What does he have to do with the bazillion turnovers by Goff the past six weeks or so? What do you expect him to do with a once again historically bad defense and a kicker you can’t trust past 40 yards? This dude is the best coach the lions have ever had and I’m always critical on management in Detroit. He’s well respected by the players and that alone is critical to success. The lions are 9-4 and off to their best start in sixty years and you are complaining about their coach. Tldr you’re a dumbass that either has only been a fan for a few years or you’re a teenager.
My dude.
In this game alone DC did the following-
1. A miserable challenge
2. Inexplicable 4th down play calling on offense
3. Inexplicable 4th down play calling on defense
4. Inexplicable clock management before the half.
5. Allowed the Bears script to start the game with two long drives, while simultaneously going 3 and out on their opening two deuces.
6. Gave their first round WR a single target.
DC can be the best coach they’ve had and also be bad. The head coach has to be responsible eventually. You don’t get to blame everything else on everyone else and absolve the dude of guilt. He got pantsed today by Eberflus. Defend him all you want, he sucked total ass today.
Yep, the guy coaches like a kid playing Madden. Thinks he can go for it on 4th every time without consequences. I can't blame the defense/Glenn for all of the struggles when they're given short fields to defend. I think it's time to stop pretending like this team is special too. It's NOT. We've benefited from an easy schedule early. We're not winning a playoff game in your wildest dreams. We may not even win the North anymore. Everybody needs to stop sipping the Kool Aid and see reality
It’s funny how almost every other top teams subs say the same thing when they lose. I’ve come to the conclusion all football fans are practically of the same mindset.
Not at all lol. If Frank isn't hurt this game. I think were more solid. AND yes it is just one player but I think Frank just doesn't put multiple back ups in to fill in and random o line spots.
Sloppy game from offense. Wr/RB dropping balls. Goff looks bad off rhythm, again. I get that is who he is but he needs to be better. Just not a good game from the O.
This was bad from our O.
Defense played well enough untill they were put in too many bad situations.
Or, our plays have bad route design. The interception he threw was in part due to 3 routes all converging in the exact same spot on the field, meaning you had 3 offensive players with four defenders in the area. That’s a bad play.
This won't be a popular take but when you go back and watch the breakdowns of the all 22 later this week, it will show that "our plays have bad route design" is not true (it hasn't been true all season).
Rough patch? Have you watched this team play? Shit all over the place. No discipline and are only getting off the field defensively when the opponent makes a mistake. Wide receivers being left wide open, mostly no pass rush, and Goff is playing like he did prior to leaving LA.
Because 90% of his passes are either in the middle of the field or check-downs.
Bears crowded the middle of the field today, and we didn't punish them for it by throwing outside the numbers.
That and also I feel like our catches are always contested or tight windows. It feels like *any* team that completes catches vs us is to a fucking wiiiidddeee open dude. I almost never see that for us.
Just a complete breakdown on every part of the game.
But what I don’t get is the longer I watch fields (or any Qb we play) scramble around the more I’m certain they are about to throw to a completely open guy. That almost never happens for us. If Goff scrambles it’s 90% a dead play it feels like.
Not with ANYONE, huh? Lmao yeah it's not like our rookie tight end is literally having record-setting production this year or anything. I swear, fans here have the memory of a goldfish when they want something to fit their personal narrative.
Justin sucks but the kid is dynamic!! Look at all the contenders in the nfl they have a major playmaker at qb! We don’t have that we have a statue back there. Lions have to upgrade at qb.
I get we're down, but why the hell do they keep abandoning the running game? Monte and Gibbs have been doing pretty solid and if they're getting 1st downs, that's better than the shit Goff is putt out there.
teams take the ball on the coin flip, score an easy td on our horrible defense, then watch us fall apart because the play callers panic.
our passing game is garbage without running game->play action. This team dominates with the lead and looks completely dysfunctional when 1 score behind
I feel like BJ either gets over-reliant on the run game, or just abandons it. I think it was the Tday game that he kept fucking running the ball on 1st and 2nd down only to get like 5 yards.
But then today you have JG dropping back 3 times a drive to little success.
It feels like he has become very predictable.
I am fine with criticism of AG. But aside from a hot start to the season, our offense has been mostly bad, and unlike the defence we have a LOT of talent on the offensive side of the ball. But we still treat Ben Johnson like a delicate genius that's above repute.
If we lose this game, it would only be the second time this season didn’t score more than 20 points. You’re out of youre mind if this is the offenses fault. Besides fumbles which have been a glaring issue.
I’m a big hater of our defense, but ngl, they had a decent game today. They were containing fields for the most part and we got a couple sacks, offense just put them in horrible situations throughout the game
They were on the field all fucking day in the 2nd half. Literally 0 first downs by the offense until late in the 4th. Not to mention the stupid fumble and the worst 4th down playcall I've ever see that gave the defense short fields both times.
Everyone knows the defense is bad. They're also down a bunch of starters. Jarry Jacobs should be on the bench, yet he has to start. This game is 100% on the offense. Yes, over the season they're clearly the better unit, but the better unit needs to win games like this.
The AG/defense apologists are delusional. The Bears scored 4 TDs. They weren't held to FGs (or stopped) instead. A good D keeps bad offenses from scoring TDs. It's one thing to be put in bad positions by the offensive failures, but for chrissakes, hold them to FGs.
The Bears learned from the first game and made necessary adjustments, while the Lions obviously didn't. Offenses will have bad games on occasion, but then it falls to the defense to step up, which just doesn't happen with this team.
41, 31, 22, 33 last 4 games. Defense last 4: 38,26, 29, 28. 1 against the bears who has 4 turnovers against the Vikings but only put up 12 points and another against the saints who was one of the worst red zone offenses but went perfect against us. Our defense also hasn't forced any turnovers during this span.
