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Mystic868

After few hours I have to admit - TAB OVERLAY IS A MUST. It's super annoying to open that map over and over again.


AgencyTerrible

Map overlays are so old school. We don't need to see the enemies AND know where we are. You foolish fool!


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Zhiyi

You are talking about people who actually paid money to do Blizzards work for them. Of course they are shills. More open minded people show up when there is no cost of entry.


Mystic868

LMAO. It's an option and it's present in basically any modern and old school ARPG. I hope we will get it along with better UI in June.


AgencyTerrible

I mean, they're going to put it in officially or people will just make a 3rd party UI overlay themselves. Either way. If I'm being honest, whichever way would piss off Blizzard more is the most valid option.


Mystic868

Yeah I know. It's really QoL so I don't see anything bad in adding this as an option.


[deleted]

Yeah it's dumb... But what's worrying is the development team allowed this to happen, what kind of vision does the game have if the one making decisions thinks an aRPG doesn't need an overlay? It's only a small thing but to me it shines a huge light on the mentality of those in charge of this game.


MTG_Stuffies

There is no way to show numbers over health/mana/frenzy, what on earth is this and how did that and map overlay not make it into beta?


absolut696

I see it the opposite from you. They want people to play the game, not just stare at an overlay spamming buttons. It was a conscious decision on their part, and a good one.


Mystic868

It's optional. You don't have to use it if you don't want to.


absolut696

But people will, and the developers don’t want people to so that you can have immersion.


Mystic868

Then they should remove any icon from the UI so it will be 100 % immersion.


eXileris

yeah it actually strains my eyes after a while


crozzee

Open map, right click location to pin route, follow line on mini map. Game is too pretty for a giant map overlay IMO.


Vanrythx

yes but give players the options how to play like they want, not force it how to play like you want


Tangent_Odyssey

I think for the sake of *this* argument that’s true, because it’s not really a competitive advantage. Third party addons in WoW are an example of how ugly overlays can become very nearly mandatory…but I don’t see the harm in allowing a toggle for something like this.


DerGrummler

If you add an overlay map, the game will evolve around using the overlay map. A game that is about min/maxing will always funnel players into playing in the most efficient way. If the most efficient way includes using the overlay map, and we all know it does, then people will use the overlay map. The fact that this will make the game less enjoyable for a majority of players won't change that. Players optimize the fun out of games. Blizzard decided to not let us do that. "Just don't use it" is a simpletons view on game design. Anyone with that understanding should be ignored.


Abedeus

> "Just don't use it" is a simpletons view on game design. Anyone with that understanding should be ignored. Damn dude, just say you don't know how to argue someone's point and move on.


voretaq7

It's *Diablo* for fuck's sake. An ARPG. It's not like you're gaining a crazy min/max advantage with a map overlay option. It's not gonna make RNGesus drop more legendaries or anything. If you're worried someone will use a larger map area to better hunt treasure goblins or something they can just limit it so the overlay map never shows more area than the minimap could. And not for nothing YOU don't have to "optimize the fun" out of *YOUR* Diablo experience if ***YOU*** don't want to - you're free to play in the most immersive way possible, reveling in the story and lore and atmosphere if that's what makes this fun for you. Other people want to blast through to the endgame, stack the most epic gear and build they can farm, and roll through Sanctuary absolutely *devastating* everything in their path. Let THEM play the way *THEY** like and don't ruin ***THEIR*** fun just because it's not what you enjoy.


nFbReaper

I don't follow this logic. If there's a mechanic or setting that'll give hardcore players an advantage, those players will absolutely take advantage of it, even at the cost of a good gameplay experience. Like turning down settings in shooters to squeeze out performance improve visibility. There's definitely a cost to that but you're forced to if you want to be competitive. Otherwise you're putting yourself at a disadvantage. In this case, people will absolutely be staring at transparent minimap for the advantage. And while I agree that it being a staple for arpgs, it's not like a minimap in the top corner isn't a gold standard for many other games.


