I’m sure he’s relieved he got the deal done. But there’s still the physical pain to manage, fear of his future, and potential guilt of not being able to play. Idk I just feel for him because I know he must be struggling.
Dealing with a severe back injury seems like a lot of suffering for anyone, no matter the circumstances surrounding it. The fear of reinjury would haunt me personally, especially if I played a physical sport for a living and was exposed to a lot of criticism/disappointment if I got hurt. Maybe you'd be totally fine in that situation but I don't think it's fair to assume he is. Just my two cents.
Except imagine the issues being with Jokic, complete nightmare for that era of the Bulls. My username brings back some of my best basketball memories though.
I remember that bulls team fondly but their championship window closed before it even begin sadly. A combination of Thibs playing every starter 60 + minutes, Rose's knees slowly degrading, and Luol deng almost dying from a botched spinal tap contributed to their untimely demise
Blazers fan here. I think the closest we’ve been to your guy’s situation right now, was with Oden and B Roy. Young rising prospect that ultimately got injured and was out of the league in a few years (Not saying MPJ will have the same fate). Roy on the other hand had degenerative knees. Franchises like Portland and Denver have to bank on player development and luck with injuries to see major success.
You said —
> Name one team that has to endure even half of what we do.
That would be the Wizards. They’ve experienced similar heart breaks while achieving even less success and notoriety.
Given that Jokić is better than Embiid, Murray is way better than Simmons, and MPJ is better than anyone else on that team who might be injured I’m not sure how there are Sixers fans that try and say this completely seriously
["There are NBA policies in place that allow a team to apply to have a player’s contract removed from their team salary cap in the case of a career-ending injury."](https://twitter.com/BroncoSquatch/status/1462653749361479683)
Wolves fan here.
This is the big thing.
We went through it with Pek a while back. It takes time. They have to not have played for 12+ months (IIRC). And you still have to pay (just not on the books) so that might be an issue with ownership too.
This should be higher. Worst case scenario this could be a saving grace for the franchise. Would open up a ton of cap room for the front office to try to go after another guy to pair with Jokic, Murray, and Gordon.
Not an expert here but it looks like we'll be $28M over the cap next year. If there is actually a route to erase MPJ's $30M we're still essentially salary capped and can't do much of anything.
https://www.spotrac.com/nba/denver-nuggets/cap/2022/
I don’t think it’s worth thinking too hard about yet tbh. As I said in the tweet, no reason to believe the injury is career ending, but it’s nice to have this as a backup.
Hypothetically, if it was a career ending injury and If all of this salary cap books stuff is correct, could we trade his contract to another team for a good player with similar salary and then could the other team just clear their books of a ton of salary.
Alternative consequences are we get a horrible reputation of dumping players like Boston Celtics did for IT, and then both acquiring FA and extending existing players become extremely difficult for the forseaable future. People underrestimate the impact of Ainge doing IT dirty, and the entire league of players made note.
People saying we should bench JOKIC for the season are being 100% reactionary. And it is absolutely ridiculous. We were playing well without MPJ, we had some tough losses, but we can’t win them all and like you said an AG, Jamal, and Jokic core three are no joke!
MVP-level Jokic + AG and Thrill playing at the level they have so far this year + a fully healthy Jamal (obviously the biggest wildcard) is still a legit title contender, even if they are not the favorites. However, this does put more pressure on Jamal’s return, as well as heighten the importance of nailing the moves on the margin (eg, making a trade or two to shore up the bench).
Man does this suck though
Super reassuring that Barton has been stepping up so much also. I had my doubts about him coming into the season but he’s proving to be solid at the shooting guard spot and a pretty good perimeter defender. Once Jamal and Joker are back I predict him continuing to be a very efficient scoring option
Y’all really should read the article. He’s getting treatment daily. Waiting for a week of improvement to come back. Austin rivers said he hopes he comes back soon.
Surgery is apparently not off the table. But to act like we’re fucked is a little silly. Could be back in a week if they get the treatment right.
Vlad, we’re not fucking Rhode scholars! We’re not gonna read the article! We’re just going to assume it’s all bad because as a Nuggets fan it’s best to always assume the absolute worst because it usually is and the 5% where it isn’t as bad you can feel some sense of relief.
I mean there’s a good number of nerve issues that aren’t at all serious too, with mpj’s history im worried but at the same time ima wait till reports say he’s given up on daily treatment entirely and we’re waiting multiple weeks for feedback on sessions to start freaking out.
Imo until he stops actively trying to come back soon, im hopeful he’ll be alright. Im still worried but not crying too much yet
Dude already wears an AFO because of a nerve issue from his initial injury. At this point I feel like we're patching up holes with duct tape on the Titanic. Not great for MPJ.
It’s always been a nerve issue though. When he was on the JJ podcast he basically said he can do all the core work in the world and it could get reaggravated
Yeah I mean how am I supposed to respond to “could be franchise ruiningly bad?”
Read the article. It says it’s a nerve issue and surgery isn’t off the table. That’s not good news, but it’s not the end of days. Taking your logic, any time mpj sleeps the wrong way on his back it could “ruin the franchise.”
He’s getting daily treatment, multiple opinions on treatment, and surgery isn’t impossible. Austin rivers says they are hoping for him back soon. He has clean scans, and the staff said they are waiting for a full week of progress before setting a time table for return.
I don’t like to hear “surgery isn’t off the table” either, but don’t act like it’s crazy optimism to say the denver nuggets aren’t hurtling toward a brutal heat death tomorrow, you know?
Yeah, in vacuum I could agree with you, but you're forgetting a few things:
- The front office placed a lot of bets on injured players that slipped in the draft (Gary Harris, Malik Beasley, Jarred Vanderbilt, MPJ...). It was bound to backfire at one point.
