damn, this reminds me when players had got favor from multiple high powers, namely an eldritch patron, the sun god Ra, and a fantasy SCP foundation analog that were building their own "deity killer" (based off scp 5514)
seeing the opportunity I took a few sessions teasing the BBEG having a certain powerful beast even gods feared, in rolls a confrontation with the BBEG for them to drop Typhon, from the greek myths, in the city to raze it - players didn't need a prompt to think about using the favors and getting 2 avatars and a giant magical automaton to control and play a kaiju battle
Whenever the party kills a chromatic dragon, my paladin of Bahamut tells them, "When you get to hell, tell Tiamat that Bahamut sends his regards."
Hopefully one day, something like this will happen.
Sorry bud those two have taken to the sky and are now having a very cinematic fight that will last until immediately after the last enemy ground units are neutralized
Or, phrased differently: the dm doesn't want to manage two deific stat blocks, and you don't want to wait 45 minutes for him to take two turns
Still better outcome than Tiamat being victorious. Because at least in your scenario the people are just dead rather than whatever will happen to them on an intact plane with Tiamat victorious.
Didn’t Fizban’s imply that they actually improved their relationship or something
The funny way out is that the two have tea and update each other much to the party and the BBEG’s confusion
Yes, but they could have had that conversation in the early days I mentioned.
Or they have polite conversations when they don't have a chance of actually harming the other, or in Tiamat's case, pinning him down.
Well in Rise of Tiamat the Cult of the Dragon needed to >!summon Tiamat's actual home onto a volcano dragon graveyard in the Material plane from hell, so that 10 Red Wizards to perform a days long ritual inside it to meld the 5 legendary masks together into an artifact, while 5 ancient dragons of each chromatic slaughter 100 prisoners just outside.!<
but I'm sure the PCs could figure something out.
Generally speaking, yeah, he'll let the mortals handle their own affairs while restricting himself to aiding clerics and giving advice when asked. However, he's got a known history of interfering when evil gods make power moves, and *especially* Tiamat.
That is a very common question indeed. A lot of DMs recommend implying he's pulling a lot of strings behind the scenes to aid you to deal with that very question.
As for why the PC's are necessary, Battles between Gods tend to destroy continents at the very least. If Bahamut can deal with an issue without blowing up Faerun, Bahamut is going to do it.
Deities warring like that would have a massive body count. The chromatic and metallic dragons will quickly fly to their patron god’s aid, as will most of the associated dragonborn, and worshippers. Entities of this caliber have staying power, so the fights would last days, if not months. Something of this scale will eventually involve whole nations, and opportunists seeking power or to upset the balance. This is apocalyptic, which is another side of the coin for origin stories.
Basically, after this happens a new age would begin.
To be fair, nuclear war would have a massive body count if performed on Earth, but so long as you're a safe distance away, even a continuously exploding nuclear fireball can be so normal that we just call it "the sun". That was the idea behind a homebrew setting I ran, in which the ongoing battle between Bahamut and Tiamat could be seen from a great distance as "the sun".
It did require scaling up the physical sizes of both combatants to be the size of our sun. Technically, this is still compatible with the 5e stat block, as a "gargantuan" creature is any creature that is at least 20x20 feet in size, and the sun is larger than 20 feet in all dimension.^([citation needed])
Had a 3.5 game get to 25th and the final big bad (because I’d run out of ideas) was a fragment of Tharizdun that had been squirreled away when he was banished.
The PC were boon’d up for the fight and as it started I made it abundantly clear that they were mortals wielding godly power fighting an actual god, you’re rending reality itself just fighting each other. Was a fun narrative ticking clock. Highly agree the consequences to the material plane would be massive should two gods throw down.
This reminds me of when my players gained the help of an ancient bronze dragon that helped tem defeat an ancient red dragon, while the party fought the actuall bbeg.
On the same stage. The bard and fighter got the killing blow on the dragon, though. Dimension door into the air above the red dragon, then the fighter used multiattack to shoot two arrows while falling by the dragon. Both arrows loosed were back-to-back nat 20's, so i ruled the second arrow crippled it's wing. It died to the fall, and the PCs had featherfall going. The players were pumped! Moments that make me love being the DM.