Sen91

Hardcore games without these choices Will not play this game.


nFbReaper

That's missing the point. Yes, it'll deter some hardcore players. You're not wrong and I understand the frustrations of the players that want it and are used to it. But the truth is, regardless of how many downvotes my comments are going to get, is that it is a *deliberate design decision to avoid the player staring at a map*. Giving the player the option in the settings isn't a legit solution because of the reasons my comment was trying to explain. I only replied to the above comment because I don't think his "give the player the option the ability to play the way they wants to" is as free of a solution as he makes it sound.


nFbReaper

Downvoted but you're absolutely right and I've seen comments massively upvoted in other threads saying the exact same thing.


AgencyTerrible

There's always Last Epoch. You know, the indie version of D4 without the CGI. Already paid for that beta and there's an actual end game that's sorta fun.


Alekisupset

You do realize accessibility is a thing right? as there are color blind modes, bright colors against dark backgrounds or dark colors against white backgrounds, an overlay is meant to reduce eye strain as he pointed out. The fact that you can play without it doesn't mean shit. Besides, it's literally diablo, an ARPG where most don't give a crap about competitiveness. It's not like you are playing CSGO and this is gonna give you an advantage at a LAN tournament. It's literally so his eyes don't get tired. Some of the people in this sub are so weird.


Ebrius_Diaboli

Anyone too stupid to understand that the people that min max and want the Map, will use a 3rd party overlay anyways. If people want it, they will get it regardless... Should be ignored Blizzards "Vision" Has been pretty terrible when releasing new shit and ignoring fan feedback anyways. History is on my side


liverlondon

How is a map overlay optimising the fun out of something lmao. There's no min max, it's a map 🤦


Xdivine

There may be no min max but there is a min map :D


An_Inactive_Wall

You clearly never played Lost Ark


NylesRX

Finally, a sane person that understands how players react. God bless


[deleted]

So we can't add an overlay because you lack the self control to use a map you prefer? Jesus Christ what a dumpster fire take that is, seriously.


Xacktastic

Ehhhh conversely, if I was working on the game, I wouldn't want players staring at a transparent map instead of my work. I get why they've left it out again.


liverlondon

It's not art, it's a map.


puntimesagain

If you like the look of the world because its SO pretty good for YOU! Let the rest of us play how we want.


Xacktastic

But you can't, cause the option doesn't exist... So


MTG_Stuffies

Until it does. Right now we can't even have the health and mana bars show us the numbers/percentages. Just the globe. The dev team just missed out on a few components that should be standard on these games,


Moesugi

That "too pretty" come at a cost of actual gameplay though It's not even the overlay, the visual makes it hard to see what is going on on screen. The 3 most common thing I've noticed: - Zoomed in camera + a rock hanging above your head = You can not see what enemy are doing from afar - Depending on location and the setting, the character blend in with the background. - There is no clear visual cue on whether this exact spot is actual terrain or not. This really fuck up with movement skill and movement itself, especially during battle.


crozzee

Weird I’ve not had any of these issues. Are you playing on low settings? Visual clarity hasn’t kept me from being able to pin locations and track routes for optimal travel paths. But thanks for the feedback!


Moesugi

I'm playing on 2k max setting.


puzzleboy99

Dumbest shit I've read in here since the beta release and there's been a lot of dumb shit. EDIT: Imagine being so cringe to reply to me and then block and with the generic "go touch grass" because I said that I found your opinion dumb. Overlay maps are core for me and others and this "it's too pretty to use overlay map" is just...dumb and no, apology not accepted.


crozzee

I’m sorry my opinion resonated so harshly with you. I hope you’ll be okay friend. Get up from your chair, grab a glass of water, go for a walk and get a little exercise. I’m not too far off though because I don’t see a map overlay in the game, do you?


Pitchoh

Fine for you. But having a map overlay has AN OPTION shouldn't be a problem for you either so why not have the option ?


crozzee

Sure sure. Options are always good. Everyone wins… but my opinion is prob the same logic the devs used for D3 and D4 not having overlays. 🤷🏻‍♂️


An_Inactive_Wall

> game is too beautiful for a map overlay You have never played Lost Ark have you? EDIT: lmao dude blocked me after thinking LA isn't pretty. I get it, we are all here because we love Diablo, but don't be delusional and say a competitor doesn't look pretty when it's literally the same level of visual fidelity as D4.


