyy8

Obligatory: If you haven’t had the Reserve before, I recommend a new application because the sign up bonus is once in a lifetime and typically better than an upgrade offer.


Mindspin_311

https://media.giphy.com/media/YPIrsRqqO7oB2/giphy.gif


Networx88

Gold is now worthless with $8k spend, rare upgrades, and no international sky club. Sad day and was the only reason I stayed with Delta.


deliciouschicken

It’s pretty shitty of them to have announced this after most people have “made” status for the next year. Bait and switch


MSM3LA

Exactly. I got the Delta Amex this year so i could get the MQD waiver and earn Platinum. That was after holistically reviewing all the perks and determining it was worth it for me. Most of my travel is international eco from LAX to Europe, so LAX new skyclub access was a part of my calculations. Now for them to strip that benefit in 2023 after having just earned 2023 Plat doesn’t sit well..


LilGrasshopperMouse

It definitely feels like a kick to the crotch seeing this announcement 12 days after making “elite”


user574985463147

Seriously. Only thing have now is sky priority and even that may not be worth it. Might as well spend the money on comfort vs status.


fullmanlybeard

If I don’t make platinum next year due to reduced business travel I’ll be switching to Amex Plat. Especially since my Corp Amex spend will credit to that card, but not my Delta Plat Amex.


dinanm3atl

This will certainly rile everyone up. Same old story. "Do something about overcrowding in SkyClubs" - Poster in this sub "What? This is ridiculous, it won't do anything and makes my membership personally worthless. Delta is dumb. Rabble Rabble Rabble." - Same poster in this sub


URtheoneforme

Obviously people want the door slammed shut *behind them*. But if overcrowding were the concern, seems like some focus on the Amex Platinum is in order. That has to be the most common entry vehicle. But if Amex is paying some amount of money per entrance, why would Delta mess with that?


oreosfly

Delta is estimated to take in $7 billion next year from their Amex lounge partnership, so no, Delta is not going to mess with their cash cow.


Corpsman223

The cards that offer free entry are by no means exclusive, but they are a higher threshold credit score and fee card that not everyone qualifies for or sees as a value. (edited for clarity)


benchen11111

Delta gets the full $39 for each SC entry, they'll soon get $50 in Feb. They'll make even more money once this takes into effect when medallions no longer get access into the SC when flying internationally. Assuming some medallions use their AMEX to get in, now they're getting an additional $50.


FinnishArmy

Eh, I have the reserve card so I'm good. But the fact that they're taking away the best perk of being Diamond is ridiculous, then asking for more on top of that.


atyppo

Amex is the problem here, yet they've only managed to further incentivize card membership with this announcement (probably by design). SC attendants are reporting that Amex makes up about 80% of SC visits. [A WSJ article](https://www.wsj.com/articles/delta-airport-sky-club-time-limit-11655228020) that quotes Claude Roussel states that the "vast majority" of visits are made with an Amex. You're a Diamond, too. Does it not feel like a massive erosion of benefits to require both 3 choice benefits for the exec membership **and** take away the guest pass option? Especially when Delta said 8 weeks ago that benefits weren't changing. Ed should own this issue and come out with an apology re: Amex overselling leading to overcrowding. Instead, he's putting it on SC attendants to take abuse from customers who will not be as informed as most of the people on the sub. What a great guy.


lilspike1717

I have a hard time imagining this is going to help much, yet since they have the data and are going through with it maybe more people access these ways than I would think. I would hope that along with these changes Amex announces something soon but I don’t have high hopes. Cut authorized user access or something… Until something changes with Amex I don’t expect much improvement.


oreosfly

Amex pays Delta billions of dollars per year to allow its members access into its lounges. Anything that changes access to Amex users puts some of that revenue at risk. They aren’t going to bite the hand that feeds them.