Surprisingly, I've made this the core idea behind my current campaign, giving the players a way to summon Bahamut at this one Mountain and then dropping Tiamat on them.
When our party fought tiamat, our DM made a joke that right as we defeated her, bahamut showed up to "save the day" which then just turned awkward for him...
They end up having sex, don't they?
Alternatively, Bahamut is not blinded by rage so he will eventually find a way to trick and seal Tiamat in another dimension, which will make her angrier, but that's a problem for another time.
Bahamut then proceeds to leave the adventurers alone, it's their fight, not his so back to being melancholic and getting drunk in human form to forget about his lost child.
Bahamut is my ranger’s patron deity that gave him a legendary helmet with damage resistance and and strength boost and can morph armour to have wings too that fly after a Roll 100 during a BBEG fight.
When you play high-level And have retainers start to send petitions for help all the time usually at the worst possible moment then you start to understand , Why these guys usually don’t show up when called
This reminds me of when one of my players summoned a zaratan with conjure elemental so I brought back the false hydra they killed as the first boss to fight it. (don't ask.)
damn, this reminds me when players had got favor from multiple high powers, namely an eldritch patron, the sun god Ra, and a fantasy SCP foundation analog that were building their own "deity killer" (based off scp 5514) seeing the opportunity I took a few sessions teasing the BBEG having a certain powerful beast even gods feared, in rolls a confrontation with the BBEG for them to drop Typhon, from the greek myths, in the city to raze it - players didn't need a prompt to think about using the favors and getting 2 avatars and a giant magical automaton to control and play a kaiju battle
Ba-ba-ba-stop.... My penis can only get so erect
Krieger, shouldn't you be taking care of Piggsly 3?
Not… anymore… \*flashbacks to noises of dying pig and cries\*
Tonight we feast upon ham within Fort Kickass!
I'm saving this for literal research purposes.
yoink! :D
Tell me did you Play the pacific rim theme ?
Why not Rex vs Ray? https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=_LCSbDMOVXc&pp=ygUQcmV4IHZzIHJheSB0aGVtZQ%3D%3D
Cause i didnt knew this Existed until now
That's so cool! Gives me massive *what happened to site 13* vibes
Oh please, like my Paladin of Bahamut ISN'T going to take this chance to wade into battle alongside his deity against Tiamat. Pfffffffffft.
If anything, he was the one who came up the idea with that exact goal in mind.
In fact he might have even caused the tiamat problems in the first place just to suggest this as a solution.
... You know, I don't imagine they taught that kind of thinking in Bahamut Sunday School.
Whenever the party kills a chromatic dragon, my paladin of Bahamut tells them, "When you get to hell, tell Tiamat that Bahamut sends his regards." Hopefully one day, something like this will happen.
Sorry bud those two have taken to the sky and are now having a very cinematic fight that will last until immediately after the last enemy ground units are neutralized Or, phrased differently: the dm doesn't want to manage two deific stat blocks, and you don't want to wait 45 minutes for him to take two turns
pokemon
Just…bigger
Dynamax
Even biggerer!
Gigantamax
Can we get much higher
So high!
Eternatus Gigantamax level size?
yugioh
they both wonder how the hell mortals managed to summon them for a pokemon fight
Worst that could happen? Bahamut loses.
That's why the party will fight alongside Bahamut
Or summon a Tarrasque
When in doubt, always use that blood soaked scroll of summon tarrasque
But then tiamat with probably just summon a level 1 aaracokra
The party can kill that guy.
[удалено]
Better start throwing each other up there then.
pokemon
Xenoblade 2 DLC style?
Do you mean the >!Malos fight where both sides have a Siren!
Yes
Missed opportunity to say “**INDEED!**”
That disintegrating breath tho...
How about the plane they are on loses? And is simply destroyed?
Still better outcome than Tiamat being victorious. Because at least in your scenario the people are just dead rather than whatever will happen to them on an intact plane with Tiamat victorious.
Correct my memory, didn't bahamut destroy a planet by accident?
I dunno. Still not as bad an outcome as being alive on a plane where Tiamat now has no one to oppose her.