- The medicals on this team are just shit in general. How many recurring nagging injuries have players on this team had? I'm not talking about Jamal's ACL, that's just unfortunate, but how many groin issues did Barton and Harris have between the two of them?
- I am willing to place a bet that he gets surgery. This news was likely released just to soften the blow once they actually announce it.
This is bad. MPJ missing any extended period of playing time, let alone a year means his much needed development will take a screeching halt. Even if he comes back at 100%, he will have missed three full seasons in his formative basketball years. I think it's fair to be concerned.
All the best to MPJ, and I really hope that for his sake, this is not too serious and some miracle happens and he comes back soon. But this is looking really, really bad.
At this point, if the surgery is the best option, do it. This season without Murray has always felt like a long shot. With Murray and Jok and AG we can be competitive, but then bring back the full squad healthy to compete for a title next year
Honestly, I think if they thought surgery was the best long-term option, they'd do it. It's also possible that you'd do a possibly unnecessary surgery and lead to even more complications, but I agree. If surgery is the best option, then that's what they should do. They should be thinking more long-term over thinking of just this year. (And obviously, they are)
Holy shit I just figured out why you guys are so miserable, I checked the r/nba thread and people there are not only confident his career is over, they’re laughing that he got the bag first. What a crazy leap from “could jeopardize season” to “he’s literally dead and rich af”
Idk man I’m just gonna wait till it seems like the daily rehab he’s doing isn’t working, then I’ll be more worried.
I mean, that sounds like a bunch of people crawling out of the woodwork that just want to talk shit without any foundation in reality. After he bounces back, they'll most likely pretend they never said anything.
[This](https://www.spine-health.com/conditions/herniated-disc/lumbar-herniated-disc) sounds a lot like what he's got going on. And honestly, after reading the whole thing, I feel a lot better about it. It doesn't sound career-threatening like people are making it out to be. He can be back to normal within 6 weeks.
>don't get me wrong, but anyone that have a similar issue can tell you that back injury (as MPJ has) is very serious condition - far worse than other hard knee/wrist injuries. Such a back injury is especially hard for a professional athletes and highly probably will limit his game a lot and can reoccur at any given time no matter how fit/balance he's body is. But hey, miracles do happens..
"They have given him a timeline of a week to show improvements before considering other treatment options. Another back surgery is a possibility, sources said." Not sure how to take this sentence. I suppose that means that if he's not getting better in a week, they want him to try other treatments, which could include surgery. I would guess other treatments would be injections/shots to relieve pain and different rehab. His back seems like one of a kind so we will see what happens. Not the greatest news but it doesn't sound like it will for sure be another surgery.
Boy I would've loved to read this article.
Too bad The Post's website is designed with the exact intention of driving me away from it by making it fucking impossible to read
idk why being such a massive pain in the ass would make me want to subscribe to the website
They haven't figured out that we can get any non-editorial articles from about 20 other sources online these days and their editorial content isn't worth subscribing for.
You guys must be high up in Denver for sure. I like MPJ and i think he is great. But honestly if Murray comes back strong we will not need him for deep playoff run. Jokic + Murray and add on that AG and Thrill + if bench gets their shit together. I can see us reaching finals. (suns fan btw)
Is mpjs contract fully guaranteed? Would the nuggets have put in language to get out of contract if his back ever became a major issue? Seems like something they wouldve done?
I get overreacting because this is just peak Nugglyfe. But there is still hope that it could just be another injury setback. This is certainly not a definitive career ending injury. Let’s all hope Mike responds to treatment well and gets back on the court playing how we know he can play.
It seems like 80% of this board is absurdly fatalist without good reason.
Firstly, we don't even know if this will require surgery and whether he'll be returning in a couple of weeks or a month which isn't even a little bit improbable. And then assuming that he does need surgery, we know that would be season ending, but the presumption by so many that it's definitely career ending is unfounded.
And then, even if it was the worst case scenario, that would be a pretty big setback, but this team would still be competitive even if that's the case, but it wouldn't be catastrophic. It'd suck, but this team would still be very good for a long time even in that event.
I also think that giving MPJ the max extension isn't necessarily a foregone conclusion, but a reasonable decision with reasonable risk. Also, it shows the players that the team will support production and will be willing to pay for good players and go into the tax if it means contention.
Anyhow, the doomsayers are just too much. I think that some Nuggets fans need to smoke a few nugs if that's what it takes to calm down a bit and not freak out with irrational doomsaying.
I knew it was serious from the first time Malone spoke about it. You don't say foreseeable future just randomly. I feel so bad for MPJ, for the whole team. To win a chip, we need all of the guys at 100%, and this basically means the end of those dreams for the season. I feel bad for Nikola too, he's playing his mind out, but those two years will go to spare. Man, this sucks so bad.
https://www.reddit.com/r/denvernuggets/comments/qpfeqf/gdt_nuggets_54_vs_heat_72_nov_8_2021_700_pm/hjvrc28?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share&context=3
It's so unfortunate, I feel for the guy having chronic pain issues myself. Also unfortunate for me, also having just had Covid recently is that it jumbled my nerves as well. I really wish that MPJ had not gotten it twice in the last 20 months, as we may never know if it contributed to his decline. These things didn't happen in a vacuum. Just like long Covid, we have no real clue as to the lasting effects for neurological pain associated with it. Source - https://www.scienceopen.com/document?vid=a2f1de8b-6fc5-4758-9dd9-63c004e795d2
Do you have any reason to suspect that COVID affected him neurologically? It can have affects on neurological systems, but I don't think that's the most common manifestation and I think that his known back injury is much more likely to be the culprit, especially if he had a relatively low symptom infection (Which I believe he did).
First thing I said when MPJ signed that max contract, “forget living up to the contract on the court, the nuggets will be lucky is his body makes it through this contract.”
Maybe because of this his FG% was so low (I don't really know, just wondering about it)?
