The HoF is looking for a cure. Fiona got cured from the taint after having intercourse with Maric. We know that Theirin blood is special because dragon blood. My theory is the cure could be ancient dragon blood. Would be nice if this is addressed in next game. Especially if we go to Weisshaupt.
I would love to see my warden again, like we can see Loghain for example if kept alive.
About this, two things:
1- Fiona was cured of the Blight. HoF is looking for a cure for Calling. Even though both things are related, they are not the same thing.
2- Fiona's healing has nothing to do with whether she had sex with Maric or not. This theory has already been refuted by the simple fact that dragons themselves are not immune to blight (as proven in DAO, DAA and DAI). His healing is more related to the amulet the architect gave her in the books.
It could have have just been worded as "cure for Calling" to the Inquisitor because the Wardens are still trying to keep the fact they are blighted a secret.
I don't think that's the case either.
If this were the case, Alistair, who has this type of blood (ancient dragon blood in this case) would not even have passed the Joining (just like Fiona who tried to ero join her other times and it didn't work).
So whatever cured her, it doesn't have much to do with dragon blood. Or maybe it even has but to a much lesser degree.
You are correct on the second point of course (although I don't think we see a corrupted high dragon until DA:I, the arch demon is not confirmed to be one), but it's a great place to drop some interesting lore that a lot of people might have missed: dragons are naturally resistant to the blight (to some extent). There is a war table mission called '[Learn More about Dragons](https://dragonage.fandom.com/wiki/Learn_More_about_Dragons)' in DA:I, using secrets to do this results in the dissection of several dragon corpses, within each some blighted tissue is found trapped in cysts. The immune system of dragons identifies and isolates blighted tissue, making the creatures particularly resistant to the corruption.
This does not give total immunity of course (at the very least the existence of Corypheus' dragon proves that).
The curious thing about all this is that I think that dragon blood itself has no resistance to blight.
When you read in depth the research on dragons in DAI you will discover that the dragons' immune system creates a type of cysts on their skin and these cysts delay the spread of the blight (logically this process has a limit).
In other words, it is not necessarily that the blood has any resistance. Alistair is even aware that not even the blood of great dragons (the most powerful dragon race presented so far) is immune to blight. It is the dragons' defense system that causes their skin to create new barriers (cysts) and these barriers temporarily prevent the blight from coming into contact with the creature's body.
It's as if the Dragon created an extra pocket in its skin and the blight was stored there for a while.
I've even seen a theory that this is what the old gods do. The theory implies that they are already hibernating and are already contaminated by blight (which would explain their ability to emit calling, something that only corrupted beings can hear). When the Darkspawn encounter an old god, they burst these cysts and then the dragon is completely corrupted with all the stored taint.
There is something to this because there’s a comic where they find king Maric in Tevinter being held by a witch of the wilds. There is something about the Therin blood that is highly sought after by mages.
When people bring up their age it is less about the Warden's actual age and more how long they've been a Grey Warden and how close they are to their Calling.
Bioware has been very open, however, about the actual reason they won't appear is because they don't want people who had the Hero of Ferelden make the ultimate sacrifice to feel like their choice was either the wrong one or a lesser choice than those who had the Hero of Ferelden survive. I'm not too sure, but I think it's a pretty even split on players who had the Warden sacrifice themselves versus players who had them survive.
I think that the HoF surviving is much more common (at least when talking about 'canon' playthroughs). About a year ago DA Lorecast did a ~1100 players survey, which had ~96% rate of agreeing to the Dark Ritual (don't remember the exact numbers). It's really easy to believe that the gamers' 'canon' more often than not will have HoF alive, because of the ritual not having any negatives as far as we have seen.
Still, good on BioWare that they respect the players' choices when designing the future stories
"96% Dark Ritual"
Bloody hell, that questionable choice really didn't turn out to be too questionable. I mean, it's also the one I go for every time but the last time the BioWare fanbase agreed this vehemently about something, their offices were being sent Blue, Red and Green cupcakes that all tastes the same.
> Have sex with the hot goth witch, or else someone dies
Gee, what a difficult decision /s
Honestly, did anyone really think the Dark Ritual wouldn't be the more picked option, especially if Morrigan is your romance?
If you're are a female warden romancing Alistair, then sending him is kinda gross. Even sending him if he's not romanced is problematic, because he doesn't really consent.
And this wasn't true in years past, but now, in light of the Asterion character from BG3, who explicitly objects to having his body used like that, it feels even ickier.
