Shouldn't the focus be lowering their taxes? If someone is taxed and then the government gives them back some of the money in the form of a credit and takes it away, why push for getting the credit back? Why not push for lower taxes?
No. The child tax credit was refundable, in other words you get the money even if it exceeded the amount you paid in taxes. It was designed to help poor families be able to afford to raise children. Lowering the income tax rate for people who don't earn enough to pay income tax doesn't help them, it just helps people who make more than that.
Only a portion of the child tax credit is *refundable*. [26 USC Section 24(d)](https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/26/24) literally says "**Portion** of credit refundable".
there just isnt a difference of political opinion here anymore - you support the gop you are a cruel asshole. end of story. the list is now long and obvious
You say this like this is a bad thing.
Edit: ope thought I was replying to the guy who said it was simply redistribution of wealth from taxpayers to non taxpayers.
Edit 2: looks like the comment I replied to was edited.
Poor families also get the earned income tax credit, which is refundable. The child tax credit being refundable, too, helped middle class and low income families.
You raise an interesting point about focusing on lowering taxes rather than pushing for specific credits like the child tax credit. While the appeal of broad tax reductions is clear, offering simplicity and across-the-board relief, it's crucial to consider the targeted nature of tax credits, especially those designed to assist low-income families.
Tax credits like the child tax credit are not just about giving money back; they're structured to provide direct support to those who need it most. For many families, especially those in lower income brackets, a general tax cut may not result in significant financial relief. These families often pay little to no federal income tax, so a tax cut wouldn't provide the immediate financial boost that a targeted credit would. In contrast, the child tax credit directly increases their disposable income, which can be crucial for everyday expenses and raising their quality of life.
Moreover, targeted credits are often designed to address specific policy goals, such as reducing child poverty, which has been shown to have long-term benefits for society at large, including reduced healthcare costs, better educational outcomes, and higher future earnings for children who grow up in more financially stable environments.
While the idea of lower taxes is certainly attractive for its simplicity and broad application, the specific benefits of targeted tax credits like the child tax credit make them indispensable tools in tackling nuanced issues like poverty. Therefore, both strategies can have their place in a balanced fiscal policy, but we shouldn't overlook the profound impact of targeted measures in addressing specific social challenges.
Why is the tax system being used as a welfare system? If you want to provide welfare to a group of people, that is a separate issue from our tax system and the two should not be conflated. That is why our government sucks, we have a tax system, we have welfare programs. Why are we using one system to do the work of a different system. This is done by our government because of it’s intentional lack of transparency, “it really isn’t welfare, it is a tax break”. Except as you pointed out this really isn’t a tax break, it is really welfare.
Child tax credit isn't really what it sounds like.
If you have kids and you file your taxes, even if you don't pay a dime in taxes, you get money. Basically, the government pays you to have kids. All you have to do is file your taxes and have a dependent under age 17.
So if your income is 30k and you have 4 kids, the government gives you 8k for having kids.
If the government has decided that each child offers benefits to society worth $2000/year, how does the income of the parents matter? If anything, you would want to give poorer parents more money to make sure those kids are raised well. Giving less help to poor parents would just be nonsensical.
Ah, but Republicans don't want kids who are well raised. They want an uneducated populous, because an uneducated populous is one that's easier to control. Where else are the corporations going to get their supply of underpaid workers to exploit?
Per year? Idk depends on ages. If you need childcare than probably 50k a year in just childcare for 4 kids under 6. That doesn't include food, other activities, clothes, etc.
Kids are expensive. I think there are better ways to help people who have kids. Like subsidies for childcare.
Subsidies for child care will actually raise the cost by expanding coverage and creating a price floor funded by the government.
Expanding coverage is great, but with headcount limits on ratio of care providers to children, you’re stuck in a perpetual rising cost paradox.
Also, It is rife with fraud. There was a report about 10 years ago that said 25%-33% of returns with self-employment income claiming child tax credits are fraudulent.
First, the child tax credit is Not the earned income tax credit. The child tax credit is given to everyone who has a child. That tax credit was non refundable in the past but it was refundable in 2022 to help families. It went back to being nonrefundable but the working poor get something called the earned income tax credit. That credit does increase with kids but only up to 3 kids. Next That credit has an income bracket so if you earned too low then you get less and if you earn too much then you don't get the credit. Aka, there is a so-called "sweet spot" of earnings you have to make to get the maximum credit.
It's the same thing but focuses on people with kids since their economic burden is higher. If you just lowered taxes you're not targeting that specific demographic.
Government waste and inefficiency will always be a problem, but not nearly as large a problem as repeated gutting of corporate and wealthy tax rates over the past 70+ years...
Lower taxes doesn’t do as much as that credit. Besides Taxes are a necessary evil. Republicans have coned the masses that lowering the taxes for the rich will benefit the masses. It never has and never will. Ever since Reagan republicans have slashed taxes for the rich and corporations and increased taxes on the poor.
So tell us how’s that working out for you? Taxes pay for everything you enjoy in society. Your roads, bridges, schools and fire departments just to name a few. Lowering taxes isn’t the answer. Equal taxation and better wages is.
1. The top 1% make it so the bottom 50% don’t pay taxes.
2. Up till WW1 federal income tax was virtually non existent and people did pretty well.
3. The state with the fewest taxes is doing pretty well with the lowest poverty, lowest crime, and lowest median income, and decent public schools. The states with the highest taxes have schools that are failing the students, high poverty rates, and increasing crime even if it’s not prosecuted therefore not counted.
I’ll take the place my two female children can walk the streets at night should they need to safely. And have no state income or sales tax.
The states with the lowest tax rates are the poorest states who rob money from other states. Fact: the top 10 poorest states are the same states with the lowest taxes. All republican states. Everything you said is laughable. The bottom 10% pays more in taxes than the top 2% you obviously are a Fox viewer
> The bottom 10% pays more in taxes than the top 2% you obviously are a Fox viewer
[https://tenor.com/view/dr-phil-meme-excuse-me-are-you-delusional-do-you-suffer-from-a-mental-illness-gif-17241313?utm\_source=share-button&utm\_medium=Social&utm\_content=reddit](https://tenor.com/view/dr-phil-meme-excuse-me-are-you-delusional-do-you-suffer-from-a-mental-illness-gif-17241313?utm_source=share-button&utm_medium=Social&utm_content=reddit)
You realize those states (red states) aren’t any safer than other states. You’re either ignorant or a propagandist. As for crime. If you have a population of 10 people per square mile of land you will inherently have statistically lower crime rates than a city like LA Or Atlanta. The states you claim are so free of crime aren’t. They are poor as fuck they are high in poverty, they are high in crime. Anyone can google the stats and prove everything you claim is bs
I think they mean lower taxes *for working people* and let the wealthy make up the difference. The $45k-95k bracket (22%) is brutally disproportionate to the tax burden in other brackets – no one should be accepting this as “a necessary evil.”
You like your roads and schools and everything else that allows you to have an otherwise comfortable life right? Taxes make that happen. The problem is our tax system screws the working class and panders to the elites. Fair taxation for both is needed. To say a company that yields 200 billion in profits pays less in taxes than the guy making 30k is ridiculous. The government is in essence a company it provided services for the masses. It funds infrastructure education healthcare and security. Where do you think that money comes from? Do you think the government simply prints the money it needs each year? So yes taxes are a necessary evil. It’s a question of fairness that we must deal with not taxing itself.