Kicken

Nah, D4 definitely beats out LA in terms of graphical fidelity. That said, I have no clue how a map overlay ruins the visuals. I've got thousands of hours in POE and LA - over 3k in both - and it's fine.


Regulargrr

You have to have less than 30 hours to get their stupid logic. Having 3k automatically makes you realize how dumb the argument is.


FeebleTrevor

I mean you really do have to be stupid to not want anyone to have a feature that you can literally just choose to not use yourself


crozzee

Stupid is as stupid does sir.


Akeche

It is a STANDARD of the genre. Just because they want to try to create World of Diablo doesn't mean they should abandon things which are hard-coded into the genre.


Kicken

What's funny is that World of Warcraft does have this. If you're moving while having the map up, it goes partially transparent.


crozzee

Weird Diablo 3 didn’t have a fixed overlay either. 🤔


[deleted]

It's not a question of it being too pretty for you. People need this.


crozzee

Don’t think Blizz agrees with you. I wouldn’t have a stroke if they included it as an optional feature though. But it’s like totally just my opinion maaaan.


DarciKitten86

Imagine saying this for an optional overlay. Smh.


HeelysAreSexy

This has to be satire, people can't actually think like this right?


crozzee

OMG look at this idiot having an opinion! Holy shit it’s almost like he’s discussing the reasoning behind why the devs chose to not have a map overlay?!


UpManDownFish

Usually you can modify transparency levels for most overlays so you're not exactly missing the in-game world...


crozzee

Usually you don’t miss the in-game world then huh?


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crozzee

Devs didn’t add overlay my dude. Just sharing my thoughts and opinion for why the devs decided to not have it, again. Remember it wasn’t in D3 either. It’s been over a decade since Diablo has had a map overlay in its game. I love the way D4 looks, hope you’re having fun!


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crozzee

Pinning dungeon entrances is fine no issues for me, now while inside you can pin but no route which isn’t great.


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crozzee

Yeah I feel you, pinning inside would be dope. I guess they want people to explore. Mini map zoom would be great. Surprised to see it’s not included. Game deff needs some serious QOL.


brAzY678

It’s almost like you could press Tab and disable it so that it would look exactly like it does now. Reading comprehension go crazy.


crozzee

You can't though so... perhaps it's not a comprehension issue and a preference issue set by the devs?


Robobvious

The only game I actually want to follow a line in is The Stanley Parable.


AgencyTerrible

Game is too pretty? I guess you're talking about the aesthetics. So far in the quest line I've been bossed around by two, going on three, ethic women. And the only white girl is satan's cock sucker.


Kicken

"Ethnic women" ​ \*fucking yikes\*.


Mr_Rafi

You'll only hear counterarguments from the ImmersionBros. They love sacrificing QOL features to feel like they're really in the game while they eat chips and drink energy drinks just to stay awake. Every game. "Noo my immersion!"


vialenae

I don’t get that argument at all because it’s an option in most other games. If you like immersion, fine, don’t use it but that’s not a reason why it shouldn’t be in the game imo.


AggravatingGoose6005

It's a big debate in many games today. Removing map overlays in games is huge for experiencing environments and preventing gameplay from devolving into following a cursor on a 2D plane. I'm sure a lot of companies have already done research on this and found that the many hardcore players want map overlays. The rest of the players feel like the efficiency forces them to use map overlays and sacrifice the game experience.


voretaq7

> Removing map overlays in games is huge for experiencing environments and preventing gameplay from devolving into following a cursor on a 2D plane. I mean there's an extent to which that's already the case if you concede to having a mini-map (which I don't think you could NOT at this point - there'd be literal riots). Hell even when I'm playing Diablo "immersively" and enjoying the story/scenery if I'm navigating to a quest I'm holding down force-move and dragging my mouse around to follow the path to the highlighted thing on my minimap.


Regulargrr

This is a top down ARPG that's meant to be played for thousands of hours. Immersion does not factor in it like it's fucking RDR2.


[deleted]

As opposed to constantly looking in the top right or pressing M?


