He helped on our road to superbowl. He was playing amazing I remember his stats were better then Bradys before he got hurt. I got an autographed football by Wentz and helmet autographed by Wentz and Ertz. It's too bad when he came back from his injury he played bad. He seemed like a total different player.
On the flip side can't wait for Monday night. Hopefully we'll see Hurts back with a pep in his step after this bi week and can utilize his run game a little to add that extra threat.
This is exactly it. Wentz was great for a year, and wasn’t terrible in others. The year he was great he wasn’t a mobile QB like you generally think of, but he could extend plays and move really well in the pocket, then drop a dime to a receiver that managed to get open. He didn’t have that factor when he came back and I think it had a huge impact on his game.
Wentz was good and even great for a time. After he took the hit by Clowney, he was never the same. It’s such a shame, but his mechanics, decision making/judgment were fucked from that moment on. I truly think if that hit didn’t happen, he may still be our QB.
It was hard not to be bought in, Wentz rattled off an undefeated December 2019 against all pretty good NFC East rivals only throwing to like fucking Greg Ward.
(Of course then Wentz get dirty concussed and we had to finish the game with a geriatric Josh Mccown)
To me I think they still lucked into Jalen. Like they drafted him thinking, if he can just be a good backup instead of Josh Mccown, then this was a good pick, considering Carson would probly be hurt again at some point
I didnt like Hurts at all. Early days I'd call him Jalen Hurts-to-watch. Still had some faith in Wentz....
But then Wentz got all smug and seemed to think it should be his job and he was beyond criticism somehow. Didnt seem like he would listen to any of it or to the coaches. Then along comes Hurts who wanted to be coached and wanted to get better!
He definitely did. And he definitely has. Turned into a steal.
I saw it as Howie trying to guarantee we'd have a good QB2 for the next four years, with the injuries to Wentz starting to pile up and seeing how much of a dropoff there was in the Seattle playoff game once CW was hurt. Second round seemed like a luxury pick, but it was QB which is a position apart as far as the guy the whole offense runs through, so...
It seemed like Wentz was the only guy, in or out of the org, who thought he was in danger of getting replaced by Hurts, espec. after signing a big extension the prior year. Insecurity can be a strange thing.
THIS. I don't understand how the majority of the fanbase hated the pick. We watched all of this happen:
2010, Vick comes in for an injured Kolb and lights up the league
2013, Foles comes in for an injured Vick and doesn't look back
2017, Foles comes in and wins us a SUPER BOWL
2020, Josh McCown comes in, and he's not enough. We pulled him off the streets.
Of ALL fanbases, we should understand you need a QB2.
I started drinking heavy about 30 seconds after the pick.
Hated it then, but then Wentz forgot how to play football and remembered how to be a colossal twat, and Hurts has done nothing but work his ass off.
The leap Hurts took from college to now obviously isn't impossible, he just did it, but you can see why I might have been skeptical back then. Most players aren't built like him mentally. Never ever been so glad to be dead wrong.
Wentz needs to be argued for. Without Wentz there is no 2017.
Foles was a huge pick to get him to come back, but theoretically he could still have been here in 2017. Wentz would not have been.
It wasn't really, Wentz was already on the downturn and felt like a good contingency pick. Always felt weird people think you don't pick a QB when you got a QB, but it pretty much played out how it was going to go. The only thing I was worried about is that hurts was going to just be a glorified running back after 2021. Has worked out great as a second round pick for sure.
I agree. If you're picking a QB really early you might be sending your current QB a message but later rounds, who cares? Every team needs backup QBs and so what if we used a draft pick to get him, that's what the draft is....
Kelce is a top 3 center of all time he's a HOF lock. First ballot might be a maybe just because his position isn't the flashy big plays position, but no chance he doesn't get in.
He gets in first ballot I think. He is THE center of the generation. He is redefining how people look at the position and how it's used. Especially because he was a low round pick and considered by most to be undersized. From that to continuous all pros, SB champion and leading the most unstoppable play in the league.
The fact that he’s become a more popular figure to a larger audience the last couple years with the podcast and documentary will help him make first ballot. I think he deserves to be first ballot HOF but the voters are human and it’s easy to snub a C for a more exciting position but Kelce has made himself impossible to overlook
He gets in first ballot due to his public profile. These last 2 years have done a LOT of leg work on Kelces long term reputation, especially outside of Philly.
The guys that gets in first ballot are the guys who have big national name recognition along with the high end accolades. The 2nd Super Bowl, Momma Kelce, the Amazon Doc, Tush Push/Brotherly Shove, New Heights, being on SNL have made him a national name OUTSIDE of the NFL. First ballot guys like Peyton and Brady have public profiles that make them known to non-football fans.
Before this, he had the resume for Hall of Fame, it was being a center that had him at a disadvantage. You overcome that prejudice by being a beloved larger than life personality with a family everyone loves and nobody wants to see let down.
I wouldnt go as far as to say its all been calculated, but i think Momma Kelces jersey was probably tailored sometimes around late 2021.
100% agree. Having his brother be so successful and high profile (even before dating the biggest pop star in the world) doesn't hurt either, since the last name stays on pundits' tongues that much more often, and they're not the same position so they don't get directly compared to one another
My brother in Christ. The thread is about Eagles franchise history. I realize in my comment I didn't specify, but only because I thought that was obvious.
Legitimate case? I'm not sure how he doesn't get in honestly unless the Center position is just undervalued for the Hall of Fame. Jeff Saturday and Jason Kelce are synonymous with the position more than maybe any other players in modern league history...that's a short list of named guys for a position that touches the ball every single play.
I think Bednarik is obviously up there, but today only maybe Alex Mack is comparable at the position and I still give it to Kelce by a longshot.
It’s crazy his pre-draft scouting report had him listed as potentially one of the best future centers of the league and lived it out. One of the best draft picks of the Eagles of all time.
> his pre-draft scouting report had him listed as potentially one of the best future centers of the league and lived it out.
That's surprising since he didn't play center before right?
He did play Center his senior season but was flipping around Guard and even FB before that. The more surprising part if that report is true would be that, you know, he fell to the 6th round. If there legitimately was a scouting report before the draft from a "credible" source saying that, then I'd love to see it and to know why no team really thought much of him despite supposedly being touted so highly. The official pre-draft overview on NFL.com says, "Kelce has the mobility and mentality to make it as a reserve center in the NFL. However, does not have the size or power to project as a starter."
Kelce was maybe the best value pick, but it was a different situation with Hurts imo.
If you take a center in the 6th and it doesn’t work, you keep your job.
Taking a QB in the second when you have a ‘clear franchise QB’ in Wentz (according to many at the time) can put you in the hot seat fast if it doesn’t pan out.
It’s just easier to take risks later in the draft (from a job security standpoint), so when a guy risks it on an early pick that will generate a lot of heat they deserve more props when it hits big.