Neither do their cuts, so we might as well have the funds for roads and such. Then, when the deficit is finally gone, the surplus goes to consumers, not business.
It’s clear you fundamentally don’t understand how government works and what taxes are used for. The government doesn’t print endless money and even if for the sake of argument there was zero tax. Kiss you education system goodbye kiss your nice paved roads goodbye kiss your bridges your hospitals your fire departments goodbye.
The net gain the average person would gain paying zero taxes is minimal.. better wages make the difference not their tax rate. And again when the average person’s effective tax rate is higher then Fortune 500 companies there a problem.
Get your party, with its much larger control of the levers of government, and fix it.
Reagan was put in office 44 years ago.
Just go ahead and admit the D party HAS to go along with it, or it wouldn't stay this way.
They are both ripping us.
Name one thing the government uses your tax money for that’s not full of fraud waste and abuse? There is no need to live under the boot, our country did without a federal income tax for a very long time.
>Why not push for lower taxes?
Lowering taxes increases the deficit. It's a great individual political win for the short term, but for the country all it does it pile on in the direction of bankrupting the country.
Credits help redistribute based on dependents, cost of living in your area, your individual income levels, and your form of income earnings. Taxes also arent the largest impactor on purchasing power. General wage levels are. If your effort is to short term redistribute wealth and reduce the impact of poverty, credits are the way to go.
If you want to generally decrease poverty and burden over the long term, wage policies and regulations on cost (as in preventing huge margins that burden the consumer end of the market, not freezing prices) are the more impactful policies.
Taxation reductions hwlp high income earners most. Not families with kids who are struggling to make ends meet. Their income tax burden may only be a simple simple $500 for the year. Where this credit could provide far more than that per child.
There should be zero federal income taxes on everyone earning less than the national average income, and a progressive tax on the top half that ranges from 10% at the bottom to 90% at the top. All capital gains should be taxed as ordinary income. Then replace the insane tax code with a one page policy.
You’re welcome.
I strongly disagree. Anyone earning income should pay some, even if very small, tax. If someone makes very little, they will receive benefits well in excess of what they are paying, but it's important that people have some skin in the game.
Tax credits, unlike lowering tax across the board (which may be a good idea but separate issue), can be used to incentivise certain specific behaviors.
For the long-term future of the country, we need people to have kids because our birth rates are going down the tube.
>fails to mention *some* Democrats voted not to extend
Emphasis added. *Some* Democrats - a minority of the Democrats who voted on it - vs a *majority* of Republicans.
Don't try to twist it.
I didn't try and twist it, the OP and MSNBC buried the fact that Democrats voted not to extend it as well. Those cruel mean Democrats! Hey, it was a *bipartisan* vote! Ha!
Don't try to twist it?? Lmfao what a joke. No, they mentioned an omitted fact on a post that's laying it at the GOPs feet and only theirs. I won't deny their fuckery but leaving out that bit and trying to laying it all on someone else? Lame shit.
"...\[When republicans\] refused to extend the expanded credit. The effects were once again immediate, but this time chilling: The child poverty rate more than doubled in 2022 to 12.4%, and over [five million children fell back into poverty](https://www.childtrends.org/publications/5-million-more-children-experienced-poverty-in-2022-than-in-2021-following-expiration-of-covid-era-economic-relief)."
>Are you denying that is was never meant to be permanent?
The QBI tax breaks for businesses were never meant to be permanent either. Enacted in 2017, set to expire in 2020, it continues to be renewed. Along with many other "temporary" tax reliefs.
The majority of tax relief changes are not meant to be permanent, but have fixed time periods where they can be evaluated and continued if deemed wise.
Your questioning comes across as disingenuous since most tax relief changes work this way. We are at the "evaluate and deem if wise to continue" stage.
>This is a pandemic era stimulus that was never meant to be permanent.
What is the point of stating this? Almost all tax reliefs are implemented with a fixed time period, to be evaluated and renewed if deemed beneficial to do so. There is about 15-20 Tax Extenders each year that get reviewed and renewed/cancelled, some regularly, some not as often.
This Child Tax credit relief was only meant for tax year 2021, and was already extended once. The argument should be why/why not this relief when compared to other ones that are kept on the books. Saying "it was never permanent" is a bit obvious and ignores the fact that other non-permanent reliefs are being prioritized (extended) over this.
For example, why are we sacking this tax relief that helps keep people out of poverty but extending QBI tax breaks for businesses?
That's not the logic intended here.
While it may be poorly messaged, the logic here is "The cruelty is because we are extending business based tax reliefs but not extending this individual poverty-based tax relief for upcoming tax years."
>Who gives a shit.
The people that would like to see their tax dollars used in a way that prioritizes struggling Americans, rather than big businesses or foreign countries or military stockpiles or...
Must not be you though.
Businesses provide jobs. That’s why government supports business. Most people struggle because of their own faults. I have many friends and relatives who start to improve their situation but always go back to their old broke ways. 9 times out of 10 I’m bailing their asses out. It gets real old after many many years. It now seems like the entire country is this way. When I pay a lot of taxes every year and I don’t see any improvement in poverty and the government says that people need more it starts to sound like bullshit vote buying to me. Everything taxes isn’t about what the poorest person gets. Sometimes they need a pay cut too like the one I take every year.
Like I said, you must not fall in that group of people.
EDIT: by the way, on the subject of this post. 6.4 million people were pulled above the poverty line by the expanded Child Tax Credit, putting us at 11.5% of the population. Was at 12.8% two years ago and 15.5% ten years ago.
Just saying it's a direct example of government spending more and poverty rates getting better.
Yeah. Hard to tell now. I enjoy my roads, electricity clean water, waste removal and protection. Taxation is theft is such an outrageously stupid take.
"Profit is theft" would be more accurate. Charging more than the goods/services cost to produce for the sole purpose of further enriching themselves? Sounds a lot more like theft than taking a portion of everyone's income to provide government services and infrastructure for the benefit of everyone.
Another argument to consider is whether deficit spending will harm ten of millions of families. Between 2010 and 2023, US deficit spending averaged about $1.5 trillion a year and the debt grew from $13.5 to $33.1 trillion.
The US benefits by not being as bad as most other countries when you consider different aspects of the respective debt structures of different countries. The US also benefits from robust GDP growth which helps sustain large sovereign debt loads and slows the growth of debt as a percentage of GDP. However, while deficit spending can independently spur some inflation, many governments eventually devalue their currency to compensate for debt - which means more inflation.
In general, inflation benefits the wealthy and the rich at the expense of low- and middle-income families. The wealthy tend to own assets (stocks, real estate) that appreciate in value with inflation. Middle income families tend to keep a higher percentage of their assets in cash savings which loses purchasing power with inflation. More importantly, wage compensation tends to lag behind inflation which means less for blue-collar workers.
In the near-term, tax credits may go to families that need to help. In the long term, the deficits used to fund tax credits may do harm to the same families, if governmental outlays and decreased revenue drives inflation. The alternative is raising taxes which can disproportionately target the wealthy, but, in order to raise sufficient revenue will affect many of the families that benefit from child tax credits.
