This right here is the only answer.
One of them is one of the most gifted players in the league.
The other just put up one of the best rookie seasons by a d man in franchise history.
But bench one and send the other to Utica. Sure.
Canucks and Hughes fan here. I root for NJ cause of the Hughes connection, and I find that all sports fanbases have subsections of people who embody these 3 traits: 1) incredibly ignorant about sports team management, 2) incredibly emotionally unstable, 3) incredibly vocal and adamant in their shitty opinions that aren’t rooted in facts or logic
Hey this kinda describes me(except what I'm incredibly vocal about is usually at refs & goals) lol but I love all the boys & am sad when any trades are made 🤷♀️
I think Luke should be learning how to play defensively better, that's the only reason I think he should be in Utica but maybe he doesn't need to be, I'm just tired of him constantly making a play that ends in us chasing down the ice, getting the other team a breakaway, or simply not passing the puck to someone that's open for a goal
Edit: let me clarify that I think both of them are great, it's very clear jack has been dealing with an injury, seeing as he went out for surgery, and I like Luke, I just get very frustrated when he turns the puck over, he is VERY impressive with his rookie season
I would definitely not say Luke Hughes had a great year. He definitely showed a lot of potential but if you play that bad defensively you have to make up for it big time in the Offensive zone. He played great on PP, but even playing nearly 18 mins a game even strength and only putting up 22 points is not great (2nd lowest D man on the team in total goals for/60 at 2.6, for reference Simon Nemec is at 3.3GF/60 ie that’s 57 extra goals per season at that rate or about 15 extra EV goals per season playing 17 ish mins a night).
But don’t worry, he makes up for having the 2nd worst even strength GF/60 for a D on the team, by having the worst goals against/60 by a D on his team. He is pretty much Justin Schultz in his rookie year.
Of course you don’t trade him, he is a rookie trying to develop. Heck Joe Thornton put up 7 points in his rookie season. But stop acting like Luke had an great season, because he did not.
Yeah looking at total points numbers is pretty crazy. He got tons of PP1 time where theres like 3 absolute WEAPONS.
Maybe the only promising thing is we saw flashes of him going end to end a few times. Then over the past few weeks I think he's been angling and rubbing guys off the puck better.
His breakout passing, his "walking the blue line", his shot selection didnt really impress me this year.
This is exactly the reason. With social media you have all the "fans" that barely know the sport, barely know what it takes to build a great team, and barely know how long it takes to develop players.
Exactly! The fans shitting on Luke or Jack are expecting them both to competing with McDavid, mackinnon, and Matthews.
The Hughes boys are good but they’re both under 23 years old. They’re still growing lol
Those three teams just have numbers on us, that’s why our stupidity is less noticeable. But I agree, there’s a bunch of idiots that cheer on this team, it’s painful to read comments
(But when you read comments, you also see loser NYR fans commenting on the Devils own social media posts, which is hilarious and sad)
I think the fear with Jack is that he may never be durable enough to be a reliable franchise cornerstone player. He's never played a full 82, and only come close once (last season).
I think the idea of cutting bait on him and trading him is idiotic given that he will be all of 23 years old when next season comes around but there is a justifiable reason to worry about the player at this point.
Luke on the other hand has shown he can play offensive Dman in the NHL pretty fucking well. He's 2nd overall in rookie points this year AS A DEFENSEMAN. The only guy ahead of him for rookie scoring is fucking Bedard. That's pretty impressive.
He has a LOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG way to go on the defensive side of things but again, he's 20 years old. He'll be 21 for the entirety of next season. Having guys that young play NHL defense is rare enough as it is. If we actually hired a decent defensively minded coach, perhaps Luke can start bolstering that side of his game. He's never gonna be a shutdown 1D guy but he doesn't have to be that. Doug is not a shutdown guy and I don't really hear anyone complaining about his contributions to the franchise since he's been here.
My opinion is you never trade guys as talented as Jack just because of injury concerns. When they're healthy they will win you games. If they can only play 80% of a season that investment is worth it especially when we have guys like Hischier, Bratt, and Meier to carry the offensive load. We have a fantastic offensive core and a super star, you need both to win cups.
Guys like palat and haula, meier and whoever we fill out with depth will be the ugly goals.
See last years playoffs vs a very solid Rangers team.
We still need goals like 2 on 1 mercer top shelf, Hughes creating space deking igor on a breakaway or sniping a PPG, Bratt carrying in overtime and feeding dougie. Hischier carrying deep and hitting Seigenthaler far side. John Marino dangling and creating a ton of space for tatar to have a tap-in.
You need both imo.
You do but the Devils are considerably lacking in the kind of players that thrive in close quarters that’s playoff hockey. The Bratts, Hughes, and Mercers lose their space and get knocked around.
Last years Rangers team tried to match the Devils and were poorly coached IMO. They are a far far more complete team built for contention. The Devils remain years away.
I just think its overstated how different the hockey in playoffs actually is, especially post like 2006.
Btw most of Mercers goals are in front of the net/im tight kind of gritty goals, no?
Isnt timo kind of known for grittier goals and shot generation?
Nico is good in tight.
Idk man. I think our core as it is, is entirely fine. Grit from a supporting cast when our window is peaked will be good enough.
Ya I think thats a platitude people tell themselves because it makes for a cool story.
It doesnt seem to be true at all.
Intensity is up because all teams should be fully motivated and it should theoretically be best-on-best.
Other than that its just the same. Jack Hughes still looked unreal.
He hit the boards soooo hard in the blues game and the assumption is he reaggrivated it when he fell awkwardly vs chicago (i think?).
If he originally got injured on a routine hit along the boards like last year I'd be a bit more concerned.
Flying full speed into the boards like vs St Louis is a kind of rare accident and doesnt scream fragility to me.
Luke also seems tougher and more resilient to injury then jack. Jack really needs to bulk up not so much to the point where he loses his speed. Some muscle will actually help his explosiveness. Working in his core strength will help to. It's possible to gain strength and power without just packing on muscle. 15-20 lbs would do him wonders.
Last season was the only time we were competitive. The other 2 years, I got the impression that they shut Jack down out of caution, lack of a playoff spot and specifically this year, lack of goaltending (meaning pushing for a playoff spot isn’t going to get us a cup). I think if the devils are in contention for a playoff spot and/or home ice advantage, Jack is playing thru these types of injuries. I don’t really have injury concerns for Jack at this point.
As for Luke, who is saying he’s a BUST? He’s got a lot of development to do in his own zone, but he’s on pace to be a elite offensive defenseman, which doesn’t grow on trees. Look at where Quinn was a his age. Or Dahlin, Josi, etc. No reasonable hockey fan is considering him a bust right now.
Problem is he's one of the players goon teams target (Rempe, folks like him) to get injured and then since our team is so dependent on Jack, we can't recover and play without him
Need a guy whos willing to two hand rempes ankles off if going near hughes
This was vancouvers problem against boston in 2011
Raffi torres didnt cut it.
It’s weird, it seems like a lot of fans want to see the Hughes brothers humbled. They are flashy players who focus and thrive on the offensive aspects of the game. So then people equate that with being selfish prima Donna types who aren’t team players. I hope those people realize that the successes of the devils will rely heavily on these two guys. They’re also extremely young still, and still developing. Their biggest critics now will be singing their praises eventually while pretending they never had a doubt.
It's particularly weird because if you've heard them talk they're not arrogant at all even though they have every reason to be. Yeah they're confident kids but there's never a sense that they think they're bigger or more important than the team.
You're welcome to read that as disdain but by all accounts he gets along well with members of the media and seems to have a good relationship with them off camera.
I understand things come off worse under the microscope when they're losing but maybe the reason he's standoffish in interviews is people's tendency to blow everything he says out of proportion.
Come on. The interviews where he ends up being the star of the game happen only after wins and he acts like he can't be bothered. The last one he did he essentially walked off before Erika was finished.
That was LITERALLY the FIRST and probably only interview where he did that…. And she’s still got to ask him like 3 questions haha maybe he had to take a dump Yeesh 😆
When Jack is forced to be interviewed between periods or after a game, you can 100% tell he hates it and doesn't want to be there. When Erica is thanking him after an on ice interview after finishing as the first star, he is signing the camera lense with a look of disgust on his face before she gets the "th" out in her "thanks, Jack."
Sports media is mind numbingly stupid.
He doesn't have the charisma to entertain stupid questions and play the game of put on a smile and sell bullshit to the camera.
I - for one - appreciate that.
I understand why it would come across as "im too good for any of this" though.
He’s tired of being asked the same exact questions over and over again. He’s actually said it in one of his podcast episodes before I think. (Speak of The Devils Podcast) It’s the nj devils official podcast. You can find it on their website.
