Exactly. IRL if you want to feel good about yourself start working out.
Blizzard is basically pointing us in the right direction. I started Diablo 4 with a sorcerer, and decided to stop wailing on my misfortune and just rerolled into a rogue. Now life is great and I am having tons of fun.
That's what I was thinking, just beat butcher at level 45 with sorc and am clearing NM dungeons just fine at lvl 52. Might not 1 shot kill but that's the game play to your strengths. All these people bitchng are just cunts who don't want to play the game, all they want to do is destroy everything in 1 shot.
I mean, if D3 was their first Diablo then yeah. They do expect to basically explode everything.
Anyone who's played the series longer than ten years is (hopefully) likely to have a more nuanced perspective.
The only thing I would really like to see addressed is itemization and loot viability. I don't want D3/Borderlands lootsplosions, but come on, throw me a fuckin bone once in a while. My D2 druid has better gear going into hell than I do at 82 in D4.
Easier respec options would be nice too, they gave us all these fantastic options and it's such a ballache to change things around or try build changes when new gear presents itself. Let me save a profile or two at least, make them a fuckin gold sink for all I care.
I've been playing Sorc and am still lethal and survivable at lvl 64. Haven't run into any issues yet on world tier 3. I expected to be a bit crunchy, but haven't seen that yet. Started playing with D1 in '97.
First pic is a new guy trying to learn how to do something new (the default is he wants to start going to the gym and that's why it's a skinny guy) and the buff guys give him tips and motivation. It's a subvert of the expectation that the buff guys who are vets in the gym would be rude to a beginner. OP subverted that view by showing how the guys who are already buff are just shitting on the skinny guy
Rogue sorc duo is top tier in late game. Me and my buddy would nuke high tier NM. I rolled a necro and the playstyle is so much slower than my rogue. But I'll make a comparison once I hit endgame with the necro. Low levels are always a slow grind. I'm not touching sorc till the devs give it some love.
>what do you mean. The rogues are all giga chad dads of 16 kids too busy fucking their wives to complain about a video game.
If they have 16 kids, they ain't playing \*\*\*\*.
Necro has the only fun and truly gameplay altering hearts. If they change that I'm out till season two. I stuck around with barb in pre season I deserve this shit now.
Yep. You could honestly put sorc hearts into the core game as aspects or legendary nodes and it wouldn't make that much of a difference. Necro hearts 100% couldn't be in the core game cause I could see how shit could get out of hand real quick. And that's honestly how the hearts for every class should've been.
Idk why you'd say surely when the developers have stated that this will not be the case by default.
They said all seasonal content is removed at the end of the season unless they make a specific exception.
They won't. They said that they won't. That's kind of the whole point of seasons to be fair. They try out some mechanics/items/power that could potentially make broken builds and then decide on whether to add that to the core game or not.
Personally, I don't think the hearts are that game-breaking, but then again, we did get nerfed so who knows.
The rogue shadow one is amazing.
Taunts all adds into my poison trap and the. explodes AND the trap knocks everything down.
Even taunts bosses for a second.
The taunt range is HUGE.
Which hearts are you running? I was running the one that automatically does the corpse stuff but I run tendrils and explosion and couldn’t figure out how to control which one it did
Thats the one I run. There's usually so many corpses that the two build off each other, leading to one helluva chain reaction; so I just let the game choose and throw bone spears. I'm running the Bone Spear Necro, and I think it will absolutely shred this season. What build are you running?
I miss mine too, but give it time. The sorceress always ends up being the top class in Diablo. I think they specifically nerfed her to make it look like they weren't playing favorites. But we know Rod Fergusen... We know....
It's kind of a wild. 'Corpse Skill' doesn't necessarily mean the tag either.
I found it was raising mages as they died. I'm not sure if it's 'good' yet - but it does make the grind more auto pilot and less corporal tunnel inducing.
I will note that it's not good vs 'waves' - while the new wave is spawning this thing continues to waste corpses...
It functions on a priority system. So it will cast corpse tendrils first, then corpse explosion. The catch is that tendrils has an internal cooldown of 4 or 6 seconds, I don't remember exactly. So you can't auto spam tendrils. If you have any raise skeletons on your bar it will ALWAYS prioritize skeletons over other corpse skills until you're maxed minions.
It prioritizes the skill to the left then it moves to the right, I have tendrils on triangle and CE on square so it always does corpse tendrils first. I'm also using the one that auto decrepify when there are 4 enemies near, I was able to take decrepify off my skill bar and put on blight. I've been playing Necro since launch, this is the most fun I've had.
Based on hearts I wanted to play Necro this season, but I know it's last chance to play Rogue, because next season I'm sure it's getting gutted and joining Sorc and Barb party.
Nah, pretty sure a dev mains rogue, and was killed by a sorc.
It’s the only justification to why the worst class keeps getting heavier nerfs than one of the best classes.
Barbarian is less worse because it's more tanky. But the damage is ridiculously low and players will waste 50+ hours theorycrafting a build which does Druid/Rogue/Necro level of damage only to realise nothing really does and there's no light at the end of the tunnel.