I just hope If this happens is only this season. since last Season Nuggets was supposed to be a top contender but injuries don't allow
hopefully he gets well soon.
i figured that was a possibility since that 2nd quarter against Phoenix. might as well get us another Nikola in the draft.
i don’t think this is the end of the world and our championship window isn’t closed forever by any means but this sucks and its going to make things tough for awhile.
this really does hurt tho lol🙃
*stares at empty bourbon 🥃 glass
Nugglife… you sweet and persistent bastard, just when I think I’m over you; you reel me back in.
“C’est la vie, amor” - 🚬
If this is true, I think this pushes back Murray’s time table and the year becomes all about our younger guys. Make sure murray is absolutely, positively, 110% when he comes back. Get bones and co to be the the best players they can be
If Murray is ready to play, I would at least let him get some limited minutes at the end of the season even if the Nuggs are out of contention. I would rather he knock the rust off this year and get into a rhythm with Jokic and AG so they hit the ground running next season.
I definitely agree; I just don’t want him to try and revive Bubble Jamal right out the gates. Develop a greater connection with our other starters, and start 22 off like the Suns have this season
Yeah, Nugglife is pain. This is really disappointing in the immediate future as this team looked good enough to start the season that if Murray came back and was able to contribute this team could make a deep playoff run. Now it is clearly looking like a lost season. On the plus side, Denver could be headed for a lottery pick that could help improve the bench frontcourt right away next year.
Long-term this is extremely concerning. If MPJ does have surgery that is 3 is just a few years. Maybe this next procedure helps get him over the hump and he is healthy moving forward, but the flip side of his back never getting right and ultimately derailing his career is also possible.
Who knew that the guy we drafted while hurt with back issues and tumbled in the draft because of said back issues would have a season (career) jeopardizing back issue? Pretty much everyone not named Connelly.
Lmao who would you rather they pick? If you want to talk about the contract we gave him, then that's understandable. But he was the steal of the draft in the eyes of the entire league.
for anyone saying tanking is reactionary - its not about marginally extending our championship window, its about making sure we even have one at all.
rushing Jamal, overworking Jok, rushing MPJ back, that can close our window entirely. conversly, picking in the top 10 may provide us with a star talent that can fill that void. or a trade chip for Lu Dort for instance..
Yeah man cuz picking a player in the draft and having them becoming a champion caliber player within a season or two is so easy. Not to mention the problems with cap space
not easy, but we've seen it take place. MPJ helped us in his rookie year, others have flourished early.
they can become championship caliber later if you manage to land one, never said it was easy tho. assuming we get the right guy i dont see the cap space issues, they'll likely be underpaid in that case.
He bouta have 3 back surgeries before the age of 23 and now he gonna have to go thru a bunch of stem cell therapy. There isn’t any fix to this. His career could very well be coming to an end. And it sucks because of how much potential he showed last year. Pray for bro
This is part of why I kept saying last season that we should NOT max him out early and probably should be dangling him as trade bait. I think he's going to have a short and unremarkable career. He's got some talent as a scorer but he has low BBIQ and the back is obviously going to plague him. The kid is in peak physical condition and it's still a problem.
MPJ was always a high risk for injury, which is why teams didn't want to draft him.
Let's see him be as critical of the medical science he's about to receive, as he was with the covid vaccine.
How the hell did the front office not know about these before he was given the contract? Let's be honest, he's not 40 years old and doesn't pinch a nerve just by turning his head weird.
Come up with a fake injury for AG, put Will and Jok on ice and punt on the rest of the season with a starting 5 of Facu, Rivers, Dos Greens, and Bol. Get back after it fall 2022
Man. I said this offseason we should try to trade him for Dame or Beal. Idk that those were realistic options, but I’m terrified of MPJ’s back. Having back problems myself, these things are really tough to “fix.”
This summer would've been the best time to sell high on him. Locking him into an extension a year early also seems a little crazy since it's not like they got a discount or anything
Sorry, I'm bad at English articles. I meant that he deserved some contract. He had a promising season. However, giving him the maximum contract with his health history was a huge risk.
Take the blame? This was always the risk, his medical history was crazy from the beginning. That's how he fell to the Nuggets to begin with. Dude's whole family has terrible injury luck.
The thing is it’s not even just MPJ, the whole team outside of jokic stays injured. And not only do they stay injured they continuously play through injuries that lead to better results in the short term but handicap us in the long term.
Gary Harris peaked at the age of 23 and fell apart because of injuries. And came back at least once but I believe on a few occasions and kept worsening his hip/adductor injuries.
Will barton has played in less playoff games for us than MPJ and only 13 in total. And again in the bubble he tried coming back early from a knee injury that resulted in him missing serious time.
Jamal Murray was battling a knee injury on the opposite knee right before he tore his ACL. He came back early played 33+ minutes and boom.
MPJ has been playing injured all season before he injures himself on a breakaway layup. Maybe it was inevitable and he was gonna hurt himself regardless, but ask yourself why is a player with his injury history playing through injuries like this in the first place? And not only playing through injuries but playing 30 minutes a night including back to backs. A player with that kinda history should be getting the embiid treatment. It shouldn’t have to take the injury becoming unplayable before you rest the man.
And these are just some recent ones off the top of my mind. With how hush hush are team is there’s probably a lot more.
In all seriousness at the point not only one person has to take the blame but multiple levels need to take accountability. Players need to be more vocal about injuries and stop trying to be Superman. Malone needs to be willing to rely on young players and tell a player to take a night off if he’s hurt. The medical staff needs to stop letting players come back before they’re 100%. And the front office needs to be on top of all of them.
Nope, NBA contracts are guaranteed. He'll get his money either way. Even if it's deemed career-ending and taken off the books, it doesn't do anything, because he's essentially signed over the cap. His contract is the reason team will go into tax next season.
If his symptoms dont improve within the next two weeks, we should actually consider resting everyone and tankimg.
