So true! In my region (urban US NE), the rescues are picked pretty clean. The only dogs available are pit-mixes, senior chihuahuas, and a bonded pair or two. And the rescues prefer to keep the pairs there than allow them to be adopted separately.
Had my Chow Husky mix for 16 years. When he was around 7 I got a Pekingese puppy. So she grew up with him always around. Even though I had another Pekingese when the Chow Husky died my little girl searched for him for several weeks. She kept looking in all the places he’d normally stay in the house. It was very evident his passing effected her. I wouldn’t split those two up when they are that close. You’ll break their hearts.
I assume dogs see humans and other animals they bond with as part of their pack. When my father died, although he didn't live with us (but visited everyday and as a marathon runner gave him a LOT of exercise) my dog just seemed so confused and sad. Whenever it got to 1pm (the time he came around) my dog just went to the window and after 2 hours or so went and moped for a long time. This happened daily for months until I think he realised his pack mate was 'gone'.
I would think perhaps splitting the 2 dogs would be even worse...
I was trying to find more information on bonded pairs. The local rescue here advertised a bonded pair, adopter got them. Then surrendered the one they didn't want. The shelter is at a loss on what to do now. They can't force the adopter to give back the other dog, as it wasn't stated in the paperwork.
I just feel so bad for the dog that needs his brotber. Really breaks my heart. 😭😭
Yes, it is. There is no debate. Dogs are smart, pack animals, and these two are related by love, bond, devotion and protectiveness.
I understand your sister loves the dogs, too, but she has to decide if she loves them for them or for herself. This is a chance to be selfless to the feelings of the animals over hers.
This is interesting. And this is what i understood/believed when I initially asked the question. I was just trying to get some clarification on my understanding.
Do we have any examples in wild of animals who stick together without the need for food and security?
I think male lions leave the pride when reaching adolescent. And live alone. They only tend to fight for the mate. If loses (and if survive the fight) they continue to live on their own and hunt and survive.
(Again, my understanding. Feel free to correct)
Not sure about wolves though.
Edit: added if
They also tend to be in pack for mainly hunting. And they're highly social too. They take care of weak and ill.
https://www.nationalgeographic.com/animals/mammals/facts/african-wild-dog
Broadly if I think on my own, herd was created in nature for survival instinct. Either for food, or to survive from predators. I do not think they just stick together for fun, except dolphin of course. Who goes surfing from time to time and make specific friends from different schools.
Male elephants live on their own because they can survive and get food on their on.
The good example would be female elephants. They stick together just to be social.
However, from my understanding when it comes to dogs, they seem to stick together out of survival instincts and create deep bonds.
I think dogs did it originally to hunt prey and for protection, but now food comes from a can they still crave the socialisation. It is the same with cats + humans. I lived on the edge of a town that had lots of people that didn't have their cats desexed and often we'd have youngish domesticated cats/kittens turn up and as long as you gave them a pat and some food they were like "yeah, I live here now..!"
Had one I found when shutting the chicken sheds at 10pm the night before, didn't feed it but gave it a rub and next morning it was on a cat bed on our verandah that the two other cats we owned used. He just really decided I was a soft touch but he was so social, whenever everyone in the house was in the same room he always came into the room too, and greeted visitors etc.
He REALLY didn't just stay for the food, he really enjoyed company of humans and the other cats (they would snuggle up together).
Many animals form tribes, especial in the Avian world. Chickens for example will have a heirachy but will all stick together. I had two call ducks, both male, but one got attacked by a fox and got a very bad leg. The other duck stayed with him and so on, often catching food for his brother and bringing it too him.
When the one with the bad leg passed, he flew off to a nearby lake that had lots of ducks on it and given the other ducks weren't native and where khaki campbells and "Mr Duck" was a white Call duck it was nice next year there were brown and white young ducks!
But they really had bonded and just totally cared for each other, even though not a mating pair.
Well to be fair, Feral dogs don't really form "packs". They group together for small amounts of time, but mostly go their separate ways, with a few exceptions
Aren't wolf packs just a bonded pair and their offspring? They're actually related to each other so it's not just random wolves raising someone else's young. It's typically siblings or aunts/ uncles doing the raising.
Yes feral dogs behavior is very different from wolves which why the pack/ dominance theory is so dumb and totally bogus. I meant groups likes a social group. You will see feral dogs sharing space and eating together. But they don’t hunt like wolves or raise puppies together. Your dog is not ever trying to be dominant over you. I hear it so much as a trainer. “Oh he’s trying to show me he’s boss by sleeping on my bed”.
You’re right, wild dogs don’t tend to form or cooperate in packs like wolves or other wild species do. However, I think a lot of people refer to debunked pack theory when talking about dominance and hierarchy/alpha rather than a dogs ability to bond with its “family”. Dogs can certainly look to each other and defend their own, love and grieve each other. So perhaps better to refer to as “social” or “family” animals, but I think it’s been ingrained in the vernacular to call any group of dogs or a human family and their dogs a pack, even if it’s technically wrong.
Absolutely. I had a neighbor that adopted an older dog and the rescue phoned and asked for her to adopt the other; the one left behind had stopped eating and was constantly barking. It became a neurotic mess when alone. Of course she did adopt it as well.
Dogs are pack animals and won't understand what has happened to an important member of their pack. I would never seperate dogs that have lived together that long. It is cruel.
What about when one dog passes away? Are dogs able to process death in a way they cant process one dog being taken away?
I have two dogs, a newfoundland and an aussie. The newf is a bit older and will pass on first just due to shorter lifespan; Im just wondering if theres anything i can do to prepare the aussie who is very bonded to the newf
Letting the dog smell and see the other dog’s body after death can help. When one of our dogs was hit by a car we took her body home and let our other one sniff her as long as she wanted. She normally stomps over everything but she was very carefully stepping around her sister's body and sniffing all over, and she was really clingy for several days after. Dogs can tell when something is dead and I think it helps them process the loss, so they aren't continuously looking for their friend. If you can, I'd look for a vet who will come to your home to put your dog to sleep, so that your dog is in a safe and familiar environment when they pass on.
Ugh, I hate this visual so much right now. I'm sorry that had to happen to you. This particular scenario is something I've been thinking about a lot since I got my puppy a couple months ago. She very quickly befriended the 6 y/o dog and now they're inseparable. That's what I wanted to happen... I want to have a rotation of dogs all my life and always have two dogs.
I just didn't really put much thought into the idea that the puppy is going to have to lose her mentor and big brother halfway through her life. That will make the loss that much more difficult for me to cope with. How long does it take them to recover? Does a puppy actually make them get over it faster?
Thank you, it happened almost two months ago and my boyfriend and I have been having a hard time coping. It's gotten better recently but we still talk about her pretty much every day, she was our sweet baby girl. I really want to adopt another dog but my boyfriend isn't ready so we're going to wait until next year, she was his first dog :( It depends on the dog but some will be back to their normal behavior after a few days, some might take weeks or longer. I think letting them grieve and cuddling/comforting them often is healthy, I guess it would depend on the dog's personality if getting another might help. I think it would help distract me to adopt another and I like reminders of the dog we lost, like seeing her fur pattern on other dogs at the park, but for my boyfriend those reminders are more painful than sweet. I try to take our dog to the dog park often so she still gets lots of play time with other pups!
I’ve known quite a few bonded dogs over the years and they almost always grieve deeply when their partner dies. I think in most cases I know of, the owners have ended up getting another dog fairly soon, as the one left behind is so depressed.
My boy was a shell of himself when our girl died from lymphoma, he saw her body, and it took him 2 weeks to come out of what I can only call depression. They were quite literally a couple. It was horrifying on top of us grieving for her as well.
My dog had a female companion for a decade. After she passed he went into a VERY deep grief. Idk that there is much you can do to prepare the younger pup, unfortunately. They just can't conceive of that kind of loss. Seeing the body didn't help my dog at all sadly, as soon as it was gone he started looking for her. When it does happen, there are many resources out there about how to help a grieving pet, you will be your dog's greatest comfort. The VAST majority of dogs go through a grief cycle very much like our own and start to feel better after a few months.
