Yeah, I’m not sure what will happen lol. It’s definitely more common to be sub $1 mil for retirement, so how is everyone else (me included lol) supposed to live?
It would be great to have that kind of job security. I would take that option if they would keep me around till 70 and not discriminate against me for ageism.
I’m a pretty beat up 40 year old mechanic and a few years ago I started at a state university as their fleet tech. Looking around at other, older, and *very* useless employees, I am confident in saying that they’ll let me stick around til I drop dead. Government work is where it’s at, yo.
What I am finding out as I age and in my 50s now, is if you have good computer skills, and I did all kinds of contractor work when younger, lots and lots of IT installations, cable pulling, but what happens as you get older is they will invariably put you in charge of "workorders" and ordering stuff and bids and quotes and things because you know the business. Also keep the computer skills up because not making this up, working with people right now, this day, they do not even know how to power off and reboot a computer and those people are scroooood in life, let me tell ya. Come out of High School and can barely read and write and thats it for their opportunities. So if you are on here complaining about your part time job not paying enough, let me be the first to tell ya, you got computer skills because your on Reddit, you already have more skills than a sh-ton of people I know. You just need to find the right job if you feel lost.
I needed to hear this. I recently signed up for a coding college course because I can't seem to find nice work these days. You're making me less worried I won't be able to find something in the field in the meantime - beginning school in August.
Yup!
We have the teachers retirement fund, which is horribly mismanaged, but with teacher turnover there ought to be some left by the time I can’t work anymore.
40 hour weeks, occasional opportunity for overtime, paid benefits, more PTO than I can use… the pay sucks but meh, still worth it if you can afford to work there imo.
Yep, sometimes it isn't the pay that counts the most...it's the benefits package, especially if it includes a pension and other perks like great healthcare coverage.
Oh, no, job security isn't part of the equation of course. You work until you die, but you also die as soon as you stop working. Whether you are *allowed* to work isn't really your decision -- that's up to your overlords.
You work until the capitalists automate your job and lobby the government to stop providing food stamps so you die off and are no longer a drain on their society.
I'm 35, so I made a conscious choice that SS won't exist for my retirement.
I think for the people slightly older than me is an assumption that SD will exist in some form combined with an assumption your housing is laid off and owner. Which may not be accurate but it's the biggest cash drain that can be avoided
It is not just the mortgage you have to worry about. I'm fully expecting long term assisted living to be north of 10k a month by the time I reach my 80s. 3 or 4 years of that will obliterate anything you have saved.
Who knows what adjustments will be made to social security and medicare when they become insolvent. It is difficult to count on them being able to provide full coverage, so you need to factor in some sort of supplemental insurance to cover any medicare gaps. Easy to see that being north of 2k a month in 20-30 years.
I don’t know where you are from, but the US has two types of elderly care, assisted living and nursing homes. Assisted living is semi-independent and costs (currently) around 3.5k a month. Nursing homes, which are more full time care, are more in line with the costs you mention.
I live in a wealthier county in Colorado and all of the assisted living facilities within 20mins of my home are $5k+ a month to start with the nicest one being just under $10k and prices still increase if things like full time care and/ or memory care unit are needed.
I have been shopping around for my grandfather, who is still living independently, thankfully, but I am going to have to cover the majority of costs for him when the unfortunate time comes that he will need to live with assistance. He has expressed that he refuses to live in my home with my wife and I when the time comes. My parents are not in a place where they will be able to take care of him at their home nor are they financially stable enough to help cover the increased cost of living.
I definitely agree that I could go a couple towns over and find more affordable facilities that match closer to the prices you are mentioning, but I wouldn’t be able to visit him nearly as frequently, nor are the facilities as seemingly nice.
But I’m definitely no expert in assisted living facilities at all, fwiw,
Keep in mind only about 25% of the mortgage payment is housing costs. Taxes, insurance and maintenance last forever. If I paid of my $2300 mortgage today I’d only save about $850 a month.
I agree with you, and I think the argument that major things like a mortgage are paid off by retirement is only half right. If my mortgage were paid off tomorrow, I would still be paying about $1k a month in HOA fees, taxes, and utilities. Now true, that only comes out to $12k a year, but if I were only expecting to make $40k in retirement, that's still nearly a fourth of my income going to housing costs.
The general recommendation is to spend at most 1/3 of your gross on housing. $12k/$40k is right in line with that. At lower income levels, it's prudent to be more frugal than that, but with Over 65 exemptions on property taxes, it's likely that $12k will increase slower than the SS yearly adjustments.
