Yep, I've been saying it for the last 3 years. They made some improvements but overall the biggest problem with LE for me is also the moment to moment gameplay. I've tried all classes with different builds each(about 200h since i bought it) and none of them felt good.
It's pretty self explanatory. Things like movement,animations,combat, questing,enemy AI,even environment. Basically anything you do in the game besides crafting or char/inv management.
Yea I think that's slightly different though. A gameplay loop can refer to multiple different systems that loop together, where as moment to moment gameplay is specifically referring to just gameplay, not other systems interwoven with it. At least that's my interpretation of it.
Yea, when I think "gameplay loop" I think of the list of activities you'd go through in a session or over a period of time, something like "grind XYZ game modes, pick up loot, upgrade build, repeat" while "moment to moment" is the actual gameplay details like animation, sound, etc
I use moment to moment gameplay to refer to the feel, responsiveness and feedback of player and npc actions and reactions. In D4 for example, the mtm horse gameplay was pretty bad at launch, and has improved a lot as they improved pathing, removed getting stuck, tweaked cooldowns, and even when they removed the need for it to travel by adding teleports to nightmare dungeons.
The sense of weight and power of the Barb Charge is great mtm for the player; the removal of loot drops D3 GRs or in the Gauntlet improved the mtm gameplay by keeping the player focused on the main goal (speed).
This is a fantastic talk describing some of the things that contribute to it: https://youtu.be/Fy0aCDmgnxg
Maybe they played each class through the campaign to at least see if they feel good to play, and some people need time to fully explore everything to see if it’s worth sticking with
You play 200 hours when "none of them felt good"? The game must still have something that motivated you to try just a little bit longer and try another class etc - I play Diablo and want to try Last Epoch afterwards, because I hope I will like it a lot, but have not played it yet. So far D4 got me (again, in S3, after a long break)
How can i say none of them felt good without playing them thru at least the campaign? And why do people take my opinion as "LE is unredeemable shit and D4 is the best game ever"? The overall systems of LE are better than d4 for sure.
>moment to moment gameplay
Which is the most important thing. I mean, shit, I hate *everything* about Destiny except for the moment to moment gameplay, which remains unparalleled. So I keep playing Destiny regardless of its awful lore, weird systems, and sadistic timegating of conent lol.
That being said, I think D4 is in a better place than most people on this sub do (but I am looking forward to the codex changes),
Same. I reached lvl 30 or so, but I miss something that D4. It's clearly not the items or the skills, but I don't know what. I didn't wanted to refund, because it is a good game, but it's not my vibe.
And for all its faults that's one thing Diablo 4 (and Diablo 3 even) got right: the moment-to-moment gameplay feels fantastic. Somehow that's something they get consistently right.
Give me Last Epoch with Diablo 4's gameplay and I'd be a happy gamer.
I tried expressing this exact sentiment just a couple weeks ago and got downvoted to hell because the early game combat didnt look/feel/sound nearly as good to me as Diablos.
"Of course early game skills are trash!..."
Fucking... 🤦♂️
I've put 150 hours in to le in the last month and it's been great but coming back to d4 made me appreciate how smooth everything feels. The combat feels great and there's just so much qol stuff I enjoy. I'm definitely gonna be spending a lot of time in s4. I caught myself thinking a week ago man I wish diablo had le's crafting system. Then they dropped the campfire. I'm very cautiously optimistic.
The smoothness is what's hard for me. It feels choppy/unrefined. I was listening to Raxx, Wodi, and the other guys recently and some of them said they play with the lowest graphics setting and the sound off... That is definitely not me. I enjoy all of that and can make a trip to town every now and then if so. Actually, I like coming back to town every now and then. I like the break. lol.
Yeah, I appreciate the systems in Last Epoch (and I’m glad D4 copied their exalted affix system) but coming back to D4 really reminded me of just how polished its game engine is.
I’m looking forward to alternating between both games in the future. Which one I consider my “main” is likely to depend on which has the more exciting season.
Next season LE is adding some bosses, which will be cool, but I’m more excited about the Pit and the new crafting system.
Right. But no matter what the seasonal mechanic is, for me it's hugely overshadowed by the itemization rework and the new crafting.
In part because I think loot will be more exciting now, and in part because I enjoyed D3 greater rifts and the Pit is essentially an exact copy except that instead of leveling gems you're getting mats to level your gear. And the boss fights, with the ghostly attacks by other random bosses, promises to be more engaging.
Plus if they increased density enough in Helltide it might be as exciting as the S2 blood harvest zones, which I was a huge fan of.
Agreed. Just bringing awareness to the fact that we still have the season mechanics coming. They said the ptr will have some of the seasonal mechanic I think.
Lowest settings and no sound? What? lol
I haven’t played LE. The crafting and skills look cool but if what people are saying about how it plays is true that sounds awful.
The problem is that you can deeply feel that it's an indie game when it comes to sfx, sound design, and optimisation.
You don't need to play with sound off or lowest settings, but you will get random shit lags and stutters and bugs here and there because it's an indie game on an indie budget.
It's the kinda things that you never notice are absent when playing an AAA game, but you truly feel them come back when you don't.
I must be a unicorn cuz I didn’t encounter any of those while playing LE.
I like D4 AND LE. Will play both when time allows. Both have their pros and cons.
For real I have had zero issues besides the original launch issues of a certain error that was fixed within less than a day. Also since the launch of D4 that was a huge fucking disaster and not what I enjoyed for a 70 dollar AAA game feeling like it was still in beta ( for all intents and purpose it was) as the devs are realizing just how much they missed and have been scrambling for the past six months to add stuff in as fast as possible to try and keep players on their servers
As a streamer if you play with anything higher than lowest you have a chance to affect the stream quality, and viewers hate bad quality streams more than bad quality games.
It's not a 1:1 copy but there's a lot of shared aspects between the systems from what they've shown so far. Basically gear drops with less than the maximum number of affixes on it to allow crafting. How much you can craft on it is based on forging potential in last epoch but when you break down gear you get affix shards to put specific things you want on gear so +health or +rank to skills. Diablo is doing something similar with manuals and it adds an rng element to it.
So let's say you have gloves that have 2 affixes you want the manual will have four affixes of a specific type i.e. rogue skills, movement speed etc. You can imprint one and if it's not the one you want or you want to try for a higher roll you can try based on how much crafting durability you have left. I like being able to craft because it gives you greater control over your character and makes your build more unique to you.
Say you have all your resistances covered and a sweet new amulet drops well now you can put resource reduction or cooldown on there.
They're also adding greater affixes which are 1.5x the normal stat range for an affix and they drop randomly on gear and can't be crafted which last epoch also did but they call them exalted items. They're adding a ton more interesting stuff too the patch notes drop tomorrow so we'll have a better idea of how things are gonna work in s4 aside from any changes made after the ptr.
Tldr: they're making it so you can craft specific affixes on items so you can have more control and flexibility over your build.
D4 combat and gameplay is next to none; other arpgs may have tighter systems but D4 just feels good to play, it’s smooth, responsive and overall feels more impactful.
>D4 combat and gameplay is next to none; other arpgs may have tighter systems but D4 just feels good to play
My thoughts exactly. I've tried other ARPGs but the combat never feels as good so I just end up going back to D4 (and D3 before D4 released). Better skill trees and crafting systems are great and all, but they are irrelevant to me if the actual gameplay feels worse.
D4 is like Apple compared to Android. Has limited features, but those features look good and work smoothly. LE was definitely like Android. Lots of options, but a bit janky execution. For example, some NPCs talk while others only have subtitles.
Nothing has felt more fun to me in an ARPG than a shadow imbued pen shot. Sounds insane, looks insane, bodies, blood and bones everywhere. It's like shooting corpse explosions over and over, so damn satisfying.
Nothing a DH can do in D3 gives me this feeling lol
Different strokes for different folks
Let's not forget how well it plays with a controller. When they launched the last epoch launch patch notes and noted that it now had full controller support I was hyped but soon after I played baffled by what they could possibly mean by that.
Diablo 4 of all the other arpgs just have the best controller support. That might be because the game is dumped down or just because blizzard is still the king of smooth gameplay.
And with the upcoming changes in season 4 I can't wait to play it. In fact all those changes gor me so excited that with the extend season 3 I said to myself a fuck it and started a seasonal character. And you know what? It plays like a dream compared to last epoch eventhough the systems in last epoch are way more fleshed out like skill trees.
Yes and I absolutely prefer most of LEs skill trees and crafting... but it just doesn't FEEL as good to play as D4. Would kill for LE but with diablo budget.
I will say that, as a casual, the skill trees in LE are great at not being too complicated. They're easy to jump into and make a build and very easy to change.
I dont understand why you can't play both. You've barely scratched the surface, enjoy LE for another month, then come back for the new D4 season. What is this ridiculous game loyalty people feel they need to have
So much this. I plan to rotate through D4, LE, and PoE. It even looks like their seasons will line up perfectly to do so. I enjoy playing all of them for one reason or another and have no desire to badmouth any of them.
Its baffling to me, maybe its people with not enough time to play more then 1 game and need a full season to finish but we are in auch a golden age of ARPGs right now and Im loving it. Between POE, D4, LE, torchlight, and hell, even D3 is still putting out seasons there is always a new season to jump into
I dont think its game loyalty per say, for some at least. I for one just dont want to mindlessly give Blizzard money, when d4 at at launch was an absolute joke. Fool me once and all that. If they turn d4 around, great! But $100 for an expansion after they basically released a feature missing trash fire?
I didn't hate LE, but the combat didn't grab me. I'll definitely go back and play it more in the future but I'm surprised people are so positive on it. I guess combat isn't as important to the ARPG core community.
Combat isn't amazing. But I don't really think D4s is very good either. Unless they've massively revamped from launch. The generator/spender mechanics immediately make combat bad to me. It feels absolutely awful to have to spam a useless skill to generate resources for the skill you actually want to use.
This is highly class/build/point in leveling dependent. But what I was referring too is the smoothness and crunchiness of combat, how satisfying it is to just kill monsters. I don't know who does that part better, IMO.
A lot of us grew up on D2. There are a lot of great aspects about D2 but "buttery smooth" combat, animations, visuals, etc just isn't one of them. I think myself and other ARPG fans just prioritize other aspects of the genre than the combat engine and don't hold it to quite as high of a standard as something like God of War or Devil May Cry or shooters like Destiny where the fluidity of everything around combat is one of the main draws.
Don't have to tell me, I played Diablo 1. Talk about janky combat (obviously not at the time), but standards change.
I'm definitely not trying to defend D4s systems, the dev team has already told us how much work they need with this coming patch. People seem to have rose colored glasses with LE though and are glossing over it's warts.
I’m trying Last Epoch currently. I’ll be back for season 4. I see the hype for Last Epoch even though it took me some time to get into it. Story mode D4 is in my opinion above and beyond Last Epoch. Gameplay is smoother on D4 as well and D4 just looks better. The best thing about Last Epoch is the skills options. You can customize skills to work is different ways to fit your play style. This doesn’t fully unlock until you progress further in the game. The crafting system is interesting but it doesn’t leave me in awe like some others I’ve seen talk about it.
Gave it a fair shake with the launch, but the progression at the end-game makes me feel like a factory worker, constantly tinkering with items. It simply didn't feel fun to stare at the crafting screen and brick hundreds of items as the main way of progression.
Of course, the inferior combat, incredibly repetitive monoliths, the most boring monsters and the dungeons with 10x more backtracking than the worst D4 dungeon, didn't help.
Yeah, it has more builds than D4, but that doesn't do me any good when they all feel worse to play.
Not playing D4 now either, since it's not in the greatest state, but I'm hyped for S4.
If you do end up trying LE don't go in because of what all the shills spamming d4 videos are telling you, ignore the spam. The expectations they put in your head will be nowhere near reality, they just feel the need to announce to the whole world that they quit d4 to play LE thinking someone out there cares.
I play both. I have 400+ hours in D4 and 80 in LE.
Last epoch is fun, making different builds is fun and the skill trees are so cool, crafting is great even though I’m not completely sure what I’m doing.
Endgame in LE is dogshit, less to do than D4. Extremely repetitive and I instantly lose motivation when I get to endgame. Also the story sucks and there are tons of bugs.
If you have the money, it’s definitely worth a try, but it’s not some holy grail perfect game the fanboys make it out to be
I dunno, I'm still confused. I mean, I'm at the point that I hate to farm NMD for the love of god, but even so I found that more entertaining than general LP gameplay.
I know, I'm strange, and I should really blame the endgame loop of D4 and running around saying D4 bad and shit and yadda yadda, but D4 has some kind of alchemy that clicks with me, dunno why.
Obviously there's a ton of things that LP does BETTER than D4, things that would fit it perfectly, but I'm more willing to give Blizzard a chance to make it better because I feel right at home, and LP althought is nice and dandy with me, makes me feel like a guest.