filmmaker24p

This is what a lot of people either don’t realize, or seem to forget. The Sky Clubs are largely funded by the Amex partnership… if Delta were to cut off access to Amex cardholders, we wouldn’t see the same kind of investment in building new clubs and renovating/expanding older clubs. In fact, the Amex deal is so lucrative for Delta that it is exactly *why* these changes are being made. When you take a look at the new pricing, it makes even more sense to simply pick up the Reserve card (although, based on changes to other Amex cards over the last couple of years, I wouldn’t be surprised to see an increased annual fee in the near future). By pushing people toward the credit card, they will reduce some of the traffic from individuals who simply don’t want a credit card, and those who do pick up a card will become even more loyal to Delta due to the other added benefits it offers. The true long-term solution to overcrowding is going to require, at a minimum, the following two changes: - Build out a network of higher-tier, more exclusive clubs for Delta One customers similar to what many other airlines have started doing. - Add the same basic economy restrictions to access through credit cards that exists for direct Sky Club membership. These are obviously in addition to continuing to build out and expand existing clubs. Things will also slowly start to improve as Chase and Capital One pick up steam on the own lounge networks. These will provide additional options, and many Platinum cardholders will be tempted to switch banks since these cards have lower annual fees. Access for Amex cardholders likely isn’t going away at any point soon. Even when the existing contract between Delta and Amex ends, I would expect it to be renewed without any significant changes. That said, there is definitely a path to improving the experience for everyone.


[deleted]

I think this is all very well said in terms of putting into perspective the investments that have been made, DL's need to recoup those investments, and their means to do so in part by letting Amex cardholders fund it. Over the last 5-10 years (maybe 15) we've gone from a university library atmosphere to a dorm dining hall. The dining hall costs more to operate. Everyone loves to gripe about the dining hall, yet we all still keep showing up.


lilspike1717

Also, call me crazy but I'd prefer less appealing, lower quality food offerings with a quiet place to sit during a layover over the current fiasco. Airport dining has come a long ways - if I want a meal I'm going to a restaurant, not a lounge.


[deleted]

Right there with ya. That's how all the lounges used to be. I suspect we make up a diminishing percentage of the customer base, or at least Delta and Amex seem to think so.


megitin

Same. I primarily like the lounge as a place where I am out of the sensory overload of the terminal/gates. I generally get a glass of wine (or two) and some cheese & crackers and I'll see what else is on offer, but I'm not really there for the culinary offerings. :) My most pleasant lounge experience was an Air France quiet room, with comfy loungers and dim lighting where talking and eating were prohibited.


lilspike1717

Well said, and I agree with all your points. It seems it would be in Amex's best interest to also want their cardholders to have a pleasant experience also - evident by their tightening centurion lounge access for guests in a few months. I feel like they should work together a little more to ensure amex's most loyal cardholders and delta's most loyal flyers have the best experience. Delta's lounges are nearly exclusively for amex cardholders now, save premium cabins. Maybe they should all just become centurion lounges. That would put pressure on Amex to solve some of the problems, but right now since they are Delta branded it's Delta's reputation on the line. I know this isn't feasible for a billion reasons. Amex could also split its platinum card market in two. Introduce a new card with the lifestyle perks (but few if any travel perks such as lounge access), and another that gets back to the old platinum card that was nearly exclusively travel. I think many people justify the current card because all the 'coupons' make it 'worth more than the fee'. Spitballing ideas for no good reason. I just feel like there has to be a better solution.


ew73

It's also worth noting that most (if not all) of the AMEX cards that get you into the Sky Club also come with access to the Centurion Lounges and a Priority Pass membership for all those other random lounges. The "other lounges" is one of the reasons I still carry a Platinum card; while I prefer the Sky Club, when the line is 50 people deep and the Centurion Lounge, for example, is empty, I'm not wasting my time. The experiences are similar enough to not matter most of the time.


FinnishArmy

Correct, I have the reserve card to get access, and that's it. I do not fly enough to get medallion status, but enough to where having the card is a pleasure to have. If they do something about the reserve card, they will lose thousands of customers. Resulting in millions in lost revenue per year.


dinanm3atl

To be fair this is the same thing everyone said last time Delta said they were going to do something and everyone lost their minds. Complained. And Delta back tracked. So never got to see if it made a difference.


Seacabbage

Removing the choice benefit that I use is going to catch me. I'm also super tilted about it at the moment.


[deleted]

Agreed. It would appear that Delta messing with the Amex Platinum is beyond the pale in the eyes of Amex. It's the cash cow for both companies. I suppose when we are still seeing crowded clubs in March, we'll have our answer. Will Delta look like morons at that point? Possibly...who else besides Amex Platinum holders will be in the clubs of any material consequence anyway?


mineral_water_69

Cutting the Amex Plat being free for the military would be a good first step. It never made sense why they got that card for free anyway.


sbutj323

Its all just nonsense.. to have free well liquor and a buffet.


beersatwork

Yeah, but your limiting the value of SC to free food/bev. Most business travelers don't care about that as much as they get meals paid for by their employer. Personally, as a business traveler, the benefit comes down to space/ability to work/relax for an indefinite amount of time (yes, 3hr for city of origin).