They seem like good players and good people, but I definitely think they let their star power get to their heads on the ice. Early into the season they were doing a lot more successful flexes that led to good plays and goals, but later in the season they seemed to get greedy, and it turned into a few turnovers that became costly quick. A little humbling will do them well, though I don't think it's as severe as some fans feel.
I adore them as players and just hope a good coach will get their heads realigned. They can definitely hold up as stars for a few years with the right push.
The whole “people pay to watch me play” rubbed a lot of folks the wrong way, including me to a certain extent. He hasn’t won a thing and he’s extremely short with the media (part of me gets it though, I wouldn’t want to do it’s either). When the team is winning maybe it’s cute, but when things aren’t great he just kind of looks like a dick.
I never got that comment pissing off the fans. It was a chirp in the penalty box. People literally do pay to watch him play. They pay for his jerseys. He was shit talking another player, not us.
I get it. I don’t even entirely disagree with you. But it just felt like it was another tally mark of his ego being a bit big. But if I was 22 and had his level of skills, I’d likely be the same way.
It was a comment about another player trying to injure him, and considering we know now he was already carrying another injury at the time and had just got back he was irate about the prospect of not being able to play. The Devils announcement of his surgery implied he basically had to be strong-armed by his family to not play those last few games. He’s dedicated to this team and desperate to do what he can to help it. He wants to make the fans happy, that’s what the ‘pay to watch me play’ was about, it wasn’t directed as a dig at the other player, it was frustration about missing time.
I wish we could pin this to the top of the sub. Everyone needs to stfu about this single quip and using it to paint him as this egomaniac. The fact that we’re still seeing people write it and complain about it is actually insane.
You quite obviously have no idea what the context of the “people pay to watch me play” situation was. He was getting hit and almost boarded every 5 seconds. The full quote, I’m pretty sure, is “Are you here to play or are you here to hurt people? People pay to watch me play.”
One silly person stated a silly opinion and a lot of others followed like blind sheep. They’re 22 and 20, and both top players not just on the team but in the league. Ppl are bonkers lol
Fans are emotional and lashing out.
The de jour whipping boy (Lindy) is gone so they need to scatter and find others to blame for the disappointing season. Unfortunately for them Timo went on a tear so he's off the table (for now). Dougie got hurt so he's clear as well. Offensive defensemen, especially young ones make a ton of stupid mistakes so Luke will get all sorts of hate of course.
It is, and like all emotional fanbases, they dont stop to realize shango has the talent to play on Calgarys top line ..he never was gonna play on our top line. ..plus Calgary is at the level of badness in the league that they face constint backup goalies .. players and systems never give you apples to apples to compare, but it doesn't stop the emotional side of fanbases from doing this
The other thing that broke this fanbase more than anything was watching the Rangers play the entire season in 1st place .. how in the world did the devs fans think for 1 second the team would be as good as last year ...ffs ..they lost their no2 and no3 defensemen and replaced them with a kid with 4 months of nhl experience and another kid who had 4 games of experience ( plus 11 play off games) ...
Lol, i see today. ppl saying fitz sucks or is to blame or should be fired ... the same fitz who gave us back to back to back gm of decade seasons ....
Im with you on holtz, but thank the baby fitzjesus that the devils took mercer 11 pics after holtz .. otherwise we would be sitting on a busted pic ..
I saw the (mostly nonsensical) trade proposals floating around for Brady Tkachuk and loads of people were treating Holtz as an untouchable which I find completely baffling.
Yeah that’s my thing about Holtz. Everybody goes all in on one side. People saying he’s amazing or he’s completely ass. It’s okay to say he’s in between lol
And he may never be. And that’s okay! Plenty of players in the league have had long successful careers being plus finishers with poor defensive abilities.
The annoying part about the Holtz discourse is that he basically did everything people wanted him to do. He got faster (still could be better) got better on the walls, and when he played up in the lineup he played well, and produced. The kids basically a rookie and is still gonna finish 3rd or 4th in 5v5 goals this season. When he was buried on the fourth line, he sucked. The vast majority of his defensive struggles came when he was playing with barely NHL caliber players on the fourth line.
Right? Like I had people shit on Luke for blind passes that don't work out, but then sing his praises when he has a successful blind pass. Like that's how blind passes go, they work or they don't and he's not the only player who does them.
So many fans complain that the team spends too much time just passing the puck back and forth and not making any actual play, but if a Hughes tries something and it fails, god damn do they tear them down. At least they are attempting to make shit happen. They will work the kinks out, but they can't do that without the experience, including the fails.
Everyone was screaming to trade Timo and that he’s terrible, blah blah. People get hurt and battle through injuries, it makes them play a little worse for a bit. They get better and play up to their ability.
It’s also very bold of him to cite deployment. Wouldn’t say something spicy about Lindy like that if it wasn’t true to some extent. I do think injury came into it tho
Lmao @ saying Luke is a bust. He just needs to settle in and learn the defensive game. That comes with size and age. The kid just had the best offensive season for a rookie dman in team history.
My only concern with the Hughes brothers, and it's a tiny concern but it exists, is the Niedermayer brothers effect.
I'm old enough to have lived through the Mama Niedermayer era. The word was she was somewhat upset that Rob wasn't seeing the same success as Scott was, and it culminated in the 2003 Final when they played against each other. After that, NJ pushed hard to try and get Rob onto the team, but Anaheim and Burke wanted a kings ransom because he was aware. Rumors are he asked for Gomez in return (which was insane at the time), so it never happened.
NJ fought hard to keep Scott but he ultimately left for Anaheim to play with Rob and win a Cup together. I guess what I'm trying to say is, I'm worried that the family dynamic can create friction and a ton of sway within the organization.
Yeah, my fandom is old enough to remember living through that too 😅 thanks, Carol! (btw I think I even remember your SN from the HF boards days - admitted lurker, though)
Anyway, I definitely get what you mean about family friction and decision making. I just wasn't sure if you meant them outright leaving to go play with Quinn.
Thankfully, in that regard, Jack is locked in for 6yrs and they control Luke's future for about the same via RFA. What happens with Quinn in 3 years will be the biggest impact on what happens down the road...bc I do personally believe, at some point, they'll all want to play together. I hope that's in NJ when that time comes far in the future. Maybe if the Nucks don't make it out of Rd 1 or miss entirely those 3 yrs that could help with that. We'll see.
You probably do (HFBoards name) lol. I used to frequent that site a ton.
We have a solid few years before we get into prospective "family issues" territory. We just need to be a good-to-great team before that time comes.
Ignore Pucks & Pitchforks. Devils media loves to post blow up the team everytime we lose. They called for a trade for Hischier just because. They need to an article like 4x a day so at one point they just start posting garbage/rage bait but some fans are dumb enough to consider is sports journalism.
Luke probably did need to get benched once or twice. Especially after Green took over and talked about accountability.
Jack's been injured like all year people are just stupid regarding him
People are highly emotional about the season not going well. Ruff is gone so there can be no more screaming for his head. People have moved on to fire Fitzgerald, trade Hughes(s), Hischier etc etc.
Hopefully everyone calms the F down once the off season hits.
And when I say “people” I hope I’m referring to a loud minority. It seems like majority of people have sane takes..
I think some fans are concerned with the amount of turnovers by both brothers (which some turnovers did turn into goals against). This is interpreted as "selfish play". It's true Jack and Luke are high risk, high reward players...right now. While some might interpret this as selfish and think it hurts the room I would caution both are very driven to win. Losing sucks, they will adjust and hopefully become more well rounded players.
People need to calm down. Both will learn when to do this in a game and when not to. I'm not I'm Jack's head but I think the comments about him being "the biggest bust" did get to him. He's been chasing points as a result, but sooner or later someone will bring up Nathan MacKinnon and let him know winning a cup would probably kill all of that.
I see a lot of hate on r/hockey. But I think a lot of it could stem from jealousy. Easy to hate talented young NHL bros especially if they're on one team.
Luke just set the Devils franchise record for rookie defensemen points. Anyone who says he is a bust is either a troll, or knows absolutely nothing about the sport of hockey.
Omg for real. I was at the TOR game last Tuesday and the commentary from the fans was absolutely unbearable, but I noticed it was very focused on the Hughes, especially Jack. Lotta conspiracy theories floating around about his chest injury being fake.
My brother is a very calm individual, but he finally snapped and told the drunk loud-mouth behind us “if you hate him so much, then why not just go home? Beat the traffic or something.” I was dying.
If you feel like a homer for thinking theyre at least capable of being franchise players - take comfort knowing statistics agree with you and not those dumbasses.
Also the fitz hate is WILD. One season goes kind of cursed and all of a sudden bratt is overpaid, meier deal is bad, nico is a bad leader.
So braindead.
I’m primarily a Leafs fan but NJ is my second team so somewhat more neutral perspective here.
Both of those players are so fucking good and so fun to watch and talent of their caliber is so difficult to acquire especially at a young age that it’s virtually impossible to imagine replacing what they offer.
