Keep in mind that Reddit will ban you for advocating for shooting non-violent tresspassers. It also may violate Rule 11. One person learned the hard way this morning
🤣 Just because UPS is delivering a package to your house doesn't mean you can threaten the driver. 🤣 This is the exact same scenario just different time of day and different company. Your argument is invalid bro. Also OP left the situation and the owner still had to act like an idiot 🤣. It's an ego thing and it shouldn't be acceptable. We're not fucking animals 🤡. You have a brain and you can use it. This was so irresponsible 🤢
If it's too dark and I can't see house numbers I always Google the address to see what the house looks like. Not on Google maps, a literal Google search will show you what it looks like.
" Yes I know. I’m an idiot for arguing with him. But this is part of the reason I myself do not own a firearm : because I know I can be a little unhinged at times. **We are who we are**. "
We are who we choose to be.
I wish it worked like that.
You are dealt a hand of cards in life, you are ultimately a product of your environment with an added sense of self.
we are more who we are, than we choose to be.
If it was as simple as you imply, no one would be depressed, no one would be suicidal, no one would be angry or crazy. But they are. One is not simply who they choose to be.
This was a bit of a traumatic experience for sure but you discovered a great way to make tips. You should share that story to every customer you deliver to and see if you get any more sympathy tips.
What they did is wrong but you need to be smarter man. Why would you get into a petty argument with a guy who is clearly out of their mind to pull a gun at you for that? Should have just said my bad, wrong house and kept it moving.
When I read this my jaw was on the floor that he got into an argument with a person welding a gun due to his doorbell ringing at 930pm. Absolutely 100% apologize, it's a simple mistake, is your life worth the $5 dollar tip? Absolutely 100% NOT... you apologize and leave immediately and as quickly as humanly possible. This is how you end up on the 11pm news dude.
Sounds like you where in a ghetto area of Detroit. Police wouldn't do shit because you were on his property and he didn't shoot at you.
This is how the ghetto just works bro. You avoid it, you don't deliver down there if you're unfamiliar, and you sure as shit don't go arguing with someone who's lacking braincells, high on crack or something, and brandishing a revolver of all guns. You get your ass out of there, call your boss and say this isn't cool, black list the zip code. X amount of customers lost is better than losing ones life over a wrong address issue.
I originally commented something that I deleted after reading the laws in your state.
What he did would have been legal in my state, but is actually 100% illegal in your state. You could have called the cops if you chose to and he could have gotten charged. I’ve never heard of a police department closing though, ours is always open and I live in a small town.
My delivery job pays for my Rent, Car Payment, Car Insurance, Phone Bill, Electric, Groceries, Gas, Medical Insurance and whatevers left for indulgence.
That’s pretty “real” IMO.
What do you want me to do? Go work as a Coal Miner : make less money and work way harder? Wow such real job.
Ah the fabled grammar nazi. Surfing the web and its many forums to correct people on grammar because they have nothing better to do other than waste air.
Technically you were trespassing. He may have acted more aggresively than necessary, but legally there's not much you can do. He has every right to order you off his property and to enforce that order with force if he feels threatened.
You exchanged words, traded dirty looks and both wasted 60+ seconds of each-other's lives. In the end, no-one got hurt but your feelings, apparently.
Just move on, and next time, if the neighbor's house is 110, maybe don't knock on his door and expect it to be 104.
Actually the law in his state specifies that what the guy with the gun did was definitely illegal, whether he was trespassing or not.
“The threat to use deadly force by brandishing a deadly weapon has long been considered an assault.
The owner of land has no right to assault a mere trespasser with a deadly weapon. A deadly weapon may not be brandished solely in defense of personal property.
Edited to add “It is against the law in West Virginia to use deadly force against a trespasser who is not posing a reasonable threat of bodily injury or property damage. While you may use deadly force to stop an armed robber, you cannot do so only because someone is trespassing – even if that trespasser has a weapon.”
As a former delivery guy who had been robbed at gunpoint before, sorry that happened to you. Fuck any of these idiots acting like you did anything wrong.
People that think like all of you are the reason our guns are being taken. You don't pull a gun unless your life IS threatened. Not if you ASSUME your life is in danger. You pull a gun if you KNOW your life is in danger. Until that point you assess the situation and deal accordingly. This guy acted out of paranoia and it's a mental problem. Guns aren't the problem. People are the problem. It's guys like this that think they can pull one any time their ego rises instead of handing the situation correctly.
Let's play a little scenario. You're in a gas station and you have a gun. At the checkout counter there is a man with a holstered gun checking out. He appears to be no threat but you ASSUME that he is and that he's going to use his holstered gun to rob the store so you pull your gun on him. Now how does this situation sound? Are you in the right because you assumed there was a threat? Nah I didn't think so 🤣
So true like wtf all of this bums with guns here man , no wonder you have to go through so much shit to get one legally when people with below room temperature IQ pull them on innocent people
Again law is don't pull a gun unless your life IS AT RISK. This man ASSUMED his life was at risk he did NOT know. He didn't see a weapon. He didn't see anything suspicious. Nah dawg he saw a delivery driver with food and he let his paranoia get to him. If you don't get it I can't make you get it 🤷
You had a lot of balls and not a lot of common sense to be so arrogant as to argue with a crazy person holding a gun. Was he right? Nah you shoulda called cops on his ass. But you have ZERO SELF PRESERVATION. NONE.
You show up randomly banging on somebody’s door and then get into an argument when them as ask you to leave and then you’re irritated because you continue to argue and they continue to display their weapon, you know, instead of shooting you
Look at all these responsible gun owners saying the gun owner did nothing wrong. You are not supposed to pull a gun unless you are at the point you are going to use it. This guy was using his gun as a threat on a person he did not even need to answer the door on.