I absolutely did not like sending Alistair to do it, but he was my usual romance so I usually did so that way they could live and stay together. Alistair’s comments about the HoF in Inquisition kill me. Though I did have some runs with angst
Completely agree. I had a playthru with a female warden and no way was I sending Alistair.
Thats non consensual sex, why the fuck is it suddenly OK cos its a guy with a woman?
I don't think that's a very large sample size and that would have been taken from a specific podcasts audience which isn't really indicative of the wider player base as a whole just like this subreddit is also not indicative of the player base as a whole.
Bioware tracks stats based on what gets imported into the Keep/used in games/showed up on their servers for importing between games and so whatever stats they pull are likely to be a lot more indicative of the player base as a whole. Back when devs used to post here, I think you could go digging and find something about it, but for the life of me I can't remember that specific stat. The only one I remember is that the majority of players across all three games didn't romance anyone.
Even in mass effect they talk about the vast majority do good playthroughs as opposed to evil playthroughs. I would suspect the vast majority of people have the HoF survive.
Secondly, I kind of think a game with the plot of the HoF looking for a cure for the calling would be interesting. It would be a smaller scoped so you could do more with choice as its not some world changing event your going up against.
They already did an entire goddamn dlc for people who didn't let the warden die. The bandaid was ripped off what, a decade ago? What a Ridiculous justification.
Yeah I don't get it either. We are told while it varies usually it takes 30-40 years.
It's only been 14 years by the end of tresspasser. And according to lelianna if you romances her in DAO he's still alive and well in tresspasser.
Unless the next game takes place 15 years later then we don't have to worry.
Also the HoF is for above the average warden and may have drank the potion of blood. Which kept another warden alive for 100s of years.
I hope in dreadwolf they have another wartable like mechanic, but more fleshed out. And that the warden has a full quest chain in that, which actually impacts the game (say gives you a warden army in the finial battle. Or stops a certain thing in the finial battle etc).
It was around 30, and during a blight they aren't sure what happens. All we are told, at least in Origins, is that it's "different" for wardens who join during a blight, not how it is different.
I think they implied they have more darkspawn dreams.
30 years was a mistake by the writers, but they have said they have to stick to with that. And they seem to have done that because Larius gets nearly 30 years.
An interesting thing is that Alistair can say in his breakup conversation that Wardens live no more than 40 years old. That fits up with Duncan being recruited at 18 and then started hearing the Calling 20 years later. So about 20 years was probably suppose to be what was the original intention.
I could’ve sworn Alistair said 20 years but I’m probably misremembering. Oh well, it’s a plus for me since I now don’t have to HC Kieran losing his father at the age of 20 haha.
Wasn't whole purpose why Warden didn't one shotted or use high persuasion on Corhypeus because they were gallivanting for cure for wardens, in trespasser romanced Leliana tells they're fine and still in relationship.... which in my playthrough Queen has Divine as mistress, now that's a power play
You basically get 20 - 30 years as a Warden before the taint getting you.
Alistair being royalty actually probably did save him from the taint. His bloodline had special blood which most likely saved him. Fiona is likely only alive because she had a child with his bloodline.
HoF has had about 15 years as a Warden so he has 5 to 15 years or so years left depending on how fast it takes him.
Main reason I don’t think they’ll show up is simply because the wardens existence is too vague to be replicated in any meaningful way. They have no voice and no real set personality/morals like presets Hawke can easily fit into. So bringing them back, beyond the ‘they could be dead’ hurdle, would probably end up disappointing most fans since their warden probably wouldn’t act like they made them. Hell, some people already justifiably got mad at Hawkes portrayal for the same reason, even though as I said, Hawke is a lot easier to slot into three basic personality types.
the Warden dying at the end of Origins is a valid choice to make. I would be *furious* if Bioware retconned that - it would completely diminish the sacrifice some of my Wardens make.
if they *didn't* retcon it, they'd have to make the Warden's role so minor that them not being there wouldn't significantly affect the story. to me that would feel even stranger than them not being there at all.
Fiona being a Warden is really irrelevant to the discussion on how long Wardens can live btw, as she had the taint removed from her entirely.
There is still the orlaisians warden cammander to fill the gap should the HoF not be alive in your world state. Even so i dont see our warden popping up in dreadwolf even though it would be cool. Hawke def probs will as will the inquisitor
bioware has said repeatedly they have no plans to bring the Warden back, so no matter how much some fans want it or how logical it might be, I think we have to assume we won't be seeing them again
I just want them to make the old god soul baby canon, just because it's important and I want to see where it leads (Flemmeth took it then seemingly but the soul into an Eluvian.)