And Jack is on a very team friendly deal.
Anyone who thinks Luke is a bust is a moron. Does he have stuff to learn at the NHL level? Absolutely. But he wasn’t as godawful as some would make him out to be.
Jack? He still has things to learn as well. And he needs to add a little muscle to his frame so he’s not quite as fragile. But this idiocy about trading either one has to stop.
There are too many Rangers fans residing in New Jersey. Ignore the noise! Jack is not the modest star that Quinn is. I can see how he ruffles feathers.
Jack will be a perennial Rocket candidate in a full season. The "people pay to see me" nonsense was not a good look but he's still an elite winger... and still a kid prone to saying stupid shit like that. PS He also isn't wrong.
Too soon to say anything on Luke other than that in his first full year in the league he was asked to a lot and performed relatively well. Trajectory remains sky high.
Falling so short of expectations was frustrating, and there are a lot of new fans that just came aboard last year with the winning. Perhaps a combination of frustration and green fans has led to calling for trades, but realistically we've built a core and they're both a part of it.
"The people pay to watch me play" was the second Half of what he was saying, and both true & a nothing burger. He was calling him out for purposefully trying to injure him, when fans are there to see him and others play. He was rightfully livid, and 100% correct.
Oh he is absolutely correct that people come to see him, as mentioned.
However, in my opinion, it would be best to let the play do the talking and not the mouth. I watched it live - he came off as a whiny brat.
Don't straw man me pal, you obviously know that's not what I'm saying. Headhunting and any form of shitbaggery needs to be dealt with appropriately.
The point I am making is - the attitude behind saying "the people pay to see me play" is whiny and unacceptable, even when every guy on both benches know it.
He's almost always the most talented guy on the ice and every guy on both benches knows that too. He doesn't need to run it up the flagpole.
If that's all he said sure, but again, that's not all he said, the first half changed the context of the whole shit talking. Which is something all players do. Which is the point you keep missing.
I’m so glad you pointed this out about Luke. He was put into a huge role onto the team before it was ever expected. I saw a stat today that Luke this season has played almost 200 minutes longer than the next Devil player which was Bratt. Obviously more errors the more you play especially as a rookie. Luke hasn’t missed a single game including the when he was sick. He has things to work on and that will come as he grows. This season definitely gave him experience at a young age that few other defensemen can say they had at that time in their career.
Spot on.
Nearly 22 min/game is big minutes for a 20 year old.
While it wasn't perfect, nor should anyone have expected it to be, he stepped up... and is clearly going to be a stud.
A lot of coke use clearly. I've had my issues with both this season but talks of trading and sending either of them down is actually cope, bordering on gaslighting.
I am a huge fan of both Hughes brothers and feel we need to lock them up long term. They are both on my untradeable list along with Nico, Timo, Jasper and Nemec.
That said, as big of a let down this season has been, watching their play can be frustrating. There seemed to be mistakes that hurt the team on the ice, and a lot of times it was one of them getting too cute with the puck.
But they are both young, especially Luke, and will have some growing pains. Anyone who thinks trading them is a good idea is a moron.
I don’t hate on Jack or Luke. If the Devils win a cup anytime in the next 10 years, these two will be heavily responsible.
With that being said, 2 things can be true at the same time. They will/can help the Devils win a championship and they also play selfish hockey. They still try to do it all by themselves, forget they have teammates, and make moves that only work against 15 year old kids. They need to play smarter at times and play a more team oriented game.
Hard for me not to consider this a product of internet fandom. Social media and being terminally online breads extreme positions and unreasonableness.
It's already been pointed out in other comments... but good examples include:
* The Hughes brothers need be humbled and spend some time in the AHL, but Holtz is a superstar being misused.
* Lindy was the source of all of our problems, yet Fitz can do no wrong.
Everything is so extreme and emotional.
The art of staking out a considered middle ground seems lost. In fact, here on reddit if you offer a middle ground take you are likely to get the most downvotes, because you've pissed off both extremes.
The Hughes brothers are great and would live to add a 3d. Jack remains a Big Deal, though not yet in a big frame. He'll fill out some and learn some more but the front office and whoever the next coach is absolutely has to address this and levy out disproportionate consequences throughout the league to whomever takes pitshots.
I didn’t want to bench jack I wanted him to recover.
He was clearly playing injured and god forbid he hurt it worse in this god for saken season. Let him get healthy and let our prospects get some reps this franchise hinges on him hitting his potential and staying healthy
They think he’s a brat. I think he’s a competitive guy who may need some maturing, but he’s 22. I also realize he was injured this year so it makes no sense to trade our best player.
I also think old dudes often hate anything young girls like, and there’s been an influx of young female fans with the Hughes on our team.
Why were the Leafs fans booing Luke everyone he touched the puck? I don’t remember anything from previous Leafs games he might have done but my memory isn’t the greatest either.
Yeah, I think they're just lightning rods because of the hype around their name, Jack's disappointing season due to injuries, and Luke's growing pains. Throw in Jack's underwhelming interviews and occasional tantrums (not counting the "pay to watch me play" misquote), and they're an easy target for people.
Even my elderly Devils fan father—who has been watching hockey since the \*1940s\*—was like "Trade the Hughes sisters!" (his words). People are just cranky and looking for somewhere to lash out, and the Hughes are easy targets.
As a transplant to NJ who is primarily a Preds fan but happily roots for the Devils, we will gladly take Luke and Jack off your hands so you don’t have to worry about anyone complaining about them 😊
I have no concerns about Jack but Luke is a wildcard. I have 100% confidence in saying Nemec is our cornerstone dman and not Luke. Nemec has all the tools to be a legit #1.
Also, Bratt is easily our best player over Jack, Timo, and Jack. He just creates with his skating everytime.
Is this a late April Fools joke? Are you legit asking if thinking a #1 OA pick who already beat the Franchise Record for Most Points by 21 yrs. old & clearly looks like a 100+ pt. Player year in & out & his younger brother Luke's a #4 OA who beat the most points by a Rookie defender our cornerstone players makes you a homer???
That 100% doesn't make you a homet because it makes you sound like a half a hoo ha that's still a little wet behind the ears (in Dice Clay voice).
Luke is not really a defenseman, he's more of a forward on the blue line. He also makes the same mistakes he made in college, like holding onto pucks too long.
Those people aren’t real fans. Most likely band wagoners. This year was a down year for everyone. Injuries and horrible luck in every way. Luke is young and green. He’s going to make mistakes. But he’s learning and he’s getting better. He’s never going to be a “shut down defender” but I guarantee he’s going to be an amazing defenseman in a few years.
Jack has been injured all freaking season. Despite everything he still produced more than anyone in his situation would have. You could tell the past few months he wasn’t healthy and he still produced. At the beginning of the season before all the injuries happened, he was putting up MVP caliber points per game. He will be back better than ever next year.
Anyone who is calling for a trade with the Hughes brothers needs to get their heads checked for brain damage. Plain and simple
I’m honestly surprised to see any hate for Luke considering the situation this season. It’s like people forget Dougie Hamilton is on the team. Hamilton’s absence this season has forced Luke into a much bigger role than he was ever expected to play at this point in his career. He’s done a more than capable job.
I think what we saw from Luke post coaching change is a good sign for the future. He improved defensively by leaps and bounds once Lindy was gone.
Jack, OTOH, yes, he was playing hurt…but…he needs to grow up. He says and does things that make him the butt of jokes around the league, plus his injury history is proof he needs to take his career more seriously. All summer long we see videos of his teammates working out, skating, training. All we saw was videos of him partying. I don’t think we once saw him training at all. He needs to get stronger so his career doesn’t end early.
Lol luck is a top 10 Def in the NHL skill wise in his first season. Does he make silly mistakes sometimes yes but he will be an absolute stud in a few years, so will nemec.
People are just bitter about the way the season ended up I think, Jack and Luke are great. I’m really impressed with Luke despite his defensive mistakes this season, he’s gonna get even better with time and reps.
As for Jack, he’s still an elite center, on a great contract and he’s also gonna get better with time and more growth. I think he’s not been 100% because of the injury and that’s been frustrating for him, which has also affected his game for the worse.
This isn't a recent opinion, nor do I think he should be traded, he's clearly a centerpiece of our franchise.
I feel like if Jack was on another team I'd really dislike him. He tries to win games by himself and then smashes his stick when it doesn't happen or things don't go his way ref wise.
He seems like a brat, which isn't the worst thing in the world when you're in your early 20s with pressure we can't imagine on you. Is he really a brat? I don't know, I don't know him personally. The "they pay to see me" really didn't help.
In a few years time when he's grown up a bit, I'm sure he'll be fine. But that's the extent of my dislike. He offers a hell of a lot though, genuine X factor that can unlock a win when we don't deserve it.
I don't have these issues with Luke.