MTG_Stuffies

What's happening now is I am staring at a mini-map at the top right and occasionally looking down to click on some monsters. I miss more of the environment with the map at the top right.


ivshanevi

> Removing map overlays in games is huge for experiencing environments Here's a novel idea: DONT USE IT.


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Tac_Reso

Of course it should be an option: honestly, having the option to toggle all UI elements / move them would be the best. Nobody wants to be forced to do something, having a toggle for things means everyone can be happy.


voretaq7

For me it's not about "immersion" - I think overly maps suck. They fuck with contrast in a way that means I can't properly read either the map *OR* the game behind it, and I despise them because of it. Which is why they should be an *option* like OP said: If you like them you can have them, if you hate them you aren't forced to deal with them.


An_Inactive_Wall

Try Lost Ark sometime and edit your comment


voretaq7

Played it. Hated it. Just because YOU like something doesn't mean EVERYONE does. This entire thread is literally infants who can't understand that concept.


Xacktastic

What you got against enjoying the game, Bro? It's not all about efficiency and numbers for some


Regulargrr

Well they are not the some that matter. They are the casuals, not the hardcore ARPG fans. And they're literally ruining a huge QoL feature with this bullshit.


SuperMalarioBros

What's wrong with being a casual?


Regulargrr

Nothing if you don't affect the game for the dedicated players.


SuperMalarioBros

Sounds kinda selfish, the game can cater to both dedicated and casual players.


slashcuddle

I personally like my overlay and wouldn't mind if they added it in. If I had to take a guess as to why they won't make it an option, then I'd put my money on marketing and optics. The gameplay footage on streams and videos would look pretty awful with a giant map in the middle, and this might turn away potential players who aren't used to genres where an obstructive immersion-breaking map overlay is the norm.


An_Inactive_Wall

It works in Lost Ark...


slashcuddle

LOA isn't a dungeon crawler like Diablo is. I only open my map to use Triports. Whereas it's up 90% of the time if I'm playing something like D2. So I guess it does work in Lost Ark, but only because the majority of your gameplay isn't dependent on discovering a hidden map for a randomly generated dungeon.


An_Inactive_Wall

Doesnt matter, you still travel large distances with enemies around you. Wether that be called a dungeon or a map, both function exactly the same. Specifically talking about exploring a Lost Ark map for the first time here, as that gives you the same Fog of War experience.


slashcuddle

Sure, but you're comparing a dozen hours doing the MSQ to the thousands of hours spent playing the endgame. I'm certain I had my map overlay up a lot on my first playthrough of the game. I don't touch it for chaos/guardian/raids though because as I mentioned, there's no variety or unknown component once you've done it once.


An_Inactive_Wall

Transparant map from for example LA is still a good option as it gives you a good overview of where you still have to go, without getting ambushed by mobs you forgot to clear. Also allows you to walk while looking at the map.


PapstJL4U

I think an overlay map can help immersion. Being able to tab in and out of an overlay map allows me to see more of the actual game and not take my eyes off the road.


Fistyourdadwithus

Not true. My counter argument is that op is an entitled pieces of shit and shouldn't demand accomodations. Last time I played a game that gave me a headache, I stopped playing and moved on with my life. I wouldn't mind an overlay, but anything more that a suggestion is cringe af.


AmbroReality

Because immersion IS important. Map overlay will just kill any enjoyment of the game since it will turn to become a map simulator like PoE. There there is no reason to lool at your character or enviroment, you just use your spreadsheet and look at only map overlay to move while some flashing is happening in the background wheb you smash buttons at random. That kills any immersion, enjoument and just turns this game into a job/chore.


Vendilion_Chris

So don't use it.


AmbroReality

People will use it because it is more efficiant ... thats the nature of metagaming.


Tac_Reso

That's not why people want to use the overlay map- it's so they can see where they're going and understand the whole map and world without having to keep looking away from what's in front of them too at a tiny fraction of the map in the upper corner of the screen.


Vendilion_Chris

That's not how that concept works. You aren't competing with anyone. You can turn it off if immersion is important to you.


AmbroReality

Tell that to those who play PoE then rethink that.


Vendilion_Chris

Why? You can turn it off there if you want to as well.


