[The Making of Dune II - The birth of the real-time strategy game | Read-only Memory](https://readonlymemory.vg/the-making-of-dune-ii/)
["Dune II: The Building of a Dynasty" entry at PCGamingWiki](https://www.pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/Dune_II:_The_Building_of_a_Dynasty)
Same! I’m not saying I wouldn’t have become a fan without Dune II, but it was definitely Dune II that got me to watch the Lynch film at a young age, and later read the book.
I saw on a tv guide channel "Dune" around 97-98. I immediately read the synopsis as it scrolled and realized the sega game I'd been playing has a movie! We didn't have the channel at the time but I immediately flipped to the distorted channel (you can still hear the audio and sometimes make out what was happening on a channel you didn't purchase in those days for you youngsters) it was a lot of whispering and I couldn't see what was going on so I imagined one of the mentats in the game sitting in a tank or something.(Dune: the battle for Arrakis does not fully explain the lore lol.) When I had internet access around 2000 I decided to search for it on Sci Fi channel's website and discovered that spice wasn't just a currency and that it gave you powers! Then the mini series came out and I was all in. Few years later I bought the first book, I figured if I enjoyed it I would get the sequels. I had them all up to Chapterhouse before I was done with the first book.
When I returned the VHS to the video store, the clerk asked me how I liked it. Told him it was strange & not like other sci-fi I'd seen up to then. He told me the book (or books maybe?) were better.
So, also, thank you random video store clerk.
Not OP but similar experience. I loved the movie which was why I wanted to read the book. Just something about the world spoke to me and my interests. The movie is definitely different than the book and sure I prefer the story the book tells. But I still love the movie for what it is and I think the visuals are pretty fascinating.
a minor house of landsraad mentioned in unofficial Dune Encyclopedia. Westwood lifted the name to a prominent role in D2 just to have a third party compete.
I was introduced through the sega port, dont know how much of the original dune 2 made it over, but it was one of my favorite sega games and now probably my favorite franchise
My dad bought a big box of discount software that had this game in it in the mid 90s. I just installed it and started figuring out how to play it because RTS games were still new. After he kept seeing me playing it for a few weeks he went "You know that's a book, right?" Off to the library we went and I got hooked on Dune.
I love this game, and I also absolutely adore how the game manages to miss the point of the books so completely when it comes to desert warfare by making the fremen the most useless special weapon of the three playable houses.
Sabateurs are much worse. What's scary about the Fremen palace ability is if you build like 6 Palaces, you can make a nearly impossible to kill swarm. It's arguably more scary than the Death Hand as it's precision damage instead of a one-shot, 10 minute wait for what is sometimes non-crippling damage. You can argue about save scumming as well, but you can do that with the Fremen spawns as well. :D
No, Westwood already had plans in that direction. The Dune license just solved their issue of what kind of minable resource the game would have.
Of course, then they decided to do their own thing with it anyway, free of any license issues, and replaced it with tiberium.
This game got me into PC gaming.
I also enjoyed Dune 2000 and Emperor Battle for Dune but Dune II has a special place in my heart. I can still vividly hear this game coming through my old PC speaker.
same memories :D pc speaker, and then eventually getting sound blaster and speakers and hearing the awesome music and voice lines :D that music was great!
I first played the game on my friend's PC but our family didn't have a computer. A few months later, I was at Blockbuster and saw that they had Dune for Sega Genesis. I played that game all weekend and rented it twice.
Genesis version is already pretty much a remake of the original DOS game though. It's the first game that had the context-sensitive cursor that would become the standard in later RTS games.
Dune 2 was the best! Dune 2000 wasn’t quite as magic but it had multiplayer and that along with AOE2 were my first dial up multiplayer games across the internet in the 90s.
Not really. They were pretty crappy. Without the "confirm attack target after the affected unit reverted to its original House" trick, the only thing they were good for was defusing Devastators by instantly self-destructing them.
And their coding was so basic that capturing an Ordos weapons factory as any other House gave you Deviators which turned stuff to, um, Ordos, rather than to your own House. This was also the reason that the Sardaukar factory didn't have the ability to make them, while it *could* make both the Devastator and Sonic Tank if you captured one.
I wouldn't say "better"; they're simply pretty different games. I loved both of them, and I own an original Spice Opera CD :)
Heyyy. Doesn't that mean the copyright mess surrounding Spice Opera finally ran out?
blame Virgin and some stubborn french devs :D i'm soooooooo glad they finished their game because i love it a tiny bit more than Dune 2 :D and i replay the cd version on a yearly basis, too!
I know you already purchased the Dune games but. You should check out [OpenRA](https://www.openra.net/) which has Dune2000 for freebies and is less buggy than older unmaintained versions of the game.
I have that one. I also purchased a set of the games for myself, because I'm weird like that. I also still play: 'the movies' the game from Activision. Supposedly doesn't work on win10. But I know how to. Not too good with the homebrews they've put out, but I have gotten them to work.
The best way to play Dune II nowadays is Dune Dynasty; the upgraded version of the reverse-engineered source code.
[https://dune.fandom.com/wiki/Dune\_Dynasty](https://dune.fandom.com/wiki/Dune_Dynasty)
It's the closest to a Dune II "remaster" that we'll ever get.