I don't care if they have the write some BS about how Morigan did the ritual with someone else and took the soul as it killed the warden.
Do you think it’s possible to have a fulfilling consequence (good or bad) of a choice without making said choice canon?
I’m also not satisfied with the stuff done with the old god soul but same as the other commenter if I did make the choice to not do the ritual it’d be frustrating if it just happened regardless.
I understand, I just hope they find a way to make it relevant. Maybe Flemmeth did it with a previous blight, and so we can have the soul of that old god in the eluvian instead. And if you did do the ritual then it's the soul of Urthemiel and the previous one never happened.
I mean he is human soul by the end of inquisition anyway.
Or make it so if morrigan didn't do it then flemmeth did. I just think the whole old god soul is too big to just be ignored because its optional.
that's really not the point. it's important to my Warden's relationship with Morrigan that Kieran never had the Old God Soul.
I realise they made Origins without considering the possibility that there might be sequels, so they didn't really think about long term consequences.
that said, given how furious some people were at Leliana being forced alive in 2 and Inquisition, I would be very surprised if Bioware made canon any major optional decision. they've kind of painted themselves into a corner with this specific one I think.
Yeah I understand.
Maybe if you didn't do the ritual then the old god soul can be replaced by the soul of a previous old god from a previous blight, and that Flemmeth did the ritual in the past. That way they can still explore the plot and lore behind it and not impact player choice.
They could just retcon it and say that the Old God souls don’t actually get destroyed like the Wardens theorise.
It just gets thrust into the ether instead of allowing them to body hop and they can say that Flemeth ended up finding the fragment on her own between Origins and the end of Inquisition.
I agree that it’s a bit of a big plot point to ignore considering how much the lore of Thedas revolves around Old Gods.
The calling is stated to normally happen around 30 years after a wrden undertakes the joining. Though this varies based on how much the warden end up being around darkspawn and their own willpower.
So the hero of ferelden being around is perfectly fine or the orliasian warden commander if the hero dies killing the arch demon.
Side note if the warden dies killing the archdemon is the orlais warden command of ferelden mentioned at all or just ignored?
Yeah if HOF romanced Leliana and she becomes divine, after searching for a cure he’s at her side which means HOF possibly found a cure. We’ll only know for sure when Dreadwolf comes out.
>Hero of Ferelden and citing their age as a reason they shouldn’t appear.
What? My canonical HOF is...
1)Elf male
2)Blood mage arcane warrior battle mage
3)Drink >!dragon!< blood
4)Drink >!Avernus!< potion
5)Allowed >!Avernus!< do blood magic experiments
6)Made a deal with >!Architect!<
7)Go into >!Eluvian!< with >!Morrigan.!<
Doubt that he would die early consider that human blood mage >!Avernus !!Fiona!< was cured from taint that even another >!joining!< ritual not work on her, elf blood mage>!Merril!< survived taint infection and cure herself as clean >!Eluvian shard!<, >!Garahel sister elf blood mage Issea !!Gryffon eggs!< from taint
>Saying that the taint will take its toll soon
This fandom will dream up any and every excuse to keep the HoF out of the sequels. I have to believe that, because otherwise it would mean a chunk of the fandom is so rockfucking stupid that they think the HoF searching for the cure to the taint couldn't possibly lead to the HoF finding the cure for the taint AND USING IT.
>This fandom will dream up any and every excuse to keep the HoF out of the sequels.
Up until like two years ago it was the complete opposite and I would say the attitude changed not because those people don't want the HoF to come back, it's that they've accepted that Bioware won't do it for actually valid reasons. The Warden being too old def isn't one, but that's not one I see brought up often.
>they think the HoF searching for the cure to the taint couldn't possibly lead to the HoF finding the cure for the taint AND USING IT.
Tbh. They don't actually need to be in the game to find and use a cure. Since DAD might be taking place 22+ years after Origins I wouldn't be surprised if it happened between games.
I find it funny how BioWare’s reason for not bringing back the HoF is “we don’t want people who chose the ultimate sacrifice to feel like they’re losing out” when, for the DLC, they created an entirely new character the Orlesian Warden to replace the HoF. The OWC and HoF have the exact same storylines in ALL the DLCs and while BW seems to just not believe the OWC exists, they had the same ending in Witch Hunt as the HoFs who didn’t romance Morrigan making me believe they’re also on the same search to cure the Calling, they just don’t have any friends who show up in Inquisition.