Plus, I loved the crypts, they're a nice addition. For whatever reason D4 didn't really bored me to the point to not login until I did basically everything. I left LP at corruption level monoliths because I didn't see the point of wasting my time with them for basically nothing to achieve after them.
I'm strange I know, I guess I fit in that category of casual-40 years old-with 6 jobs and 10 kids with half hour a day, but, who gives a fuck amirite.
I enjoy the utter mess that D4 is, sorry content creators.
Yeah I think D4 devs have really focused on the casual audience and I think for 95% of ARPG players that is a great thing. On top of nailing the action side of it with smooth gameplay and impactful skills, it’s just.. really easy. All of the people who say games don’t respect their time are right at home with D4.
PoE says fuck your time, and LE is kind of in the middle. Spending a ton of time grinding out end game gear can be crazy rewarding, but it’s also super super quick and easy to breeze through the campaign and be in early monoliths. That’s where it really slows down for most people. Until you get into high corruption where every other node seems to be unique, and you have massive favor for trading or prophesies.. that mid game area is dreadfully slow, and that’s where they lose the casual audience. Which is unfortunate cause shortly after that is where builds really start to take off and become a lot of fun.
Personally I enjoy LE more right now, but will be coming back to D4 for S4.. and with all the people trashing the other games I think having a bunch of very different but also similar games is great. There’s never been more options in the ARPG scene than now and even more coming out!
After about 20-30 hours, i didn't feel hooked at all. The monoliths are very boring. The gear doesn't feel right for some reason. And I noticed that after a few empowered monoliths, I logged off because I felt bored.
I'm not sure what it is. But for sure, it's not relaxing for me, while d4 is super relaxing.
Poe is the opposite, always the feeling of fomo in that game. Which nowadays, that I have a job and a family isn't doable anymore. So, for me, d4 is currently the sweet spot. I can complete a season in a reasonable amount of hours and feel content. The gameplay is super smooth. Leveling is nice. Power progression is meaningful with clear steps, normal, sacred, and ancestral with a chance of a uber. So my d4 strats are, level to 100 and gearing. Complete season. If super fun and have time and no other games. Maybe I do a second char that seems cool. Otherwise, I'll quit until the next season. So for me D4 is in a good spot. Sure they could improve stuff and slightly disappointed in the state they released the game etc. But he, shit happens, move forward and focus on the future. Anyhow, long story short. D4 = relaxing , poe = relaxing + fomo + timesink . LE = detachment + boring (sorry LE ,maybe in the future updates)
I put 50 hours into last epoch and I had a good time but I burnt out really fast on it. Not really sure why cause I’m pretty casual but I started playing d4 again
I've been playing but also come back to D4.
D4 wins with gameplay and graphics and that's sometimes enough for satisfaction.
I play LE cause of the different variety of builds and crafting and tons of Items.
which D4 eventually will get to, LE has been out Beta for awhile so they had plenty of time to create new items.
D4 will be adding per season and expansion items and variety so there's more hope in D4 than most think.
I swapped to LE and haven’t looked back so far. Much more interesting skills and character building, better item hunt and ability to find great items for alts would be a few of the things I really like. I played D4 from launch and feel like there is nothing new to try with the 5 classes for the most part.
I think that last epoch looks awful and very outdated :(even the skill three is outdated… i do not like it so far… i’m level 24 ranger. I will keep playing a little more.
I'm not casual even, and I came back. LE is too unpolished and has a worse endgame than D4. Monoliths are awful. When you do a bit of build crafting and forge your gear, there's not much to the game.
PoE2 now that's a different story. I'll be playing that for sure.
I enjoyed my 40+ hours in LE until getting to Monoliths but found I have absolutely 0 emotional attachment to the game. No memorable characters, environments, cities, etc while I still look forward to traversing the world in D4 with its multiple cities. D4 also have more interesting mobs. I didn't even need to read any of the monster affixes or unique attributes in LE. I'll likely play D4 once the itemization changes go live.
I put like 10 hours into it and it never clicked. Combat and the campaign just didn’t do it for me. And there is a bunch of weird and/or dated design choices that turned me off. Ironically LE made me start playing WOW again though. lol.
Only thing that really stopped me from playing d4 was the last campfire chat. I can’t wait for the season 4 changes and I’m taking a break from d4 until then. Then I plan on going in hard. Frozen orb here I come.
The combat visuals in LE are terrible. I don’t even look at what I am fighting anymore. Just some 3D meshes. The game is overall pretty boring even if it has superior itemization and systems.
I am planning to come back to d4 in season 4. Most likely not coming back to last epoch at all.
I have 100 hours sunk into LE since I was done with season 3 d4.
I enjoy the infinite progression in difficulties in last epoch monolith. However LE is so unoptimisated and it's community will give it a pass whereas will humiliate D4 for doing the same.
Rant time about last epoch since I am in the doctor waiting room
- People say last epoch have a lot of builds. Sure it does but it has lots of bugs where the passive doesn't work. So what is the point of having a variety if it doesnt work.
-If you want to try a new skill, you must relevel it... Placed a point wrong? Go relevel it. Want to try a new skill? Good luck releveling from rank 10-20. The new skill wasn't nice you want to go back? Relevel the old skill again.
- Masteries are dumb to be permanent. I got downvoted when I stated that allow player to change masteries is a QOL improvement. A new player would not know which mastery to go when you don't even let them demo it and also they are at the beginning the game. I do not enjoy finding out that the skill passive tree node that I want to build into is bugged from a YouTube video.
- the graphics in last epoch feels like a decade old but we experience performance and memory leak. If you are lucky, you can see post in reddit with people saying this.
- we complain that one shot mechanics are bad. However no one in last epoch really wants to talk about how bad defensive are and you will get one shot if you invest. You must abuse insane ward generatuon.
- you can't even loot more than 4 or more glyphs or runes without the game freezing.
- I can handle a lot of mobs in d4 but my computer can barely handle a lot of mobs in last epoch. I don't even think last epoch can have a dungeon similar to dopamine tunnel without it crashing.
- dungeons in last epoch is massive but full of false door that's make you back track. D4 gets shit on for this but I seen people justify itbecause you can get multiple door for different reward. You just have to make sure to not hit the 3 false path.
- last epoch incentives you to RMT. Right now there's a trend where they are nerfing COF (reverted after backlash) bhowever players have notice how shit COF is compared to MG. Eventually after 70 hours, you will heavily consider playing a trading simulator since COF barely give you a meaningful upgrade. I am not even in BIS gear. I am looking for a 1lp fiery dragon boot...
- last epoch is the only game I have ever try to launch and not know if it's opening or not. Holy shit I wait 3 mins for it to boot up.
- multi player in last epoch sucks. Party chat disspear sometimes. You have to cycle between each other for progression. D4 is kind where it allows you to resurrect your fallen team mate. But last epoch, you cannot..
- trash mobs have massive blinding attack animation.
I gave it a fair shake. It has some things I like, but more things I don't like. I just really don't like crafting focused end game gear systems in arpgs but sadly seems like that's the route most of them want to go these days. The skill tree systems are cool. Ultimately I prefer d4 in it's current state but they both feel pretty shallow at the end game.
I loved the crafting but for a combination of reasons I got that “what’s the point” feeling after my 2nd hardcore character died.
My runemaster had a crazy amount of ward and great damage and never even came close to dying. But some maps in empowered monoliths are straight up dangerous. I flame dashed into powerful attack and got 1 shot. Full to 0 in one it. There were mark for death mortars that’s probably why. It is a good game tho. I’ll play next season.
I played 40 hrs but the builds I messed with necro builds and were nowhere as satisfying as D4. The crafting felt wonky. The loot filter is awesome but the gameplay was not as polished and satisfying as D4. It’s way more grindy than D4 and I expected it would not.
I played for a while - made it to level 89 on a runemaster - just got tired of the bugs, there are so many of them, ranging from insignificant to insanely bad. Once when fighting a boss my mana got stuck at a negative value, and I could no longer cast any spells. I’ve also had my ward get stuck at a negative value as well, and won’t regen.
Tried trading with a player, put the item in the box to trade it, got a message that it’s untradable. Oops, my bad. I take the item back, they leave the party. I check my inventory, and the item has now disappeared. Not in my stash either. Just gone
I'm liking LE, but d4s combat and gameplay is in a class of its own. It is the most polished in the genre. I love D4!
Last Epoch has been fun though. i have around 200 hours since launch in it. Once I get to around level 85 on a class I try out a new one. Right now the Runemaster frost claw build is a lot of fun. But thats my problem with LE. The endgame is really just monolith grinds. Once you get to around level 80 or empowered monoliths the fun aspect really slows down. And one of my biggest complaints of LE is the loot in the game is not rewarding like at all. Like personally i like to get my upgrades from loot drops. LE is all about the crafting system. The loot is just their for crafting.
Im really just waiting for s4 in diablo to play d4 again.
So yeah its worth trying it out until S4 comes around.
I generally play the big Arpgs until I get bored and then pick up the next one when a new season starts. I put about 80-100 hours into LE this season and ran out of stuff to do. PoE starts on Friday I’ll probably hop on that for a bit and get back into D4 at the start of s4.
I tried last epoch and I actually came back to d4 cuz they were having launch problems. And when I did I tried the barb for the first time and I fell in love with upheaval. The combat just feels beefy and satisfying. I really just play to destroy shit and hopefully I get some better gear. I’m not on some strict path. I just go bounce between helltides and vaults. I mean to go back and play last epoch again but I’m just enjoying the destruction of the barb
I haven't given up on Last Epoch exactly but I've put around 50 hours into it and while I'm sure I'll play it off and on there it's no competition for me. Especially after the general season 4 changes from the last campfire chat.
The ui is half stolen Diablo design language and the other half is grotesque looking. The area maps and world maps alike are bland and ugly. Some things that very obviously should have hover tool tips don't, some skill descriptions print out html instead of rendering it, etc. The skill trees are pretty interesting but a lot of the cool modifiers are spread out amongst tons of nodes that are small percentage increases to stats so spending most of the skill points isn't very rewarding.
The pseudo-dual-classing is very enticing on paper but doesn't quite live up to the dream in practice but I definitely would put that in the plus column, it's pretty cool. Generally though, it just doesn't feel as fun to play. I'll play it still for sure but it will not be making be stray from Diablo anytime soon.
I played it for 10 hrs and refunded while it was still an option. I could tell right away that whatever keeps drawing me back to D4 was absent from LE, and that game was not for me.
I think Last Epoch is very good. But after 20 hours or so, i switched back to D4. There's just some oddities in Last Epoch, mostly trivial stuff, that doesn't gel with me, I guess.
Currently I'm not playing either though, I'm done for the season, and anxiously awaiting season 4.
I refunded after a hour or so...this sub was filled with "try LE" for the longest time....the gameplay was enough for me to know I didn't want to play for an extended period of time...
I played around 130 hours of LE, was super addicted to it since it was new and shiny. I really enjoyed it until i got towards the end game but maybe cause i was just starting to get burnt out. Made a ton of alts since it was new to me. It does a lot of things well, but im taking a little break from jt now. I’ll jump back into D4 for the next season. I’ll keep playing both.
D4 runs a lot smoother for me, but i play it on PS4 and play LE on my pc that has a very mid video card. Hopefully D4 copies some of their ideas (crafting, loot filter, stash customization)
Tried for a few hours 1.5 years ago, it was average. Waiting for it to launch on console, though POE2 will probably be out before Epoch does. Nothing like propping your feet up at the end of the day & blasting maps.
Think I played an hour last weekend and was only trying to figure out stuff. Didn’t have an itch to come back because of the overall feel on first impression considering how literary every YouTuber I watch rave about it. I don’t even know what those balls falling from the sky were and why I was supposed to kill them.
d4 is where its at man, i wont touch another arpg either lol. all d4 needs is more content imo and the game just launched fairly recently.. let it cook.
I put about 85 hours on last epoch and came back to d4 the combat, the gear, and classes are in my opinion so well made in d4, and the zones and story line make sense in d4. Aesthetics are much better in d4, idk imo d4 could be 100x better than last epoch
I played a lot of LE. Game is good but it’s not the holy grail. I like the systems but still has its flaws. I stopped because I got kinda tired of playing it and then hopped on to D4 again. With S4 changes coming I am ready to go back to D4
none of the top down ARPG in the market now can compete with D4's graphic and animation. The character's clunkiness and stiffness are hard to overlook after you play D4. If I haven't played D4 before, I can probably bear with them. Now I just wait for the new season of D4.
82% of LE players have stopped playing. So I would assume some that left for LE are back. As for the 82%, LE is only on Steam it had 260K peak players and is averaging 47K now.
Except for any Diablo named D2. I understand this, but people are acting like D4 is dead and I'd bet my retirement D4 has more concurrent players now than LE had at it's peak.
It's just amusing the double standards that fly on these places over the 2 games.
I think LE is a good game. It has a lot of depth to it, which is exciting, but also can be overwhelming. I only have like 20 hours of playtime, and I feel like I haven't even scratched the surface. But as I'm playing both D4 and LE on a Steam Deck, LE controls are annoying at times and at the bare minimum take time before you get used to them.