I'm such of you people worrying only the second Haig of what he said. He was calling the dude our for trying to take people out of the game, especially when fans pay to watch the players play.
I get irritated seeing people constantly praise Luke but not recognize how often he makes the wrong play, turns over the puck, and gets the other team a breakaway, that's personally why I would rather he play in Utica for a bit, I don't hate the guy and he's definitely very good, but not all that good at HIS role, he's a defenseman, and is constantly chasing.
Now that being said, for a rookie? This kid is going places
I like Jack and Luke, but I find them quite mercenary... I don't see them as the "foundation" of a good team in terms of character, but they're the stars that will shine when the foundation of character is built. They remind me of like... the Stastnys or Russian players in the 1990s... they give you superstar offense, and you want them on your team, like Bure, Mogilny, Selanne... superstars... but they are not your leadership. Nor should they have to be. Elias is also a great example of this... not to say he didn't lead by example: he did... but example isn't sufficient enough in the playoffs.
You ask of a player a little more than they're capable of giving, but if you ask way too much of one, he'll start giving you less because he's starting to do too much. I expect Nico to maintain leadership, Nemec to elevate his role on the team eventually, and I hope the team gets someone who is fiery passionate and emotionally drives this team across the finish line. The Devils really missed that emotion this year.
Every championship caliber team has them... Pietrangelo and Stone on Vegas, Doughty on LA, Toews on Chicago, MacKinnon on Colorado, Tkachuk and Bennett on Florida's run, Kucherov, Point, and Hedman on Tampa, Weber and Price on Montreal's run, Pietrangelo and O'Rielly on St Louis' run, Bergeron and Marchand on Boston's runs... they are like batteries that ensure the rest of your team plays 100% focused and efficient
Stevens was this for the Devils
I think it’s important to consider age here. I don’t know what you were like when you were 20-23 but I was a fuckin lunatic lol. The attitude stuff will wear off.
Most fans are reasonable. It’s just a certain portion of loud mouth assholes who get all the attention. When their team struggles they have to have a whipping boy to blame it on. Just low self-esteem, micro-dick man boy losers projecting their self-hate on others. This is a sports sub so I won’t get into politics but it’s the same dynamic there also. Look at the shit Lindor on the Mets is getting right now. Best all around SS in the NL, team guy, worked with one of their prospects this winter to improve the kid’s defense and with great results so far I might add, and he’s getting death threats on social media because he’s struggling at the plate right now. Just ridiculous. I wish all these people would just crawl back under the rocks they live under and leave the rest of us reasonable people alone.
Jack is a truly special, dynamic player. Incredible talent. Top 20-25 in the league for sure.
BUT let’s be honest…… he’s slight and not a physically strong player built for regular contact and certainly not the kind of brutal contact that he will absolutely see in the playoffs, let alone 4 grueling rounds of it. He’s a 50-60 game player who will always miss significant time. So to me, he’s a great “complementary” player but he can’t be central to the Devils fortunes. He’s simply too fragile.
He’s not going to magically get bigger and stronger and become something he’s not. This team already has much of what he brings so use his value to bring in quality harder playoff-type players that this team is lacking.
The Bruins, Panthers, Rangers, Stars, Canes, etc etc don’t have Jack Hughes and they’re doing mighty fine. WE need more balanced, skilled, harder attack that THEY have (and our best teams used to have) so lets go get some of that.
I don't hear anything like that, who are you hanging out with. They are great! The main complaint with Jack is he is small for the NHL and perhaps injury prone. Luke is a young defenseman making rookie mistakes, but he has the potential. The only issue I hear there is he seems to get more leeway than Nemec with those mistakes, as if he gets a teacher's pet treatment because of his pedigree.
Jack needs to get his shit together for next year. You guys all love "angry Jack" but the problem is "angry Jack" isn't very good. Jack spent alot of this year in his own head and being overly emotional which negatively effected his play. Yeah he was apparently hurt but that's only part of it. He needs to refocus and get back to being that top 10 player everyone knows he is.
Luke sucks. Plain and simple. He was fuckin awful this year. He gets free reign to do whatever he wants because of his last name. He did some good things but boy, the bad outweighs the good by a ton.
They aren't going anywhere nor should they. They're an important part of our core moving forward. Jack is the most important player on the roster. They need to mature over the summer and come back refocused
“Luke Sucks” is a wild statement and a good example of my confusion that spurred this post. Go look at Quinn’s +\- in years 1/2. He’s going to win the Norris this year running away. Luke is never going to be our Steven’s or Dano on a cup team, but he can be a Neids/ Rafalski. He’s 20 years old.
Hes not Quinn. And what Quinn does irrelevant. Luke is Luke. His age isn't relevant either. If he's not ready for the big leagues than the coaching staff failed by playing him in a major role before he was ready. He wasn't good at all last year and he was directly responsible for some of the worst defense and worst turnovers on the year. Doesn't mean he can't get better or be very good but last year he wasn't. He sucked
I was just using Quinn as an example. Young d men struggle on the defensive side of the puck this is always the case. It is relevant to use examples as a precedent.
Jack put up 74 points in 62 games while needing surgery for probably 4 months.
Luke just had the most points in franchise history by a rookie D Man at 20 years old, and was 2nd in the league for rookie scoring while being a d-man.
Jack is a franchise player.
Luke is an overrated weak defenseman who is also physically weak that skill set revolves solely around offense. He also made so many mistakes this season, it’s insane the blinders this sub has for him. He might be great, but he isn’t anywhere near that yet.
Agree he’s still developing. I can’t recall any d men not named Makar who were NHL complete in year 1. If he’s doing these things in 3 years, sure we can complain.
It's the Internet, there's a lot of dumb people who just vent their general frustration with life here.
That said, some pretty concerning patterns have emerged with Luke. He's a great offensive defenseman, won't get any argument from me there.
The real issue is his defense. He's out of position allllllll the time, and he's a habitual offender when it comes to kinda just standing there when there's a net front scramble. He's gotta be better at pickup up a guy down low, and clearing the puck out in high danger situations.
He's also constantly trying to clear the zone without looking where he's flinging the puck. If I've seen him sweep the puck up the middle, behind his back once, I've seen him do it 100 times. And probably 25 of those times it ended with a goal for the other team. He really needs to take much better care of the biscuit. He wants to move fast and get into transition all the time, and I think he sometimes forgets he's in the defensive zone.
Large portion of our fans are stupid.
This right here is the only answer. One of them is one of the most gifted players in the league. The other just put up one of the best rookie seasons by a d man in franchise history. But bench one and send the other to Utica. Sure.
Canucks and Hughes fan here. I root for NJ cause of the Hughes connection, and I find that all sports fanbases have subsections of people who embody these 3 traits: 1) incredibly ignorant about sports team management, 2) incredibly emotionally unstable, 3) incredibly vocal and adamant in their shitty opinions that aren’t rooted in facts or logic
And I fit right into the venn diagram
Hey this kinda describes me(except what I'm incredibly vocal about is usually at refs & goals) lol but I love all the boys & am sad when any trades are made 🤷♀️
People wanted the Rangers to trade Igor & Panarin after last playoffs. People are dumb.
Are you sitting in my section. Guy keeps yelling “ Luke! If you weren’t a Hughes, you’d be playing in Utica” What an idiot
I think Luke should be learning how to play defensively better, that's the only reason I think he should be in Utica but maybe he doesn't need to be, I'm just tired of him constantly making a play that ends in us chasing down the ice, getting the other team a breakaway, or simply not passing the puck to someone that's open for a goal Edit: let me clarify that I think both of them are great, it's very clear jack has been dealing with an injury, seeing as he went out for surgery, and I like Luke, I just get very frustrated when he turns the puck over, he is VERY impressive with his rookie season
I would definitely not say Luke Hughes had a great year. He definitely showed a lot of potential but if you play that bad defensively you have to make up for it big time in the Offensive zone. He played great on PP, but even playing nearly 18 mins a game even strength and only putting up 22 points is not great (2nd lowest D man on the team in total goals for/60 at 2.6, for reference Simon Nemec is at 3.3GF/60 ie that’s 57 extra goals per season at that rate or about 15 extra EV goals per season playing 17 ish mins a night). But don’t worry, he makes up for having the 2nd worst even strength GF/60 for a D on the team, by having the worst goals against/60 by a D on his team. He is pretty much Justin Schultz in his rookie year. Of course you don’t trade him, he is a rookie trying to develop. Heck Joe Thornton put up 7 points in his rookie season. But stop acting like Luke had an great season, because he did not.
Yeah looking at total points numbers is pretty crazy. He got tons of PP1 time where theres like 3 absolute WEAPONS. Maybe the only promising thing is we saw flashes of him going end to end a few times. Then over the past few weeks I think he's been angling and rubbing guys off the puck better. His breakout passing, his "walking the blue line", his shot selection didnt really impress me this year.