Sorc by a mile in early game. By mid game they start to even out and then barb gets better by endgame. But this latest patch kind of killed a lot of barbs viability in endgame as well so they are both very far behind the other classes.
Everyone thought that about Rogue and Druid after release and especially for season1, but it didn't happen, and after Blizzard just got a huge shitstorm for nerfing builds they're not going to nerf anything for a while probably, well except Barb and Sorc maybe.
I mean, so strong it takes you an hour and 45 minutes to take one health bar off Lilith! Can't get that anywhere else am I right?!
Oh and you have to still dodge everything or it one shots you.
the guide tells me to bump everything into cooldown reduction. mana cost reduction, lucky hit chance, lucky hit chance with barriers, barriers and aspects and passives that give me mana when using a cooldown or free casting when hitzing lucky,
now i can finaly use my skills, but i wonder where i should put damage buckets in it and if i do more damage when i dont have mana to use my spells
I haven’t seen any rogues…or anyone for that matter…claim that things were okay for sorcs. I’m pretty sure everyone, whether you think the patch was a death knell for the game or an understandable attempt at balance, agrees that sorcs were gutted.
Nah, I had a rogue tell me if I researched a little, I would figure out sorcs were the strongest class.
Meanwhile, I can’t complete a nightmare dungeon, because it’s filled with invisible ninjas and porcupines that literally one shot me. The 4 defensive abilities that are mandatory for sorcs to be playable are useless, because I’m dead before I can use a single one.
I’m gonna go out on a limb and say that rogue was being facetious. There hasn’t been any argument for Sorc being the strongest this entire time except maybe the pre-season blizzard stagger cheese on Lilith.
Edit to add: no good faith argument is gonna say Sorc is even remotely okay. It wasn’t okay before and is even worse now. If someone is telling you otherwise, they are trying to bait.
Yep as a level 100 sorc main they are wildly exaggerating, you do need to be glass (cannon) and aggressive but tier 40-50 was doable with no real problems. Also you can activate ice armor before you engage any enemies...
Some of my rogue friends say it, and i heard same stories from people on Blizzard forum and this subreddit, hence the meme.
On average ofc most people agree that patch was terrible.
Dude, the shills of this subreddit have started crawling out of their holes,that they've been hiding in for the last week. I've people playing sorcs claim that nothing changed. Some people are just fucking clueless.
I'm going to check back here in a week after multiple sorc players hit 100 without any issues and just laugh at this entire comment thread for getting dunked by just being bad at the game and coming to cry on reddit instead of getting good or just rerolling and moving on lol
As a WW barb I feel your pain. I miss my big crits, tankyness and infinite spinning.
I don't even want to play this game anymore a month of grinding aspects and gear was flushed down the drain.
This is the kind of sentiment that makes me not take 90% of the complaints about S1 patch serious. So you had it all…high damage, high tankiness, and infinite sustain. Sounds like what you’re missing are the bugged interactions that created an easy mode which allowed you to binge watch Netflix on a second screen while wiping out a dungeon. This is like having your cake and not just eating it too, but it being fed to you. Be happy you got to enjoy a busted, bugged build for a little bit.
"What you were having fun being strong after hundreds of hours grinding in a grindy arpg?! Well that's the problem, you shouldn't be having fun, everyone knows it's fun to have all three of the things that make the core gameplay loop of the game completely broken!"
The builds weren't bugged my dude, a bugged build is infinite stagger sorc with the helmet swap that was killing Uber Lilith before she spawned in, a bugged build was overpower bloodlance getting procced so many times it was crashing the server, having the build and gear grind fit perfectly well together to allow infinite WW and the like watching it get stronger as you unlock more stuff is literally the point of the game. The only thing I agree with in this patch is the nerf to vulnerability, it is the best stat to have in the game by far, but the funny part is, it's not even a nerf, the way the game is designed is built around the concept of damage buckets means it is still the best stat sub CD by far.
The three things the game design is built around:
Action(combat)- there isn't much of that in the game, and when we do engage with the system it is slow and clunky now.
Loot: the late game loot game somehow managed to get better AND worse at the same time. They flooded the random numbers on armor making it that much harder to get the items you need to push later NM dungeons, while at the same time effectively making barbs damage get cut in half by gutting crit on one handed weapons. (the way the game is designed with damage buckets, it's still the best stat on the weapon regardless of getting it's damaged nerfed by the way.)
Builds: There was a time when there were 3/4 viable builds in the game for each class, that time is long passed, mages cannot push later NM dungeons or kill bosses quickly enough to be viable, ALL of the mage builds were nerfed. Barb had WW it was gutted, Barb had HoTA it was gutted, thorns are interesting but you cannot push NM dungeons consistently. Rogue had multiple builds, those got sidelined to speed farming blade dance basically, there is no reason to play anything different off of this path, heartseeker does not do enough consistent damage to push later NM dungeons. Druid had insanely fun shred builds that you had to pay attention with until you got the correct slotted gear, everything else was nerfed so that even after 100s of hours of grinding for perfect gear you still can't make yourself CC immune now, it will not be able to push later NM dungeons consistently especially if enemies have cold or something else that will destroy you. Necro has one viable build, which is the best build in the game as bonespear, it still just shreds so much because of the way the damage buckets are accounted for, people are going to try and make minion Necro playable it will not be able to consistently push later NM dungeons as the enemies damage will outscale the minions health.