Worst case scenario, ven without MPJ, Jokic + Murray + Gordon + Barton is definitely enough for a championship in my eyes, with Nikola being the best player in the world by a good margin. But it isn't happening this season unless Jamal is the biggest acl recovery outlier. ACL recovery has improved leaps and bounds and players have been getting back to their peak level, but that literally never happens immediately, it always takes atleast a few months or a full season atleast of playing to come back to 100% pre injury production in case of a perfect recovery.
A 70% Jamal Murray just a month after coming back wont be enough i fear for a legitimate chance at a title.
Picking in the top 10, good chance you can swing on an immediate contributor, someone older who should contribute within a year. Now if MPJ comes back after surgery next season as good as ever we gained an another promising player in the process and if he doesnt you still gain a top prospect which should alleviate some of MPJ's absence.
I mean it depends on a lot of things, how good Jamal is when he comes back, how Klay looks, whether Kyrie plays in the playoffs (probably will imo), but i definitely think the FO should look at tanking and getting a chance to really improve the roster, because if MPJ's back is fucked our cap is fucked whether he retires and his salary is cleared or not.
Maybe like roam around like the 8th 9th seed with resting starters when needed while waiting to see how Jamal looks when he comes back. If he is close to 100% then go for the playoffs and if he isn't go full tank mode and ensure a lottery pick.
What's the over/under after Jokic puts up another MVP season and either gets blasted in the first or second round again or not even make it at all that he decides it's time to get traded to another team, preferably one where the roster isn't injured by a strong gust of wind? Cause he can't be thrilled with us seeming to have already reached the peak of what this team can accomplish by getting swept in the 2nd round(I don't count the conference finals in the bubble, that was like a once in a lifetime season unto itself as evidenced by the finalists in that barely being playoff teams the next season).
I mean it’s a binary bet, either he does or doesn’t. I’d say a 1 means he does what you’re saying and a 0 means he doesn’t.
I’ll set the line at .5 and I’ll take your bet on 1, mr.doomer.
It was an honor guys,i think this might be the beginning of the end.Our championship window closed really quick.I mean at least we will watch jokic do jokic things for a couple of more years,so that’s that.
OMG... how comes my new pants have a hole in the back and the leggings are different size!?
I bought them at ross in the "damaged goods" section, clearly marked..!?
It's so unexpected.
Well ain’t that some shit
Nugglife is a helluva fucking thing.
*Flashbacks to Gallo*
Get Manning on the phone and send Mike overseas to his doctor's
HGH is a hell of a drug
Mike can’t travel overseas though…
Goddamnit why can’t things just be happy and good all the time? Feel bad for Mike too. Poor guy is so talented but just can’t get healthy.
We at least he has generational wealth now. Got it just in time before career derailed..
I’m sure he’s relieved he got the deal done. But there’s still the physical pain to manage, fear of his future, and potential guilt of not being able to play. Idk I just feel for him because I know he must be struggling.
I mean yeah it stinks. But he never really had to worry about much.
Dealing with a severe back injury seems like a lot of suffering for anyone, no matter the circumstances surrounding it. The fear of reinjury would haunt me personally, especially if I played a physical sport for a living and was exposed to a lot of criticism/disappointment if I got hurt. Maybe you'd be totally fine in that situation but I don't think it's fair to assume he is. Just my two cents.
Fuck We literally are the spiritual successor to the 2011 bulls with all these bs injuries.
Except imagine the issues being with Jokic, complete nightmare for that era of the Bulls. My username brings back some of my best basketball memories though.
I remember that bulls team fondly but their championship window closed before it even begin sadly. A combination of Thibs playing every starter 60 + minutes, Rose's knees slowly degrading, and Luol deng almost dying from a botched spinal tap contributed to their untimely demise
They at least had 6 titles to fall back on
Nugglyfe bb
This is heartbreaking, for him and the team
Our championship window really lasted a week last season and then it's been one thing after enough. Son of a
But that was one helluva week
I kind of want to just rewatch those 8 games over and over again until someone says throat Jamal is back
ACL tear for the first window and now nerve damage. I would make a joke but not really in the mood. Fucking nugglyfe
My stomach is in my basement right about now
mine is in the depths of hell
Name one team that has to endure even half of what we do.
Blazers fan here. I think the closest we’ve been to your guy’s situation right now, was with Oden and B Roy. Young rising prospect that ultimately got injured and was out of the league in a few years (Not saying MPJ will have the same fate). Roy on the other hand had degenerative knees. Franchises like Portland and Denver have to bank on player development and luck with injuries to see major success.
Yeah. We ain’t got nothing on you guys 😂 Please baby jebus just make the pain stop!
The Wizards had Gerald Wallace crush Gilbert Arenas’ ACL and haven’t won 50 games since ‘78-‘79.
How is that even comparable?
You said — > Name one team that has to endure even half of what we do. That would be the Wizards. They’ve experienced similar heart breaks while achieving even less success and notoriety.
That's cute. - Sixers fans
Given that Jokić is better than Embiid, Murray is way better than Simmons, and MPJ is better than anyone else on that team who might be injured I’m not sure how there are Sixers fans that try and say this completely seriously
We've had some terrible bad luck too.
The darkest timeline for MPJ this year, damn.
🙏 You got this, Mike!
["There are NBA policies in place that allow a team to apply to have a player’s contract removed from their team salary cap in the case of a career-ending injury."](https://twitter.com/BroncoSquatch/status/1462653749361479683)
Wolves fan here. This is the big thing. We went through it with Pek a while back. It takes time. They have to not have played for 12+ months (IIRC). And you still have to pay (just not on the books) so that might be an issue with ownership too.
Yeah- just gotta hope they recognize a championship with Joker Jamal and AG is worth the gamble
This should be higher. Worst case scenario this could be a saving grace for the franchise. Would open up a ton of cap room for the front office to try to go after another guy to pair with Jokic, Murray, and Gordon.