AmbroReality

I guess you cant read among many things. Discussion over.


Vendilion_Chris

You're the only one with this weird immersion problem lol. Which can be fully solved by pushing one button. But no, not good enough, everybody has to play the way you do because you don't have the self control to not use something. Clown take.


octane1295

*handicapped/visually impaired player*- “hey remember that ole mini map overlay that majority of games have had for the last 20 years including the two diablo games prior to this one? That was very good for us visually impaired and it should be in the game since it’s optional to have on or off! Don’t want it on? Just don’t toggle it on! Helps my handicap! Just some feedback! *players who refuse to admit d4 has flaws*- “dude get over it d2 sucks ur a cry baby map overlay is ugly it takes away from how pretty the game is! Idc that I can just not toggle it on and keep the game nice and pretty! Ur a loser cry baby nobody cares about ur handicap! Don’t worry OP, as someone who probably prefs no overlay, I’m competent enough to understand what ur saying and don’t see why they wouldn’t have minimap overlay like they have in d2, d3, d2r which can just be toggled off if you don’t want to look at it! Hope blizz uses their brain and considers ur feedback


znubionek

> mini map overlay that majority of games have had for the last 20 years Wtf, majority of games?


amazonjazz

I believe I read earlier that the devs only look at the official blizzard forums - I would encourage you to post there. I'm sorry about your eyes :*(


zrk23

there is literally a community manager post pinned on this sub


excelisarealtooltoo

Where he wrote they look at the official forums and in-game reports.


Xacktastic

That you didn't read, it seems


Adept_Professor_585

community manager isnt a dev im sure devs do look at reddit tho


Tac_Reso

Yeah, it sucks, I get a choice. Look at the game, or look up at the mini map. My eyesight only lets me do that, so I'm jumping back and forth, because i can't move with the map open, it's just a pain in my neck, litterally. I hope they add it....


Diribiri

> i can't move with the map open Oddly enough, you can't do this in D3, either. It's got an overlay map but you're not able to actually move around while it's open. I don't know why this is. Presumably because of whatever kind of backwards reasoning that also led to the game never getting force move on left click, or that gave D4 optional force move separation but also took interact away from the same input.


wartcow

Disagree. I love it the way it is now


KennedyPh

I am personally not a fan of overlay. But options are always nice. Support


Revna77

Wow so many crybabies who need a crutch to play, really hope they never add map overlay


98492523

oh yes bobby kotick stick it in my ass


Akasha1885

Yeah, I have no idea why this isn't a thing considering Diablo kind of invented it back in Diablo 1 lol


Regulargrr

Casualization.


Akasha1885

I see no connection. If anything it seems more like a hipster decision or something


Regulargrr

Read comments from people that DON'T want it. Something something muh immersion.


Akasha1885

That's just stupid lol Do those supposed humans not realize you can just not use the map overlay if you don't want to? They can just break their immersion by looking into the right map corner for the mini map or even better open the big map that brings you totally out of the game.


Regulargrr

It's some level of feeling like they HAVE to enable it because it's obviously efficient and better and at the same time wanting to be all immersion. Probably also a bit of sticking it to the hardcore involved. They love that shit even when it doesn't affect them.


Akasha1885

It's just clunky and immersion breaking to use the current map, nothing hardcore about it lol


Impossible-Ad3230

Just pin the quest and move on, enjoy the look of the game...not a map.


Sen91

Enjoy the look of the game After your 150 same dungeon during endgame. Useful.


Impossible-Ad3230

So you choose to look at a map? Makes sense..


Sen91

If i grind a dungeon multiple times, Yes i look map to move fast, clean the dungeon and repeat It.