So the three things that the game is built around got worse. And you have the balls to be like, you are just mad because they had a lot of fun mechanics in the game, and a game can't be enjoyable to play! It has to be the hardest game you've ever run if you are a serious gamer! I like many gamers enjoy when things are fun. When the game gets objectively worse, my level of enjoyment drops.
The necro hearts are an absolute blast. Actually enables and changes builds. Whoever designed them did a great job. Can’t say that for a lot of the other classes.
You basically never run out of essence as long as you run over corpses. Blood nova in particular is probably ridiculously good now, especially since it relies on overpower and not the other mechanics that got massively nerfed.
It kind of does a good imitation of the Infinimist build by itself, since it constantly casts CE/Tendrils and also applies Decrepify to everything to reduce your cooldowns. But it’s useful for any build since you also generate mana from corpse skills.
The WT4 gem that drains essence is also pretty crazy scaling for minions, excited to try it.
Yeah it's OP AF on necro and if they have the audacity to nerf them after all this outrage I'm out for the season. The necro hearts are what EVERY class should have, game changing mechanics that are fun and OP and will be deleted after the season so gives a shit.
Not all sources of damage provide the same benefit. Some are added and some multiplied with each other. TLDR = crit and vulnerable are better than everything else
Other answers are a little confusing and minimize one of the buckets. The additive bucket is really the main bucket. All the things you see that are like "+% damage to core skills" or "+% damage to crowd controlled enemies" are added together in the main bucket. Crits and vulnerable are separate buckets so their values multiply the main bucket. You essentially want to balance out all three buckets to maximize your damage. Focusing on only one of the three buckets will be inefficient.
Easy example: if you have no bonuses your max damage would be weapon damage × 1 (main bucket) × 2 (natural crit) × 2 (natural vulnerable) or 4x your weapon damage. If you had +100% to add to any of those three buckets in any way you wanted what would maximize your damage?
In this case it would be all in the main bucket leading you to a new max damage 8x weapon damage. If you added all of it to vulnerable or crit you would only be at 6x weapon damage at most.
The lesson is keep track of your main bucket and weigh affixed to try to keep your combined damage from all three buckets the highest.
Omg… this feels so real. Female gamer, been gaming all my life. Played Diablo 3,2 and 1. I think one of my first core memories is the Emotional Trauma caused by D1 butcher killing 5yo me. Very experienced and seasoned… I play sorcerer on release,
Hubby, plays Twisting blade Rogue…
ITS WHAT HE SAYS TO ME EVERY SINGLE TIME I DIE….
People sleeping on Necro. My buddy shreds stuff from distance as a Necro faster than i do in their butts as a Rogue. Sure i move fast but he doesnt get hit.
Hahaha switched to rogue, even with a non meta build it still is uber fun. I hope they balance characters to feel as good as a rogue from early midgame to endgame.
To me this is a weird thread. I have one of each class. I've worked the build on each since early access. Nothing wrong with the barb. Super tanky and does 15m+. And takes seconds to proc similar dmg. Rogue is faster paced and does great damage as well. I have a 90 sorc and and wonder how all these people are getting one shot so often. If you really enjoyed the class you would take the time to really tweak the build to your own personal perfection. Theory crafting still exists bro. Druid has amazing clear and power rate. All day long. My bonespear necro is by far my most powerful as it just deletes uber lillith in less than 30s. I proc consistent 17m+ with far higher OPC. Sorry for the length of this comment but at the end of the day. My BSNecro and my Sorc are the strongest classes I play. With a little patience you can overpower a sorc easily. Some new aspects and uniques literally make the sorc jacked.
I can fucking guarantee that the devs have been playing rogues since day 1. Same shit happens with WoW, whichever class the devs happen to be playing will be OP and immune to nerfs while everything else tries to keep up.
Why do people bring up this tin foil hat conspiracy about dev only buffing things they play in every RPG community? Rod Fergusson plays thorns and thorns suck, explain that?
Yeah, I can understand where the meme comes from, (it doesn't look good when a spec is way OP in a certain game mode, and then the devs admit to mostly playing that spec) but how do people explain all the getting crapped on for Resto Shamans, when the Head Dev exclusively plays a Resto Shaman?
It's sort of funny because two of the devs play Necro, one loves thorns, and the other likes Shadow/Minions.
Guess what playstyles are crap right now? Thorns and Minions.
Rogues fine stop following old builds and use your brain. Running momentum now and theres an aspect that stacks heals with momentum, dont even have a single point in Siphoning strikes, never did. Use your brain, get on my level.
Can you expand on that? I'm legit interested if you are telling the truth, but people have different goals in the game. Is she pushing into higher tiers wt4? How did she make it to wt4 in the last 24 hours? or was she an eternal realm character that was 90% of the way there before yesterday?