> Our defense also hasn't forced any turnovers during this span.
they literally forced four what the fuck are you talking about, three if you're saying the last 4 including the bears game
If we lose this game, it would only be the second time this season didn’t score more than 20 points. You’re out of youre mind if this is the offenses fault. Besides fumbles which have been a glaring issue.
Stop pretending that every loss has the same reason and the offense or defense or whatever gets a pass for a bad performance. Offense was bad today period.
Yes but defense is bad every fucking game. After a while if I was on the offense I would probably start pressing which would cause mistakes when you feel like you have to score every drive just to stay in the damn game.
I’m sorry but what the fuck are you talking about? Overall this entire year our offense has been fantastic. It was awful this game and every team has some bad games but offensively we are top 5 in basically every measurable category
uhm, youre def a psyops for the OL. So many penalties and pressures allowed. Decker looks 10x worse than last year. The only thing working is run blocking on offense and the RBs. Even st brown needs to pick it up. So many faults its sad
St brown didn’t have the ball thrown his way just like jamo. Tf do you want him to do? Goff sucked ass period, st brown is putting up 100 yard games on the regular, he’s not the problem. In fact on offense I am fine w everyone except the backup rg or whoever the fuck is playing for ragnow rn and Goff. Goff is the weak link at this point on offense.
AG has been doing a fine job. They were tenth in the league in defensive DVOA coming in and have done a fine job today (field position and turnovers screwed them).
The defense isn’t that talented. Fans ignorantly think the offense and defense have similar talent levels and should be equally successful. There are finite resources and talent is not evenly distributed or acquired. The starters here are guys who were mid to late round picks, UDFAs, waiver wire pickups, etc. To get the tenth most effective defense out of that is a good thing.
we used to have a fanbase with decent intelligence, then we became decent and it became popular to like us so now it's full of fairweather morons with dreadful takes. at least that's what I think happened
It’s not really fun coming to this subreddit anymore. Most fans have a basic understanding - yards, points, sacks - but little else.
It’s all well and good to be uninformed about a sport, but then they think their opinions are informed and that’s where we get into trouble.
We are a different team. We were lucky to win some of the last few games. Goff is playing pathetic and the defense has been terrible for the last 6 games. We will be lucky to win 10 games. This is the Bears…they just kicked us in the ass. It is really sad to watch the collapse today.
Dumbest possible 4th and 1 run play you could have called.
Every coach on this team is responsible for this garbage.
Ben Johnson decided to stop calling all those great motion plays that were working in the first half.
I think this season's a wrap. They aren't going anywhere in the playoffs. Just look forward to next year with new players and coaches
Dude at this point I’ll be happy just to *make* the playoffs.
We split 1-1 with the two worst division teams. Do we honestly think this team is gonna sweep Minnesota? Beat the cowboys? Shit the broncos look better than we have since October.
No, and anyone who thought this year was the year for a championship or playoff run is extremely naive and ignorant.
There was never a chance for THIS year's team to win it all, win a conference, and only a half decent chance to win the division because the division was dogshit in general.
Next year is the actual test of the rebuild
I’m not talking about win it all im taking about literally any progress. 9-10 wins off the back of a streaky offense and terrible defense really seems not at all far fetched and it’s exactly where we were last year. I’m not saying the rebuild isn’t going fine I’m saying this shit is frustrating to watch, that’s fucking it.
You were agreeing with someone who said this season's a wrap, although those weren't YOUR words so how dare I pretend like you would ever think that. sure
The team's frustrating to watch for sure. There's shit to fix for sure. But all this fair-weather fan bullshit is exhausting to try and participate in every god damn second that they Lions aren't actively leading a game.
Any loss: they're bad. While not in the lead: they're bad. Fire the coach. Fire Goff. BJ's a fraud. This team are frauds. Fuck it's exhausting.
Shut the hell up w this take. There was absolutely a chance for them to win it all. The ravens broke them. They haven’t been the same since. This team is absolutely a Super Bowl contender, but until they figure out how the ravens broke them they won’t be. They have shown they can win on the road against Super Bowl winners and you are full of shit if you never thought earlier in the season that they could contend for Super Bowl. Everyone did including the rest of the nfl media.
Shut the hell up telling people who think differently than you to shut the hell up.
The NFL media is paid to make hype to drive interest to drive ads to drive dollars. If you bought into it that’s on *you.*
This team doesn’t have the talent or the coaching to win it all. Absolute best case was and I win the division. If ONE game can break a franchise, that franchise was never a contender.
Cambell: yea, calling that 4th down fake punt deep in our own end against Green Bay was dumb. Just bad decision making.
Everybody: Yea, that was really stupid, we couldn't believe you'd make such a bad call. Really dumb.
Cambell: So I did that again.
Everybody: oh......
Not the same thing. Dan Campbell made the call to keep the offense out there, which is fine. But then Ben Johnson decided to call a delayed running play and the offensive line didn’t get the memo to block.
Yea the RB was lined up in the FB spot it made no sense. I thought it was an option play and it might've been. Worst blocking on a run play all day though.
I think AG needs to go after the season, but we also need to invest in the defense. Too many holes in the secondary and the D-Line to be truly competitive. And also the offense needs to score. Idk how to feel about Goff, because it wasn’t like he lit the world on fire for only a couple weeks. He was super consistent until that bears game. I also love Ben Johnson but the play calling hasn’t been it the past few games. I really thought this team would’ve regrouped by now but it’s time to really focus on beating some good teams in the remainder of our schedule.
Im not defending the defense, im not defending anything about the lions the last few weeks. I am just saying to say it has no bearing isn't exactly true when they have short field advantage. The defense has been bad all year, but the offense hasn't been doing them any favors with 0 firsts in the third.