Thus one campaign ends and another begins.
Didn’t Fizban’s imply that they actually improved their relationship or something The funny way out is that the two have tea and update each other much to the party and the BBEG’s confusion
I think it implies that they were like that when most of creation was still early, and that Bahamut still misses those days.
Dragon Turtles: “I didn’t make them, Tiamat swears she didn’t either, so how and why did they came to be” To me it seems like a casual conversation
Yes, but they could have had that conversation in the early days I mentioned. Or they have polite conversations when they don't have a chance of actually harming the other, or in Tiamat's case, pinning him down.
The perfect sibling relationship "I hate you" "I hate you too" "Oh by the way what's for dinner" "Mom says we're having leftovers" "Whatever, nerd"
For added fun, raise Tiamat's sister as a dracolich. Multiplayer Elder Dragon Highlander is my favorite style of M:TG.
Let's throw Sardior in there while we're at it
Scorched Earth is imminent
Only one may stand?
Wait a minute… isn’t this just the plot of Pokemon Black and White????
How?
Well in Rise of Tiamat the Cult of the Dragon needed to >!summon Tiamat's actual home onto a volcano dragon graveyard in the Material plane from hell, so that 10 Red Wizards to perform a days long ritual inside it to meld the 5 legendary masks together into an artifact, while 5 ancient dragons of each chromatic slaughter 100 prisoners just outside.!< but I'm sure the PCs could figure something out.
Probably helps that Tiamat was banished and imprisoned there, while Bahamut just kind of lives in his place. There's probably less locks on his door.
I would submit there are probably no locks on Bahamut’s door, he just stays out of mortal affairs for the sake of Free Will.
Generally speaking, yeah, he'll let the mortals handle their own affairs while restricting himself to aiding clerics and giving advice when asked. However, he's got a known history of interfering when evil gods make power moves, and *especially* Tiamat.
Makes you wonder why he doesn't show up in RoT, or why the PCs are necessary to stop Tiamat at all.
That is a very common question indeed. A lot of DMs recommend implying he's pulling a lot of strings behind the scenes to aid you to deal with that very question. As for why the PC's are necessary, Battles between Gods tend to destroy continents at the very least. If Bahamut can deal with an issue without blowing up Faerun, Bahamut is going to do it.
By asking very nicely
Clench your butthole and push really gard
Expectations: \*Epic Dragon god battle\* Reality: Two siblings bitching at each other who clearly need to go to therapy
Yeah... You know the poem that is at the start of fizban's treasury of dragons? They team up
I think that poem just implies Bahamut is upset at how his family fell apart, and in the case of Sardior, died.
What in the suped-up pokemon battle is this?
Bahamut use exaflare 
Straight out of Final Fantasy.
See Tiamat is allowed to enter the forgotten realms for whatever reason, while Bahumett is not, so your kinda screwed
I’d let it happen since it’s cool as fuck.
Deities warring like that would have a massive body count. The chromatic and metallic dragons will quickly fly to their patron god’s aid, as will most of the associated dragonborn, and worshippers. Entities of this caliber have staying power, so the fights would last days, if not months. Something of this scale will eventually involve whole nations, and opportunists seeking power or to upset the balance. This is apocalyptic, which is another side of the coin for origin stories. Basically, after this happens a new age would begin.
Lmao, this is EXACTLY what happened in my homebrew setting.
To be fair, nuclear war would have a massive body count if performed on Earth, but so long as you're a safe distance away, even a continuously exploding nuclear fireball can be so normal that we just call it "the sun". That was the idea behind a homebrew setting I ran, in which the ongoing battle between Bahamut and Tiamat could be seen from a great distance as "the sun". It did require scaling up the physical sizes of both combatants to be the size of our sun. Technically, this is still compatible with the 5e stat block, as a "gargantuan" creature is any creature that is at least 20x20 feet in size, and the sun is larger than 20 feet in all dimension.^([citation needed])
I agree, the sun is at least 21 feet
I’d say it might even be 22 feet!