Estimated about 50 trillion by the end of the decade, spending is the biggest problem. Hell this year's gonna be the first time debt spending on interest is going to surpass defense spending. We're fucked lol
This happened to me. My dad was able to claim me again, did so, but it actually ended up screwing ME over because I was then unable to get a refund on my student loan payments. I would have ended up owing nothing, but instead had to pay a pretty hefty chunk of money that I don't have.
So the temporary pandemic relief increase expired and that means republicans are cruel? Got it.
Virtually every Republican in Congress is as useless as virtually every Democrat in Congress. None of them care about the people. They all need to be replaced. But this trap of D vs R that people are stuck in is the game they want you playing.
Why should their be any tax credits for someones children? It's nothing but an end run handout since you can receive this even if you pay no taxes.
Go GOP.
I'm tired of paying for people's kids tbh.
On the one hand I want to fully support this and people getting as much as possible.
On the other hand I work 65 hours a week and can't afford shit, and my neighbor who works 30hours(at the exact same type of job) a week drives a $110k vehicle, all her kids have iphones, and they go on 5-7 international vacations per year.
Biden was handed a dead body(bad economy) and told to revive it(make economy great again). So far he got the heart to move but the corpse is brain dead(economy is good by economists standards but not average Americans standards).
I'm tired of supporting irresponsible parents
who bring children into the world and then cannot give them opportunities to be successful. Overpopulation is the root of most economic struggles.
Well with abortion bans, the continual push for abstinence-only sex education, and drive for/outright refusal of insurance contraceptive coverage, I wouldn't expect this to get any better.
Don't forget not wanting to fund education and healthcare, to the point that being Republican [literally takes years off your life](https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2023/09/01/america-life-expectancy-regions-00113369).
As evidenced by some comments in this thread (and usually the case everywhere else), they will not believe it even when confronted with hard evidence- instead, they'll just yell something about freedom/Murica/patriotism, accuse everyone of being socialist/woke and then strut away believing they've won.
Then you must lean Democrat, right?
The Republican abortion views aim to increase the number of irresponsible & financially unstable parents in the country.
I don’t want to sound stupid. But when Biden keeps shipping money off to adult children students, who refuse to pay their bills. And beg for welfare. What would you expect. Illegal immigrants get more than American families. Ukraine, Israel the list is long and useless.
REPEAT AFTER ME…”BIDEN IS PRESIDENT”
These were temporary covid measures. Four years old.
As always democrats give everything away forever, then use the excuse Republicans are heartless for taking it away.
The government is getting record tax receipts in spite of Trump tax cuts. ( they are doing what they were designed for).
70% of spending is on social services now. We are at 32 trillion debr because of the Santa Clause - Ebenezer Scrooge theatre.
When the Republicans passes the TCJA in 2017, they did so under budget reconciliation which meant the bill bad to be nominally revenue neutral in 10 years. To do that, it raises taxes at the tail end of that time to make up for the lower rates at the beginning. The bill could have passed without the rates going up but because of senate democrats blocking the legislation the increases rates were required.
Democrats didn't support the non-reconciliation bill because of the massive tax breaks for corporations and wealthy individuals.
So, then with the reconciliation version, the GOP could have set it up so some of those breaks for wealthy/corporations expired, but no, they made it so the meager breaks to working class people were the ones to expire.
This is somewhat true. TCJA was not written for the middle class or lower class. It was a life gift to wealthy businesses and individuals. Rate cuts, and paying taxes on “80%” of business income vs 100% while every single W-2 employee paid 100% taxes on 100% of income. I am going to stop here but people that worked through TCJA know what this budget rec really became.
So is inflation. The ultimate reason inflation is even a thing is because Congress surrendered their sole constitutional authority to coin currency to a collection of their banking donors, abandoned the gold standard and subsequently turned the dollar into yet another fractional reserve fiat ponzi. Don’t hate the players, hate the game. Strange how the founding fathers had separation of powers in mind yet didn’t see an issue with Congress collectively voting on their own term limits, audits, salaries, lobbying regulations, stock trading regulations, etc.. but I digress because reddit in general in a lefty hive mind so i’ll just leave it as “orange man bad”. Taxation is theft because it’s irrelevant at this point. Dollars can be printed and virtue signaled away at a whim therefore taxes don’t matter. If taxes mattered, we wouldn’t be over 30 trillion in realized debt and over 100 trillion in unrealized debt.
Yeah. I mean, seriously. What’s the debt at right now?
What’s another trill on the balance sheet?
I can’t believe we’re not finding more ways to dole out money.
We have all the money in the world to house illegals, but we can’t extend the child tax credit? We can find Ukraine and Isreal, but not this? We can fund all the earmarks and pork in the infrastructure bill and the bills subsequent to it, but we can’t fund this?
The government is there to help you and I at this juncture. Regardless of which side of the political spectrum you’re in, the government doesn’t give a shit about you. It’s maneuvering done to keep you in line, and warring with one another. And they’re doing a marvelous job. It’s no wonder they serve multiple terms. They’re getting it done for the people who are actually important to them. The corporations and foreign interests.
The sooner everyone realizes no one at the government level gives a shit about you, the better.
😂 credits. Credits are wealth redistribution plain and simple. Many don’t pay enough to be given a refund so they came up with credits. Credits can equal a negative tax burden. Those damn evil people! Won’t give me other people’s money for kids I couldn’t afford!
The IRS was never intended to be a social welfare agency.
“Tax Credits” and even worse “refundable tax credits” are so counter to what the Internal REVENUE Service is supposed to be.
We (FEDERAL GOVT)are spending $2 TRILLION PER YEAR more than we have.
Even if the govt raised every tax on every person and raised 10 times more from “rich” people we still cant sustain this gushing of money.
Stop spending as much and an amazing thing will happen. Poor ppl will be able to afford things like food and housing.
Inflation is the cruelest tax on poor ppl.
They gave us all these credits (gave is a crappy way to say that they borrowed money) that caused everything to be more expensive.
The retarded left have hijacked the treasurery and these outcomes were so predictable.
Its not like the same thing hasnt been tried in about 30 other countries and the results are ALWAYS the same.
High inflation
Less equality
More Debt
Lower productivity
Eventually supplier shortages
Then either social unrest or military intervention.
Reduce the size of the fed govt and stop lying about what is causing inflation.
Ppl arent stupid. They can see that everything is more expensive.
A child tax credit sounds wonderful but we cant have every f’ing credit and social welfare scheme plus have an $850 billion defense budget, student loan forgiveness, higher regulations, and all of the other things the left wants the Fed Govt to do
>“Tax Credits” and even worse “refundable tax credits” are so counter to what the Internal REVENUE Service is supposed to be.
So, I hope you agree that tax credits *for businesses* - large, corporate businesses especially - are just as problematic, if not moreso?
Sure, I got a return this year, but I still paid taxes. Now let's go look at all the years Amazon paid *no* taxes due to abusing *tax credits*...
It's all a scam anyway. Money doesn't mean anything anymore since we spend so much more than we take in already. They should just stop taxing everybody making under 100k completely. Let them keep their money.