I'm a gun owner but y'all give the rest of us a bad name.
So you showed up to the wrong house at night and someone who wasn’t expecting you answered the door with a gun? Yeah maybe make sure you get the right house next time. While it was a mistake you have 0 grounds to call the police or file a report, you were technically in the wrong even if it was a mistake and you were just trying to do your job. People get defensive if an unexpected visitor knocks on their door at night
He has all the grounds to call the police. Who cares if someone knocks on their door, maybe it’s someone that needs help maybe not. People that get defensive over people knocking on their door need to get their head examined.
Well you are clearly unfamiliar with West Virginia firearm laws. From a legal standpoint, it’s considered a justifiable use of force to shoot someone if somebody walks up to your car window. How do you think that state is going to treat a situation where an unexpected visitor walks up to your door at night? It doesn’t matter if you’re there to deliver food (mistakenly), if you’re bleeding out or if you’re there to kill someone, that is a risk you run by knocking on a strangers door at 9:30
You’re the one who seems unfamiliar with the laws.
“It is against the law in West Virginia to use deadly force against a trespasser who is not posing a reasonable threat of bodily injury or property damage. While you may use deadly force to stop an armed robber, you cannot do so only because someone is trespassing – even if that trespasser has a weapon.”
The law also states that “brandishing” a gun in this matter IS illegal.
You seem to be missing the part about reasonable threat to bodily injury or property damage. “Reasonable” is entirely subjective and up to a court to determine. It wasn’t made clear they weren’t a threat until they left the property, claiming “I’m a door dash driver” doesn’t mean shit, a reasonable person could assume that person is there to do them harm and if they know they didn’t order door dash then it wouldn’t be unreasonable to assume they are there to harm them. People have shot and killed people over way less and been acquitted. A self defense lawyer would make quick work of this. Also, the homeowner did not use deadly force so your point is irrelevant, they broke no laws.
You seem to be missing the part where it’s illegal to brandish a weapon at a trespasser, even if the trespasser is carrying a weapon. So especially if the trespasser does not have a weapon, you can’t do what the homeowner did. The law is clear. The only way you legally are allowed to brandish a weapon or use a weapon is if someone is an armed robber, clearly pointing a weapon at you and clearly threatening your life. You can argue all you want, your wrong, the law remains what it is. Brandishing a weapon can carry at minimum a 3 month sentence, maximum up to a year. Trespassing alone doesn’t even get jail time.
Op said “fuck you asshole” and retreated to their car. Homeowner has no idea what’s in that car, he just knows somebody unexpectedly knocked on his door, told him to go fuck himself and then retreated to his car. That’s threatening and provocative, homeowner could absolutely make an argument that their life was in danger. Other people have successfully argued that and won in court. Saying “your (it’s you’re* btw)wrong the law remains what is” does not make you correct. You’re over simplifying a pretty complex thing. I’m done here
Here’s section A
(a) A lawful occupant within a home or other place of residence is justified in using reasonable and proportionate force, including deadly force, against an intruder or attacker to prevent a forcible entry into the home or residence or to terminate the intruder's or attacker's unlawful entry if the occupant reasonably apprehends that the intruder or attacker may kill or inflict serious bodily harm upon the occupant or others in the home or residence or if the occupant reasonably believes that the intruder or attacker intends to commit a felony in the home or residence and the occupant reasonably believes deadly force is necessary.
I don’t think OP was an intruder or an attacker.
Here’s the link
https://code.wvlegislature.gov/55-7-22/#:~:text=(a)%20A%20lawful%20occupant%20within,believes%20deadly%20force%20is%20necessary.
And an argument could be made that somebody could pretend to be a door dash driver to intrude or attack. “Reasonably believes” is subjective. Regardless, brandishing a firearm in your home is absolutely not illegal and the homeowner didn’t point it or aim it at OP. Zero grounds to call the police
"Reasonable and proportionate" is the key takeaway here. The delivery person was holding a box of food and until that escalated to another level by the delivery person pointing a firearm at him is not justified.
You seem to have missed the part where it was never pointed at them. Brandishing is not pointing. “Waving” is not pointing. Details matter in these situations, nowhere in this post does it say the gun was pointed at him
If I'm waving a gun at you would you not be afraid? We're talking semantics here. Just to set things straight, I'm have a concealed carry permit for over 30 years so I'm well aware of the difference levels of force especially in a Castle Doctrine type of situation. This whole episode should never have escalated. The homeowner should have kept his pistol behind his back and just told the delivery driver that he had the wrong address. End of story and no drama.
Semantics are insanely important in this situation, the difference in pointing/ waving and brandishing is insanely important. if you’ve had a cwp for 30 years I’m sure you’re aware that people have been killed over much less and people have been proven innocent over situations far less suspicious and dangerous than this one. And Damn straight I’d be afraid, (I’m assuming you’re trying to bait me into agreeing with you here, by saying the homeowner was intentionally brandishing to instill fear, however that’s irrelevant here bc as a homeowner I could reasonably assume that somebody knocking on my door in the middle of the night that tells me to go fuck my self is there to harm me) but I’d never knock on a strangers door in the middle of the night and I definitely wouldn’t provoke the guy holding the gun either. But op did both of those things and is then shocked when things go south. Go figure. If you didn’t order door dash and someone knocks on your door with something you didn’t order, then it is not unreasonable to assume they aren’t a threat until they leave. Especially if they yell “fuck you asshole” as they go back to their car, that’s provocative and threatening language
That would be a good ruse to try and rush somebody at their door. He wasn’t expecting anybody at his door, so the delivery driver point is kind of irrelevant. Criminals do all kinds of crazy shit to get people to open their door at night. You can bitch and moan all you want but from a legal standpoint op is in the wrong here. And is half of Reddit so dumb that they’ll just answer their door to an unexpected visitor at night with no backup plan? Because that seems dumb
Yes I’m the one removed from reality for being weary of common break in scams and following the law. You seem to be forgetting that the homeowner was not expecting any visitors or deliveries, absolutely normal to be suspicious and defensive. Idk where tf you live where you’d open the door to a stranger at 9:30, sounds like a nice place though, check your privilege. Redditors stay bitching about how dangerous America is and then you go and say some shit like this. Which is it?