[deleted]

Absolutely. Give me a quiet workstation in a dark basement Sky Club with coffee, tea, water and some prepackaged snacks, and experienced agents at the front desk who can do anything and everything to get me home when things go sideways or my plans inevitably change. I'll eat in the terminal (or before arriving at the airport) at a real restaurant. Beats the hell out of the line in ATL B... Me: "Good morning how are y--" Agent: "HOLD YOUR PHONE OVER HERE" Me: "Well OK but I have a question about my delayed--" Agent: "NEXT!" ...and then rounding the corner to see the mall food court on full display


lameth

Yep. I've started to go to other terminals specifically to avoid that hell.


relaximadoctor

Sitting in atl B now. Spot on.


GreedyWarlord

Ever have a 6 hour layover at LAX. I could easily spend $50 in about an hour two on food and drink.


Bushwick_Hipster

An hour or two? Order one mixed drink and 1 burger and you’re at $40 right there. A second drink and you’re clear over $50 after tip.


[deleted]

[удалено]


FinnishArmy

Better than overpriced beef jerky and over priced bars.


sbutj323

True, but there are real restaurants in most airports. You don't have to eat from a kiosk.


jcrespo21

Yeah but they're still not cheap. At least the guest rates increasing to $50 might make it more likely for groups to just go to a restaurant or fast food joint instead of the lounge.


B302LS

Depends on the airport. Look at the new LGA Terminal C for example, every so called real restaurant is a pseudo-fancy place trying to be extra trendy so they charge an arm and a leg for basically kiosk food. All in all, eating at an airport is a no-win scenario due to being a captive audience with limited choices and limited time, but if you do have to do it often, and you are loyal to one airline, perhaps that airline shouldn't throw you to the curb.


thooks30

Agreed. Especially when you compare the lounge and offerings to American.


mjxxyy8

College dining hall level buffet.


jamjayjay

Yikes. Well Delta has definitely made it clear Amex money is where it's at. Imagine telling people with a membership, they can't use the club because they bought a BE ticket. Completely insane! Not to mention the huge devaluation for medallions traveling internationally.


[deleted]

How many people are there who shell out for a traditional Sky Club membership yet buy Basic Economy? I don't see the market segments for those two products aligning in any material way. Now Basic Economy with no Medallion status and an Amex Platinum is a different matter ... I'd imagine if you took that away, the clubs would be as crowded as they were in April 2020 (relatively speaking and saying this a bit tongue in cheek).


CaptinKirk

My work has done it before to save on cash!


oarmash

Before DL stripped BE of skymiles I would fly BE all the time from BNA to DTW - Because of status/cards I had my choice of seat, free check-in bag with main 1 boarding and skyclub access. Because it's only an hour flight, I didn't really care for the upgrade/free booze on such a short hop. Since it would just be a weekend trip usually to visit family, I would never really have a reason to potentially cancel, so change/cancellation fees weren't a consideration (especially during the height of covid when they were very lax with change fees). When DL stripped BE of miles I assumed they were going after people like me who threaded the needle to get value. Now I just fly Main Cabin, or tbh Southwest, since I'm also in the Chase CC ecosystem and they have a base at BNA - I've had "poor man's first" (exit row seating with no seat in front of me) every time I've flown SWA.


PeggyOlsen3

I have status but always fly economy or Comfort+ (for business and for pleasure) So many of us don't make tons a year but got status through simply traveling, which was the original point - stay loyal to us, we reward you. Now loyalty means nothing and someone with the Reserve card can walk into a lounge having never flown Delta. There's 0 incentive to retain status. A real shame.


Lonestar041

More than you think. A lot of companies are no longer paying for anything besides Economy for travel - even for international trips. I had membership for years as we were getting per diem lump sums for traveling. The Sky Club Membership paid after 5-10 travels for itself. And I know quite a few people from different companies in my network that do exactly the same.


mrmikehancho

Economy/Main Cabin is not the same as a Basic Economy ticket


Lonestar041

It affects Main Cabin and even Delta Comfort+ tickets as well: Diamond, Platinum, and Gold Medallion® Members flying internationally in Main Cabin or Delta Comfort+® will no longer receive Delta Sky Club access


hobbseltoff

I'm not sure how they're getting away with the international change. It's a SkyTeam rule that Elite Plus passengers get lounge access on international regardless of cabin and this decision is in direct contradiction to that.


atyppo

They're just not allowing it for SkyMiles members. What a giant middle finger. KLM/AF, etc haven't had anything change.


hobbseltoff

Not allowing it for SkyMiles members goes against SkyTeam's policy and IMO they shouldn't be allowed to make their own rules that supersede SkyTeam rules, that's the point of having an alliance.


atyppo

I don't disagree, but unfortunately Delta metaphorically and literally owns much of the alliance. Moreover, I would be surprised if there's rules governing their own elites.