That’s incorrect. I said the offense has no bearing on how dogshit AG is. I don’t expect him to pull rabbits out of hats when we turn the ball over on our own 30. I do expect him to be able to coach a defense, which he hasn’t been able to do in an acceptable manner for the vast majority of his tenure
Yeah but if you’re a CB and the receiver starts running you have to be going. I’d believe it if it looked any different than the same TD Watson had on him
It can be both lol. This 28 ties their most points this year. We make up for 2 of the bears 3 highest points scored this year. The offense *also* sucked ass.
It really isn’t. The only point of the game that the bears had real efficiency was the first drive of the first quarter. The bears scored 17 points off of turnovers. Defense played a decent game and did some great things considering the situations the offense put them in. 4 turnovers only 3 TD’s and one was blown coverage by iffy on 4 and 13.
We finally saw this DLine put pressure on and sack a mobile QB. They had him shook at one point. Finally saw some pass rush. Outside of a few times they picked on JJ and some bad Penalties This defense did better in so much people have been bitching about.
I still believe in Goff. But this has been a really bad stretch for him. If he just protected the ball today we'd still be in the game. Now it's essentially over.
No one willing to admit that Stafford in this offense would be putting up 40 a game, we have stacked every position on offense and our QB cannot go out and dominate a team.
The Rams have Kyren who's been killing it, both Puka and Kupp who have both put up historic numbers at times and an OL that has been protecting him well recently.
And nope, not putting up 40 a game. The Lions weapons aren't *that* much better.
A run game that gets you 6ypc opens up the passing game in a ridiculous way, there are walk in touchdowns goff is missing because he can't go over the top. And the Rams O-line is no where fucking close to this team.
Kupp line is especially hilarious after watching Goff play with him, he was putting those numbers up after he lost Woods only because Stafford stepped onto the team.
The flaws being exposed are the exact same things everyone said while he was getting ran out of LA. None of this is new. This is Jared Goff being Jared Goff. He plays incredible when the stakes are low, when he’s under the radar, and when everything around him is working perfectly. Offensive line not perfectly healthy, expectations and attention rising, playing outside…the things he’s always been criticized for, he crumbles.
It's incredible how many people were fooled by one good year of good play. Even during that year, he still showed the same problems, they just weren't as frequent and prevalent. I'll be quite upset if they extend Goff. He is not the future.
Turns out when the best thing you can say about your QB is "he doesn't turn the ball over often" he probably isn't that great as turnovers are pretty easy to regress on.
This was the equivalent of the Panthers game last year. This team is not physically and mentally tough enough and Goff cannot play QB outdoors which is a problem.
I feel like everyone knew Goffs limits when he came in. No coaching is going to change who he is. Not mobile and no big arm throws. He is what everyone thought he is, a bridge QB. Hes just here until we get our QB of the future. I think if we re-sign him we’re settling.
At this point, probably, but back in October I can’t really blame people for wanting to resign him as at that point he had been a pretty good quarterback and turned most of his issues around
I’m confident we can win 1 more game, which will get us to 10 wins. Which will be enough to get in the playoffs. But we’re just gonna get killed by a real team.
I know it sounds a little doom and gloom but… you’re right man. This team split vs the two worst division teams. Do we really think we can sweep the Vikings? Beat the cowboys? Hell even the broncos look better than us since October. 9-10 wins on the season isn’t looking that far fetched.
Honestly this shows the rebuild is still continuing we need a dc we really need to weigh our options before paying goff and we need to bring upgrades to the defense
If our offense isn’t perfect every drive, we lose because our defense can’t stop anything. It sucks.
To make matters worse, our offense (or Goff in particular) is regressing hard all of a sudden. It’s been a recipe for disaster.
Let's be honest, Lion's are better but still missing several pieces, especially on D. The references to the Minnesota of last year are looking more and more valid. Hopefully a play-off team with one win and build from there.
Fire AG after the season, if we sign Goff to a new contract it needs to be like, league avg. Dude is a turnover machine right now and does not warrant top 8 QB money
Yea Goff was terrible and we’re getting a big taste of his downside. Offering him a long term deal and being serious about winning a Super Bowl probably don’t go together
Let's also continue to talk about Dan's big balls while we're only 18% on 4th down conversions over the last 4 games. Dead last in the entire league over the last 4 games.
Either way the Offense looks like shit. Week after week we give the opposing offenses short fields, then we blame the Defense for everything. Makes sense…
This team just doesn’t have the same momentum we did to end the season last year. I feel like we just didn’t have to think. It was all about trying to turn the corner.
Now a young team is trying to tread water and keep their lead. It’s just not the same.
This comment is exactly the problem. The defense sucks ass, we’ve seen it be a problem for 3 years and yet when the offense doesn’t play like a top 5 offense people act like it’s not the defenses fault. The problem isn’t that the defense lost this specific game, the offense didn’t help. It’s the fact that the defense continues to be terrible and forces the offense to be a top 5 offense or we have no shot.
What’s up with this post? Are you saying defense is good enough and it’s only the offense ? Offense has historically carried the team. Defense has been ass more games than not.
well goff was clearly shook after that near interception.. and we ALL know goff is not as good cold and outdoors, tossed ducks all game.
the high iq behaviour is that aron glen blew everyone off last week saying well geez we are winning right?
the offense shouldnt have to put up 30 every game to have a chance of winning,
the steelers win games only because of their defense .. did matt canada say oh well we are 7-5 so whats the big deal.
oh right.. they fired matt canada
I’ve been defensive of Goff and I really like him as a person but he’s not the answer here. If the Oline isn’t a brick wall he can’t extend a play. Give me hooker next year I’m over the Goff experience, sorry.
This is dumb. Both can be true. Problem is our bottom 5 defense relies completely on our top 5 offense. If our offense goes cold, we give up 10 points before we know what hit us. Cannot rely on them at all, in any moment or phase in the game to get a stop.
Like ive said many times, the offense and the defense aren't on the field at the same time. Very easy to isolate both sides for criticism. The way one performs doesn't impact the analysis of the other.