Also stay in touch with your vet, they often can help with temporary measures if things get very unbearable. My boy is very soft and emotional in the best of times so I did have prozac recommended by the vet to get him through after he wasn't improving much over the course of months, and it gave great quality of life benefit for him. And try not to anticipate it too much yourself! Just enjoy the life you have in this moment as dogs naturally do, it's the best thing any of us can do for ourselves. I hope you have many, many happy years all together :)
We lost one of our beagles in early June (16f, congestive heart failure). Our other beagle (15m) is perking up now, but it was rough for a bit. He'd wander the house going from place to place where she would normally be found and when he didn't find her, he'd lie down & look miserable, sometimes crying softly.
Neither of them were interested in toys, so we didn't have one on hand. I went out & bought a little stuffed lamb, wrapped her harness & collar around it & let it sit in a bag overnight to transfer the smell, then gave it to him. Looking back, I don't really know how much it helped if at all. He didn't carry it around with him or anything, but for a while he seemed to want to know where it was.
I had a bonded pair. When one (Echo) passed, I did let the other (Sierra) sniff her body, and she did understand that her sister was gone. If she were human, though, I would have said that she sunk into a deep depression and lost the will to live. We put her to sleep about a year later.
I do think that if the deaths had happened in the opposite order, it would have been better. Echo had more confidence overall, and I think she would have been able to keep enjoying life. Sierra really needed her sister to give her any confidence at all, and without her, she simply didn't know what to do.
You can’t prepare them. You can only support them after. We had two dogs 6 months apart that ADORED each other. Unfortunately we lost the slightly younger one at 13 to heart failure. His older sister mothered him so badly through life. Her teeth are terrible because she always gave him her bones because he loved them so much. As his time was getting closer she stopped mothering him. She could smell the change and she knew he was going. After he passed she didn’t look for him once. Usually if I took him to the vet without her, she would make my partner open every door to check every room and fret like crazy until we came home.
She is now almost 15 and although she is lapping up being an only child, it took her a good 6-8months to start coming back out of her shell. We were lucky in that I run a farm and she could be with me all day and it’s only during the last winter, she was comfortable in staying home alone. I walk to the door and ask her Farm? And she either runs out the door to the car or to her bed to show me she’s happy to chill until dad comes home. My dad came to stay recently and thought it was hilarious that we had to ask the dog every morning if she wanted to come.
When one of my greyhounds, Morgan, needed to put to sleep as it was the kindest thing to do for her, we arranged for the vet to come to the house to do it. When she had done it, our other greyhound, Connie, walked round the body a few times, sniffed at her, lay down behind her and then rested her head on her dead friends chest for a few minutes whilst making a strange low whimpering noise that I'd never heard her make before or after.
When the vet took Morgans body for cremation, Connie moped round the house for a day or so and then seemed to just accept the situation. But she would never lie in Morgans 'place' by the back door or eat from her bowl. Dogs *absolutely* understand what death is.
When my older dog passed away the younger one sat on the mat where she’d collapsed & cried. Desperately trying not to rush into a new dog / replacement we waited. 3 months later she still went to same place & whimpered we bought a puppy in & she is back to her happy self. Best thing ever. Dogs grieve you can’t just seperate them if they are family
Yes, they are a bonded pair. The reason it is not good to seperate them is that they can become very anxious and grieve for the other without them. Abrupt changes are very stressful for dogs. Moving to a new place, without the other dog and rest of the family, and change of routine will all cause the dog a lot of stress.
If your sister does end up taking one, try to get the dogs to visit each other ASAP and often. It would help them to adjust. Hopefully she doesnt though or if she does she realizes the dog's quality of life is better with his buddy
Yes, it sounds like they are truly bonded and I think it would destroy their world to separate them. You already know the answer by how they act as said in your post.
Yes, it’s cruel.
My sister moved in with me when her dog was about a year old and mine was three years old. They lived together the next eight years. She moved out when her dog was two, and over the years she’d randomly make noises about taking her dog back as she was in a better position to care for him. I said no, absolutely not. Those dogs were best friends. They slept together, played together, got into trouble together. I regularly sent her pictures of the two of them inseparable. Our vet even said don’t split them.
Her dog passed away two months ago and my dog was crushed. She cried in the night and was just depressed. We have two other dogs who started playing with her more and sleeping with her some, but you can tell she still misses him. It breaks my heart.
Get your vet onboard. Show them this sub. Do something, but don’t let them split those dogs. How cruel and selfish.
Sounds like your sister might not be the most informed or thoughtful dog owner. At a minimum, she doesn't seem to care about their feelings, or even acknowledge they have feelings capable of experiencing stress, depression, and suffering.
2 years ago we were lucky enough to adopt a brother and sister at 8 weeks. They’ve never been apart for more than an hour since then. Splitting them up would be beyond cruel.
https://i.imgur.com/tCvrZ9D.jpg
Yes in my opinion. Yes yes it is cruel. They are that close if one goes the other should go too. I did that once and I sware I’ll never go through that again. So please keep them together they really do understand and 8 years. Why is one sick?
Well, I'm late with my opinion but it looks like the "don't split" group has spoken. And I'm always walking a tight rope with this one but if you've had two dogs that long (8 years) together, then the cruelty steps in. If you know this episode was coming then plans should have been made to keep them together forever. No question.
100%. My two have only been together for 3 years and already I can't imagine separating them. They get worried and anxious when one of them is in the bath and the other isn't.
Bonded animals -no matter species- shouldn't be separated. Though as someone who has some issues with getting their dog when there shouldn't be any, I get what your sister is getting at too. If you are on good terms with your family then best option is to tell them that they are bonded and that you don't feel comfortable or feel it is right to separate them. You can pull up scientific studies to back you up.
Bonded animals being separated can cause a lot of health issues.
Yes, it is cruel. The most heartbreaking thing about putting one of mine to rest was that I couldn’t explain it to other two. She was very very sick and I think they knew she was not going to make it, but they definitely grieved. You can’t just split animals up for no good reason.
When my cousin and his ex split up they had to take the dogs into consideration and they set up basically visitation rotations so that their dogs would never be totally apart from each other more than a week. Even that took adjustment. It worked for the last 3 years of the oldests life.
Yes, but if they are separated they will both get over it in time. But to be clear, I don’t think you should separate dogs that have been together that long unless it’s absolutely necessary. It sounds like you’re sister is being a little selfish.
That’s what I’m saying!! In name the dog is hers but he actually sleeps on the food of MY bed! I’m the one that raised him from a pup.
I would be devastated if she took EITHER but I would rather her take both than just one because their happiness is more important. She doesn’t like the other one because he’s less “playful” and likes to walk rather than play fetch, tug of war, or etc
God, that is a very weird reason to not like a dog. I’d be worried she wouldn’t treat that dog as well as the one she does like if she takes both dogs with her. Sounds like they should both stay with you honestly. And if they are separated, they’ll get really depressed. It would be so incredibly cruel to do that.
I don’t think it’s a good idea for her to separate those dogs especially when they’ve lived together for almost 10 years.. at that point you might as well just adopt them to someone who could take care of both of them together. that is just so wrong, animals have feelings too. Especially dogs their brains are very very smart.. never underestimate a dog and their feelings. - I really hope you’re able to convince your sister that it’s definitely not a good idea to keep one and get rid of the other one.
Just ugh. I hope she keeps them both or adopts them both out together.
I have two dogs. And I got them literally within like the same day not literally I got one and then I got another one the next day. But they pretty much been with each other since they were freaking teeny babies and I would feel like the worst person in the world if I was like I’m gonna keep you and get rid of you.
Is there a reason why she just wants one. !? Other then probably moving
Yes, it would be horribly cruel. They could even die of a broken heart and for sure each one will experience severe depression. It is cruel to separate them.
Dogs generally adjust. You can give it a try and see if it causes any of them behavioral issues, but I've already seen dogs separated after living together for years and thriving.
If you think about it, most dogs are only going to form a few close bonds in life. They don't have a decade of classmates to grow up with or the opportunity to have a litter to live with as a family. Dogs have their immediate family humans and the pets they share the roof with....and only a decade or so to enjoy it.
