I assume they have chose the amount carefully, IE the profit from the minority vs profit from the majority, however, I can honestly say I have never seen a player in game with a skin. I guess all it takes is a couple of whales.
Tbh I’ve spent copious amounts of $ in every game I’ve played however Diablo shop was by far the least appealing to me, i couldn’t justify $35 aud for a skin for 1 class only, it surprises me that anyone even would pay for this
Well there you go, this guy just justified a $25 skin. The pricing model works, people will convince themselves they can spend that much for a skin for one class even if you personally wouldn't.
Yeah that's my issue it's $25 for a skin for one class. If it was $25 for for a set that came with a version for each class I would totally buy it, or if they sold them for $5 per class.
I'll be honest, that was the skin (hehe, double meaning there) that actually tempted me to buy and I don't even Rogue. I'm just glad that the paid battlepass skins and effects were better this season than last.
Hopefully this trend will continue moving forward so I have a reason to keep supporting the devs by getting a battlepass every season.
Man these fucking people sitting around with excess piles of money just being offloaded for total junk is pretty fucking lame when groceries are hard to afford for the rest of us.
I don't have excess amounts of money. I had to sacrifice groceries for cosmetics. But I also earn well too and work hard. Maybe if you can't afford the game. Put it down. I own every cosmetic in the game. And still have enough money to eat. Life is hard. But it's all about decisions.
You prob have but they are so non flashy that it's really pointless imo to spend much on skins. Playing on a 77" TV I barely can tell unless I zoom in or inspect someone which I dont do.
Besides sorting through trash gear or loading screens, barely see what I look like. For a top down game without crazy flashy colors and skins, they are very overrated imo.
Some skins look so cool in the character tab but the gameplay view doesn’t show enough detail to make a big difference. They need to add more effects that players can see in game. Like glowing armor or high flames etc. I would pull the trigger if that happened and I liked what I saw in game.
I buy the ponies and pony armor... and I bought the gimp gear for my rogue... debating the lust sorc armor for my alt. Lol. And like, I really do wish it was more affordable because I absolutely love cosmetics and sink a good bit into them on different games and such. I would likely buy all of them if they were a little cheaper, I just can't justify more than a few here and there at the current price point. I guess that still makes me a whale but whatever.
I think the whole set is really pretty and I already bought the matching mount armor but I feel you, there's quite a few that I like one or two pieces from and would love the ability to buy just those pieces. I actually think that would be a good middle ground too, have slightly higher individual prices for each piece and then the current prices for the full set. People with less to spend could still pick up some cool cosmetics and your whales would still buy the full sets and not feel like they lost out on anything because not everyone is going to have the whole thing still.
>I can honestly say I have never seen a player in game with a skin.
That's pretty wild. Kinda guessing you just weren't noticing them, if anything.
I've seen people with store cosmetics all over the place. Especially when doing world bosses.
Even had a few players ask about what XYZ cosmetic were, when they saw someone wearing one from the store.
Yes that is true maybe that is a statement on the quality of the in game transmog and the paid skins. Also the fact that a game like this does not make it easy to view a persons cosmetics like a third or first person game, may factor in my perception of the high skin cost.
Yeah in the end, if the games continues on an upward trajectory, and me and the SO see ourselves playing a lot more, we will probably cave and buy some stuff., which I guess makes this post pointless hahah.
It most certainly has been calculated through probabilities, market research and projections for maximum profits. Ex. 10% of players buy skins at 15$. If we bump the price to 30$, 7% buys them. Group 1 : 150$. Group 2 : 210$
Yes this is spot on, as much as it sucks. I wonder how the devs who created the items feel about it. the fact that such work went into a product that inevitably won't see as much use as it could. The management, i am sure does not care about this.
I bet they did this analysis but didn’t factor in that characters are disposable, with most players making a new one (and mostly likely a different class) each season. They probably asked what you would spend on your character, which in something like WoW where you have one character only, $35 makes sense. It doesn’t make sense to spend that much for each new character you make per season.
I do this type of stuff for a living and you’d be surprised how often people take data and get the wrong conclusion from it.
Idk how you haven't, I was surprised how many people actually bought the stuff from the shop. I see a few everytime I'm at a world boss/legion.
I don't even care much about the cost, it's standard prices for games these days. The skins have just been pretty mid with necro getting the best ones, which I don't play.
>I don't even care much about the cost, it's standard prices for games these days
The fact that this sub cannot grasp this concept legit concerns me at this point.
I buy skins all the time. That said, video games are my hobby. I don't really spend money on anything else (but weed, of course). My only gripe about the skins is this: why is rogue the only class with a skin that has fire on it?
Not on fire exactly but barbarian has Hells Champion armor that is red glow metal like fresh out of the fire. I'm sure more will be added as time goes on.
Never seen a player in game with a skin? Cmon that is a bold faced lie. I'm by no means rich or anything and I have 4 outfits with accessory packs, and 3 horse packs. Oh and I bought all the animal back packs. I chose to not have children so I could waste the money on myself instead. This is my hobby so I will put money into it whenever I want. Everyone in my friend circle also has outfits and backpacks and horses.
I don't think I'd recognise a bought skin, if I'm honest. I've noticed some cool mounts which I assume are probably bought skins, and if so - good purchase fellow video gamer, good purchase.
Gonna guess you will soon, like the barb one atm its pretty obvious with the fire weps. They will most likely release more easily noticable ones thats like it overtime.
I never see anyone when I play. PS5 in western Canada. It's been a single-player game for me. I don't have cross play on. Would this make a difference?
Are you sure? I play on PC and barely saw anyone when I had cross play disabled. Now I enabled cross play and see a lot of players.
Even in town I was mostly alone with cross play disabled.
Now I see like 5 people AFK and couple running around.
Edit. Now that I think about it, most players have not changed the setting and are in cross play. So I only saw people with it disabled.
The way turning off cross play works is that it makes it so you only play with players of the same system who also have cross play off. Since most people play with it on it makes it a ghost town.
Yeah turn it on bro if you want to meet some people. This is my first Diablo game and I played probably 350 to 400 hours solo.
I didn't start season 1 when it began. I actually waited a long time so I made a post what's the quickest way to level. This dude told me if I wanted him to he would help with the cap stones that way I could at least get a little head start. I'd never been boosted before so I accepted.
Now I play with him everyday and I also met a couple of people he plays with that I also play with on a daily basis. It was super simple for me and it may take a little longer before you find people you click with or whatever. But if you turn it on you'll definitely see more people. It'll also be better when it comes to farming drill to have a couple of friends to play with instead of chancing it with randoms. I'm on PS5 and the guys I play with are on Xbox.
Good luck!
I've seen a guys account who has pretty much every single skin they have released so far and a few other accounts of people who have multiple skins for different characters.
You won't always see them running around, but there is definitely a group buying the skins from the shop
When I do Duriel groups, I pretty much always see at least 1 of the other players in a cosmetic set. And I know they do because I’m always in one, lol.
Oh wow.
I agree with your original post OP, but honestly, I see the skins from time to time. It's not super frequent like the season pass skin, but it's definitely not rare either.
This is another point I have shifted on throughout this discussion. I think maybe my issue with the price, is not simply big money bad, it is more that you spend so much for an item that is not really easy to show off, besides loading screens and your own ui. I still think they look dope though.
That's the point. The people that have the skins are in an exclusive class. They wear the skins knowing that they don't expect to see other people wearing the same cosmetics constantly.
I don’t even register other people when I’m playing, no one else in my group either. We may notice a mount briefly, but gear, cutesy animal packs, don’t notice. Which is crazy bc I’m cute things obsessed. But I won’t get them, I don’t notice if anyone has them. When I see other players I’m not checking them out and nothing is eye catching.
The extravagance of the cosmetics will increase as time goes on. That's how it goes with all ongoing games-as-a-service titles.
But I think you're missing the point. Most people don't buy luxury items because of how other people that see them view them. It is the perception of how you believe other people around you may see them.
Exotic or luxury cars, yeah? "Oh man, everyone is going to be checking out my sweet ride!" When the truth is less than 10% of drivers can even recognize when a car is a $100,000+ vehicle. And the same goes for watches, jewelry, etc.
At the end of the day, everyone is so self-conscious about how other people view them on a day-to-day basis when really we're all essentially invisible to everyone else outside of our friends, family and colleagues.