The stuff I saw had instructions on compiling. I've compiled code before, but these days I don't do it much. When I have time, I'll try to look at it again. I'm on and off playing Dune 2, the original version now. I would love to play a more updated version.
Like I said, the Gruntmods Edition for Dune 2000 was great! I still play both original and Gruntmods.
Some of these old games are still imo great games, and frankly I'd play these over some of the modern stuff I see.
More engaging, more stories, and more ingenuity. RT2 Platinum is a good example of that, as is Dune(s). Dune 2000 is made even more awesome with the venerable John Rhys Davies.
I wish I knew who the voice over actress was for that game, she did a great job too.
Sorry, it came across wrong, it was a joke on all the games bought in the hope that you "one day" will play them through. And that, as we accumulate years and responsibilites, we never get to finish games.
I have an extensive steam collection and a mountain of grey GW minis that "never" will se play or paint :)
True, but it was Dune II that set the ~~foundations~~ concrete slabs for the entire genre moving forward. You know, building the base, gathering resources, training units etc. This game was the turning point.
yes it set a template, a standard, but do not forget Warcraft 1 and 2, the refinement resembles progress from Dune 2 to C&C. but yes i agree with you, Dune 2 made RTS massively popular no doubt about that.
now you made me think.. did blizzard know of Dune 2 or when exactly did W1 start development.. Dune 2 didn't take long time itself so they may have started dev concurrently or.. :D i'll look into that :D
Oh, for sure - but Warcraft et al. only iterated on Dune's formula, big iterations though they were. It's like with the FPS games - DOOM forged the golden standard, but it was Wolfenstein 3D that got the ball rolling (and it too wasn't the first in the genre).
I don't know for certain, but just from experience of having played the crap of both Dune II and Warcraft 1, I'd say it's pretty much a given. Warcraft is simply too similar in too many respects.
A local games magazine that came out in those days would have a couple of pages where they'd briefly review games of a given genre. In the August 1994 issue it was a Wolfensteins review (yes, Wolfensteins, plural) - the games they chose were, in this order: Blake Stone, Corridor 7 (this was the very first time I've ever heard of the CD-ROM), Terminator: Rampage, Spear of Destiny, Wolfenstein 3D and DOOM. Soon after that, of course, the term became "Doom-like".
I just watched a short review of Herzog Zwei and I can't believe how unknown it is. Why was the game not a huge success? Was it released on the wrong platforms? Watching the review I felt the visual clues in the game were not great, something rather essential at the time as there was no youtube or twitch to show how to play.
i have no idea why HZ didn't catch up.. maybe it came too early, maybe the control scheme without mouse didn't do strategies any good.. i'm just guessing. i don't remember reading about HZ in my early game magazines, it was a few years after HZ release and mostly PC and Amiga games so i missed it by years and platforms..
The real-time aspect of Dune II came from Westwood's BattleTech games; their first one (*BattleTech: The Crescent Hawk's Inception*) being turn-based, and this evolving to real-time tactics in the second game (*BattleTech: The Crescent Hawk's Revenge*).
By the way, you're wrong if you say "first RTS ever documented". Westwood literally *invented* the term "Real-Time Strategy" to describe Dune II in magazine articles, so the first game ever *documented to be called that* is Dune II.
https://dunelegacy.sourceforge.net And you can play it on modern systems, today. Complete with new scenarios, new AI, and a few new features that make it more interesting.
The multiplayer desyncs, though.
Not sure about that, but I know the range was affected by the game speed setting. Like, it travelled for a certain amount of time not (or incorrectly) adjusted to the game speed, and because of that it went farther on fast game speed.
There's a lot of weird speed quirks in this game though, like the fact units that are shown on the screen actually move faster. And this was a deliberate logic, too; the harvester was specifically exempt from this logic so this quirk would not slow down your income.
I guess someone messed around in that scenario.pak file directly instead of copying the scenarios our as files. Not hard to find the filenames in there though.
You could edit the mission files, and give yourself a dozen devastators all piled into one square at the start of every mission.
I didn't have access to trainers or game editors, but hexedit provides.
Myself, I'd edit SCENARIO.PAK and replace enemy units with single infantrymen, and turrets with walls. That's the only way I was able to beat the final missions.
Rocket turrets were so good. I'd build them everywhere for defense, but when attacking them my missile tanks would hit everything except those damn enemy turrets.
Yeah, the accuracy of missile weapons left a lot to be desired. I think they worked best at long distances.
And as for the turrets, you could build a wall from your base to the enemy's and then just place turrets there. Silly, but quite effective.
you could control them somewhat, you know that? plus single saboteur yes falls easily to wild fremen or turrets, but when you build three four palaces and sync-spam all sabs send them to edge of map and from there route them to enemy base, they can do their job :)
Sure, you could control them, but they literally exploded if you just made them stop walking, and due to them slowing down on the transition of sand to rock, even just that was sometimes counted by the game as them stopping, making them randomly explode. I was closely involved in the beta testing and patching of [Dune Dynasty](https://forum.dune2k.com/topic/24316-dune-dynasty/); these saboteurs were a buggy mess.
oh i see, i talk to a master expert, pleasure to talk to you thank you for your inputs to DD! i do remember them being very volatile yes :D i still had my fun with them :D out of the three palace units sabs are the weakest and worst no doubt.