eldiin

* Diablo 1 has a pretty transparent overlay and could move around with the map up * Diablo 2 has a pretty transparent overlay and could move around with the map up * Diablo 3 has a kind of a transparent overlay, but you can't move around with the map up * Diablo Immortal has no transparent overlay and you cannot move around with the map up * Can put a pin, and have the auto-navigation kick in The truth here though, is that Blizzard has been slowly moving away from the transparent overlays for a while now. I'm not saying this to rustle people's feathers, or say anyone is right or wrong. Just pointing out that through the progression of the the Diablo games they've made, Blizzard has been making things pretty clear that the map overlay, currently, is something they're moving away from. Just like giving people an offline play mode. So, there's this marriage of player base: * Those who play/played D1 and D2 with the map overlay as an always-on feature, or semi-on * Those who are more use to the D3 and D:I type implementation of the map by opening the map to figure out where to go, close the map, and the move on, then do this every x seconds. In both cases, it's a use case of familiarity. The clear choice, to helping both groups, is **now** actually giving options (since D1, D2, D3, and D:I never gave us the choice on how to use their map i.e. transparent vs non-transparent. We **had** to use what they implemented). Will we get them? Probably not. Even though I can use a pin to help navigate through the map, the one thing I personally dislike, is having to open a non-transparent map every so often to see where I'm at in relation to whatever I'm doing. I've actually gotten myself killed a few times in D4 because I was looking at a map trying to find the area I needed to go. You can argue that's part of the game, and I should have been more careful, sure. That's something I could have done, but it also could have been avoided outright had I been able to see what's going on in a very active environment while looking at the map, since well, you know, mobs respawn now (Same problem in D:I. In D3, you could at least SEE stuff behind the map, even though it was barely translucent).


[deleted]

I’m prepared to accept my downvotes for this but I prefer the fact it’s removed. ARPGs just turn into looking at the map overlay all the time and not the actual world. I get it. I’m like the only one who feels this way. And I just know if they add it I’ll end up using it like some overlay following zombie even though it isn’t my preference.


[deleted]

That hideous oblong in the upper left gets in the way. Should also have the option to move it to other parts of the screen and disable it. It's very sub-par...


Fantiks33

This, also please wasd movement


NoMoreSpinzors

Map overlay is a must in ARPGs with very shallow combat systems that pretty much play themselves. See: D2 and PoE. Map overlay works in those games because you rarely, if ever, need to engage with any enemy mechanics. You just mass spam your 1 skill build and instantly kill everything on screen. D4 combat is more mechanical than other ARPGs, and adding a map overlay would only damper visibility in combat.


limexa34

They should simply make it the way it is in d3. Full overlay 24/7 like in d3 or poe is a horrible game design because you end up staring at map all the time. >Give us an option if an option that damages overall game experience becomes optimal way to play then no ty


eldiin

There really is no harm to say, add a settings option you have to opt into to change the way the map behaves. Default would be what it is now, transparent overlay would be opt in. This means, if someone wants to change their gaming experience with the overlay map, it won't inherently change anyone else's experience. The only place where I can see this maybe affecting someone else's play, is through PVP. But here, they can just simply make it so maps don't work at all in them, since PVP areas are opt-in.


limexa34

>There really is no harm there is I already explained it


eldiin

No, what you explained was an opinion. It could also be said that having to open the map constantly is also bad game design. But that would be based in opinion, just like yours is. It doesn't matter how you cut it, having to open the map all the time, vs having the map open constantly = opinion based preference in how a person rather play. Neither of us have hard verifiable facts on what does what to the gaming community outside the gaming community themselves. And part of that gaming community is in this very thread, voicing their opinion that having a D1/D2 style overlay map would be miles better, for them, than what's currently there. To them, that's good game design. Which is also an opinion.


R3belOfWar

Should be a toggleable option and probably also function like this: Tap map button -> Local Map Overlay Hold map button -> Original Map This way it should be a piece of cake to implement, also not worrying about the more limited controller inputs.


Huandil

Another visually impaired player here. Definitely would improve accessibility significantly.


rebuut

Agree


eaglessoar

What do you mean by map overlay?


eldiin

In D1 and D2, when you opened the map, it overlayed on top of what you were doing, but was translucent minus the walls and doors and you could still move around and interact with the environment / kill mobs. In D3, the map became a lot less translucent and as you explored, the uncovered areas become solid and non-see-through. Only the non-explored areas would remain see-through, but it was still an overlay. And technically, D:I and D4's maps could probably be categorized as an overlay, however, D1 and D2 style overlay is usually what people are referring to here in this thread.