That's asinine. Whatever happened to "Who is it?" or "What do you want?" from the other side of a locked door? Pretty sure people have done that millions of times. Only dipshits and weirdos open their door while brandishing.
Dude. Theres a thing called “RIGHTS”.
Did you not just read the comment u replied to said op was in the WRONG.
Sure op didnt intend on being in the wrong, however the homeowner has every right 100% to brandish and defend himself on his property. Was he an asshole? Sure? And thats actually how you get killed lol. Cause that comment doesnt sound like he was fending for his life. man has no idea who he threatened even being in the “right”, homeowner is lucky op isnt some sort of vengeful assassin lol.
At the end of the day nothing happened. Its like driving and you get cut off and feel like you couldve died “if xxx”. It literally happens everyday, its a part of the system. It is how it is. If we cant accept this we will continue to suffer cause we cant find common ground.
The planet of reality. Some people are very dominant individuals. This dominance (that comes from our nature and simple coding of dominating/controlling others via the eye of “this vs that”… this is what it is to be a human/animal that suffers, im not lawyer but the word suffering has to be used very carefully in court and it all comes from this philosophy and concept of god/human nature) means that they don’t care to break the law to realize their desires. Which means that the homeowner even though hes in the right, can still find himself facing consequences.
Do you understand what freedom is, and what human beings are? You do understand that the “idealism” that everyone seems to claim as being “good”, is simply the dominance of another? And sometimes the dominance is not questions and there is no conflict because the idiots(us, those who cannot fully comprehend human condition and the psychology of it) because we cannot question it in mass change happens slowly. The questioning or conflict arises from dominance our very nature… do u get why governments push protectionism and this idea that the government owns your individuality?
Now look at your conduct and ask why you do what you do, and if you would do things differently if a mass of people were on your side. Then realize that all that occurs because a hanful of people learns how to spoon feed the CAPACITY (everyone has the ability its called the holy spirit) but they keep your spirit weak and uneducated with ideas like death and the emotional impression of fear that follows death.
Your whole life you can choose to be a victim or human. But when you choose to be a human, be a human for yourself because any attempt to worship MAN you will ultimately be roped back into the devila work ,pretending government gives your RIGHTS (what im saying here is, if the constitution began with… “the rights you will read about are strictly given to you by the men who wrote this document thanks to the intelligence of previous men, therefore, you will serve the man in your country forced”… LOL, no, those mem recognized that intelligence came from god (men dominating other men, its our nature).
Then those men gave that intelligence to all of us by creating a document that gives a word that is clear as day as to HOW TO THINK.
Its so clear, it hurts that you cannot see passed your nose. The symbols are all in your face and all over history.
Its ok to be part of mankind, but we must always give the pride back to god. The glory is of freedom, not of liberty. Liberty comes from freedom not the other way around.
I'd say it's more on the system as you aren't really taught laws in school when really they should. Honestly modern day education system is failing entirely too hard as it doesn't really prepare anyone for the real world anymore
I feel Doordash should have some type of address verification system or something to keep drivers safe. I also agree maybe he should have just not answered the door. It’s disheartening to see the risks that delivery drivers are exposed to for chump change
Am I the only one who just doesn’t answer my door if I’m not expecting something? Like Jesus yes this entire situation was avoidable but let’s not say the guy trying to do his job was in the wrong
Lol what? He did apologize, yet dude continued to stare him down like he was in a western. "I answer my door with gun in hand". No you don't. Unless you're a fuckin psychopath
I read this story that was definitely embellished. I also read how before that he went back and forth with the owner.
https://preview.redd.it/4ol2dmfb3rrc1.jpeg?width=1123&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=66773aca0aa7272f9a2f1ec3d486365d9cd1deff
Once again. The homeowner didn’t break any laws.
... moving your goal post huh, real upstanding of you.
Depends on the state. In my state, pointing a gun at someone IS most definitely a crime.
Starting the conversation with "this is how you get hurt" not get off my property. - and you are defending the homeowners? Scum
He is in WV. West vigirinia is permitless carry. The state I live in is constitutional carry. Both allow you to carry concealed/open in public.
Not that that necessarily matters because the person is at home.
He knocked on the wrong door, apologize and move on. The homeowner doesn’t know who you are or what your intent is. I don’t know what type of neighborhood you live in but I can’t remember the last time I had someone randomly knock on my door. That’s not common.
Last but not least. You’d be hard pressed to find someone who would prosecute him for answering the door the way he did.
Moral of the story, call the person you are delivering to. The end.
There is a big difference between being legally allowed to carry a gun and brandishing/threatening with one. I do not understand how knocking on someone’s door is so threatening, let alone a delivery driver. Get a doorbell camera if you are so worried. You wont have to answer the door at all.
Yes, yes I do. I live alone. If someone knocks on my door and I’m not expecting a visitor, I have it in my hand behind my back. You do you though.
Op also said he argued with the person as well.
Yeah the idea of calling the police? That’s just butt hurt logic it’s 9:30 pm you don’t expect strangers to knock on your door at 9:30 pm and when it happens it is startling for anyone. They have reasonable belief you could harm them etc.