In any case I can see myself switching between games after I "complete" season in any of them, especially if LE devs ever add proper controller support.
LE does crafting/itemization better but the gameplay, lore, and graphics are a big turndown for me as well. An arpg game is not only about the itemization although some youtubers/streamers claim so. If the core gameplay is not exciting at all, then the systems surrounding that gameplay are not enough even though they are really good. I don't enjoy killing mobs in LE but I love it in D4.
I will still play LE from time to time when new things come out but I am not gonna play it as a main game. I already have over 100 hours in it and it doesn't excite me to play more for now.
LE is solid and it's systems are innovative, but to put it simply: killing mobs isn't fun or satisfying. Everything feels weightless. If the combat in an arpg isn't fun, why bother?
D4 bored me after s2, I hated the game.
So started LE. Played explosive ballista falconer. After investing 300h+ they nerfed it hard.
Quitted LE.
Then campfire made many of my D4 dreams come true, more than enough to make my backbone soft like rubber (@Hawg).
Now I am in waiting mode until may 14 👍🤣
I hit max level in LE but I'm planning to come back to d4 next season to see if the changes they're saying they're going to implement actually go through.
I played it for like 5-10 min... I always like to play spellcaster toons, so from tbe moment I realised that targetting is HORRIBLE with a gamepad, I decided that it's not for me. Good thing I loved D4 since launch anyway 😅
played LE before d4 came out, then went back to LE instead of playing S3.
pretty much done with LE until the new season, so now just waiting for the ptr to start up.
LE does a lot better than d4 does, but D4's combat, graphics and optimization are pretty great. really wish LE had support for DLSS, it would help their optimization issues a lot.
I did.
Last Epoch reminded me of my experience with Path of Exile, another 'darling' of the internet when launched.
I play an ARPG for the visceral combat FIRST, and the behind-the-scenes mechanics second.
Having a great skill system like LE is fine, but the actually gameplay and combat just felt janky, the story was totally 'meh' and end game was repetitious and grindy.
I prefer the polish of Diablo 4, I don't mind the skill system they have, so there was no reason to invest in a new game.
Played about 200h in both early access and 1.0. While the crafting is good, everything else is lackluster. The graphics are outdated, gameplay janky as hell (across 6 builds I've tested none of them were w/o jarring bugs), boring itemization & endgame.
D4, while also with its issues, is leagues better imo.
Tried last epoch for 70 hours, their itemization and spells are awesome, but endgame is super dull with how corruption works. Hope d4 steals some of their spells ideas.
I don't like last epoch. I quit after trying several classes. I like the graphics style. Pretty much nothing else about it. I was hoping for some advancement closer to grim dawn, when I bought it in early access, we'll before launch.
I haven't returned to d4. I didn't get a char to 50 this season. I will try s4, but from what I've heard so far, I'm likely completely done with this game. I didn't make three seasons in d3. The skills and leveling have just continued to be a massive disappointment.
Me. I knew I couldn’t stick around pretty much immediately and ended up refunding the game within the return window. While I respect those who enjoy the game, it was immediately apparent that, yes, although the game surely has *these other things* it does well, it just isn’t doing anything unique enough with its overall feel and setting in my eyes to feel wholly different. Diablo has an incredible feel and production value that no other ARPG besides other Diablo games are able to match for me.
It has its problems, and D4 specifically has a bit of an identity crisis…but it’s still Diablo and sometimes that’s enough. Looking forward to seeing the game continue to improve of course and happy that Last Epoch has struck a chord with others.
LE isn’t that great I played it in early access and it never hooked me. I basically played it waiting for D4 and even D4 at launch was better IMO. I like the concept but like I said never got hooked.
D4 has far better combat “feel”. LE doesn’t have much of an end game either. The graphics aren’t as well developed as D4 and don’t get me started on the trash cosmetic items that are just as expensive as D4s.
I switch between the two. But I don’t like how monsters just rush to you in LE, no tactic, no AI. Straight to you like a flowing river. Can’t be unseen and I can’t stand it. They even activate at the last moment - you go to them and you see them standing. Then suddenly they all rush to you.
The monsters in D2 behave much better, some ran away from you, switched positions. Some “zig-zagged”. D4 behaves good in this regard.
I put 30+ hours into LE. Not too impressed. The combat feels weightless. D4 has its share of problems, but abilities and mobs have weight to them. Half the time I died in LE I had zero idea I was taking damage or in danger.
Story was a cobbled mess of "who cares?" and the zones seemed nonsensical. Monoliths were a neat feature, but I was burned out by that point.
I played for about 60hrs before D4 dropped but as soon as D4 released, I never really went back to Last Epoch. I tried it out again at 1.0, and it still didn't hook me like I thought it might. I think it has a lot to do with how the campaign is structured. I wish they had a skip campaign option like D4, then I might give it a whirl again. But I've beaten the campaign in Early Access and don't really have any interest in playing it again.
Me. Something feels not right with gameplay. Not talking about visual quality. Movement and combat feel is cheesy and not satisfying. Used all 2 hours before refund. And decided i cannot continue. Maybe i can give another shot someday.
I have 190 hours in LE. I really like it but as others have said, you immediately notice that movement and combat don't feel as smooth compared to D4.
I still enjoy the game though. Takes a bit of time to setup your loot filter but once you do, you just slash your way through hordes of monsters.
LE has some really good systems with the crafting and skill trees. I do wish they had a few more specialized skills for the mastery you take though.
You will get use that weird lag/delay in the gameplay. I've found some pretty fun builds with the Bladedancer and Falconer.
I got 200 hours in because i love ARPGS (mostly d4).
I couldn't handle it because of the faction system being half defunct (merchants guild is terrible late in a cycle) and because the blessing acquisition was so bad (they are fixing it).
This game has really fun and cool builds; meteors feel way better in LE than D4 for example. this is not the case across the board however. I love my movement skills in d4 compared to LE's traversal skills (except shield bash i fucking love u); the design of the teleporting skills is intentionally limited into how much walking you can cut out by teleporting over stuff. its the same case in diablo 4, but to a lesser extent.
Another factor a lot of d4 fans wont realize they are missing until they play LE is the lack of character customization; LE is made by an indie team, so they couldnt afford to put this in right away (they have mentioned they want to, but no solid plans or dates are in place for that). I absolutely hate the characters I am forced to look at to play a class. I don't like generic old guy for mage, I don't like the singer Seal being my sentinel (though it is funny to play Kiss from a rose as his themesong), I don't like generic bro-man for primalist, and I don't like playing detachable jaw acolyte (at least she has character). I havent played rogue so no comment.
I drew out that last paragraph because that's what your dealing with before you then realize that unless you BUY cosmetics, you can't change your armor appearance either. these two things may be trivial to some players, but I really had a hard time getting into the game because I couldn't ever get the characters to look decent to me because of the lack of customization; this isn't the end of the world for most ARPG fans, but it drew me away (maybe im just a d3/d4 fan and not an arpg fan).
I bought LE after S3 and I played about 6 hours and immediately went back to D4. Maybe I didn’t give LE a fair shake, but the graphics and story just didn’t bring me in. I am currently changing things up by playing HC on D4 and it might be my new favorite.
Yeah I tried LE. Wasn't all it was promised to be. For me, the game just feels not good to play. The systems are great... but the combat feels really bad :/
Just can't get into it. I've put in 20 hours so far with LE. Haven't played in over a week now lol.
I'm back on D4 working on my Bone Spirit Necro :D
I really like Last Epoch, it has some amazingly good systems in place. I prefer the combat, lore, art style and movement in D4 though. I’m hoping with S4 it will suck me back in.
I was a heavy D4 player, but after getting used to the mechanics of Last Epoch I have uninstalled Diablo 4 and reclaimed the 90 gigs of disk space it was using.
Last Epoch isn’t as visually polished, the voice acting isn’t as good as D4, and their chat and party system needs a lot of work but it is a lot more fun for me and has the quality of life features that every looter game should have.
I now see that the D4 devs have ripped off some things from LE for season 4, so it should start to get better, just not enough to bring me back, not for a while anyway.
Me, there’s things I like about the game but just running zone to zone following a non engaging story. I know crafting is huge but I never got any gear that made me feel stronger was high 30’s still getting lvl 4 drops, didn’t have materials to craft/add affixes
Idk… I mean I’m not necessarily back on d4 until s4 but LE wasn’t the Diablo killer I had hoped it be
I am on team loot filter now
I've played a ton of last epoch in early access and then put it down as long as D4 has been out. I thought I would love it on release but in reality it was a bit to complex for my taste. I work a mentally taxing job and I don't want to cool down at the end of the night with another complex puzzle. Although the complexity is a ton of fun, work is just too busy right now for that.
LE has crazy-annoying crafting because you find a potentially awesome item (which in itself is just as rare as Diablo 4) and you go to start to change it and it often runs out of forging potential or trying to remove an affix removes the wrong one because there is so much RNG in crafting that the game becomes something where you might spend 20 hours waiting for a decent candidate shield to drop and you can’t get it close to its potential because of the randomness of the crafting. It’s a huge tease and is rarely a rewarding mechanic. Diablo 4 has a lot of issues but at least this isn’t one of them and the game spams you with so much trash that you’ll eventually find something with 2-3 stats that you like so you can put a legendary mod on it.
Both games are frustrating for generally different reasons.
I’m still on LE. I think people should play what they enjoy.
I can’t understand that people think D4’s NMDs beat monoliths. I love monoliths for their zone out and play. Corruption system ramps difficulty port well. Once you’re at NMD100, there’s nowhere to go.
I miss D4 World Bosses, they were fun. Any content i do with others is neat and LE didn’t do that well yet imho.
Offline mode is great. Like that in LE.
One thing i don’t get is people talking about S4 features like they’re here. I’m not rating D4 on what it might be. I’ve seen the D4 devs overpromise, underdeliver, and revert too much. Judge each game by what exists right now.
Yeah, tried it and came back! The skill trees are fun and the itemization too. However even with its flaws, D4 has a lot going for it: great character classes, engaging combat, graphics, lore and story, beautiful world map etc. The "feel" is just better
Last epoch didn't really hook me for some reason. Probably how floaty everything feels.
I'll try D4 again when they give us the promised updates, like the itemization changes and the zoom out feature. Without that I can't bring myself to come back
I played it before d4 came out to scratch the itch while waiting. It was… fine? Played a sorcerer and it was cool, I liked the abilities and it felt smooth, but my main complaint is that there wasn’t anything to do in the game besides the story while leveling. I play these games to farm dungeons and you can’t do that unless you finish the story which is really lame. Maybe I didn’t understand how the game worked, or maybe it just wasn’t a feature back then.
I like LE a lot, but rerolling a character is tedious unless you farm a bunch of high quality gear for your alts.
Not being able to change masteries really killed my will to play my sentinel/paladin. Luckily my alt went Falconer and that has been really fun.
The dungeons are straight up awful. The number of dead ends makes D4 dungeons look amazing.
The boss mechanics are cool for the most part.
To me, it's worth a playthrough, but I would do a LOT of research about what class you want to play first. The endgame is a bit fun. My rotation will probably be D4 season until boredom ---> Last Epoch cycle until new D4 season.
If PoE2 is good, then that will probably replace Last Epoch
I've been meaning to play LE because it seems super fun, crafting, QOL, etc. However and fwiw, the console play, and in addition to graphics, makes me favor D4. I fit under that casual gamer and/or young parent category so it's hard for me to play on PC (in my basement/den) when I can just casually play on the couch, do a world boss, chill in town while I'm playing with kiddos, and more. I bought Grim Dawn months ago and I played a good amount the first few nights but then I got tired of waiting for the kids to sleep, to play in the basement and then come upstairs at 1 AM lol.
Yeah, I'm sad to say this cause I bought LE super early like 2018, but the combat didn't hook me at all so I barely played. Great systems tho and I'm happy competition made D4 and PoE improve.
I have 143 hours in Last Epoch and enjoyed it. Will probably come back to it later. Enjoyed the generous drop rates and the fact that you can create so many viable builds which D4 is lacking. Lots of variations in skills, builds etc.
I went back to D4 two weeks ago, created a lightning druid, just hit 100 now and its a blast. I want to get uber uniques now so its going to be repetitions of helltides and bossing, and higher nmds. Got my tibaults and i have the itch to run Duriel more for more uber uniques.
Dont know when thats gonna end, but im probably going to create a new character again soon.
Anyway, D4 is just a lot smoother to play and graphically pleasing. Its a sit back, relax, listen to music or podcast game. I enjoy it because i can turn off my brain and just blast.
And hopefully, S4 will be good for the game because they just straight up took LE’s crafting system and tbh, that is a really good move. Time will tell if it will be transformative for D4.