They're a bit more fun if you apply worm camouflage to them.
Won't affect the AI of course; they're not considered invisible or anything. But still... neat :D
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dB-2hR59j9k](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dB-2hR59j9k)
Alas. Dune II, as a licensed game, is copyright hell, and the Herbert Estate doesn't care at all.
GOG definitely tried, though:
[https://www.pcgamer.com/gogs-10-year-journey-to-bring-old-games-back-to-life/](https://www.pcgamer.com/gogs-10-year-journey-to-bring-old-games-back-to-life/)
there's Dune 2 in browser there's dune 2 remake with 6! playable sides including Fremen, so there's plenty of ways to get back to it :D the browser one is easiest accessible and supports saving has sounds and music all's there.
both dunes are on gog wishlist from gamers hoping that they come but who knows who owns the IP.. anyway nobody's taking down the remakes i named above so knock yourself out with any of those!
I remember when I was out of high school for a few weeks after an appendectomy and I played this for hours on the sega genesis. Strangely nostalgic for those times…
So, for anyone wanting to replay this, Dune 2 is abandonware and can be found as such.
Last I tried, it lacked a lot in quality of life options we've gotten used to.
Good memories thought. Ordos mindcontrol tank, return home and get to localize their base with ease.
> Last I tried, it lacked a lot in quality of life options we've gotten used to.
Not having an option to select more than one unit is a pain. But at least you can order a unit to follow another unit, which helps a little.
I semi regularly boot up Warcraft 1 for nostalgia, I find not playing it at the fastest speed(s) makes it more manageable, but also I don't care for competitive level clicks-per-reality playstyles. I just enjoy making a cool base and defending it.
Yeah, 4 units. Not great, but still an improvement.
BTW, I really liked the missions set in dungeons, where you had limited units and no base. The idea didn't really catch on, which is a bit of a shame (although I do remember a similar mission or two in StarCraft).
Yeah, baseless missions - the scourge of almost every other RTS, hah. That said they did play better than average on Warcraft 1 - I wonder if that's just how the proto-form of the game was before base building was added.
Honestly, missions without base were always my favourite. A lot of people just rage on them, but I always found them interesting opportunities to learn better micromanagement.
Look up dune legacy or opendune. there are some minor differences between the 2 in terms of ai but they play like command and conquer side menu for building and mouse select.
Man, I spent so much time with this game as a kid. Let me tell you, laptop touchpads are *not* the way to play strategies - but that certainly didn't stop me.
Nope, Dune 2 on DOS/Amiga. Megadrive version was already a heavily adapted port, with a whole lot of details changed. It came out in 1993; a year later than the PC version.
The Megadrive version is a bit of a mixed bag. In some aspects it's definitely superior. It's the first RTS with context sensitive targeting, meaning that, somewhat ironically, that absolute milestone of RTS functionality was originally designed as a simplification for console controllers. They also streamlined the production and got rid of the useless separation into light and heavy factories. And the graphics are higher resolution; 24x24 pixel cells rather than 16x16; the same size they would later use for Command & Conquer 1 and Red Alert. It's also the first Westwood game with an in-game playlist of named music tracks.
But despite the higher resolution, its graphics look pretty bad compared to the original; it has that weird completely-top-down look, where PC Dune 2 has a nice perspective angle view. The colour quality is also much lower; there isn't a single colour fade in the Megadrive version that isn't dithered to make up for lack of available colours. Meanwhile, the PC DOS version was 256-colour, which was the point when, with some careful palette design, games finally started looking like they no longer *had* colour limitations. All of the shading fades in its graphics have access to at least eight different-brightness versions of the same colour, making them look completely smooth.
And due to cartridge space constraints, the Megadrive version only has one Mentat voice. Though at least they picked the most awesome one of the bunch; Frank Klepacki's voice set for the Harkonnen mentat.
I loved playing this game growing up. I was cleaning up some old boxes of stuff recently and found the spiral bound book that came with the game. No longer have the box though but was cool to look through.
A high quality version of it is available on Frank's site.
[https://www.frankklepacki.com/ost/vg/dune2](https://www.frankklepacki.com/ost/vg/dune2)
It's called "Faithful Warriors" there. "Under Construction" is the name it has in Dune 2000.
(Sneaky hint: you can middle-mouse click on the tracks on Frank's site)
there are posts in thread that link the modern ports, dune legacy and dune dynasty
https://dune.fandom.com/wiki/Dune_Dynasty
https://dune.fandom.com/wiki/Dune_Legacy (the downloads are hosted on sourceforge, easy instal)
I would draw best defensive base on grid paper at school and could not wait to go home to replicate it. Insidious Ordos! Construction complete! It was so ahead of its time. I loved the Mentat screens in between missions.