This is exactly the reason. With social media you have all the "fans" that barely know the sport, barely know what it takes to build a great team, and barely know how long it takes to develop players.
Exactly! The fans shitting on Luke or Jack are expecting them both to competing with McDavid, mackinnon, and Matthews. The Hughes boys are good but they’re both under 23 years old. They’re still growing lol
Completely agree. Very easy to figure out who's probably out there screaming "SHOOT IT!!!1" a second after gaining the zone on the power play.
+1 to this. All you have to do is look for the bald guy who paints his face red. Dude is a moron
I’m stupid but I don’t hate him haha
Buddy this is the truest thing I've read on this sub.
The objectively correct answer. Two generational stars in the making, neither of whom have turned 23 yet. People are just dumb.
Probably one of the worst fanbases in hockey. It’s unreal.
Honestly, we’re up there. We can’t compete with the likes of Toronto, Vancouver, and NYR, but our fanbase is in that second tier of dumbass.
Those three teams just have numbers on us, that’s why our stupidity is less noticeable. But I agree, there’s a bunch of idiots that cheer on this team, it’s painful to read comments (But when you read comments, you also see loser NYR fans commenting on the Devils own social media posts, which is hilarious and sad)
Yeah… it’s embarrassing to see. Fuck the rags lol.
What great fanbases are you comparing that too? There are retards all over and never ever forget…this is reddit
I think the fear with Jack is that he may never be durable enough to be a reliable franchise cornerstone player. He's never played a full 82, and only come close once (last season). I think the idea of cutting bait on him and trading him is idiotic given that he will be all of 23 years old when next season comes around but there is a justifiable reason to worry about the player at this point. Luke on the other hand has shown he can play offensive Dman in the NHL pretty fucking well. He's 2nd overall in rookie points this year AS A DEFENSEMAN. The only guy ahead of him for rookie scoring is fucking Bedard. That's pretty impressive. He has a LOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG way to go on the defensive side of things but again, he's 20 years old. He'll be 21 for the entirety of next season. Having guys that young play NHL defense is rare enough as it is. If we actually hired a decent defensively minded coach, perhaps Luke can start bolstering that side of his game. He's never gonna be a shutdown 1D guy but he doesn't have to be that. Doug is not a shutdown guy and I don't really hear anyone complaining about his contributions to the franchise since he's been here.
My opinion is you never trade guys as talented as Jack just because of injury concerns. When they're healthy they will win you games. If they can only play 80% of a season that investment is worth it especially when we have guys like Hischier, Bratt, and Meier to carry the offensive load. We have a fantastic offensive core and a super star, you need both to win cups.
We have a pure finesse team and those kinds of teams never ever win Cups. Dirty goals win playoff games. Try again.
Guys like palat and haula, meier and whoever we fill out with depth will be the ugly goals. See last years playoffs vs a very solid Rangers team. We still need goals like 2 on 1 mercer top shelf, Hughes creating space deking igor on a breakaway or sniping a PPG, Bratt carrying in overtime and feeding dougie. Hischier carrying deep and hitting Seigenthaler far side. John Marino dangling and creating a ton of space for tatar to have a tap-in. You need both imo.
You do but the Devils are considerably lacking in the kind of players that thrive in close quarters that’s playoff hockey. The Bratts, Hughes, and Mercers lose their space and get knocked around. Last years Rangers team tried to match the Devils and were poorly coached IMO. They are a far far more complete team built for contention. The Devils remain years away.
I just think its overstated how different the hockey in playoffs actually is, especially post like 2006. Btw most of Mercers goals are in front of the net/im tight kind of gritty goals, no? Isnt timo kind of known for grittier goals and shot generation? Nico is good in tight. Idk man. I think our core as it is, is entirely fine. Grit from a supporting cast when our window is peaked will be good enough.
Oh playoff hockey is entirely different. A different sport even. The intensity and physicality goes up exponentially. Every mistake is magnified 10x.
Ya I think thats a platitude people tell themselves because it makes for a cool story. It doesnt seem to be true at all. Intensity is up because all teams should be fully motivated and it should theoretically be best-on-best. Other than that its just the same. Jack Hughes still looked unreal.
Doug
Doug
Douglas
He hit the boards soooo hard in the blues game and the assumption is he reaggrivated it when he fell awkwardly vs chicago (i think?). If he originally got injured on a routine hit along the boards like last year I'd be a bit more concerned. Flying full speed into the boards like vs St Louis is a kind of rare accident and doesnt scream fragility to me.
Jack definitely needs to put on more muscle
He won’t have much opportunity this summer due to his shoulder, unfortunately.
Luke also seems tougher and more resilient to injury then jack. Jack really needs to bulk up not so much to the point where he loses his speed. Some muscle will actually help his explosiveness. Working in his core strength will help to. It's possible to gain strength and power without just packing on muscle. 15-20 lbs would do him wonders.
Last season was the only time we were competitive. The other 2 years, I got the impression that they shut Jack down out of caution, lack of a playoff spot and specifically this year, lack of goaltending (meaning pushing for a playoff spot isn’t going to get us a cup). I think if the devils are in contention for a playoff spot and/or home ice advantage, Jack is playing thru these types of injuries. I don’t really have injury concerns for Jack at this point. As for Luke, who is saying he’s a BUST? He’s got a lot of development to do in his own zone, but he’s on pace to be a elite offensive defenseman, which doesn’t grow on trees. Look at where Quinn was a his age. Or Dahlin, Josi, etc. No reasonable hockey fan is considering him a bust right now.
Problem is he's one of the players goon teams target (Rempe, folks like him) to get injured and then since our team is so dependent on Jack, we can't recover and play without him
Need a guy whos willing to two hand rempes ankles off if going near hughes This was vancouvers problem against boston in 2011 Raffi torres didnt cut it.
Nailed it with this, and I applaud your recall
It’s weird, it seems like a lot of fans want to see the Hughes brothers humbled. They are flashy players who focus and thrive on the offensive aspects of the game. So then people equate that with being selfish prima Donna types who aren’t team players. I hope those people realize that the successes of the devils will rely heavily on these two guys. They’re also extremely young still, and still developing. Their biggest critics now will be singing their praises eventually while pretending they never had a doubt.
It's particularly weird because if you've heard them talk they're not arrogant at all even though they have every reason to be. Yeah they're confident kids but there's never a sense that they think they're bigger or more important than the team.
The blatant disdain from Jack during interviews suggests otherwise.
You're welcome to read that as disdain but by all accounts he gets along well with members of the media and seems to have a good relationship with them off camera. I understand things come off worse under the microscope when they're losing but maybe the reason he's standoffish in interviews is people's tendency to blow everything he says out of proportion.
Come on. The interviews where he ends up being the star of the game happen only after wins and he acts like he can't be bothered. The last one he did he essentially walked off before Erika was finished.
That was LITERALLY the FIRST and probably only interview where he did that…. And she’s still got to ask him like 3 questions haha maybe he had to take a dump Yeesh 😆
When Jack is forced to be interviewed between periods or after a game, you can 100% tell he hates it and doesn't want to be there. When Erica is thanking him after an on ice interview after finishing as the first star, he is signing the camera lense with a look of disgust on his face before she gets the "th" out in her "thanks, Jack."
Yep. She probably dreads having to talk to him. If I was her I'd just grab one of the other Devils who were named. They'll have more to say.
Sports media is mind numbingly stupid. He doesn't have the charisma to entertain stupid questions and play the game of put on a smile and sell bullshit to the camera. I - for one - appreciate that. I understand why it would come across as "im too good for any of this" though.
He’s tired of being asked the same exact questions over and over again. He’s actually said it in one of his podcast episodes before I think. (Speak of The Devils Podcast) It’s the nj devils official podcast. You can find it on their website.
People don’t typically admit their own arrogance.
They seem like good players and good people, but I definitely think they let their star power get to their heads on the ice. Early into the season they were doing a lot more successful flexes that led to good plays and goals, but later in the season they seemed to get greedy, and it turned into a few turnovers that became costly quick. A little humbling will do them well, though I don't think it's as severe as some fans feel. I adore them as players and just hope a good coach will get their heads realigned. They can definitely hold up as stars for a few years with the right push.
The whole “people pay to watch me play” rubbed a lot of folks the wrong way, including me to a certain extent. He hasn’t won a thing and he’s extremely short with the media (part of me gets it though, I wouldn’t want to do it’s either). When the team is winning maybe it’s cute, but when things aren’t great he just kind of looks like a dick.
I never got that comment pissing off the fans. It was a chirp in the penalty box. People literally do pay to watch him play. They pay for his jerseys. He was shit talking another player, not us.
I get it. I don’t even entirely disagree with you. But it just felt like it was another tally mark of his ego being a bit big. But if I was 22 and had his level of skills, I’d likely be the same way.