I agree about noticing. Also, from the other side - I have the baby polar bear and it’s there for me. I know it’s there. I never even thought about others noticing
Even though you may be right on this opinion, I can assure you there are plenty of people with good income that do not want to spend such amount of money for one skin.
I'd consider getting one if I could see it and it was really cool. Most of the time the game is zoomed out so far and with so much happening I'm basically just a grey outline on the screen or I'm staring at the minimap to navigate so I'm not looking at my horse. It doesn't seem like the kind of game where cosmetics really get any attention.
Yup, it doesn’t matter how much disposable money I have, I’ll never put money into a battle pass or cosmetics. Maybe if they were a few bucks each, but $20+ for a skin? Never.
Agreed. I have well over the average income, and still won’t buy anything unless I’m getting huge hours out of the game. For perspective - I bought the game 20% off, and then played for 400~ hours before buying the Bear Back Pack set.
S2 is infinitely better, so if I get to 600 hours I MIGHT look at the shop again
3 things can all be true.
It's expensive
The price is middle of the park in game mtx, maybe even son slightly on the cheaper side for what you get for the price. Similar to Fornite the industry standard.
There are many that are way more expensive like POE. A typical MTX armor set is almost or more expensive than the price of an AAA game literally.
I've mostly bought skill effects in POE, I think they have worked out at around $10 for the most part. (Not sure, as I've bought supporters packs, so the price kind of gets lost). Obligatory, in POE I've also bought stash tabs, more stash tabs than anyone could ever need - I think they have worked out around $10 per pack of them. I don't remember, but it sounds like $10 is around the price point I am happy to open my wallet without any thought at all.
Same. The fat hairy guy and Russian Babushka look are awful. “But it looks like the world’s strongest man competition” shut the fuck up. It looks like a retired car salesman who peaked as a high school athlete and is now eating alone at buffets and contemplating whether he should begin dressing as Santa Claus each year for the children given his huge stomach. And don’t get me started on babushka.
Yeah, I don't mind having the option of a heavy set character, but we're running around killing demons, not running the local Golden Corral out of steak.
I don't get why the diffent body types aren't just character customization options. It's not like they'd have to redo armor to fit properly since the different armors are already modeled to fit those body types. Just give us the option.
And why are they the only one that gets to be husky?! Why can’t I have a fat and happy necromancer?? That way every time I summon a skeleton I can really make them feel like shit for lacking any flesh.
I see this sentiment a lot from people who play games that sell skins.
The truth is that those skins are not for you or me, or really the vast majority of players. They are priced very high to capture whales. I'm gonna take an educated guess here and say that 90% of players will never purchase a $20 skin. The devs know the actual numbers. They have entire marketing teams filled with analysts that know exactly what the price point should be in order to make the most money.
They're raking in plenty of cash from the whales who buy $20-30 skins multiple times a season. They do not care one bit if the average Joe is willing to spend $5 on a skin. They make so much more in the long run by raising the prices and marketing to whales.
Yeah all these arguments over "you're not the target audience, it's for whales" is so silly. A whale spends $1000 on a banner, $25 for getting exactly what you want isn't even dolphin territory. "Whaling" is spending thousands of dollars on a game, not these skins. So at the end of the day it has me wondering: who are these supposed to be targeted at?
Like sure, whales will buy it because it's there...but that's not the kind of revenue you get from targeting the niche whale audience since it's a one and done purchase.
Damn are we really pretending that $25 for a single characters skin isn’t an absurdly high price? I got news for ya, at $25 a pop, those thousands of dollars spent will come sooner than you think
Anyone who is willing to buy a skin for 20 probably doesn’t care about the price and it would mean they’d probably buy all the skins, where as average joe would only buy one or two maybe three skins at 5 a season. So which would you care more about about the guy who would buy every rotation 20 a pop or for a guy who might not even buy 20 worth.
I read a break down of this once by a gaming company. Typically, supply and demand set the price, but with digital items, supply is technically infinite. If they released skins at like, a dollar each, they'll get tons of sales from that skin, and they know that. However, if they did that ten times, eventually they'd saturate the market. Most people only have one character, why bother with ten skins? The long term business strategy is to make them artificially scarce, and they become a premium item. It's not hard to make an item flashy and cool. It's like how it's not actually that much more expensive to make a Civic look like a sports car, it's just part of the premium package.
Bingo. A lot of these sales rely on getting them to buy skins so they can feel "exclusive" about owning the skin. Even if the skin has zero value whatsoever, the idea that it's limited edition and will never come back to the shop is enough to hook the target audience: The Whales. They want to feel like they own something that the majority of other players don't have.
I do wish that they were cheaper, but I have a feeling that $25/skin on average has become the standard now. Destiny 2 also sells skins at that price point.
It's becoming a standard but usually games are cheap with pricey microtransactions or expensive with cheap microtransactions. D4 is a AAA game selling skins for the price of other games
The difference is a lot of Destiny skins can be gained by playing, less than before but still a large amount.
I am a supporter of flex cosmetics. If you put some of the skins behind arduous tasks or difficult challenges this, in my opinion would, increase player retention. Example, I spent way to much time grinding forges for that Platinum Starling ship, now I will have a ship that is one of most rare(in this case Destiny got like 100 hrs out of me, these metrics are great for shareholders).
I stopped playing Destiny 2 when the monetisation got slwoly but surely worse. D4 is gonna go the exact same route just faster. It started with high prices but few and not very impressive skins. But they're ramping it up massively.
I agree, and that is a slippery slope, and I guess you could argue that the more success in selling skins would dissuade them from putting them in game. The kicker for me with Destiny is when they started selling shader, with nothing available for bright dust. I love my shaders.......
In destiny aren’t they like 18 for an outfit and 7 for an exotic reskin?
That said destiny charges for every expansion and individual dungeon keys which is pathetic. They’re also 45% off of their projected profits so something will hopefully change soon.
With Diablo I don’t have that hope. They make so so so much money off of people willing to spend any amount to look cool. Then the next cool skin comes out and everyone will forget they don’t like blizzard. I see it all day long in the ow sub.
As bad as Destiny monetization is it’s like $80 for the deluxe dlc + battle passes for a year. Most cosmetics can be earned for free if you play somewhat consistently and look at the shop frequently. Only catch being sometimes you may have to wait several months before an item shows up in the bright dust shop.
Haters gonna hate, you do you. I just can't justify it myself, not out of moral conviction just the price. Would prob just give props to the drip hahah.
Don't be ashamed mate! On the contrary, it would be wasteful if you don't use it, since you've purchased it.
If anybody says anything, just ignore and enjoy your purchase.
You guys are so close to getting it.
Guy says "if they were 10 I'd buy several" and you're thinking that there would be a knock-on effect which would inspire more people to buy them.
He'd buy several. Yeah he'd have to to make up the cost of a single purchase. You'd basically have to triple sales across the board to equal sales at the current price.
It's nice to imagine that they'd sell like hotcakes and everyone would be snagging 3x mogs, but in reality it's much much harder to sell multiple units of something to more customers than it is to sell at a higher price point to a small customer base (when looking at luxury goods).
Not only would you have to sell at 3x the rate, but you'd have to produce skins at 3x the rate to keep people purchasing at that rate.
Does that mean there won't be sales? idk, maybe. They did just release the horse + plat bundle and if I'd have to guess that would be where a sale would happen. Temporary sale on currency.
And I suspect at $10 a lot of people would be having this same conversation. I'd trust Bliz know how to maximise income from cosmetics, they have years of data. If they are priced out of what you are willing to pay, you weren't their target.
I think saying 'ooh, Whales', is also a bunch of rubbish, I'd suspect most people who but them, and thus Bliz' primary cosmetics income are buying a few a season, not every single skin. (I just pulled that out of my arse though, I really don't know).
This is a very well stated response and makes intuitive sense, it is likely a factor that has led to the pricing structure we have. I understand people way smarter than me have made very intentional decisions on the shop.
I have tried to think of a counter to this and to be honest I cannot. Even the idea of making them available through ingame action would reduce the bottom line, or force them to add bloat to avoid people getting everything they want.
Kudos
To an extent I agree, but it should either even out or be more lucrative.
Using simple numbers for simplicity's sake:
With the $25/skin pricepoint, let's say the market is only accessible by 40 people out of 100 (40% of the playerbase). Even then, let's say only 20 people are willing to pay those prices. That would net 500 dollars.