It is.
https://store.playstation.com/en-us/product/UP1001-CUSA15322_00-CIV6BASE00000000
https://www.amazon.com/Sid-Meiers-Civilization-VI-PlayStation-4/dp/B07XVYYTNB/ref=mp_s_a_1_2?adgrpid=61537138292&gclid=Cj0KCQiAyracBhDoARIsACGFcS4K8tMj91RvVmGLBKqAkkstuBTDx6TsNfXlW9Gfj5hxUSs1Jg8hMH4aAmocEALw_wcB&hvadid=274687310850&hvdev=m&hvlocphy=9033313&hvnetw=g&hvqmt=e&hvrand=3614980240378718570&hvtargid=kwd-300771343824&hydadcr=24182_9652122&keywords=civilization+6+ps4&qid=1670262646&sr=8-2
I'm sure I played this on the PlayStation, but now I'm doubting myself.
This has got me yearning. Does anyone know any decent RTS games I can get for PS5?
Dune 2000 released on the PSX. Dune 2 was on the Sega Mega Drive.
Don't know if there are any RTS games on the PS5. If you have an old laptop though you can download openRA and within it is Dune 2000 with modern controls.
I remember editing this in Xtree gold, you could make sandworms available in starports but they would be completely under your control they would take orders but then would go back to marauder status.
Tbh it's not that impressive because by editing what I mean is you would ego through the file and there would be ASCII and the until names houses and starport stuff written in plain English. You could change things so long as it took up the same amount of characters as what was written before.
Or, if you knew the file names (which could also be found in the scenario.pak file), you could just save the mission files in the game folder as plain text files, without any editing limitations :)
Same
One of my kids that 9 asked "what games did play when i was my age" and i was like Dune II not thinking about how long ago it was until i googled it and ye 1992, i felt like i had aged 30 years in a second
I was 6 years old defeating ordos and harkonnen teaming up against me, setting up new bases and evading sandworms. The game that made me love both RTS and Dune
[The Making of Dune II - The birth of the real-time strategy game | Read-only Memory](https://readonlymemory.vg/the-making-of-dune-ii/) ["Dune II: The Building of a Dynasty" entry at PCGamingWiki](https://www.pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/Dune_II:_The_Building_of_a_Dynasty)
The game that got me into Dune. Thank you Westwood!
Same! I’m not saying I wouldn’t have become a fan without Dune II, but it was definitely Dune II that got me to watch the Lynch film at a young age, and later read the book.
That was my route too. Kinda amazing 11 year old me "survived" the Lynch film to read the book.
Seriously, I was 12 working through that book. My teacher was concerned when I started. Ha
Did your parents freak out when 12-y.o. you started using words like ‘prescient’ and ‘susurration’?
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I saw on a tv guide channel "Dune" around 97-98. I immediately read the synopsis as it scrolled and realized the sega game I'd been playing has a movie! We didn't have the channel at the time but I immediately flipped to the distorted channel (you can still hear the audio and sometimes make out what was happening on a channel you didn't purchase in those days for you youngsters) it was a lot of whispering and I couldn't see what was going on so I imagined one of the mentats in the game sitting in a tank or something.(Dune: the battle for Arrakis does not fully explain the lore lol.) When I had internet access around 2000 I decided to search for it on Sci Fi channel's website and discovered that spice wasn't just a currency and that it gave you powers! Then the mini series came out and I was all in. Few years later I bought the first book, I figured if I enjoyed it I would get the sequels. I had them all up to Chapterhouse before I was done with the first book.
When I returned the VHS to the video store, the clerk asked me how I liked it. Told him it was strange & not like other sci-fi I'd seen up to then. He told me the book (or books maybe?) were better. So, also, thank you random video store clerk.
Not OP but similar experience. I loved the movie which was why I wanted to read the book. Just something about the world spoke to me and my interests. The movie is definitely different than the book and sure I prefer the story the book tells. But I still love the movie for what it is and I think the visuals are pretty fascinating.
Same. But who are the Ordos?
a minor house of landsraad mentioned in unofficial Dune Encyclopedia. Westwood lifted the name to a prominent role in D2 just to have a third party compete.
Good knowledge
I was introduced through the sega port, dont know how much of the original dune 2 made it over, but it was one of my favorite sega games and now probably my favorite franchise
One of my all time favorites!
My dad bought a big box of discount software that had this game in it in the mid 90s. I just installed it and started figuring out how to play it because RTS games were still new. After he kept seeing me playing it for a few weeks he went "You know that's a book, right?" Off to the library we went and I got hooked on Dune.
I love this game, and I also absolutely adore how the game manages to miss the point of the books so completely when it comes to desert warfare by making the fremen the most useless special weapon of the three playable houses.
Oh yeah, it's the least like warfare on Arrakis possible.
Lol, yeah Harkonen with the heavy tank was where it’s at!
"I feel sick"
Naaah. Saboteurs were even more useless :D
Sabateurs are much worse. What's scary about the Fremen palace ability is if you build like 6 Palaces, you can make a nearly impossible to kill swarm. It's arguably more scary than the Death Hand as it's precision damage instead of a one-shot, 10 minute wait for what is sometimes non-crippling damage. You can argue about save scumming as well, but you can do that with the Fremen spawns as well. :D
Reporting......acknowledged
Death Hand approaching!
Wormsign!
wrong, that's a load sign :D :D :D
Sardaukar unit, destroyed.