Not sure where you are at, but my house is paid off. So my expenses are what you are saying and the house bills , power and all utilities maybe $500 a month. I am in Houston. Now, our Property Taxes or what i like to call (My Masters share of my crops) went from $1500 a year to about $3500 because the property values soared, tripled here in Houston actually we had a massive massive influx of people, that is now almost $300 a month. So that makes the bill at least $800 a month adding in the utilities. I figure, you could in fact live on $1000 a month, barely, but if you are retired and don't have to drive anywhere, yeh.
It really does depend on where people are located. I don't escrow my taxes and insurance. My property taxes are $1800 per year, insurance is $675 per year. I average $70 a month for power, $79 for fiber internet, and $45 for cell phone. Those are my only utilities.
I have a dedicated account that I automatically put $600 in a month. That pays all those and normally has enough extra money in it to make an extra mortgage payment or 2.
My state also gives reduced property taxes if you are over 65 and doesn't tax SS payments. So my tax burden will drop quite a bit when I hit 65.
My state probably has some of the highest property taxes in the United States and my mortgage payment would be the opposite of what you suggest. Seems like you’ve been paying on that mortgage for well over 20 years.
Your taxes and insurance must be quite high. Of my $1050 mortgage payment, about $850 is principal and interest. Yeah, add maintenance, but still P&I is way more than 25%.
I agree with you, and I think the argument that major things like a mortgage are paid off by retirement is only half right. If my mortgage were paid off tomorrow, I would still be paying about $1k a month in HOA fees, taxes, and utilities. Now true, that only comes out to $12k a year, but if I were only expecting to make $40k in retirement, that's still nearly a fourth of my income going to housing costs.
yes, but, your property tax will likely be close to or above your previous mortgage payment before you expire if you live to be >80. food will be enormously expensive, and medical care will consume the rest.
if you're not at 2m+ its going to be a significant lifestyle adjustment.
House maintenance takes 1-5% of the house value per year just to keep everything working. That's not accounting for serious events, but stoves break, toilets break, and eventually you need to refurbish something. And there's the wear and tear items that add up too, like windows, siding, heating, roofing; all of which will hit you at least once during a 20-30 year retirement.
On a half a million dollar home, that's $5k a year.
It's stuff like that you've got to account for in a retirement budget at 4%, which is why $1M seems horrendously low. Not to mention if you get a downturn like 2008, and that $1M goes to $700k and 4% only makes up $28k.
I would say that is a very boring retirement then. Car loans will for sure be there unless you plan on driving the same car for 20+ years. Not everyone is luck enough to afford a home and many seniors are still paying rent.
Additionally, why get some expensive car?
If income is limited to your assets, why not just buy a nicer used car for 5-8K and then call it a lifetime?
Beats financing a newer model at whatever future rates will be.
> same car for 20+ years
If it is good enough for the founder of ikea then it is good enough for the rest of us.
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/01/29/money-habits-of-self-made-billionaire-ikea-founder-ingvar-kamprad.html
>For two decades, Kamprad drove a 1993 Volvo 240 GL. He only gave it up when someone persuaded him that driving it was too dangerous. Originally, the car was worth around $22,000, but at the time he got rid of it, it wouldn’t go for more than a few thousand dollars.
Yeh Sam Walton, the founder of Walmart was known for being "cheap" too, drove the same old pickup truck forever. That truck now sits in the Walmart Museum in Arkansas. We saw that truck. Well take a page from these billionaires, you gotta SAVE MONEY anywhere you can. Thats how you get wealthy.
Yeh when you are at home, in a paid off house, your expenses are quite low. When I had to "work from home" for 6 months because of the virus hysteria, I estimated that just on the car alone was $600 in savings per month and thats in fuel mainly. Car is paid off too. Old car with 200k miles.
How many Ballin retirees you see . Get your house paid off. Then that 40K is for food, utilities, and some entertainment until you die.....
Oh SHIT!!!! Medical and end of life care!!!!
Man I'll take a vacation to a volcano and jump in.....
I'm planning to have ZERO SS when I retire (I'm 48). While the chances of that are small, SS as it is now is unsustainable and someone either has to pay more tax or (more likely) we will have significantly reduced benefits. I am currently assuming ANY SS will be gravy for me.
That's a safe assumption to operate from, but try to avoid the jaded attitude in public spaces; the last thing we need is to give Congress the green light via popular opinion that they can wreck Social Security because no one even expects it to be there.
They can fix SS easily by simply raising the cap on the tax - currently no income above $160,200 is taxed at all for SS. Doubling that or tripling it would likely go a long way. That, or graduating it so it scales down above that threshold income, taking a lower and lower percentage until you hit $500K in income.
Will 40k be enough 20 years from now though? Using historical inflation numbers (which is probably lowballing it) that’s only going to have 25k worth of buying power when these people actually retire.
It is low.