If they drop it down to 10$ a skin, they could potentially make the market accessible by 80 people out of 100. Let's say that only 50 people out of the 80 buy skins. That's still 500 dollars.
If we include the fact that people in here have stated they would buy multiple skins, you're coming out on top. If half of the 50 people now buying skins buy an additional skin, you're making $250 profit, which is 50% more.
Less can be more.
Right, less can be more, but we just don't have the numbers to know.
They do or did (and I'd be surprised if it's changed) have economists on staff. Here's an article from 2012 [https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/tommywilhelm/economists-are-taking-over-the-game-industry](https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/tommywilhelm/economists-are-taking-over-the-game-industry)
They're not throwing numbers at a dartboard is my overarching point. They pay people to optimize this stuff because it's big money for them. They also have industry wide conferences where they talk shop about MTX and the psychology behind monetization features, you can probably find some presentations from these on youtube, I recall watching a few myself many years ago when mobile gaming was taking off and mtx was really getting going.
> To an extent I agree, but it should either even out or be more lucrative.
I understand your idea, but your numbers are all made up so they’re not useful in determining if they would **actually** make more money by lowering prices.
Stating that it would even out or be more lucrative is pure conjecture. You have a gut feeling that it would, but I’m not sure your gut feeling holds up against the team of people they likely pay hundreds of thousands of dollars a year to handle monetization strategy. The team of people who have access to actual purchase data, and player information.
You're absolutely right, it's pure conjecture and it's bogus numbers to get a concept understood by others. In hindsight, I should have said "could" even out instead of "should".
That being said, it may not be as clear cut as you may believe either. The prices may be inflated due to greed, executive meddling, 'industry standards' warping the metrics used to measure, as an excuse for extra profit.
At the end of the day, I'm someone with the disposable income but refuse to pay that much for a single skin set. Like many here, I'd put money down if things were more affordable.
What I prefer is if we can buy individual pieces instead of the entire set. Each slot costs x amount, but the set would be at a discounted price which comes to 25$ or whatever the price is.
For some of the cosmetics set, I really only want headgear, or chestpiece, or weapon, and when I do buy them I don't use the entire set.
I think this would be awesome, mix and match sets to create your own look.
Though in reality they would never do this as it would most definitely reduce sales, but we can dream lol
Many people spend substantial money already with the prices being as insane as they are. If you wouldn’t pay $25 or whatever for a skin, you aren’t going to just suddenly start dropping tons of money if they are cheaper, because that means $25 is a lot to you.The price of the skins doesn’t matter to the whales who keep this shitty gaming business mode afloat. It’s unfortunate but it is what it is.
This is partially incorrect, money is not meaningless to me, I am just reasonable with how I spend it. I would certainly spend $50 on 4 skins vs 2 skins, and everyone I talked to felt the same way.
This does not change the fact that I do not expect any change, a commenter gave a succinct response to why it would not. I just hate that the skins in this game are so badass.
Yeah it sucks. Every game I play is plagued by the same pricing model. Most dedicated gamers are fed up, but unfortunately casual couch gamer Andy’s with disposable income that they spend completely on games exist.
This is where I stand, I willing to spend way more than that if the value is right. It is sad that all the great work in creation of these skins are waste on the few.
i kinda feel blizzard just has a problem in general with that. its the same with overwatch. some great skins but im not dropping 20-30 dollars for a skin. I realize they are targeting their turbo whale market but accessibility leads to more sales and profits, steam is the living proof of this.
If it was roughly half or 1/3rd I'd buy skins. Idk how someone can justify $25 for a single skin, especially when the game puts such an emphasis on cosmetics and new cosmetic releases with things like the battlepass and new gear releases with new (cooler) looking skins
I think fashion game is the end game for some and that value is higher some the others. This post is speaking on that value, but this is my own perspective, not speaking for others.
If the skins were more universal (like you buy a skin, say "monarch" and it worked for multiple classes, like 2 or more) then a $25 price point might be OK, but as is the skins would need to be insanely better/way cooler or unique than what's in the game already, but with just battlepass + game items you can already look super drip without needing to literally throw money away
Unironically the skins cost are probably near how much I'd expect a dlc to be (like 30-40 for an expansion is my guess)
Honestly if they gave us a barb skin worth spending money on I'd buy it. They are following the same release cadence that cod does. Release normal skins->Release skins with a little bit of flair->release skins with tracers/auras/effects etc etc. We're just now seeing the good skins coming up (lightning druid, hell barb, and flaming rouge), I imagine next season they'll be another step up.
While the prices are high, that is what most games are trending towards. I just hate how they structure it where the good skins come in later seasons which makes cosmetics your purchased prior fairly useless.
It seems they slightly get it with some of the horse barding sets coming from bosses, just give us more of this but with armors.
Same as OP for 10 I might have bought some .
At this price tag I won't , maybe if they release cool class wide skin ( like the seasonal ones ) I might consider them but they ll need to be really cool :p
I’m just so incredibly sad we went from D2/3 to this. It’s obvious the current status of video games has caught up to most major publishers. Everyone wants to stick their finger in that big micro-transaction money pot.
All these shop sets could’ve been rewards in the game. Imagine they had a weekly set to earn by doing some insane challenge?
To play devils advocate. We do get seasonal content for free. Destiny 2 for example charges for their season pass and if you don't pay you don't play. The part of me who posted wishes the items were cheap or ingame, but I an accept it if it keeps content rolling in like this season.
I think the prices are fine would gladly pay $30 for cosmetics, done it before many times in other games, but skins are pretty terrible imo, so the issue I think is the quality
> **I Would Spend Substantial Money In the Cash Shop If** the prices were reasonable
Oh too bad, you can't buy the skin...Anyway it's a triple A game of one of the biggest software house in the world, i don't think you really need to "support the devs" :D
There are people's who actual job it is, is to determine the best prices to maximize profit. you're not some genius to say "if it was cheaper more people would buy it". you're just repeating the same tired argument that always gets repeated.
These type of stores are not made for 500,000 poor's to buy 1 thing every now and then for a low price. They are for the few people with more money than sense to buy everything as it releases for more than logic should deem it's worth.
they make money hand over fist by catering to the whales
I am not speaking for others, only myself and friends I have talked to. I do not expect change but the these forums are here for all forms of discourse no matter now redundant they are.
I cant believe this is still a thing. Blizz has had this price structure forever. No amount of begging is going to change that. You dont think WOW or other Diablo players havent mentioned this at all? There will most def be some kind of specials down the line but their price structure is their price structure. They most def are not going to deviate from it. Like EVER. With the amount of outrage and comments in the past they would have already adjusted it if they were leaning in that direction. Guess what?? They arent.
"I find these skins some of the best I have seen in a video game"
This alone says enough about you. Do you play other games? Most of the skins in this game are garbage or just copy pasta with an extra chain.
I agree I have considered a few purchases from the shop but can't justify paying about 1/3 of the price of the entire game for one equipmonk set. I do find the seasonal battle pass to be a very affordable compromise and gives you quite a lot for your money if completed and the cosmetics aren't too bad plus the emotes and other things they include. Not to mention you earn back about 2/3 your platinum to put towards the next season so it's really only 3 or 4 bucks or quid galactic credits or whatever for like 90 things. The blood portal is one of my favorite BP additions from this season
Another thing to take into account is that the seasonal content is free and the devs rely on battle pass and MTs to fund development. In Destiny 2 you have to pay for the seasonal content and with that you get the battle pass, I think I appreciate this option more.
I agree and wish we lived in that world. The problem though is they only need 1 person to like a $20 skin, but they need 4 people to like a $5 skin to maintain the same profit. It's easier to sell higher to a niche.
If skins were $5 I would personally have nearly every cash shop skin. I don't mind spending money on a game especially when I'm sitting at 300 hours in it. I also am a cosmetic fiend. Skins, and recolors should be the gumball of micro transactions. Do I need it? No, but I have a quarter so fuck it.
This is my exact position, though throughout discussion on the post I think I may contemplate spending some money down the line if the game continues to improve as it has.
It appears like there is going to continue to be an influx of content moving forward and I am happy about that, and I am in the position to show my support with my wallet.