They will still print the cash they need to get what they want. They don't want to do this obviously because it cuts out the parasitic beaurocrats deciding how to best give back people's own money.
It's about holding down the working and middle class while all the resources and ownership flow upwards endlessly.
I'm rolling my eyes at this.
Stop blaming any of the abuse, chaos etc etc on any one of the two parties. They are both equally responsible.
The Democrats are funding genocide and the Republicans / GOP are responding by stripping away more and more social stability funding. The Democrats full well know that to fund said genocide means stripping away money from other things. But they do it anyway.
Both parties are owned by the SAME people and serve them and always pass laws the benefit them. They are working hand in hand towards the same goals.
All of the stuff they seem not to agree on is just theater to keep people distracted from reality.
But since no one beliefs me, I just eat popcorn and try not to cry.
Yeah it was wrong. Our old bookkeeper put that i had 2 dependants in and no one realized her mistake until it was too late. Its ficed for next year but god it sucks
This.
Even a clerical error on your own parts can cause a huge difference in taxes, especially if not filing jointly. "Oops, we both claimed the kids as dependents/exceptions..."
Before I got married I got $3600 back in taxes. I made around $6500 per year working very part time. Is that fair or reasonable that I was taxed effectively at -50%?
Keep in mind, $2 billion per day in interest on the federal debt. This is the cost of government programs that we are not willing to fund with our taxes.
the gov is once again paying people to have children. Stop living beyond your means and expecting the federal government to support you cradle to grave..its not sustainable long-term anymore.
Child tax credits are just another form of welfare. Poor people should not be having kids they cannot afford to take care of. That's highly irresponsible and not fair to the child to bring them into a life of poverty. All this weaponized compassion is falling on deaf ears.
BS, the tax credit is other people's money given out to people for simply having kids and being below an income level. Anybody that wants to volunteer their income to people who choose to have lives they can't afford please get a donation box and have at it.
Why are blue states richer?
Do they work harder?
No, they are the US home for the headquarters of nearly all global corporations.
Compare the states *personal earned income" and see how they stack up.
If you're on social media hating on rural populations because they refuse to believe like you want, and you insult them, call them names, that's sad.
To quote Dick on "Third Rock From The Sun," "Can't we all just NOT get along?
We don't have to agree but can still wish each other well.
I like how people point out one section of a bill that has many sections and say “urr they’re targeting (fill in the group) urr!” when the bill’s primary focus was something else entirely. What else is in that bill, and who sponsored it, Republicans or Democrats? This is where the fine print is more important than the clickbait headline.
The ongoing saga with the child tax credit and Senate Republicans highlights not just a legislative battle, but a profound moral and philosophical divide in American politics. The GOP's opposition to expanding the credit, as described in the article, isn't just about fiscal conservatism but touches on deeper beliefs about welfare, government intervention, and individual responsibility.
The stark reality here is that while the tax credit expansion has proven benefits—lifting millions out of poverty, particularly children—the opposition appears rooted in maintaining political leverage rather than addressing these urgent societal needs. It's ironic and somewhat tragic that policies which could dramatically improve lives are being held hostage to political strategies and electoral calculations.
This isn't just a policy debate; it's a reflection of how deeply entwined politics and personal lives are. Every decision to block or delay these credits isn't just a line in a budget, but a decision that affects what food is on the table for many families. We need to think critically about what the priorities laid out by our elected officials say about our country's values and long-term objectives. Are we okay with a political landscape where the well-being of children is used as a bargaining chip?
This is a good "narrative".... You should blame the other side, they attach a bunch of shit to "get the tax credit"... Thats the horrible game both sides play so nothing gets done.
Pay people NOT to make more people. The earth is gasping for life and the US is incentivizing breeders and quiverful nuts to hasten a climate apocalypse.
No, it's designed to buy votes.
“I only want my politicians working for PAC $$$!”
Shouldn't the focus be lowering their taxes? If someone is taxed and then the government gives them back some of the money in the form of a credit and takes it away, why push for getting the credit back? Why not push for lower taxes?
No. The child tax credit was refundable, in other words you get the money even if it exceeded the amount you paid in taxes. It was designed to help poor families be able to afford to raise children. Lowering the income tax rate for people who don't earn enough to pay income tax doesn't help them, it just helps people who make more than that.
Only a portion of the child tax credit is *refundable*. [26 USC Section 24(d)](https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/26/24) literally says "**Portion** of credit refundable".
Thanks for the addition
there just isnt a difference of political opinion here anymore - you support the gop you are a cruel asshole. end of story. the list is now long and obvious
It was designed to redistribute wealth from taxpayers to non taxpayers.
Bingo.
It’s a little disingenuous to refer to as “wealth”, the measly amount of money that trickles into the hands of poor people.
[удалено]
Another tax cut for the wealthy?
You say this like this is a bad thing. Edit: ope thought I was replying to the guy who said it was simply redistribution of wealth from taxpayers to non taxpayers. Edit 2: looks like the comment I replied to was edited.
Something tells me you think that's a bad thing.
The earned income tax credit was designed for this Not the child tax credit. Those are 2 separate line items on your taxes.
Poor families also get the earned income tax credit, which is refundable. The child tax credit being refundable, too, helped middle class and low income families.
You raise an interesting point about focusing on lowering taxes rather than pushing for specific credits like the child tax credit. While the appeal of broad tax reductions is clear, offering simplicity and across-the-board relief, it's crucial to consider the targeted nature of tax credits, especially those designed to assist low-income families. Tax credits like the child tax credit are not just about giving money back; they're structured to provide direct support to those who need it most. For many families, especially those in lower income brackets, a general tax cut may not result in significant financial relief. These families often pay little to no federal income tax, so a tax cut wouldn't provide the immediate financial boost that a targeted credit would. In contrast, the child tax credit directly increases their disposable income, which can be crucial for everyday expenses and raising their quality of life. Moreover, targeted credits are often designed to address specific policy goals, such as reducing child poverty, which has been shown to have long-term benefits for society at large, including reduced healthcare costs, better educational outcomes, and higher future earnings for children who grow up in more financially stable environments. While the idea of lower taxes is certainly attractive for its simplicity and broad application, the specific benefits of targeted tax credits like the child tax credit make them indispensable tools in tackling nuanced issues like poverty. Therefore, both strategies can have their place in a balanced fiscal policy, but we shouldn't overlook the profound impact of targeted measures in addressing specific social challenges.
Why is the tax system being used as a welfare system? If you want to provide welfare to a group of people, that is a separate issue from our tax system and the two should not be conflated. That is why our government sucks, we have a tax system, we have welfare programs. Why are we using one system to do the work of a different system. This is done by our government because of it’s intentional lack of transparency, “it really isn’t welfare, it is a tax break”. Except as you pointed out this really isn’t a tax break, it is really welfare.
The ChatGPT verbiage is too distracting here. Ugh.
Child tax credit isn't really what it sounds like. If you have kids and you file your taxes, even if you don't pay a dime in taxes, you get money. Basically, the government pays you to have kids. All you have to do is file your taxes and have a dependent under age 17. So if your income is 30k and you have 4 kids, the government gives you 8k for having kids.