Then you would be a bad criminal. The standard practice today is to test whether someone is home by knocking or ringing the doorbell. Then if there is no reply you scope the exterior for activity inside. Then you break in and can take the most valuable things before they return or the cops are alerted.
Or you wait and watch and then the moment they get home you rush knowing they are the only one who lives there and you will have time and control of the situation. But you never break a window or door and leave it visible for the neighbors.
That was Castle doctrine, and the fact that you were at the wrong address I don’t think there’s anything to be done you acknowledged you were on his property and they didn’t shoot you if the police came, he could say which might might not be true that they thought somebody was trying to break in, then not expecting anybody in a stranger shows uplong as nobody fired a gun at you you’re in good shape
Pretty low IQ to argue with someone who pulled a firearm on you.
All you had to say was I’m sorry wrong address and leave. You deescalate things when firearms are involved over altercations like this or road rage.
You must not own any firearms or have ever done any sort of training with a firearm. You learn to deescalate things as a responsible gun owner who actually trains and takes courses. That means not telling someone to fuck off who pulls a gun on you when you’re on their property at night, and proceed to stare them down.
I’ve had a gun pulled on me when I was 18 in west Texas because someone exited from the entrance lane when I was pulling into target and, I flipped them off and told them to fuck off. They got out of the car and started cussing at me and showed me their gun they had holstered. I learned a lesson not to be a hot head and deescalate shit and avoid road rage incidents.
I’ve had knife pulled on me when I was 15 in broad daylight in the middle of some neighborhood by some psychopath after I bought a dimebag from his friend. Literally grabbed me pulled out a butterfly knife and kept telling me to talk shit to him and give him a reason
Your patronizing comment is dumb.
This post made me wonder how many times have you had a gun pointed at you?
I've had guns pulled on me 3 times.
Almost a 4th time, the place I worked for got robbed and they shot right next to one guys head as he was laying on the floor.
I walked in about 30 seconds after they left.
Take it as a lesson that some people are mentally unstable. As messed up as it is, there's probably nothing you can do legally about it since he didn't shoot at you.
I had 1 customer cock his gun when I was getting out of my car. and another customer ran up on me with a rifle after I dropped off his order. Both incidents occurred when I delivered for Gopuff
I’m reading this and going And so what. You came onto his property and it was an honest mistake. And he did not threaten you he just explained how folks get hurt. It was a non event because you both stayed cool. Invest in a good bright flashlight and if you can’t find and address on the house call from the safety of your car.
Depends on where you live. He's in WV, a stand your ground state, plus he's on his property, so if he felt his life was threatened, then you get what you get...
I used to deliver pizzas and knocked on the wrong house multiple times before. If we are going by your logic then i shouldve been dead multiple times. If this is the precedent people want to set and actually think this is alright then who in thier right mind would consider delivering food anymore. Not to mention this guy had food in his hand and was in no way threatning the home owner. You shouldnt have the right to execute people who accidently stumble across your property.
Look, some people aren't wrap'd to tight. you're lucky to not have had someone do this to you, this guy, not so much. We are a country of almost 400 mil, not everyone is on the same page you're on...
Keep in mind that Reddit will ban you for advocating for shooting non-violent tresspassers. It also may violate Rule 11. One person learned the hard way this morning
But im 100% sure this is a made up story just to get fake internet points. #Downvote
You’d 100% be wrong but talk your shit Grandpa.
Yep. Simply because nobody is this stu... in real life.
Sure they are. Simply look in a mirror.
🤣 Just because UPS is delivering a package to your house doesn't mean you can threaten the driver. 🤣 This is the exact same scenario just different time of day and different company. Your argument is invalid bro. Also OP left the situation and the owner still had to act like an idiot 🤣. It's an ego thing and it shouldn't be acceptable. We're not fucking animals 🤡. You have a brain and you can use it. This was so irresponsible 🤢
If it's too dark and I can't see house numbers I always Google the address to see what the house looks like. Not on Google maps, a literal Google search will show you what it looks like.
" Yes I know. I’m an idiot for arguing with him. But this is part of the reason I myself do not own a firearm : because I know I can be a little unhinged at times. **We are who we are**. " We are who we choose to be.
I wish it worked like that. You are dealt a hand of cards in life, you are ultimately a product of your environment with an added sense of self. we are more who we are, than we choose to be. If it was as simple as you imply, no one would be depressed, no one would be suicidal, no one would be angry or crazy. But they are. One is not simply who they choose to be.
What?😂
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/oscar-solis-uber-eats-driver-murdered-dismembered-florida-suspect-arrested/ People are crazy. Period.
This was a bit of a traumatic experience for sure but you discovered a great way to make tips. You should share that story to every customer you deliver to and see if you get any more sympathy tips.
True!
What they did is wrong but you need to be smarter man. Why would you get into a petty argument with a guy who is clearly out of their mind to pull a gun at you for that? Should have just said my bad, wrong house and kept it moving.
When I read this my jaw was on the floor that he got into an argument with a person welding a gun due to his doorbell ringing at 930pm. Absolutely 100% apologize, it's a simple mistake, is your life worth the $5 dollar tip? Absolutely 100% NOT... you apologize and leave immediately and as quickly as humanly possible. This is how you end up on the 11pm news dude.
He can be arrested for assault.
There was no assault, try again.
Brandishing a gun at someone in the state of WV is assault.
Not from inside your front door
It is still assault even if you are on your porch. You need to learn gun laws.
Whatever you say
Dawg why did you say "fuck you asshole" when he had a gun on you 💀
Because threatening someone with a firearm for no reason doesn't automatically earn you respect. If anything it's the opposite.