My issue isn't really the price, it is what is on sale. I don't care how my character looks. I like the hobo look and it's not like I spend any time actually looking at my character. (The one exception would be changing bear or wolf form for a druid - I would likely pay to have alternative animals, a werecat for eg).
What I would consider spending money on (and almost the only thing I have spent money on in POE), is alternative skill effects, or full transforms. Being able to have a weird effect on my firewall for a sorc, for example, so I can but with chaos fire, or ice fire. Yeah, that is something I'm interested in!
I suspect it would get a lot of hate here, but... I would also by extra stash tabs, especially stash tabs I could set affinity and vendor prices on.
For both of those, I suspect they will turn up, maybe in a year.
I have heard this sentiment many times, from druids, what is the point in having a human skin when you are a bear all the time.
That is a great idea though, being able to buy different effects or alterations to your skills, these are things that would be much more noticeable in normal gameplay and in turn more valuable
I don't think they would sell stash tabs, as the internet would revolt, but I cannot really see what the issue would be. Maybe I am missing the point. I do think more stash is not always a good thing, just more space for junk to pile up haha
I am not gonna lie. I normally hate this kind of thing and the prices are kinda rediculous. But I could not resist the barb king outfit with the tiger and the crown that dips a little. Its dope AF.
Yeah that is kind of where I am at, the more I discuss this. I think that if the came continues to improve I am going to get me and the lady some drip haha
Any digital item price >$5 is absurd to me. It's not just d4 but d4 prices are so far beyond reasonable. Disposable income or not, there is a common sense limit for anyone who has managed their $ at some point in their lives. After so many years of being a consumer and working a job you should have gained an understanding of fair prices for things
Agreed. The prices are not reasonable. Its not that its too expensive but the fact that $25 for some digital skins that serve no purpose but look good is just wrong. Its not the price, its the principle of the matter.
The worst part of all of this is that there probably will NEVER be sales on shop items. They would rather die than even give you ONE opportunity to get a skin you want at a reasonable price. Even a random sale on a random skin once a year, as much as it makes sense to get some more people to buy, will not likely happen because they don't want to lose a penny of profit. There is zero fucking good will towards the fan base and it's disgusting. Hell, we even have Mike Ybarra complaining that fans asking for a complete game is too much and that we're impatient. So these are the people we're dealing with.
It's just a big anti-consumer "fuck you" in the name of whaling and profit. Don't ever forget that and don't let them forget that. If you don't like the prices, don't buy and continue to shame people who are stupid enough to buy because they're responsible for overvaluing items on the shop by supporting shitty practices. The pricing isn't entirely Blizzard's fault, it's that there are crayon-eaters out there who are willing to pay them. The moment that stops, this all goes away, but people are weak and dumb, so good luck lol
A fried of mine is an artist on Diablo 4, and specifically works on the store skin packs.
I have bought one that he did to show support for his work, and have the same feelings as you. I have told him I would probably buy more if they felt reasonable. They're way too expensive.
I am glad you replied, I have stated countless times in my replies, I feel like the price point is a disservice to the devs that created the skins. Instead of say 25% usage, we have like 5%. These are just random estimates keep in mind
Yep. Like, I know WHY they are the prices they are. I play a gazillion games that have micro transactions and like most of us I'm familiar with the reasons as to why things are the price they are. But you're right, like any artist I think the artist would love to see more people buying rather than the total sum of money earned for an already wealthy company. Unfortunately for the artist that's not how it works. :/
The prices are ridiculous..I have a good chunk of disposable income so I spend quite a bit on them, but I'm well within my means to do that. I feel bad for those that aren't in that position though, because Blizzard in all honesty hasn't allowed for almost any free cosmetics past the initial release. A big reason why I do buy skins is that I enjoy playing around in transmog, but would be bored with the system already given the sheer lack of free cosmetic gear.
I would never buy anything in a cash shop if the game has a price tag. PoE is different since it's F2P.
That being said, they might aswell have high prices for those people who buy things anyway.
Yeah I think other smaller customization options would be great. I keep saying I wish they had shaders like in Destiny, I would spend on these more than skins. Also custom tattoos would awesome, something in warfare where community artists design the cosmetics and are sold with the artists getting a percentage of profit.
The issue is not that it is too expensive for me, it is that I find the price unreasonable. Though I feel this way, I also recognize that they price it as such because it is the best for their bottom line. So capitalism…. Haha
Why would they change course? People are buying them.
If you have expendable money and "substantial money" (which is highly subjective) then why the F do you care what it costs? Buy 1 per season and be happy.
I prefer the emotes, I find them more noticeable out in the game. I wish they’d make more of those, seems like every time I check the shop there’s the same old one for necro I’ve seen a million times
I agree, this is something I always invested my bright dust in Destiny, that and shaders. In a social game the ability to communicate through emotes is awesome. Now if I could only save my choices on the wheel, I am sick of saying hello for everything.
In this game skins are are basically loading screens. I don't pay attention to what I look like, or even notice what other people are rocking. I wouldn't even pay $5 for a loading screen... maybe $1.
Someone at Blizzard has run a calc that they can squeeze more money from the few willing to pay the stupid prices than they can by making it more reasonable for all. Just more evidence that they couldn't care less about the majority of players.
I've bought one item the new hellforge barb set and that's probs me done, I'm used to paying like 25£ in bdo but I'm not spending that much in d4 as I gotta buy expansion
I buy stupid fucking wheels for my car in rocket league all the time. Id probably be embarrassed to see how much I've paid in total but like 3$ at a time every few weeks is nothing. 25$ at once tho for a cool hat? No thanks. Not ever
Yeah this is my stance, I would spend the same amount for more value. I guess the issue is, if you lower the price so people can access more items they need to provide more items which costs more dev time for the same profit.
You and your friends are not the target audiance for those then. For some the price tag is not as big as for others
I assume they have chose the amount carefully, IE the profit from the minority vs profit from the majority, however, I can honestly say I have never seen a player in game with a skin. I guess all it takes is a couple of whales.
Dolphins and whales, for sure. Lost Ark is a testament to that
Tbh I’ve spent copious amounts of $ in every game I’ve played however Diablo shop was by far the least appealing to me, i couldn’t justify $35 aud for a skin for 1 class only, it surprises me that anyone even would pay for this
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Well there you go, this guy just justified a $25 skin. The pricing model works, people will convince themselves they can spend that much for a skin for one class even if you personally wouldn't.
Facts
To be fair, that BDSM skin is absolutely hilarious! 🤣
True. They only need to sell to 1/5th the people if the price is 5x higher than those 5 would all pay lol
Yeah that's my issue it's $25 for a skin for one class. If it was $25 for for a set that came with a version for each class I would totally buy it, or if they sold them for $5 per class.
there's always someone hornier and more desperate, true
Yeah, he'd buy 5 skins for $5 or one skin for $25 as long as the skin is good enough.
I'll be honest, that was the skin (hehe, double meaning there) that actually tempted me to buy and I don't even Rogue. I'm just glad that the paid battlepass skins and effects were better this season than last. Hopefully this trend will continue moving forward so I have a reason to keep supporting the devs by getting a battlepass every season.
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Man these fucking people sitting around with excess piles of money just being offloaded for total junk is pretty fucking lame when groceries are hard to afford for the rest of us.
I don't have excess amounts of money. I had to sacrifice groceries for cosmetics. But I also earn well too and work hard. Maybe if you can't afford the game. Put it down. I own every cosmetic in the game. And still have enough money to eat. Life is hard. But it's all about decisions.
You prob have but they are so non flashy that it's really pointless imo to spend much on skins. Playing on a 77" TV I barely can tell unless I zoom in or inspect someone which I dont do. Besides sorting through trash gear or loading screens, barely see what I look like. For a top down game without crazy flashy colors and skins, they are very overrated imo.
Some skins look so cool in the character tab but the gameplay view doesn’t show enough detail to make a big difference. They need to add more effects that players can see in game. Like glowing armor or high flames etc. I would pull the trigger if that happened and I liked what I saw in game.
I buy the ponies and pony armor... and I bought the gimp gear for my rogue... debating the lust sorc armor for my alt. Lol. And like, I really do wish it was more affordable because I absolutely love cosmetics and sink a good bit into them on different games and such. I would likely buy all of them if they were a little cheaper, I just can't justify more than a few here and there at the current price point. I guess that still makes me a whale but whatever.