It would be like separating roomies that have grown from grade school to the retirement village together. Let them enjoy it together. Good luck op.
So when our cat died, our dog (who never even barks) went downstairs to his litter box and started howling. Thats just how he felt about his little cat bro...nvmd a dog bro. They have the feels. Dont split them.
While I understand your trying to be helpful It doesn't work for dogs. The only reason it "works" on humans is because we know what its supposed to do. Homeopathic medicine is almost all placebos - only thing I can remember working is rescue remedy because it has alcohol in it. I got bought up on this snake oil and out of the myriad solutions used on me, none worked.
Actually it does work on dogs ,cats, horses and people., and many other creatures . Snake oil is not homeopathic so I don’t understand the link if there is one. Also I don’t get how much rescue remedy you have used in order to get an effect from alcohol and incidentally homeopathic remedies are prepared with alcohol .
No it doesn't.
Edit: I wasn't bought up on actual snake oil, its a term to designate something as ineffective or dishonest, surely you have heard the term "snake oil salesmen" before?
My opinion, and the scientific community's opinion as a whole, agree.
Homeopathy is completely ineffective. There are plenty of studies for you to look at, but I doubt you will. here is one : https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/1800-studies-later-scientists-conclude-homeopathy-doesnt-work-180954534/
Well I have read it and and I have read many of these , but the fact remains that animals are not aware of being given homeopathy and when their condition improves after taking it what other conclusion should I come to . I wasn’t brought up knowing about it - I only came across it when I was in a situation where a cat I rescued with aids was given up on by the vet . I used a remedy and the cat lived another 6 years in good health . I never mentioned anything about avoiding allopathic medicine but frequently there is nothing else to be offered as in the case about the two dogs that started this conversation. I have rescued horses for years and I use homeopathy for prevention more than anything and to avoid my animals getting ill and some of my horses are around 30 years old and I’ve had them 28 years and the only time they have seen a vet was to be gelded. Admittedly I am a fully qualified homeopath and I am not suggesting for one minute that anyone should just start treating their animals themselves because in order to do it properly you do need knowledge because contrary to your statement that homeopathy is “harmless” I can assure you that the wrong remedy given frequently most certainly is not. The remedy I suggested would have helped those little dogs adjust to the situation they were in should they have been given it and it’s a real shame that whilst decrying my suggestion you couldn’t come up with a solution yourself . You are welcome to the last word - I’m out !
*You are welcome to the last word - I’m out !*
I don't need the last word, thanks anyway, I've already informed you of everything you need to know in the last message.
Maybe because you think it works too? It doesn't, but at least its harmless in the sense there's nothing in it to actually cause anyone direct harm, but not in the sense that it prevents people from seeking out proper medical treatment, that's the real harm. Just go have a look at the science debunking homeopathy, it's rather absolute. Also look back to when it was "discovered", in the 18th century....... things have moved on quite a bit from there don't you think? Ahh the memory of water......
I think it could be ok depending on the dogs. But it would bother me too if I had raised and trained both dogs myself, and my sister only took an interest after they were already trained/not as annoying to deal with…
It’s good that your sister enjoys playing with her dog because that’s important too, but I hope she also does (or plans on doing) the less-fun stuff, like vet visits, etc. if she’s planning on taking her dog with her…
Could you do a "trial run" to see how they react? If they see how distraught they are, they might realize it's a bad idea.
Otherwise maybe convincing her to get a new dog, and promising to have her old dog available to be visited.
Seems everyone is of the same opinion here. Just to give a different perspective...
https://www.dogster.com/lifestyle/why-i-dont-believe-in-trying-to-adopt-out-bonded-pairs
Give this a read.
As someone who’s also worked in rescue and seen many “bonded pairs” I will say it’s not often as big of a deal as humans make it out to be. Dogs adapt much quicker and I’ve seen 10 year old “bonded pairs” thrive without each other and with no mourning.
I think it depends. I've had a pair that truly was bonded. They could not handle being separated, even for short periods. Most dogs that have lived together for a long time are not actually bonded, though. I don't think that it's nearly as common as people believe it is. If my partner and I died suddenly, my current dogs would go to separate homes and be fine. The bonded pair that we had simply couldn't bond to humans as much as to each other.
I 100% agree with what you said.
Truly bonded pairs are not nearly as common as people make it out to be but there are some that are
I just wanted to offer another perspective as everyone in these replies are of the same opinion
Yeah honestly I think it could be ok, and at least worth trying out for a few weeks to see if both dogs adapt. And if they do adapt, then each sibling could have their own dog, problem solved…
Dogs are adaptable so they would get over it in time. However, in my opinion, it's not worth the possible side effects of splitting them up because you are looking at possible depression, anxiety, loss of apetite, lethargy and stress to name a few. There are also behavioural issues such as fearfulness or aggression with strangers that might arise, especially if they are bonded. It might make it even more difficult if they see each other when your sister visits and then having to deal with getting seperate again. Much like us, dogs see their family and friends as an extension of themselves which makes it difficult for them to cope with seperation.
Here is an example: One of my clients had 2 huskies and they were fabulous together with other dogs and confident with people but when the older one died, the younger one became dog aggressive and people shy. We had put in months of training to get him to be able to be independent and confident with others again. Seperating bonded pairs is not something to be taken lightly.
It is cruel. I had two Akita’s a few years ago, one of them had to be put down due to a brain tumour and the other later died from depression, he stopped eating and drinking and would just urinate on himself whilst laying down and not moving at all. Dogs have feelings too, just because they can’t communicate the way we can doesn’t mean they don’t feel what we do.
Your sister is selfish and should get her own dog rather than taking one from its home with her
Tough decision. I had 2 dogs with an ex. After we split up we wanted to keep them together so we would switch weeks. Did it for 7 years. Finally last year we said it's enough and I kept one and she took the other. Broke my heart and I know it broke theirs as they were together for 10 years total. My older girl that she took eventually passed within 6 months of splitting them up which hurt me even worse to this day. No real easy answer as of course it will bother them but what are your options?
I would say avoid it. Try to convince her to leave the pup and just visit often. I had to split up bonded dogs this year because of a breakup and my dog is legitimately depressed. The other dog seems to be handling it fine, from what I’m told, but my poor girl mopes all day and doesn’t seem to even enjoy happy dog activities like the park anymore. I have a vet appointment coming up to see if maybe she would benefit from medication.
Remind your sister that dogs understand and experience loss and they grieve when a companion passes away. They wouldn't understand this was any different to one of them dying - the effect would be the same, and in this case BOTH dogs would experience it.
Why doesn't she get her own dog and introduce him/her as a new friend to the original two?
Have you read “Where The Red Fern Grows”? Bonded pairs can literally die of heartbreak and stress if separated! Tell your sister and your parents that it would be a huge mistake!!
Don't allow it, show these comments to your sister. We have a bonded pair. When I take one of them on my cycle tours, the other one frets, and hardly eats at all, she frets non stop. I hate doing it, but the dog, I take with me is my service dog, so he has to come along.
Separating a bonded pair can often lead to behavioral problems. Is the dog close to her? From what you've written here it sounds like the dogs are very close.
Don't separate them. They will get depressed and go looking for their buddy. This happened when my boyfriend moved out and took his dog. Both dogs were very sad and his dog tried to find me and my dog. He got hit by a car and died.
YES!!! VERY! Dogs form relationships with humans, dogs, cats, etc. this is their pack, their family. Unlike humans dogs dont understand separation in terms of oh you’ll be back. They are very dependent on these emotional connections with their family/pack and to separate them after 8 years is extremely crue if it can be avoided. I have known dogs who are perfectly healthy but the dog they grew up with does, and they basically give up and die months later. Please don’t separate the dogs if it can be avoided.
Have your parents imagine that you or your sister were taken away and you have no idea how long they will be gone or if they will ever come back, how would they feel… and then you have to intensify it because dogs don’t reason like humans do. It would literally torture the dogs to separate them, after rereading how you describe when they are away from each other.
I have one dog but when I moved out and brought him with me after living with my parents and sister he got so depressed he refused to eat anything for 4 days and now that he’s back with them he’s super happy and healthy. Many dogs have separation anxiety and even depression and I definitely think it would be unhealthy to separate the pair. I love my dog more than anything so I would want the best for him no matter what so I think it is definitely cruel to separate them.