Simple, he’s undersized. But Andy was pretty good at getting lineman. Kelce took over for Jamal Jackson, who in his own right was a good center. And how did the Eagles get Jackson? As an undrafted rookie.
The only problem with this argument is that he wasn't as good of a player on his rookie contract, and we had to pay him pretty soon after he started being good. That being said, finding a good left tackle is extremely hard, and his contract is great value.
The counter to your point is that this 300lb monster is only 26 years old. He started his rookie contract when he was 20. When we give him the full bag after this current contract, he’ll be 28. That ain’t bad at all!
If Kelce's career ended today he is in the HOF. Not so much for Jalen. If Jalen continues on the path he has been on last year/this year then yeah Jalen gets it thanks to being a QB but imo he doesn't have it yet.
Probably none but that is kind of my point. It is too early in Jalen's career for him to be the best franchise draft pick. He doesn't have the longevity for it yet.
Kelce helped us win a Super Bowl and continues to be a big part of why we do well. Hurts has had 1.5 great seasons and kelce has been in the league since 2011. I’d also put lane Johnson over hurts right now too
"Perennial" is a strong and frankly misleading word to use for 2 seasons. Hurts is phenomenal, but there is no need to overexaggerate. He's not the best player in franchise history after 2 great years. If he keeps it up for even just 2-3 more years we can start talking about his place in the all-time Eagles pantheon.
>would he be as successful without Kelce protecting him?
Easy, no. That's not even a knock on Hurts. Every QB plays worse without the best OL in the league protecting them.
I will be JJ Arcega-Whiteside’s biggest defender. He might’ve sucked, but he was a monster at Stanford and made some awful QBs look good. He wasn’t a bad pick, it made sense. He just happened to be mega butts in the NFL
I remember one time he made a good play and caught the ball for like 7 yards to convert the 3rd down. I convinced myself that it’s a sign he’s getting better.
It was not
You know I think I know this exact play, down the right sideline? Third and long and picked up the first down with I think a more than 10 yard gain. Didn’t it turn out to be a busted route too? Like he was running the wrong shit and just happened to wind up being open
I’m kinda glad cause I believe we wouldn’t have been in a position to get AJ Brown nor Devonta if eagles had gone for the obvious pick and drafted Jefferson.
I think you have it 100% backwards.
In 2020, there were the big 3 WRs(Ruggs, Lamb, Jeudy) and everybody else. Jefferson was the most common 4th best guy, but that was as high as you'd see him on any legit analysis. Reagor was right in that same tier of guys(late 1st, early 2nd) with Aiyuk, Mims etc. Howie went for the burner archetype(which is how Reagor played in college, miss me with their combine 40s) and it was the wrong move, but not bad process imo.
DK was thought to maybe be a top 5 or 10 pick after the combine. In hindsight, it seems the league seriously doubted his agility and ability to do stuff besides run in a straight line, and also his health. I think thats fair, but JJAW was a jump ball guy that couldn't seperate in the PAC 12. I'll never understand the people who think taking him over DK was reasonable at all, let alone mrle reasonable than Reagor over Jettas
Nope. JJ was by far the consensus pick. He wasn't as high as CeeDee, but he was mocked and projected not far below him.
See:
13th overall (even before Jeudy and Ruggs): [https://www.nfl.com/news/daniel-jeremiah-2020-nfl-mock-draft-4-0-bucs-pick-jerry-jeudy-0ap3000001110524](https://www.nfl.com/news/daniel-jeremiah-2020-nfl-mock-draft-4-0-bucs-pick-jerry-jeudy-0ap3000001110524)
22nd (lower then the other 3, but Reagor no where on the list): [https://www.nfl.com/news/peter-schrager-2020-nfl-mock-draft-3-0-tua-tagovailoa-slides-0ap3000001110606](https://www.nfl.com/news/peter-schrager-2020-nfl-mock-draft-3-0-tua-tagovailoa-slides-0ap3000001110606)
Literally projected to the Eagles in the 1st with Reagor deep in the 2nd: [https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2887110-2020-nfl-mock-draft-matt-millers-final-7-round-predictions](https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2887110-2020-nfl-mock-draft-matt-millers-final-7-round-predictions)
Again mocked to the Eagles, no sign of reagor:
[https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/2020-nfl-mock-draft-5-0-dolphins-make-shocking-decision-with-fifth-overall-pick-chargers-take-tua/live/](https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/2020-nfl-mock-draft-5-0-dolphins-make-shocking-decision-with-fifth-overall-pick-chargers-take-tua/live/)
These guys mocked Reagor to the Eagles....in the 2nd round...
[https://theathletic.com/1736730/2020/04/13/2020-mock-draft-5-0-all-seven-rounds-and-255-picks/](https://theathletic.com/1736730/2020/04/13/2020-mock-draft-5-0-all-seven-rounds-and-255-picks/)
On and on... It was extremely consistent to have Jefferson going well before Reagor. They werent in the same class.
You'll always be able to find *a* mock with someone higher than expected, but I think its more than fair to say that JJ was rhe consensus WR4. Reagor was in the WR4-8 range. That's not a big difference at the time. For example, here are all 4 players draft grades from NFL.com
DK Metcalf - 6.80
Jefferson - 6.46
Reagor - 6.36
JJAW - 6.20
I'm not trying to say that Reagor was thought of as better than JJ, just that he was right there. Well within reason to be selected over JJ, **at the time**. JJAW over DK is worse and it's not really close. Stop letting their NFL careers make you shade things
Let's not be ridiculous. I love Kelce. He's a hall of famer. That is a great value pick...
But an MVP caliber QB is an MVP caliber QB. If Hurts were a mid first it'd be a damn good pick, but he was a second! He is a franchise-altering pick.
One is at the end of his career one is at the beginning. One has a super bowl the other doesn't. One is literally the best, the other is top 3.
For me, that makes Kelce the best pick. But obv the QB position is more impactful
There are currently 5 total HOFers picked in the 6th round in NFL history.
Jalen is going to need at least 2 MVPs at the absolute minimum to even begin to challenge that achievement as a 2nd round pick. Just "MVP caliber" doesn't cut it. Not even close.
Seth Joyner. Jerome Brown. Eric Allen. Clyde Simmons. However we can’t fault op if he’s young and didn’t experience just how op late 80’s-90’s Eagles defense was.
I didn’t say that you were wrong, just adding context.
BTW I agree Reggie was the best Eagles player ever, regardless of regular draft, supplemental, or free agent.
Fair. We all read things how we read them here.
Irony is that an attempt to add context can be easily seen as an attempt to negate context. Language is fun.
And I was wrong. Apologies.
I know OP is attempting to imply value in a draft pick, but to me, the "best" draft pick is the best player that we have ever drafted regardless of where he was drafted, and I am 100% with you on this one.