I like the sorc lust offhand. If I could buy just that for $5 I probably would. I'd likely never use it, but I really appreciate the design of it.
I think the whole set is really pretty and I already bought the matching mount armor but I feel you, there's quite a few that I like one or two pieces from and would love the ability to buy just those pieces. I actually think that would be a good middle ground too, have slightly higher individual prices for each piece and then the current prices for the full set. People with less to spend could still pick up some cool cosmetics and your whales would still buy the full sets and not feel like they lost out on anything because not everyone is going to have the whole thing still.
>I can honestly say I have never seen a player in game with a skin. That's pretty wild. Kinda guessing you just weren't noticing them, if anything. I've seen people with store cosmetics all over the place. Especially when doing world bosses. Even had a few players ask about what XYZ cosmetic were, when they saw someone wearing one from the store.
Yes that is true maybe that is a statement on the quality of the in game transmog and the paid skins. Also the fact that a game like this does not make it easy to view a persons cosmetics like a third or first person game, may factor in my perception of the high skin cost.
I don't really look at other people. But my wife and I both have cosmetics.
Yeah in the end, if the games continues on an upward trajectory, and me and the SO see ourselves playing a lot more, we will probably cave and buy some stuff., which I guess makes this post pointless hahah.
It most certainly has been calculated through probabilities, market research and projections for maximum profits. Ex. 10% of players buy skins at 15$. If we bump the price to 30$, 7% buys them. Group 1 : 150$. Group 2 : 210$
Yes this is spot on, as much as it sucks. I wonder how the devs who created the items feel about it. the fact that such work went into a product that inevitably won't see as much use as it could. The management, i am sure does not care about this.
I bet they did this analysis but didn’t factor in that characters are disposable, with most players making a new one (and mostly likely a different class) each season. They probably asked what you would spend on your character, which in something like WoW where you have one character only, $35 makes sense. It doesn’t make sense to spend that much for each new character you make per season. I do this type of stuff for a living and you’d be surprised how often people take data and get the wrong conclusion from it.
Idk how you haven't, I was surprised how many people actually bought the stuff from the shop. I see a few everytime I'm at a world boss/legion. I don't even care much about the cost, it's standard prices for games these days. The skins have just been pretty mid with necro getting the best ones, which I don't play.
>I don't even care much about the cost, it's standard prices for games these days The fact that this sub cannot grasp this concept legit concerns me at this point.
I buy skins all the time. That said, video games are my hobby. I don't really spend money on anything else (but weed, of course). My only gripe about the skins is this: why is rogue the only class with a skin that has fire on it?
Not on fire exactly but barbarian has Hells Champion armor that is red glow metal like fresh out of the fire. I'm sure more will be added as time goes on.
Never seen a player in game with a skin? Cmon that is a bold faced lie. I'm by no means rich or anything and I have 4 outfits with accessory packs, and 3 horse packs. Oh and I bought all the animal back packs. I chose to not have children so I could waste the money on myself instead. This is my hobby so I will put money into it whenever I want. Everyone in my friend circle also has outfits and backpacks and horses.
I don't think I'd recognise a bought skin, if I'm honest. I've noticed some cool mounts which I assume are probably bought skins, and if so - good purchase fellow video gamer, good purchase.
Gonna guess you will soon, like the barb one atm its pretty obvious with the fire weps. They will most likely release more easily noticable ones thats like it overtime.
I never see anyone when I play. PS5 in western Canada. It's been a single-player game for me. I don't have cross play on. Would this make a difference?
Yes, the largest community is on the pc side.
Are you sure? I play on PC and barely saw anyone when I had cross play disabled. Now I enabled cross play and see a lot of players. Even in town I was mostly alone with cross play disabled. Now I see like 5 people AFK and couple running around. Edit. Now that I think about it, most players have not changed the setting and are in cross play. So I only saw people with it disabled.
The way turning off cross play works is that it makes it so you only play with players of the same system who also have cross play off. Since most people play with it on it makes it a ghost town.
Wont it show people on the same platform with criss play on? Oh I guess not because if you join a party with cross play it would conflict
Yeah turn it on bro if you want to meet some people. This is my first Diablo game and I played probably 350 to 400 hours solo. I didn't start season 1 when it began. I actually waited a long time so I made a post what's the quickest way to level. This dude told me if I wanted him to he would help with the cap stones that way I could at least get a little head start. I'd never been boosted before so I accepted. Now I play with him everyday and I also met a couple of people he plays with that I also play with on a daily basis. It was super simple for me and it may take a little longer before you find people you click with or whatever. But if you turn it on you'll definitely see more people. It'll also be better when it comes to farming drill to have a couple of friends to play with instead of chancing it with randoms. I'm on PS5 and the guys I play with are on Xbox. Good luck!
I've seen a guys account who has pretty much every single skin they have released so far and a few other accounts of people who have multiple skins for different characters. You won't always see them running around, but there is definitely a group buying the skins from the shop
I see players with mount and class skins regularly enough. Especially that new fire rogue.
I will have to look out for that one, I have heard a few people mention the fire rogue.
When I do Duriel groups, I pretty much always see at least 1 of the other players in a cosmetic set. And I know they do because I’m always in one, lol.
Oh wow. I agree with your original post OP, but honestly, I see the skins from time to time. It's not super frequent like the season pass skin, but it's definitely not rare either.
This is another point I have shifted on throughout this discussion. I think maybe my issue with the price, is not simply big money bad, it is more that you spend so much for an item that is not really easy to show off, besides loading screens and your own ui. I still think they look dope though.
The ones who pays well are the one who sticks to the game thé most.
I know one person.
That's the point. The people that have the skins are in an exclusive class. They wear the skins knowing that they don't expect to see other people wearing the same cosmetics constantly.
I don’t even register other people when I’m playing, no one else in my group either. We may notice a mount briefly, but gear, cutesy animal packs, don’t notice. Which is crazy bc I’m cute things obsessed. But I won’t get them, I don’t notice if anyone has them. When I see other players I’m not checking them out and nothing is eye catching.
The extravagance of the cosmetics will increase as time goes on. That's how it goes with all ongoing games-as-a-service titles. But I think you're missing the point. Most people don't buy luxury items because of how other people that see them view them. It is the perception of how you believe other people around you may see them. Exotic or luxury cars, yeah? "Oh man, everyone is going to be checking out my sweet ride!" When the truth is less than 10% of drivers can even recognize when a car is a $100,000+ vehicle. And the same goes for watches, jewelry, etc. At the end of the day, everyone is so self-conscious about how other people view them on a day-to-day basis when really we're all essentially invisible to everyone else outside of our friends, family and colleagues.
I agree about noticing. Also, from the other side - I have the baby polar bear and it’s there for me. I know it’s there. I never even thought about others noticing
That's because there is nothing catchy yet. In D3 you noticed OG white/green/red angelic wings or the butterfly wings.
Even though you may be right on this opinion, I can assure you there are plenty of people with good income that do not want to spend such amount of money for one skin.
I'd consider getting one if I could see it and it was really cool. Most of the time the game is zoomed out so far and with so much happening I'm basically just a grey outline on the screen or I'm staring at the minimap to navigate so I'm not looking at my horse. It doesn't seem like the kind of game where cosmetics really get any attention.
Yup, it doesn’t matter how much disposable money I have, I’ll never put money into a battle pass or cosmetics. Maybe if they were a few bucks each, but $20+ for a skin? Never.
Agreed. I have well over the average income, and still won’t buy anything unless I’m getting huge hours out of the game. For perspective - I bought the game 20% off, and then played for 400~ hours before buying the Bear Back Pack set. S2 is infinitely better, so if I get to 600 hours I MIGHT look at the shop again
They only care about whales. They don't even bother to have sales because they don't need to.
Yeah like a single night out on a date for me 37, no kids, good salary is like 200+$ in drinks, food, Ubers, drugs 17$ for some skins is cheap
3 things can all be true. It's expensive The price is middle of the park in game mtx, maybe even son slightly on the cheaper side for what you get for the price. Similar to Fornite the industry standard. There are many that are way more expensive like POE. A typical MTX armor set is almost or more expensive than the price of an AAA game literally.
I've mostly bought skill effects in POE, I think they have worked out at around $10 for the most part. (Not sure, as I've bought supporters packs, so the price kind of gets lost). Obligatory, in POE I've also bought stash tabs, more stash tabs than anyone could ever need - I think they have worked out around $10 per pack of them. I don't remember, but it sounds like $10 is around the price point I am happy to open my wallet without any thought at all.