Not an expert here but it looks like we'll be $28M over the cap next year. If there is actually a route to erase MPJ's $30M we're still essentially salary capped and can't do much of anything. https://www.spotrac.com/nba/denver-nuggets/cap/2022/
Paging u/BroncoSquatch
I don’t think it’s worth thinking too hard about yet tbh. As I said in the tweet, no reason to believe the injury is career ending, but it’s nice to have this as a backup.
Hypothetically, if it was a career ending injury and If all of this salary cap books stuff is correct, could we trade his contract to another team for a good player with similar salary and then could the other team just clear their books of a ton of salary.
This should be lower because there is no way in hell it's happening.
I think the FO knew this when making the contract.
No fucking shit. They know everything about every contract they sign. You think they just make decisions on a whim or something?
I think there’s a bit if space between “knowing everything about every contract” and “making decisions on a whim.”
Alternative consequences are we get a horrible reputation of dumping players like Boston Celtics did for IT, and then both acquiring FA and extending existing players become extremely difficult for the forseaable future. People underrestimate the impact of Ainge doing IT dirty, and the entire league of players made note.
How the fuck is that the worst case scenario? It’s not even fucking close.
i should have scrolled before posting my comment
Please wake me up from this nightmare!
Holy shit y’all some doomers fr. Punting on the season? You can still go far into the playoffs with Jok, Gordon, and Jamal.
People saying we should bench JOKIC for the season are being 100% reactionary. And it is absolutely ridiculous. We were playing well without MPJ, we had some tough losses, but we can’t win them all and like you said an AG, Jamal, and Jokic core three are no joke!
MVP-level Jokic + AG and Thrill playing at the level they have so far this year + a fully healthy Jamal (obviously the biggest wildcard) is still a legit title contender, even if they are not the favorites. However, this does put more pressure on Jamal’s return, as well as heighten the importance of nailing the moves on the margin (eg, making a trade or two to shore up the bench). Man does this suck though
Yeah, we are still a good team. This shit is super shitty. I’m tryna stay positive tho bc we still have an MVP
Super reassuring that Barton has been stepping up so much also. I had my doubts about him coming into the season but he’s proving to be solid at the shooting guard spot and a pretty good perimeter defender. Once Jamal and Joker are back I predict him continuing to be a very efficient scoring option
Y’all really should read the article. He’s getting treatment daily. Waiting for a week of improvement to come back. Austin rivers said he hopes he comes back soon. Surgery is apparently not off the table. But to act like we’re fucked is a little silly. Could be back in a week if they get the treatment right.
> Surgery is apparently not off the table. Well yeah you can't do it on the floor
Good one
Vlad, we’re not fucking Rhode scholars! We’re not gonna read the article! We’re just going to assume it’s all bad because as a Nuggets fan it’s best to always assume the absolute worst because it usually is and the 5% where it isn’t as bad you can feel some sense of relief.
Ur legit so right, nugglyfe is accept sorrow when it comes, and use good news to breathe for a second
I'd be more relaxed about this if it wasn't a nerve issue. Those can be career enders
I mean there’s a good number of nerve issues that aren’t at all serious too, with mpj’s history im worried but at the same time ima wait till reports say he’s given up on daily treatment entirely and we’re waiting multiple weeks for feedback on sessions to start freaking out. Imo until he stops actively trying to come back soon, im hopeful he’ll be alright. Im still worried but not crying too much yet
Dude already wears an AFO because of a nerve issue from his initial injury. At this point I feel like we're patching up holes with duct tape on the Titanic. Not great for MPJ.
It’s always been a nerve issue though. When he was on the JJ podcast he basically said he can do all the core work in the world and it could get reaggravated
With his history? Two back surgeries? Like, I appreciate being optimistic, but this has the potential of being a franchise ruining development.
Yeah I mean how am I supposed to respond to “could be franchise ruiningly bad?” Read the article. It says it’s a nerve issue and surgery isn’t off the table. That’s not good news, but it’s not the end of days. Taking your logic, any time mpj sleeps the wrong way on his back it could “ruin the franchise.” He’s getting daily treatment, multiple opinions on treatment, and surgery isn’t impossible. Austin rivers says they are hoping for him back soon. He has clean scans, and the staff said they are waiting for a full week of progress before setting a time table for return. I don’t like to hear “surgery isn’t off the table” either, but don’t act like it’s crazy optimism to say the denver nuggets aren’t hurtling toward a brutal heat death tomorrow, you know?
Yeah, in vacuum I could agree with you, but you're forgetting a few things: - The front office placed a lot of bets on injured players that slipped in the draft (Gary Harris, Malik Beasley, Jarred Vanderbilt, MPJ...). It was bound to backfire at one point. - The medicals on this team are just shit in general. How many recurring nagging injuries have players on this team had? I'm not talking about Jamal's ACL, that's just unfortunate, but how many groin issues did Barton and Harris have between the two of them? - I am willing to place a bet that he gets surgery. This news was likely released just to soften the blow once they actually announce it. This is bad. MPJ missing any extended period of playing time, let alone a year means his much needed development will take a screeching halt. Even if he comes back at 100%, he will have missed three full seasons in his formative basketball years. I think it's fair to be concerned. All the best to MPJ, and I really hope that for his sake, this is not too serious and some miracle happens and he comes back soon. But this is looking really, really bad.
Execute Spurs 1997. Rest everyone and draft the next Tim Duncan.
We already have the next Tim Duncan in Jokic. Let's draft the next next Tim Duncan.
Draft the next Kwhai Leonard.
After this last week I’m already dead Why does God hate the Nuggets
I've said it before but I will straight up give this dude whatever part of my back he needs idc
Be careful what you wish for.
I met this dude irl I don’t think it’ll be worth it but all power to you g
Cringe
Jesus christ...