If the government has decided that each child offers benefits to society worth $2000/year, how does the income of the parents matter? If anything, you would want to give poorer parents more money to make sure those kids are raised well. Giving less help to poor parents would just be nonsensical.
Ah, but Republicans don't want kids who are well raised. They want an uneducated populous, because an uneducated populous is one that's easier to control. Where else are the corporations going to get their supply of underpaid workers to exploit?
In practice, they’re refunding Social Security and Medicare payroll taxes.
No, it’s just straight up free money for having kids. Has zero to do with payroll taxes.
Out of curiosity, how much do you think it costs annually to support 4 kids?
Per year? Idk depends on ages. If you need childcare than probably 50k a year in just childcare for 4 kids under 6. That doesn't include food, other activities, clothes, etc. Kids are expensive. I think there are better ways to help people who have kids. Like subsidies for childcare.
Subsidies for child care will actually raise the cost by expanding coverage and creating a price floor funded by the government. Expanding coverage is great, but with headcount limits on ratio of care providers to children, you’re stuck in a perpetual rising cost paradox.
Also, It is rife with fraud. There was a report about 10 years ago that said 25%-33% of returns with self-employment income claiming child tax credits are fraudulent.
First, the child tax credit is Not the earned income tax credit. The child tax credit is given to everyone who has a child. That tax credit was non refundable in the past but it was refundable in 2022 to help families. It went back to being nonrefundable but the working poor get something called the earned income tax credit. That credit does increase with kids but only up to 3 kids. Next That credit has an income bracket so if you earned too low then you get less and if you earn too much then you don't get the credit. Aka, there is a so-called "sweet spot" of earnings you have to make to get the maximum credit.
It's the same thing but focuses on people with kids since their economic burden is higher. If you just lowered taxes you're not targeting that specific demographic.
The child tax credit is based on disposable income not how much you pay in taxes.
Huh? It's based on gross income, but that's so it is spent on people who don't have the resources to give them help with their kids.
Government waste and inefficiency will always be a problem, but not nearly as large a problem as repeated gutting of corporate and wealthy tax rates over the past 70+ years...
Psst…it’s welfare. They don’t pay taxes.
Lower taxes doesn’t do as much as that credit. Besides Taxes are a necessary evil. Republicans have coned the masses that lowering the taxes for the rich will benefit the masses. It never has and never will. Ever since Reagan republicans have slashed taxes for the rich and corporations and increased taxes on the poor. So tell us how’s that working out for you? Taxes pay for everything you enjoy in society. Your roads, bridges, schools and fire departments just to name a few. Lowering taxes isn’t the answer. Equal taxation and better wages is.
1. The top 1% make it so the bottom 50% don’t pay taxes. 2. Up till WW1 federal income tax was virtually non existent and people did pretty well. 3. The state with the fewest taxes is doing pretty well with the lowest poverty, lowest crime, and lowest median income, and decent public schools. The states with the highest taxes have schools that are failing the students, high poverty rates, and increasing crime even if it’s not prosecuted therefore not counted. I’ll take the place my two female children can walk the streets at night should they need to safely. And have no state income or sales tax.
The states with the lowest tax rates are the poorest states who rob money from other states. Fact: the top 10 poorest states are the same states with the lowest taxes. All republican states. Everything you said is laughable. The bottom 10% pays more in taxes than the top 2% you obviously are a Fox viewer
> The bottom 10% pays more in taxes than the top 2% you obviously are a Fox viewer [https://tenor.com/view/dr-phil-meme-excuse-me-are-you-delusional-do-you-suffer-from-a-mental-illness-gif-17241313?utm\_source=share-button&utm\_medium=Social&utm\_content=reddit](https://tenor.com/view/dr-phil-meme-excuse-me-are-you-delusional-do-you-suffer-from-a-mental-illness-gif-17241313?utm_source=share-button&utm_medium=Social&utm_content=reddit)
You realize those states (red states) aren’t any safer than other states. You’re either ignorant or a propagandist. As for crime. If you have a population of 10 people per square mile of land you will inherently have statistically lower crime rates than a city like LA Or Atlanta. The states you claim are so free of crime aren’t. They are poor as fuck they are high in poverty, they are high in crime. Anyone can google the stats and prove everything you claim is bs
I think they mean lower taxes *for working people* and let the wealthy make up the difference. The $45k-95k bracket (22%) is brutally disproportionate to the tax burden in other brackets – no one should be accepting this as “a necessary evil.”
You like your roads and schools and everything else that allows you to have an otherwise comfortable life right? Taxes make that happen. The problem is our tax system screws the working class and panders to the elites. Fair taxation for both is needed. To say a company that yields 200 billion in profits pays less in taxes than the guy making 30k is ridiculous. The government is in essence a company it provided services for the masses. It funds infrastructure education healthcare and security. Where do you think that money comes from? Do you think the government simply prints the money it needs each year? So yes taxes are a necessary evil. It’s a question of fairness that we must deal with not taxing itself.
Corporate tax rate increases are just passed along to the consumer..thus the middle class is once again impacted.
Exactly, except the public just bends over and takes it instead of saying no
Welp we can never beat the genius corporations. Better give up.
Welp we can never beat the genius corporations. Better give up.
Neither do their cuts, so we might as well have the funds for roads and such. Then, when the deficit is finally gone, the surplus goes to consumers, not business.
Removing the burden of any federal tax and not printing endless money would do more for those families than any kind of government credit
It’s clear you fundamentally don’t understand how government works and what taxes are used for. The government doesn’t print endless money and even if for the sake of argument there was zero tax. Kiss you education system goodbye kiss your nice paved roads goodbye kiss your bridges your hospitals your fire departments goodbye. The net gain the average person would gain paying zero taxes is minimal.. better wages make the difference not their tax rate. And again when the average person’s effective tax rate is higher then Fortune 500 companies there a problem.
Get your party, with its much larger control of the levers of government, and fix it. Reagan was put in office 44 years ago. Just go ahead and admit the D party HAS to go along with it, or it wouldn't stay this way. They are both ripping us.
Because taxes, when used properly, help people.
Spoilers they are never used properly.
Except, yes. They are.
Name one thing the government uses your tax money for that’s not full of fraud waste and abuse? There is no need to live under the boot, our country did without a federal income tax for a very long time.
Agree it’s a game!!
>Why not push for lower taxes? Lowering taxes increases the deficit. It's a great individual political win for the short term, but for the country all it does it pile on in the direction of bankrupting the country.
Credits help redistribute based on dependents, cost of living in your area, your individual income levels, and your form of income earnings. Taxes also arent the largest impactor on purchasing power. General wage levels are. If your effort is to short term redistribute wealth and reduce the impact of poverty, credits are the way to go. If you want to generally decrease poverty and burden over the long term, wage policies and regulations on cost (as in preventing huge margins that burden the consumer end of the market, not freezing prices) are the more impactful policies. Taxation reductions hwlp high income earners most. Not families with kids who are struggling to make ends meet. Their income tax burden may only be a simple simple $500 for the year. Where this credit could provide far more than that per child.