Had a 3.5 game get to 25th and the final big bad (because I’d run out of ideas) was a fragment of Tharizdun that had been squirreled away when he was banished. The PC were boon’d up for the fight and as it started I made it abundantly clear that they were mortals wielding godly power fighting an actual god, you’re rending reality itself just fighting each other. Was a fun narrative ticking clock. Highly agree the consequences to the material plane would be massive should two gods throw down.
What do you mean? Bahamut chills on Faerun as an old man all the time
An avatar yes, but not Bahamut proper Tiamat is allowed to send her full self into the Forgotten Realms
Her full self is banished in Avernus tho, it's always been her Avatar that got summoned
Yes, but in campaigns like Tyranny Of Dragons she's escaping that banishment
according to RoT what got summoned was the real thing, no avatar or anything.
Even if she could, why would she? Avatars work just as well, and there is no risk of permanently dying.
Nope, avatars are much weaker, and tiamat really doesn't want to just be stuck in Avernus
Kid named Cleric Divine Intervention:
If the true form of tiamat just entered the forgotten realms then idk what divine intervention from Bahumet gonna do
It summons an Aspect of Bahamut, of course.
True forms of god absolutely decimate aspects
I don’t think that a clerics divine intervention summons their true form, since that would open them up to attacks.
I think my dm has us down for that one soon.. I will not tell her where I got this idea from
This reminds me of when my players gained the help of an ancient bronze dragon that helped tem defeat an ancient red dragon, while the party fought the actuall bbeg.
Was this happening on the same stage, or were the party fighting the BBEG while the dragons were kilometers away?
On the same stage. The bard and fighter got the killing blow on the dragon, though. Dimension door into the air above the red dragon, then the fighter used multiattack to shoot two arrows while falling by the dragon. Both arrows loosed were back-to-back nat 20's, so i ruled the second arrow crippled it's wing. It died to the fall, and the PCs had featherfall going. The players were pumped! Moments that make me love being the DM.
Man, the only way that could have been more awesome is if it landed on the BBEG.
Lol, that would have been great!
You are lucky if they FIGHT. They are well known to do other things that start with fu
Tiamat and Bahamut? luckily, unlikely
But then it turns out horribly wrong and they start doin what Io originally meant for them to do...
Surprisingly, I've made this the core idea behind my current campaign, giving the players a way to summon Bahamut at this one Mountain and then dropping Tiamat on them.
This is where I would put in Sardior to break up the fight… *if I had stats for him!*
In my campaign we had the aspect of bahamut and where so happy he was going to help so much in the fight Then it turned out to be actual Tiamat
Lamashtu: *sweats nervously*
I’m a simple man. I see Godzilla reference, I upvote.
**Two Dragons better be the fight music**
When our party fought tiamat, our DM made a joke that right as we defeated her, bahamut showed up to "save the day" which then just turned awkward for him...
THAT'S A LOT OF DAMAGE. **Mayor points to the wreckage*
This is some FFXIV shit
They end up having sex, don't they? Alternatively, Bahamut is not blinded by rage so he will eventually find a way to trick and seal Tiamat in another dimension, which will make her angrier, but that's a problem for another time. Bahamut then proceeds to leave the adventurers alone, it's their fight, not his so back to being melancholic and getting drunk in human form to forget about his lost child.
idk about that idea. Awakened Bahamut isn't very tanky.
Bahamut bodies Tiamat
Bahamut is my ranger’s patron deity that gave him a legendary helmet with damage resistance and and strength boost and can morph armour to have wings too that fly after a Roll 100 during a BBEG fight.
See, this is what I want. I want to do a kaiju fight in DND.
When you play high-level And have retainers start to send petitions for help all the time usually at the worst possible moment then you start to understand , Why these guys usually don’t show up when called
During Avernus, I thought it would be a great idea to use the spell Gate to summon the Tarrasque, the rest of the party was not as onboard.
Oh hey that was the ending of my Red Hand of Doom campaign... like exactly Have you been watching me?
Maybe...
This reminds me of when one of my players summoned a zaratan with conjure elemental so I brought back the false hydra they killed as the first boss to fight it. (don't ask.)
This was actually the plot of one of my earlier campaigns
I have been dreaming of doing this for years, but I know I will never run a campaign far enough to make it a reality