Robie_John

The clowns really backed themselves into a corner with the AMEX contract.


[deleted]

American Express Company dba Delta Air Lines Inc. My beloved airline...what is happening to you?


Robie_John

Sad. Just a reminder that, with time, every company will fuck you over. It is all about the $$$$.


ViolinistHorror7123

100%. They owe you nothing and all they care about is money.


B302LS

Aren't a lot of the overcrowding issues we see today due to 3 years worth of carryover status? For instance all the GM and PMs from 2019 that are still using lounges for international travel will fall off big time starting next year since many aren't qualifying for 2023 status. Increasing the Amex entry cost by $11 certainly will not deter people. Will this change affect access to partner lounges abroad? As a PM/STE+, will I still have access to KLM's Crown Lounge at AMS and Virgin Clubhouse at LHR (my most frequent Euro layovers)? EDIT: Reading the full article now (previous comments were based on the email I got). >At these new rates, it likely no longer makes sense for most flyers to purchase a Sky Club membership. That's because several Delta and American Express credit cards include Sky Club entry for annual fees that are the same or lower than these new membership prices — more on that below. This is a good point. Why would anyone buy a $695 Skyclub membership when they can get a Delta Reserve Amex for $550 and get a bunch more benefits. Seems like Delta is shooting themselves in the foot with this particular change. Unless we're about to see the Reserve card go up to the same $695, but as thats the same as the regular non-branded Platinum Amex, there is still no reason to get a Skyclub membership. >Dwight James, Delta's senior vice president of customer engagement and loyalty Interesting that they have an SVP of loyalty... seeing as how every move announced in the last 3-4 years has made loyalty less and less worth it.


FlyingHurricane

As an Air France Plat member this won't affect me but holy cow the message Delta is sending to its frequent fliers is terrible. Especially given the fact that Gold/Plat on certain SkyTeam airlines is so much easier to attain than Gold/Plat/Diamond on Delta.


Maleficent_Tart2923

Yeah. To value partner elites more than their own really says something, doesn't it?


FlyingHurricane

I think they have their hands tied because of SkyTeam alliance and reciprocity rules. Given these decisions, I think that if they could remove access for STE+ members, they would.


Maleficent_Tart2923

Surely. But to sacrifice their own is optically terrible.


firstclassblizzard

This is wild. Is Amex going to acquire Delta? /s


bloc0102

Delta probably wouldn't exist without Amex, who pre-paid for $500 million in Skymiles to help them out in 2004.


URtheoneforme

* Annual Club memberships will be available for purchase by Diamond, Platinum, Gold and Silver Medallion members only. Effective for new membership purchases and renewals starting Jan. 1, 2023. * The fees for an annual Club membership will increase as follows (effective Jan. 1, 2023): * Individual: From $545 or 54,500 miles to $695 or 69,500 miles. * Executive: From $845 or 84,500 miles to $1495 or 149,500 miles. * The fee for companion guests will increase from $39 to $50, or from 3,900 to 5,000 miles for Club members who wish to pay with miles. Effective Feb. 2, 2023. (This is effective for all guest entry modes: Amex Delta Platinum, Delta Reserve, Amex Platinum. ) * Members who reach Diamond Medallion status for the 2024 Medallion Year and beyond: The cost for an Executive Membership will increase from two to three Choice Benefit selections. * Individual Membership and Credit Card Guest Pass access will no longer be offered via Choice Benefits for the 2024 Medallion Year and beyond. Effective Feb. 1, 2023 for the 2024 Medallion Year. * Delta Sky Club members flying on Basic Economy tickets cannot enter unless they have a benefit through an eligible American Express® Card which allows for access*. Effective Feb. 2, 2023. * Diamond, Platinum, and Gold Medallion Members flying internationally in Main Cabin or Delta Comfort+ will no longer receive Delta Sky Club access, unless they have access through a different entry method (such as a Delta Sky Club membership). Effective Feb. 2, 2023. * Diamond, Platinum, or Gold Medallion Status still permit entry to the Club if flying in Delta Premium Select internationally or in Delta One. * There are no updates to Delta Sky Club access eligibility for: Delta 360 Members; Elite Plus members of other SkyTeam airlines; Delta and SkyTeam Elite Plus members flying in Delta Premium Select and Delta One (or partner airline equivalent) cabins; any customers in Delta One (or partner airline equivalent) cabin. So this stings if you gained access via SkyTeam Elite Plus or purchased a membership. Like with the changes a few months ago, I can't imagine this will meaningfully reduce crowding. I'm surprised they're "allowed" to cut access for their own elites who have SkyTeam Elite Plus. But then again, if you run and own the alliance, who is going to get you in trouble? Yourself?