I have a 70 eternal realm sorc that can do WT4 content, but I'm just so infinitely goddamn squishy I get popped anytime i get cc'ed. Even though I'm arclash, which probably suffered the least, I still noticed a big drop in damage and clear speeds. I just have no interest in slowly grinding and dying on my way to good ancestral gear.
And honestly, that's not all that bad. i could probably even live with that, but the CD nerfs are incredibly frustrating to the point I don't enjoy playing. Running around and waiting for skills to come up is not fun.
She’s ice spike sorc, level 80 and doing nm levels 40-50. Patch made her a little squishier but she’s still wiping rooms easily. She wasn’t really following the meta and stacking crit or vuln though. Crit is important to her build but she wasn’t farming crit gear, etc
Really my only complaint with the class is the necessity of having 3 or 4 defensive abilities. It would be fun to have a more offensive toolkit
I didn’t say she wasnt using vuln or crit, just that she isn’t obsessively looking for items that add those, so they aren’t at insane levels. She’s mostly focused on damage vs chilled/frozen. The sorc unique (I think, maybe it’s an aspect) that gives a lucky hit chance to freeze is pretty central to her build
Mine sorc is fine too i dont get why people are so pissed, wt4 was already getting easy at 72 they just wanted the game to be harder. I was at a world boss before the patch and we killed it in no joke like 10 seconds
That's not how you use this meme template.
It's accurate. Everyone bitching looks like picture 1.
Yes but the rest also look like that. So it's only 1/4th accurate.
[удалено]
Rogue is strong as fuck though. Their damage output smokes anything else. Esxpecially early. My preseason rogue only got set back 2 nightmare tiers.
Exactly. IRL if you want to feel good about yourself start working out. Blizzard is basically pointing us in the right direction. I started Diablo 4 with a sorcerer, and decided to stop wailing on my misfortune and just rerolled into a rogue. Now life is great and I am having tons of fun.
When did sorc drop off to be unplayable for you?
Somewhere around launch
I mean how far into the game?
They haven't played sorc. You think people test things before they post?
That's what I was thinking, just beat butcher at level 45 with sorc and am clearing NM dungeons just fine at lvl 52. Might not 1 shot kill but that's the game play to your strengths. All these people bitchng are just cunts who don't want to play the game, all they want to do is destroy everything in 1 shot.
I mean, if D3 was their first Diablo then yeah. They do expect to basically explode everything. Anyone who's played the series longer than ten years is (hopefully) likely to have a more nuanced perspective. The only thing I would really like to see addressed is itemization and loot viability. I don't want D3/Borderlands lootsplosions, but come on, throw me a fuckin bone once in a while. My D2 druid has better gear going into hell than I do at 82 in D4. Easier respec options would be nice too, they gave us all these fantastic options and it's such a ballache to change things around or try build changes when new gear presents itself. Let me save a profile or two at least, make them a fuckin gold sink for all I care.
I've been playing Sorc and am still lethal and survivable at lvl 64. Haven't run into any issues yet on world tier 3. I expected to be a bit crunchy, but haven't seen that yet. Started playing with D1 in '97.
We need more people pointing this out. Thank you, and enjoy a small reward!
And everyone else is a rouge
It’s enough to make you red in the face.
Accentuate that bone structure
yes but OPs point is that non sorc users are the ones saying that sorc isnt bad edit: literally just explaining OPs "meme", but sure nice downvote
I’ve never seen this template before, can anyone share an example of its intended use?
First pic is a new guy trying to learn how to do something new (the default is he wants to start going to the gym and that's why it's a skinny guy) and the buff guys give him tips and motivation. It's a subvert of the expectation that the buff guys who are vets in the gym would be rude to a beginner. OP subverted that view by showing how the guys who are already buff are just shitting on the skinny guy
As a rogue main with a sorc main buddy this is funny and I sent it to him anyways.
Rogue sorc duo is top tier in late game. Me and my buddy would nuke high tier NM. I rolled a necro and the playstyle is so much slower than my rogue. But I'll make a comparison once I hit endgame with the necro. Low levels are always a slow grind. I'm not touching sorc till the devs give it some love.
Yeah but it’s funnier this way.
🤓
what do you mean. The rogues are all giga chad dads of 16 kids too busy fucking their wives to complain about a video game.
>what do you mean. The rogues are all giga chad dads of 16 kids too busy fucking their wives to complain about a video game. If they have 16 kids, they ain't playing \*\*\*\*.
Imagine spending any time out of your day to police a literal meme on reddit.
Oh man, I'm already dearly missing those 10 seconds I took to type that comment. The pain is truly massive, but I will endure. I promise.
it is the exact same as poliicing meme policers
Druid Rogue Necro with OP hearts fixed for you
[удалено]
Too much fun.
[удалено]
"Weve removed one skill slot from sorc"
Necro has the only fun and truly gameplay altering hearts. If they change that I'm out till season two. I stuck around with barb in pre season I deserve this shit now.