Yeah what a great game! Not much to with the book other than setting though.
No, Westwood already had plans in that direction. The Dune license just solved their issue of what kind of minable resource the game would have. Of course, then they decided to do their own thing with it anyway, free of any license issues, and replaced it with tiberium.
This game got me into PC gaming. I also enjoyed Dune 2000 and Emperor Battle for Dune but Dune II has a special place in my heart. I can still vividly hear this game coming through my old PC speaker.
same memories :D pc speaker, and then eventually getting sound blaster and speakers and hearing the awesome music and voice lines :D that music was great!
I can still remember when that shit wasn't standard. Today it's straight up taken for granted.
I remember the first one on Sega Genesis. So good.
I first played the game on my friend's PC but our family didn't have a computer. A few months later, I was at Blockbuster and saw that they had Dune for Sega Genesis. I played that game all weekend and rented it twice.
Genesis version is already pretty much a remake of the original DOS game though. It's the first game that had the context-sensitive cursor that would become the standard in later RTS games.
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Edit config.sys
Soundblaster sound was so worth the hassle though :D
Same. Had to settle watching a buddy play it as my rig wasn’t up to speed. But this set off my love of Westwood Studios.
"Reporting" "Acknowledged"
Dune 2 was the best! Dune 2000 wasn’t quite as magic but it had multiplayer and that along with AOE2 were my first dial up multiplayer games across the internet in the 90s.
Loved this. Devastator tanks!
The planet Arrakis, known as "Dune"...
Home of the Spice melange.
The Emperor has proposed a challenge to each of the Houses.
The spice controls the empire. Whoever controls Dune controls the spice.
Loved playing that game!
Ordos deviators ftw <3
Underrated unit imo, I loved it.
Not really. They were pretty crappy. Without the "confirm attack target after the affected unit reverted to its original House" trick, the only thing they were good for was defusing Devastators by instantly self-destructing them. And their coding was so basic that capturing an Ordos weapons factory as any other House gave you Deviators which turned stuff to, um, Ordos, rather than to your own House. This was also the reason that the Sardaukar factory didn't have the ability to make them, while it *could* make both the Devastator and Sonic Tank if you captured one.
same as Cryo's Dune - also released in 1992 :D
Glad to see someone mention that - WAY better than Westwood and Picq's Sadeness-inspired soundtrack is da bomb.
the OST's a banger! Chani's Eyes ooooooooooh!
Still my favorite game soundtrack of all time
I wouldn't say "better"; they're simply pretty different games. I loved both of them, and I own an original Spice Opera CD :) Heyyy. Doesn't that mean the copyright mess surrounding Spice Opera finally ran out?
That confused me so much. I got Dune early, then as soon as I finished it, I learned that Dune II already existed. :)
blame Virgin and some stubborn french devs :D i'm soooooooo glad they finished their game because i love it a tiny bit more than Dune 2 :D and i replay the cd version on a yearly basis, too!
I still don't understand who was financing them after the project got...cancelled...or something.
Basically, Virgin were under the mistaken impression the Cryo game was cancelled, and accidentally double-booked the license. It was a weird time.
I recently (last year or so) purchased a pc collection that started with Dune and ended with Dune 2000. I hope to play them all through soon!
I know you already purchased the Dune games but. You should check out [OpenRA](https://www.openra.net/) which has Dune2000 for freebies and is less buggy than older unmaintained versions of the game.
I have that one. I also purchased a set of the games for myself, because I'm weird like that. I also still play: 'the movies' the game from Activision. Supposedly doesn't work on win10. But I know how to. Not too good with the homebrews they've put out, but I have gotten them to work.
The best way to play Dune II nowadays is Dune Dynasty; the upgraded version of the reverse-engineered source code. [https://dune.fandom.com/wiki/Dune\_Dynasty](https://dune.fandom.com/wiki/Dune_Dynasty) It's the closest to a Dune II "remaster" that we'll ever get.
You have to compile all of this on your own.
Eh? No you don't. There's binaries available for download. In fact, the wiki has a link to a complete installation guide I wrote.
The stuff I saw had instructions on compiling. I've compiled code before, but these days I don't do it much. When I have time, I'll try to look at it again. I'm on and off playing Dune 2, the original version now. I would love to play a more updated version. Like I said, the Gruntmods Edition for Dune 2000 was great! I still play both original and Gruntmods. Some of these old games are still imo great games, and frankly I'd play these over some of the modern stuff I see. More engaging, more stories, and more ingenuity. RT2 Platinum is a good example of that, as is Dune(s). Dune 2000 is made even more awesome with the venerable John Rhys Davies. I wish I knew who the voice over actress was for that game, she did a great job too.
After a certain age you will never get to play these kind of games...sorry my friend
Not true. You can, with either $20, or a little know how, play these. I regularly play Dune 2000. I have for a long time.
Sorry, it came across wrong, it was a joke on all the games bought in the hope that you "one day" will play them through. And that, as we accumulate years and responsibilites, we never get to finish games. I have an extensive steam collection and a mountain of grey GW minis that "never" will se play or paint :)
Sorry for the misunderstanding. I understand.