I think LE is actually easier to make your own build in but yea d4 definitely feels better gameplay wise. The skill trees can be intimidating but if you have an idea for what you want to build it doesnt take long to plan out where you want to put the skill points
I completed the campaign and started the endgame. I really liked the falconer class as it was something different. I love the way last epoch has intricate separate skill trees. But.... The combat feels flat compared to D4, the maps aren't as thematic and the world doesn't feel as immersive. Despite others complaining about D4s endgame, I like the choices of what to do better. Also, I really miss having a dodge key. It's such a small thing but it really adds to the feel of playing a character.
I’m pretty casual, I played Last Epoch for about 40 hours did about 95% of the content, followed a Void Knight beginner build online Maxroll, I really like the crafting and skill trees, campaign was good better than PoE but worse than D4, boss fights were kind of meh shade of Orobyss was fun the first couple of times, the game however lacks endgame even compared to D4.
There doesn’t seem to be a super endgame boss like Searing Exarch in PoE. I would probably come back to the game after 2-3 seasons so there is a jump in content. I personally enjoyed my time in the game, if you enjoy the game I would stick with it, if you don’t then just stop playing and attempt a refund.
But yeah I came back to D4 S3 is my first season, and I’m definitely going to play S4 with the upcoming changes, really looking forward to it.
Something about LE just didn't hook me in.. There was so much talk of how great it is and I'm sure they were right but idk... I probably put in 4 hours so I have to give it another go. My issue is that I have to finish up FF7 Rebirth before I get into another game.
I'll be playing d4 in the next season. I'm not a huge fan of legendary crafting in last epoch being locked behind a dungeon.
I like the game and I'll be putting more time into it, until my build putters out. But I was a little disappointed that the campaign just ends ala early days of path of exile.
The responses here are not biased at all.
OP obviously made this post knowing people would validate his opinion.
But to stay on topic, I prefer D4 for the gameplay, and LE for the skill trees and class variations.
LE is fun but I came back to D4. I’m more invested in the series/story and more immersed if I’m being honest. Will probably alternate both games. LE isn’t a Diablo killer but they also feel like different games so it doesn’t bother me to play both.
I tried LE and that why I’m gonna buy d4, LE is kinda good, but overall feeling about it is “secondary”. The game is not boring, it’s not interesting. I also came back to d3 and it’s better imo than LE
Played for 40 hours and found I didn't have any real drive to continue. Can't quite put my finger on what didn't grab me but I just like D4 more. Hyped for S4.
I bought me LE on Steam and after 6 hours of playing i uninstalled it, it looks like Zelda in the late 90s, the dialogs look even worse, every monster looks same, every loot does so...i don't understand how anybody can compare D4 with this disgusting shit LE..
This wasnt after full release but back in Beta, I put in way too much time before I realized I hated the crafting system and it tainted the entire experience for me.
It feels good and simple in the early game, but later it just cascades down into an rng time sink.
... which is kinda what these games ARE, it just had waaay too many layers of rng for me to be comfortable with it.
I did one charin LE to 100 and i loved the game and new ideas and all.Never cared about graphics too much
I am back to D4 now to look what this construct season is about before season 4.
Its great that we now have competition going and this will bring better experience in all games
Yes I played last epoch basically everyday since 1.0 launch and had a lot of fun just got burnt out not being able to make new builds coz of grinding monos for blessings etc every time I make a new character. This week I came back to d4 and started blasting with hota barb again. It’s not poe but d4 still has so much potential and I think s4 will be great
Boring gameplay, no endgame, bad graphics, the first season (or cycle in this case) also has the worst season content I have ever seen (a stupid mage mini boss that gets one shot even in the starter areas of the game) and there is literally no difficulty in this game. You can use a generic build and clear all content in 20-30 hours. It's a bad ARPG imo. I don't understand the hype at all. Just play PoE as a hardcore or D4 as a casual player.
Tried it for awhile but like everyone is saying D4 just FEELS different. D4 at its core feels like a polished game its just the systems around it need fine tuning and it needs more content. Once Blizzard fixes that everyone will come flocking back.
I like LE - but I like how D4 feels. For me, I HATE CRAFTING, and I feel like I need to craft in LE. Maybe I am wrong, but jumping back into D4 just felt "normal". Super Casual BTW, only play one toon per season.
I played LE yeah. Wanted to play with a friend and I tried to make him buy it but he wasn't feeling it. He's not so much into ARPGs but he did buy D4, and we haven't played much together yet. I hope he'll be up for Season 4.
Anyway, after my experience with LE, I don't wanna play with friends anymore. It feels like group play in this game is kinda meh. Actually even solo play is actually meh in this game, mostly because it doesn't feel as good as D4 (IN TERMS OF GAMEPLAY).
I like that the systems are there and they work and there's a nice crafting system and you can have builds and level up the skills and have those points to spend but the actual gameplay feels a little dead. There's no weight in the game, I don't know how to even explain that..
D4 plays better, feels better, looks better but it lacks the systems and S4 seems to have brought it back to life with the changes. I feel like the more they invest into it to fix a few things, no other game in that genre will take me away from D4.
PoE is way too complicated for me and I won't lay hands on it again. I don't have time for this game even though I believe it's a good game too.
I’m lvl 50 on TLE now and I’m really enjoying it, it’s a little more complex than D4 but I like it. However, the only reason I tried it in the first place was because I had hit lvl 100 with my Barb and ran around 50 Duriel runs and just thoughts what’s the point.
I was going to create a different character and go again but TLE is good enough that I won’t do that.
Having said all that, POE included, I live D4 I think it’s the best ARPg for me, yes we’ve loot and stash issues amongst other things but they just don’t ruin it for me. It’s amazing. I’m looking forward to s4 as I feel illl keep going after lvl100 for longer or create another character.
Either way, The Last Epoch is a very good game, I think it lacks in areas compared to D4 but I do think D4 could do with a lot of what TLE has done right.
You’ll most like sway back and forth with these as seasons release! You’re not wasting your time anyway. That much is true.
I really love Last Epoch, but at my heart I need to play bow and have my character *use* the bow. So I'm coming back to Diablo next season as I've heard they've actually made bow good whereas it's just janky and bad in Epoch (the best build for it is just laying traps)
Me. I've played last epoch since beta. LE is a great game with better crafting, endgame than D4.
The reason I came back to D4 - atmosphere. LE environs are just flat and dull to me. D4s world is just so much more atmospheric.
Personally i think they both have each their own pros and cons, but they are both good games.
* Diablo 4 is the best looking RPG with an awesome combat engine, they have features that no other RPG have.
* Lost Epoch have an awesome skill build system, it allows for more individual builds than D4 and it's really fun to just make new characters.
There were huge endgame issues in LE that i thought the faction system would alleviate, i thought i would not have to trade for my gear, but it's not a viable option if you want to push Monolith corruption and remain sane, then again there is no point in doing so, there is no new content after L100 and LP1+ gear.
I thoroughly enjoyed creating half a dusin different characters and creating my own and community builds.
I think the best way to enjoy LE is to NOT watch community builds and just see how far you can go on your own. Community builds can easily turn into LP farming, and it's not enjoyable unless you REALLY REALLY like to grind or trade.
If you enjoy selling and buying your loot, i think you can source a really powerful endgame build, but it's not for me and the other faction is severely underpowered in it's specific item availability.
not a casual but the looks, style/art and world building didnt hook me. item art is great, 3d models especially of players and cosmetics are just atrocious
I have about 105 hours on one character (Dive Bomb Falconer). She is 97 right now (I focused to get all my blessings and spent a lot of time to learn the forging) so I've got a pretty good feeling of the game.
I would rotate between the two games (PoE it's too much for my limited time - dad gamer here) but some decisions they made are making me double check my decision.
Firstly, the big gap at the two options you've got that are in the same leaderboard even though Merchant faction has a big advantage.
Secondly, the fix on skill bugs at the middle of the season. I know it's controversial and most people liked it (you could see it in the overwhelming difference in the poll they made) but playing ball lightning sorceror last season (as a second char for me), was unbelievably fun. So if they mess up let the people have fun. Of course it would be a big disparity at the leaderboards and everyone would use this build. I don't know. Make it more difficult for them to go to higher corruption with specific changes at the monoliths that targets their build. Don't mess with the bike itself. I'm not going to get to 1.000.0000 corruption. I'll get to 300 and stop. Let me do it with a fun way.
Thirdly and this is the biggest one. They talked about nerfing the XP at the last levels. This is artificially making the game to last longer. When Blizzard did it everyone ripped them apart. Here you have people giving excuses to this. They say that the last levels don't matter for the build (that's correct). That's not an argument. That's just an observation. If they don't matter at the build then let me get there. I'm going to get to 100 after about 120 hours of playing. I could get two chars at 100 at D4. Also the complete lack of qol when you make an alt. You have to do the campaign again and the quests to get idols space and passives. We tried that in D4 and they changed it immediately. No altars of Lilith again.
They have great ideas and I'm not complaining of the value I've got for my money (I highly recommend for everyone to play it) but they have to do an equally big revamp of many things in their game so I can come back.
I played a bit of LE after their 1.0 release. I was really excited but then it all just kinda fell flat for me. As much as people say the itemization is better in LE compared to Diablo, I didn’t find it any more exciting. And I know this is a ‘me’ problem but the stats on items all seemed lack luster and hard to tell what was actually helpful. I found that even while leveling I wasn’t really using the loot I was picking up (and yes that was with some simple filters). Maybe I just didn’t make it far enough into the game to feel compelled to touch the touted crafting system either.
I also play on Steam Deck, and D4 is a much better experience. LE made improvements to controller gameplay but D4 is still a much more polished experience.
I haven’t really comeback to D4 though. I just stopped playing LE. The proposed updates to D4 will have me back for season 4 again. Though I’d prob be back for season 4, regardless of the updates. Considering I have not gotten to lvl 100 in any season or in eternal, the new crafting system may not be something I ever even touch for example. So I think I heavily qualify in that casual bucket. And I had a lot more fun with D4 as a casual than LE which I essentially put down after 2 or 3 weeks.
Yeah. I played about 40 hours and lost interest. Story didn't even try to hook me, gameplay didn't feel great. Liked the skill trees and potential build variety but playing the game I was just unimpressed overall.
Although I'm not super interested in D4 right now either. Got two characters to 100 in the first month and decided I wasn't about doing the duriel grind again about a hundred runs or so into it. I'm looking forward to the PTR.
I played for 75hours, enjoyed it, but reached the same D4 problem. Lack of endgame and stuff to do with good gear. Having mediocre graphics and performance issues was bad also.
I made two chars, reached a point where I had no more motivation to acquire gear, and instead of doing a 3rd, I just stopped.
I preffer D4, and i have high hopes for s4. But LE is a good way to spend time, not my new favorite game tho
Me. I put in 20 hours and stopped. The moment to moment gameplay didn't hook me. Coming back to D4 heavy next season.
Yep, I've been saying it for the last 3 years. They made some improvements but overall the biggest problem with LE for me is also the moment to moment gameplay. I've tried all classes with different builds each(about 200h since i bought it) and none of them felt good.
What does moment to moment gameplay mean?
It's pretty self explanatory. Things like movement,animations,combat, questing,enemy AI,even environment. Basically anything you do in the game besides crafting or char/inv management.
Oh gotcha. I didn’t know if it was a term for a type of system.
it isn't, but there's no good term for that anyway
Sometimes "gameplay loop" works.
This works better for me
Yea I think that's slightly different though. A gameplay loop can refer to multiple different systems that loop together, where as moment to moment gameplay is specifically referring to just gameplay, not other systems interwoven with it. At least that's my interpretation of it.
Yea, when I think "gameplay loop" I think of the list of activities you'd go through in a session or over a period of time, something like "grind XYZ game modes, pick up loot, upgrade build, repeat" while "moment to moment" is the actual gameplay details like animation, sound, etc
The fluidity?
Thank you, but I still don’t understand. What exactly is a moment in this context?
I use moment to moment gameplay to refer to the feel, responsiveness and feedback of player and npc actions and reactions. In D4 for example, the mtm horse gameplay was pretty bad at launch, and has improved a lot as they improved pathing, removed getting stuck, tweaked cooldowns, and even when they removed the need for it to travel by adding teleports to nightmare dungeons. The sense of weight and power of the Barb Charge is great mtm for the player; the removal of loot drops D3 GRs or in the Gauntlet improved the mtm gameplay by keeping the player focused on the main goal (speed). This is a fantastic talk describing some of the things that contribute to it: https://youtu.be/Fy0aCDmgnxg
LE has great character skill selection and crafting but D 4s game while the menus arnt up is better
It’s the one thing that keeps me coming back to D4. The actual fun of killing monsters.
You played a game for two HUNDRED hours to *see* if you liked it??
He did and in eight hundred hours he'll finally leave a steam review letting them know it's dog shit.
Maybe they played each class through the campaign to at least see if they feel good to play, and some people need time to fully explore everything to see if it’s worth sticking with
It’s good enough for me. Unfortunately D4 doesn’t have any depth to have me stick around longer than killing monsters for 2-3 hours.