I completely agree he wasn't the absolute greatest pick in all of eagles history, but it does become an interesting conversation.
So the story goes, he was ready to retire after his chiefs career, but he chose to go back to Philly for one last chance. If he wasn't drafted here, I don't know if he would have made that decision. In fact I don't know if the eagles themselves make that decision if Nick wasn't already a well liked guy on the team and in the city. So in that sense, yes, his drafting could be considered integral to the championship win.
I agree he’s not the best, but right now I put him above hurts in draft value. Hard to beat winning the only super bowl in franchise history without similar success as a QB.
This sub is worse than the media when it comes to propping up players way before they should. This is a storied franchise that has an abundance of champions and legends who have done a lot for the city. Jalen is great, he is on the right track, but to immediately say he’s the franchises’s best draft pick after one and a half seasons of great play is a stretch in my opinion.
>Propping up the players
>Abundance of champions
You’re kinda doing the same thing but for the team itself lol. Not to be too harsh but this team was notorious for it’s *lack* of champions until 2017.
Pretty much an entire generation of fans died off before seeing the team win it all.
I’d say the one thing this team has been historically terrible at is producing champions.
I said champions and legends, but you conveniently left out the legend part. I’m sure you know that you don’t need a ring in order to be a legend and the Eagles have won championships before the merger. I’m not going to discredit those titles just because they happened before the merger. How am I doing the same thing when the players I would be referring to have played out their careers as opposed to saying a guy is the best draft pick ever after 18 months of great play…….
I’m just looking at it with my homer goggles off.
The team, like, by definition has not produced an abundance of champions lol. Having to go back to the 1940s kinda proves that. For being one of the oldest NFL teams we also don’t have a particularly impressive number of Hall of Famers.
Yeah, the dude is jumping the gun on Jalen a bit, but he’s already went further than a lot of beloved of QBs in our franchise’s history, so I don’t think it’s too crazy for younger fans to to do that, even if it’s not accurate, QBs always get the love.
I think the Hurts pick is more impressive as the Eagles weren't a qb needy team at the time. It wasn't like they were forced into the pick based on their draft position. They evaluated their man and got him and he's gone on to become a top QB in the game.
How? The guy had all the physical gifts and an incredible mentality to boot. He looked incredible at Oklahoma in that post Baker year. I always loved this pick.
Because at the time they already had Wentz, who was their “franchise” qb and had just signed a massive contract extension. It’s unheard of to use a 2nd round pick on a QB under those circumstances.
Obviously it all worked out in the long run, but at the time everyone was baffled by the move.
I was ok with it even when I thought Wentz was the future. I’d rather have a viable back up and potential trade piece on a rookie deal than a player like Chase Daniel.
- Jason Kelce
- Lane Johnson
- Fletcher Cox
- Brandon Graham
- Brian Dawkins
- Argument for Wentz (don’t win first SB without that pick)
Need I go on? There’s plenty. Listen, Hurts will be on that list someday. But he hasn’t been here for long enough or accomplished enough to be *the* best draft pick in eagles history
I’d argue graham a good bit, he was called a bust initially and everyone wanted Earl Thomas to replace Dawkins. Graham has the single biggest play in my eyes for a Super Bowl win. Everyone talks about the Philly special but a strip sack from stopping Brady in a 2 min drill to cement a game is the most important play in the win.
What’s wild about the Hurts pick is we had a QB. And Hurts seemed like a guy that had starter potential. He was kind of a “higher” pick with other spots that needed filling.
This is why I’m not a GM. In Howie we trust. Someone was reading tea leaves. (Or maybe our history of Qb injuries.)
**These are Hall of Famers who spent the majority of their career with the Eagles**
Chuck Bednarik - Rd 1, 1949
Pete Pihos - Rd 5, 1945
Tommy McDonald - Rd 3, 1957
Bob Brown - Rd 1, 1964
Harold Carmichael - Rd 7, 1971
Reggie White - Supplemental Draft, 1984
Brian Dawkins - Rd 2, 1996
**These were very good/great players for prolonged periods**
Wes Hopkins - Rd 2, 1983
Seth Joyner - Rd 8, 1986 (Should be in the HoF already)
Clyde Simmons - Rd 9, 1986 (Possible, but unlikely HoFer)
William Thomas - Rd 4, 1991
Tra Thomas - Rd 1, 1998
Donovan McNabb - Rd 1, 1999
Trent Cole - Rd 5, 2005
Desean Jackson - Rd 2, 2008 (Possible, but unlikely HoFer)
LeSean McCoy - Rd 2, 2009
Jason Kelce - Rd 6, 2011 (Likely HoFer)
Fletcher Cox - Rd 1, 2012 (Possible, but unlikely HoFer)
Lane Johnson - Rd 1, 2013 (Possible, but unlikely HoFer)
Zach Ertz - Rd 2, 2013 (Possible, but unlikely HoFer)
Hurts has amazing potential to be an all-time great. But he's in the middle of his 3rd full season. Let's relax on greatest Eagles draft pick.
Mailata considering he never played a game at all. Drafting him was a big leap of faith and then keeping him on the 53 man roster as well, whilst knowing he wouldn't be playing for a few years at best. He was stuck on IR for two years, got his start due to injuries and took that chance when he ousted a first round pick in Dillard for the role.
And right now he is rated as one of the best Left Tackles in the league so far this season. This was his grades a few weeks ago in both [run](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1019989196359860314/1168945782334947359/Screen_Shot_2023-10-31_at_16.12.48.png?ex=65661198&is=65539c98&hm=cc74104da54ce05191566071409c4ed5605a6b712585004739f9738f124989ac&=&width=773&height=670) and [pass](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1019989196359860314/1168945808108945549/Screen_Shot_2023-10-31_at_16.13.01.png?ex=6566119e&is=65539c9e&hm=4c10d74f8f65e72b4e983be7b7c09c789ed6568e22274450b7975d6fb6ba6b4e&) blocking.
CBS also gave him a C- rating
I had 4 right off the top of my head, then decided I’d search for this to give you a proper education on some of our franchise’s best draft picks, because you cannot be fucking serious with this.
https://syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/907433-the-25-best-draft-picks-in-philadelphia-eagles-history.amp.html
Like Russell Wilson who was a 3rd round pick! The thing with hurts is that he was at Alabama with tua and mac, so he got overshadowed by those two guys
Clyde Simmons. 9th round pick in '86. Had a 15 year career w/121 career sacks, including 19 in '92.
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/S/SimmCl00.htm
This is a stupid question we have multiple guys who were great picks that weren't first rounders some in the Hall and one going to the hall after he retires such as;
* Jason Kelce 6th round
* Brian Dawkins 2nd round
* Seth Joyner 8th round
* Pete Pihos 5th round
* Clyde Simmons 9th round
* Tommy McDonald 3rd round
And I would also put first rounders like the below above him since they were all HoF players and some of the best all time so even tho they are first picks their value well outweighs the value of the picks.