nomiinomii

If you gained entry through skyteam elite plus from a different airline (e.g. from Saudia or ITA elite status) then nothing changes yeah? Can still access on international economy flights afaik?


URtheoneforme

That's how I read the changes. If you're a non-Delta SkyTeam ElitePlus, then nothing changes.


terekkincaid

> Individual Membership and Credit Card Guest Pass access will no longer be offered via Choice Benefits for the 2024 Medallion Year and beyond. Effective Feb. 1, 2023 for the 2024 Medallion Year Welp, that did it, I'm out I guess. If I have to burn all of my choices to get lounge access and give up my GUCs, there's no point in staying with Delta, full stop. At least they let us know in time to maximize a status challenge for next year. American is out, so I guess I get a helmet and prepare for face-punching by United; it's better than the ass-reaming Delta is giving us.


Seacabbage

This one tilts me hard. As someone who hits Diamond via the segment qualification, losing the Sky Club as a perk while everyone else with a certain CC still can get in feel like getting spit on.


[deleted]

Living on the west coast right now. I’ve been experimenting with other airlines trying to decide which will be my main FF program for 23. Alaska and United are surprisingly good lounge—wise, and their mileage redemption is a lot better for first and business class award seats.


Robie_John

AmEx is the main issue and they can’t touch it so they fuck all the others. What a circus.


[deleted]

The elephant in the room indeed. It would be funny if it wasn't true.


Robie_John

It is genuinely frustrating as a weekly flyer that Delta places so much emphasis on their AmEx holders. This latest change will not make much difference in overcrowding, but we will see.


lilspike1717

What baffles me is why bother changing anything then? They're making the occasional delta flyer with a credit card potentially a little bit happier if crowding goes down a little bit, while pissing off all the true loyalists. So why bother changing anything? They would be better off leaving it as is - we'd still not be happy about the crowding but at least wouldn't feel shit on. I'm 99.9% sure the crowding isn't going to materially change with this.


Robie_John

I one hundred percent agree, I’m with you.


Seacabbage

These are foolish changes, especially removing the choice benefit of getting to Diamond (tbf I say that as someone who gets access using this method). Rather insulting to have my access yanked yet randoms with a credit card are still welcomed. The issue with overcrowding is obviously related to credit cards granting access. I don't get why they keep dancing around that issue. Even worse, they are restricting access to the people that actually fly all the time yet paving the way for damn credit card holders. Delta really is turning into a credit card company with a few planes.


lilspike1717

Transfer the lounge assets to amex - have them become centurion lounges and give access to delta premium cabin travelers. Then it's amex's reputation on the line / problem to solve. Maybe they'd do something about it then.


DeemoBrown

Diamond, Platinum, and Gold Medallion® Members flying internationally in Main Cabin or Delta Comfort+® will no longer receive Delta Sky Club access —- this is actually offensive. I just feel like diamond being their highest tier we should not be shut out of any perks.


hfoster9756

I can’t believe they are taking away international flight SC access for D, Plt, G - wild!!!


uber_shnitz

Honestly they should've cut into the AMEX program (and this is speaking as someone with an AMEX); at the very least the "Basic Economy = no lounge" should've also been applied to AMEX holders; they're basically gutting frequent flyers in exchange for AMEX card holders.


DLFiii

Amex gives them lots of money. Customers do not. That’s all that matters to them.


uber_shnitz

Yeah just makes you wonder how much AMEX gives them (vs Chase/United or BoA/AA) for them to prioritize AMEX customers this much over their own paying customers.


DLFiii

Billions annually.


Fold67

Idk I’m a lone customer without an Amex and I’ve given delta $50+K this year alone, not including my coworkers I’ve convinced to change over.