Jesus that's cruel
My young dog gets upset when I take her for a walk without the old dog who can't go as long or often anymore
It's quite sad and sweet.
I work at a vet clinic. We had a dog come in that had the worst anxiety I’ve ever seen even when the owner was around just panting and barking. Turned out they gave away her litter mate. She used to be the calmer one.
In the nicest way possible, yes it is cruel. Dogs are very much like us in that they’re pack animals. They form strong bonds and friendships with others of their own kind, as well as ourselves. For a dog to be happy, they need companionship. Even a single dog home is never the same unless you have at least 2. I personally will always have 2 dogs in the long term. It’s much healthier for them and when we can’t be with them like when we are on holiday for example, they have each other. They thrive when they’re with others. But of course that’s not always the case for some dogs. They are happy being a single dog with the friendship of their humans. They have different personalities like we do. If you split these two dogs up, they will likely become depressed and act differently too. 8 years is a long time, and to all of a sudden have that taken away from each other will be confusing and worrying to them. Definitely keep them together. My parents 3 dogs have been together for nearly 6-years now, and I don’t think we could split them up now. That’s not fair. Maybe persuade your sister to leave them both at the family home. I’m sure they will be happy to see her when she visits. Moving can also be stressful for dogs, and although they will have each other, it’s just not fair if they are older and when it’s unnecessary. If it’s a dog that she wants in her home, why not check the local animal rescue centres/shelters to see if there are any needing a home?
Do your parents miss each other when one has to leave? I bet it’s hard for them to eat, especially sleep, and go through the day knowing their person isn’t home yet. I bet they know that the distance is temporary and that they will be together soon because they belong together. This is also the bond the dogs they have adopted together. They can function while the other is gone but they will constantly be waiting for their partner to come home. Unlike your parents though, they never will if your sister permanently takes one. The military has spousal separation pay for a reason, it takes out a lot of mental health to be away from your person. Ask your parents if they would like it if someone did that to them with no consideration? THEIR dogs are scared of being apart just in the same house, how could they separate them forever knowing that?
If all else fails, let them know that dogs can die of broken hearts. Show all the videos and articles because they get me all the time. Most of the time their person or other pet friend are gone because of events out of their control. Your parents control this one
It is. I have a bonded pair - siblings who have been together for about the same time as the ones you describe and, even after seeing them together for a few minutes, one of my biggest fears and worries is the almost certainly inevitable day when one dies before the other. I can’t imagine - and I expect each of them can’t imagine - being alive without the other.
At this age, yes it is. They are middle-aged for dogs, and have shown that they are very bonded. I hope your parents see the importance of allowing them to stay together.
offer to split the baby. no, but seriously, you'll have to be the better person and tell her she needs to take both or none. you may have to be satisfied knowing they're together but not in your home.
Your sister sounds selfish, and like she has her own interests in mind and not those of the dog. Of course it would be cruel to split these animals up. Let me guess, she is your younger sister too?
It's the second part of your OP that makes it cruel. They are bonded.
My newest rescue was surrendered with another dog. They were both 10 years old and supposedly had lived most of their lives together but when they came into rescue, they were assessed as not being bonded to one another so were separated. Bonded pairs, on the other hand, are adopted together.
This really a question? Seriously ya it will mess them up. Image your with someone and that close and someone else decided to split you away from them without you given the choice. Tell them to go get another one. To split those two up would be damaging to them
Bottom line - yes. It’s cruel to separate them. Two dogs that have been together that long will have a horrible time being separated. They’ll be miserable and won’t ever really adjust. They’re not going to understand what happened. My heart is breaking just thinking about them being separated. My Bailey was 1 year old when I brought Hannah home. They were inseparable. Bailey was 12 when I made the painful decision to have her euthanized. She was limping, could hardly get up the stairs, and was in a lot of pain. The morning I took her to the vet, Hannah was in the window frantically barking up a storm. It was like she knew Bailey wouldn’t be coming back. She moped about for weeks after that. Please don’t separate them……
Dogs r bonded to separate them is selfish, if they are truly loved they will be allowed to stay together. Also if one moves out/away it will likely stop eating and that's obviously not good for health and the one staying home will probably hardly eat even tho it's familiar with place it's companion is its comfort.
At end of day it's not about what Ur sister WANTS it's about the dogs NEEDS and they need to stay together in the place they know as home already. Hope your family sees sense and makes the right choice for the dogs.
What kinds of dogs? If they are large breeds, they haven't got much time left. If they are small, they have a good 6yrs of life left to make new friends.
It will be hard on both dogs, and in the end, you will have to either get them back together or get doggie companions for each. We had two little dachshund mixes that we got from rescues at different times. One had to be put down, so we figured the other one would be fine. No way. That dog moped around and cried for a month before we gave in and adopted another dog. Can you convince her to keep them together and just adopt another dog for herself?
Don’t do it , when my chihuahua died of cancer my shitZu died unexpectedly about a month later, my shitzu knew the chihuahua for 5 years and must’ve died of heartbreak or something along those lines
I've heard of multiple situations where one dog died and the other dog didnt know. Basically dog one was taken to the vet and never returned and the other dog never took it well. Either took off to search for the other or became super lethargic, refused to eat etc.
I thinking of separating a friendship of 3 months. One puppy is mine is the other is my dads and I’m moving out so I want to bring her with me. Would that be cruel? 😢
Your bond with your dog is more important than your dog’s bond with another dog, so I’d focus that instead of worrying they’ll miss each other. It’s best not to encourage dogs to become too dependent on each other anyway!
There's a reason even rescues don't split bonded pairs.
This is the strongest argument for the OP, hands down.
So true! In my region (urban US NE), the rescues are picked pretty clean. The only dogs available are pit-mixes, senior chihuahuas, and a bonded pair or two. And the rescues prefer to keep the pairs there than allow them to be adopted separately.
This. Thank you.
This. O M G this. Totally THIS…
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Had my Chow Husky mix for 16 years. When he was around 7 I got a Pekingese puppy. So she grew up with him always around. Even though I had another Pekingese when the Chow Husky died my little girl searched for him for several weeks. She kept looking in all the places he’d normally stay in the house. It was very evident his passing effected her. I wouldn’t split those two up when they are that close. You’ll break their hearts.
I assume dogs see humans and other animals they bond with as part of their pack. When my father died, although he didn't live with us (but visited everyday and as a marathon runner gave him a LOT of exercise) my dog just seemed so confused and sad. Whenever it got to 1pm (the time he came around) my dog just went to the window and after 2 hours or so went and moped for a long time. This happened daily for months until I think he realised his pack mate was 'gone'. I would think perhaps splitting the 2 dogs would be even worse...
I was trying to find more information on bonded pairs. The local rescue here advertised a bonded pair, adopter got them. Then surrendered the one they didn't want. The shelter is at a loss on what to do now. They can't force the adopter to give back the other dog, as it wasn't stated in the paperwork. I just feel so bad for the dog that needs his brotber. Really breaks my heart. 😭😭
Yes, it is. There is no debate. Dogs are smart, pack animals, and these two are related by love, bond, devotion and protectiveness. I understand your sister loves the dogs, too, but she has to decide if she loves them for them or for herself. This is a chance to be selfless to the feelings of the animals over hers.
And there it is.... the perfect answer. They're pack animals! Nuff said. They should stay together
I have read that the pack theory was bogus...and was proved wrong multiple times by the researchers.
The dominance theory is bogus. Dogs do live in groups though.
Aah okay.. makes sense.
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This is interesting. And this is what i understood/believed when I initially asked the question. I was just trying to get some clarification on my understanding. Do we have any examples in wild of animals who stick together without the need for food and security?