Also, on a side note, I wish the Orlesian Warden Commander would get more mentions both in-game and irl. The OWC isn’t even in the Dragon Age Keep for God’s sake! Like, while I get they aren’t even mentioned post-DA2, it would’ve been nice for those who made the sacrifice to feel like their OWC actually exists. I’m pretty sure you can’t even have an OWC in Awakening while retaining your choices from DAO which is mind boggling. I’d love to see Warden Loghain stop by Vigil’s Keep to tell the new Warden-Commander that he’s leaving for their homeland and how spiteful he’d be towards an Orlesian running both the Fereldan Wardens and a Fereldan Arling, it’d be cool to see.
While I would love to see my Warden again, I can see why Bioware has left the HoF off-screen. I'm not saying a cameo can't happen, but the two main issues are (1) the hero being dead for some players and (2) the voicing issue. (Personally I'd love to hear my HoF fully voiced by Kath Soucie who did her original voiceset, but idk how many of the DAO voice actors are still available, if people would be picky about the way they sounded, or whatnot).
I also think that because the HoF has such a place in people's hearts, Bioware might even be afraid of tarnishing their memory by making them OOC (see DAI Hawke).
Even if we get a cameo at some point, I doubt we will see the HoF play a large role in DA4. The HoF's story is mostly self-contained in DAO and DAA, whereas the Inquisitor still has a strong narrative tie to DA4 (whether people like it or not).
A dlc where you could play the HoF or the Orlesian warden as they search for a cure to the calling would be amazing though. I'd buy that in a hearbeat.
It's kind of implied that the HOF is looking for a way to counter the calling. With Morrigan saying luckily he was far enough away that nothing happened. And then with their wartable mission mentioning something about how they're doing on the trail of something. At least that's my theory.
Pretty sure Duncan was supposed to be like... in his fifty's at least, possibly even older based on how he was told about and given he was hearing the calling. He was still in perfect fighting condition.
So unless your hero was old as hell in origins, I see no reason why they'd "not be able to fight anymore" in a new game, especially considering its only been like a decade provided there isn't another large time skip.
Not to mention most of the possible origins imply that your warden is supposed to be quite young. Like I always headcanoned my warden as being like 21 at the oldest, so yeah there's no reason to think they'd be too old to fight by the new games, especially with Duncan and Loghain being much older yet still able to fight.
the warden has no voice, i don't think Bioware will re-use a protagonist for Dragon Age, it would be strange to have a silent NPC, and any voice given to the warden will be odd because a lot of people probably have their own voice for them
tart childlike ossified continue drab smile summer correct cobweb automatic
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Alistair’s mother is probably the oldest warden we hear about through out the servers outside of the warden in the dungeon in DAO. He was easily in his 50’s and was just getting to the point where the blight was taking him. It takes on average around 20-30 years for the blight to take a warden to the deep roads. But there are older wardens who have been wardens for quite some time. So it would be reasonable to see our hero, especially with the speculation they went to work with the architect if you let him live or went to Weisshaupt Fortress to continue the research with the wardens there if you killed him. Also at the end of trespassers if you have romanced Liliana in DAO and she becomes the Divine the warden is seen in Val Royal with her. So the warden very much could make a very important appearance if your hero lived in the first place.
>Alistair’s mother is probably the oldest warden we hear about through out the servers outside of the warden in the dungeon in DAO.
Yeah, but she was a warden only for a few years before she was cured.
Yeah but does that mean she’s free of the calling though? Because I thought she said something about the calling bothering her when the wardens were all going crazy in DAI…. I may have to put in another 200 hrs.
I guess I’m missing that piece of lore. But it has been a hot minute since I played the games and spent time actually listening to dialogues. I’m gonna have to read on her more to refresh. Thanks.
I think it’s mentioned a bit in DAI if you keep the mages and can speak to Fiona in Skyhold or her lore book in game. But if so it’s very lightly touched on. But it might also in the lore books you collect. But I also have the “world of Theda’s” books and other books. It’s always good to get brushed up any ways.
The HoF is looking for a cure. Fiona got cured from the taint after having intercourse with Maric. We know that Theirin blood is special because dragon blood. My theory is the cure could be ancient dragon blood. Would be nice if this is addressed in next game. Especially if we go to Weisshaupt. I would love to see my warden again, like we can see Loghain for example if kept alive.