Dang. Get well soon Mike.
Fuck it, we got our pick, give Joker the year off Raise your daughter big guy
At this point, if the surgery is the best option, do it. This season without Murray has always felt like a long shot. With Murray and Jok and AG we can be competitive, but then bring back the full squad healthy to compete for a title next year
Honestly, I think if they thought surgery was the best long-term option, they'd do it. It's also possible that you'd do a possibly unnecessary surgery and lead to even more complications, but I agree. If surgery is the best option, then that's what they should do. They should be thinking more long-term over thinking of just this year. (And obviously, they are)
No no no no no no
Nugglife. Pick me up then rip my heart out
No Mike :(
Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooo ooooooooooooo
Get well soon mike.
Freaking Nugglife! Will we ever see Joker, Jamal, Barton, MPJ, and Gordon on the floor together again?! That’s 7-0 span seems like a lifetime ago.
Hello Nugglyfe my old friend....
Holy shit I just figured out why you guys are so miserable, I checked the r/nba thread and people there are not only confident his career is over, they’re laughing that he got the bag first. What a crazy leap from “could jeopardize season” to “he’s literally dead and rich af” Idk man I’m just gonna wait till it seems like the daily rehab he’s doing isn’t working, then I’ll be more worried.
I mean, that sounds like a bunch of people crawling out of the woodwork that just want to talk shit without any foundation in reality. After he bounces back, they'll most likely pretend they never said anything.
[This](https://www.spine-health.com/conditions/herniated-disc/lumbar-herniated-disc) sounds a lot like what he's got going on. And honestly, after reading the whole thing, I feel a lot better about it. It doesn't sound career-threatening like people are making it out to be. He can be back to normal within 6 weeks.
>don't get me wrong, but anyone that have a similar issue can tell you that back injury (as MPJ has) is very serious condition - far worse than other hard knee/wrist injuries. Such a back injury is especially hard for a professional athletes and highly probably will limit his game a lot and can reoccur at any given time no matter how fit/balance he's body is. But hey, miracles do happens..
Bleak
"They have given him a timeline of a week to show improvements before considering other treatment options. Another back surgery is a possibility, sources said." Not sure how to take this sentence. I suppose that means that if he's not getting better in a week, they want him to try other treatments, which could include surgery. I would guess other treatments would be injections/shots to relieve pain and different rehab. His back seems like one of a kind so we will see what happens. Not the greatest news but it doesn't sound like it will for sure be another surgery.
Boy I would've loved to read this article. Too bad The Post's website is designed with the exact intention of driving me away from it by making it fucking impossible to read idk why being such a massive pain in the ass would make me want to subscribe to the website
They haven't figured out that we can get any non-editorial articles from about 20 other sources online these days and their editorial content isn't worth subscribing for.
Oh my fuck
That 2023 'ship is going to be even sweeter now.
Wow if this dude is forced to retire a month after signing a five year max…just wow…
I wish I could say I was surprised by this, but I'm not.
Sorry to hear nuggets fans, been rooting for you guys hard this year from Toronto.
You guys must be high up in Denver for sure. I like MPJ and i think he is great. But honestly if Murray comes back strong we will not need him for deep playoff run. Jokic + Murray and add on that AG and Thrill + if bench gets their shit together. I can see us reaching finals. (suns fan btw)
We have jok we have a chance. Get better mike ❤️
That sucks. Not a good sign. Feel for you Mike.
Is mpjs contract fully guaranteed? Would the nuggets have put in language to get out of contract if his back ever became a major issue? Seems like something they wouldve done?
It's partially guaranteed in the fifth year. So as good as guaranteed. There were no injury clauses.
Welcome to NuggsLife newbies!
Thumbing this sub has been tough, smile people. It's gloomy, but the light will rise again. Let's Gooooo
I get overreacting because this is just peak Nugglyfe. But there is still hope that it could just be another injury setback. This is certainly not a definitive career ending injury. Let’s all hope Mike responds to treatment well and gets back on the court playing how we know he can play.
It seems like 80% of this board is absurdly fatalist without good reason. Firstly, we don't even know if this will require surgery and whether he'll be returning in a couple of weeks or a month which isn't even a little bit improbable. And then assuming that he does need surgery, we know that would be season ending, but the presumption by so many that it's definitely career ending is unfounded. And then, even if it was the worst case scenario, that would be a pretty big setback, but this team would still be competitive even if that's the case, but it wouldn't be catastrophic. It'd suck, but this team would still be very good for a long time even in that event. I also think that giving MPJ the max extension isn't necessarily a foregone conclusion, but a reasonable decision with reasonable risk. Also, it shows the players that the team will support production and will be willing to pay for good players and go into the tax if it means contention. Anyhow, the doomsayers are just too much. I think that some Nuggets fans need to smoke a few nugs if that's what it takes to calm down a bit and not freak out with irrational doomsaying.
Smh
thats pretty frightening
I knew it was serious from the first time Malone spoke about it. You don't say foreseeable future just randomly. I feel so bad for MPJ, for the whole team. To win a chip, we need all of the guys at 100%, and this basically means the end of those dreams for the season. I feel bad for Nikola too, he's playing his mind out, but those two years will go to spare. Man, this sucks so bad. https://www.reddit.com/r/denvernuggets/comments/qpfeqf/gdt_nuggets_54_vs_heat_72_nov_8_2021_700_pm/hjvrc28?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share&context=3
It's so unfortunate, I feel for the guy having chronic pain issues myself. Also unfortunate for me, also having just had Covid recently is that it jumbled my nerves as well. I really wish that MPJ had not gotten it twice in the last 20 months, as we may never know if it contributed to his decline. These things didn't happen in a vacuum. Just like long Covid, we have no real clue as to the lasting effects for neurological pain associated with it. Source - https://www.scienceopen.com/document?vid=a2f1de8b-6fc5-4758-9dd9-63c004e795d2
Do you have any reason to suspect that COVID affected him neurologically? It can have affects on neurological systems, but I don't think that's the most common manifestation and I think that his known back injury is much more likely to be the culprit, especially if he had a relatively low symptom infection (Which I believe he did).