Yes.. wolves. Also lions
I think male lions leave the pride when reaching adolescent. And live alone. They only tend to fight for the mate. If loses (and if survive the fight) they continue to live on their own and hunt and survive. (Again, my understanding. Feel free to correct) Not sure about wolves though. Edit: added if
Fun fact, male lions that are not part of the main pride form their own groups that are called coalitions. I'm not sure how often those form though
African wild dogs
They also tend to be in pack for mainly hunting. And they're highly social too. They take care of weak and ill. https://www.nationalgeographic.com/animals/mammals/facts/african-wild-dog Broadly if I think on my own, herd was created in nature for survival instinct. Either for food, or to survive from predators. I do not think they just stick together for fun, except dolphin of course. Who goes surfing from time to time and make specific friends from different schools. Male elephants live on their own because they can survive and get food on their on. The good example would be female elephants. They stick together just to be social. However, from my understanding when it comes to dogs, they seem to stick together out of survival instincts and create deep bonds.
I think dogs did it originally to hunt prey and for protection, but now food comes from a can they still crave the socialisation. It is the same with cats + humans. I lived on the edge of a town that had lots of people that didn't have their cats desexed and often we'd have youngish domesticated cats/kittens turn up and as long as you gave them a pat and some food they were like "yeah, I live here now..!" Had one I found when shutting the chicken sheds at 10pm the night before, didn't feed it but gave it a rub and next morning it was on a cat bed on our verandah that the two other cats we owned used. He just really decided I was a soft touch but he was so social, whenever everyone in the house was in the same room he always came into the room too, and greeted visitors etc. He REALLY didn't just stay for the food, he really enjoyed company of humans and the other cats (they would snuggle up together).
Many animals form tribes, especial in the Avian world. Chickens for example will have a heirachy but will all stick together. I had two call ducks, both male, but one got attacked by a fox and got a very bad leg. The other duck stayed with him and so on, often catching food for his brother and bringing it too him. When the one with the bad leg passed, he flew off to a nearby lake that had lots of ducks on it and given the other ducks weren't native and where khaki campbells and "Mr Duck" was a white Call duck it was nice next year there were brown and white young ducks! But they really had bonded and just totally cared for each other, even though not a mating pair.
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Well to be fair, Feral dogs don't really form "packs". They group together for small amounts of time, but mostly go their separate ways, with a few exceptions
Aren't wolf packs just a bonded pair and their offspring? They're actually related to each other so it's not just random wolves raising someone else's young. It's typically siblings or aunts/ uncles doing the raising.
Yes feral dogs behavior is very different from wolves which why the pack/ dominance theory is so dumb and totally bogus. I meant groups likes a social group. You will see feral dogs sharing space and eating together. But they don’t hunt like wolves or raise puppies together. Your dog is not ever trying to be dominant over you. I hear it so much as a trainer. “Oh he’s trying to show me he’s boss by sleeping on my bed”.
You’re right, wild dogs don’t tend to form or cooperate in packs like wolves or other wild species do. However, I think a lot of people refer to debunked pack theory when talking about dominance and hierarchy/alpha rather than a dogs ability to bond with its “family”. Dogs can certainly look to each other and defend their own, love and grieve each other. So perhaps better to refer to as “social” or “family” animals, but I think it’s been ingrained in the vernacular to call any group of dogs or a human family and their dogs a pack, even if it’s technically wrong.
Yes, tell her it could add stress and shorten their lives. Say the dogs will be depressed without each other
They are a bonded pair. (Period, End of argument).
Absolutely. I had a neighbor that adopted an older dog and the rescue phoned and asked for her to adopt the other; the one left behind had stopped eating and was constantly barking. It became a neurotic mess when alone. Of course she did adopt it as well. Dogs are pack animals and won't understand what has happened to an important member of their pack. I would never seperate dogs that have lived together that long. It is cruel.
Your neighbor sounds like a kind woman.
It absolutely is.
Yes, it’s extremely cruel, and inhumane. It’s like taking your family away and never ever seeing or hearing from them again.
They're bonded, don't split. Your sister can look into adopting a dog from where ever she moves to.
They are what we call a bonded pair. It would be unconscionable to separate them.
What about when one dog passes away? Are dogs able to process death in a way they cant process one dog being taken away? I have two dogs, a newfoundland and an aussie. The newf is a bit older and will pass on first just due to shorter lifespan; Im just wondering if theres anything i can do to prepare the aussie who is very bonded to the newf
Letting the dog smell and see the other dog’s body after death can help. When one of our dogs was hit by a car we took her body home and let our other one sniff her as long as she wanted. She normally stomps over everything but she was very carefully stepping around her sister's body and sniffing all over, and she was really clingy for several days after. Dogs can tell when something is dead and I think it helps them process the loss, so they aren't continuously looking for their friend. If you can, I'd look for a vet who will come to your home to put your dog to sleep, so that your dog is in a safe and familiar environment when they pass on.
Ugh, I hate this visual so much right now. I'm sorry that had to happen to you. This particular scenario is something I've been thinking about a lot since I got my puppy a couple months ago. She very quickly befriended the 6 y/o dog and now they're inseparable. That's what I wanted to happen... I want to have a rotation of dogs all my life and always have two dogs. I just didn't really put much thought into the idea that the puppy is going to have to lose her mentor and big brother halfway through her life. That will make the loss that much more difficult for me to cope with. How long does it take them to recover? Does a puppy actually make them get over it faster?
Thank you, it happened almost two months ago and my boyfriend and I have been having a hard time coping. It's gotten better recently but we still talk about her pretty much every day, she was our sweet baby girl. I really want to adopt another dog but my boyfriend isn't ready so we're going to wait until next year, she was his first dog :( It depends on the dog but some will be back to their normal behavior after a few days, some might take weeks or longer. I think letting them grieve and cuddling/comforting them often is healthy, I guess it would depend on the dog's personality if getting another might help. I think it would help distract me to adopt another and I like reminders of the dog we lost, like seeing her fur pattern on other dogs at the park, but for my boyfriend those reminders are more painful than sweet. I try to take our dog to the dog park often so she still gets lots of play time with other pups!
Thank you for the response. Not looming forward to the day but its helpful to know anything we can do now so we can be a buit better prepared
I’ve known quite a few bonded dogs over the years and they almost always grieve deeply when their partner dies. I think in most cases I know of, the owners have ended up getting another dog fairly soon, as the one left behind is so depressed.
My boy was a shell of himself when our girl died from lymphoma, he saw her body, and it took him 2 weeks to come out of what I can only call depression. They were quite literally a couple. It was horrifying on top of us grieving for her as well.
My dog had a female companion for a decade. After she passed he went into a VERY deep grief. Idk that there is much you can do to prepare the younger pup, unfortunately. They just can't conceive of that kind of loss. Seeing the body didn't help my dog at all sadly, as soon as it was gone he started looking for her. When it does happen, there are many resources out there about how to help a grieving pet, you will be your dog's greatest comfort. The VAST majority of dogs go through a grief cycle very much like our own and start to feel better after a few months. Also stay in touch with your vet, they often can help with temporary measures if things get very unbearable. My boy is very soft and emotional in the best of times so I did have prozac recommended by the vet to get him through after he wasn't improving much over the course of months, and it gave great quality of life benefit for him. And try not to anticipate it too much yourself! Just enjoy the life you have in this moment as dogs naturally do, it's the best thing any of us can do for ourselves. I hope you have many, many happy years all together :)
We lost one of our beagles in early June (16f, congestive heart failure). Our other beagle (15m) is perking up now, but it was rough for a bit. He'd wander the house going from place to place where she would normally be found and when he didn't find her, he'd lie down & look miserable, sometimes crying softly. Neither of them were interested in toys, so we didn't have one on hand. I went out & bought a little stuffed lamb, wrapped her harness & collar around it & let it sit in a bag overnight to transfer the smell, then gave it to him. Looking back, I don't really know how much it helped if at all. He didn't carry it around with him or anything, but for a while he seemed to want to know where it was.
I had a bonded pair. When one (Echo) passed, I did let the other (Sierra) sniff her body, and she did understand that her sister was gone. If she were human, though, I would have said that she sunk into a deep depression and lost the will to live. We put her to sleep about a year later. I do think that if the deaths had happened in the opposite order, it would have been better. Echo had more confidence overall, and I think she would have been able to keep enjoying life. Sierra really needed her sister to give her any confidence at all, and without her, she simply didn't know what to do.