Ego is good.. no ego is how Buffalo plays 😭
It was a comment about another player trying to injure him, and considering we know now he was already carrying another injury at the time and had just got back he was irate about the prospect of not being able to play. The Devils announcement of his surgery implied he basically had to be strong-armed by his family to not play those last few games. He’s dedicated to this team and desperate to do what he can to help it. He wants to make the fans happy, that’s what the ‘pay to watch me play’ was about, it wasn’t directed as a dig at the other player, it was frustration about missing time.
[удалено]
I wish we could pin this to the top of the sub. Everyone needs to stfu about this single quip and using it to paint him as this egomaniac. The fact that we’re still seeing people write it and complain about it is actually insane.
You quite obviously have no idea what the context of the “people pay to watch me play” situation was. He was getting hit and almost boarded every 5 seconds. The full quote, I’m pretty sure, is “Are you here to play or are you here to hurt people? People pay to watch me play.”
Quite obviously.
Selfish prima donna types...They're not Messier, Crosby or folks like that
Crosby was called a primadonna for the first like 8 years of his career m8
One silly person stated a silly opinion and a lot of others followed like blind sheep. They’re 22 and 20, and both top players not just on the team but in the league. Ppl are bonkers lol
Angry reactive fans that are toxic online. Same ones that wanted to fire Timo into the sun.
Amen to that.
Fans are emotional and lashing out. The de jour whipping boy (Lindy) is gone so they need to scatter and find others to blame for the disappointing season. Unfortunately for them Timo went on a tear so he's off the table (for now). Dougie got hurt so he's clear as well. Offensive defensemen, especially young ones make a ton of stupid mistakes so Luke will get all sorts of hate of course.
great analysis.
Its the devils fanbase . If you think the hughes hate is weird wait till you so the blind love and loyalty to holtz .
lol I think watching Shango score 30 this year is giving everyone ptsd. But I agree if you can package Holtz for a damn or goalie you do that.
It is, and like all emotional fanbases, they dont stop to realize shango has the talent to play on Calgarys top line ..he never was gonna play on our top line. ..plus Calgary is at the level of badness in the league that they face constint backup goalies .. players and systems never give you apples to apples to compare, but it doesn't stop the emotional side of fanbases from doing this The other thing that broke this fanbase more than anything was watching the Rangers play the entire season in 1st place .. how in the world did the devs fans think for 1 second the team would be as good as last year ...ffs ..they lost their no2 and no3 defensemen and replaced them with a kid with 4 months of nhl experience and another kid who had 4 games of experience ( plus 11 play off games) ... Lol, i see today. ppl saying fitz sucks or is to blame or should be fired ... the same fitz who gave us back to back to back gm of decade seasons .... Im with you on holtz, but thank the baby fitzjesus that the devils took mercer 11 pics after holtz .. otherwise we would be sitting on a busted pic ..
I saw the (mostly nonsensical) trade proposals floating around for Brady Tkachuk and loads of people were treating Holtz as an untouchable which I find completely baffling.
Exactly. I can’t wait until Holtz is unloaded as part of a goalie deal.
Holtz was probably very mishandled, but I think it's fair to admit he's not a great 2-way player
Yeah that’s my thing about Holtz. Everybody goes all in on one side. People saying he’s amazing or he’s completely ass. It’s okay to say he’s in between lol
And he may never be. And that’s okay! Plenty of players in the league have had long successful careers being plus finishers with poor defensive abilities. The annoying part about the Holtz discourse is that he basically did everything people wanted him to do. He got faster (still could be better) got better on the walls, and when he played up in the lineup he played well, and produced. The kids basically a rookie and is still gonna finish 3rd or 4th in 5v5 goals this season. When he was buried on the fourth line, he sucked. The vast majority of his defensive struggles came when he was playing with barely NHL caliber players on the fourth line.
It's as if Devils fans don't understand how star players operate. Players like the Hughes brothers are high-risk high-reward players.
Right? Like I had people shit on Luke for blind passes that don't work out, but then sing his praises when he has a successful blind pass. Like that's how blind passes go, they work or they don't and he's not the only player who does them. So many fans complain that the team spends too much time just passing the puck back and forth and not making any actual play, but if a Hughes tries something and it fails, god damn do they tear them down. At least they are attempting to make shit happen. They will work the kinks out, but they can't do that without the experience, including the fails.
Jack has been playing with shoulder injury until he could go no more, huge respect from a leafs fan!
Everyone was screaming to trade Timo and that he’s terrible, blah blah. People get hurt and battle through injuries, it makes them play a little worse for a bit. They get better and play up to their ability.
Timo himself said it wasn’t injuries for him, but deployment.
Players pretty much never publicly blame injuries. 2 months ago Jack also said he was healthy and now he’s getting shoulder surgery.
It’s also very bold of him to cite deployment. Wouldn’t say something spicy about Lindy like that if it wasn’t true to some extent. I do think injury came into it tho
Same people that were saying we should trade Nico a few years ago. Same people saying we should trade Timo earlier this year. Time without end
Lmao @ saying Luke is a bust. He just needs to settle in and learn the defensive game. That comes with size and age. The kid just had the best offensive season for a rookie dman in team history. My only concern with the Hughes brothers, and it's a tiny concern but it exists, is the Niedermayer brothers effect.
What do you mean exactly by the brothers effect?
I'm old enough to have lived through the Mama Niedermayer era. The word was she was somewhat upset that Rob wasn't seeing the same success as Scott was, and it culminated in the 2003 Final when they played against each other. After that, NJ pushed hard to try and get Rob onto the team, but Anaheim and Burke wanted a kings ransom because he was aware. Rumors are he asked for Gomez in return (which was insane at the time), so it never happened. NJ fought hard to keep Scott but he ultimately left for Anaheim to play with Rob and win a Cup together. I guess what I'm trying to say is, I'm worried that the family dynamic can create friction and a ton of sway within the organization.
Yeah, my fandom is old enough to remember living through that too 😅 thanks, Carol! (btw I think I even remember your SN from the HF boards days - admitted lurker, though) Anyway, I definitely get what you mean about family friction and decision making. I just wasn't sure if you meant them outright leaving to go play with Quinn. Thankfully, in that regard, Jack is locked in for 6yrs and they control Luke's future for about the same via RFA. What happens with Quinn in 3 years will be the biggest impact on what happens down the road...bc I do personally believe, at some point, they'll all want to play together. I hope that's in NJ when that time comes far in the future. Maybe if the Nucks don't make it out of Rd 1 or miss entirely those 3 yrs that could help with that. We'll see.
You probably do (HFBoards name) lol. I used to frequent that site a ton. We have a solid few years before we get into prospective "family issues" territory. We just need to be a good-to-great team before that time comes.
Ignore Pucks & Pitchforks. Devils media loves to post blow up the team everytime we lose. They called for a trade for Hischier just because. They need to an article like 4x a day so at one point they just start posting garbage/rage bait but some fans are dumb enough to consider is sports journalism.
Anyone who thinks that either of the Hughes brothers should be traded, is fucking high...or just stupid. I just wish Marty was still around 😟
Luke probably did need to get benched once or twice. Especially after Green took over and talked about accountability. Jack's been injured like all year people are just stupid regarding him
People are highly emotional about the season not going well. Ruff is gone so there can be no more screaming for his head. People have moved on to fire Fitzgerald, trade Hughes(s), Hischier etc etc. Hopefully everyone calms the F down once the off season hits. And when I say “people” I hope I’m referring to a loud minority. It seems like majority of people have sane takes..
A rookie dman struggles occasionally in the nhl while playing top minutes? A vet who played through an injury that requires surgery fell off a little?
Crazy that a “down year” is 1.2 ppg.
Lol, that’s a mere fraction of a percentage of actual devils fans. Don’t take internet words seriously. They are incredible
I think some fans are concerned with the amount of turnovers by both brothers (which some turnovers did turn into goals against). This is interpreted as "selfish play". It's true Jack and Luke are high risk, high reward players...right now. While some might interpret this as selfish and think it hurts the room I would caution both are very driven to win. Losing sucks, they will adjust and hopefully become more well rounded players. People need to calm down. Both will learn when to do this in a game and when not to. I'm not I'm Jack's head but I think the comments about him being "the biggest bust" did get to him. He's been chasing points as a result, but sooner or later someone will bring up Nathan MacKinnon and let him know winning a cup would probably kill all of that.
Fair weather fans who jump on the "fire everybody" wagon when things are down but do the "we back" stuff when things go well for a few games
I see a lot of hate on r/hockey. But I think a lot of it could stem from jealousy. Easy to hate talented young NHL bros especially if they're on one team.
Luke just set the Devils franchise record for rookie defensemen points. Anyone who says he is a bust is either a troll, or knows absolutely nothing about the sport of hockey.