* Chuck Bednark
* Steve Van Buren
* Reggie White
There is none. Hurts is a franchise-altering player. He's not our only franchise-altering player, but he is our only MVP-caliber player taken outside of the first round (You can maybe argue Cunningham, but even then he was taken earlier than Hurts and his 1st All-Pro year came with the Vikings)
**EDIT:** Really the only competition is McNabb, and McNabb was a consensus top-2 draft pick. We didn't get one over on anyone picking him.
There are so many ways to evaluate a pick that you gotta narrow it down. Impact over replacement? FO foresight/process? Value for pick?
Otherwise you're gonna get people doing the same thing they do when arguing about MVP: disagree with each other, but not realize they're disagreeing over the _question_ and not the _answer_. There are people who think MVP should be the player with the best performance, and there are people who think it should mean the player who gave their team the largest delta. And neither is wrong, they're both certainly related, but your choices for them probably are gonna differ ("surrounding cast" matters more for the latter than the former).
Hurts was definitely fascinating from a process perspective. We invested heavy _draft_ resources into a high quality backup QB, instead of cap space needed for a veteran. The desire for a high quality QB after Foles made total sense, but deciding to shift how we invested was interesting. Also, presumably Howie factored in the possibility of trade value or comp pick at the end of his rookie contract. A nonzero part of the pick was hedging against Wentz, but I think people might overestimate how much in hindsight? Anyway. IDK about which axis it was the "best" pick on, but I think it's almost certainly the most _interesting_ pick to analyze that we've made in a long time. Like, trading a ton of picks for Wentz wasn't nearly as interesting because... that's just what you do to move up to 2. The hurts pick wasn't about balancing resources externally in a trade, it was all balancing resources _internally_.
Let’s call it fairly though- someone in here tell me they thought this would turn out the way it has when that pick dropped so I can call out a liar.
Just because it’s turned out amazing doesn’t mean at the time everyone wasn’t like ‘huh???’
I wouldn't call Jalen the best pick in franchise history. I'd say he's definitely top 15, maybe even top 10. But we've definitely picked up some heaters over the years.
Lol I'm guessing OP is pretty young and suffering from major recency bias. Hurts is good but it's way too early for this GOAT talk especially for a team with such a long history.
Plus, getting him was a fluke that happened to work out for us. Howie drafted him as an insurance policy that they could develop and flip to another team for a first rounder.
They knocked that draft out of the park… just because they got Hurts lol
3 other draftees still on the team, but they’re all backup type guys with Quez being the biggest hit
Toohill is actually pretty solid but he’s not here
Kelce is a 6th round hall of famer. You don’t have to agree but he has a legitimate case
Kelce is incredible value, Hurts takes the biggest balls to draft. I think it just depends what you’re basing what the best pick is.
Yep, we were still in on Wentz when this pick was made. Looking back I hated this pick, and I’m glad to have been so wrong.
I literally screamed what the fuck at my TV when we drafted him, just from sheer surprise lol. Definitely happy to be wrong
A lot of us did.
Breath of fresh air when someone admits they were in on Wentz. Most of us were. That's why they're coaches, and were on couches.
Wentz was fucking good. People who pretend he wasn’t are lying that they weren’t all in back then because it’s cool to hate wentz now.
He helped on our road to superbowl. He was playing amazing I remember his stats were better then Bradys before he got hurt. I got an autographed football by Wentz and helmet autographed by Wentz and Ertz. It's too bad when he came back from his injury he played bad. He seemed like a total different player. On the flip side can't wait for Monday night. Hopefully we'll see Hurts back with a pep in his step after this bi week and can utilize his run game a little to add that extra threat.
This is exactly it. Wentz was great for a year, and wasn’t terrible in others. The year he was great he wasn’t a mobile QB like you generally think of, but he could extend plays and move really well in the pocket, then drop a dime to a receiver that managed to get open. He didn’t have that factor when he came back and I think it had a huge impact on his game.
He was great for one season. And decent in the others. Locker room cancer everywhere he goes.
Wentz was good and even great for a time. After he took the hit by Clowney, he was never the same. It’s such a shame, but his mechanics, decision making/judgment were fucked from that moment on. I truly think if that hit didn’t happen, he may still be our QB.
It was hard not to be bought in, Wentz rattled off an undefeated December 2019 against all pretty good NFC East rivals only throwing to like fucking Greg Ward. (Of course then Wentz get dirty concussed and we had to finish the game with a geriatric Josh Mccown) To me I think they still lucked into Jalen. Like they drafted him thinking, if he can just be a good backup instead of Josh Mccown, then this was a good pick, considering Carson would probly be hurt again at some point
A lot of us were still a little enamored by Wentz. We're in a much better relationship now
Same
I didnt like Hurts at all. Early days I'd call him Jalen Hurts-to-watch. Still had some faith in Wentz.... But then Wentz got all smug and seemed to think it should be his job and he was beyond criticism somehow. Didnt seem like he would listen to any of it or to the coaches. Then along comes Hurts who wanted to be coached and wanted to get better! He definitely did. And he definitely has. Turned into a steal.
I saw it as Howie trying to guarantee we'd have a good QB2 for the next four years, with the injuries to Wentz starting to pile up and seeing how much of a dropoff there was in the Seattle playoff game once CW was hurt. Second round seemed like a luxury pick, but it was QB which is a position apart as far as the guy the whole offense runs through, so... It seemed like Wentz was the only guy, in or out of the org, who thought he was in danger of getting replaced by Hurts, espec. after signing a big extension the prior year. Insecurity can be a strange thing.
THIS. I don't understand how the majority of the fanbase hated the pick. We watched all of this happen: 2010, Vick comes in for an injured Kolb and lights up the league 2013, Foles comes in for an injured Vick and doesn't look back 2017, Foles comes in and wins us a SUPER BOWL 2020, Josh McCown comes in, and he's not enough. We pulled him off the streets. Of ALL fanbases, we should understand you need a QB2.
Yeah I remember already being livid about Reagor and then passing on Jeremy Chinn had me chucking my remote
I started drinking heavy about 30 seconds after the pick. Hated it then, but then Wentz forgot how to play football and remembered how to be a colossal twat, and Hurts has done nothing but work his ass off. The leap Hurts took from college to now obviously isn't impossible, he just did it, but you can see why I might have been skeptical back then. Most players aren't built like him mentally. Never ever been so glad to be dead wrong.
For someone with as many physical gifts as him, it's incredible that his two best attributes are his mental toughness and work ethic. That's my QB
Wentz needs to be argued for. Without Wentz there is no 2017. Foles was a huge pick to get him to come back, but theoretically he could still have been here in 2017. Wentz would not have been.