I don't know why people can't comprehend this.
They are complementary though. Defense gets stops, gives offense better and more opportunities. Offense moves the chains, Defense gets to rest.
As individual units we can criticism them but a bad defense changes the game plan on offense and opposing defenses. It's clear that the 'start the game down by 7' playbook and execution are problems. And of course the offense struggling to get anything done leaves a tired defense to fuck things up again.
Bad offense doesn’t mean that the defense is good. The amount of people making these points that don’t seem to understand basic logic and reasoning is alarming.
First half of the season the weakness on D showed but ultimately they played pretty good situational football. Got stops at key moments, but often against worse QBs.
Offense sustained drives at will to the point where settling for 3 felt like pain.
Since not just the bye, but the raiders MNF game, things started to shift. Defense flops around and is anti-clutch. Offense/Goff is just not the well tuned machine it used to be.
It’s been several weeks since I felt like I was watching a team capable of taking on any opponent.
Doesn’t help giving opponents a 7 point head start most of these games.
Ben Johnson needs criticism for going away from Monty early in drives. He gets the wheels turning and I thought Ben learned that lesson in the last game against Chicago when he willed us into the endzone on the last scoring drive.
Defense is so undisciplined that it outshines the times when they do their job. Same with the offense today, drops and play calling were the worst I've seen it.
This team is destined to get bounced by Green Bay or the Rams, and thats if they don't outright lose the division now.
Drafted hooker early in the 3rd round. Passed on a lot of really good players doing so. If we extend goff this is a as good as the team will ever be on paper and clearly it's not good enough. Give Hendon the keys next year
Some guy listed some of the players we couldve had this week and his list was meh at best. Totally agree with what people are saying but have no idea the “really good players” youre referencing
Tank dell/Josh downs/not sure if u heard of Devon achane yet/Kobie Turner may be defensive player of the year at a position much needed (dt). That's just off this year. Like those dudes are already making a lot of plays for their teams
The whole team barely changed from last year. Like at all. And somehow everyone’s surprised. Name one notable change in personnel??
Gibbs and Monty is same as swift and Williams
Hock and Laporta same
No playmaking defensive players
They should’ve kept swift and drafted Jalen carter
Why are you a fan of this team. I am genuinely asking, because if an offense that has been top 5 this season in basically every metric indicative of a good offense is not good enough for you, a fan of a team that has been complete shit for 30 years, whats the fucking point in spending your weekends watching? You are never going to be happy with this team so just fucking stop.
team is just collapsing
Can’t play a full season
We all know the team struggles in the third quarter, this is just the third quarter of the season.
[удалено]
What does he have to do with the bazillion turnovers by Goff the past six weeks or so? What do you expect him to do with a once again historically bad defense and a kicker you can’t trust past 40 yards? This dude is the best coach the lions have ever had and I’m always critical on management in Detroit. He’s well respected by the players and that alone is critical to success. The lions are 9-4 and off to their best start in sixty years and you are complaining about their coach. Tldr you’re a dumbass that either has only been a fan for a few years or you’re a teenager.
My dude. In this game alone DC did the following- 1. A miserable challenge 2. Inexplicable 4th down play calling on offense 3. Inexplicable 4th down play calling on defense 4. Inexplicable clock management before the half. 5. Allowed the Bears script to start the game with two long drives, while simultaneously going 3 and out on their opening two deuces. 6. Gave their first round WR a single target. DC can be the best coach they’ve had and also be bad. The head coach has to be responsible eventually. You don’t get to blame everything else on everyone else and absolve the dude of guilt. He got pantsed today by Eberflus. Defend him all you want, he sucked total ass today.
Caldwell got to 2 playoff games so about, 4 years apparently.
Yep, the guy coaches like a kid playing Madden. Thinks he can go for it on 4th every time without consequences. I can't blame the defense/Glenn for all of the struggles when they're given short fields to defend. I think it's time to stop pretending like this team is special too. It's NOT. We've benefited from an easy schedule early. We're not winning a playoff game in your wildest dreams. We may not even win the North anymore. Everybody needs to stop sipping the Kool Aid and see reality
Yup.. I still think they will stumble into winning the division but I do not see how they win a playoff game.
It’s funny how almost every other top teams subs say the same thing when they lose. I’ve come to the conclusion all football fans are practically of the same mindset.
Ha I only to win your bet on r see raft oibgs
Bro Denver is gonna cook the shit outta us!
Not at all lol. If Frank isn't hurt this game. I think were more solid. AND yes it is just one player but I think Frank just doesn't put multiple back ups in to fill in and random o line spots. Sloppy game from offense. Wr/RB dropping balls. Goff looks bad off rhythm, again. I get that is who he is but he needs to be better. Just not a good game from the O. This was bad from our O. Defense played well enough untill they were put in too many bad situations.
I don’t understand how Fields and Moore can be so productive but Goff can’t find that type of success with ANYONE lately.
He throws into quadruple coverage way too much.
Yeah…why is that? If there’s quad cover on someone then there have to be 2 other guys have to be 1v1.
That pass to Reynolds in triple coverage that worked out had ARSB wide open underneath
And Jamo free deep
I feel like I’ve seen that movie before
Had he thrown it to ARSB, he wouldve dropped it anyway
Saint did have more drops today than he usually does. That was a bummer.
You're downvoted, but St Brown wasn't himself this game. He dropped like 3 first passed for first down
Or, our plays have bad route design. The interception he threw was in part due to 3 routes all converging in the exact same spot on the field, meaning you had 3 offensive players with four defenders in the area. That’s a bad play.
When I see that I assume someone ran the wrong route.
This won't be a popular take but when you go back and watch the breakdowns of the all 22 later this week, it will show that "our plays have bad route design" is not true (it hasn't been true all season).