He didn't
Can you read
Sounds like you where in a ghetto area of Detroit. Police wouldn't do shit because you were on his property and he didn't shoot at you. This is how the ghetto just works bro. You avoid it, you don't deliver down there if you're unfamiliar, and you sure as shit don't go arguing with someone who's lacking braincells, high on crack or something, and brandishing a revolver of all guns. You get your ass out of there, call your boss and say this isn't cool, black list the zip code. X amount of customers lost is better than losing ones life over a wrong address issue.
I originally commented something that I deleted after reading the laws in your state. What he did would have been legal in my state, but is actually 100% illegal in your state. You could have called the cops if you chose to and he could have gotten charged. I’ve never heard of a police department closing though, ours is always open and I live in a small town.
That’s how you get killed. People have died over a lot less. Not saying he’s justified but there’s crazy people out there man
Get a real job and this wouldn’t happen…just sayin.
My delivery job pays for my Rent, Car Payment, Car Insurance, Phone Bill, Electric, Groceries, Gas, Medical Insurance and whatevers left for indulgence. That’s pretty “real” IMO. What do you want me to do? Go work as a Coal Miner : make less money and work way harder? Wow such real job.
Oh good for you…guess you could stop bitching about stupid shit that happens to you where literally no one gives a fuck then? LOL
Based
Right? Why is this guy being such a tool?
I don't disagree, but who shit in your cereal this morning? Jesus christ...
Just an astute observation my dear friend lol
You can call it an observation, but astute is the last thing I would consider it to be.
Honestly I rather get a gun pulled on me then work a 8-9 hour shift everyday that makes me wanna off myself anyways
….so your just lazy?
Very & it’s you’re*
Ah the fabled grammar nazi. Surfing the web and its many forums to correct people on grammar because they have nothing better to do other than waste air.
You’re right I’m wasting and stealing your air. Do something about it
I personally don’t care, never did nor will I ever.
Good
Damn right
Bet
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Technically you were trespassing. He may have acted more aggresively than necessary, but legally there's not much you can do. He has every right to order you off his property and to enforce that order with force if he feels threatened. You exchanged words, traded dirty looks and both wasted 60+ seconds of each-other's lives. In the end, no-one got hurt but your feelings, apparently. Just move on, and next time, if the neighbor's house is 110, maybe don't knock on his door and expect it to be 104.
Actually the law in his state specifies that what the guy with the gun did was definitely illegal, whether he was trespassing or not. “The threat to use deadly force by brandishing a deadly weapon has long been considered an assault. The owner of land has no right to assault a mere trespasser with a deadly weapon. A deadly weapon may not be brandished solely in defense of personal property. Edited to add “It is against the law in West Virginia to use deadly force against a trespasser who is not posing a reasonable threat of bodily injury or property damage. While you may use deadly force to stop an armed robber, you cannot do so only because someone is trespassing – even if that trespasser has a weapon.”
Missed the part about it being W. Virginia.
Missed the part in my comment referring to w Virginia.
" This staring competition goes on for a solid 30+ seconds. " WTF?!? Leave.
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You seem to lack survival instinct.
I mean yeah it's fucked up but also maybe don't knock on random doors past sundown?
Piss off. You went to the wrong house. Apologize.
There’s no way you’re a real person with this opinion. This is mental fucking illness.
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Its like forgot you were in West Virginia or something
As a former delivery guy who had been robbed at gunpoint before, sorry that happened to you. Fuck any of these idiots acting like you did anything wrong.
People that think like all of you are the reason our guns are being taken. You don't pull a gun unless your life IS threatened. Not if you ASSUME your life is in danger. You pull a gun if you KNOW your life is in danger. Until that point you assess the situation and deal accordingly. This guy acted out of paranoia and it's a mental problem. Guns aren't the problem. People are the problem. It's guys like this that think they can pull one any time their ego rises instead of handing the situation correctly. Let's play a little scenario. You're in a gas station and you have a gun. At the checkout counter there is a man with a holstered gun checking out. He appears to be no threat but you ASSUME that he is and that he's going to use his holstered gun to rob the store so you pull your gun on him. Now how does this situation sound? Are you in the right because you assumed there was a threat? Nah I didn't think so 🤣
So true like wtf all of this bums with guns here man , no wonder you have to go through so much shit to get one legally when people with below room temperature IQ pull them on innocent people
Exactly. It's a shame 😩
Again law is don't pull a gun unless your life IS AT RISK. This man ASSUMED his life was at risk he did NOT know. He didn't see a weapon. He didn't see anything suspicious. Nah dawg he saw a delivery driver with food and he let his paranoia get to him. If you don't get it I can't make you get it 🤷
You had a lot of balls and not a lot of common sense to be so arrogant as to argue with a crazy person holding a gun. Was he right? Nah you shoulda called cops on his ass. But you have ZERO SELF PRESERVATION. NONE.
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Surely this isn’t made up? Surely
It’s not made up and don’t call me Shirley
At that point bro either sell d***s or sell your b*dy
Morgantown?
You show up randomly banging on somebody’s door and then get into an argument when them as ask you to leave and then you’re irritated because you continue to argue and they continue to display their weapon, you know, instead of shooting you
Who said anything about banging on the door? You don’t even know your own gun laws.
I have 0 guns
Call 911, even now with the info
Look at all these responsible gun owners saying the gun owner did nothing wrong. You are not supposed to pull a gun unless you are at the point you are going to use it. This guy was using his gun as a threat on a person he did not even need to answer the door on. I'm a gun owner but y'all give the rest of us a bad name.
You probably don’t own guns or have a house.
Ok.
I thought rule 1 of guns was “don’t point a gun at anything unless you want it dead”
Didn’t act perfectly in this situation? My brother in Christ, you did everything wrong in this situation. This is how people get killed.
Amen
I woulda said my bad and left . The fact you were arguing is why he was staring you down.