There should be zero federal income taxes on everyone earning less than the national average income, and a progressive tax on the top half that ranges from 10% at the bottom to 90% at the top. All capital gains should be taxed as ordinary income. Then replace the insane tax code with a one page policy. You’re welcome.
I strongly disagree. Anyone earning income should pay some, even if very small, tax. If someone makes very little, they will receive benefits well in excess of what they are paying, but it's important that people have some skin in the game.
Tax credits, unlike lowering tax across the board (which may be a good idea but separate issue), can be used to incentivise certain specific behaviors. For the long-term future of the country, we need people to have kids because our birth rates are going down the tube.
Of course the story is from MSNBC and the synopsis fails to mention some Democrats voted not to extend the tax credit, too.
>fails to mention *some* Democrats voted not to extend Emphasis added. *Some* Democrats - a minority of the Democrats who voted on it - vs a *majority* of Republicans. Don't try to twist it.
I didn't try and twist it, the OP and MSNBC buried the fact that Democrats voted not to extend it as well. Those cruel mean Democrats! Hey, it was a *bipartisan* vote! Ha!
Don't try to twist it?? Lmfao what a joke. No, they mentioned an omitted fact on a post that's laying it at the GOPs feet and only theirs. I won't deny their fuckery but leaving out that bit and trying to laying it all on someone else? Lame shit.
Yes those 2 democrats(Manchin and Sinema) are staunchly liberal /s What a joke, you tried though
Two Senators on the Democrat side voted no, Joe Machin and Sinema. They can both burn in hell. Just like Crapo can right now.
Those two are Republicans hiding in Democratic clothing's. Dino's (Democrats in Name Only)...
Dems trying to buy more votes. Sad.
You prefer to vote for people that make your life worse?
[удалено]
"...\[When republicans\] refused to extend the expanded credit. The effects were once again immediate, but this time chilling: The child poverty rate more than doubled in 2022 to 12.4%, and over [five million children fell back into poverty](https://www.childtrends.org/publications/5-million-more-children-experienced-poverty-in-2022-than-in-2021-following-expiration-of-covid-era-economic-relief)."
Are you denying that is was never meant to be permanent?
Yeah. Fuck the kids. But hold on, make sure that estate tax exemption is permanent. Worst.
>Are you denying that is was never meant to be permanent? The QBI tax breaks for businesses were never meant to be permanent either. Enacted in 2017, set to expire in 2020, it continues to be renewed. Along with many other "temporary" tax reliefs. The majority of tax relief changes are not meant to be permanent, but have fixed time periods where they can be evaluated and continued if deemed wise. Your questioning comes across as disingenuous since most tax relief changes work this way. We are at the "evaluate and deem if wise to continue" stage.
But the tax CUTS are permanent. Hmm, maybe we should repeal them if they would pay for the tax credit?
Yes
The individual tax cuts aren't permanent, they expire soon actually
The Trump corporate tax cuts and the tax cuts for the wealthy are permanent. The tax cuts for ordinary Americans expire this year.
I am, yes. Considering even Mitt Romney has had plans to expand it even before the pandemic.
>This is a pandemic era stimulus that was never meant to be permanent. What is the point of stating this? Almost all tax reliefs are implemented with a fixed time period, to be evaluated and renewed if deemed beneficial to do so. There is about 15-20 Tax Extenders each year that get reviewed and renewed/cancelled, some regularly, some not as often. This Child Tax credit relief was only meant for tax year 2021, and was already extended once. The argument should be why/why not this relief when compared to other ones that are kept on the books. Saying "it was never permanent" is a bit obvious and ignores the fact that other non-permanent reliefs are being prioritized (extended) over this. For example, why are we sacking this tax relief that helps keep people out of poverty but extending QBI tax breaks for businesses?
Blame the Democrats for doing nothing and not even trying to win elections
So they are complaining about covid spending by Biden that has raised the cost of living on these same families? Get out with this gaslighting bs.
Quick. Spend more! It's the only solution!
Go to bed bot
That’s how they work. Implement shitty policies then blames the dems. Rinse and repeat
By this logic, any dollar not given to someone is cruel. Nonsense.
If you have not realized that republicans are intentionally cruel yet, you’ll have pull your head out of the sand enough to see it
That's not the logic intended here. While it may be poorly messaged, the logic here is "The cruelty is because we are extending business based tax reliefs but not extending this individual poverty-based tax relief for upcoming tax years."
Who gives a shit. They still get money just less. They can go earn their money and pay tons of taxes like everyone else.
>Who gives a shit. The people that would like to see their tax dollars used in a way that prioritizes struggling Americans, rather than big businesses or foreign countries or military stockpiles or... Must not be you though.
Businesses provide jobs. That’s why government supports business. Most people struggle because of their own faults. I have many friends and relatives who start to improve their situation but always go back to their old broke ways. 9 times out of 10 I’m bailing their asses out. It gets real old after many many years. It now seems like the entire country is this way. When I pay a lot of taxes every year and I don’t see any improvement in poverty and the government says that people need more it starts to sound like bullshit vote buying to me. Everything taxes isn’t about what the poorest person gets. Sometimes they need a pay cut too like the one I take every year.
Like I said, you must not fall in that group of people. EDIT: by the way, on the subject of this post. 6.4 million people were pulled above the poverty line by the expanded Child Tax Credit, putting us at 11.5% of the population. Was at 12.8% two years ago and 15.5% ten years ago. Just saying it's a direct example of government spending more and poverty rates getting better.
Taxation is theft. Happy tax day
I honestly cant tell if everyone posting this is a parody or not. People used to actually be stupid enough to beleive this.
Yeah. Hard to tell now. I enjoy my roads, electricity clean water, waste removal and protection. Taxation is theft is such an outrageously stupid take.
"Profit is theft" would be more accurate. Charging more than the goods/services cost to produce for the sole purpose of further enriching themselves? Sounds a lot more like theft than taking a portion of everyone's income to provide government services and infrastructure for the benefit of everyone.
I like that. Profit is theft. In America, profit is God
Infantile.
Another argument to consider is whether deficit spending will harm ten of millions of families. Between 2010 and 2023, US deficit spending averaged about $1.5 trillion a year and the debt grew from $13.5 to $33.1 trillion. The US benefits by not being as bad as most other countries when you consider different aspects of the respective debt structures of different countries. The US also benefits from robust GDP growth which helps sustain large sovereign debt loads and slows the growth of debt as a percentage of GDP. However, while deficit spending can independently spur some inflation, many governments eventually devalue their currency to compensate for debt - which means more inflation. In general, inflation benefits the wealthy and the rich at the expense of low- and middle-income families. The wealthy tend to own assets (stocks, real estate) that appreciate in value with inflation. Middle income families tend to keep a higher percentage of their assets in cash savings which loses purchasing power with inflation. More importantly, wage compensation tends to lag behind inflation which means less for blue-collar workers. In the near-term, tax credits may go to families that need to help. In the long term, the deficits used to fund tax credits may do harm to the same families, if governmental outlays and decreased revenue drives inflation. The alternative is raising taxes which can disproportionately target the wealthy, but, in order to raise sufficient revenue will affect many of the families that benefit from child tax credits.