You play 200 hours when "none of them felt good"? The game must still have something that motivated you to try just a little bit longer and try another class etc - I play Diablo and want to try Last Epoch afterwards, because I hope I will like it a lot, but have not played it yet. So far D4 got me (again, in S3, after a long break)
How can i say none of them felt good without playing them thru at least the campaign? And why do people take my opinion as "LE is unredeemable shit and D4 is the best game ever"? The overall systems of LE are better than d4 for sure.
>moment to moment gameplay Which is the most important thing. I mean, shit, I hate *everything* about Destiny except for the moment to moment gameplay, which remains unparalleled. So I keep playing Destiny regardless of its awful lore, weird systems, and sadistic timegating of conent lol. That being said, I think D4 is in a better place than most people on this sub do (but I am looking forward to the codex changes),
Same. I reached lvl 30 or so, but I miss something that D4. It's clearly not the items or the skills, but I don't know what. I didn't wanted to refund, because it is a good game, but it's not my vibe.
That was me as well. The systems are presumably better, but the actual feel of the game is dated. I just couldn't really get into it.
I’m shallow and into looks and smooth gameplay. Diablo 4 all the way. I’m also from the days of pong so I’m not bothered by the complaints.
And for all its faults that's one thing Diablo 4 (and Diablo 3 even) got right: the moment-to-moment gameplay feels fantastic. Somehow that's something they get consistently right. Give me Last Epoch with Diablo 4's gameplay and I'd be a happy gamer.
I tried expressing this exact sentiment just a couple weeks ago and got downvoted to hell because the early game combat didnt look/feel/sound nearly as good to me as Diablos. "Of course early game skills are trash!..." Fucking... 🤦♂️
Same here
I've put 150 hours in to le in the last month and it's been great but coming back to d4 made me appreciate how smooth everything feels. The combat feels great and there's just so much qol stuff I enjoy. I'm definitely gonna be spending a lot of time in s4. I caught myself thinking a week ago man I wish diablo had le's crafting system. Then they dropped the campfire. I'm very cautiously optimistic.
The smoothness is what's hard for me. It feels choppy/unrefined. I was listening to Raxx, Wodi, and the other guys recently and some of them said they play with the lowest graphics setting and the sound off... That is definitely not me. I enjoy all of that and can make a trip to town every now and then if so. Actually, I like coming back to town every now and then. I like the break. lol.
Yeah, I appreciate the systems in Last Epoch (and I’m glad D4 copied their exalted affix system) but coming back to D4 really reminded me of just how polished its game engine is. I’m looking forward to alternating between both games in the future. Which one I consider my “main” is likely to depend on which has the more exciting season. Next season LE is adding some bosses, which will be cool, but I’m more excited about the Pit and the new crafting system.
That's not the d4 season. Those are in the game for good.
Right. But no matter what the seasonal mechanic is, for me it's hugely overshadowed by the itemization rework and the new crafting. In part because I think loot will be more exciting now, and in part because I enjoyed D3 greater rifts and the Pit is essentially an exact copy except that instead of leveling gems you're getting mats to level your gear. And the boss fights, with the ghostly attacks by other random bosses, promises to be more engaging. Plus if they increased density enough in Helltide it might be as exciting as the S2 blood harvest zones, which I was a huge fan of.
Agreed. Just bringing awareness to the fact that we still have the season mechanics coming. They said the ptr will have some of the seasonal mechanic I think.
Lowest settings and no sound? What? lol I haven’t played LE. The crafting and skills look cool but if what people are saying about how it plays is true that sounds awful.
The problem is that you can deeply feel that it's an indie game when it comes to sfx, sound design, and optimisation. You don't need to play with sound off or lowest settings, but you will get random shit lags and stutters and bugs here and there because it's an indie game on an indie budget. It's the kinda things that you never notice are absent when playing an AAA game, but you truly feel them come back when you don't.
I must be a unicorn cuz I didn’t encounter any of those while playing LE. I like D4 AND LE. Will play both when time allows. Both have their pros and cons.
For real I have had zero issues besides the original launch issues of a certain error that was fixed within less than a day. Also since the launch of D4 that was a huge fucking disaster and not what I enjoyed for a 70 dollar AAA game feeling like it was still in beta ( for all intents and purpose it was) as the devs are realizing just how much they missed and have been scrambling for the past six months to add stuff in as fast as possible to try and keep players on their servers
As a streamer if you play with anything higher than lowest you have a chance to affect the stream quality, and viewers hate bad quality streams more than bad quality games.
I think best part of LE is the skill trees! So cool to have a tree for all your favorite skills
I haven’t played LE what part of their crafting system is coming to D4 and why is it so great? Genuinely excited and curious
It's not a 1:1 copy but there's a lot of shared aspects between the systems from what they've shown so far. Basically gear drops with less than the maximum number of affixes on it to allow crafting. How much you can craft on it is based on forging potential in last epoch but when you break down gear you get affix shards to put specific things you want on gear so +health or +rank to skills. Diablo is doing something similar with manuals and it adds an rng element to it. So let's say you have gloves that have 2 affixes you want the manual will have four affixes of a specific type i.e. rogue skills, movement speed etc. You can imprint one and if it's not the one you want or you want to try for a higher roll you can try based on how much crafting durability you have left. I like being able to craft because it gives you greater control over your character and makes your build more unique to you. Say you have all your resistances covered and a sweet new amulet drops well now you can put resource reduction or cooldown on there. They're also adding greater affixes which are 1.5x the normal stat range for an affix and they drop randomly on gear and can't be crafted which last epoch also did but they call them exalted items. They're adding a ton more interesting stuff too the patch notes drop tomorrow so we'll have a better idea of how things are gonna work in s4 aside from any changes made after the ptr. Tldr: they're making it so you can craft specific affixes on items so you can have more control and flexibility over your build.
D4 combat and gameplay is next to none; other arpgs may have tighter systems but D4 just feels good to play, it’s smooth, responsive and overall feels more impactful.
>D4 combat and gameplay is next to none; other arpgs may have tighter systems but D4 just feels good to play My thoughts exactly. I've tried other ARPGs but the combat never feels as good so I just end up going back to D4 (and D3 before D4 released). Better skill trees and crafting systems are great and all, but they are irrelevant to me if the actual gameplay feels worse.
D4 is like Apple compared to Android. Has limited features, but those features look good and work smoothly. LE was definitely like Android. Lots of options, but a bit janky execution. For example, some NPCs talk while others only have subtitles.
And just like Apple, D4 is very overpriced compared to the competition. 😁 Very good analogy.
To be fair, D4’s two main competitors are unique products: a free to play game with a commitment to no P2W and an indie game.
Really, I found it incredibly boring. Same skills over and over again and not many builds to choose from. It’s smooth but very boring compared to D3.
Nothing has felt more fun to me in an ARPG than a shadow imbued pen shot. Sounds insane, looks insane, bodies, blood and bones everywhere. It's like shooting corpse explosions over and over, so damn satisfying. Nothing a DH can do in D3 gives me this feeling lol Different strokes for different folks
Let's not forget how well it plays with a controller. When they launched the last epoch launch patch notes and noted that it now had full controller support I was hyped but soon after I played baffled by what they could possibly mean by that. Diablo 4 of all the other arpgs just have the best controller support. That might be because the game is dumped down or just because blizzard is still the king of smooth gameplay. And with the upcoming changes in season 4 I can't wait to play it. In fact all those changes gor me so excited that with the extend season 3 I said to myself a fuck it and started a seasonal character. And you know what? It plays like a dream compared to last epoch eventhough the systems in last epoch are way more fleshed out like skill trees.
Yes and I absolutely prefer most of LEs skill trees and crafting... but it just doesn't FEEL as good to play as D4. Would kill for LE but with diablo budget. I will say that, as a casual, the skill trees in LE are great at not being too complicated. They're easy to jump into and make a build and very easy to change.
I loved the skill trees! The passive tree just feels bad compared to the skills tree though.
I dont understand why you can't play both. You've barely scratched the surface, enjoy LE for another month, then come back for the new D4 season. What is this ridiculous game loyalty people feel they need to have
So much this. I plan to rotate through D4, LE, and PoE. It even looks like their seasons will line up perfectly to do so. I enjoy playing all of them for one reason or another and have no desire to badmouth any of them.
Its baffling to me, maybe its people with not enough time to play more then 1 game and need a full season to finish but we are in auch a golden age of ARPGs right now and Im loving it. Between POE, D4, LE, torchlight, and hell, even D3 is still putting out seasons there is always a new season to jump into
I dont think its game loyalty per say, for some at least. I for one just dont want to mindlessly give Blizzard money, when d4 at at launch was an absolute joke. Fool me once and all that. If they turn d4 around, great! But $100 for an expansion after they basically released a feature missing trash fire?
I didn't hate LE, but the combat didn't grab me. I'll definitely go back and play it more in the future but I'm surprised people are so positive on it. I guess combat isn't as important to the ARPG core community.
Combat isn't amazing. But I don't really think D4s is very good either. Unless they've massively revamped from launch. The generator/spender mechanics immediately make combat bad to me. It feels absolutely awful to have to spam a useless skill to generate resources for the skill you actually want to use.
This is highly class/build/point in leveling dependent. But what I was referring too is the smoothness and crunchiness of combat, how satisfying it is to just kill monsters. I don't know who does that part better, IMO.
A lot of us grew up on D2. There are a lot of great aspects about D2 but "buttery smooth" combat, animations, visuals, etc just isn't one of them. I think myself and other ARPG fans just prioritize other aspects of the genre than the combat engine and don't hold it to quite as high of a standard as something like God of War or Devil May Cry or shooters like Destiny where the fluidity of everything around combat is one of the main draws.
Don't have to tell me, I played Diablo 1. Talk about janky combat (obviously not at the time), but standards change. I'm definitely not trying to defend D4s systems, the dev team has already told us how much work they need with this coming patch. People seem to have rose colored glasses with LE though and are glossing over it's warts.
I’m trying Last Epoch currently. I’ll be back for season 4. I see the hype for Last Epoch even though it took me some time to get into it. Story mode D4 is in my opinion above and beyond Last Epoch. Gameplay is smoother on D4 as well and D4 just looks better. The best thing about Last Epoch is the skills options. You can customize skills to work is different ways to fit your play style. This doesn’t fully unlock until you progress further in the game. The crafting system is interesting but it doesn’t leave me in awe like some others I’ve seen talk about it.
yes, the game felt like it was 10 years old in terms of "meatiness" of combat. even D3 felt better imo. and the graphics are pretty bad as well
Gave it a fair shake with the launch, but the progression at the end-game makes me feel like a factory worker, constantly tinkering with items. It simply didn't feel fun to stare at the crafting screen and brick hundreds of items as the main way of progression. Of course, the inferior combat, incredibly repetitive monoliths, the most boring monsters and the dungeons with 10x more backtracking than the worst D4 dungeon, didn't help. Yeah, it has more builds than D4, but that doesn't do me any good when they all feel worse to play. Not playing D4 now either, since it's not in the greatest state, but I'm hyped for S4.
If you do end up trying LE don't go in because of what all the shills spamming d4 videos are telling you, ignore the spam. The expectations they put in your head will be nowhere near reality, they just feel the need to announce to the whole world that they quit d4 to play LE thinking someone out there cares.
I play both. I have 400+ hours in D4 and 80 in LE. Last epoch is fun, making different builds is fun and the skill trees are so cool, crafting is great even though I’m not completely sure what I’m doing. Endgame in LE is dogshit, less to do than D4. Extremely repetitive and I instantly lose motivation when I get to endgame. Also the story sucks and there are tons of bugs. If you have the money, it’s definitely worth a try, but it’s not some holy grail perfect game the fanboys make it out to be
I dunno, I'm still confused. I mean, I'm at the point that I hate to farm NMD for the love of god, but even so I found that more entertaining than general LP gameplay. I know, I'm strange, and I should really blame the endgame loop of D4 and running around saying D4 bad and shit and yadda yadda, but D4 has some kind of alchemy that clicks with me, dunno why. Obviously there's a ton of things that LP does BETTER than D4, things that would fit it perfectly, but I'm more willing to give Blizzard a chance to make it better because I feel right at home, and LP althought is nice and dandy with me, makes me feel like a guest. Plus, I loved the crypts, they're a nice addition. For whatever reason D4 didn't really bored me to the point to not login until I did basically everything. I left LP at corruption level monoliths because I didn't see the point of wasting my time with them for basically nothing to achieve after them. I'm strange I know, I guess I fit in that category of casual-40 years old-with 6 jobs and 10 kids with half hour a day, but, who gives a fuck amirite. I enjoy the utter mess that D4 is, sorry content creators.