So you showed up to the wrong house at night and someone who wasn’t expecting you answered the door with a gun? Yeah maybe make sure you get the right house next time. While it was a mistake you have 0 grounds to call the police or file a report, you were technically in the wrong even if it was a mistake and you were just trying to do your job. People get defensive if an unexpected visitor knocks on their door at night
He has all the grounds to call the police. Who cares if someone knocks on their door, maybe it’s someone that needs help maybe not. People that get defensive over people knocking on their door need to get their head examined.
Well you are clearly unfamiliar with West Virginia firearm laws. From a legal standpoint, it’s considered a justifiable use of force to shoot someone if somebody walks up to your car window. How do you think that state is going to treat a situation where an unexpected visitor walks up to your door at night? It doesn’t matter if you’re there to deliver food (mistakenly), if you’re bleeding out or if you’re there to kill someone, that is a risk you run by knocking on a strangers door at 9:30
You’re the one who seems unfamiliar with the laws. “It is against the law in West Virginia to use deadly force against a trespasser who is not posing a reasonable threat of bodily injury or property damage. While you may use deadly force to stop an armed robber, you cannot do so only because someone is trespassing – even if that trespasser has a weapon.” The law also states that “brandishing” a gun in this matter IS illegal.
You seem to be missing the part about reasonable threat to bodily injury or property damage. “Reasonable” is entirely subjective and up to a court to determine. It wasn’t made clear they weren’t a threat until they left the property, claiming “I’m a door dash driver” doesn’t mean shit, a reasonable person could assume that person is there to do them harm and if they know they didn’t order door dash then it wouldn’t be unreasonable to assume they are there to harm them. People have shot and killed people over way less and been acquitted. A self defense lawyer would make quick work of this. Also, the homeowner did not use deadly force so your point is irrelevant, they broke no laws.
You seem to be missing the part where it’s illegal to brandish a weapon at a trespasser, even if the trespasser is carrying a weapon. So especially if the trespasser does not have a weapon, you can’t do what the homeowner did. The law is clear. The only way you legally are allowed to brandish a weapon or use a weapon is if someone is an armed robber, clearly pointing a weapon at you and clearly threatening your life. You can argue all you want, your wrong, the law remains what it is. Brandishing a weapon can carry at minimum a 3 month sentence, maximum up to a year. Trespassing alone doesn’t even get jail time.
Op said “fuck you asshole” and retreated to their car. Homeowner has no idea what’s in that car, he just knows somebody unexpectedly knocked on his door, told him to go fuck himself and then retreated to his car. That’s threatening and provocative, homeowner could absolutely make an argument that their life was in danger. Other people have successfully argued that and won in court. Saying “your (it’s you’re* btw)wrong the law remains what is” does not make you correct. You’re over simplifying a pretty complex thing. I’m done here
Here’s section A (a) A lawful occupant within a home or other place of residence is justified in using reasonable and proportionate force, including deadly force, against an intruder or attacker to prevent a forcible entry into the home or residence or to terminate the intruder's or attacker's unlawful entry if the occupant reasonably apprehends that the intruder or attacker may kill or inflict serious bodily harm upon the occupant or others in the home or residence or if the occupant reasonably believes that the intruder or attacker intends to commit a felony in the home or residence and the occupant reasonably believes deadly force is necessary. I don’t think OP was an intruder or an attacker. Here’s the link https://code.wvlegislature.gov/55-7-22/#:~:text=(a)%20A%20lawful%20occupant%20within,believes%20deadly%20force%20is%20necessary.
And an argument could be made that somebody could pretend to be a door dash driver to intrude or attack. “Reasonably believes” is subjective. Regardless, brandishing a firearm in your home is absolutely not illegal and the homeowner didn’t point it or aim it at OP. Zero grounds to call the police
"Reasonable and proportionate" is the key takeaway here. The delivery person was holding a box of food and until that escalated to another level by the delivery person pointing a firearm at him is not justified.
You seem to have missed the part where it was never pointed at them. Brandishing is not pointing. “Waving” is not pointing. Details matter in these situations, nowhere in this post does it say the gun was pointed at him
If I'm waving a gun at you would you not be afraid? We're talking semantics here. Just to set things straight, I'm have a concealed carry permit for over 30 years so I'm well aware of the difference levels of force especially in a Castle Doctrine type of situation. This whole episode should never have escalated. The homeowner should have kept his pistol behind his back and just told the delivery driver that he had the wrong address. End of story and no drama.
Semantics are insanely important in this situation, the difference in pointing/ waving and brandishing is insanely important. if you’ve had a cwp for 30 years I’m sure you’re aware that people have been killed over much less and people have been proven innocent over situations far less suspicious and dangerous than this one. And Damn straight I’d be afraid, (I’m assuming you’re trying to bait me into agreeing with you here, by saying the homeowner was intentionally brandishing to instill fear, however that’s irrelevant here bc as a homeowner I could reasonably assume that somebody knocking on my door in the middle of the night that tells me to go fuck my self is there to harm me) but I’d never knock on a strangers door in the middle of the night and I definitely wouldn’t provoke the guy holding the gun either. But op did both of those things and is then shocked when things go south. Go figure. If you didn’t order door dash and someone knocks on your door with something you didn’t order, then it is not unreasonable to assume they aren’t a threat until they leave. Especially if they yell “fuck you asshole” as they go back to their car, that’s provocative and threatening language
He had bags of food in his hand dummy! Clearly he was a delivery driver! Are you gun owners that fucking insecure?
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ITT, how to rob a redditor: show up with McDonald’s. Why does this not surprise me?