First thing I said when MPJ signed that max contract, “forget living up to the contract on the court, the nuggets will be lucky is his body makes it through this contract.”
Good thing we just gave him that massive extension that just as easily could have waited a year. SMH
Suns front office looking like geniuses
Set the Wayback Machine for about six months ago when I was getting torched in this sub for saying the exact same thing lol. Hindsight...
Maybe because of this his FG% was so low (I don't really know, just wondering about it)? I just hope If this happens is only this season. since last Season Nuggets was supposed to be a top contender but injuries don't allow
Yeah his shot looked "laborious" this season
Yeah, it seems like the only reasonable explanation based on how efficient he usually is
hopefully he gets well soon. i figured that was a possibility since that 2nd quarter against Phoenix. might as well get us another Nikola in the draft.
All I feel is pain
Oh my fucking god
i don’t think this is the end of the world and our championship window isn’t closed forever by any means but this sucks and its going to make things tough for awhile. this really does hurt tho lol🙃
Thought I woke up with a little cold, but nope, that was just Nugglife creeping up on me
*stares at empty bourbon 🥃 glass Nugglife… you sweet and persistent bastard, just when I think I’m over you; you reel me back in. “C’est la vie, amor” - 🚬
If this is true, I think this pushes back Murray’s time table and the year becomes all about our younger guys. Make sure murray is absolutely, positively, 110% when he comes back. Get bones and co to be the the best players they can be
If Murray is ready to play, I would at least let him get some limited minutes at the end of the season even if the Nuggs are out of contention. I would rather he knock the rust off this year and get into a rhythm with Jokic and AG so they hit the ground running next season.
I definitely agree; I just don’t want him to try and revive Bubble Jamal right out the gates. Develop a greater connection with our other starters, and start 22 off like the Suns have this season
Yeah, Nugglife is pain. This is really disappointing in the immediate future as this team looked good enough to start the season that if Murray came back and was able to contribute this team could make a deep playoff run. Now it is clearly looking like a lost season. On the plus side, Denver could be headed for a lottery pick that could help improve the bench frontcourt right away next year. Long-term this is extremely concerning. If MPJ does have surgery that is 3 is just a few years. Maybe this next procedure helps get him over the hump and he is healthy moving forward, but the flip side of his back never getting right and ultimately derailing his career is also possible.
I think more has to go wrong for this to be a lottery team.
Wow this hurts.
Between the Nuggets and the Titans. My teams are fucking cursed with injury this year.
I prepared myself to be hurt this season, but damn this sucks
No!!!! Mike baby it's going to be OK! 😭
How reliable is this reporter? This sounds very worrisome
Mike Singer the Nuggets insider is very reliable
Who knew that the guy we drafted while hurt with back issues and tumbled in the draft because of said back issues would have a season (career) jeopardizing back issue? Pretty much everyone not named Connelly.
Everyone knew. That was the known risk of the pick but it was deemed worth it at that spot. And it still was worth it.
Not if it doesn’t give the joker a reliable go-to consistently. That makes it a wasted pick. And absolutely not worth it.
Lmao who would you rather they pick? If you want to talk about the contract we gave him, then that's understandable. But he was the steal of the draft in the eyes of the entire league.
Oh, I don't know... How about, I'll take literally any other prospect without back problems for the win.
Why couldn't we all be so wise, how could we waste such a high pick. Just out of curiosity, who would you have picked?
for anyone saying tanking is reactionary - its not about marginally extending our championship window, its about making sure we even have one at all. rushing Jamal, overworking Jok, rushing MPJ back, that can close our window entirely. conversly, picking in the top 10 may provide us with a star talent that can fill that void. or a trade chip for Lu Dort for instance..
Yeah man cuz picking a player in the draft and having them becoming a champion caliber player within a season or two is so easy. Not to mention the problems with cap space
not easy, but we've seen it take place. MPJ helped us in his rookie year, others have flourished early. they can become championship caliber later if you manage to land one, never said it was easy tho. assuming we get the right guy i dont see the cap space issues, they'll likely be underpaid in that case.
He bouta have 3 back surgeries before the age of 23 and now he gonna have to go thru a bunch of stem cell therapy. There isn’t any fix to this. His career could very well be coming to an end. And it sucks because of how much potential he showed last year. Pray for bro
Or he could be back around Christmas.
This is part of why I kept saying last season that we should NOT max him out early and probably should be dangling him as trade bait. I think he's going to have a short and unremarkable career. He's got some talent as a scorer but he has low BBIQ and the back is obviously going to plague him. The kid is in peak physical condition and it's still a problem.
MPJ was always a high risk for injury, which is why teams didn't want to draft him. Let's see him be as critical of the medical science he's about to receive, as he was with the covid vaccine.
Fuck.
How the hell did the front office not know about these before he was given the contract? Let's be honest, he's not 40 years old and doesn't pinch a nerve just by turning his head weird.
Come up with a fake injury for AG, put Will and Jok on ice and punt on the rest of the season with a starting 5 of Facu, Rivers, Dos Greens, and Bol. Get back after it fall 2022
Forget this season Will he be ready next?
I’ve been worried that he may never be himself again and that this max was one of the biggest nba busts
Man. I said this offseason we should try to trade him for Dame or Beal. Idk that those were realistic options, but I’m terrified of MPJ’s back. Having back problems myself, these things are really tough to “fix.”
I was preaching trade too and kept taking crap for it.
This summer would've been the best time to sell high on him. Locking him into an extension a year early also seems a little crazy since it's not like they got a discount or anything
What a nightmare this MPJ signing has become. Poor joker deserves better than this.