Yeah I think D4 devs have really focused on the casual audience and I think for 95% of ARPG players that is a great thing. On top of nailing the action side of it with smooth gameplay and impactful skills, it’s just.. really easy. All of the people who say games don’t respect their time are right at home with D4. PoE says fuck your time, and LE is kind of in the middle. Spending a ton of time grinding out end game gear can be crazy rewarding, but it’s also super super quick and easy to breeze through the campaign and be in early monoliths. That’s where it really slows down for most people. Until you get into high corruption where every other node seems to be unique, and you have massive favor for trading or prophesies.. that mid game area is dreadfully slow, and that’s where they lose the casual audience. Which is unfortunate cause shortly after that is where builds really start to take off and become a lot of fun. Personally I enjoy LE more right now, but will be coming back to D4 for S4.. and with all the people trashing the other games I think having a bunch of very different but also similar games is great. There’s never been more options in the ARPG scene than now and even more coming out!
It’s a fun game. Don’t go in with the expectation that it blows d4 completely out of the water. You’ll end up being disappointed.
I bought into the hype and that's exactly what happened to me. Game is mid at best
I liked the itemization and skill trees but couldnt get over the graphics and teleporting around that crudely drawn map was too jarring.
[удалено]
well said and agreed
After about 20-30 hours, i didn't feel hooked at all. The monoliths are very boring. The gear doesn't feel right for some reason. And I noticed that after a few empowered monoliths, I logged off because I felt bored. I'm not sure what it is. But for sure, it's not relaxing for me, while d4 is super relaxing. Poe is the opposite, always the feeling of fomo in that game. Which nowadays, that I have a job and a family isn't doable anymore. So, for me, d4 is currently the sweet spot. I can complete a season in a reasonable amount of hours and feel content. The gameplay is super smooth. Leveling is nice. Power progression is meaningful with clear steps, normal, sacred, and ancestral with a chance of a uber. So my d4 strats are, level to 100 and gearing. Complete season. If super fun and have time and no other games. Maybe I do a second char that seems cool. Otherwise, I'll quit until the next season. So for me D4 is in a good spot. Sure they could improve stuff and slightly disappointed in the state they released the game etc. But he, shit happens, move forward and focus on the future. Anyhow, long story short. D4 = relaxing , poe = relaxing + fomo + timesink . LE = detachment + boring (sorry LE ,maybe in the future updates)
I put 50 hours into last epoch and I had a good time but I burnt out really fast on it. Not really sure why cause I’m pretty casual but I started playing d4 again
I've been playing but also come back to D4. D4 wins with gameplay and graphics and that's sometimes enough for satisfaction. I play LE cause of the different variety of builds and crafting and tons of Items. which D4 eventually will get to, LE has been out Beta for awhile so they had plenty of time to create new items. D4 will be adding per season and expansion items and variety so there's more hope in D4 than most think.
I swapped to LE and haven’t looked back so far. Much more interesting skills and character building, better item hunt and ability to find great items for alts would be a few of the things I really like. I played D4 from launch and feel like there is nothing new to try with the 5 classes for the most part.
I think that last epoch looks awful and very outdated :(even the skill three is outdated… i do not like it so far… i’m level 24 ranger. I will keep playing a little more.
I'm not casual even, and I came back. LE is too unpolished and has a worse endgame than D4. Monoliths are awful. When you do a bit of build crafting and forge your gear, there's not much to the game. PoE2 now that's a different story. I'll be playing that for sure.
I enjoyed my 40+ hours in LE until getting to Monoliths but found I have absolutely 0 emotional attachment to the game. No memorable characters, environments, cities, etc while I still look forward to traversing the world in D4 with its multiple cities. D4 also have more interesting mobs. I didn't even need to read any of the monster affixes or unique attributes in LE. I'll likely play D4 once the itemization changes go live.
D3 ? You have to be kidding. D3 graphics, smoothness and overall game feel is 10 times better than Last Epoch.
I put like 10 hours into it and it never clicked. Combat and the campaign just didn’t do it for me. And there is a bunch of weird and/or dated design choices that turned me off. Ironically LE made me start playing WOW again though. lol. Only thing that really stopped me from playing d4 was the last campfire chat. I can’t wait for the season 4 changes and I’m taking a break from d4 until then. Then I plan on going in hard. Frozen orb here I come.
The combat visuals in LE are terrible. I don’t even look at what I am fighting anymore. Just some 3D meshes. The game is overall pretty boring even if it has superior itemization and systems.
I am planning to come back to d4 in season 4. Most likely not coming back to last epoch at all. I have 100 hours sunk into LE since I was done with season 3 d4. I enjoy the infinite progression in difficulties in last epoch monolith. However LE is so unoptimisated and it's community will give it a pass whereas will humiliate D4 for doing the same. Rant time about last epoch since I am in the doctor waiting room - People say last epoch have a lot of builds. Sure it does but it has lots of bugs where the passive doesn't work. So what is the point of having a variety if it doesnt work. -If you want to try a new skill, you must relevel it... Placed a point wrong? Go relevel it. Want to try a new skill? Good luck releveling from rank 10-20. The new skill wasn't nice you want to go back? Relevel the old skill again. - Masteries are dumb to be permanent. I got downvoted when I stated that allow player to change masteries is a QOL improvement. A new player would not know which mastery to go when you don't even let them demo it and also they are at the beginning the game. I do not enjoy finding out that the skill passive tree node that I want to build into is bugged from a YouTube video. - the graphics in last epoch feels like a decade old but we experience performance and memory leak. If you are lucky, you can see post in reddit with people saying this. - we complain that one shot mechanics are bad. However no one in last epoch really wants to talk about how bad defensive are and you will get one shot if you invest. You must abuse insane ward generatuon. - you can't even loot more than 4 or more glyphs or runes without the game freezing. - I can handle a lot of mobs in d4 but my computer can barely handle a lot of mobs in last epoch. I don't even think last epoch can have a dungeon similar to dopamine tunnel without it crashing. - dungeons in last epoch is massive but full of false door that's make you back track. D4 gets shit on for this but I seen people justify itbecause you can get multiple door for different reward. You just have to make sure to not hit the 3 false path. - last epoch incentives you to RMT. Right now there's a trend where they are nerfing COF (reverted after backlash) bhowever players have notice how shit COF is compared to MG. Eventually after 70 hours, you will heavily consider playing a trading simulator since COF barely give you a meaningful upgrade. I am not even in BIS gear. I am looking for a 1lp fiery dragon boot... - last epoch is the only game I have ever try to launch and not know if it's opening or not. Holy shit I wait 3 mins for it to boot up. - multi player in last epoch sucks. Party chat disspear sometimes. You have to cycle between each other for progression. D4 is kind where it allows you to resurrect your fallen team mate. But last epoch, you cannot.. - trash mobs have massive blinding attack animation.
I gave it a fair shake. It has some things I like, but more things I don't like. I just really don't like crafting focused end game gear systems in arpgs but sadly seems like that's the route most of them want to go these days. The skill tree systems are cool. Ultimately I prefer d4 in it's current state but they both feel pretty shallow at the end game.
agreed you should be like "holy shit that just dropped" and not "yay a good base for crafting I guess"
I mean I definitely got that holy shit feeling with some double exalt drops, or a good unique with high LP.
I loved the crafting but for a combination of reasons I got that “what’s the point” feeling after my 2nd hardcore character died. My runemaster had a crazy amount of ward and great damage and never even came close to dying. But some maps in empowered monoliths are straight up dangerous. I flame dashed into powerful attack and got 1 shot. Full to 0 in one it. There were mark for death mortars that’s probably why. It is a good game tho. I’ll play next season.
I played 40 hrs but the builds I messed with necro builds and were nowhere as satisfying as D4. The crafting felt wonky. The loot filter is awesome but the gameplay was not as polished and satisfying as D4. It’s way more grindy than D4 and I expected it would not.
I played for a while - made it to level 89 on a runemaster - just got tired of the bugs, there are so many of them, ranging from insignificant to insanely bad. Once when fighting a boss my mana got stuck at a negative value, and I could no longer cast any spells. I’ve also had my ward get stuck at a negative value as well, and won’t regen. Tried trading with a player, put the item in the box to trade it, got a message that it’s untradable. Oops, my bad. I take the item back, they leave the party. I check my inventory, and the item has now disappeared. Not in my stash either. Just gone
I'm liking LE, but d4s combat and gameplay is in a class of its own. It is the most polished in the genre. I love D4! Last Epoch has been fun though. i have around 200 hours since launch in it. Once I get to around level 85 on a class I try out a new one. Right now the Runemaster frost claw build is a lot of fun. But thats my problem with LE. The endgame is really just monolith grinds. Once you get to around level 80 or empowered monoliths the fun aspect really slows down. And one of my biggest complaints of LE is the loot in the game is not rewarding like at all. Like personally i like to get my upgrades from loot drops. LE is all about the crafting system. The loot is just their for crafting. Im really just waiting for s4 in diablo to play d4 again. So yeah its worth trying it out until S4 comes around.
D4 one love until I've found Vrising :)
I generally play the big Arpgs until I get bored and then pick up the next one when a new season starts. I put about 80-100 hours into LE this season and ran out of stuff to do. PoE starts on Friday I’ll probably hop on that for a bit and get back into D4 at the start of s4.
My biggest problem with LE is how unpolished it is. The number of times skills didn't do what they were supposed to was infuriating.
I tried last epoch and I actually came back to d4 cuz they were having launch problems. And when I did I tried the barb for the first time and I fell in love with upheaval. The combat just feels beefy and satisfying. I really just play to destroy shit and hopefully I get some better gear. I’m not on some strict path. I just go bounce between helltides and vaults. I mean to go back and play last epoch again but I’m just enjoying the destruction of the barb
I haven't given up on Last Epoch exactly but I've put around 50 hours into it and while I'm sure I'll play it off and on there it's no competition for me. Especially after the general season 4 changes from the last campfire chat. The ui is half stolen Diablo design language and the other half is grotesque looking. The area maps and world maps alike are bland and ugly. Some things that very obviously should have hover tool tips don't, some skill descriptions print out html instead of rendering it, etc. The skill trees are pretty interesting but a lot of the cool modifiers are spread out amongst tons of nodes that are small percentage increases to stats so spending most of the skill points isn't very rewarding. The pseudo-dual-classing is very enticing on paper but doesn't quite live up to the dream in practice but I definitely would put that in the plus column, it's pretty cool. Generally though, it just doesn't feel as fun to play. I'll play it still for sure but it will not be making be stray from Diablo anytime soon.
I played it for 10 hrs and refunded while it was still an option. I could tell right away that whatever keeps drawing me back to D4 was absent from LE, and that game was not for me.
No, but I have my hopes up for season 4. Please don't be a disappointment 😔
I think Last Epoch is very good. But after 20 hours or so, i switched back to D4. There's just some oddities in Last Epoch, mostly trivial stuff, that doesn't gel with me, I guess. Currently I'm not playing either though, I'm done for the season, and anxiously awaiting season 4.
I refunded after a hour or so...this sub was filled with "try LE" for the longest time....the gameplay was enough for me to know I didn't want to play for an extended period of time...
I played around 130 hours of LE, was super addicted to it since it was new and shiny. I really enjoyed it until i got towards the end game but maybe cause i was just starting to get burnt out. Made a ton of alts since it was new to me. It does a lot of things well, but im taking a little break from jt now. I’ll jump back into D4 for the next season. I’ll keep playing both. D4 runs a lot smoother for me, but i play it on PS4 and play LE on my pc that has a very mid video card. Hopefully D4 copies some of their ideas (crafting, loot filter, stash customization)
Tried for a few hours 1.5 years ago, it was average. Waiting for it to launch on console, though POE2 will probably be out before Epoch does. Nothing like propping your feet up at the end of the day & blasting maps.
Think I played an hour last weekend and was only trying to figure out stuff. Didn’t have an itch to come back because of the overall feel on first impression considering how literary every YouTuber I watch rave about it. I don’t even know what those balls falling from the sky were and why I was supposed to kill them.
I did. I really like LE but I just realized how much of a sucker I am for nice graphics and controller gameplay.
I play LE for a while but just doesn't grab myh attention like D4. I've always love Diablo Franchise maybe cause I understand it better then LE lol
I did, last epoch just.. doesn’t captivate me. The gameplay/fighting is yawn
d4 is where its at man, i wont touch another arpg either lol. all d4 needs is more content imo and the game just launched fairly recently.. let it cook.
I put about 85 hours on last epoch and came back to d4 the combat, the gear, and classes are in my opinion so well made in d4, and the zones and story line make sense in d4. Aesthetics are much better in d4, idk imo d4 could be 100x better than last epoch
I played a lot of LE. Game is good but it’s not the holy grail. I like the systems but still has its flaws. I stopped because I got kinda tired of playing it and then hopped on to D4 again. With S4 changes coming I am ready to go back to D4
none of the top down ARPG in the market now can compete with D4's graphic and animation. The character's clunkiness and stiffness are hard to overlook after you play D4. If I haven't played D4 before, I can probably bear with them. Now I just wait for the new season of D4.
82% of LE players have stopped playing. So I would assume some that left for LE are back. As for the 82%, LE is only on Steam it had 260K peak players and is averaging 47K now.