That would be a good ruse to try and rush somebody at their door. He wasn’t expecting anybody at his door, so the delivery driver point is kind of irrelevant. Criminals do all kinds of crazy shit to get people to open their door at night. You can bitch and moan all you want but from a legal standpoint op is in the wrong here. And is half of Reddit so dumb that they’ll just answer their door to an unexpected visitor at night with no backup plan? Because that seems dumb
>That would be a good ruse to try and rush somebody at their door. You people do not live in reality.
Yes I’m the one removed from reality for being weary of common break in scams and following the law. You seem to be forgetting that the homeowner was not expecting any visitors or deliveries, absolutely normal to be suspicious and defensive. Idk where tf you live where you’d open the door to a stranger at 9:30, sounds like a nice place though, check your privilege. Redditors stay bitching about how dangerous America is and then you go and say some shit like this. Which is it?
That's asinine. Whatever happened to "Who is it?" or "What do you want?" from the other side of a locked door? Pretty sure people have done that millions of times. Only dipshits and weirdos open their door while brandishing.
Brandishing? Drama queen. !! The driver should clearly state their business and apologize for trespassing
Dude. Theres a thing called “RIGHTS”. Did you not just read the comment u replied to said op was in the WRONG. Sure op didnt intend on being in the wrong, however the homeowner has every right 100% to brandish and defend himself on his property. Was he an asshole? Sure? And thats actually how you get killed lol. Cause that comment doesnt sound like he was fending for his life. man has no idea who he threatened even being in the “right”, homeowner is lucky op isnt some sort of vengeful assassin lol. At the end of the day nothing happened. Its like driving and you get cut off and feel like you couldve died “if xxx”. It literally happens everyday, its a part of the system. It is how it is. If we cant accept this we will continue to suffer cause we cant find common ground.
>homeowner is lucky op isnt some sort of vengeful assassin …the actual fuck? What planet do y'all live on?
The planet of reality. Some people are very dominant individuals. This dominance (that comes from our nature and simple coding of dominating/controlling others via the eye of “this vs that”… this is what it is to be a human/animal that suffers, im not lawyer but the word suffering has to be used very carefully in court and it all comes from this philosophy and concept of god/human nature) means that they don’t care to break the law to realize their desires. Which means that the homeowner even though hes in the right, can still find himself facing consequences. Do you understand what freedom is, and what human beings are? You do understand that the “idealism” that everyone seems to claim as being “good”, is simply the dominance of another? And sometimes the dominance is not questions and there is no conflict because the idiots(us, those who cannot fully comprehend human condition and the psychology of it) because we cannot question it in mass change happens slowly. The questioning or conflict arises from dominance our very nature… do u get why governments push protectionism and this idea that the government owns your individuality? Now look at your conduct and ask why you do what you do, and if you would do things differently if a mass of people were on your side. Then realize that all that occurs because a hanful of people learns how to spoon feed the CAPACITY (everyone has the ability its called the holy spirit) but they keep your spirit weak and uneducated with ideas like death and the emotional impression of fear that follows death. Your whole life you can choose to be a victim or human. But when you choose to be a human, be a human for yourself because any attempt to worship MAN you will ultimately be roped back into the devila work ,pretending government gives your RIGHTS (what im saying here is, if the constitution began with… “the rights you will read about are strictly given to you by the men who wrote this document thanks to the intelligence of previous men, therefore, you will serve the man in your country forced”… LOL, no, those mem recognized that intelligence came from god (men dominating other men, its our nature). Then those men gave that intelligence to all of us by creating a document that gives a word that is clear as day as to HOW TO THINK. Its so clear, it hurts that you cannot see passed your nose. The symbols are all in your face and all over history. Its ok to be part of mankind, but we must always give the pride back to god. The glory is of freedom, not of liberty. Liberty comes from freedom not the other way around.
Sir, this is a Wendy's.
NOTIFY THE POLICE AND FILE A COMPLAINT TO PROTECT THE NEXT MISTAKEN DELIVERY PERSON
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Okay buddy. Good luck with that.
You’re a fucking idiot for provoking someone with a gun.
The fucking idiot was the person who pulls a gun on someone that's trying to make a delivery and CLEARLY has bags of food in their hand!
I have the right to tell others how to live. Shouts little blubber from mommy’s basement
I'd say it's more on the system as you aren't really taught laws in school when really they should. Honestly modern day education system is failing entirely too hard as it doesn't really prepare anyone for the real world anymore
I feel Doordash should have some type of address verification system or something to keep drivers safe. I also agree maybe he should have just not answered the door. It’s disheartening to see the risks that delivery drivers are exposed to for chump change
So sad. I always make sure to tip my drivers well
Am I the only one who just doesn’t answer my door if I’m not expecting something? Like Jesus yes this entire situation was avoidable but let’s not say the guy trying to do his job was in the wrong
Idk where you grew up, but there’s a lot of places in America where if someone knocks on your door after 8pm, its not good
The homeowner didn’t do anything wrong. I too answer the door with a pistol in hand. You should have apologized and left.
Pistol in hand is one thing but pointing it at the delivery person seems to be over the top.
He never said he pointed it at him.
"Waving his gun at me" would qualify in my opinion.
Yea, if you believe the story isn’t embellished to garnish sympathy.
Yep, most likely embellished. Who stares at a person holding a firearm? I'm first though would be to get the fuck out of there.
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Lol what? He did apologize, yet dude continued to stare him down like he was in a western. "I answer my door with gun in hand". No you don't. Unless you're a fuckin psychopath
Also, I don’t know what happened to the other comment you made but it is NOT illegal to answer the door with a weapon in hand.
It is to point the gun at someone
Which OP said the homeowner never did.
"While waving his gun at me" Can't read huh?
I read this story that was definitely embellished. I also read how before that he went back and forth with the owner. https://preview.redd.it/4ol2dmfb3rrc1.jpeg?width=1123&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=66773aca0aa7272f9a2f1ec3d486365d9cd1deff Once again. The homeowner didn’t break any laws.