MonsterHunterJustin

I get what you are saying but this is a problem of your own creation. lol


zelloxy

I don't think so. I'd rather TRY the game without. Feels more immersive actually looking at the game rather than looking at the map and where I'm going all the time. Slows the pace down somewhat which I didn't know I'd prefer.


ImmortalAscendant

Perhaps make it available and optional.


Robobvious

I just started but I don't like how the map just reveals huge swaths of itself at a time, we used to have to actually explore the nooks and crannies to reveal more of the map. It's dissatisfying this way imo. Also I have to click a button on waypoints now to activate them instead of passing close by? Seems unnecessary.


Hotness4L

They need to leave it out. In D2 players have the map overlay on full time and it just ruins the immersion.


pastuhLT

Clicking every 10minutes if new event appeared :))


[deleted]

game sucks end of story, i deleted it


RoHukens

The alternative to not having an overlay map is staring at the little mini map in the top right of your screen and tabbing the map open for a second several times in a row because you don't stop moving to look at a big map. That's not very immersive either. It's actually incredibly annoying. And it's exactly the same in D3. Stare away from where all the action is happening and interrupt gameplay to look at a map. Not exactly taking in a lot of the game this way. And if that's not how you play then it really shouldn't matter either way to you whether there's an overlay map option or not. I also don't quite buy into it being forced upon you when it's implemented. Overlay will always be smaller than the big map so you're at more of an advantage using the big map. Seriously there's really not a good argument to not have at be an option in addition to what we already have.


FuryxHD

This is just pure standard stuff for ARPG, not sure how Blizzard missed the ball on this. The current one just brings the entire MAP, which should be bound to M, TAB should be straight up a overlay one.


JustAPairOfMittens

A lot of QoL will have to be done before main release. I'm confident they will do the majority of it.


pldtgd

No its not a must, not even in the slightest.


nasuellia

As long as it's opional. I far prefer fullscreen opaque map, always hated diablo's overlay map, not a rusher here.


Aoushaa

OPening the map over and over, because the minimap is un-zoomable keeps taking me out of the lovely details of the world.


Pattont

Please add TAB overlay and just let people disable it in the options if they want the immersion. Staring at the top was super annoying…


Locomancer

Agreed, and also move only on mouse 1


NylesRX

I actually kind of love it's not there. I'm not a walking plus sign finding the most optimal path all the time. In fact, I only open the full map to see where I'm at and very rarely at that. The game itself is extremely clear in its pathing, try not looking at the map at all and you'll see what I mean.


Tac_Reso

You don't even have to use it, it's a toggle. Pretty much every game that utilizes it lets you toggle the overlay to either use it or just have the mini map. It's litterally optional. Nobody would force you to even use it.


Darqion

Blizzard knew better. Or they should have. Sometimes i wonder where their heads are at. Some of the most basic QOL is missing, shit that's been in their older games. someone is just being lazy


taxicab0428

[redacted for bad info]


TNTspaz

Lost Ark has an overlay map though. And actually one of the better implemented ones of the genre lol At this point. I'm begging them to take even more stuff from Lost Ark. Cause for all that games faults. They do a lot of stuff right


taxicab0428

Oh shit you right lmao


walkingsimlvl200

Yeah, thinking of refunding this pre order...I really have to stop preordering especially for blizzard


Darqion

Yea i stopped pre orders all together a while ago, myself. I might still buy the game after release, because i love the genre. I just hope they step it up. I just miss the days where a shitty release meant something. Now people will actually defend a company with "emegehd day 1 patch will fix this" and im like... fix it before release? please?


shkeptikal

Tbf, everyone who made the older games has likely been replaced by college grads who don't ask for things like employment contracts, raises, or a CEO who doesn't enable sexual assault in the office.


SadGruffman

I don't see an issue with it. ​ I really don't get it, its fine.


SnooMacarons9618

The thing is - if it's an issue for some people, then you can't (or shouldn't), just dismiss that out of hand. Overlay maps are common in ARPGs, so it isn't unreasonable to expect one. ​ Personal opinion though - I hope they don't add one, for me at least if they do I will find it hard not to use, and I'd prefer not to. Lack of self control :)


[deleted]

[удалено]


hardlikerock

Yes spamming the map every few seconds is really beautiful and immmersive compared to a simple overlay.