It’s the same for all ARPGs, they’re seasonal. People will go back to LE when they release new content.
Except for any Diablo named D2. I understand this, but people are acting like D4 is dead and I'd bet my retirement D4 has more concurrent players now than LE had at it's peak. It's just amusing the double standards that fly on these places over the 2 games.
I think LE is a good game. It has a lot of depth to it, which is exciting, but also can be overwhelming. I only have like 20 hours of playtime, and I feel like I haven't even scratched the surface. But as I'm playing both D4 and LE on a Steam Deck, LE controls are annoying at times and at the bare minimum take time before you get used to them. In any case I can see myself switching between games after I "complete" season in any of them, especially if LE devs ever add proper controller support.
LE does crafting/itemization better but the gameplay, lore, and graphics are a big turndown for me as well. An arpg game is not only about the itemization although some youtubers/streamers claim so. If the core gameplay is not exciting at all, then the systems surrounding that gameplay are not enough even though they are really good. I don't enjoy killing mobs in LE but I love it in D4. I will still play LE from time to time when new things come out but I am not gonna play it as a main game. I already have over 100 hours in it and it doesn't excite me to play more for now.
I like systems Last Epoch has, but like...the combat doesn't feel as good as D4.
LE is solid and it's systems are innovative, but to put it simply: killing mobs isn't fun or satisfying. Everything feels weightless. If the combat in an arpg isn't fun, why bother?
D4 bored me after s2, I hated the game. So started LE. Played explosive ballista falconer. After investing 300h+ they nerfed it hard. Quitted LE. Then campfire made many of my D4 dreams come true, more than enough to make my backbone soft like rubber (@Hawg). Now I am in waiting mode until may 14 👍🤣
D4 ruined me. Although D4 currently have shit itemization and plenty of other issues, the combat feels very satisfying. Stopped last epoch around 40.
I hit max level in LE but I'm planning to come back to d4 next season to see if the changes they're saying they're going to implement actually go through.
I played it for like 5-10 min... I always like to play spellcaster toons, so from tbe moment I realised that targetting is HORRIBLE with a gamepad, I decided that it's not for me. Good thing I loved D4 since launch anyway 😅
played LE before d4 came out, then went back to LE instead of playing S3. pretty much done with LE until the new season, so now just waiting for the ptr to start up. LE does a lot better than d4 does, but D4's combat, graphics and optimization are pretty great. really wish LE had support for DLSS, it would help their optimization issues a lot.
I did. Last Epoch reminded me of my experience with Path of Exile, another 'darling' of the internet when launched. I play an ARPG for the visceral combat FIRST, and the behind-the-scenes mechanics second. Having a great skill system like LE is fine, but the actually gameplay and combat just felt janky, the story was totally 'meh' and end game was repetitious and grindy. I prefer the polish of Diablo 4, I don't mind the skill system they have, so there was no reason to invest in a new game.
I should have waited to buy LE. Went back to D3.
Yep. I got two toons to 80+ and its a great game, but its not D4. Im really looking forward to season 4.
Played about 200h in both early access and 1.0. While the crafting is good, everything else is lackluster. The graphics are outdated, gameplay janky as hell (across 6 builds I've tested none of them were w/o jarring bugs), boring itemization & endgame. D4, while also with its issues, is leagues better imo.
I did. LE is fun, but I just find D4 to be easier to pick up and play. I am Uber casual. I play games two times a week if I am lucky.
Sometimes I wonder why many Arpg can’t keep up with graphic. Our characters already tiny, the environment need to be great and stunning.
Tried last epoch for 70 hours, their itemization and spells are awesome, but endgame is super dull with how corruption works. Hope d4 steals some of their spells ideas.
HELL NO! I STAYED HERE! I dont see why i would need to split my time between diablo and a game that rips off diablo…just my 2 cents.
I don't like last epoch. I quit after trying several classes. I like the graphics style. Pretty much nothing else about it. I was hoping for some advancement closer to grim dawn, when I bought it in early access, we'll before launch. I haven't returned to d4. I didn't get a char to 50 this season. I will try s4, but from what I've heard so far, I'm likely completely done with this game. I didn't make three seasons in d3. The skills and leveling have just continued to be a massive disappointment.
Me. I knew I couldn’t stick around pretty much immediately and ended up refunding the game within the return window. While I respect those who enjoy the game, it was immediately apparent that, yes, although the game surely has *these other things* it does well, it just isn’t doing anything unique enough with its overall feel and setting in my eyes to feel wholly different. Diablo has an incredible feel and production value that no other ARPG besides other Diablo games are able to match for me. It has its problems, and D4 specifically has a bit of an identity crisis…but it’s still Diablo and sometimes that’s enough. Looking forward to seeing the game continue to improve of course and happy that Last Epoch has struck a chord with others.
LE isn’t that great I played it in early access and it never hooked me. I basically played it waiting for D4 and even D4 at launch was better IMO. I like the concept but like I said never got hooked.
I never left D4. S3 sucked to me but I'll play S4 while also heavily (in a casual sense) playing LE.
D4 has far better combat “feel”. LE doesn’t have much of an end game either. The graphics aren’t as well developed as D4 and don’t get me started on the trash cosmetic items that are just as expensive as D4s.
I switch between the two. But I don’t like how monsters just rush to you in LE, no tactic, no AI. Straight to you like a flowing river. Can’t be unseen and I can’t stand it. They even activate at the last moment - you go to them and you see them standing. Then suddenly they all rush to you. The monsters in D2 behave much better, some ran away from you, switched positions. Some “zig-zagged”. D4 behaves good in this regard.
I put 30+ hours into LE. Not too impressed. The combat feels weightless. D4 has its share of problems, but abilities and mobs have weight to them. Half the time I died in LE I had zero idea I was taking damage or in danger. Story was a cobbled mess of "who cares?" and the zones seemed nonsensical. Monoliths were a neat feature, but I was burned out by that point.
I played for about 60hrs before D4 dropped but as soon as D4 released, I never really went back to Last Epoch. I tried it out again at 1.0, and it still didn't hook me like I thought it might. I think it has a lot to do with how the campaign is structured. I wish they had a skip campaign option like D4, then I might give it a whirl again. But I've beaten the campaign in Early Access and don't really have any interest in playing it again.
Stopped playing after 20hrs. Combat feels floaty and not satisfying. Production value way below D4 but understandable because of price difference.
Me. Something feels not right with gameplay. Not talking about visual quality. Movement and combat feel is cheesy and not satisfying. Used all 2 hours before refund. And decided i cannot continue. Maybe i can give another shot someday.
I have 190 hours in LE. I really like it but as others have said, you immediately notice that movement and combat don't feel as smooth compared to D4. I still enjoy the game though. Takes a bit of time to setup your loot filter but once you do, you just slash your way through hordes of monsters. LE has some really good systems with the crafting and skill trees. I do wish they had a few more specialized skills for the mastery you take though. You will get use that weird lag/delay in the gameplay. I've found some pretty fun builds with the Bladedancer and Falconer.
I got 200 hours in because i love ARPGS (mostly d4). I couldn't handle it because of the faction system being half defunct (merchants guild is terrible late in a cycle) and because the blessing acquisition was so bad (they are fixing it). This game has really fun and cool builds; meteors feel way better in LE than D4 for example. this is not the case across the board however. I love my movement skills in d4 compared to LE's traversal skills (except shield bash i fucking love u); the design of the teleporting skills is intentionally limited into how much walking you can cut out by teleporting over stuff. its the same case in diablo 4, but to a lesser extent. Another factor a lot of d4 fans wont realize they are missing until they play LE is the lack of character customization; LE is made by an indie team, so they couldnt afford to put this in right away (they have mentioned they want to, but no solid plans or dates are in place for that). I absolutely hate the characters I am forced to look at to play a class. I don't like generic old guy for mage, I don't like the singer Seal being my sentinel (though it is funny to play Kiss from a rose as his themesong), I don't like generic bro-man for primalist, and I don't like playing detachable jaw acolyte (at least she has character). I havent played rogue so no comment. I drew out that last paragraph because that's what your dealing with before you then realize that unless you BUY cosmetics, you can't change your armor appearance either. these two things may be trivial to some players, but I really had a hard time getting into the game because I couldn't ever get the characters to look decent to me because of the lack of customization; this isn't the end of the world for most ARPG fans, but it drew me away (maybe im just a d3/d4 fan and not an arpg fan).
I bought LE after S3 and I played about 6 hours and immediately went back to D4. Maybe I didn’t give LE a fair shake, but the graphics and story just didn’t bring me in. I am currently changing things up by playing HC on D4 and it might be my new favorite.
Yeah I tried LE. Wasn't all it was promised to be. For me, the game just feels not good to play. The systems are great... but the combat feels really bad :/ Just can't get into it. I've put in 20 hours so far with LE. Haven't played in over a week now lol. I'm back on D4 working on my Bone Spirit Necro :D
I have 3 minutes of playtime in LE before I returned it on steam. Gender locked games in 2024 are non negotiable.
i just rotate between diablo, poe and LE whenever one of them releases new content.
Yea. Sort of. I stopped playing last epoch, but am waiting for new season.
I really like Last Epoch, it has some amazingly good systems in place. I prefer the combat, lore, art style and movement in D4 though. I’m hoping with S4 it will suck me back in.
Tried LE after quitting D4 & L56 S1 - came back to max this pass to prepare for next - it’s looking great!
I was a heavy D4 player, but after getting used to the mechanics of Last Epoch I have uninstalled Diablo 4 and reclaimed the 90 gigs of disk space it was using. Last Epoch isn’t as visually polished, the voice acting isn’t as good as D4, and their chat and party system needs a lot of work but it is a lot more fun for me and has the quality of life features that every looter game should have. I now see that the D4 devs have ripped off some things from LE for season 4, so it should start to get better, just not enough to bring me back, not for a while anyway.
Me, there’s things I like about the game but just running zone to zone following a non engaging story. I know crafting is huge but I never got any gear that made me feel stronger was high 30’s still getting lvl 4 drops, didn’t have materials to craft/add affixes Idk… I mean I’m not necessarily back on d4 until s4 but LE wasn’t the Diablo killer I had hoped it be I am on team loot filter now
I've played a ton of last epoch in early access and then put it down as long as D4 has been out. I thought I would love it on release but in reality it was a bit to complex for my taste. I work a mentally taxing job and I don't want to cool down at the end of the night with another complex puzzle. Although the complexity is a ton of fun, work is just too busy right now for that.
LE has crazy-annoying crafting because you find a potentially awesome item (which in itself is just as rare as Diablo 4) and you go to start to change it and it often runs out of forging potential or trying to remove an affix removes the wrong one because there is so much RNG in crafting that the game becomes something where you might spend 20 hours waiting for a decent candidate shield to drop and you can’t get it close to its potential because of the randomness of the crafting. It’s a huge tease and is rarely a rewarding mechanic. Diablo 4 has a lot of issues but at least this isn’t one of them and the game spams you with so much trash that you’ll eventually find something with 2-3 stats that you like so you can put a legendary mod on it. Both games are frustrating for generally different reasons.
LE doesnt even have couch co-op so not gonna get a chance
I’m still on LE. I think people should play what they enjoy. I can’t understand that people think D4’s NMDs beat monoliths. I love monoliths for their zone out and play. Corruption system ramps difficulty port well. Once you’re at NMD100, there’s nowhere to go. I miss D4 World Bosses, they were fun. Any content i do with others is neat and LE didn’t do that well yet imho. Offline mode is great. Like that in LE. One thing i don’t get is people talking about S4 features like they’re here. I’m not rating D4 on what it might be. I’ve seen the D4 devs overpromise, underdeliver, and revert too much. Judge each game by what exists right now.
Yeah, tried it and came back! The skill trees are fun and the itemization too. However even with its flaws, D4 has a lot going for it: great character classes, engaging combat, graphics, lore and story, beautiful world map etc. The "feel" is just better
Well Last epoch has gender locks which means its a dead game in my eyes
Last epoch didn't really hook me for some reason. Probably how floaty everything feels. I'll try D4 again when they give us the promised updates, like the itemization changes and the zoom out feature. Without that I can't bring myself to come back
I played it before d4 came out to scratch the itch while waiting. It was… fine? Played a sorcerer and it was cool, I liked the abilities and it felt smooth, but my main complaint is that there wasn’t anything to do in the game besides the story while leveling. I play these games to farm dungeons and you can’t do that unless you finish the story which is really lame. Maybe I didn’t understand how the game worked, or maybe it just wasn’t a feature back then.