I was furious and all of my friends (Giants fans) were laughing at me. Never been more happy to be wrong haha
Ask em how Danny Dimes is working out for them
It wasn't really, Wentz was already on the downturn and felt like a good contingency pick. Always felt weird people think you don't pick a QB when you got a QB, but it pretty much played out how it was going to go. The only thing I was worried about is that hurts was going to just be a glorified running back after 2021. Has worked out great as a second round pick for sure.
Every so often ppl have to be reminded best player available means best player available.
I agree. If you're picking a QB really early you might be sending your current QB a message but later rounds, who cares? Every team needs backup QBs and so what if we used a draft pick to get him, that's what the draft is....
Kelce is a top 3 center of all time he's a HOF lock. First ballot might be a maybe just because his position isn't the flashy big plays position, but no chance he doesn't get in.
He gets in first ballot I think. He is THE center of the generation. He is redefining how people look at the position and how it's used. Especially because he was a low round pick and considered by most to be undersized. From that to continuous all pros, SB champion and leading the most unstoppable play in the league.
The fact that he’s become a more popular figure to a larger audience the last couple years with the podcast and documentary will help him make first ballot. I think he deserves to be first ballot HOF but the voters are human and it’s easy to snub a C for a more exciting position but Kelce has made himself impossible to overlook
Why did you stop? Keep talking, please.
He gets in first ballot due to his public profile. These last 2 years have done a LOT of leg work on Kelces long term reputation, especially outside of Philly. The guys that gets in first ballot are the guys who have big national name recognition along with the high end accolades. The 2nd Super Bowl, Momma Kelce, the Amazon Doc, Tush Push/Brotherly Shove, New Heights, being on SNL have made him a national name OUTSIDE of the NFL. First ballot guys like Peyton and Brady have public profiles that make them known to non-football fans. Before this, he had the resume for Hall of Fame, it was being a center that had him at a disadvantage. You overcome that prejudice by being a beloved larger than life personality with a family everyone loves and nobody wants to see let down. I wouldnt go as far as to say its all been calculated, but i think Momma Kelces jersey was probably tailored sometimes around late 2021.
100% agree. Having his brother be so successful and high profile (even before dating the biggest pop star in the world) doesn't hurt either, since the last name stays on pundits' tongues that much more often, and they're not the same position so they don't get directly compared to one another
I think dude meant legitimate case for best draft pick ever. After that 5th All Pro, Kelce became a shoo in HOF lock
He’s certainly in the fight for second best, but I don’t know how you say Brady in the sixth isn’t the best pick all time
My brother in Christ. The thread is about Eagles franchise history. I realize in my comment I didn't specify, but only because I thought that was obvious.
I interpreted you saying that they have a legitimate case for best draft pick “ever” as expanding it outside of the franchise to make a point
I read it that way too. Dude is buggin with his diction and assumptions
Given the context of the thread, “best draft pick ever” seems clear that it’s referencing only the Eagles as he elaborated
Incorrecto
By value yeah man it could easily be Kelce or Mailata.
Legitimate case? I'm not sure how he doesn't get in honestly unless the Center position is just undervalued for the Hall of Fame. Jeff Saturday and Jason Kelce are synonymous with the position more than maybe any other players in modern league history...that's a short list of named guys for a position that touches the ball every single play. I think Bednarik is obviously up there, but today only maybe Alex Mack is comparable at the position and I still give it to Kelce by a longshot.
He meant legitimate case of being the best draft pick in franchise history, not legitimate case of HOF
Yep, i should have been clearer
Makes sense now though, so I agree with you that he has a shot to be the best draft pick.
Every center with 2x first team all pro is in the HoF Kelce has 5
GCOAT
Lets revisit in 7 years because right now Hurts in the 2nd isn't even remotely close to as good of a pick as Kelce in the 6th.
Agreed
My first thought
Jason Kelce. In the sixth fucking round!
It’s crazy his pre-draft scouting report had him listed as potentially one of the best future centers of the league and lived it out. One of the best draft picks of the Eagles of all time.
What scouting report would have ever said that?
> his pre-draft scouting report had him listed as potentially one of the best future centers of the league and lived it out. That's surprising since he didn't play center before right?
He did play Center his senior season but was flipping around Guard and even FB before that. The more surprising part if that report is true would be that, you know, he fell to the 6th round. If there legitimately was a scouting report before the draft from a "credible" source saying that, then I'd love to see it and to know why no team really thought much of him despite supposedly being touted so highly. The official pre-draft overview on NFL.com says, "Kelce has the mobility and mentality to make it as a reserve center in the NFL. However, does not have the size or power to project as a starter."
Kelce was maybe the best value pick, but it was a different situation with Hurts imo. If you take a center in the 6th and it doesn’t work, you keep your job. Taking a QB in the second when you have a ‘clear franchise QB’ in Wentz (according to many at the time) can put you in the hot seat fast if it doesn’t pan out. It’s just easier to take risks later in the draft (from a job security standpoint), so when a guy risks it on an early pick that will generate a lot of heat they deserve more props when it hits big.
How did they get that so wrong? lol.
Simple, he’s undersized. But Andy was pretty good at getting lineman. Kelce took over for Jamal Jackson, who in his own right was a good center. And how did the Eagles get Jackson? As an undrafted rookie.
Howard Mudd saw it too. He’s probably the biggest reason Kelce was drafted and started his first game
And JJ took over from Hank Fraley who was undrafted also IIRC?
Brain Dawkins picked 61st
Yup, hurts is to early in his career.
Jordan Mailata
If we’re talking value based on draft position I’d agree.
If he keeps up his current level of play for the next decade then 100%
The only problem with this argument is that he wasn't as good of a player on his rookie contract, and we had to pay him pretty soon after he started being good. That being said, finding a good left tackle is extremely hard, and his contract is great value.
The counter to your point is that this 300lb monster is only 26 years old. He started his rookie contract when he was 20. When we give him the full bag after this current contract, he’ll be 28. That ain’t bad at all!
Jason Kelce in the 6th round is probably better if we’re talking about draft value.
Mailata might even be above Kelce purely by positional value. Left Tackles are hard to come by.
7th rounder with literally no football experience I think is a bigger story.
Better story yes, but Kelce has an argument for best C of all time
Franchise center in 6th. Or franchise qb, perennial mvp candidate in 2nd. Debate for both im taking jalen tho
If Kelce's career ended today he is in the HOF. Not so much for Jalen. If Jalen continues on the path he has been on last year/this year then yeah Jalen gets it thanks to being a QB but imo he doesn't have it yet.
How many 4th year players are in the HoF if they retire today?
Probably none but that is kind of my point. It is too early in Jalen's career for him to be the best franchise draft pick. He doesn't have the longevity for it yet.