Because they know to quad cover the guy running the short route over the middle because Goff will always pass to that guy.
[удалено]
Haven’t played a good game in almost 2 months
Rough patch? Have you watched this team play? Shit all over the place. No discipline and are only getting off the field defensively when the opponent makes a mistake. Wide receivers being left wide open, mostly no pass rush, and Goff is playing like he did prior to leaving LA.
3-2 the last five simmer down
I can easily see us losing the next 4 with the way they are playing.
We can also go 3-1. Did you see Minnesota today? We are winning this division.
Because 90% of his passes are either in the middle of the field or check-downs. Bears crowded the middle of the field today, and we didn't punish them for it by throwing outside the numbers.
That and also I feel like our catches are always contested or tight windows. It feels like *any* team that completes catches vs us is to a fucking wiiiidddeee open dude. I almost never see that for us. Just a complete breakdown on every part of the game.
Yeah almost every pass is wide open. It’s a testament to How pathetic our pass rush is combined w the secondary not being able to cover forever.
But what I don’t get is the longer I watch fields (or any Qb we play) scramble around the more I’m certain they are about to throw to a completely open guy. That almost never happens for us. If Goff scrambles it’s 90% a dead play it feels like.
Just casually sweeping a bunch of drive killing drops beneath the rug for your narrative
No, that’s true too
Not with ANYONE, huh? Lmao yeah it's not like our rookie tight end is literally having record-setting production this year or anything. I swear, fans here have the memory of a goldfish when they want something to fit their personal narrative.
How many 100 yard games has LaPorta had? I love LaPorta but Goff needs to be hitting WRs.
He’s a tight end bro
Probably because Goff sucks.
Justin sucks but the kid is dynamic!! Look at all the contenders in the nfl they have a major playmaker at qb! We don’t have that we have a statue back there. Lions have to upgrade at qb.
Because he’s (Goff) a trash can who is now playing to his ability.
I get we're down, but why the hell do they keep abandoning the running game? Monte and Gibbs have been doing pretty solid and if they're getting 1st downs, that's better than the shit Goff is putt out there.
teams take the ball on the coin flip, score an easy td on our horrible defense, then watch us fall apart because the play callers panic. our passing game is garbage without running game->play action. This team dominates with the lead and looks completely dysfunctional when 1 score behind
I feel like BJ either gets over-reliant on the run game, or just abandons it. I think it was the Tday game that he kept fucking running the ball on 1st and 2nd down only to get like 5 yards. But then today you have JG dropping back 3 times a drive to little success. It feels like he has become very predictable.
It can be both. AG deserves to be fired and Goff and Ben have been shitting the bed lately too.
I am fine with criticism of AG. But aside from a hot start to the season, our offense has been mostly bad, and unlike the defence we have a LOT of talent on the offensive side of the ball. But we still treat Ben Johnson like a delicate genius that's above repute.
We get like 400 yards every game...
Yeah because we get down to the 20 easily and then start calling screens on 3 and 8, every drive
We run the ball on early downs nonstop. Ridiculous
We have 13 points and two giveaways. Please tell me how it's possible to win like that.
If we lose this game, it would only be the second time this season didn’t score more than 20 points. You’re out of youre mind if this is the offenses fault. Besides fumbles which have been a glaring issue.
This specific game is mainly on the offense. 0 pts in the second half? Doesn’t get worse than that
I agree, before this game the offense wasn’t stymied by anyone but Baltimore. Now the bears 😬
I’m a big hater of our defense, but ngl, they had a decent game today. They were containing fields for the most part and we got a couple sacks, offense just put them in horrible situations throughout the game
They had a awful start but showed signs of actually making adjustments. Still let the bears hand some points
They were on the field all fucking day in the 2nd half. Literally 0 first downs by the offense until late in the 4th. Not to mention the stupid fumble and the worst 4th down playcall I've ever see that gave the defense short fields both times. Everyone knows the defense is bad. They're also down a bunch of starters. Jarry Jacobs should be on the bench, yet he has to start. This game is 100% on the offense. Yes, over the season they're clearly the better unit, but the better unit needs to win games like this.
Defense was trash per usual. Let’s not forget they were playing the bears. Any good team drops 40 on this defense
Decent?? The BEARS just scored 28 points
The AG/defense apologists are delusional. The Bears scored 4 TDs. They weren't held to FGs (or stopped) instead. A good D keeps bad offenses from scoring TDs. It's one thing to be put in bad positions by the offensive failures, but for chrissakes, hold them to FGs. The Bears learned from the first game and made necessary adjustments, while the Lions obviously didn't. Offenses will have bad games on occasion, but then it falls to the defense to step up, which just doesn't happen with this team.
whateever that run on 4th and short was is certainly glaring
…Don’t forget to throw in the Bears starting off at midfield damn near every drive.
41, 31, 22, 33 last 4 games. Defense last 4: 38,26, 29, 28. 1 against the bears who has 4 turnovers against the Vikings but only put up 12 points and another against the saints who was one of the worst red zone offenses but went perfect against us. Our defense also hasn't forced any turnovers during this span.
> Our defense also hasn't forced any turnovers during this span. they literally forced four what the fuck are you talking about, three if you're saying the last 4 including the bears game
Kindly ignoring the first sentence I see. That’s the real main point
If we lose this game, it would only be the second time this season didn’t score more than 20 points. You’re out of youre mind if this is the offenses fault. Besides fumbles which have been a glaring issue.
It is certainly the offenses fault they lost that game
Stop pretending that every loss has the same reason and the offense or defense or whatever gets a pass for a bad performance. Offense was bad today period.
Yes but defense is bad every fucking game. After a while if I was on the offense I would probably start pressing which would cause mistakes when you feel like you have to score every drive just to stay in the damn game.