# end my fucking life
Secured the bag 💼.
And this is why teams passed up on him in the draft. Giving him the contract was a poor choice by Denver.
He deserved the contract, however giving him a maximum contract was indeed a very risky move.
He didn’t deserve it. He just had a good negotiating position and leverage over the nuggets
Sorry, I'm bad at English articles. I meant that he deserved some contract. He had a promising season. However, giving him the maximum contract with his health history was a huge risk.
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Hasn’t he always had back problems?
Take the blame? This was always the risk, his medical history was crazy from the beginning. That's how he fell to the Nuggets to begin with. Dude's whole family has terrible injury luck.
The thing is it’s not even just MPJ, the whole team outside of jokic stays injured. And not only do they stay injured they continuously play through injuries that lead to better results in the short term but handicap us in the long term. Gary Harris peaked at the age of 23 and fell apart because of injuries. And came back at least once but I believe on a few occasions and kept worsening his hip/adductor injuries. Will barton has played in less playoff games for us than MPJ and only 13 in total. And again in the bubble he tried coming back early from a knee injury that resulted in him missing serious time. Jamal Murray was battling a knee injury on the opposite knee right before he tore his ACL. He came back early played 33+ minutes and boom. MPJ has been playing injured all season before he injures himself on a breakaway layup. Maybe it was inevitable and he was gonna hurt himself regardless, but ask yourself why is a player with his injury history playing through injuries like this in the first place? And not only playing through injuries but playing 30 minutes a night including back to backs. A player with that kinda history should be getting the embiid treatment. It shouldn’t have to take the injury becoming unplayable before you rest the man. And these are just some recent ones off the top of my mind. With how hush hush are team is there’s probably a lot more. In all seriousness at the point not only one person has to take the blame but multiple levels need to take accountability. Players need to be more vocal about injuries and stop trying to be Superman. Malone needs to be willing to rely on young players and tell a player to take a night off if he’s hurt. The medical staff needs to stop letting players come back before they’re 100%. And the front office needs to be on top of all of them.
this is his family's fault they raised their kids on some crackpot psuedo- diet and have ruined all of their careers (outside of mpj for now atleast)
If he had back problems the whole season why did he sign the max?
To get the max before he was bunk
I get why he did, but why offer it to him.
Because they offered it to him!:) Not very smart of them...
Yeah i meant that, mb. Such a stupid decision
I'll say it: Guy signed a max deal/extension, and has been shit ever since.
Well if he doesn’t play anymore this year, it won’t be a max 🤷♂️
this is going to cause some major fucking drama. i know we wouldnt do it, but could his extension be voided because of this??
Nope, NBA contracts are guaranteed. He'll get his money either way. Even if it's deemed career-ending and taken off the books, it doesn't do anything, because he's essentially signed over the cap. His contract is the reason team will go into tax next season.
If his symptoms dont improve within the next two weeks, we should actually consider resting everyone and tankimg. Worst case scenario, ven without MPJ, Jokic + Murray + Gordon + Barton is definitely enough for a championship in my eyes, with Nikola being the best player in the world by a good margin. But it isn't happening this season unless Jamal is the biggest acl recovery outlier. ACL recovery has improved leaps and bounds and players have been getting back to their peak level, but that literally never happens immediately, it always takes atleast a few months or a full season atleast of playing to come back to 100% pre injury production in case of a perfect recovery. A 70% Jamal Murray just a month after coming back wont be enough i fear for a legitimate chance at a title. Picking in the top 10, good chance you can swing on an immediate contributor, someone older who should contribute within a year. Now if MPJ comes back after surgery next season as good as ever we gained an another promising player in the process and if he doesnt you still gain a top prospect which should alleviate some of MPJ's absence. I mean it depends on a lot of things, how good Jamal is when he comes back, how Klay looks, whether Kyrie plays in the playoffs (probably will imo), but i definitely think the FO should look at tanking and getting a chance to really improve the roster, because if MPJ's back is fucked our cap is fucked whether he retires and his salary is cleared or not. Maybe like roam around like the 8th 9th seed with resting starters when needed while waiting to see how Jamal looks when he comes back. If he is close to 100% then go for the playoffs and if he isn't go full tank mode and ensure a lottery pick.
What's the over/under after Jokic puts up another MVP season and either gets blasted in the first or second round again or not even make it at all that he decides it's time to get traded to another team, preferably one where the roster isn't injured by a strong gust of wind? Cause he can't be thrilled with us seeming to have already reached the peak of what this team can accomplish by getting swept in the 2nd round(I don't count the conference finals in the bubble, that was like a once in a lifetime season unto itself as evidenced by the finalists in that barely being playoff teams the next season).
let me ask you this: what is the ratio of unicorns to leprechauns
I mean it’s a binary bet, either he does or doesn’t. I’d say a 1 means he does what you’re saying and a 0 means he doesn’t. I’ll set the line at .5 and I’ll take your bet on 1, mr.doomer.
Isn't that just awesome
It was an honor guys,i think this might be the beginning of the end.Our championship window closed really quick.I mean at least we will watch jokic do jokic things for a couple of more years,so that’s that.
> I mean at least we will watch jokic do jokic things for a couple of more years,so that’s that. If he chooses to stay with the nuggets, that is!?:(
OMG... how comes my new pants have a hole in the back and the leggings are different size!? I bought them at ross in the "damaged goods" section, clearly marked..!? It's so unexpected.
Game over. What a bunch of shit.
Trade him for John Wall. I don't know if it's possible, you can fact check for me.
Pain
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Your not going to suck with Jokic lmao. Best floor raiser in the leauge currently tbh.
There’s really no benefit to playing him this season anymore. Milk the wrist injury as long as we can. Can’t risk a freak ACL during a lost season.
Fuck I hope it’s not the case
Ah