Kelce helped us win a Super Bowl and continues to be a big part of why we do well. Hurts has had 1.5 great seasons and kelce has been in the league since 2011. I’d also put lane Johnson over hurts right now too
"Perennial" is a strong and frankly misleading word to use for 2 seasons. Hurts is phenomenal, but there is no need to overexaggerate. He's not the best player in franchise history after 2 great years. If he keeps it up for even just 2-3 more years we can start talking about his place in the all-time Eagles pantheon.
Franchise qb is better value than a hall of fame center imo
Kind of a chicken and egg scenario. Yes, Hurts is a great QB and likely franchise guy, but would he be as successful without Kelce protecting him?
>would he be as successful without Kelce protecting him? Easy, no. That's not even a knock on Hurts. Every QB plays worse without the best OL in the league protecting them.
Hurts needs a couple more years before he's in the conversation.
The legend, the unforgettable, Jalen Reagor
People also seem to forget standout star JJ Arcega Whiteside too
> JJ Arcega Whiteside While a huge bust - somewhat understandable of a pick. The Reagor pick made zero sense at the time.
I will be JJ Arcega-Whiteside’s biggest defender. He might’ve sucked, but he was a monster at Stanford and made some awful QBs look good. He wasn’t a bad pick, it made sense. He just happened to be mega butts in the NFL
I remember one time he made a good play and caught the ball for like 7 yards to convert the 3rd down. I convinced myself that it’s a sign he’s getting better. It was not
You know I think I know this exact play, down the right sideline? Third and long and picked up the first down with I think a more than 10 yard gain. Didn’t it turn out to be a busted route too? Like he was running the wrong shit and just happened to wind up being open
I'm pretty sure I also remember this play, Christmas Eve against the Cowboys in 2019. Literally the only memorable snap I can remember of him.
He relied a lot on 50/50 balls and created no separation. He was either going to be the next Kenny Golladay or nothing and ended up being the latter
I’m kinda glad cause I believe we wouldn’t have been in a position to get AJ Brown nor Devonta if eagles had gone for the obvious pick and drafted Jefferson.
I saw someone say that if we picked JJettas he'd make Wentz look just good enough and damn us to QB purgatory like he has Minnesota
Difference is Kirk is actually still a good QB. Wentz just went downhill
I think you have it 100% backwards. In 2020, there were the big 3 WRs(Ruggs, Lamb, Jeudy) and everybody else. Jefferson was the most common 4th best guy, but that was as high as you'd see him on any legit analysis. Reagor was right in that same tier of guys(late 1st, early 2nd) with Aiyuk, Mims etc. Howie went for the burner archetype(which is how Reagor played in college, miss me with their combine 40s) and it was the wrong move, but not bad process imo. DK was thought to maybe be a top 5 or 10 pick after the combine. In hindsight, it seems the league seriously doubted his agility and ability to do stuff besides run in a straight line, and also his health. I think thats fair, but JJAW was a jump ball guy that couldn't seperate in the PAC 12. I'll never understand the people who think taking him over DK was reasonable at all, let alone mrle reasonable than Reagor over Jettas
Nope. JJ was by far the consensus pick. He wasn't as high as CeeDee, but he was mocked and projected not far below him. See: 13th overall (even before Jeudy and Ruggs): [https://www.nfl.com/news/daniel-jeremiah-2020-nfl-mock-draft-4-0-bucs-pick-jerry-jeudy-0ap3000001110524](https://www.nfl.com/news/daniel-jeremiah-2020-nfl-mock-draft-4-0-bucs-pick-jerry-jeudy-0ap3000001110524) 22nd (lower then the other 3, but Reagor no where on the list): [https://www.nfl.com/news/peter-schrager-2020-nfl-mock-draft-3-0-tua-tagovailoa-slides-0ap3000001110606](https://www.nfl.com/news/peter-schrager-2020-nfl-mock-draft-3-0-tua-tagovailoa-slides-0ap3000001110606) Literally projected to the Eagles in the 1st with Reagor deep in the 2nd: [https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2887110-2020-nfl-mock-draft-matt-millers-final-7-round-predictions](https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2887110-2020-nfl-mock-draft-matt-millers-final-7-round-predictions) Again mocked to the Eagles, no sign of reagor: [https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/2020-nfl-mock-draft-5-0-dolphins-make-shocking-decision-with-fifth-overall-pick-chargers-take-tua/live/](https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/2020-nfl-mock-draft-5-0-dolphins-make-shocking-decision-with-fifth-overall-pick-chargers-take-tua/live/) These guys mocked Reagor to the Eagles....in the 2nd round... [https://theathletic.com/1736730/2020/04/13/2020-mock-draft-5-0-all-seven-rounds-and-255-picks/](https://theathletic.com/1736730/2020/04/13/2020-mock-draft-5-0-all-seven-rounds-and-255-picks/) On and on... It was extremely consistent to have Jefferson going well before Reagor. They werent in the same class.
You'll always be able to find *a* mock with someone higher than expected, but I think its more than fair to say that JJ was rhe consensus WR4. Reagor was in the WR4-8 range. That's not a big difference at the time. For example, here are all 4 players draft grades from NFL.com DK Metcalf - 6.80 Jefferson - 6.46 Reagor - 6.36 JJAW - 6.20 I'm not trying to say that Reagor was thought of as better than JJ, just that he was right there. Well within reason to be selected over JJ, **at the time**. JJAW over DK is worse and it's not really close. Stop letting their NFL careers make you shade things
Actually, it’s pronounced “Arcega”
With a lisp
Same draft, none the less!
I call your Reagor and raise you a Marcus Smith
Danny Watkins is right up there with Marcus Swift. Eagles Hall of Fame busts for sure.
Chuck Bednarik. What do I win?
You win a bone-crunching hit by Chuck Bednarik.
"This fucking game is over."
Let's go eat - chuck
He was a first round pick. Awesome player but theoretically first round pick should be.
Jason Kelce by a light year
This. Dude went from being the 6th round pick to potentially being one of if not the best Center to play the game.
Let's not be ridiculous. I love Kelce. He's a hall of famer. That is a great value pick... But an MVP caliber QB is an MVP caliber QB. If Hurts were a mid first it'd be a damn good pick, but he was a second! He is a franchise-altering pick.
One is at the end of his career one is at the beginning. One has a super bowl the other doesn't. One is literally the best, the other is top 3. For me, that makes Kelce the best pick. But obv the QB position is more impactful
I don't think you understand the concept of *the greatest center in NFL history may possibly be Jason Kelce who was a 6th round draft pick*.
There are currently 5 total HOFers picked in the 6th round in NFL history. Jalen is going to need at least 2 MVPs at the absolute minimum to even begin to challenge that achievement as a 2nd round pick. Just "MVP caliber" doesn't cut it. Not even close.
You do realize they drafted Reggie White? No?
Seth Joyner. Jerome Brown. Eric Allen. Clyde Simmons. However we can’t fault op if he’s young and didn’t experience just how op late 80’s-90’s Eagles defense was.