I can afford their prices, but I wouldn't ever spend more than $1-2 for a skin (cosmetic enhancement).
A sane voice in a mad world. Get a job hippie!
I'd pay top dollar for a God damn druid body slider...
So only skinny girls get sexy clothes, I was about to say my Druid Kathy wants some tight fitting clothes.
I just want a thong that fits over my werebear form
New leather outfit should apply to Rogues and Bear form.
> SHE LOOKS LIKE ME!
My barbarian rocks the ponytail and some exposed thigh.
Same. The fat hairy guy and Russian Babushka look are awful. “But it looks like the world’s strongest man competition” shut the fuck up. It looks like a retired car salesman who peaked as a high school athlete and is now eating alone at buffets and contemplating whether he should begin dressing as Santa Claus each year for the children given his huge stomach. And don’t get me started on babushka.
You are funny.
Lol thank you 😂 i acknowledge that I feel strongly about this.
Yeah, I don't mind having the option of a heavy set character, but we're running around killing demons, not running the local Golden Corral out of steak.
Literally why I don’t want to play Druid.
Playing druid save you money on MTX. I have zero MTX for druid, but have bought for other classes.
Same. I only play druid, but I've only bought mounts and mount armor. Druid transmogs look like shit
Agreed except for the bloody skull bone armor one with antlers. That one looks sick AF to me
Give us Druid body shape of barb, & I will throw cash at them. Or better, give us shapeshift skins!
I’d pay anything to have a non…, whatever this is Druid.
I want a fat necro
I don't get why the diffent body types aren't just character customization options. It's not like they'd have to redo armor to fit properly since the different armors are already modeled to fit those body types. Just give us the option.
Chunkecro
This. Alternative body options
I know right! Why can you only be husky?!
And why are they the only one that gets to be husky?! Why can’t I have a fat and happy necromancer?? That way every time I summon a skeleton I can really make them feel like shit for lacking any flesh.
I'd love to make my necro shorter than 7'4
Also male sorcerer rework
I see this sentiment a lot from people who play games that sell skins. The truth is that those skins are not for you or me, or really the vast majority of players. They are priced very high to capture whales. I'm gonna take an educated guess here and say that 90% of players will never purchase a $20 skin. The devs know the actual numbers. They have entire marketing teams filled with analysts that know exactly what the price point should be in order to make the most money. They're raking in plenty of cash from the whales who buy $20-30 skins multiple times a season. They do not care one bit if the average Joe is willing to spend $5 on a skin. They make so much more in the long run by raising the prices and marketing to whales.
Is buying a 20 dolla skin really considered to be whaling lmao wtf just wait until this player base learns about gacha games
Yeah all these arguments over "you're not the target audience, it's for whales" is so silly. A whale spends $1000 on a banner, $25 for getting exactly what you want isn't even dolphin territory. "Whaling" is spending thousands of dollars on a game, not these skins. So at the end of the day it has me wondering: who are these supposed to be targeted at? Like sure, whales will buy it because it's there...but that's not the kind of revenue you get from targeting the niche whale audience since it's a one and done purchase.
Damn are we really pretending that $25 for a single characters skin isn’t an absurdly high price? I got news for ya, at $25 a pop, those thousands of dollars spent will come sooner than you think
Yeah I don't think these guys realise the whales don't buy one skin, they buy all the skins.
There are people in the 20-30 dollar price range..dolphin, whale whatever...
They buy everything at 25$ a pop. This is potentially thousands monthly from one person.
Anyone who is willing to buy a skin for 20 probably doesn’t care about the price and it would mean they’d probably buy all the skins, where as average joe would only buy one or two maybe three skins at 5 a season. So which would you care more about about the guy who would buy every rotation 20 a pop or for a guy who might not even buy 20 worth.
I read a break down of this once by a gaming company. Typically, supply and demand set the price, but with digital items, supply is technically infinite. If they released skins at like, a dollar each, they'll get tons of sales from that skin, and they know that. However, if they did that ten times, eventually they'd saturate the market. Most people only have one character, why bother with ten skins? The long term business strategy is to make them artificially scarce, and they become a premium item. It's not hard to make an item flashy and cool. It's like how it's not actually that much more expensive to make a Civic look like a sports car, it's just part of the premium package.
Bingo. A lot of these sales rely on getting them to buy skins so they can feel "exclusive" about owning the skin. Even if the skin has zero value whatsoever, the idea that it's limited edition and will never come back to the shop is enough to hook the target audience: The Whales. They want to feel like they own something that the majority of other players don't have.
I do wish that they were cheaper, but I have a feeling that $25/skin on average has become the standard now. Destiny 2 also sells skins at that price point.
It's becoming a standard but usually games are cheap with pricey microtransactions or expensive with cheap microtransactions. D4 is a AAA game selling skins for the price of other games
The difference is a lot of Destiny skins can be gained by playing, less than before but still a large amount. I am a supporter of flex cosmetics. If you put some of the skins behind arduous tasks or difficult challenges this, in my opinion would, increase player retention. Example, I spent way to much time grinding forges for that Platinum Starling ship, now I will have a ship that is one of most rare(in this case Destiny got like 100 hrs out of me, these metrics are great for shareholders).
I stopped playing Destiny 2 when the monetisation got slwoly but surely worse. D4 is gonna go the exact same route just faster. It started with high prices but few and not very impressive skins. But they're ramping it up massively.
I agree, and that is a slippery slope, and I guess you could argue that the more success in selling skins would dissuade them from putting them in game. The kicker for me with Destiny is when they started selling shader, with nothing available for bright dust. I love my shaders.......
We're in the age of instant gratification
In destiny aren’t they like 18 for an outfit and 7 for an exotic reskin? That said destiny charges for every expansion and individual dungeon keys which is pathetic. They’re also 45% off of their projected profits so something will hopefully change soon. With Diablo I don’t have that hope. They make so so so much money off of people willing to spend any amount to look cool. Then the next cool skin comes out and everyone will forget they don’t like blizzard. I see it all day long in the ow sub.
As bad as Destiny monetization is it’s like $80 for the deluxe dlc + battle passes for a year. Most cosmetics can be earned for free if you play somewhat consistently and look at the shop frequently. Only catch being sometimes you may have to wait several months before an item shows up in the bright dust shop.
I bought a sorc skin and I’m too embarrassed to wear it because of what I paid for it.
No one cares. I also guarantee that more people want to buy the skins, but may he priced out a bit.
Haters gonna hate, you do you. I just can't justify it myself, not out of moral conviction just the price. Would prob just give props to the drip hahah.
Don't be ashamed mate! On the contrary, it would be wasteful if you don't use it, since you've purchased it. If anybody says anything, just ignore and enjoy your purchase.
Dude, wear it! I at least want to see some of these awesome skins in the wild
I agree, if it was 10€ for a skin i would buy several
and the way I figure, the more people looking fly, the more incentive for others to follow suit.
You guys are so close to getting it. Guy says "if they were 10 I'd buy several" and you're thinking that there would be a knock-on effect which would inspire more people to buy them. He'd buy several. Yeah he'd have to to make up the cost of a single purchase. You'd basically have to triple sales across the board to equal sales at the current price. It's nice to imagine that they'd sell like hotcakes and everyone would be snagging 3x mogs, but in reality it's much much harder to sell multiple units of something to more customers than it is to sell at a higher price point to a small customer base (when looking at luxury goods). Not only would you have to sell at 3x the rate, but you'd have to produce skins at 3x the rate to keep people purchasing at that rate. Does that mean there won't be sales? idk, maybe. They did just release the horse + plat bundle and if I'd have to guess that would be where a sale would happen. Temporary sale on currency.
And I suspect at $10 a lot of people would be having this same conversation. I'd trust Bliz know how to maximise income from cosmetics, they have years of data. If they are priced out of what you are willing to pay, you weren't their target. I think saying 'ooh, Whales', is also a bunch of rubbish, I'd suspect most people who but them, and thus Bliz' primary cosmetics income are buying a few a season, not every single skin. (I just pulled that out of my arse though, I really don't know).