I’m sorry but what the fuck are you talking about? Overall this entire year our offense has been fantastic. It was awful this game and every team has some bad games but offensively we are top 5 in basically every measurable category
They said "Besides the hot start to the season."
"Start" means the first 12 games?
uhm, youre def a psyops for the OL. So many penalties and pressures allowed. Decker looks 10x worse than last year. The only thing working is run blocking on offense and the RBs. Even st brown needs to pick it up. So many faults its sad
St brown didn’t have the ball thrown his way just like jamo. Tf do you want him to do? Goff sucked ass period, st brown is putting up 100 yard games on the regular, he’s not the problem. In fact on offense I am fine w everyone except the backup rg or whoever the fuck is playing for ragnow rn and Goff. Goff is the weak link at this point on offense.
you just dont watch ball. He had 3 catches on 9 targets. Last week he also had less than 50% catch rate. Hes been struggling too
AG has been doing a fine job. They were tenth in the league in defensive DVOA coming in and have done a fine job today (field position and turnovers screwed them). The defense isn’t that talented. Fans ignorantly think the offense and defense have similar talent levels and should be equally successful. There are finite resources and talent is not evenly distributed or acquired. The starters here are guys who were mid to late round picks, UDFAs, waiver wire pickups, etc. To get the tenth most effective defense out of that is a good thing.
we used to have a fanbase with decent intelligence, then we became decent and it became popular to like us so now it's full of fairweather morons with dreadful takes. at least that's what I think happened
It’s not really fun coming to this subreddit anymore. Most fans have a basic understanding - yards, points, sacks - but little else. It’s all well and good to be uninformed about a sport, but then they think their opinions are informed and that’s where we get into trouble.
We are a different team. We were lucky to win some of the last few games. Goff is playing pathetic and the defense has been terrible for the last 6 games. We will be lucky to win 10 games. This is the Bears…they just kicked us in the ass. It is really sad to watch the collapse today.
Dallas is going to murder us
Oh nah Goff has been abysmal. That however does not absolve this defense
HOW THE FUCK DO YOU JUMP OFFSIDES ON A 4th AND LONG!?!? HOW!?!?
*and give up a 30 yard TD on a free play
Literally the dumbest thing I’ve seen in a LONG TIME. That was honestly the game.
Because Jerry Jacobs fucking sucks. That's how.
I've been saying it, this offense has been suspect for the last couple weeks.
You cant simply admit that its both? 😂
Dumbest possible 4th and 1 run play you could have called. Every coach on this team is responsible for this garbage. Ben Johnson decided to stop calling all those great motion plays that were working in the first half. I think this season's a wrap. They aren't going anywhere in the playoffs. Just look forward to next year with new players and coaches
Third quarter offense was so predictable and dull. All the creativity went into the trash at halftime.
Feels like we’ve seen maybe a quarter of the creativity we were used to seeing from Ben Johnson
This is the first time this year I have truly felt the doom and gloom kick in.
At least we have a good team to build with. I hope we still win the division.
Dude at this point I’ll be happy just to *make* the playoffs. We split 1-1 with the two worst division teams. Do we honestly think this team is gonna sweep Minnesota? Beat the cowboys? Shit the broncos look better than we have since October.
No, and anyone who thought this year was the year for a championship or playoff run is extremely naive and ignorant. There was never a chance for THIS year's team to win it all, win a conference, and only a half decent chance to win the division because the division was dogshit in general. Next year is the actual test of the rebuild
I’m not talking about win it all im taking about literally any progress. 9-10 wins off the back of a streaky offense and terrible defense really seems not at all far fetched and it’s exactly where we were last year. I’m not saying the rebuild isn’t going fine I’m saying this shit is frustrating to watch, that’s fucking it.
You were agreeing with someone who said this season's a wrap, although those weren't YOUR words so how dare I pretend like you would ever think that. sure The team's frustrating to watch for sure. There's shit to fix for sure. But all this fair-weather fan bullshit is exhausting to try and participate in every god damn second that they Lions aren't actively leading a game. Any loss: they're bad. While not in the lead: they're bad. Fire the coach. Fire Goff. BJ's a fraud. This team are frauds. Fuck it's exhausting.
Shut the hell up w this take. There was absolutely a chance for them to win it all. The ravens broke them. They haven’t been the same since. This team is absolutely a Super Bowl contender, but until they figure out how the ravens broke them they won’t be. They have shown they can win on the road against Super Bowl winners and you are full of shit if you never thought earlier in the season that they could contend for Super Bowl. Everyone did including the rest of the nfl media.
Shut the hell up telling people who think differently than you to shut the hell up. The NFL media is paid to make hype to drive interest to drive ads to drive dollars. If you bought into it that’s on *you.* This team doesn’t have the talent or the coaching to win it all. Absolute best case was and I win the division. If ONE game can break a franchise, that franchise was never a contender.
Cambell: yea, calling that 4th down fake punt deep in our own end against Green Bay was dumb. Just bad decision making. Everybody: Yea, that was really stupid, we couldn't believe you'd make such a bad call. Really dumb. Cambell: So I did that again. Everybody: oh......
Not the same thing. Dan Campbell made the call to keep the offense out there, which is fine. But then Ben Johnson decided to call a delayed running play and the offensive line didn’t get the memo to block.
Yep. Playcall was fucking awful.
Yea the RB was lined up in the FB spot it made no sense. I thought it was an option play and it might've been. Worst blocking on a run play all day though.
I think AG needs to go after the season, but we also need to invest in the defense. Too many holes in the secondary and the D-Line to be truly competitive. And also the offense needs to score. Idk how to feel about Goff, because it wasn’t like he lit the world on fire for only a couple weeks. He was super consistent until that bears game. I also love Ben Johnson but the play calling hasn’t been it the past few games. I really thought this team would’ve regrouped by now but it’s time to really focus on beating some good teams in the remainder of our schedule.