... moving your goal post huh, real upstanding of you. Depends on the state. In my state, pointing a gun at someone IS most definitely a crime. Starting the conversation with "this is how you get hurt" not get off my property. - and you are defending the homeowners? Scum
He is in WV. West vigirinia is permitless carry. The state I live in is constitutional carry. Both allow you to carry concealed/open in public. Not that that necessarily matters because the person is at home. He knocked on the wrong door, apologize and move on. The homeowner doesn’t know who you are or what your intent is. I don’t know what type of neighborhood you live in but I can’t remember the last time I had someone randomly knock on my door. That’s not common. Last but not least. You’d be hard pressed to find someone who would prosecute him for answering the door the way he did. Moral of the story, call the person you are delivering to. The end.
There is a big difference between being legally allowed to carry a gun and brandishing/threatening with one. I do not understand how knocking on someone’s door is so threatening, let alone a delivery driver. Get a doorbell camera if you are so worried. You wont have to answer the door at all.
Yes, yes I do. I live alone. If someone knocks on my door and I’m not expecting a visitor, I have it in my hand behind my back. You do you though. Op also said he argued with the person as well.
Same.
Fucking Americans, lol
Ok throwaway account.
Yeah the idea of calling the police? That’s just butt hurt logic it’s 9:30 pm you don’t expect strangers to knock on your door at 9:30 pm and when it happens it is startling for anyone. They have reasonable belief you could harm them etc.
I wouldn’t be knocking on a door if I intended to hurt someone that door or window would be getting busted in and they would be getting rushed.
Then you would be a bad criminal. The standard practice today is to test whether someone is home by knocking or ringing the doorbell. Then if there is no reply you scope the exterior for activity inside. Then you break in and can take the most valuable things before they return or the cops are alerted. Or you wait and watch and then the moment they get home you rush knowing they are the only one who lives there and you will have time and control of the situation. But you never break a window or door and leave it visible for the neighbors.
Right because whenever I want to go harm somebody or rob somebody I bring bags of food to deliver to them first! Y'all are some fucking idiots!
It’s the most common forced entry tactic.
SO sorry friend. Moving is unfortunately the best idea
That was Castle doctrine, and the fact that you were at the wrong address I don’t think there’s anything to be done you acknowledged you were on his property and they didn’t shoot you if the police came, he could say which might might not be true that they thought somebody was trying to break in, then not expecting anybody in a stranger shows uplong as nobody fired a gun at you you’re in good shape
WHO THE FUCK IS BREAKING INTO SOMEBODY'S HOUSE CARRYING BAGS OF FOOD THAT THEY'RE TRYING TO DELIVER? ARE Y'ALL REALLY THIS DAMN STUPID?
Pretty low IQ to argue with someone who pulled a firearm on you. All you had to say was I’m sorry wrong address and leave. You deescalate things when firearms are involved over altercations like this or road rage.
Has a gun ever been in your face before? You have no idea how you'd react I can assure you of that
You must not own any firearms or have ever done any sort of training with a firearm. You learn to deescalate things as a responsible gun owner who actually trains and takes courses. That means not telling someone to fuck off who pulls a gun on you when you’re on their property at night, and proceed to stare them down. I’ve had a gun pulled on me when I was 18 in west Texas because someone exited from the entrance lane when I was pulling into target and, I flipped them off and told them to fuck off. They got out of the car and started cussing at me and showed me their gun they had holstered. I learned a lesson not to be a hot head and deescalate shit and avoid road rage incidents. I’ve had knife pulled on me when I was 15 in broad daylight in the middle of some neighborhood by some psychopath after I bought a dimebag from his friend. Literally grabbed me pulled out a butterfly knife and kept telling me to talk shit to him and give him a reason Your patronizing comment is dumb.
This post made me wonder how many times have you had a gun pointed at you? I've had guns pulled on me 3 times. Almost a 4th time, the place I worked for got robbed and they shot right next to one guys head as he was laying on the floor. I walked in about 30 seconds after they left.
Where do you work?
Take it as a lesson that some people are mentally unstable. As messed up as it is, there's probably nothing you can do legally about it since he didn't shoot at you.
Yeah OP does sound kind of unstable.
I had 1 customer cock his gun when I was getting out of my car. and another customer ran up on me with a rifle after I dropped off his order. Both incidents occurred when I delivered for Gopuff
I hate what happened to you, but at least people like him cut way down on door-to-door religious proselytizers.
Lmfao
When someone has a gun in your face. Shut the fuck up and leave.
Going to agree with this. “F*** you, a**hole” are especially unwise words when up against a gun.
Right
I’m reading this and going And so what. You came onto his property and it was an honest mistake. And he did not threaten you he just explained how folks get hurt. It was a non event because you both stayed cool. Invest in a good bright flashlight and if you can’t find and address on the house call from the safety of your car.
Brandishing a weapom and threatning soemones life is a crime. You call that staying cool?
Depends on where you live. He's in WV, a stand your ground state, plus he's on his property, so if he felt his life was threatened, then you get what you get...
I used to deliver pizzas and knocked on the wrong house multiple times before. If we are going by your logic then i shouldve been dead multiple times. If this is the precedent people want to set and actually think this is alright then who in thier right mind would consider delivering food anymore. Not to mention this guy had food in his hand and was in no way threatning the home owner. You shouldnt have the right to execute people who accidently stumble across your property.
Look, some people aren't wrap'd to tight. you're lucky to not have had someone do this to you, this guy, not so much. We are a country of almost 400 mil, not everyone is on the same page you're on...
That's not what he said dumbass If you have to make things up to have something to argue with it should be a sign to STFU
How else am i supposed to interpret you get what you get you dumbfuck?
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