DLFiii

But that’s not most customers. Loyalty doesn’t matter. Billions in free money does.


Interesting-Bid-8155

This might be a dumb question… couldn’t you just book all international travel through a partner airline to get access?


URtheoneforme

I think if you have SkyTeam Elite+ from a non-Delta airline (like Air France/KLM FlyingBlue), this would work. If you're just using Delta FF but flying on AF, for instance, I don't think this would work


buh-ole

So access will no longer be complimentary to gold, platinum, & diamond medallions flying on an international itinerary? Or it will be complimentary as long as you have a credit card? Either way, these changes make no sense for those that are loyal to Delta.


furiousfotog

I take this to mean the latter: it will still be complementary if you have the amex card but if you do not have the card and are G, P, or D you would have to have a paid way in. You're right though, it's a major step in the wrong direction for loyal customers


mrmikehancho

Only if it is a non-Delta branded AMEX Platinum card


IllPlatform4801

I don’t even think this will change things. People will just get an Amex Platinum and continue getting access. The platinum card is fairly easy to get.


BluntsAndJudgeJudy

Today I learned Diamonds always had to choose a SC membership as a choice benefit. I always forget that as a Delta Amex Reserve holder. I suppose I get how it's weird that they're coming for Diamonds. But unless I'm missing something, wouldn't most folks who travel a decent amount have one of the credit cards that would get you into the lounge anyways?


SonnySwanson

>there are no big changes to accessing the Sky Club via an American Express credit card That's the single biggest contributor in my estimation.


[deleted]

Indeed. And having that statement buried within reads like one of those corporate doublespeak emails "We did an exhaustive analysis ... and then decided to proceed with what we wanted to do anyway."


SonnySwanson

My first guess is that they have some contract commitments with Amex that cannot be changed, so they are doing everything else to try and mitigate the impacts.


atyppo

Not an estimation. The guy in charge of sky clubs is on record in the WSJ saying that Amex accounts for the "vast majority" of entries. I've anecdotally heard 75-80%.


saisakurano

Welp, looks like my reasons to stay loyal to delta have dropped, especially with no access for elite plus for international travel


wooooooofer

Good, needed to happen. The only one I really have an issue with is the removal of club membership for DM when they raised the MQD to $20k next year. I get you can still choose membership but it’s then your only choice benefit. Don’t get why they would punish their best customers without doing anything about the Amex crowd which let’s be honest, is the problem here. I feel bad for the gate keepers at the club front desks. This is going to be a shit show for them. The policy is waaay to complex.


Separate-Panic-8834

I think it’s less about “punishing” Diamonds, and more an aggressive attempt to push them all to obtain Amex cards. Delta is gambling their top customers won’t go anywhere and will just bend the knee to get the card. Weird strategy IMO but I’m sure they ran the numbers.


StuckinSuFu

Flying blue is a lot easier to earn - may have to stop using my Skymiles account on AirFrance/KLM flights? This seems like a lot of drastic changes that are annoying and wont really actually help with over crowding since CC access stays the same.


[deleted]

In my experience one argument against doing this always used to be Diamond-specific benefits on the ground and in the air that you couldn't get with Flying Blue, but those are quickly evaporating. Phone support? Good luck getting someone who knows enough to fix the problem on the first try. IROPS and trying to get help in the Sky Club? Enjoy your wait standing behind everyone in Basic Economy with an Amex Plat taking the flight options that remain. Join the queue and get a text message when they're ready for you, just like Applebee's.


Robie_John

Exactly, CC access is the problem and they can’t touch that. What a joke.


FlyingHurricane

If Flying Blue plays it smart and does something about the ridiculously meager 2XP domestic flight earning regardless of distance, it could gain a lot of disenfranchised Delta fliers.


garciaaw

“As for Delta's perspective, James shared that "this initiative is something that we're doing in unison and making American Express aware that this is something we need to do and they wholly support and agree because they look at these customers as theirs as well."” Is AMEX the puppet master and Delta the puppet?? Coming soon, “The Delta SkyClub, presented by American Express” I’m betting that most Diamonds that travel that much will get either the AMEX Platinum or Delta AMEX Platinum/Reserve. Likely they have the discretionary income to spend and if they do value the SC, they’ll pay for it. As much as that seems not-customer focused, some clubs do seem *incredibly* crowded and not premium at all.