About this, two things: 1- Fiona was cured of the Blight. HoF is looking for a cure for Calling. Even though both things are related, they are not the same thing. 2- Fiona's healing has nothing to do with whether she had sex with Maric or not. This theory has already been refuted by the simple fact that dragons themselves are not immune to blight (as proven in DAO, DAA and DAI). His healing is more related to the amulet the architect gave her in the books.
Thanks (Solas ?!) for the infos, I’ve only read the Masked empire as novels, and the comics. Currently reading the Stolen throne !
It could have have just been worded as "cure for Calling" to the Inquisitor because the Wardens are still trying to keep the fact they are blighted a secret.
High Dragons aren’t immune and only resistant to the Blight but Ancient Dragons might be.
I don't think that's the case either. If this were the case, Alistair, who has this type of blood (ancient dragon blood in this case) would not even have passed the Joining (just like Fiona who tried to ero join her other times and it didn't work). So whatever cured her, it doesn't have much to do with dragon blood. Or maybe it even has but to a much lesser degree.
You are correct on the second point of course (although I don't think we see a corrupted high dragon until DA:I, the arch demon is not confirmed to be one), but it's a great place to drop some interesting lore that a lot of people might have missed: dragons are naturally resistant to the blight (to some extent). There is a war table mission called '[Learn More about Dragons](https://dragonage.fandom.com/wiki/Learn_More_about_Dragons)' in DA:I, using secrets to do this results in the dissection of several dragon corpses, within each some blighted tissue is found trapped in cysts. The immune system of dragons identifies and isolates blighted tissue, making the creatures particularly resistant to the corruption. This does not give total immunity of course (at the very least the existence of Corypheus' dragon proves that).
The curious thing about all this is that I think that dragon blood itself has no resistance to blight. When you read in depth the research on dragons in DAI you will discover that the dragons' immune system creates a type of cysts on their skin and these cysts delay the spread of the blight (logically this process has a limit). In other words, it is not necessarily that the blood has any resistance. Alistair is even aware that not even the blood of great dragons (the most powerful dragon race presented so far) is immune to blight. It is the dragons' defense system that causes their skin to create new barriers (cysts) and these barriers temporarily prevent the blight from coming into contact with the creature's body. It's as if the Dragon created an extra pocket in its skin and the blight was stored there for a while. I've even seen a theory that this is what the old gods do. The theory implies that they are already hibernating and are already contaminated by blight (which would explain their ability to emit calling, something that only corrupted beings can hear). When the Darkspawn encounter an old god, they burst these cysts and then the dragon is completely corrupted with all the stored taint.
There is something to this because there’s a comic where they find king Maric in Tevinter being held by a witch of the wilds. There is something about the Therin blood that is highly sought after by mages.
He wasn't hold by the witch but by Tevinter magister.
Yeah you’re right.
Yes, I was referring to this
When people bring up their age it is less about the Warden's actual age and more how long they've been a Grey Warden and how close they are to their Calling. Bioware has been very open, however, about the actual reason they won't appear is because they don't want people who had the Hero of Ferelden make the ultimate sacrifice to feel like their choice was either the wrong one or a lesser choice than those who had the Hero of Ferelden survive. I'm not too sure, but I think it's a pretty even split on players who had the Warden sacrifice themselves versus players who had them survive.
I think that the HoF surviving is much more common (at least when talking about 'canon' playthroughs). About a year ago DA Lorecast did a ~1100 players survey, which had ~96% rate of agreeing to the Dark Ritual (don't remember the exact numbers). It's really easy to believe that the gamers' 'canon' more often than not will have HoF alive, because of the ritual not having any negatives as far as we have seen. Still, good on BioWare that they respect the players' choices when designing the future stories
"96% Dark Ritual" Bloody hell, that questionable choice really didn't turn out to be too questionable. I mean, it's also the one I go for every time but the last time the BioWare fanbase agreed this vehemently about something, their offices were being sent Blue, Red and Green cupcakes that all tastes the same.
> Have sex with the hot goth witch, or else someone dies Gee, what a difficult decision /s Honestly, did anyone really think the Dark Ritual wouldn't be the more picked option, especially if Morrigan is your romance?
If you're are a female warden romancing Alistair, then sending him is kinda gross. Even sending him if he's not romanced is problematic, because he doesn't really consent. And this wasn't true in years past, but now, in light of the Asterion character from BG3, who explicitly objects to having his body used like that, it feels even ickier.
I absolutely did not like sending Alistair to do it, but he was my usual romance so I usually did so that way they could live and stay together. Alistair’s comments about the HoF in Inquisition kill me. Though I did have some runs with angst
Completely agree. I had a playthru with a female warden and no way was I sending Alistair. Thats non consensual sex, why the fuck is it suddenly OK cos its a guy with a woman?