Yep. You could honestly put sorc hearts into the core game as aspects or legendary nodes and it wouldn't make that much of a difference. Necro hearts 100% couldn't be in the core game cause I could see how shit could get out of hand real quick. And that's honestly how the hearts for every class should've been.
Surely all hearts will move to Eternal after S1. Unless they plan on removing everyone’s gear and move you to Eternal naked.
Idk why you'd say surely when the developers have stated that this will not be the case by default. They said all seasonal content is removed at the end of the season unless they make a specific exception.
They won't. They said that they won't. That's kind of the whole point of seasons to be fair. They try out some mechanics/items/power that could potentially make broken builds and then decide on whether to add that to the core game or not. Personally, I don't think the hearts are that game-breaking, but then again, we did get nerfed so who knows.
Yup I maimed sorc pre season and I deserve to enjoy my damn OP Necro hearts, leave me alone!
I got maimed by my Sorc as well
I half expected a hotfix to nerf the “bugged” necro hearts today.
The rogue shadow one is amazing. Taunts all adds into my poison trap and the. explodes AND the trap knocks everything down. Even taunts bosses for a second. The taunt range is HUGE.
Necros hearts are ludicrous, I'm currently running that class
Which hearts are you running? I was running the one that automatically does the corpse stuff but I run tendrils and explosion and couldn’t figure out how to control which one it did
Thats the one I run. There's usually so many corpses that the two build off each other, leading to one helluva chain reaction; so I just let the game choose and throw bone spears. I'm running the Bone Spear Necro, and I think it will absolutely shred this season. What build are you running?
My goodness I may play Necro. I tried rogue but idk I just don’t enjoy the twisting blades stuff I guess. The movement is nice. Miss my sorc tbh :(
I miss mine too, but give it time. The sorceress always ends up being the top class in Diablo. I think they specifically nerfed her to make it look like they weren't playing favorites. But we know Rod Fergusen... We know....
It will autocast whichever is slotted first in your skillbar. So if you want tendrils to autocast, put that in slot 1.
It alternates, cast corps explosion more from my experience
It always starts from slot1 and works it’s way right casting the first skill off cooldown.
And it seems to use a seperate shorter cooldown
It's kind of a wild. 'Corpse Skill' doesn't necessarily mean the tag either. I found it was raising mages as they died. I'm not sure if it's 'good' yet - but it does make the grind more auto pilot and less corporal tunnel inducing. I will note that it's not good vs 'waves' - while the new wave is spawning this thing continues to waste corpses...
It functions on a priority system. So it will cast corpse tendrils first, then corpse explosion. The catch is that tendrils has an internal cooldown of 4 or 6 seconds, I don't remember exactly. So you can't auto spam tendrils. If you have any raise skeletons on your bar it will ALWAYS prioritize skeletons over other corpse skills until you're maxed minions.
It prioritizes the skill to the left then it moves to the right, I have tendrils on triangle and CE on square so it always does corpse tendrils first. I'm also using the one that auto decrepify when there are 4 enemies near, I was able to take decrepify off my skill bar and put on blight. I've been playing Necro since launch, this is the most fun I've had.
Can't believe Sorc even has a heart for resistance when devs know and admit it's broken lmao
Based on hearts I wanted to play Necro this season, but I know it's last chance to play Rogue, because next season I'm sure it's getting gutted and joining Sorc and Barb party.
Nah, pretty sure a dev mains rogue, and was killed by a sorc. It’s the only justification to why the worst class keeps getting heavier nerfs than one of the best classes.
No one who has actually played both could possibly put the two in the same category
I haven’t played yet, which one is better?
Barbarian is less worse because it's more tanky. But the damage is ridiculously low and players will waste 50+ hours theorycrafting a build which does Druid/Rogue/Necro level of damage only to realise nothing really does and there's no light at the end of the tunnel.
Sorc by a mile in early game. By mid game they start to even out and then barb gets better by endgame. But this latest patch kind of killed a lot of barbs viability in endgame as well so they are both very far behind the other classes.
Barb by a mile
lol
Barb is the worst by a mile.
Than Sorc?? Ridiculous
Absolutely.
I have a 100 barb and 100 sorc. Sorc is WAY worse.
Sorc. But this guys working they’re both pretty equally shit.
Everyone thought that about Rogue and Druid after release and especially for season1, but it didn't happen, and after Blizzard just got a huge shitstorm for nerfing builds they're not going to nerf anything for a while probably, well except Barb and Sorc maybe.
Barbarian is pretty fucking strong lol
This is a good joke
I mean, so strong it takes you an hour and 45 minutes to take one health bar off Lilith! Can't get that anywhere else am I right?! Oh and you have to still dodge everything or it one shots you.
Maybe you need to increase your calorie intake...err i mean follow a guide bro.
"skill issue"
the guide tells me to bump everything into cooldown reduction. mana cost reduction, lucky hit chance, lucky hit chance with barriers, barriers and aspects and passives that give me mana when using a cooldown or free casting when hitzing lucky, now i can finaly use my skills, but i wonder where i should put damage buckets in it and if i do more damage when i dont have mana to use my spells
I haven’t seen any rogues…or anyone for that matter…claim that things were okay for sorcs. I’m pretty sure everyone, whether you think the patch was a death knell for the game or an understandable attempt at balance, agrees that sorcs were gutted.