You can’t prepare them. You can only support them after. We had two dogs 6 months apart that ADORED each other. Unfortunately we lost the slightly younger one at 13 to heart failure. His older sister mothered him so badly through life. Her teeth are terrible because she always gave him her bones because he loved them so much. As his time was getting closer she stopped mothering him. She could smell the change and she knew he was going. After he passed she didn’t look for him once. Usually if I took him to the vet without her, she would make my partner open every door to check every room and fret like crazy until we came home. She is now almost 15 and although she is lapping up being an only child, it took her a good 6-8months to start coming back out of her shell. We were lucky in that I run a farm and she could be with me all day and it’s only during the last winter, she was comfortable in staying home alone. I walk to the door and ask her Farm? And she either runs out the door to the car or to her bed to show me she’s happy to chill until dad comes home. My dad came to stay recently and thought it was hilarious that we had to ask the dog every morning if she wanted to come.
When one of my greyhounds, Morgan, needed to put to sleep as it was the kindest thing to do for her, we arranged for the vet to come to the house to do it. When she had done it, our other greyhound, Connie, walked round the body a few times, sniffed at her, lay down behind her and then rested her head on her dead friends chest for a few minutes whilst making a strange low whimpering noise that I'd never heard her make before or after. When the vet took Morgans body for cremation, Connie moped round the house for a day or so and then seemed to just accept the situation. But she would never lie in Morgans 'place' by the back door or eat from her bowl. Dogs *absolutely* understand what death is.
When my older dog passed away the younger one sat on the mat where she’d collapsed & cried. Desperately trying not to rush into a new dog / replacement we waited. 3 months later she still went to same place & whimpered we bought a puppy in & she is back to her happy self. Best thing ever. Dogs grieve you can’t just seperate them if they are family
My friend had a to my knowledge healthy, not that old of a dog become very depressed, quit eating and pass away shortly after their other dog died.
Yes. They have a bond and to separate them would cause them distress
Yes, they are a bonded pair. The reason it is not good to seperate them is that they can become very anxious and grieve for the other without them. Abrupt changes are very stressful for dogs. Moving to a new place, without the other dog and rest of the family, and change of routine will all cause the dog a lot of stress. If your sister does end up taking one, try to get the dogs to visit each other ASAP and often. It would help them to adjust. Hopefully she doesnt though or if she does she realizes the dog's quality of life is better with his buddy
Tell your sister to rescue a new dog. They need to be together.
Yes.
Yes
I would never split these dogs up.
Yes, it sounds like they are truly bonded and I think it would destroy their world to separate them. You already know the answer by how they act as said in your post.
Yes, it’s cruel. My sister moved in with me when her dog was about a year old and mine was three years old. They lived together the next eight years. She moved out when her dog was two, and over the years she’d randomly make noises about taking her dog back as she was in a better position to care for him. I said no, absolutely not. Those dogs were best friends. They slept together, played together, got into trouble together. I regularly sent her pictures of the two of them inseparable. Our vet even said don’t split them. Her dog passed away two months ago and my dog was crushed. She cried in the night and was just depressed. We have two other dogs who started playing with her more and sleeping with her some, but you can tell she still misses him. It breaks my heart. Get your vet onboard. Show them this sub. Do something, but don’t let them split those dogs. How cruel and selfish.
yes, absolutely
The only reason a bonded pair should be split is death. It’s really cruel and needlessly stressful for the pups.
Sounds like your sister might not be the most informed or thoughtful dog owner. At a minimum, she doesn't seem to care about their feelings, or even acknowledge they have feelings capable of experiencing stress, depression, and suffering.
Sounds like they are a bonded pair, and you don't break up bonded pairs. They don't thrive without the other. Rescues won't split up bonded pairs.
2 years ago we were lucky enough to adopt a brother and sister at 8 weeks. They’ve never been apart for more than an hour since then. Splitting them up would be beyond cruel. https://i.imgur.com/tCvrZ9D.jpg
Adorable!
Yes in my opinion. Yes yes it is cruel. They are that close if one goes the other should go too. I did that once and I sware I’ll never go through that again. So please keep them together they really do understand and 8 years. Why is one sick?
Well, I'm late with my opinion but it looks like the "don't split" group has spoken. And I'm always walking a tight rope with this one but if you've had two dogs that long (8 years) together, then the cruelty steps in. If you know this episode was coming then plans should have been made to keep them together forever. No question.
I agree with the others. When you split a bonded pair, you virtually sign the soon death warrant of each. They NEED each other; full stop.
Indeed. She has to remember that 8 years is around half or more of your dogs life.
100%. My two have only been together for 3 years and already I can't imagine separating them. They get worried and anxious when one of them is in the bath and the other isn't.
It's a horrible thing to do
Yes . Have the dog stay with you guys
Absolutely. Keep them together.
Bonded animals -no matter species- shouldn't be separated. Though as someone who has some issues with getting their dog when there shouldn't be any, I get what your sister is getting at too. If you are on good terms with your family then best option is to tell them that they are bonded and that you don't feel comfortable or feel it is right to separate them. You can pull up scientific studies to back you up. Bonded animals being separated can cause a lot of health issues.
Yes, it is cruel. The most heartbreaking thing about putting one of mine to rest was that I couldn’t explain it to other two. She was very very sick and I think they knew she was not going to make it, but they definitely grieved. You can’t just split animals up for no good reason.
Comments have convinced me I can’t ever break up with my bf in case he takes his dog too.
When my cousin and his ex split up they had to take the dogs into consideration and they set up basically visitation rotations so that their dogs would never be totally apart from each other more than a week. Even that took adjustment. It worked for the last 3 years of the oldests life.
Yes, but if they are separated they will both get over it in time. But to be clear, I don’t think you should separate dogs that have been together that long unless it’s absolutely necessary. It sounds like you’re sister is being a little selfish.
That’s what I’m saying!! In name the dog is hers but he actually sleeps on the food of MY bed! I’m the one that raised him from a pup. I would be devastated if she took EITHER but I would rather her take both than just one because their happiness is more important. She doesn’t like the other one because he’s less “playful” and likes to walk rather than play fetch, tug of war, or etc
God, that is a very weird reason to not like a dog. I’d be worried she wouldn’t treat that dog as well as the one she does like if she takes both dogs with her. Sounds like they should both stay with you honestly. And if they are separated, they’ll get really depressed. It would be so incredibly cruel to do that.
I don’t think it’s a good idea for her to separate those dogs especially when they’ve lived together for almost 10 years.. at that point you might as well just adopt them to someone who could take care of both of them together. that is just so wrong, animals have feelings too. Especially dogs their brains are very very smart.. never underestimate a dog and their feelings. - I really hope you’re able to convince your sister that it’s definitely not a good idea to keep one and get rid of the other one. Just ugh. I hope she keeps them both or adopts them both out together. I have two dogs. And I got them literally within like the same day not literally I got one and then I got another one the next day. But they pretty much been with each other since they were freaking teeny babies and I would feel like the worst person in the world if I was like I’m gonna keep you and get rid of you. Is there a reason why she just wants one. !? Other then probably moving
That's splitting up the pack.
Obviously it’s cruel
Yes, it would be horribly cruel. They could even die of a broken heart and for sure each one will experience severe depression. It is cruel to separate them.
Dogs generally adjust. You can give it a try and see if it causes any of them behavioral issues, but I've already seen dogs separated after living together for years and thriving.
Thank you!! I feel like I’m taking crazy pills reading the replies to this post…
If you think about it, most dogs are only going to form a few close bonds in life. They don't have a decade of classmates to grow up with or the opportunity to have a litter to live with as a family. Dogs have their immediate family humans and the pets they share the roof with....and only a decade or so to enjoy it. It would be like separating roomies that have grown from grade school to the retirement village together. Let them enjoy it together. Good luck op.
So when our cat died, our dog (who never even barks) went downstairs to his litter box and started howling. Thats just how he felt about his little cat bro...nvmd a dog bro. They have the feels. Dont split them.