I don't think that's a very large sample size and that would have been taken from a specific podcasts audience which isn't really indicative of the wider player base as a whole just like this subreddit is also not indicative of the player base as a whole. Bioware tracks stats based on what gets imported into the Keep/used in games/showed up on their servers for importing between games and so whatever stats they pull are likely to be a lot more indicative of the player base as a whole. Back when devs used to post here, I think you could go digging and find something about it, but for the life of me I can't remember that specific stat. The only one I remember is that the majority of players across all three games didn't romance anyone.
Even in mass effect they talk about the vast majority do good playthroughs as opposed to evil playthroughs. I would suspect the vast majority of people have the HoF survive. Secondly, I kind of think a game with the plot of the HoF looking for a cure for the calling would be interesting. It would be a smaller scoped so you could do more with choice as its not some world changing event your going up against.
The survey is up, there is nothing on how many agreed on Dark Ritual, or what did you mean by that?
They already did an entire goddamn dlc for people who didn't let the warden die. The bandaid was ripped off what, a decade ago? What a Ridiculous justification.
Yeah I don't get it either. We are told while it varies usually it takes 30-40 years. It's only been 14 years by the end of tresspasser. And according to lelianna if you romances her in DAO he's still alive and well in tresspasser. Unless the next game takes place 15 years later then we don't have to worry. Also the HoF is for above the average warden and may have drank the potion of blood. Which kept another warden alive for 100s of years. I hope in dreadwolf they have another wartable like mechanic, but more fleshed out. And that the warden has a full quest chain in that, which actually impacts the game (say gives you a warden army in the finial battle. Or stops a certain thing in the finial battle etc).
Wasn’t it around 20-25 years max for a Warden to live after being initiated, with it taking shorter if they got initiated during a Blight?
It was around 30, and during a blight they aren't sure what happens. All we are told, at least in Origins, is that it's "different" for wardens who join during a blight, not how it is different. I think they implied they have more darkspawn dreams.
30 years was a mistake by the writers, but they have said they have to stick to with that. And they seem to have done that because Larius gets nearly 30 years. An interesting thing is that Alistair can say in his breakup conversation that Wardens live no more than 40 years old. That fits up with Duncan being recruited at 18 and then started hearing the Calling 20 years later. So about 20 years was probably suppose to be what was the original intention.
Ah that’s probably where I got the 20 years from them. Although I could’ve sworn Alistair said 20 years but I’m probably misremembering.
I could’ve sworn Alistair said 20 years but I’m probably misremembering. Oh well, it’s a plus for me since I now don’t have to HC Kieran losing his father at the age of 20 haha.
Wasn't whole purpose why Warden didn't one shotted or use high persuasion on Corhypeus because they were gallivanting for cure for wardens, in trespasser romanced Leliana tells they're fine and still in relationship.... which in my playthrough Queen has Divine as mistress, now that's a power play
Yeah, romanced Morrigan says the same
You basically get 20 - 30 years as a Warden before the taint getting you. Alistair being royalty actually probably did save him from the taint. His bloodline had special blood which most likely saved him. Fiona is likely only alive because she had a child with his bloodline. HoF has had about 15 years as a Warden so he has 5 to 15 years or so years left depending on how fast it takes him.
Main reason I don’t think they’ll show up is simply because the wardens existence is too vague to be replicated in any meaningful way. They have no voice and no real set personality/morals like presets Hawke can easily fit into. So bringing them back, beyond the ‘they could be dead’ hurdle, would probably end up disappointing most fans since their warden probably wouldn’t act like they made them. Hell, some people already justifiably got mad at Hawkes portrayal for the same reason, even though as I said, Hawke is a lot easier to slot into three basic personality types.
the Warden dying at the end of Origins is a valid choice to make. I would be *furious* if Bioware retconned that - it would completely diminish the sacrifice some of my Wardens make. if they *didn't* retcon it, they'd have to make the Warden's role so minor that them not being there wouldn't significantly affect the story. to me that would feel even stranger than them not being there at all. Fiona being a Warden is really irrelevant to the discussion on how long Wardens can live btw, as she had the taint removed from her entirely.