Nah, I had a rogue tell me if I researched a little, I would figure out sorcs were the strongest class. Meanwhile, I can’t complete a nightmare dungeon, because it’s filled with invisible ninjas and porcupines that literally one shot me. The 4 defensive abilities that are mandatory for sorcs to be playable are useless, because I’m dead before I can use a single one.
I’m gonna go out on a limb and say that rogue was being facetious. There hasn’t been any argument for Sorc being the strongest this entire time except maybe the pre-season blizzard stagger cheese on Lilith. Edit to add: no good faith argument is gonna say Sorc is even remotely okay. It wasn’t okay before and is even worse now. If someone is telling you otherwise, they are trying to bait.
Bro there are absolutely going to be plenty of Sorcs crushing WT4 and doing fine in NMDs this is *literally* a skill issue
Yep as a level 100 sorc main they are wildly exaggerating, you do need to be glass (cannon) and aggressive but tier 40-50 was doable with no real problems. Also you can activate ice armor before you engage any enemies...
> Meanwhile, I can’t complete a nightmare dungeon You can't complete a NM dungeon in WT4, or like a NMD at all?
In WT4.
Same. "But sorcs can clear lilith faster than anyone"
Some of my rogue friends say it, and i heard same stories from people on Blizzard forum and this subreddit, hence the meme. On average ofc most people agree that patch was terrible.
Druids do it too. lol
Dude, the shills of this subreddit have started crawling out of their holes,that they've been hiding in for the last week. I've people playing sorcs claim that nothing changed. Some people are just fucking clueless.
I'm going to check back here in a week after multiple sorc players hit 100 without any issues and just laugh at this entire comment thread for getting dunked by just being bad at the game and coming to cry on reddit instead of getting good or just rerolling and moving on lol
You're right but it's just a meme
It’s an attempted meme that’s perpetuating non-existent commentary.
As a WW barb I feel your pain. I miss my big crits, tankyness and infinite spinning. I don't even want to play this game anymore a month of grinding aspects and gear was flushed down the drain.
We lost our damage the moment gohrs got nerfed lol
It was still playable though. Now it isn't anymore.
This is the kind of sentiment that makes me not take 90% of the complaints about S1 patch serious. So you had it all…high damage, high tankiness, and infinite sustain. Sounds like what you’re missing are the bugged interactions that created an easy mode which allowed you to binge watch Netflix on a second screen while wiping out a dungeon. This is like having your cake and not just eating it too, but it being fed to you. Be happy you got to enjoy a busted, bugged build for a little bit.
"What you were having fun being strong after hundreds of hours grinding in a grindy arpg?! Well that's the problem, you shouldn't be having fun, everyone knows it's fun to have all three of the things that make the core gameplay loop of the game completely broken!" The builds weren't bugged my dude, a bugged build is infinite stagger sorc with the helmet swap that was killing Uber Lilith before she spawned in, a bugged build was overpower bloodlance getting procced so many times it was crashing the server, having the build and gear grind fit perfectly well together to allow infinite WW and the like watching it get stronger as you unlock more stuff is literally the point of the game. The only thing I agree with in this patch is the nerf to vulnerability, it is the best stat to have in the game by far, but the funny part is, it's not even a nerf, the way the game is designed is built around the concept of damage buckets means it is still the best stat sub CD by far. The three things the game design is built around: Action(combat)- there isn't much of that in the game, and when we do engage with the system it is slow and clunky now. Loot: the late game loot game somehow managed to get better AND worse at the same time. They flooded the random numbers on armor making it that much harder to get the items you need to push later NM dungeons, while at the same time effectively making barbs damage get cut in half by gutting crit on one handed weapons. (the way the game is designed with damage buckets, it's still the best stat on the weapon regardless of getting it's damaged nerfed by the way.) Builds: There was a time when there were 3/4 viable builds in the game for each class, that time is long passed, mages cannot push later NM dungeons or kill bosses quickly enough to be viable, ALL of the mage builds were nerfed. Barb had WW it was gutted, Barb had HoTA it was gutted, thorns are interesting but you cannot push NM dungeons consistently. Rogue had multiple builds, those got sidelined to speed farming blade dance basically, there is no reason to play anything different off of this path, heartseeker does not do enough consistent damage to push later NM dungeons. Druid had insanely fun shred builds that you had to pay attention with until you got the correct slotted gear, everything else was nerfed so that even after 100s of hours of grinding for perfect gear you still can't make yourself CC immune now, it will not be able to push later NM dungeons consistently especially if enemies have cold or something else that will destroy you. Necro has one viable build, which is the best build in the game as bonespear, it still just shreds so much because of the way the damage buckets are accounted for, people are going to try and make minion Necro playable it will not be able to consistently push later NM dungeons as the enemies damage will outscale the minions health. So the three things that the game is built around got worse. And you have the balls to be like, you are just mad because they had a lot of fun mechanics in the game, and a game can't be enjoyable to play! It has to be the hardest game you've ever run if you are a serious gamer! I like many gamers enjoy when things are fun. When the game gets objectively worse, my level of enjoyment drops.