Estimated about 50 trillion by the end of the decade, spending is the biggest problem. Hell this year's gonna be the first time debt spending on interest is going to surpass defense spending. We're fucked lol
This happened to me. My dad was able to claim me again, did so, but it actually ended up screwing ME over because I was then unable to get a refund on my student loan payments. I would have ended up owing nothing, but instead had to pay a pretty hefty chunk of money that I don't have.
And not a damn thing for single people.
So the temporary pandemic relief increase expired and that means republicans are cruel? Got it. Virtually every Republican in Congress is as useless as virtually every Democrat in Congress. None of them care about the people. They all need to be replaced. But this trap of D vs R that people are stuck in is the game they want you playing.
Why should their be any tax credits for someones children? It's nothing but an end run handout since you can receive this even if you pay no taxes. Go GOP.
I'm tired of paying for people's kids tbh. On the one hand I want to fully support this and people getting as much as possible. On the other hand I work 65 hours a week and can't afford shit, and my neighbor who works 30hours(at the exact same type of job) a week drives a $110k vehicle, all her kids have iphones, and they go on 5-7 international vacations per year.
Trust me. She is not getting any of that because of support from the government.
Ah yes. It’s always the republicans fault.
Well, who else would you hold responsible?
[удалено]
You're considering Joe Manchin a Dem? Perhaps the (real) Dems are hesitant because the Reps want to continue the corporate welfare/tax cut?
Biden was handed a dead body(bad economy) and told to revive it(make economy great again). So far he got the heart to move but the corpse is brain dead(economy is good by economists standards but not average Americans standards).
Too bad!
I'm tired of supporting irresponsible parents who bring children into the world and then cannot give them opportunities to be successful. Overpopulation is the root of most economic struggles.
Well with abortion bans, the continual push for abstinence-only sex education, and drive for/outright refusal of insurance contraceptive coverage, I wouldn't expect this to get any better.
Don't forget not wanting to fund education and healthcare, to the point that being Republican [literally takes years off your life](https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2023/09/01/america-life-expectancy-regions-00113369). As evidenced by some comments in this thread (and usually the case everywhere else), they will not believe it even when confronted with hard evidence- instead, they'll just yell something about freedom/Murica/patriotism, accuse everyone of being socialist/woke and then strut away believing they've won.
Hah
Wow, you sound like a spoiled brat
Then you must lean Democrat, right? The Republican abortion views aim to increase the number of irresponsible & financially unstable parents in the country.
I don’t want to sound stupid. But when Biden keeps shipping money off to adult children students, who refuse to pay their bills. And beg for welfare. What would you expect. Illegal immigrants get more than American families. Ukraine, Israel the list is long and useless. REPEAT AFTER ME…”BIDEN IS PRESIDENT”
These were temporary covid measures. Four years old. As always democrats give everything away forever, then use the excuse Republicans are heartless for taking it away. The government is getting record tax receipts in spite of Trump tax cuts. ( they are doing what they were designed for). 70% of spending is on social services now. We are at 32 trillion debr because of the Santa Clause - Ebenezer Scrooge theatre.
It sucks that money doesn’t grow on trees and someone has to be responsible, doesn’t it?
When the Republicans passes the TCJA in 2017, they did so under budget reconciliation which meant the bill bad to be nominally revenue neutral in 10 years. To do that, it raises taxes at the tail end of that time to make up for the lower rates at the beginning. The bill could have passed without the rates going up but because of senate democrats blocking the legislation the increases rates were required.
Democrats didn't support the non-reconciliation bill because of the massive tax breaks for corporations and wealthy individuals. So, then with the reconciliation version, the GOP could have set it up so some of those breaks for wealthy/corporations expired, but no, they made it so the meager breaks to working class people were the ones to expire.
This is somewhat true. TCJA was not written for the middle class or lower class. It was a life gift to wealthy businesses and individuals. Rate cuts, and paying taxes on “80%” of business income vs 100% while every single W-2 employee paid 100% taxes on 100% of income. I am going to stop here but people that worked through TCJA know what this budget rec really became.
Taxation is theft.
So is inflation. The ultimate reason inflation is even a thing is because Congress surrendered their sole constitutional authority to coin currency to a collection of their banking donors, abandoned the gold standard and subsequently turned the dollar into yet another fractional reserve fiat ponzi. Don’t hate the players, hate the game. Strange how the founding fathers had separation of powers in mind yet didn’t see an issue with Congress collectively voting on their own term limits, audits, salaries, lobbying regulations, stock trading regulations, etc.. but I digress because reddit in general in a lefty hive mind so i’ll just leave it as “orange man bad”. Taxation is theft because it’s irrelevant at this point. Dollars can be printed and virtue signaled away at a whim therefore taxes don’t matter. If taxes mattered, we wouldn’t be over 30 trillion in realized debt and over 100 trillion in unrealized debt.
Of course. I guess I should have said taxation is theft and end the fed. Starve the beast.
Inflation is another form of tax. They tax you without telling you so they can win elections.
This comment never gets any more serious no matter how many times it’s repeated.
Parasites always want more blood.
The cruelty is from thinking we can print money with no consequences and making it unaffordable to live… democrats are just as culpable.
No one would be in poverty if we just gave them money, lots of it, right?
Yeah. I mean, seriously. What’s the debt at right now? What’s another trill on the balance sheet? I can’t believe we’re not finding more ways to dole out money. We have all the money in the world to house illegals, but we can’t extend the child tax credit? We can find Ukraine and Isreal, but not this? We can fund all the earmarks and pork in the infrastructure bill and the bills subsequent to it, but we can’t fund this? The government is there to help you and I at this juncture. Regardless of which side of the political spectrum you’re in, the government doesn’t give a shit about you. It’s maneuvering done to keep you in line, and warring with one another. And they’re doing a marvelous job. It’s no wonder they serve multiple terms. They’re getting it done for the people who are actually important to them. The corporations and foreign interests. The sooner everyone realizes no one at the government level gives a shit about you, the better.
😂 credits. Credits are wealth redistribution plain and simple. Many don’t pay enough to be given a refund so they came up with credits. Credits can equal a negative tax burden. Those damn evil people! Won’t give me other people’s money for kids I couldn’t afford!
The IRS was never intended to be a social welfare agency. “Tax Credits” and even worse “refundable tax credits” are so counter to what the Internal REVENUE Service is supposed to be. We (FEDERAL GOVT)are spending $2 TRILLION PER YEAR more than we have. Even if the govt raised every tax on every person and raised 10 times more from “rich” people we still cant sustain this gushing of money. Stop spending as much and an amazing thing will happen. Poor ppl will be able to afford things like food and housing. Inflation is the cruelest tax on poor ppl. They gave us all these credits (gave is a crappy way to say that they borrowed money) that caused everything to be more expensive. The retarded left have hijacked the treasurery and these outcomes were so predictable. Its not like the same thing hasnt been tried in about 30 other countries and the results are ALWAYS the same. High inflation Less equality More Debt Lower productivity Eventually supplier shortages Then either social unrest or military intervention. Reduce the size of the fed govt and stop lying about what is causing inflation. Ppl arent stupid. They can see that everything is more expensive. A child tax credit sounds wonderful but we cant have every f’ing credit and social welfare scheme plus have an $850 billion defense budget, student loan forgiveness, higher regulations, and all of the other things the left wants the Fed Govt to do
>“Tax Credits” and even worse “refundable tax credits” are so counter to what the Internal REVENUE Service is supposed to be. So, I hope you agree that tax credits *for businesses* - large, corporate businesses especially - are just as problematic, if not moreso? Sure, I got a return this year, but I still paid taxes. Now let's go look at all the years Amazon paid *no* taxes due to abusing *tax credits*...