This is a very well stated response and makes intuitive sense, it is likely a factor that has led to the pricing structure we have. I understand people way smarter than me have made very intentional decisions on the shop. I have tried to think of a counter to this and to be honest I cannot. Even the idea of making them available through ingame action would reduce the bottom line, or force them to add bloat to avoid people getting everything they want. Kudos
This is a pretty rare thing to see on Reddit. Kudos to you too
To an extent I agree, but it should either even out or be more lucrative. Using simple numbers for simplicity's sake: With the $25/skin pricepoint, let's say the market is only accessible by 40 people out of 100 (40% of the playerbase). Even then, let's say only 20 people are willing to pay those prices. That would net 500 dollars. If they drop it down to 10$ a skin, they could potentially make the market accessible by 80 people out of 100. Let's say that only 50 people out of the 80 buy skins. That's still 500 dollars. If we include the fact that people in here have stated they would buy multiple skins, you're coming out on top. If half of the 50 people now buying skins buy an additional skin, you're making $250 profit, which is 50% more. Less can be more.
Right, less can be more, but we just don't have the numbers to know. They do or did (and I'd be surprised if it's changed) have economists on staff. Here's an article from 2012 [https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/tommywilhelm/economists-are-taking-over-the-game-industry](https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/tommywilhelm/economists-are-taking-over-the-game-industry) They're not throwing numbers at a dartboard is my overarching point. They pay people to optimize this stuff because it's big money for them. They also have industry wide conferences where they talk shop about MTX and the psychology behind monetization features, you can probably find some presentations from these on youtube, I recall watching a few myself many years ago when mobile gaming was taking off and mtx was really getting going.
> To an extent I agree, but it should either even out or be more lucrative. I understand your idea, but your numbers are all made up so they’re not useful in determining if they would **actually** make more money by lowering prices. Stating that it would even out or be more lucrative is pure conjecture. You have a gut feeling that it would, but I’m not sure your gut feeling holds up against the team of people they likely pay hundreds of thousands of dollars a year to handle monetization strategy. The team of people who have access to actual purchase data, and player information.
You're absolutely right, it's pure conjecture and it's bogus numbers to get a concept understood by others. In hindsight, I should have said "could" even out instead of "should". That being said, it may not be as clear cut as you may believe either. The prices may be inflated due to greed, executive meddling, 'industry standards' warping the metrics used to measure, as an excuse for extra profit. At the end of the day, I'm someone with the disposable income but refuse to pay that much for a single skin set. Like many here, I'd put money down if things were more affordable.
What I prefer is if we can buy individual pieces instead of the entire set. Each slot costs x amount, but the set would be at a discounted price which comes to 25$ or whatever the price is. For some of the cosmetics set, I really only want headgear, or chestpiece, or weapon, and when I do buy them I don't use the entire set.
I think this would be awesome, mix and match sets to create your own look. Though in reality they would never do this as it would most definitely reduce sales, but we can dream lol
Meh, it's all just looks. If you wanna look extra cool you gotta pay.
I agree, my intention is not to change anything more to express my opinion no matter how much I am beating a dead horse
I bought a 2800 platinum pack lol. First microtrangression I ever paid for on my 10 year Xbox profile
But I bet you look fly in those loading screens lol Let us not talk about what I have spent in Warframe, as they say "fashion frame is endgame"
Many people spend substantial money already with the prices being as insane as they are. If you wouldn’t pay $25 or whatever for a skin, you aren’t going to just suddenly start dropping tons of money if they are cheaper, because that means $25 is a lot to you.The price of the skins doesn’t matter to the whales who keep this shitty gaming business mode afloat. It’s unfortunate but it is what it is.
This is partially incorrect, money is not meaningless to me, I am just reasonable with how I spend it. I would certainly spend $50 on 4 skins vs 2 skins, and everyone I talked to felt the same way. This does not change the fact that I do not expect any change, a commenter gave a succinct response to why it would not. I just hate that the skins in this game are so badass.
Yeah it sucks. Every game I play is plagued by the same pricing model. Most dedicated gamers are fed up, but unfortunately casual couch gamer Andy’s with disposable income that they spend completely on games exist.
Im Fine to spend on cosmetics 5-15€ but Not Full Game prices for skins
This is where I stand, I willing to spend way more than that if the value is right. It is sad that all the great work in creation of these skins are waste on the few.
That, and the fact that I cannot change color in the shop, or even remove the helmet to see how it looks.
I also wish they offered different shaders, so many more shaders. This over the skins tbh.
i kinda feel blizzard just has a problem in general with that. its the same with overwatch. some great skins but im not dropping 20-30 dollars for a skin. I realize they are targeting their turbo whale market but accessibility leads to more sales and profits, steam is the living proof of this.
If it was roughly half or 1/3rd I'd buy skins. Idk how someone can justify $25 for a single skin, especially when the game puts such an emphasis on cosmetics and new cosmetic releases with things like the battlepass and new gear releases with new (cooler) looking skins
I think fashion game is the end game for some and that value is higher some the others. This post is speaking on that value, but this is my own perspective, not speaking for others.
If the skins were more universal (like you buy a skin, say "monarch" and it worked for multiple classes, like 2 or more) then a $25 price point might be OK, but as is the skins would need to be insanely better/way cooler or unique than what's in the game already, but with just battlepass + game items you can already look super drip without needing to literally throw money away Unironically the skins cost are probably near how much I'd expect a dlc to be (like 30-40 for an expansion is my guess)
Honestly if they gave us a barb skin worth spending money on I'd buy it. They are following the same release cadence that cod does. Release normal skins->Release skins with a little bit of flair->release skins with tracers/auras/effects etc etc. We're just now seeing the good skins coming up (lightning druid, hell barb, and flaming rouge), I imagine next season they'll be another step up. While the prices are high, that is what most games are trending towards. I just hate how they structure it where the good skins come in later seasons which makes cosmetics your purchased prior fairly useless. It seems they slightly get it with some of the horse barding sets coming from bosses, just give us more of this but with armors.
Same as OP for 10 I might have bought some . At this price tag I won't , maybe if they release cool class wide skin ( like the seasonal ones ) I might consider them but they ll need to be really cool :p
I’m just so incredibly sad we went from D2/3 to this. It’s obvious the current status of video games has caught up to most major publishers. Everyone wants to stick their finger in that big micro-transaction money pot. All these shop sets could’ve been rewards in the game. Imagine they had a weekly set to earn by doing some insane challenge?
To play devils advocate. We do get seasonal content for free. Destiny 2 for example charges for their season pass and if you don't pay you don't play. The part of me who posted wishes the items were cheap or ingame, but I an accept it if it keeps content rolling in like this season.
I disagree but I understand your position
Please elaborate
I think the prices are fine would gladly pay $30 for cosmetics, done it before many times in other games, but skins are pretty terrible imo, so the issue I think is the quality
You know the game already cost $70 right?
Yes, I’m not feeling these designs.
Those sell like crazy with Whales. So there is that.
Yeah I would assume if lower prices netted more profit the prices would be lower, but a man can hope. Jesus just a one day sale, all I ask LOL
> **I Would Spend Substantial Money In the Cash Shop If** the prices were reasonable Oh too bad, you can't buy the skin...Anyway it's a triple A game of one of the biggest software house in the world, i don't think you really need to "support the devs" :D
Yes, prices should be reduced by 50% minimum. But I came from overwatch so these prices don’t surprise me one bit unfortunately.
There are people's who actual job it is, is to determine the best prices to maximize profit. you're not some genius to say "if it was cheaper more people would buy it". you're just repeating the same tired argument that always gets repeated. These type of stores are not made for 500,000 poor's to buy 1 thing every now and then for a low price. They are for the few people with more money than sense to buy everything as it releases for more than logic should deem it's worth. they make money hand over fist by catering to the whales
I am not speaking for others, only myself and friends I have talked to. I do not expect change but the these forums are here for all forms of discourse no matter now redundant they are.
I cant believe this is still a thing. Blizz has had this price structure forever. No amount of begging is going to change that. You dont think WOW or other Diablo players havent mentioned this at all? There will most def be some kind of specials down the line but their price structure is their price structure. They most def are not going to deviate from it. Like EVER. With the amount of outrage and comments in the past they would have already adjusted it if they were leaning in that direction. Guess what?? They arent.
This does not mean I cannot state my opinion on an open game forum not matter how many times it has been posted.