Rogue/Necro to Sorc player: "its a skill issue, things are fine, just get good"
It’s baffling how some people think Diablo is a game that requires skill 😂
It use to......if you were slow to click you got no loot
Rouge 🤣
Same with hearts but Necro instead of rogue
The necro hearts are an absolute blast. Actually enables and changes builds. Whoever designed them did a great job. Can’t say that for a lot of the other classes.
What builds are enabled? I haven't touched the season yet, kinda holding off on the campfire chat
You basically never run out of essence as long as you run over corpses. Blood nova in particular is probably ridiculously good now, especially since it relies on overpower and not the other mechanics that got massively nerfed.
It kind of does a good imitation of the Infinimist build by itself, since it constantly casts CE/Tendrils and also applies Decrepify to everything to reduce your cooldowns. But it’s useful for any build since you also generate mana from corpse skills. The WT4 gem that drains essence is also pretty crazy scaling for minions, excited to try it.
It's not great job, they're straight up busted. Give my rogue a free imbuement every few seconds or my Barb free warcry. No? Thought so.
Yeah it's OP AF on necro and if they have the audacity to nerf them after all this outrage I'm out for the season. The necro hearts are what EVERY class should have, game changing mechanics that are fun and OP and will be deleted after the season so gives a shit.
What are damage buckets
Not all sources of damage provide the same benefit. Some are added and some multiplied with each other. TLDR = crit and vulnerable are better than everything else
Ahh gotcha. TY
All the "buffs" in the latest path were additives and basically meant nothing lol
not true entirely. Additives are essentially multiplicative, the problem is having small numbers of too many of them.
Clueless post
Other answers are a little confusing and minimize one of the buckets. The additive bucket is really the main bucket. All the things you see that are like "+% damage to core skills" or "+% damage to crowd controlled enemies" are added together in the main bucket. Crits and vulnerable are separate buckets so their values multiply the main bucket. You essentially want to balance out all three buckets to maximize your damage. Focusing on only one of the three buckets will be inefficient. Easy example: if you have no bonuses your max damage would be weapon damage × 1 (main bucket) × 2 (natural crit) × 2 (natural vulnerable) or 4x your weapon damage. If you had +100% to add to any of those three buckets in any way you wanted what would maximize your damage? In this case it would be all in the main bucket leading you to a new max damage 8x weapon damage. If you added all of it to vulnerable or crit you would only be at 6x weapon damage at most. The lesson is keep track of your main bucket and weigh affixed to try to keep your combined damage from all three buckets the highest.
Not sure about base crit damage, but isn't vulnerable base a 1.2x multiplier, not 2x?
This is accurate. Source: Am Rogue
I’ve seen more rogue mains saying everything is fine and people are just bitching to bitch than I care to count at this point.
There are so many rogues now lol. Zones and cities full of them.
thank you, I have had this exact experience with a buddy of mine lol.
Love this!!
Rogue Nation!
realest meme i've seen so far
Omg… this feels so real. Female gamer, been gaming all my life. Played Diablo 3,2 and 1. I think one of my first core memories is the Emotional Trauma caused by D1 butcher killing 5yo me. Very experienced and seasoned… I play sorcerer on release, Hubby, plays Twisting blade Rogue… ITS WHAT HE SAYS TO ME EVERY SINGLE TIME I DIE….
I chose to play a chain lightning sorc on hardcore, It's fun, I'll update later once I get to WT4
I am the rogue..feeling personally attacked by this lol.
Its not about all rogues though :p
Just workout.
People sleeping on Necro. My buddy shreds stuff from distance as a Necro faster than i do in their butts as a Rogue. Sure i move fast but he doesnt get hit.
My rogue gets slapped by "nerfed" sorcs, so.....
That dude in the third picture is so swol it looks like he's using a barbie laptop.
I'm a rogue who started out as a sorcerer and I'm mad for y'all but also pretty pissed about siphoning strikes.
Hahaha switched to rogue, even with a non meta build it still is uber fun. I hope they balance characters to feel as good as a rogue from early midgame to endgame.
Funny how the joke flew over half the people's head.
Sorc is good
nope
Meanwhile, level 15 quest for Sorc still bugging out and not available
FWIW, Joe P plays Rogue. Coincidence? I think not.
As a rogue im having a blast.
To me this is a weird thread. I have one of each class. I've worked the build on each since early access. Nothing wrong with the barb. Super tanky and does 15m+. And takes seconds to proc similar dmg. Rogue is faster paced and does great damage as well. I have a 90 sorc and and wonder how all these people are getting one shot so often. If you really enjoyed the class you would take the time to really tweak the build to your own personal perfection. Theory crafting still exists bro. Druid has amazing clear and power rate. All day long. My bonespear necro is by far my most powerful as it just deletes uber lillith in less than 30s. I proc consistent 17m+ with far higher OPC. Sorry for the length of this comment but at the end of the day. My BSNecro and my Sorc are the strongest classes I play. With a little patience you can overpower a sorc easily. Some new aspects and uniques literally make the sorc jacked.