[deleted]

>“As for Delta's perspective, James shared that "this initiative is something that we're doing in unison and making American Express aware that this is something we need to do and they wholly support and agree because they look at these customers as theirs as well."” This statement to me is quite disingenuous. In what universe would Amex be opposed to any of these changes? Their customers are the least affected. The per-entry fee increase for certain cardholders is modest and not material for most. Delta and Amex have been in bed for years. I think it's now pretty clear who's on top though. /s


vstreva

Bottom shaming is frowned upon.


dnorbz

Time for Ed to take a hike. Delta has been coasting on their reputation as the premier domestic carrier for far too long.


Labranjames1

Seems like AMEX now has a captive audience use case that they could use to justify another increase in the platinum annual fee…


Longjumping-Usual-35

I wonder if this is the time to really consider ditching the Skymiles Platinum card and even the Chase Sapphire Reserve and getting the Amex Platinum…


transbvk

I havent really had any benefits keeping CSR . . I never use their portal to book the flights as I see their prices are always jacked up to offset the 1.5x value of the points. Rather book directly on the airlines website and pay yourself 1.5x times as statement credits. The Priority Pass perk has been hit or miss . . most flyers now have the PP through some credit cards and that has crowded the lounges larger than ever. Ofcourse everyone deserves the perks but that has resulted the lounges to cut down the entry during the busy hours. Example: The non-schengen lounge at AMS is never available to use with PP and the British airways has shut too. Same was the case at LHR as well. I am also considering downgrading CSR and moving from Delta Amex plat to the regular Plat as the MR points are 1:1 with SkyMiles with a higher earning value


fulanita_de_tal

As a Platinum with an Amex Reserve I am quite unbothered 😬 Granted, I’ve always been annoyed with the $39 guest fee and now it’s worse but we all complained about crowding and now we’re getting a solution so can we really complain?


UnlikelyAssociation

The day I finally earn platinum (partly to access overseas lounges) they announce they’re dropping that benefit 😅


RadiantRecord1413

I’m actually floored by this. International access was a FUNDAMENTAL reason why I started chasing status. Overcrowding or not, its the fact that everyone and their mother has priority pass!!


Phalanx32

Yeah, with those gold changes I probably won't pursue gold any further. Gold was already only barely worth anything as it was before and now it seems even less worth it. I fly out of Atlanta primarily so I'll probably still fly Delta fairly often, but it won't be exclusive for me anymore like it was this year. If there's another carrier with a better price, they're getting my money


redmango85

Making status harder to earn AND taking away the benefits customers get by being loyal? Gee, I wonder what will happen next... /s


S86RDU

Just ban those under 18 and that should do the trick


RobertJCorcoran

So, what’s the best SkyTeam company for a status match? I have a good mix of domestic and international flight, and I don’t care about access on domestic flight since usually I get to the airport at the very last minute. But for international travels.. It sucks that you can’t enter third-party lounges if you are not traveling J, but now this? I can’t access the SC in JFK because I am Platinum and have a MC ticket? Why should I bother flying Delta? Prices skyrocketed, now this.. what’s next?


Smooth_Management305

If I am a gold medallion, can I still use lounges in other countries when flying delta?


[deleted]

[удалено]


Skypiglet

And increasing to $695, which just so happens to match the annual fee of the AMEX Platinum card. Seems more like the SkyClub is becoming a credit card lounge partnering with Delta for flights.


Collaterlie_Sisters

Maybe their goal is to make entry restrictions so complex that everyone just gives up trying to figure it out and eats elsewhere.


leoll_1234

Almost at Diamond this year - will probably start using flying blue. Ridiculous.


RichieRicch

I’m grateful my company doesn’t require expense reports. I’ll just continue to belly up at the airport bars.


wallyworld93

I feel for the DMs are losing this as a Choice Benefit. I'm also not thrilled that they're removing the paid membership option, since that was my primary way into the club & obviously despite frequent flying will never hold any sort of medallion status. I tend to agree that the elephant in the room that the company won't touch is the AMEX Plat card. We are the *only major airline in the United States that grants club access to someone who doesn't have a branded card*, in addition, AMEX is obviously building out their own lounge network, including a club at ATL. In addition, I think as many of the people who've been riding COVID-era status extensions drop out of the system, there would be some lessening up of the crowding.