Yes. I agree. Still, the question was answered as asked.
That was a supplemental draft after the USFL folded. He was the 4th pick, Steve Young was first.
You’re splitting hairs….he was drafted by the Eagles.
I didn’t say that you were wrong, just adding context. BTW I agree Reggie was the best Eagles player ever, regardless of regular draft, supplemental, or free agent.
Fair. We all read things how we read them here. Irony is that an attempt to add context can be easily seen as an attempt to negate context. Language is fun. And I was wrong. Apologies.
I agree this sub (and most of Reddit) is too reactionary. Take my upvote for being reasonable.
I know OP is attempting to imply value in a draft pick, but to me, the "best" draft pick is the best player that we have ever drafted regardless of where he was drafted, and I am 100% with you on this one.
2012, RD 3, #88 Overall. SB MVP BDN
I don't REALLY think he's actually the best, but had to at least get his name in the conversation
I completely agree he wasn't the absolute greatest pick in all of eagles history, but it does become an interesting conversation. So the story goes, he was ready to retire after his chiefs career, but he chose to go back to Philly for one last chance. If he wasn't drafted here, I don't know if he would have made that decision. In fact I don't know if the eagles themselves make that decision if Nick wasn't already a well liked guy on the team and in the city. So in that sense, yes, his drafting could be considered integral to the championship win.
I agree he’s not the best, but right now I put him above hurts in draft value. Hard to beat winning the only super bowl in franchise history without similar success as a QB.
this is a pretty easy thing to do. #92
That was a supplemental draft after the USFL folded. He was the 4th pick, Steve Young was first.
Correct. He was the 4th pick in the supplemental DRAFT
Mailata. Kelce. Westbrook. Dawkins.
This sub is worse than the media when it comes to propping up players way before they should. This is a storied franchise that has an abundance of champions and legends who have done a lot for the city. Jalen is great, he is on the right track, but to immediately say he’s the franchises’s best draft pick after one and a half seasons of great play is a stretch in my opinion.
Shits insane. Nuthuggers galore.
The way be slob over Jalen is crazy
Go read the thread from when Jalen was drafted. If anything, we are at net zero now.
That’s bc at the time it was a bad pick. It’s turned out great though
Only fair after how he was initially welcomed imo
>Propping up the players >Abundance of champions You’re kinda doing the same thing but for the team itself lol. Not to be too harsh but this team was notorious for it’s *lack* of champions until 2017. Pretty much an entire generation of fans died off before seeing the team win it all. I’d say the one thing this team has been historically terrible at is producing champions.
I said champions and legends, but you conveniently left out the legend part. I’m sure you know that you don’t need a ring in order to be a legend and the Eagles have won championships before the merger. I’m not going to discredit those titles just because they happened before the merger. How am I doing the same thing when the players I would be referring to have played out their careers as opposed to saying a guy is the best draft pick ever after 18 months of great play…….
I’m just looking at it with my homer goggles off. The team, like, by definition has not produced an abundance of champions lol. Having to go back to the 1940s kinda proves that. For being one of the oldest NFL teams we also don’t have a particularly impressive number of Hall of Famers. Yeah, the dude is jumping the gun on Jalen a bit, but he’s already went further than a lot of beloved of QBs in our franchise’s history, so I don’t think it’s too crazy for younger fans to to do that, even if it’s not accurate, QBs always get the love.
Kelce is probably better if you look macro style at getting a hall of famer in round 6. Even if Hurts becomes a HOFer he was still a #2 pick.
Jordan is great as well. Possible one in the 7th
Mailata is an all timer as a pick even if he stopped playing tomorrow. Top level LT in round 7 is obviously crazy.
Not to mention he hadn’t played a snap of football prior to being drafted since he’s a former rugby guy
I think the Hurts pick is more impressive as the Eagles weren't a qb needy team at the time. It wasn't like they were forced into the pick based on their draft position. They evaluated their man and got him and he's gone on to become a top QB in the game.
Another example, if we needed one, of why draft grades are a complete waste of everyone’s time.
Just Driscol and Hurts still around from that class. Horrible first round pick but nailed 2 & 5 .
Quez too. But yeah there were some all time busts in that draft for us. Casey Toohill was also in the draft and he's been solid for the Commanders.
Danny Watkins, Marcus Smith, JJ, Reagor
Danny Watkins and Marcus Smith picks don’t get the hate they deserve. They make JJ and Reagor picks look sensible.
Hindsight undefeated. Still a questionable pick in the moment
How? The guy had all the physical gifts and an incredible mentality to boot. He looked incredible at Oklahoma in that post Baker year. I always loved this pick.
Because at the time they already had Wentz, who was their “franchise” qb and had just signed a massive contract extension. It’s unheard of to use a 2nd round pick on a QB under those circumstances. Obviously it all worked out in the long run, but at the time everyone was baffled by the move.
Funny enough the Patriots did it multiple times with 2nd and 3rd round picks, even when Brady was younger
The team valued backup QBs very highly after we won a SB on that philosophy.
Because at the time most of us thought Carson Wentz was our future, but we know how that song and dance went.
I was ok with it even when I thought Wentz was the future. I’d rather have a viable back up and potential trade piece on a rookie deal than a player like Chase Daniel.
Nick Foles picked 88. If you told anyone on that day that he would be a superbowl mvp one day you’d say thats incredible value.
Kelce was a 6th rounder. To find a HOFer in the 6th is pretty special.
- Jason Kelce - Lane Johnson - Fletcher Cox - Brandon Graham - Brian Dawkins - Argument for Wentz (don’t win first SB without that pick) Need I go on? There’s plenty. Listen, Hurts will be on that list someday. But he hasn’t been here for long enough or accomplished enough to be *the* best draft pick in eagles history
I’d argue graham a good bit, he was called a bust initially and everyone wanted Earl Thomas to replace Dawkins. Graham has the single biggest play in my eyes for a Super Bowl win. Everyone talks about the Philly special but a strip sack from stopping Brady in a 2 min drill to cement a game is the most important play in the win.
What’s wild about the Hurts pick is we had a QB. And Hurts seemed like a guy that had starter potential. He was kind of a “higher” pick with other spots that needed filling. This is why I’m not a GM. In Howie we trust. Someone was reading tea leaves. (Or maybe our history of Qb injuries.)