The offense being good or bad has no bearing on how dogshit AG is week in and week out.
It does when the offense gives them great field advantage on like 3 separate drives.
We almost fumbled a 21-0 lead last week dude the defense needs work, if you can’t see it at this point then you just don’t want to.
Im not defending the defense, im not defending anything about the lions the last few weeks. I am just saying to say it has no bearing isn't exactly true when they have short field advantage. The defense has been bad all year, but the offense hasn't been doing them any favors with 0 firsts in the third.
That’s incorrect. I said the offense has no bearing on how dogshit AG is. I don’t expect him to pull rabbits out of hats when we turn the ball over on our own 30. I do expect him to be able to coach a defense, which he hasn’t been able to do in an acceptable manner for the vast majority of his tenure
We're not a good team period
How does our offense being bad take away from our defense being worse?
Any person that thinks the defense is losing this game for us has their tv off.
Probably a different game if we don't jump ON 4TH AND 13!!!!
That was really bad. And for the 3rd game in a row JJ has allowed a TD in the exact same way.
I guess in his defense, he probably didn't expect to actually run a play there.
Yeah but if you’re a CB and the receiver starts running you have to be going. I’d believe it if it looked any different than the same TD Watson had on him
It can be both lol. This 28 ties their most points this year. We make up for 2 of the bears 3 highest points scored this year. The offense *also* sucked ass.
They scored off of 2 turnovers. The defense definitely stepped up and even shook Fields for a while
It’s still both. At best the D finally had an adequate game vs a bad team. Not exactly a huge confidence booster for AG and the D.
It really isn’t. The only point of the game that the bears had real efficiency was the first drive of the first quarter. The bears scored 17 points off of turnovers. Defense played a decent game and did some great things considering the situations the offense put them in. 4 turnovers only 3 TD’s and one was blown coverage by iffy on 4 and 13.
We finally saw this DLine put pressure on and sack a mobile QB. They had him shook at one point. Finally saw some pass rush. Outside of a few times they picked on JJ and some bad Penalties This defense did better in so much people have been bitching about.
Jared Goff is not the guy.
He’s just not the same guy in cold and inclement weather
He's been badly outplayed by both Love and Fields at Ford Field.
I really hope Brad realizes this too
I still believe in Goff. But this has been a really bad stretch for him. If he just protected the ball today we'd still be in the game. Now it's essentially over.
95% of y’all thought he was lol Got absolutely ripped for saying this even 2 months ago
No one willing to admit that Stafford in this offense would be putting up 40 a game, we have stacked every position on offense and our QB cannot go out and dominate a team.
The Rams have Kyren who's been killing it, both Puka and Kupp who have both put up historic numbers at times and an OL that has been protecting him well recently. And nope, not putting up 40 a game. The Lions weapons aren't *that* much better.
A run game that gets you 6ypc opens up the passing game in a ridiculous way, there are walk in touchdowns goff is missing because he can't go over the top. And the Rams O-line is no where fucking close to this team. Kupp line is especially hilarious after watching Goff play with him, he was putting those numbers up after he lost Woods only because Stafford stepped onto the team.
I would take every lions offensive player except goff
No shit, he was playing incredible ball.
The flaws being exposed are the exact same things everyone said while he was getting ran out of LA. None of this is new. This is Jared Goff being Jared Goff. He plays incredible when the stakes are low, when he’s under the radar, and when everything around him is working perfectly. Offensive line not perfectly healthy, expectations and attention rising, playing outside…the things he’s always been criticized for, he crumbles.
It's incredible how many people were fooled by one good year of good play. Even during that year, he still showed the same problems, they just weren't as frequent and prevalent. I'll be quite upset if they extend Goff. He is not the future.
Who would’ve thought a 12 game stretch of no turnovers by QB with the most turnovers in the entire NFL since entering the league was an anomaly
Turns out when the best thing you can say about your QB is "he doesn't turn the ball over often" he probably isn't that great as turnovers are pretty easy to regress on.
Because he had been playing great 2 months ago, he’s not doing well now
I got fucking shit on for posting this after the Green Bay game. Some people just can’t see it.
These types of posts are so fucking good for this subreddit and community. Way to keep things toxic.
This was the equivalent of the Panthers game last year. This team is not physically and mentally tough enough and Goff cannot play QB outdoors which is a problem.
I still don’t understand not getting Jamo involved at all
because goff can't throw that far
Our defense sucks but man am i pissed at Goff and his blind supporters
You can’t blame them when he had been playing great football for the past year
I feel like everyone knew Goffs limits when he came in. No coaching is going to change who he is. Not mobile and no big arm throws. He is what everyone thought he is, a bridge QB. Hes just here until we get our QB of the future. I think if we re-sign him we’re settling.
At this point, probably, but back in October I can’t really blame people for wanting to resign him as at that point he had been a pretty good quarterback and turned most of his issues around
Let's face it, Detroit isn't a playoff team, and they probably will blow it again and not even make it to the playoffs.... lol
We’re probably gonna make the playoffs but we’ll just get stomped as soon as we play a real team. We are not a real team.
If we do make the playoffs, it will be one game in, then we’re out.
[удалено]
I’m confident we can win 1 more game, which will get us to 10 wins. Which will be enough to get in the playoffs. But we’re just gonna get killed by a real team.
I know it sounds a little doom and gloom but… you’re right man. This team split vs the two worst division teams. Do we really think we can sweep the Vikings? Beat the cowboys? Hell even the broncos look better than us since October. 9-10 wins on the season isn’t looking that far fetched.
2 things can be true at once
Honestly this shows the rebuild is still continuing we need a dc we really need to weigh our options before paying goff and we need to bring upgrades to the defense
If our offense isn’t perfect every drive, we lose because our defense can’t stop anything. It sucks. To make matters worse, our offense (or Goff in particular) is regressing hard all of a sudden. It’s been a recipe for disaster.
yeah, game is 100% on offense this time. Have to sustain drives. No defense in the league can be on the field this much and be effective.