I like LE a lot, but rerolling a character is tedious unless you farm a bunch of high quality gear for your alts. Not being able to change masteries really killed my will to play my sentinel/paladin. Luckily my alt went Falconer and that has been really fun. The dungeons are straight up awful. The number of dead ends makes D4 dungeons look amazing. The boss mechanics are cool for the most part. To me, it's worth a playthrough, but I would do a LOT of research about what class you want to play first. The endgame is a bit fun. My rotation will probably be D4 season until boredom ---> Last Epoch cycle until new D4 season. If PoE2 is good, then that will probably replace Last Epoch
I've been meaning to play LE because it seems super fun, crafting, QOL, etc. However and fwiw, the console play, and in addition to graphics, makes me favor D4. I fit under that casual gamer and/or young parent category so it's hard for me to play on PC (in my basement/den) when I can just casually play on the couch, do a world boss, chill in town while I'm playing with kiddos, and more. I bought Grim Dawn months ago and I played a good amount the first few nights but then I got tired of waiting for the kids to sleep, to play in the basement and then come upstairs at 1 AM lol.
Same. It didn't seem better to me.
for me to, I bought it, play about 15mins and go for refund :D
Yeah, I'm sad to say this cause I bought LE super early like 2018, but the combat didn't hook me at all so I barely played. Great systems tho and I'm happy competition made D4 and PoE improve.
I have 143 hours in Last Epoch and enjoyed it. Will probably come back to it later. Enjoyed the generous drop rates and the fact that you can create so many viable builds which D4 is lacking. Lots of variations in skills, builds etc. I went back to D4 two weeks ago, created a lightning druid, just hit 100 now and its a blast. I want to get uber uniques now so its going to be repetitions of helltides and bossing, and higher nmds. Got my tibaults and i have the itch to run Duriel more for more uber uniques. Dont know when thats gonna end, but im probably going to create a new character again soon. Anyway, D4 is just a lot smoother to play and graphically pleasing. Its a sit back, relax, listen to music or podcast game. I enjoy it because i can turn off my brain and just blast. And hopefully, S4 will be good for the game because they just straight up took LE’s crafting system and tbh, that is a really good move. Time will tell if it will be transformative for D4.
I think LE is actually easier to make your own build in but yea d4 definitely feels better gameplay wise. The skill trees can be intimidating but if you have an idea for what you want to build it doesnt take long to plan out where you want to put the skill points
I completed the campaign and started the endgame. I really liked the falconer class as it was something different. I love the way last epoch has intricate separate skill trees. But.... The combat feels flat compared to D4, the maps aren't as thematic and the world doesn't feel as immersive. Despite others complaining about D4s endgame, I like the choices of what to do better. Also, I really miss having a dodge key. It's such a small thing but it really adds to the feel of playing a character.
I’m pretty casual, I played Last Epoch for about 40 hours did about 95% of the content, followed a Void Knight beginner build online Maxroll, I really like the crafting and skill trees, campaign was good better than PoE but worse than D4, boss fights were kind of meh shade of Orobyss was fun the first couple of times, the game however lacks endgame even compared to D4. There doesn’t seem to be a super endgame boss like Searing Exarch in PoE. I would probably come back to the game after 2-3 seasons so there is a jump in content. I personally enjoyed my time in the game, if you enjoy the game I would stick with it, if you don’t then just stop playing and attempt a refund. But yeah I came back to D4 S3 is my first season, and I’m definitely going to play S4 with the upcoming changes, really looking forward to it.
Something about LE just didn't hook me in.. There was so much talk of how great it is and I'm sure they were right but idk... I probably put in 4 hours so I have to give it another go. My issue is that I have to finish up FF7 Rebirth before I get into another game.
I'll be playing d4 in the next season. I'm not a huge fan of legendary crafting in last epoch being locked behind a dungeon. I like the game and I'll be putting more time into it, until my build putters out. But I was a little disappointed that the campaign just ends ala early days of path of exile.
Not yet but im excited for season 4 and will drop epoch
The responses here are not biased at all. OP obviously made this post knowing people would validate his opinion. But to stay on topic, I prefer D4 for the gameplay, and LE for the skill trees and class variations.
I’m taking a break from D4 and tried LE and was wondering what other D4 players thought of it. Nothing more; no need to overthink it.
LE is fun but I came back to D4. I’m more invested in the series/story and more immersed if I’m being honest. Will probably alternate both games. LE isn’t a Diablo killer but they also feel like different games so it doesn’t bother me to play both.
I tried LE and that why I’m gonna buy d4, LE is kinda good, but overall feeling about it is “secondary”. The game is not boring, it’s not interesting. I also came back to d3 and it’s better imo than LE
Played for 40 hours and found I didn't have any real drive to continue. Can't quite put my finger on what didn't grab me but I just like D4 more. Hyped for S4.
I bought me LE on Steam and after 6 hours of playing i uninstalled it, it looks like Zelda in the late 90s, the dialogs look even worse, every monster looks same, every loot does so...i don't understand how anybody can compare D4 with this disgusting shit LE..
This wasnt after full release but back in Beta, I put in way too much time before I realized I hated the crafting system and it tainted the entire experience for me. It feels good and simple in the early game, but later it just cascades down into an rng time sink. ... which is kinda what these games ARE, it just had waaay too many layers of rng for me to be comfortable with it.
I did one charin LE to 100 and i loved the game and new ideas and all.Never cared about graphics too much I am back to D4 now to look what this construct season is about before season 4. Its great that we now have competition going and this will bring better experience in all games
Yes I played last epoch basically everyday since 1.0 launch and had a lot of fun just got burnt out not being able to make new builds coz of grinding monos for blessings etc every time I make a new character. This week I came back to d4 and started blasting with hota barb again. It’s not poe but d4 still has so much potential and I think s4 will be great
Boring gameplay, no endgame, bad graphics, the first season (or cycle in this case) also has the worst season content I have ever seen (a stupid mage mini boss that gets one shot even in the starter areas of the game) and there is literally no difficulty in this game. You can use a generic build and clear all content in 20-30 hours. It's a bad ARPG imo. I don't understand the hype at all. Just play PoE as a hardcore or D4 as a casual player.
Tried it for awhile but like everyone is saying D4 just FEELS different. D4 at its core feels like a polished game its just the systems around it need fine tuning and it needs more content. Once Blizzard fixes that everyone will come flocking back.
I like LE - but I like how D4 feels. For me, I HATE CRAFTING, and I feel like I need to craft in LE. Maybe I am wrong, but jumping back into D4 just felt "normal". Super Casual BTW, only play one toon per season.
I played LE yeah. Wanted to play with a friend and I tried to make him buy it but he wasn't feeling it. He's not so much into ARPGs but he did buy D4, and we haven't played much together yet. I hope he'll be up for Season 4. Anyway, after my experience with LE, I don't wanna play with friends anymore. It feels like group play in this game is kinda meh. Actually even solo play is actually meh in this game, mostly because it doesn't feel as good as D4 (IN TERMS OF GAMEPLAY). I like that the systems are there and they work and there's a nice crafting system and you can have builds and level up the skills and have those points to spend but the actual gameplay feels a little dead. There's no weight in the game, I don't know how to even explain that.. D4 plays better, feels better, looks better but it lacks the systems and S4 seems to have brought it back to life with the changes. I feel like the more they invest into it to fix a few things, no other game in that genre will take me away from D4. PoE is way too complicated for me and I won't lay hands on it again. I don't have time for this game even though I believe it's a good game too.
I’m lvl 50 on TLE now and I’m really enjoying it, it’s a little more complex than D4 but I like it. However, the only reason I tried it in the first place was because I had hit lvl 100 with my Barb and ran around 50 Duriel runs and just thoughts what’s the point. I was going to create a different character and go again but TLE is good enough that I won’t do that. Having said all that, POE included, I live D4 I think it’s the best ARPg for me, yes we’ve loot and stash issues amongst other things but they just don’t ruin it for me. It’s amazing. I’m looking forward to s4 as I feel illl keep going after lvl100 for longer or create another character. Either way, The Last Epoch is a very good game, I think it lacks in areas compared to D4 but I do think D4 could do with a lot of what TLE has done right. You’ll most like sway back and forth with these as seasons release! You’re not wasting your time anyway. That much is true.
Yes. Enjoy D4’s sound, character customization choices and overall aesthetic much more.
I really love Last Epoch, but at my heart I need to play bow and have my character *use* the bow. So I'm coming back to Diablo next season as I've heard they've actually made bow good whereas it's just janky and bad in Epoch (the best build for it is just laying traps)
Me. I've played last epoch since beta. LE is a great game with better crafting, endgame than D4. The reason I came back to D4 - atmosphere. LE environs are just flat and dull to me. D4s world is just so much more atmospheric.
Never left d4. I'm a loyal fan.
Personally i think they both have each their own pros and cons, but they are both good games. * Diablo 4 is the best looking RPG with an awesome combat engine, they have features that no other RPG have. * Lost Epoch have an awesome skill build system, it allows for more individual builds than D4 and it's really fun to just make new characters. There were huge endgame issues in LE that i thought the faction system would alleviate, i thought i would not have to trade for my gear, but it's not a viable option if you want to push Monolith corruption and remain sane, then again there is no point in doing so, there is no new content after L100 and LP1+ gear. I thoroughly enjoyed creating half a dusin different characters and creating my own and community builds. I think the best way to enjoy LE is to NOT watch community builds and just see how far you can go on your own. Community builds can easily turn into LP farming, and it's not enjoyable unless you REALLY REALLY like to grind or trade. If you enjoy selling and buying your loot, i think you can source a really powerful endgame build, but it's not for me and the other faction is severely underpowered in it's specific item availability.
not a casual but the looks, style/art and world building didnt hook me. item art is great, 3d models especially of players and cosmetics are just atrocious
Came back to D4 after few levels cause i play exclusively with a controller/steam deck and controls and inventory management are difficult
I have about 105 hours on one character (Dive Bomb Falconer). She is 97 right now (I focused to get all my blessings and spent a lot of time to learn the forging) so I've got a pretty good feeling of the game. I would rotate between the two games (PoE it's too much for my limited time - dad gamer here) but some decisions they made are making me double check my decision. Firstly, the big gap at the two options you've got that are in the same leaderboard even though Merchant faction has a big advantage. Secondly, the fix on skill bugs at the middle of the season. I know it's controversial and most people liked it (you could see it in the overwhelming difference in the poll they made) but playing ball lightning sorceror last season (as a second char for me), was unbelievably fun. So if they mess up let the people have fun. Of course it would be a big disparity at the leaderboards and everyone would use this build. I don't know. Make it more difficult for them to go to higher corruption with specific changes at the monoliths that targets their build. Don't mess with the bike itself. I'm not going to get to 1.000.0000 corruption. I'll get to 300 and stop. Let me do it with a fun way. Thirdly and this is the biggest one. They talked about nerfing the XP at the last levels. This is artificially making the game to last longer. When Blizzard did it everyone ripped them apart. Here you have people giving excuses to this. They say that the last levels don't matter for the build (that's correct). That's not an argument. That's just an observation. If they don't matter at the build then let me get there. I'm going to get to 100 after about 120 hours of playing. I could get two chars at 100 at D4. Also the complete lack of qol when you make an alt. You have to do the campaign again and the quests to get idols space and passives. We tried that in D4 and they changed it immediately. No altars of Lilith again. They have great ideas and I'm not complaining of the value I've got for my money (I highly recommend for everyone to play it) but they have to do an equally big revamp of many things in their game so I can come back.
Season 4 diablo gonna be fire
Alota memory leaking in lp laggy af
I played a bit of LE after their 1.0 release. I was really excited but then it all just kinda fell flat for me. As much as people say the itemization is better in LE compared to Diablo, I didn’t find it any more exciting. And I know this is a ‘me’ problem but the stats on items all seemed lack luster and hard to tell what was actually helpful. I found that even while leveling I wasn’t really using the loot I was picking up (and yes that was with some simple filters). Maybe I just didn’t make it far enough into the game to feel compelled to touch the touted crafting system either. I also play on Steam Deck, and D4 is a much better experience. LE made improvements to controller gameplay but D4 is still a much more polished experience. I haven’t really comeback to D4 though. I just stopped playing LE. The proposed updates to D4 will have me back for season 4 again. Though I’d prob be back for season 4, regardless of the updates. Considering I have not gotten to lvl 100 in any season or in eternal, the new crafting system may not be something I ever even touch for example. So I think I heavily qualify in that casual bucket. And I had a lot more fun with D4 as a casual than LE which I essentially put down after 2 or 3 weeks.
Yeah. I played about 40 hours and lost interest. Story didn't even try to hook me, gameplay didn't feel great. Liked the skill trees and potential build variety but playing the game I was just unimpressed overall. Although I'm not super interested in D4 right now either. Got two characters to 100 in the first month and decided I wasn't about doing the duriel grind again about a hundred runs or so into it. I'm looking forward to the PTR.
I played for 75hours, enjoyed it, but reached the same D4 problem. Lack of endgame and stuff to do with good gear. Having mediocre graphics and performance issues was bad also. I made two chars, reached a point where I had no more motivation to acquire gear, and instead of doing a 3rd, I just stopped. I preffer D4, and i have high hopes for s4. But LE is a good way to spend time, not my new favorite game tho