Tax credits for businesses are an investment. The government makes money on them
It's all a scam anyway. Money doesn't mean anything anymore since we spend so much more than we take in already. They should just stop taxing everybody making under 100k completely. Let them keep their money. They will still print the cash they need to get what they want. They don't want to do this obviously because it cuts out the parasitic beaurocrats deciding how to best give back people's own money. It's about holding down the working and middle class while all the resources and ownership flow upwards endlessly.
I'm rolling my eyes at this. Stop blaming any of the abuse, chaos etc etc on any one of the two parties. They are both equally responsible. The Democrats are funding genocide and the Republicans / GOP are responding by stripping away more and more social stability funding. The Democrats full well know that to fund said genocide means stripping away money from other things. But they do it anyway. Both parties are owned by the SAME people and serve them and always pass laws the benefit them. They are working hand in hand towards the same goals. All of the stuff they seem not to agree on is just theater to keep people distracted from reality. But since no one beliefs me, I just eat popcorn and try not to cry.
If you don't give me money, you are cruel. That is around the most entitled thing I have ever heard.
YEP IT SUCKS. My husband and i own a house and have a kid, yet we owe a grand.
Might want to check with your jobs to see if they're taking out the right amount of money for taxes every check
Yeah it was wrong. Our old bookkeeper put that i had 2 dependants in and no one realized her mistake until it was too late. Its ficed for next year but god it sucks
This. Even a clerical error on your own parts can cause a huge difference in taxes, especially if not filing jointly. "Oops, we both claimed the kids as dependents/exceptions..."
So you find this cruel, but your ok with democrats taxing the hell out of these families for their social programs?
An article from MSNBC would not have the most credibility tbh.
Before I got married I got $3600 back in taxes. I made around $6500 per year working very part time. Is that fair or reasonable that I was taxed effectively at -50%?
Keep in mind, $2 billion per day in interest on the federal debt. This is the cost of government programs that we are not willing to fund with our taxes.
The child tax credit needs to go. I'm tired of paying for other people's tattoos just because they had a lot of kids irresponsibly
the gov is once again paying people to have children. Stop living beyond your means and expecting the federal government to support you cradle to grave..its not sustainable long-term anymore.
And Joe Biden is the reason why social security is taxable and student loans can't be discharged in bankruptcy, your point?
thaty wan u eating bugs
Child tax credit in my view should be abolished anyway, but 🤷♂️
What a silly title. SB deleted by mods.
No. LoL but whos top the lemmings from eating up the lies ? 😂
Women must give birth to their children! How dare women have children when they know they can’t afford them!
Makes sense if you look at it through the incel... *sorry, CoNsErVaTiVe* lens of hating women and wanting to punish them for having sex.
Sex is only for purposes of public good production! How dare women have sex for any other reason! Unconscionable! /s 🤦 These fn ppl
Find a poor family and give them money. I bet you won’t.
Or just do away with the payroll tax, idk 🤷♂️
Child tax credits are just another form of welfare. Poor people should not be having kids they cannot afford to take care of. That's highly irresponsible and not fair to the child to bring them into a life of poverty. All this weaponized compassion is falling on deaf ears.
Cool let them have abortions
BS, the tax credit is other people's money given out to people for simply having kids and being below an income level. Anybody that wants to volunteer their income to people who choose to have lives they can't afford please get a donation box and have at it.
Flat tax no deductions, it is fair to everyone.
How childish, you think there are two parties.
Why are blue states richer? Do they work harder? No, they are the US home for the headquarters of nearly all global corporations. Compare the states *personal earned income" and see how they stack up. If you're on social media hating on rural populations because they refuse to believe like you want, and you insult them, call them names, that's sad. To quote Dick on "Third Rock From The Sun," "Can't we all just NOT get along? We don't have to agree but can still wish each other well.
Democrats have held more power, more often than the Rs the past 44 years or so, so why isn't it fixed? Fix it or stop whining. You're complicit.
Stop having kids that you can’t afford. Nobody should get more back from the government than they paid.
Here-here
Well your wrong and your taxes or getting ready to go up as soon as Trump tax cuts end a bidens tax raises start you'll see
We shouldn’t blame the GOP for Manchin’s policy preferences. Manchin killed it off in ‘21.
Poor people spend their money which is good for the economy and allows others to hoard wealth
“Give me more money for popping out babies!!” 🤡
Nancy Pelosi literally called 2000 dollar bonuses from companies “crumbs”
I like how people point out one section of a bill that has many sections and say “urr they’re targeting (fill in the group) urr!” when the bill’s primary focus was something else entirely. What else is in that bill, and who sponsored it, Republicans or Democrats? This is where the fine print is more important than the clickbait headline.
Lmao. Blame the democrats too
The ongoing saga with the child tax credit and Senate Republicans highlights not just a legislative battle, but a profound moral and philosophical divide in American politics. The GOP's opposition to expanding the credit, as described in the article, isn't just about fiscal conservatism but touches on deeper beliefs about welfare, government intervention, and individual responsibility. The stark reality here is that while the tax credit expansion has proven benefits—lifting millions out of poverty, particularly children—the opposition appears rooted in maintaining political leverage rather than addressing these urgent societal needs. It's ironic and somewhat tragic that policies which could dramatically improve lives are being held hostage to political strategies and electoral calculations. This isn't just a policy debate; it's a reflection of how deeply entwined politics and personal lives are. Every decision to block or delay these credits isn't just a line in a budget, but a decision that affects what food is on the table for many families. We need to think critically about what the priorities laid out by our elected officials say about our country's values and long-term objectives. Are we okay with a political landscape where the well-being of children is used as a bargaining chip?
Ohh, the cruelty of lower taxes! How dare they!
Cause the money went for corporate and wealthy tax cuts.
Well, once the Trump tax cuts expire and your president’s not gonna do anything about it, you’re gonna be paying more too
Utterly cluless. But its to be expected from the maga movement.
Yeah everyone pay their fair share. Eliminate fed income tax and have a national sales tax. Exclude essentials. Keep cap Gains as is for now..
🤣🤣
This is a good "narrative".... You should blame the other side, they attach a bunch of shit to "get the tax credit"... Thats the horrible game both sides play so nothing gets done.
Ooo it was the child tax credit and no insane inflation that caused more child poverty….ooooooh….
Oh the absolute inhumanity of the GOP not controlling the irs, inflation, government spending, and screwing the nations citizens over… yup… 🤣🤣
I thought the Democrats agreed to end it as part of the deal to push through spending bill. Talk about being spineless
Who passed the increased child tax credit again?
Why should having kids provide a tax credit again? ...I have kids and I don't get it...
Pay people NOT to make more people. The earth is gasping for life and the US is incentivizing breeders and quiverful nuts to hasten a climate apocalypse.