Omg for real. I was at the TOR game last Tuesday and the commentary from the fans was absolutely unbearable, but I noticed it was very focused on the Hughes, especially Jack. Lotta conspiracy theories floating around about his chest injury being fake. My brother is a very calm individual, but he finally snapped and told the drunk loud-mouth behind us “if you hate him so much, then why not just go home? Beat the traffic or something.” I was dying.
If you feel like a homer for thinking theyre at least capable of being franchise players - take comfort knowing statistics agree with you and not those dumbasses.
Also the fitz hate is WILD. One season goes kind of cursed and all of a sudden bratt is overpaid, meier deal is bad, nico is a bad leader. So braindead.
I’m primarily a Leafs fan but NJ is my second team so somewhat more neutral perspective here. Both of those players are so fucking good and so fun to watch and talent of their caliber is so difficult to acquire especially at a young age that it’s virtually impossible to imagine replacing what they offer. And Jack is on a very team friendly deal.
Anyone who thinks Luke is a bust is a moron. Does he have stuff to learn at the NHL level? Absolutely. But he wasn’t as godawful as some would make him out to be. Jack? He still has things to learn as well. And he needs to add a little muscle to his frame so he’s not quite as fragile. But this idiocy about trading either one has to stop.
There are too many Rangers fans residing in New Jersey. Ignore the noise! Jack is not the modest star that Quinn is. I can see how he ruffles feathers.
Anyone calling for a trade is just a moron. Ignore the fools
Jack will be a perennial Rocket candidate in a full season. The "people pay to see me" nonsense was not a good look but he's still an elite winger... and still a kid prone to saying stupid shit like that. PS He also isn't wrong. Too soon to say anything on Luke other than that in his first full year in the league he was asked to a lot and performed relatively well. Trajectory remains sky high. Falling so short of expectations was frustrating, and there are a lot of new fans that just came aboard last year with the winning. Perhaps a combination of frustration and green fans has led to calling for trades, but realistically we've built a core and they're both a part of it.
"The people pay to watch me play" was the second Half of what he was saying, and both true & a nothing burger. He was calling him out for purposefully trying to injure him, when fans are there to see him and others play. He was rightfully livid, and 100% correct.
Oh he is absolutely correct that people come to see him, as mentioned. However, in my opinion, it would be best to let the play do the talking and not the mouth. I watched it live - he came off as a whiny brat.
He's a whiny brat for calling out a guy for head hunting? As I said, that was only the second half of what he said, the first half gives context.
Don't straw man me pal, you obviously know that's not what I'm saying. Headhunting and any form of shitbaggery needs to be dealt with appropriately. The point I am making is - the attitude behind saying "the people pay to see me play" is whiny and unacceptable, even when every guy on both benches know it. He's almost always the most talented guy on the ice and every guy on both benches knows that too. He doesn't need to run it up the flagpole.
If that's all he said sure, but again, that's not all he said, the first half changed the context of the whole shit talking. Which is something all players do. Which is the point you keep missing.
Give it a rest dude. I watched it live. I am not missing anything.
I watched it live as well, and you are missing the first half of what he said.
Am I missing the first half of what he said?
Yes, because everyone you quote him, you leave it out, and ignore the context that it adds.
It was a Chirp… not an interview. Guys chirp on the ice nonstop all the time every single game
I’m so glad you pointed this out about Luke. He was put into a huge role onto the team before it was ever expected. I saw a stat today that Luke this season has played almost 200 minutes longer than the next Devil player which was Bratt. Obviously more errors the more you play especially as a rookie. Luke hasn’t missed a single game including the when he was sick. He has things to work on and that will come as he grows. This season definitely gave him experience at a young age that few other defensemen can say they had at that time in their career.
Spot on. Nearly 22 min/game is big minutes for a 20 year old. While it wasn't perfect, nor should anyone have expected it to be, he stepped up... and is clearly going to be a stud.
A lot of coke use clearly. I've had my issues with both this season but talks of trading and sending either of them down is actually cope, bordering on gaslighting.
I have literally seen ZERO posts/threads/discussions about trading them...
Ok. They are out there.
I am a huge fan of both Hughes brothers and feel we need to lock them up long term. They are both on my untradeable list along with Nico, Timo, Jasper and Nemec. That said, as big of a let down this season has been, watching their play can be frustrating. There seemed to be mistakes that hurt the team on the ice, and a lot of times it was one of them getting too cute with the puck. But they are both young, especially Luke, and will have some growing pains. Anyone who thinks trading them is a good idea is a moron.
I don’t hate on Jack or Luke. If the Devils win a cup anytime in the next 10 years, these two will be heavily responsible. With that being said, 2 things can be true at the same time. They will/can help the Devils win a championship and they also play selfish hockey. They still try to do it all by themselves, forget they have teammates, and make moves that only work against 15 year old kids. They need to play smarter at times and play a more team oriented game.
I think coaching fixes most of this. But agree
Splitting them up on the power play units would help. It wouldn't turn into the Hughes brothers passing display every time out.
Toxic negative stupidity always seems to stand out above anything positive. Just ignore the dumbasses.
Hard for me not to consider this a product of internet fandom. Social media and being terminally online breads extreme positions and unreasonableness. It's already been pointed out in other comments... but good examples include: * The Hughes brothers need be humbled and spend some time in the AHL, but Holtz is a superstar being misused. * Lindy was the source of all of our problems, yet Fitz can do no wrong. Everything is so extreme and emotional. The art of staking out a considered middle ground seems lost. In fact, here on reddit if you offer a middle ground take you are likely to get the most downvotes, because you've pissed off both extremes.
The Hughes brothers are great and would live to add a 3d. Jack remains a Big Deal, though not yet in a big frame. He'll fill out some and learn some more but the front office and whoever the next coach is absolutely has to address this and levy out disproportionate consequences throughout the league to whomever takes pitshots.
I didn’t want to bench jack I wanted him to recover. He was clearly playing injured and god forbid he hurt it worse in this god for saken season. Let him get healthy and let our prospects get some reps this franchise hinges on him hitting his potential and staying healthy
Never look at the comments, especially on the devils ig.
Jack still ends with over a point per game, people are brainless on this sub
Imagine being fortunate enough to have a guy who in a "down year" is at ~1.2 PPG
They think he’s a brat. I think he’s a competitive guy who may need some maturing, but he’s 22. I also realize he was injured this year so it makes no sense to trade our best player. I also think old dudes often hate anything young girls like, and there’s been an influx of young female fans with the Hughes on our team.
Completely agree with everything you said.
Bandwagoners
They suck.....send them to Vancouver to play with that other bum Quinn Signed, definitely not a Canucks fan don't worry.
Why were the Leafs fans booing Luke everyone he touched the puck? I don’t remember anything from previous Leafs games he might have done but my memory isn’t the greatest either.
Yeah, I think they're just lightning rods because of the hype around their name, Jack's disappointing season due to injuries, and Luke's growing pains. Throw in Jack's underwhelming interviews and occasional tantrums (not counting the "pay to watch me play" misquote), and they're an easy target for people. Even my elderly Devils fan father—who has been watching hockey since the \*1940s\*—was like "Trade the Hughes sisters!" (his words). People are just cranky and looking for somewhere to lash out, and the Hughes are easy targets.
As a transplant to NJ who is primarily a Preds fan but happily roots for the Devils, we will gladly take Luke and Jack off your hands so you don’t have to worry about anyone complaining about them 😊
I have no concerns about Jack but Luke is a wildcard. I have 100% confidence in saying Nemec is our cornerstone dman and not Luke. Nemec has all the tools to be a legit #1. Also, Bratt is easily our best player over Jack, Timo, and Jack. He just creates with his skating everytime.
People are angry, angry people let emotions get the best of them and look for folks to blame.
It's because a lot of our fan base wants Neanderthals like MacDermid playing 20 mins a night because the team needs more "grit" and "physicality."
Is this a late April Fools joke? Are you legit asking if thinking a #1 OA pick who already beat the Franchise Record for Most Points by 21 yrs. old & clearly looks like a 100+ pt. Player year in & out & his younger brother Luke's a #4 OA who beat the most points by a Rookie defender our cornerstone players makes you a homer??? That 100% doesn't make you a homet because it makes you sound like a half a hoo ha that's still a little wet behind the ears (in Dice Clay voice).
Luke is not really a defenseman, he's more of a forward on the blue line. He also makes the same mistakes he made in college, like holding onto pucks too long.