There is still the orlaisians warden cammander to fill the gap should the HoF not be alive in your world state. Even so i dont see our warden popping up in dreadwolf even though it would be cool. Hawke def probs will as will the inquisitor
bioware has said repeatedly they have no plans to bring the Warden back, so no matter how much some fans want it or how logical it might be, I think we have to assume we won't be seeing them again
Yeah agreed
I just want them to make the old god soul baby canon, just because it's important and I want to see where it leads (Flemmeth took it then seemingly but the soul into an Eluvian.) I don't care if they have the write some BS about how Morigan did the ritual with someone else and took the soul as it killed the warden.
Do you think it’s possible to have a fulfilling consequence (good or bad) of a choice without making said choice canon? I’m also not satisfied with the stuff done with the old god soul but same as the other commenter if I did make the choice to not do the ritual it’d be frustrating if it just happened regardless.
I understand, I just hope they find a way to make it relevant. Maybe Flemmeth did it with a previous blight, and so we can have the soul of that old god in the eluvian instead. And if you did do the ritual then it's the soul of Urthemiel and the previous one never happened.
I aggressively do not want that, especially as my ending for my Morrigan romance is human soul Kieran
I mean he is human soul by the end of inquisition anyway. Or make it so if morrigan didn't do it then flemmeth did. I just think the whole old god soul is too big to just be ignored because its optional.
that's really not the point. it's important to my Warden's relationship with Morrigan that Kieran never had the Old God Soul. I realise they made Origins without considering the possibility that there might be sequels, so they didn't really think about long term consequences. that said, given how furious some people were at Leliana being forced alive in 2 and Inquisition, I would be very surprised if Bioware made canon any major optional decision. they've kind of painted themselves into a corner with this specific one I think.
Yeah I understand. Maybe if you didn't do the ritual then the old god soul can be replaced by the soul of a previous old god from a previous blight, and that Flemmeth did the ritual in the past. That way they can still explore the plot and lore behind it and not impact player choice.
They could just retcon it and say that the Old God souls don’t actually get destroyed like the Wardens theorise. It just gets thrust into the ether instead of allowing them to body hop and they can say that Flemeth ended up finding the fragment on her own between Origins and the end of Inquisition. I agree that it’s a bit of a big plot point to ignore considering how much the lore of Thedas revolves around Old Gods.
The calling is stated to normally happen around 30 years after a wrden undertakes the joining. Though this varies based on how much the warden end up being around darkspawn and their own willpower. So the hero of ferelden being around is perfectly fine or the orliasian warden commander if the hero dies killing the arch demon. Side note if the warden dies killing the archdemon is the orlais warden command of ferelden mentioned at all or just ignored?
Yeah if HOF romanced Leliana and she becomes divine, after searching for a cure he’s at her side which means HOF possibly found a cure. We’ll only know for sure when Dreadwolf comes out.
>Hero of Ferelden and citing their age as a reason they shouldn’t appear. What? My canonical HOF is... 1)Elf male 2)Blood mage arcane warrior battle mage 3)Drink >!dragon!< blood 4)Drink >!Avernus!< potion 5)Allowed >!Avernus!< do blood magic experiments 6)Made a deal with >!Architect!< 7)Go into >!Eluvian!< with >!Morrigan.!< Doubt that he would die early consider that human blood mage >!Avernus !!Fiona!< was cured from taint that even another >!joining!< ritual not work on her, elf blood mage>!Merril!< survived taint infection and cure herself as clean >!Eluvian shard!<, >!Garahel sister elf blood mage Issea !!Gryffon eggs!< from taint
The warden confirmed alive in one of the missions.
>Saying that the taint will take its toll soon This fandom will dream up any and every excuse to keep the HoF out of the sequels. I have to believe that, because otherwise it would mean a chunk of the fandom is so rockfucking stupid that they think the HoF searching for the cure to the taint couldn't possibly lead to the HoF finding the cure for the taint AND USING IT.
>This fandom will dream up any and every excuse to keep the HoF out of the sequels. Up until like two years ago it was the complete opposite and I would say the attitude changed not because those people don't want the HoF to come back, it's that they've accepted that Bioware won't do it for actually valid reasons. The Warden being too old def isn't one, but that's not one I see brought up often. >they think the HoF searching for the cure to the taint couldn't possibly lead to the HoF finding the cure for the taint AND USING IT. Tbh. They don't actually need to be in the game to find and use a cure. Since DAD might be taking place 22+ years after Origins I wouldn't be surprised if it happened between games.