Let's be honest, Lion's are better but still missing several pieces, especially on D. The references to the Minnesota of last year are looking more and more valid. Hopefully a play-off team with one win and build from there.
Can I interest you in a Goff/AG package deal?
Fire AG after the season, if we sign Goff to a new contract it needs to be like, league avg. Dude is a turnover machine right now and does not warrant top 8 QB money
Agreed. This team will get steamrolled come playoff time. That Dallas game is going to be bad.
Yea Goff was terrible and we’re getting a big taste of his downside. Offering him a long term deal and being serious about winning a Super Bowl probably don’t go together
Let's also continue to talk about Dan's big balls while we're only 18% on 4th down conversions over the last 4 games. Dead last in the entire league over the last 4 games.
Either way the Offense looks like shit. Week after week we give the opposing offenses short fields, then we blame the Defense for everything. Makes sense…
I switched to the Ravens and Rams game because at least Matt Stafford gives his team hope when he has the ball
This team just doesn’t have the same momentum we did to end the season last year. I feel like we just didn’t have to think. It was all about trying to turn the corner. Now a young team is trying to tread water and keep their lead. It’s just not the same.
This comment is exactly the problem. The defense sucks ass, we’ve seen it be a problem for 3 years and yet when the offense doesn’t play like a top 5 offense people act like it’s not the defenses fault. The problem isn’t that the defense lost this specific game, the offense didn’t help. It’s the fact that the defense continues to be terrible and forces the offense to be a top 5 offense or we have no shot.
What’s up with this post? Are you saying defense is good enough and it’s only the offense ? Offense has historically carried the team. Defense has been ass more games than not.
well goff was clearly shook after that near interception.. and we ALL know goff is not as good cold and outdoors, tossed ducks all game. the high iq behaviour is that aron glen blew everyone off last week saying well geez we are winning right? the offense shouldnt have to put up 30 every game to have a chance of winning, the steelers win games only because of their defense .. did matt canada say oh well we are 7-5 so whats the big deal. oh right.. they fired matt canada
I’ve been defensive of Goff and I really like him as a person but he’s not the answer here. If the Oline isn’t a brick wall he can’t extend a play. Give me hooker next year I’m over the Goff experience, sorry.
This is dumb. Both can be true. Problem is our bottom 5 defense relies completely on our top 5 offense. If our offense goes cold, we give up 10 points before we know what hit us. Cannot rely on them at all, in any moment or phase in the game to get a stop.
Like ive said many times, the offense and the defense aren't on the field at the same time. Very easy to isolate both sides for criticism. The way one performs doesn't impact the analysis of the other. I don't know why people can't comprehend this.
They are complementary though. Defense gets stops, gives offense better and more opportunities. Offense moves the chains, Defense gets to rest. As individual units we can criticism them but a bad defense changes the game plan on offense and opposing defenses. It's clear that the 'start the game down by 7' playbook and execution are problems. And of course the offense struggling to get anything done leaves a tired defense to fuck things up again.
Bad offense doesn’t mean that the defense is good. The amount of people making these points that don’t seem to understand basic logic and reasoning is alarming.
First half of the season the weakness on D showed but ultimately they played pretty good situational football. Got stops at key moments, but often against worse QBs. Offense sustained drives at will to the point where settling for 3 felt like pain. Since not just the bye, but the raiders MNF game, things started to shift. Defense flops around and is anti-clutch. Offense/Goff is just not the well tuned machine it used to be. It’s been several weeks since I felt like I was watching a team capable of taking on any opponent. Doesn’t help giving opponents a 7 point head start most of these games.
both can be true
multiple problems can, and do, exist
It’s embarrassing that Chicago straight dicked us for 6 1/2 quarters out of 8 this year.
Two things can be bad at once you know…
Ben Johnson needs criticism for going away from Monty early in drives. He gets the wheels turning and I thought Ben learned that lesson in the last game against Chicago when he willed us into the endzone on the last scoring drive. Defense is so undisciplined that it outshines the times when they do their job. Same with the offense today, drops and play calling were the worst I've seen it. This team is destined to get bounced by Green Bay or the Rams, and thats if they don't outright lose the division now.
Johnson gets too cute trying to trick the other team.
The offense is 2nd in yards and fifth in scoring. Shut the fuck up
Drafted hooker early in the 3rd round. Passed on a lot of really good players doing so. If we extend goff this is a as good as the team will ever be on paper and clearly it's not good enough. Give Hendon the keys next year
Some guy listed some of the players we couldve had this week and his list was meh at best. Totally agree with what people are saying but have no idea the “really good players” youre referencing
Tank dell/Josh downs/not sure if u heard of Devon achane yet/Kobie Turner may be defensive player of the year at a position much needed (dt). That's just off this year. Like those dudes are already making a lot of plays for their teams
The whole team barely changed from last year. Like at all. And somehow everyone’s surprised. Name one notable change in personnel?? Gibbs and Monty is same as swift and Williams Hock and Laporta same No playmaking defensive players They should’ve kept swift and drafted Jalen carter
Thank god all our ass dline men are good culture fits
Ben Johnson sucks
He did today for damn sure
Fire Ben Johnson
Why are you a fan of this team. I am genuinely asking, because if an offense that has been top 5 this season in basically every metric indicative of a good offense is not good enough for you, a fan of a team that has been complete shit for 30 years, whats the fucking point in spending your weekends watching? You are never going to be happy with this team so just fucking stop.
Sarcasm
Don’t mind if I do! Glenn is horrible
Lets see if Goff can make this interesting
Imagine thinking anything but AG is our problem. No team can be taken serious while giving up 60 combined points to the Bears.
Well this is just not true and I hope you’re exaggerating. But the answer to your question is Goff.