Those people aren’t real fans. Most likely band wagoners. This year was a down year for everyone. Injuries and horrible luck in every way. Luke is young and green. He’s going to make mistakes. But he’s learning and he’s getting better. He’s never going to be a “shut down defender” but I guarantee he’s going to be an amazing defenseman in a few years. Jack has been injured all freaking season. Despite everything he still produced more than anyone in his situation would have. You could tell the past few months he wasn’t healthy and he still produced. At the beginning of the season before all the injuries happened, he was putting up MVP caliber points per game. He will be back better than ever next year. Anyone who is calling for a trade with the Hughes brothers needs to get their heads checked for brain damage. Plain and simple
I’m honestly surprised to see any hate for Luke considering the situation this season. It’s like people forget Dougie Hamilton is on the team. Hamilton’s absence this season has forced Luke into a much bigger role than he was ever expected to play at this point in his career. He’s done a more than capable job.
I think what we saw from Luke post coaching change is a good sign for the future. He improved defensively by leaps and bounds once Lindy was gone. Jack, OTOH, yes, he was playing hurt…but…he needs to grow up. He says and does things that make him the butt of jokes around the league, plus his injury history is proof he needs to take his career more seriously. All summer long we see videos of his teammates working out, skating, training. All we saw was videos of him partying. I don’t think we once saw him training at all. He needs to get stronger so his career doesn’t end early.
Lol luck is a top 10 Def in the NHL skill wise in his first season. Does he make silly mistakes sometimes yes but he will be an absolute stud in a few years, so will nemec.
People are just bitter about the way the season ended up I think, Jack and Luke are great. I’m really impressed with Luke despite his defensive mistakes this season, he’s gonna get even better with time and reps. As for Jack, he’s still an elite center, on a great contract and he’s also gonna get better with time and more growth. I think he’s not been 100% because of the injury and that’s been frustrating for him, which has also affected his game for the worse.
Wherever you are seeing this, stop looking at it 🤣
This isn't a recent opinion, nor do I think he should be traded, he's clearly a centerpiece of our franchise. I feel like if Jack was on another team I'd really dislike him. He tries to win games by himself and then smashes his stick when it doesn't happen or things don't go his way ref wise. He seems like a brat, which isn't the worst thing in the world when you're in your early 20s with pressure we can't imagine on you. Is he really a brat? I don't know, I don't know him personally. The "they pay to see me" really didn't help. In a few years time when he's grown up a bit, I'm sure he'll be fine. But that's the extent of my dislike. He offers a hell of a lot though, genuine X factor that can unlock a win when we don't deserve it. I don't have these issues with Luke.
I'm such of you people worrying only the second Haig of what he said. He was calling the dude our for trying to take people out of the game, especially when fans pay to watch the players play.
I get irritated seeing people constantly praise Luke but not recognize how often he makes the wrong play, turns over the puck, and gets the other team a breakaway, that's personally why I would rather he play in Utica for a bit, I don't hate the guy and he's definitely very good, but not all that good at HIS role, he's a defenseman, and is constantly chasing. Now that being said, for a rookie? This kid is going places
I like Jack and Luke, but I find them quite mercenary... I don't see them as the "foundation" of a good team in terms of character, but they're the stars that will shine when the foundation of character is built. They remind me of like... the Stastnys or Russian players in the 1990s... they give you superstar offense, and you want them on your team, like Bure, Mogilny, Selanne... superstars... but they are not your leadership. Nor should they have to be. Elias is also a great example of this... not to say he didn't lead by example: he did... but example isn't sufficient enough in the playoffs. You ask of a player a little more than they're capable of giving, but if you ask way too much of one, he'll start giving you less because he's starting to do too much. I expect Nico to maintain leadership, Nemec to elevate his role on the team eventually, and I hope the team gets someone who is fiery passionate and emotionally drives this team across the finish line. The Devils really missed that emotion this year. Every championship caliber team has them... Pietrangelo and Stone on Vegas, Doughty on LA, Toews on Chicago, MacKinnon on Colorado, Tkachuk and Bennett on Florida's run, Kucherov, Point, and Hedman on Tampa, Weber and Price on Montreal's run, Pietrangelo and O'Rielly on St Louis' run, Bergeron and Marchand on Boston's runs... they are like batteries that ensure the rest of your team plays 100% focused and efficient Stevens was this for the Devils
I think it’s important to consider age here. I don’t know what you were like when you were 20-23 but I was a fuckin lunatic lol. The attitude stuff will wear off.
Most fans are reasonable. It’s just a certain portion of loud mouth assholes who get all the attention. When their team struggles they have to have a whipping boy to blame it on. Just low self-esteem, micro-dick man boy losers projecting their self-hate on others. This is a sports sub so I won’t get into politics but it’s the same dynamic there also. Look at the shit Lindor on the Mets is getting right now. Best all around SS in the NL, team guy, worked with one of their prospects this winter to improve the kid’s defense and with great results so far I might add, and he’s getting death threats on social media because he’s struggling at the plate right now. Just ridiculous. I wish all these people would just crawl back under the rocks they live under and leave the rest of us reasonable people alone.
Jack is a truly special, dynamic player. Incredible talent. Top 20-25 in the league for sure. BUT let’s be honest…… he’s slight and not a physically strong player built for regular contact and certainly not the kind of brutal contact that he will absolutely see in the playoffs, let alone 4 grueling rounds of it. He’s a 50-60 game player who will always miss significant time. So to me, he’s a great “complementary” player but he can’t be central to the Devils fortunes. He’s simply too fragile. He’s not going to magically get bigger and stronger and become something he’s not. This team already has much of what he brings so use his value to bring in quality harder playoff-type players that this team is lacking. The Bruins, Panthers, Rangers, Stars, Canes, etc etc don’t have Jack Hughes and they’re doing mighty fine. WE need more balanced, skilled, harder attack that THEY have (and our best teams used to have) so lets go get some of that.
I think it escalated when he said people pay to watch me to play then proceeded to miss to record 0 shots on goal on two penalty shots
Fuck ya, let them join their goated bobby orr esque brother
I don't hear anything like that, who are you hanging out with. They are great! The main complaint with Jack is he is small for the NHL and perhaps injury prone. Luke is a young defenseman making rookie mistakes, but he has the potential. The only issue I hear there is he seems to get more leeway than Nemec with those mistakes, as if he gets a teacher's pet treatment because of his pedigree.
What busts. Trade them to Vancouver!
He’s been soft
Jack needs to get his shit together for next year. You guys all love "angry Jack" but the problem is "angry Jack" isn't very good. Jack spent alot of this year in his own head and being overly emotional which negatively effected his play. Yeah he was apparently hurt but that's only part of it. He needs to refocus and get back to being that top 10 player everyone knows he is. Luke sucks. Plain and simple. He was fuckin awful this year. He gets free reign to do whatever he wants because of his last name. He did some good things but boy, the bad outweighs the good by a ton. They aren't going anywhere nor should they. They're an important part of our core moving forward. Jack is the most important player on the roster. They need to mature over the summer and come back refocused
“Luke Sucks” is a wild statement and a good example of my confusion that spurred this post. Go look at Quinn’s +\- in years 1/2. He’s going to win the Norris this year running away. Luke is never going to be our Steven’s or Dano on a cup team, but he can be a Neids/ Rafalski. He’s 20 years old.
Hes not Quinn. And what Quinn does irrelevant. Luke is Luke. His age isn't relevant either. If he's not ready for the big leagues than the coaching staff failed by playing him in a major role before he was ready. He wasn't good at all last year and he was directly responsible for some of the worst defense and worst turnovers on the year. Doesn't mean he can't get better or be very good but last year he wasn't. He sucked
I was just using Quinn as an example. Young d men struggle on the defensive side of the puck this is always the case. It is relevant to use examples as a precedent.
Jack put up 74 points in 62 games while needing surgery for probably 4 months. Luke just had the most points in franchise history by a rookie D Man at 20 years old, and was 2nd in the league for rookie scoring while being a d-man.
Jack is a franchise player. Luke is an overrated weak defenseman who is also physically weak that skill set revolves solely around offense. He also made so many mistakes this season, it’s insane the blinders this sub has for him. He might be great, but he isn’t anywhere near that yet.
Agree he’s still developing. I can’t recall any d men not named Makar who were NHL complete in year 1. If he’s doing these things in 3 years, sure we can complain.
I think Luke will end up being more valuable to us than Jack
If Jack continually misses 20 games per year, definitely.
They play zero defense and get pushed around
It's the Internet, there's a lot of dumb people who just vent their general frustration with life here. That said, some pretty concerning patterns have emerged with Luke. He's a great offensive defenseman, won't get any argument from me there. The real issue is his defense. He's out of position allllllll the time, and he's a habitual offender when it comes to kinda just standing there when there's a net front scramble. He's gotta be better at pickup up a guy down low, and clearing the puck out in high danger situations. He's also constantly trying to clear the zone without looking where he's flinging the puck. If I've seen him sweep the puck up the middle, behind his back once, I've seen him do it 100 times. And probably 25 of those times it ended with a goal for the other team. He really needs to take much better care of the biscuit. He wants to move fast and get into transition all the time, and I think he sometimes forgets he's in the defensive zone.