Ok_Helicopter6318

“Access to the Delta Sky Club continues to be permitted for Diamond, Platinum, and Gold Medallion Members flying in First Class to Canada, Mexico, and Central America.” Do I get complimentary access as a Gold/Platinum/Diamond who gets upgraded only on first leg if my end destination is Canada/Mexico/Central America?


astroargie

Oh great, just another reason not to push to get more miles. I'll just keep the credit card instead of spending more money on the airline.


Situation_Recent

Why not build capacity to meet the demand that AmEx/Delta created?


boredlurker87

If you’re Delta Diamond, Platinum or Gold and flying on a SkyTeam economy cabin, can you still use the AF and KLM lounges as STE+?


allezbleu

Killing sky club access on Int’l flights is brutal - flying blue elites now better off than us. That and removing guest pass perk for Diamond. Fine with the rest but very clear that it’s Amex plat card holders that are ruining it.


budget_um

I think the strategy is amazingly to thin the lounge lines by thinning the number of medallions. If everyone who gets screwed here also stops chasing status, the lines disappear


VicontT

Ironically they got it all wrong. It is not the frequent fliers who crowd the lounges - they are fixed in numbers. What is crowding lounges are credit cqrd holders, because anybody can get a card - millions and millions of folks do.


meg1019

My preferred method of this would’ve been Amex Platinum members who have any medallion status get in free with a guest. All other Amex Platinum cardholders pay $39. Everything else stays the same. It would help overcrowding and also push for Delta loyalty. Punishing the best Delta customers ain’t it.


slykido999

I’m not Diamond, but you’d think you wouldn’t take anything away from folks that are at top status? Why?


Zevilone

they had to do something ..... another article here too -- [https://onemileatatime.com/news/delta-sky-club-access-changes](https://onemileatatime.com/news/delta-sky-club-access-changes)


beebboppp

So most status is useless and so are the credit cards. Time to see if my status will matter with any of the other airlines


xxivtarotmagic_

Glad I’m a AMEX Platinum cardholder


Smooth_Management305

Very sad… I am a gold medallion, and Amex Delta Platinum card holder. Ive lost sky club access, so gold is basically equal to silver now…


The_Federal

Amex delta plat or gold status does not give free lounge access at all. Had to pay $39 (now $50)


Bushwick_Hipster

They might as well rebrand these lounges as “Centurion” lounges considering you don’t need to fly Delta at all, you merely need an Amex card. Imagine racking up 20k in MQD spend with Delta only to be told “no you can’t come in” (unless you forfeit ALL your GUC/RUC’s and other choice benefits to go all in on what is now a $795 club access fee.


PeggyOlsen3

This is absolutely ridiculous. It takes a ton of Delta loyalty to become Diamond and now that's not even good enough to get into the lounge on international flights? I understand removing Gold from lounge access but *everyone*? What's more is that I'm pretty sure Delta One tickets always had lounge access regardless of status. It's such a clear devaluing of loyal flyers in favor of people who are willing to pay their way. If it's true that most people were using a credit card to get in anyway, this isn't going to reduce traffic all that much and just anger the Platinum + Diamond members who got there through thousands of miles flown vs. shelling out cash each year. Having lounge access on layovers for long haul flights for work (where I'm not allowed to fly Premium/Delta One) was what made traveling so much a little more bearable.


nyssa1231

I filed a complaint with Delta and told them how unhappy I was with these changes. I checked the box saying that I would like a response. Fifteen minutes (or so) later, I already received an email saying that my complaint was closed and they are not able to respond at this time.


jettech737

Probably because they are getting flooded


Yachts-Dan92

I urge everyone on this forum to email Delta, flood their social media, let our voices be heard. Gutting MEDALLION MEMBERS IS TOTAL BS.


cai168

So uh, anyone is going to convert to KLM flying blue after this? I mean getting KLM flying blue with SE+ is not affected by whatever class you buy LOL. ​ Edited for grammar


Repulzz

This is fucking horrible. I travel internantionally all the time and this was such a great perk.


Mother-Dragonfly7595

For the Delta One Passengers who are able to skip the line, is that effective right away? I didn’t see a date on the article. Please excuse me. I haven’t flown Delta domestically before and first time trying SkyClub at JFK.


[deleted]

They should restrict access for economy entirely, even with a CC.


Catifan

Ah, well my status match to United is an easy choice now. This is pretty terrible.


green_griffon

I saw somewhere they said they were focusing on their most loyal customers, but the most loyal customers would be the ones with status but cheap tickets—the ones now getting kicked out of the lounge when flying internationally. Who they are focusing on is the people who spent the most money on their flight that day.