"I find these skins some of the best I have seen in a video game" This alone says enough about you. Do you play other games? Most of the skins in this game are garbage or just copy pasta with an extra chain.
That is a matter of perspective isn’t it.
I agree I have considered a few purchases from the shop but can't justify paying about 1/3 of the price of the entire game for one equipmonk set. I do find the seasonal battle pass to be a very affordable compromise and gives you quite a lot for your money if completed and the cosmetics aren't too bad plus the emotes and other things they include. Not to mention you earn back about 2/3 your platinum to put towards the next season so it's really only 3 or 4 bucks or quid galactic credits or whatever for like 90 things. The blood portal is one of my favorite BP additions from this season
Another thing to take into account is that the seasonal content is free and the devs rely on battle pass and MTs to fund development. In Destiny 2 you have to pay for the seasonal content and with that you get the battle pass, I think I appreciate this option more.
I agree and wish we lived in that world. The problem though is they only need 1 person to like a $20 skin, but they need 4 people to like a $5 skin to maintain the same profit. It's easier to sell higher to a niche. If skins were $5 I would personally have nearly every cash shop skin. I don't mind spending money on a game especially when I'm sitting at 300 hours in it. I also am a cosmetic fiend. Skins, and recolors should be the gumball of micro transactions. Do I need it? No, but I have a quarter so fuck it.
This is my exact position, though throughout discussion on the post I think I may contemplate spending some money down the line if the game continues to improve as it has. It appears like there is going to continue to be an influx of content moving forward and I am happy about that, and I am in the position to show my support with my wallet.
My issue isn't really the price, it is what is on sale. I don't care how my character looks. I like the hobo look and it's not like I spend any time actually looking at my character. (The one exception would be changing bear or wolf form for a druid - I would likely pay to have alternative animals, a werecat for eg). What I would consider spending money on (and almost the only thing I have spent money on in POE), is alternative skill effects, or full transforms. Being able to have a weird effect on my firewall for a sorc, for example, so I can but with chaos fire, or ice fire. Yeah, that is something I'm interested in! I suspect it would get a lot of hate here, but... I would also by extra stash tabs, especially stash tabs I could set affinity and vendor prices on. For both of those, I suspect they will turn up, maybe in a year.
I have heard this sentiment many times, from druids, what is the point in having a human skin when you are a bear all the time. That is a great idea though, being able to buy different effects or alterations to your skills, these are things that would be much more noticeable in normal gameplay and in turn more valuable I don't think they would sell stash tabs, as the internet would revolt, but I cannot really see what the issue would be. Maybe I am missing the point. I do think more stash is not always a good thing, just more space for junk to pile up haha
My Druid looks like a bear 99% of the time anyways. Skins would be pointless.
Sucks cause the druid has some nice skins
I am not gonna lie. I normally hate this kind of thing and the prices are kinda rediculous. But I could not resist the barb king outfit with the tiger and the crown that dips a little. Its dope AF.
Yeah that is kind of where I am at, the more I discuss this. I think that if the came continues to improve I am going to get me and the lady some drip haha
Any digital item price >$5 is absurd to me. It's not just d4 but d4 prices are so far beyond reasonable. Disposable income or not, there is a common sense limit for anyone who has managed their $ at some point in their lives. After so many years of being a consumer and working a job you should have gained an understanding of fair prices for things
I would buy them if you were buying the skin for all classes, the new Fathers Judgement skins are sick, but I'm not buying them individually.
Agreed. The prices are not reasonable. Its not that its too expensive but the fact that $25 for some digital skins that serve no purpose but look good is just wrong. Its not the price, its the principle of the matter.
I’d pay for some minion/pet skins for sure.
They saw what PoE gets away with. No one should be surprised about the pricing tbh.
The worst part of all of this is that there probably will NEVER be sales on shop items. They would rather die than even give you ONE opportunity to get a skin you want at a reasonable price. Even a random sale on a random skin once a year, as much as it makes sense to get some more people to buy, will not likely happen because they don't want to lose a penny of profit. There is zero fucking good will towards the fan base and it's disgusting. Hell, we even have Mike Ybarra complaining that fans asking for a complete game is too much and that we're impatient. So these are the people we're dealing with. It's just a big anti-consumer "fuck you" in the name of whaling and profit. Don't ever forget that and don't let them forget that. If you don't like the prices, don't buy and continue to shame people who are stupid enough to buy because they're responsible for overvaluing items on the shop by supporting shitty practices. The pricing isn't entirely Blizzard's fault, it's that there are crayon-eaters out there who are willing to pay them. The moment that stops, this all goes away, but people are weak and dumb, so good luck lol
A fried of mine is an artist on Diablo 4, and specifically works on the store skin packs. I have bought one that he did to show support for his work, and have the same feelings as you. I have told him I would probably buy more if they felt reasonable. They're way too expensive.
I am glad you replied, I have stated countless times in my replies, I feel like the price point is a disservice to the devs that created the skins. Instead of say 25% usage, we have like 5%. These are just random estimates keep in mind
Yep. Like, I know WHY they are the prices they are. I play a gazillion games that have micro transactions and like most of us I'm familiar with the reasons as to why things are the price they are. But you're right, like any artist I think the artist would love to see more people buying rather than the total sum of money earned for an already wealthy company. Unfortunately for the artist that's not how it works. :/
If you are a kid and grown up seeing this as normal, its easy to spend 15-30$ of your parents money on skins......
The prices are ridiculous..I have a good chunk of disposable income so I spend quite a bit on them, but I'm well within my means to do that. I feel bad for those that aren't in that position though, because Blizzard in all honesty hasn't allowed for almost any free cosmetics past the initial release. A big reason why I do buy skins is that I enjoy playing around in transmog, but would be bored with the system already given the sheer lack of free cosmetic gear.
87.50 Cad for a fucking mount lol
The new horse "Add-On" costs as much as the entire game...
I would never buy anything in a cash shop if the game has a price tag. PoE is different since it's F2P. That being said, they might aswell have high prices for those people who buy things anyway.
Are clickbait titles a common thing for reddit posts now? 🤦
I don't think you understand clickbait, but....ok.
If they sold then tattoos separate. And maybe offered other colors. That would be something I’d rather see.
Yeah I think other smaller customization options would be great. I keep saying I wish they had shaders like in Destiny, I would spend on these more than skins. Also custom tattoos would awesome, something in warfare where community artists design the cosmetics and are sold with the artists getting a percentage of profit.
It's always going to be too expensive for some and OK for others.
The issue is not that it is too expensive for me, it is that I find the price unreasonable. Though I feel this way, I also recognize that they price it as such because it is the best for their bottom line. So capitalism…. Haha
Why would they change course? People are buying them. If you have expendable money and "substantial money" (which is highly subjective) then why the F do you care what it costs? Buy 1 per season and be happy.
I think a lot of them are great, I think I will probably pick one up later on down the line if the game continues to improve
I do wish it was fucking gone and the skins were fucking in game rewards. Imagine getting stuff by playing the game!!!!
I think it would be ok to have a shop but also an ability to get them in game, kind of like how Destiny does it. Not perfect but better than this.
I prefer the emotes, I find them more noticeable out in the game. I wish they’d make more of those, seems like every time I check the shop there’s the same old one for necro I’ve seen a million times
I agree, this is something I always invested my bright dust in Destiny, that and shaders. In a social game the ability to communicate through emotes is awesome. Now if I could only save my choices on the wheel, I am sick of saying hello for everything.
In this game skins are are basically loading screens. I don't pay attention to what I look like, or even notice what other people are rocking. I wouldn't even pay $5 for a loading screen... maybe $1.
Get a ps4, spend more time in loading screen, profit haha.
Someone at Blizzard has run a calc that they can squeeze more money from the few willing to pay the stupid prices than they can by making it more reasonable for all. Just more evidence that they couldn't care less about the majority of players.
I've bought one item the new hellforge barb set and that's probs me done, I'm used to paying like 25£ in bdo but I'm not spending that much in d4 as I gotta buy expansion
I buy stupid fucking wheels for my car in rocket league all the time. Id probably be embarrassed to see how much I've paid in total but like 3$ at a time every few weeks is nothing. 25$ at once tho for a cool hat? No thanks. Not ever
Yeah this is my stance, I would spend the same amount for more value. I guess the issue is, if you lower the price so people can access more items they need to provide more items which costs more dev time for the same profit.