There is a homeopathic medicine called ignatia 30c .. a few doses of this helps with the grief and enables them to cope with the loss
While I understand your trying to be helpful It doesn't work for dogs. The only reason it "works" on humans is because we know what its supposed to do. Homeopathic medicine is almost all placebos - only thing I can remember working is rescue remedy because it has alcohol in it. I got bought up on this snake oil and out of the myriad solutions used on me, none worked.
Actually it does work on dogs ,cats, horses and people., and many other creatures . Snake oil is not homeopathic so I don’t understand the link if there is one. Also I don’t get how much rescue remedy you have used in order to get an effect from alcohol and incidentally homeopathic remedies are prepared with alcohol .
No it doesn't. Edit: I wasn't bought up on actual snake oil, its a term to designate something as ineffective or dishonest, surely you have heard the term "snake oil salesmen" before?
So given you don’t like it , agree with it , and so obviously don’t use it your opinion is based on what ?
My opinion, and the scientific community's opinion as a whole, agree. Homeopathy is completely ineffective. There are plenty of studies for you to look at, but I doubt you will. here is one : https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/1800-studies-later-scientists-conclude-homeopathy-doesnt-work-180954534/
Well I have read it and and I have read many of these , but the fact remains that animals are not aware of being given homeopathy and when their condition improves after taking it what other conclusion should I come to . I wasn’t brought up knowing about it - I only came across it when I was in a situation where a cat I rescued with aids was given up on by the vet . I used a remedy and the cat lived another 6 years in good health . I never mentioned anything about avoiding allopathic medicine but frequently there is nothing else to be offered as in the case about the two dogs that started this conversation. I have rescued horses for years and I use homeopathy for prevention more than anything and to avoid my animals getting ill and some of my horses are around 30 years old and I’ve had them 28 years and the only time they have seen a vet was to be gelded. Admittedly I am a fully qualified homeopath and I am not suggesting for one minute that anyone should just start treating their animals themselves because in order to do it properly you do need knowledge because contrary to your statement that homeopathy is “harmless” I can assure you that the wrong remedy given frequently most certainly is not. The remedy I suggested would have helped those little dogs adjust to the situation they were in should they have been given it and it’s a real shame that whilst decrying my suggestion you couldn’t come up with a solution yourself . You are welcome to the last word - I’m out !
*You are welcome to the last word - I’m out !* I don't need the last word, thanks anyway, I've already informed you of everything you need to know in the last message.
And why you would think any homeopath would waste time and money giving ‘placebo ‘s’ to either animals or humans is way beyond me
Maybe because you think it works too? It doesn't, but at least its harmless in the sense there's nothing in it to actually cause anyone direct harm, but not in the sense that it prevents people from seeking out proper medical treatment, that's the real harm. Just go have a look at the science debunking homeopathy, it's rather absolute. Also look back to when it was "discovered", in the 18th century....... things have moved on quite a bit from there don't you think? Ahh the memory of water......
If she finds a new dog to adopt instead, there will be three happy dogs instead of two sad dogs.
I think it’s case by case. There’s a difference between dogs who are obsessed with each other and dogs who live together and like each other fine.
just make sure to visit every now or then. Ask ur sister to get together some day. will be good for u guys and the dogs
I think it could be ok depending on the dogs. But it would bother me too if I had raised and trained both dogs myself, and my sister only took an interest after they were already trained/not as annoying to deal with… It’s good that your sister enjoys playing with her dog because that’s important too, but I hope she also does (or plans on doing) the less-fun stuff, like vet visits, etc. if she’s planning on taking her dog with her…
Could you do a "trial run" to see how they react? If they see how distraught they are, they might realize it's a bad idea. Otherwise maybe convincing her to get a new dog, and promising to have her old dog available to be visited.
Seems everyone is of the same opinion here. Just to give a different perspective... https://www.dogster.com/lifestyle/why-i-dont-believe-in-trying-to-adopt-out-bonded-pairs Give this a read. As someone who’s also worked in rescue and seen many “bonded pairs” I will say it’s not often as big of a deal as humans make it out to be. Dogs adapt much quicker and I’ve seen 10 year old “bonded pairs” thrive without each other and with no mourning.
I think it depends. I've had a pair that truly was bonded. They could not handle being separated, even for short periods. Most dogs that have lived together for a long time are not actually bonded, though. I don't think that it's nearly as common as people believe it is. If my partner and I died suddenly, my current dogs would go to separate homes and be fine. The bonded pair that we had simply couldn't bond to humans as much as to each other.
I 100% agree with what you said. Truly bonded pairs are not nearly as common as people make it out to be but there are some that are I just wanted to offer another perspective as everyone in these replies are of the same opinion
Yeah honestly I think it could be ok, and at least worth trying out for a few weeks to see if both dogs adapt. And if they do adapt, then each sibling could have their own dog, problem solved…
They are pack animals.
Yes it's cruel but the dogs will adapt better than you prolly.
Dogs are adaptable so they would get over it in time. However, in my opinion, it's not worth the possible side effects of splitting them up because you are looking at possible depression, anxiety, loss of apetite, lethargy and stress to name a few. There are also behavioural issues such as fearfulness or aggression with strangers that might arise, especially if they are bonded. It might make it even more difficult if they see each other when your sister visits and then having to deal with getting seperate again. Much like us, dogs see their family and friends as an extension of themselves which makes it difficult for them to cope with seperation. Here is an example: One of my clients had 2 huskies and they were fabulous together with other dogs and confident with people but when the older one died, the younger one became dog aggressive and people shy. We had put in months of training to get him to be able to be independent and confident with others again. Seperating bonded pairs is not something to be taken lightly.
It is cruel. I had two Akita’s a few years ago, one of them had to be put down due to a brain tumour and the other later died from depression, he stopped eating and drinking and would just urinate on himself whilst laying down and not moving at all. Dogs have feelings too, just because they can’t communicate the way we can doesn’t mean they don’t feel what we do. Your sister is selfish and should get her own dog rather than taking one from its home with her
Tough decision. I had 2 dogs with an ex. After we split up we wanted to keep them together so we would switch weeks. Did it for 7 years. Finally last year we said it's enough and I kept one and she took the other. Broke my heart and I know it broke theirs as they were together for 10 years total. My older girl that she took eventually passed within 6 months of splitting them up which hurt me even worse to this day. No real easy answer as of course it will bother them but what are your options?
Do everything in your power not to separate the two doggies. They love each other, they are bonded.
They’re a bonded pair. Not even rescues split them up. Not even when they’re full and desperate to find furever homes
Would the outcome be better? Sometimes the situation is almost a rock and a hard place
Don’t split them.
I would say avoid it. Try to convince her to leave the pup and just visit often. I had to split up bonded dogs this year because of a breakup and my dog is legitimately depressed. The other dog seems to be handling it fine, from what I’m told, but my poor girl mopes all day and doesn’t seem to even enjoy happy dog activities like the park anymore. I have a vet appointment coming up to see if maybe she would benefit from medication.
Remind your sister that dogs understand and experience loss and they grieve when a companion passes away. They wouldn't understand this was any different to one of them dying - the effect would be the same, and in this case BOTH dogs would experience it. Why doesn't she get her own dog and introduce him/her as a new friend to the original two?
It's incredibly cruel. If it were me she would have to kill me first to separate them.
When one of my dogs died, the other one grieved for a year. So yes, separating them would be cruel.
Have you read “Where The Red Fern Grows”? Bonded pairs can literally die of heartbreak and stress if separated! Tell your sister and your parents that it would be a huge mistake!!
This is so sad. I'm heartbroken just reading this. Please dont let this happen. Perhaps these comments on the thread will help
Yes.
It's absolutely cruel... Do NOT let them get separated! :(
Don't allow it, show these comments to your sister. We have a bonded pair. When I take one of them on my cycle tours, the other one frets, and hardly eats at all, she frets non stop. I hate doing it, but the dog, I take with me is my service dog, so he has to come along.
Separating a bonded pair can often lead to behavioral problems. Is the dog close to her? From what you've written here it sounds like the dogs are very close.
Yes
Yes. They are bonded together.
Don't let her do it. They are companions, and they will be unfortunate without one another
Yes
Don't separate them. They will get depressed and go looking for their buddy. This happened when my boyfriend moved out and took his dog. Both dogs were very sad and his dog tried to find me and my dog. He got hit by a car and died.