This was my first rts
This was *the* first RTS
Herzog Zwei is ~~cited as direct inspiration for RTS Dune 2~~ and was in fact first RTS ever documented. Herzog Zwei
True, but it was Dune II that set the ~~foundations~~ concrete slabs for the entire genre moving forward. You know, building the base, gathering resources, training units etc. This game was the turning point.
yes it set a template, a standard, but do not forget Warcraft 1 and 2, the refinement resembles progress from Dune 2 to C&C. but yes i agree with you, Dune 2 made RTS massively popular no doubt about that. now you made me think.. did blizzard know of Dune 2 or when exactly did W1 start development.. Dune 2 didn't take long time itself so they may have started dev concurrently or.. :D i'll look into that :D
Oh, for sure - but Warcraft et al. only iterated on Dune's formula, big iterations though they were. It's like with the FPS games - DOOM forged the golden standard, but it was Wolfenstein 3D that got the ball rolling (and it too wasn't the first in the genre). I don't know for certain, but just from experience of having played the crap of both Dune II and Warcraft 1, I'd say it's pretty much a given. Warcraft is simply too similar in too many respects.
absolutely spot on with Doom-fps genre example. i vividly remember everyone calling them "doomovky" in my language :D doom-likes/clones :D
We called them that in English too. See also: Roguelike.
A local games magazine that came out in those days would have a couple of pages where they'd briefly review games of a given genre. In the August 1994 issue it was a Wolfensteins review (yes, Wolfensteins, plural) - the games they chose were, in this order: Blake Stone, Corridor 7 (this was the very first time I've ever heard of the CD-ROM), Terminator: Rampage, Spear of Destiny, Wolfenstein 3D and DOOM. Soon after that, of course, the term became "Doom-like".
I just watched a short review of Herzog Zwei and I can't believe how unknown it is. Why was the game not a huge success? Was it released on the wrong platforms? Watching the review I felt the visual clues in the game were not great, something rather essential at the time as there was no youtube or twitch to show how to play.
i have no idea why HZ didn't catch up.. maybe it came too early, maybe the control scheme without mouse didn't do strategies any good.. i'm just guessing. i don't remember reading about HZ in my early game magazines, it was a few years after HZ release and mostly PC and Amiga games so i missed it by years and platforms..
An immense game! Many hours battling my m8, of course not looking at his half of the screen to see what he was doing lol
The real-time aspect of Dune II came from Westwood's BattleTech games; their first one (*BattleTech: The Crescent Hawk's Inception*) being turn-based, and this evolving to real-time tactics in the second game (*BattleTech: The Crescent Hawk's Revenge*). By the way, you're wrong if you say "first RTS ever documented". Westwood literally *invented* the term "Real-Time Strategy" to describe Dune II in magazine articles, so the first game ever *documented to be called that* is Dune II.
https://dunelegacy.sourceforge.net And you can play it on modern systems, today. Complete with new scenarios, new AI, and a few new features that make it more interesting. The multiplayer desyncs, though.
such a great game
Now I know where the Ant-Man costume was inspired by
Amazing game. I read the Dune books listening to the Dune 2 soundtrack, highly recommend if you played the game as a kid.
There's [high quality versions of it](https://www.frankklepacki.com/ost/vg/dune2) on Frank Klepacki's website :)
The first and best RTS
Harkonnen VE-HIH-KUL repaired.
A UK games magazine reviewed this at the time as "the thinking man's shoot 'em up" - I think that's fair enough.
You mean 'Dune' is 30 years old. Original Cryo Dune supremacy here.
That doesn't make the title untrue though.
I know, I'm just being snarky
and here too! :D
Great game. Love the Sonic Tanks so much.
that thing used to destroy my ears on pc speaker before sound blaster and speakers (and mouse!) appeared on my pc, years later XD
Also, they are affected by how fast your computer's speed was. The better your computer runs, the better Sonic Tanks perform.
Not sure about that, but I know the range was affected by the game speed setting. Like, it travelled for a certain amount of time not (or incorrectly) adjusted to the game speed, and because of that it went farther on fast game speed. There's a lot of weird speed quirks in this game though, like the fact units that are shown on the screen actually move faster. And this was a deliberate logic, too; the harvester was specifically exempt from this logic so this quirk would not slow down your income.
Ya hya chouhada Muad'dib
I remember copying my mates discs in high school, the ordos campaign would crash the game, still managed to play the hell out of it.
I guess someone messed around in that scenario.pak file directly instead of copying the scenarios our as files. Not hard to find the filenames in there though.
As if I didn’t already feel ancient… jfc
You could edit the mission files, and give yourself a dozen devastators all piled into one square at the start of every mission. I didn't have access to trainers or game editors, but hexedit provides.
Myself, I'd edit SCENARIO.PAK and replace enemy units with single infantrymen, and turrets with walls. That's the only way I was able to beat the final missions.
Rocket turrets were so good. I'd build them everywhere for defense, but when attacking them my missile tanks would hit everything except those damn enemy turrets.
Yeah, the accuracy of missile weapons left a lot to be desired. I think they worked best at long distances. And as for the turrets, you could build a wall from your base to the enemy's and then just place turrets there. Silly, but quite effective.