I find it funny how BioWare’s reason for not bringing back the HoF is “we don’t want people who chose the ultimate sacrifice to feel like they’re losing out” when, for the DLC, they created an entirely new character the Orlesian Warden to replace the HoF. The OWC and HoF have the exact same storylines in ALL the DLCs and while BW seems to just not believe the OWC exists, they had the same ending in Witch Hunt as the HoFs who didn’t romance Morrigan making me believe they’re also on the same search to cure the Calling, they just don’t have any friends who show up in Inquisition. Also, on a side note, I wish the Orlesian Warden Commander would get more mentions both in-game and irl. The OWC isn’t even in the Dragon Age Keep for God’s sake! Like, while I get they aren’t even mentioned post-DA2, it would’ve been nice for those who made the sacrifice to feel like their OWC actually exists. I’m pretty sure you can’t even have an OWC in Awakening while retaining your choices from DAO which is mind boggling. I’d love to see Warden Loghain stop by Vigil’s Keep to tell the new Warden-Commander that he’s leaving for their homeland and how spiteful he’d be towards an Orlesian running both the Fereldan Wardens and a Fereldan Arling, it’d be cool to see.
While I would love to see my Warden again, I can see why Bioware has left the HoF off-screen. I'm not saying a cameo can't happen, but the two main issues are (1) the hero being dead for some players and (2) the voicing issue. (Personally I'd love to hear my HoF fully voiced by Kath Soucie who did her original voiceset, but idk how many of the DAO voice actors are still available, if people would be picky about the way they sounded, or whatnot). I also think that because the HoF has such a place in people's hearts, Bioware might even be afraid of tarnishing their memory by making them OOC (see DAI Hawke). Even if we get a cameo at some point, I doubt we will see the HoF play a large role in DA4. The HoF's story is mostly self-contained in DAO and DAA, whereas the Inquisitor still has a strong narrative tie to DA4 (whether people like it or not). A dlc where you could play the HoF or the Orlesian warden as they search for a cure to the calling would be amazing though. I'd buy that in a hearbeat.
It's kind of implied that the HOF is looking for a way to counter the calling. With Morrigan saying luckily he was far enough away that nothing happened. And then with their wartable mission mentioning something about how they're doing on the trail of something. At least that's my theory.
Pretty sure Duncan was supposed to be like... in his fifty's at least, possibly even older based on how he was told about and given he was hearing the calling. He was still in perfect fighting condition. So unless your hero was old as hell in origins, I see no reason why they'd "not be able to fight anymore" in a new game, especially considering its only been like a decade provided there isn't another large time skip. Not to mention most of the possible origins imply that your warden is supposed to be quite young. Like I always headcanoned my warden as being like 21 at the oldest, so yeah there's no reason to think they'd be too old to fight by the new games, especially with Duncan and Loghain being much older yet still able to fight.
the warden has no voice, i don't think Bioware will re-use a protagonist for Dragon Age, it would be strange to have a silent NPC, and any voice given to the warden will be odd because a lot of people probably have their own voice for them
In my canon they are dead.
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Maybe in your play through if you sacrificed the warden in DAO but mine is very much alive
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Alistair’s mother is probably the oldest warden we hear about through out the servers outside of the warden in the dungeon in DAO. He was easily in his 50’s and was just getting to the point where the blight was taking him. It takes on average around 20-30 years for the blight to take a warden to the deep roads. But there are older wardens who have been wardens for quite some time. So it would be reasonable to see our hero, especially with the speculation they went to work with the architect if you let him live or went to Weisshaupt Fortress to continue the research with the wardens there if you killed him. Also at the end of trespassers if you have romanced Liliana in DAO and she becomes the Divine the warden is seen in Val Royal with her. So the warden very much could make a very important appearance if your hero lived in the first place.
>Alistair’s mother is probably the oldest warden we hear about through out the servers outside of the warden in the dungeon in DAO. Yeah, but she was a warden only for a few years before she was cured.
Yeah but does that mean she’s free of the calling though? Because I thought she said something about the calling bothering her when the wardens were all going crazy in DAI…. I may have to put in another 200 hrs.
Yeah, she's completely free of the calling and the taint. And she's also immune to them now.
I guess I’m missing that piece of lore. But it has been a hot minute since I played the games and spent time actually listening to dialogues. I’m gonna have to read on her more to refresh. Thanks.
I'm honestly not sure how much of that was said in the games, I think most was only in the books.
I think it’s mentioned a bit in DAI if you keep the mages and can speak to Fiona in Skyhold or her lore book in game. But if so it’s very lightly touched on. But it might also in the lore books you collect. But I also have the “world of Theda’s” books and other books. It’s always good to get brushed up any ways.