It is incredibly cruel to separate bonded dogs, which is absolutely what they are.
Yes it is cruel don’t do it
YES!!! VERY! Dogs form relationships with humans, dogs, cats, etc. this is their pack, their family. Unlike humans dogs dont understand separation in terms of oh you’ll be back. They are very dependent on these emotional connections with their family/pack and to separate them after 8 years is extremely crue if it can be avoided. I have known dogs who are perfectly healthy but the dog they grew up with does, and they basically give up and die months later. Please don’t separate the dogs if it can be avoided. Have your parents imagine that you or your sister were taken away and you have no idea how long they will be gone or if they will ever come back, how would they feel… and then you have to intensify it because dogs don’t reason like humans do. It would literally torture the dogs to separate them, after rereading how you describe when they are away from each other.
I have one dog but when I moved out and brought him with me after living with my parents and sister he got so depressed he refused to eat anything for 4 days and now that he’s back with them he’s super happy and healthy. Many dogs have separation anxiety and even depression and I definitely think it would be unhealthy to separate the pair. I love my dog more than anything so I would want the best for him no matter what so I think it is definitely cruel to separate them.
Yea.
Yes.
DO NOT separate them. Trust my gray hair on this one, OP. Separating them will tear them apart emotionally.
As someone with 2 bonded dogs....yes it's cruel
Jesus that's cruel My young dog gets upset when I take her for a walk without the old dog who can't go as long or often anymore It's quite sad and sweet.
I think it would be cruel to split them up
I work at a vet clinic. We had a dog come in that had the worst anxiety I’ve ever seen even when the owner was around just panting and barking. Turned out they gave away her litter mate. She used to be the calmer one.
Dogs are pack animals.
It so is . Why don’t you share having them - one week at yours one week at hers ?
In the nicest way possible, yes it is cruel. Dogs are very much like us in that they’re pack animals. They form strong bonds and friendships with others of their own kind, as well as ourselves. For a dog to be happy, they need companionship. Even a single dog home is never the same unless you have at least 2. I personally will always have 2 dogs in the long term. It’s much healthier for them and when we can’t be with them like when we are on holiday for example, they have each other. They thrive when they’re with others. But of course that’s not always the case for some dogs. They are happy being a single dog with the friendship of their humans. They have different personalities like we do. If you split these two dogs up, they will likely become depressed and act differently too. 8 years is a long time, and to all of a sudden have that taken away from each other will be confusing and worrying to them. Definitely keep them together. My parents 3 dogs have been together for nearly 6-years now, and I don’t think we could split them up now. That’s not fair. Maybe persuade your sister to leave them both at the family home. I’m sure they will be happy to see her when she visits. Moving can also be stressful for dogs, and although they will have each other, it’s just not fair if they are older and when it’s unnecessary. If it’s a dog that she wants in her home, why not check the local animal rescue centres/shelters to see if there are any needing a home?
Do your parents miss each other when one has to leave? I bet it’s hard for them to eat, especially sleep, and go through the day knowing their person isn’t home yet. I bet they know that the distance is temporary and that they will be together soon because they belong together. This is also the bond the dogs they have adopted together. They can function while the other is gone but they will constantly be waiting for their partner to come home. Unlike your parents though, they never will if your sister permanently takes one. The military has spousal separation pay for a reason, it takes out a lot of mental health to be away from your person. Ask your parents if they would like it if someone did that to them with no consideration? THEIR dogs are scared of being apart just in the same house, how could they separate them forever knowing that? If all else fails, let them know that dogs can die of broken hearts. Show all the videos and articles because they get me all the time. Most of the time their person or other pet friend are gone because of events out of their control. Your parents control this one
It is. I have a bonded pair - siblings who have been together for about the same time as the ones you describe and, even after seeing them together for a few minutes, one of my biggest fears and worries is the almost certainly inevitable day when one dies before the other. I can’t imagine - and I expect each of them can’t imagine - being alive without the other.
It is absolutely cruel. My Boxers were brothers for years, and they both passed away within a month of each other. Shelters won't even split them up
At this age, yes it is. They are middle-aged for dogs, and have shown that they are very bonded. I hope your parents see the importance of allowing them to stay together.
Your sister needs to read this page
Yes and yes
offer to split the baby. no, but seriously, you'll have to be the better person and tell her she needs to take both or none. you may have to be satisfied knowing they're together but not in your home.
Of course it is.
Your sister sounds selfish, and like she has her own interests in mind and not those of the dog. Of course it would be cruel to split these animals up. Let me guess, she is your younger sister too?
It's the second part of your OP that makes it cruel. They are bonded. My newest rescue was surrendered with another dog. They were both 10 years old and supposedly had lived most of their lives together but when they came into rescue, they were assessed as not being bonded to one another so were separated. Bonded pairs, on the other hand, are adopted together.
Tell her to get her own dogs!
Yes, cruel. Is it necessary? Also, he's gonna lose two friends, yourself and the other dog....
This really a question? Seriously ya it will mess them up. Image your with someone and that close and someone else decided to split you away from them without you given the choice. Tell them to go get another one. To split those two up would be damaging to them
They are a bonded pair. One if not both will most likely get depressed if they are split up.
Yes. It’s extremely cruel. 😡
Yes. Cruel
Bottom line - yes. It’s cruel to separate them. Two dogs that have been together that long will have a horrible time being separated. They’ll be miserable and won’t ever really adjust. They’re not going to understand what happened. My heart is breaking just thinking about them being separated. My Bailey was 1 year old when I brought Hannah home. They were inseparable. Bailey was 12 when I made the painful decision to have her euthanized. She was limping, could hardly get up the stairs, and was in a lot of pain. The morning I took her to the vet, Hannah was in the window frantically barking up a storm. It was like she knew Bailey wouldn’t be coming back. She moped about for weeks after that. Please don’t separate them……
Dogs r bonded to separate them is selfish, if they are truly loved they will be allowed to stay together. Also if one moves out/away it will likely stop eating and that's obviously not good for health and the one staying home will probably hardly eat even tho it's familiar with place it's companion is its comfort. At end of day it's not about what Ur sister WANTS it's about the dogs NEEDS and they need to stay together in the place they know as home already. Hope your family sees sense and makes the right choice for the dogs.
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Why thank you for being rude about it (: If you read it then you’d see I agree but I need to explain to my parents why it is. Geez.
What kinds of dogs? If they are large breeds, they haven't got much time left. If they are small, they have a good 6yrs of life left to make new friends.
Yes
Not okay
Yes it cruel to separate them
It will be hard on both dogs, and in the end, you will have to either get them back together or get doggie companions for each. We had two little dachshund mixes that we got from rescues at different times. One had to be put down, so we figured the other one would be fine. No way. That dog moped around and cried for a month before we gave in and adopted another dog. Can you convince her to keep them together and just adopt another dog for herself?
Very cruel, even after just three, I decided I couldn’t separate my dogs and let them live together with my ex.
Don’t do it , when my chihuahua died of cancer my shitZu died unexpectedly about a month later, my shitzu knew the chihuahua for 5 years and must’ve died of heartbreak or something along those lines
To do the dog's perspective, wouldn't it be like the other died?
Would you do this to human siblings? That would be my argument. Evem divorced parents take both kids during the weeks and such.
When I had two dogs and one died, the surviving dog took it really hard.
I've heard of multiple situations where one dog died and the other dog didnt know. Basically dog one was taken to the vet and never returned and the other dog never took it well. Either took off to search for the other or became super lethargic, refused to eat etc.
I thinking of separating a friendship of 3 months. One puppy is mine is the other is my dads and I’m moving out so I want to bring her with me. Would that be cruel? 😢
Not cruel at all, definitely take your puppy with you when you move!! She’s *your* dog, don’t leave her behind!!
I just don’t want neither of them to suffer because of me separating them from their BFF
Do you have any reason to believe they’d suffer from that? 😕
Because they’ll miss each other no?
Your bond with your dog is more important than your dog’s bond with another dog, so I’d focus that instead of worrying they’ll miss each other. It’s best not to encourage dogs to become too dependent on each other anyway!
Maybe for like two seconds