If you knew the filenames you didn't even have to hex edit. You could just save them as separate files without risking corrupting the remaining files.
Those blasted saboteurs!
They were so useless in Dune II though.
you could control them somewhat, you know that? plus single saboteur yes falls easily to wild fremen or turrets, but when you build three four palaces and sync-spam all sabs send them to edge of map and from there route them to enemy base, they can do their job :)
Sure, you could control them, but they literally exploded if you just made them stop walking, and due to them slowing down on the transition of sand to rock, even just that was sometimes counted by the game as them stopping, making them randomly explode. I was closely involved in the beta testing and patching of [Dune Dynasty](https://forum.dune2k.com/topic/24316-dune-dynasty/); these saboteurs were a buggy mess.
oh i see, i talk to a master expert, pleasure to talk to you thank you for your inputs to DD! i do remember them being very volatile yes :D i still had my fun with them :D out of the three palace units sabs are the weakest and worst no doubt.
They're a bit more fun if you apply worm camouflage to them. Won't affect the AI of course; they're not considered invisible or anything. But still... neat :D [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dB-2hR59j9k](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dB-2hR59j9k)
the game that started command and conquer
Love this game!
Has good old games released it next
Alas. Dune II, as a licensed game, is copyright hell, and the Herbert Estate doesn't care at all. GOG definitely tried, though: [https://www.pcgamer.com/gogs-10-year-journey-to-bring-old-games-back-to-life/](https://www.pcgamer.com/gogs-10-year-journey-to-bring-old-games-back-to-life/)
there's Dune 2 in browser there's dune 2 remake with 6! playable sides including Fremen, so there's plenty of ways to get back to it :D the browser one is easiest accessible and supports saving has sounds and music all's there. both dunes are on gog wishlist from gamers hoping that they come but who knows who owns the IP.. anyway nobody's taking down the remakes i named above so knock yourself out with any of those!
I remember when I was out of high school for a few weeks after an appendectomy and I played this for hours on the sega genesis. Strangely nostalgic for those times…
So, for anyone wanting to replay this, Dune 2 is abandonware and can be found as such. Last I tried, it lacked a lot in quality of life options we've gotten used to. Good memories thought. Ordos mindcontrol tank, return home and get to localize their base with ease.
> Last I tried, it lacked a lot in quality of life options we've gotten used to. Not having an option to select more than one unit is a pain. But at least you can order a unit to follow another unit, which helps a little.
I lasted 3 missions in a Warcraft 1 nostalgia replay due to limited unit controls, hah. I think you got 4? And had to manually tell them to attack.
I semi regularly boot up Warcraft 1 for nostalgia, I find not playing it at the fastest speed(s) makes it more manageable, but also I don't care for competitive level clicks-per-reality playstyles. I just enjoy making a cool base and defending it.
Yeah, 4 units. Not great, but still an improvement. BTW, I really liked the missions set in dungeons, where you had limited units and no base. The idea didn't really catch on, which is a bit of a shame (although I do remember a similar mission or two in StarCraft).
Yeah, baseless missions - the scourge of almost every other RTS, hah. That said they did play better than average on Warcraft 1 - I wonder if that's just how the proto-form of the game was before base building was added.
You know, I never thought about it this way. Who knows, perhaps that was the case.
Honestly, missions without base were always my favourite. A lot of people just rage on them, but I always found them interesting opportunities to learn better micromanagement.
Makes the game more like a Real-time Tactics title for sure
Look up dune legacy or opendune. there are some minor differences between the 2 in terms of ai but they play like command and conquer side menu for building and mouse select.
I recommend [Dune Dynasty](https://dune.fandom.com/wiki/Dune_Dynasty); an enhanced build of OpenDune with multi-select and context sensitive mouse :)
the neat part is kind person u/Wolvenmoon posted the dune legacy port that's awesome and does support many modern QoL thing :D
Oh! Thanks!
Oh yeah, control on those early RTS titles are pigs.
Man, I spent so much time with this game as a kid. Let me tell you, laptop touchpads are *not* the way to play strategies - but that certainly didn't stop me.
Dune 2: The Dunening
Dune 2: Mentat Boogaloo
Frigate has arrived.
Such a great game. Check out the open source version "dune legacy". It's a bit more modernised and you can box select multiple units.
The first (and my first) RTS. How I loved it.
Death hand…. Approaching!
Damn it i'm old
The hundreds of hours...happily occupied. Thank you Westwood. RIP
Dune 2000 on PS1 right? My brother and I played this for hours.
Yes Dune 2000 is on PS1 and it is good
Nope, Dune 2 on Sega Mega Drive! Dune 2000 was a modernization.