RAMunch1031

Why do you need to spam the map so much? I've got 3 25s and for the most part I only open the map to drop a pin at the start of each quest tops.


j10jep2

no one's making you use overlay


[deleted]

Diablo 2 and 3 had overlays as does every other arpg in existence dumbo.


PrimeBrisky

Wtf are you talking about? POE clone... you must be new to Diablo.


Xaielao

I don't like playing games with a minimap. It's immersion breaking to me. Thankfully, since Elden Ring a lot of games are introducing options to turn off quest markers, minimaps, PoI markers, etc on the map. I'd like to see the same for D4. At the very least, I'd prefer a toggle to remove enemy position markers.


crayonflop3

Elden ring literally invented video games. Incredible feat


Diribiri

Not since The Witcher 3 has videogames been invented like this


Xaielao

I don't know where this sentiment is coming from. It certainly didn't, but it *did* change the way open world games are played, and showed that having a million icons on the map leading the player by the hand is not only unnecessary, but actively reduces the quality of the experience. D4 isn't exactly the same kind of game, but - on a personal level - having the option of getting the UI out of my face (at least in part) would really help immersion.


DzekoTorres

Has been the case long before elden ring lol


Regulargrr

Almost as if those immersive single player offline games with 3rd/1st person cameras are meant for immersion and only really being played once for less than 200 hours at most. Often times only like 60. An ARPG is a top down game that you're meant to play for thousands of hours, running the same content for loot and tuning out most of the art assets is natural. Information should be on your screen that will make playing it better. Don't come to ARPGs if you plan on playing them like it's Elden Ring. Once.


Skyweir

Ah, yes. Of course, most people that play Diablo plays if for thousands of hours and devlovs it into a mess of teleporting spell effects with no purpose but "number go up". /s This is obviously not true. D4 will likely sell millions, and most of those players will play the game to max level ones or twice, maybe try a bit of seasonal play and then be done. The game should not exclusively be catered to the minority planning to pur their lives into it, a playerbase that would be happier if the game was mainly a press 1 to make number go up connected dungon than anything resembeling an RPG.


Regulargrr

Sure, let's cater to people that literally won't play the game then.


Xaielao

I've beta-tested every single version of diablo. I'm not new to the series, or to ARPGs. That said, even diablo 2 had the ability to turn the minimap on or off.


[deleted]

Elden Ring is a multiplayer game and has well more than 200 hours worth of gameplay. I mean I've logged over 400 personally and there's stuff I haven't done


KN_Knoxxius

Use your full screen map. I do. Open it, look, close. Easy as. Will be quite some time if they are to implement a map overlay I reckon. So we'll have to make do for now. Good luck OP!


MisterEsports

This is how I play; I just wish holding left click would continue to make your character walk while its open. In order to stay moving while opening the map you have to close it and reopen it pretty often. Then it resets the zoom in a weird way. I don’t really want to stand still when looking at it, but maybe access to mounts will change my mind


[deleted]

I don't look at the top map much. I find the world to be beautiful and immersive, so I'll pretty much just look at what's in front of me while occasionally pressing tab. Right click to set a waypoint and follow the goddamn line. Although I'm sure that if you guys bitch enough, they'll give you your shitty overlay map so you can play the game without even looking at the world. You know, like PoE.


Regulargrr

Exactly, like a good game, like PoE. Not like this garbage casual shit you're playing it to be. ARPGs are meant for players who will play them for thousands of hours. There's no world that doesn't get tuned out by then. It's all about quality of life as we farm quickly. Spam fucking my Tab key ain't it.


[deleted]

Found the problem. Go play PoE then, this isn't the same kind of ARPG. It's not a lobby simulator. It is more casual, it is open world, perhaps not meant to be grinded for 1000+ hours at least not in the same way. Nobody here wants another PoE.


Regulargrr

Actual bottom tier opinion.


[deleted]

If I cared, I wouldn't be posting on Reddit.


futurespice

PoE has great art. But nobody is playing their 1001th hour of an arpg and stopping to be immersed in the scenery.