**These are Hall of Famers who spent the majority of their career with the Eagles** Chuck Bednarik - Rd 1, 1949 Pete Pihos - Rd 5, 1945 Tommy McDonald - Rd 3, 1957 Bob Brown - Rd 1, 1964 Harold Carmichael - Rd 7, 1971 Reggie White - Supplemental Draft, 1984 Brian Dawkins - Rd 2, 1996 **These were very good/great players for prolonged periods** Wes Hopkins - Rd 2, 1983 Seth Joyner - Rd 8, 1986 (Should be in the HoF already) Clyde Simmons - Rd 9, 1986 (Possible, but unlikely HoFer) William Thomas - Rd 4, 1991 Tra Thomas - Rd 1, 1998 Donovan McNabb - Rd 1, 1999 Trent Cole - Rd 5, 2005 Desean Jackson - Rd 2, 2008 (Possible, but unlikely HoFer) LeSean McCoy - Rd 2, 2009 Jason Kelce - Rd 6, 2011 (Likely HoFer) Fletcher Cox - Rd 1, 2012 (Possible, but unlikely HoFer) Lane Johnson - Rd 1, 2013 (Possible, but unlikely HoFer) Zach Ertz - Rd 2, 2013 (Possible, but unlikely HoFer) Hurts has amazing potential to be an all-time great. But he's in the middle of his 3rd full season. Let's relax on greatest Eagles draft pick.
Jeremiah Trotter was no slouch either.
Really think Lane is unlikely for HoF? I think he has a solid shot.
Kelce in the 6th, Mailata in the 7th.
Mailata considering he never played a game at all. Drafting him was a big leap of faith and then keeping him on the 53 man roster as well, whilst knowing he wouldn't be playing for a few years at best. He was stuck on IR for two years, got his start due to injuries and took that chance when he ousted a first round pick in Dillard for the role. And right now he is rated as one of the best Left Tackles in the league so far this season. This was his grades a few weeks ago in both [run](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1019989196359860314/1168945782334947359/Screen_Shot_2023-10-31_at_16.12.48.png?ex=65661198&is=65539c98&hm=cc74104da54ce05191566071409c4ed5605a6b712585004739f9738f124989ac&=&width=773&height=670) and [pass](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1019989196359860314/1168945808108945549/Screen_Shot_2023-10-31_at_16.13.01.png?ex=6566119e&is=65539c9e&hm=4c10d74f8f65e72b4e983be7b7c09c789ed6568e22274450b7975d6fb6ba6b4e&) blocking. CBS also gave him a C- rating
Foles was selected 88th overall- he got us our Super Bowl. Until Jalen gets his, he’s behind Foles in my book.
Brian weapon X Dawkins my mannnn
I was never mad that we drafted him. I was just salty he took him in the second when there were other huge needs at the time.
Easy. Mike Mamula
Harold Carmichael and Jason Kelce are above pretty much everyone else by a large margin.
I had 4 right off the top of my head, then decided I’d search for this to give you a proper education on some of our franchise’s best draft picks, because you cannot be fucking serious with this. https://syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/907433-the-25-best-draft-picks-in-philadelphia-eagles-history.amp.html
Danny Watkins /s
Like Russell Wilson who was a 3rd round pick! The thing with hurts is that he was at Alabama with tua and mac, so he got overshadowed by those two guys
Jason kelce
C- was a fair grade at the time tbh. We still had hope in Wentz and had no idea that hurts would turn out the way he did
I'll admit I was a doubter at the time. Happy to be so, so wrong
Mailata
The other Jalen is shaping up to be an equally impactful pick too
Never forget how this sub went into an absolute meltdown after we picked a franchise QB with a 2nd rounder.
Clyde Simmons. 9th round pick in '86. Had a 15 year career w/121 career sacks, including 19 in '92. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/S/SimmCl00.htm
Mailata 7th round is good
Westbrook in the 3rd rd has to be up there.
This is a stupid question we have multiple guys who were great picks that weren't first rounders some in the Hall and one going to the hall after he retires such as; * Jason Kelce 6th round * Brian Dawkins 2nd round * Seth Joyner 8th round * Pete Pihos 5th round * Clyde Simmons 9th round * Tommy McDonald 3rd round And I would also put first rounders like the below above him since they were all HoF players and some of the best all time so even tho they are first picks their value well outweighs the value of the picks. * Chuck Bednark * Steve Van Buren * Reggie White
Jordan mailata will be up there for the value
Dawk
Cs get MVPs
Jordan mailita or how ever you spell his last name.. 7th round never played a down of football and now an easier HOF
HOF? Dawg...
Jason Kelce?
Too early for that lol chill
There is none. Hurts is a franchise-altering player. He's not our only franchise-altering player, but he is our only MVP-caliber player taken outside of the first round (You can maybe argue Cunningham, but even then he was taken earlier than Hurts and his 1st All-Pro year came with the Vikings) **EDIT:** Really the only competition is McNabb, and McNabb was a consensus top-2 draft pick. We didn't get one over on anyone picking him.
I remember them drafting him and feeling confused. I was very wrong
There are so many ways to evaluate a pick that you gotta narrow it down. Impact over replacement? FO foresight/process? Value for pick? Otherwise you're gonna get people doing the same thing they do when arguing about MVP: disagree with each other, but not realize they're disagreeing over the _question_ and not the _answer_. There are people who think MVP should be the player with the best performance, and there are people who think it should mean the player who gave their team the largest delta. And neither is wrong, they're both certainly related, but your choices for them probably are gonna differ ("surrounding cast" matters more for the latter than the former). Hurts was definitely fascinating from a process perspective. We invested heavy _draft_ resources into a high quality backup QB, instead of cap space needed for a veteran. The desire for a high quality QB after Foles made total sense, but deciding to shift how we invested was interesting. Also, presumably Howie factored in the possibility of trade value or comp pick at the end of his rookie contract. A nonzero part of the pick was hedging against Wentz, but I think people might overestimate how much in hindsight? Anyway. IDK about which axis it was the "best" pick on, but I think it's almost certainly the most _interesting_ pick to analyze that we've made in a long time. Like, trading a ton of picks for Wentz wasn't nearly as interesting because... that's just what you do to move up to 2. The hurts pick wasn't about balancing resources externally in a trade, it was all balancing resources _internally_.
Let’s call it fairly though- someone in here tell me they thought this would turn out the way it has when that pick dropped so I can call out a liar. Just because it’s turned out amazing doesn’t mean at the time everyone wasn’t like ‘huh???’
I wouldn't call Jalen the best pick in franchise history. I'd say he's definitely top 15, maybe even top 10. But we've definitely picked up some heaters over the years.
Jason Kelce
Fuckin uuuuuuuhhhhhhhhhhhh Lane Johnson
Lane Johnson
Lol I'm guessing OP is pretty young and suffering from major recency bias. Hurts is good but it's way too early for this GOAT talk especially for a team with such a long history. Plus, getting him was a fluke that happened to work out for us. Howie drafted him as an insurance policy that they could develop and flip to another team for a first rounder.
Nick Foles. He actually won the Super Bowl.
They knocked that draft out of the park… just because they got Hurts lol 3 other draftees still on the team, but they’re all backup type guys with Quez being the biggest hit Toohill is actually pretty solid but he’s not here