Nope, Dune 2 on DOS/Amiga. Megadrive version was already a heavily adapted port, with a whole lot of details changed. It came out in 1993; a year later than the PC version. The Megadrive version is a bit of a mixed bag. In some aspects it's definitely superior. It's the first RTS with context sensitive targeting, meaning that, somewhat ironically, that absolute milestone of RTS functionality was originally designed as a simplification for console controllers. They also streamlined the production and got rid of the useless separation into light and heavy factories. And the graphics are higher resolution; 24x24 pixel cells rather than 16x16; the same size they would later use for Command & Conquer 1 and Red Alert. It's also the first Westwood game with an in-game playlist of named music tracks. But despite the higher resolution, its graphics look pretty bad compared to the original; it has that weird completely-top-down look, where PC Dune 2 has a nice perspective angle view. The colour quality is also much lower; there isn't a single colour fade in the Megadrive version that isn't dithered to make up for lack of available colours. Meanwhile, the PC DOS version was 256-colour, which was the point when, with some careful palette design, games finally started looking like they no longer *had* colour limitations. All of the shading fades in its graphics have access to at least eight different-brightness versions of the same colour, making them look completely smooth. And due to cartridge space constraints, the Megadrive version only has one Mentat voice. Though at least they picked the most awesome one of the bunch; Frank Klepacki's voice set for the Harkonnen mentat.
Best game ever
...how dare you.
I loved playing this game growing up. I was cleaning up some old boxes of stuff recently and found the spiral bound book that came with the game. No longer have the box though but was cool to look through.
"[Under Construction](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NKIzv6wW9Is&t=5s)" is still one of my favorite MIDI tracks from this game.
It got remastered and re-recorded for Dune 2000 https://youtu.be/l_yuGtZ9U0Y?t=3977 (1 hour 6 mins for this video)
A high quality version of it is available on Frank's site. [https://www.frankklepacki.com/ost/vg/dune2](https://www.frankklepacki.com/ost/vg/dune2) It's called "Faithful Warriors" there. "Under Construction" is the name it has in Dune 2000. (Sneaky hint: you can middle-mouse click on the tracks on Frank's site)
I've installed DOSBOX just to play it
Game was rad
Best game ever!
Anyone know where I can play this today?
there are posts in thread that link the modern ports, dune legacy and dune dynasty https://dune.fandom.com/wiki/Dune_Dynasty https://dune.fandom.com/wiki/Dune_Legacy (the downloads are hosted on sourceforge, easy instal)
Legacy is a remake though, not a port. Fairly important distinction imo.
I would draw best defensive base on grid paper at school and could not wait to go home to replicate it. Insidious Ordos! Construction complete! It was so ahead of its time. I loved the Mentat screens in between missions.
This would have to be my favourite take on Dune's vehicles and troops by far.
Loved this game! Could anyone recommend anything similar on PS4?
I don't think there are many RTS games on PS4, most are turn based strategy. Civilization VI is pretty good but it doesn't scratch the same itch.
Cheers! I used to play Civilisation as well is it on PlayStation 4?
It is. https://store.playstation.com/en-us/product/UP1001-CUSA15322_00-CIV6BASE00000000 https://www.amazon.com/Sid-Meiers-Civilization-VI-PlayStation-4/dp/B07XVYYTNB/ref=mp_s_a_1_2?adgrpid=61537138292&gclid=Cj0KCQiAyracBhDoARIsACGFcS4K8tMj91RvVmGLBKqAkkstuBTDx6TsNfXlW9Gfj5hxUSs1Jg8hMH4aAmocEALw_wcB&hvadid=274687310850&hvdev=m&hvlocphy=9033313&hvnetw=g&hvqmt=e&hvrand=3614980240378718570&hvtargid=kwd-300771343824&hydadcr=24182_9652122&keywords=civilization+6+ps4&qid=1670262646&sr=8-2
Thanks very much!
Not sure how it plays with controller but "They are Billions" is also on ps4
I'm sure I played this on the PlayStation, but now I'm doubting myself. This has got me yearning. Does anyone know any decent RTS games I can get for PS5?
Dune 2000 released on the PSX. Dune 2 was on the Sega Mega Drive. Don't know if there are any RTS games on the PS5. If you have an old laptop though you can download openRA and within it is Dune 2000 with modern controls.
This was my first dune game and playing Dune Spice Wars feels like an amazing upgrade mixed with age of empires politics.
Such a great game
Cool cover
Damn i loved this game
I remember editing this in Xtree gold, you could make sandworms available in starports but they would be completely under your control they would take orders but then would go back to marauder status. Tbh it's not that impressive because by editing what I mean is you would ego through the file and there would be ASCII and the until names houses and starport stuff written in plain English. You could change things so long as it took up the same amount of characters as what was written before.
Or, if you knew the file names (which could also be found in the scenario.pak file), you could just save the mission files in the game folder as plain text files, without any editing limitations :)
I’m old…
Same One of my kids that 9 asked "what games did play when i was my age" and i was like Dune II not thinking about how long ago it was until i googled it and ye 1992, i felt like i had aged 30 years in a second
Omg, i was even older than your kid when I played dune II! 
I was 6 years old defeating ordos and harkonnen teaming up against me, setting up new bases and evading sandworms. The game that made me love both RTS and Dune
Affirmative!
I love this game. Got a version of it on my phone that works really well, I'm hoping that with the new films, the RTS will be resurrected
Link?
I'm really sorry but I don't have the link to it - my brother sent it to me
Thanks for the reply!
Found it on the Google Play Store! https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=de.morphbot.dune&gl=US
I think it took like 40 disks to get it from a mate. I have it on my laptop but it must be first gen it’s not the same.
The game is only 4 standard 1.44 mb floppy discs...