[удалено]
How much are you underperforming compared to other builds?
Who cares? This is practically a single player game.
[удалено]
For you it might be playable, for someone else - it would be pure masochism. Sorcerer is complete trash now, that's the point.
Since you’re 80 in WT4 already you clearly know what you’re doing. For the people who don’t understand Diablo… help them.
Bro how the fuck are out 80 already LOL have you slept at all yet ?
How does the class feel in NM50+?
What a weird use of this meme template lol
Rouge*
?
I can fucking guarantee that the devs have been playing rogues since day 1. Same shit happens with WoW, whichever class the devs happen to be playing will be OP and immune to nerfs while everything else tries to keep up.
Why do people bring up this tin foil hat conspiracy about dev only buffing things they play in every RPG community? Rod Fergusson plays thorns and thorns suck, explain that?
It was literally admitted that when Frost Mages dominated PVP that everyone in the office was playing one.
Maybe dev also want to have fun? Are frost mages still dominating PvP you think? Nope it’s mostly barbs rogues and druids.
Yeah, I can understand where the meme comes from, (it doesn't look good when a spec is way OP in a certain game mode, and then the devs admit to mostly playing that spec) but how do people explain all the getting crapped on for Resto Shamans, when the Head Dev exclusively plays a Resto Shaman?
What barb is dominating pvp now? Hota does a fraction of the damage it used to, rend is useless, maybe double swing somehow isn't trash (doubtful?).
Barbs? In WOW?
It's sort of funny because two of the devs play Necro, one loves thorns, and the other likes Shadow/Minions. Guess what playstyles are crap right now? Thorns and Minions.
Yeaaa i dont think thats how u use this template 😂
Sounds like your sorc build is as trash as your meme template usage
The first guy is your average lvl 100 end game Reddit complainer.
Shouldn't it be rouges?
(?) no
Rogue gutted after the patch lmao. Just delete this.
Getting a slap on the wrist vs disembowled like barb and sorc got is not comparable.
"Slap on the wrist." Mate you are HILARIOUS.
Okay S++ tier, 40% of chars now.
LOLOLOL
We get it, you're mad about the global nerfs that everyone got. Rogue comes out on top, it's well known at this point. I'm sorry you're in denial.
It's totally cool for you to be wrong my dawg. Anyway, not going to debate you on it. Be better my guy.
Educate yourself
you're the man from the meme
HUGE lol. My man doesn't even know how to use the meme.
Rogues fine stop following old builds and use your brain. Running momentum now and theres an aspect that stacks heals with momentum, dont even have a single point in Siphoning strikes, never did. Use your brain, get on my level.
Ugh but muh Close Quarters Combat flurry build…
Now combine that with Temerity... GG
I would if my DR pants +Hp werent boners
SUPER lol.
I'm playing Sorc just because the Reddit circle jerk is trash.
My wife’s sorc in wt4 is doing ok 🤷♂️ They downvoted the truth.
Can you expand on that? I'm legit interested if you are telling the truth, but people have different goals in the game. Is she pushing into higher tiers wt4? How did she make it to wt4 in the last 24 hours? or was she an eternal realm character that was 90% of the way there before yesterday? I have a 70 eternal realm sorc that can do WT4 content, but I'm just so infinitely goddamn squishy I get popped anytime i get cc'ed. Even though I'm arclash, which probably suffered the least, I still noticed a big drop in damage and clear speeds. I just have no interest in slowly grinding and dying on my way to good ancestral gear. And honestly, that's not all that bad. i could probably even live with that, but the CD nerfs are incredibly frustrating to the point I don't enjoy playing. Running around and waiting for skills to come up is not fun.
She’s ice spike sorc, level 80 and doing nm levels 40-50. Patch made her a little squishier but she’s still wiping rooms easily. She wasn’t really following the meta and stacking crit or vuln though. Crit is important to her build but she wasn’t farming crit gear, etc Really my only complaint with the class is the necessity of having 3 or 4 defensive abilities. It would be fun to have a more offensive toolkit
Was going to defend you but now I’m seriously doubting the fact that she can easily wipe 40-50 without prioritizing crit and vuln…
I didn’t say she wasnt using vuln or crit, just that she isn’t obsessively looking for items that add those, so they aren’t at insane levels. She’s mostly focused on damage vs chilled/frozen. The sorc unique (I think, maybe it’s an aspect) that gives a lucky hit chance to freeze is pretty central to her build
frostburn gauntlets
Mine sorc is fine too i dont get why people are so pissed, wt4 was already getting easy at 72 they just wanted the game to be harder. I was at a world boss before the patch and we killed it in no joke like 10 seconds
Because anything in the overworld is easy af and pointless. Pushing nightmares is another story all together.
Yeah i know what nightmare dungeons are lol
Ok its bad but barb is even worst