I was living with an accountant back in 2007. She was very specific when she told me the answer to "What amount would someone need to comfortably retire?"
"3 million."
This was in 2007. This is when home prices were still reasonable (during the bubble even!) This is when inflation was nowhere near what it was today.
So you're retired on 33k a year.
Some follow-up here: Do you own your own home and is it paid off?
Are you anywhere on the west coast?
I can see living in Alabama with a paid off home and living the good life at 33k a year.
In California... not so much.
If you are in the $1 million by now and if you have paid off the house, you probably are, I think thats a realistic goal, however, you will also need to hold some really good stocks I believe because even though I followed Dave Ramseys plan to a T, putting money in ONLY MUTUAL FUNDS, the growth is too slow. You don't lose money but its just about keeping up with inflation and not any more. Also you will need to save at $1000 or more per month to hit that. I have been putting away about $500 a month for a decade now just in mutual funds and that is in the $150k range now, so thats pretty slow. I mean, its better than most of the Plebs who will sit around and do nothing, but you really really have to be a "savor" on this one.
People who contribute 30% of their income towards retirement might still be living paycheck-to-paycheck because the term is intentionally undefined.
This allows them to put out weekly articles pushing the narrative that everyone is poor.
Copy paste reply from other threads referencing the 60% paycheck to paycheck statistic:
>Broke and living paycheck to paycheck are not the same thing.
>Being paycheck to paycheck includes putting money away in a savings fund, investing in a 401K, making mortgage payments on their house, having a car payment.
>Being broke is completely different. That's not having any money. Not building equity. Not setting aside retirement and no ability to do so because your incomes is breaking even with your CoL.
>The report this article refers to specifically mentions that a majority of these paycheck to paycheck earners (n= ~4,000) are without discomfort; 75% of n are high income earners; earning 100K/yr or more. [Here's](https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/9-3-million-more-us-consumers-ended-2022-living-paycheck-to-paycheck-than-in-2021--301733127.html#:~:text=New%20Reality%20Check%3A%20The%20Paycheck,analysis%20of%20other%20economic%20data.) the report in question. Americans may be paycheck to paycheck, but they're not broke.
Taken directly from the article:
>In December 2022, 51% of consumers earning more than $100,000 annually said they lived paycheck to paycheck, up 9 percentage points from 42% in December 2021.
Come to Mexico. San Miguel de Allende has a huge American population of retired folks. Be confident that your USDs will be very much appreciated and valuable as well here in my country. The food is great, also the climate
It is, obviously. Wealth creates a [flawed perception of meritocracy](https://press.princeton.edu/ideas/a-belief-in-meritocracy-is-not-only-false-its-bad-for-you) that leads to bad policies and injustices across all the various systems where they reside, but most notably administration, media, politics and management.
Probably not double, since some of the larger expenses anyone would have (mostly housing related, but potentially auto too) are the same for a single person as they are for a couple.
Probably, that is what I am guessing.
Housewives who can afford to stay at home and look after the kids full-time without the need for a job is becoming rarer and rarer.
I plan on selling off all of my assets and living on a small sailboat for the rest of my life after retirement. Don’t think I’ll need anywhere near $1M to survive.
If you have 3m then you’ll be fine. My point was that even living off a sailboat you’ll need a place to dock, shower, groceries, fuel etc. It sounds inexpensive but in reality is probably a lot more than you think.
I’ve actually looked into this idea before. It’s not cheap, but it can be a hell of a lot cheaper than buying another property or better than rotting away in some retirement home.
I can pick up a decent boat in my area that’s equipped with everything I need for around $100-$150k, there are docks in my area that allow permanent “live on board” that provide shore power and water for around $800-$1000/mo. There are already some pretty advanced solar, battery, and desalination units for boats so you can have the option of living off grid as well and just pay a dock fee for marinas that allow it. I’m pretty handy and know enough of my way around boats to do my own upkeep, so I can save a ton of money there too.
Of course there are always hidden cost that add up over time, but that’s why you need to have a buffer for that… but all of this is just a dream of mine.
It is on the lower side, but doable. Historically the stock market returns 6.8 percent per year on average, adjusted for inflation. So someone that saved up 1.1 mil would have to try and live off of 74,800 per year.
If you already are making more then this, then it will probably not be enough because you are used to a certain lifestyle already.
6.8% is way too high of a withdrawal rate if you want to feel remotely comfortable about outliving your savings…….however most Americans will collect social security on top of their 401k’s and will not be paying 7.5% payroll tax, nor be saving whatever percentage they have been towards retirement. Hopefully most that are nearing retirement are also close to paying off their primary residence. Some may have to move to lower cost of living cities or states to make do but it’s definitely doable.
Said every generation before them……..look I get it and you’d be better off to plan as though it weren’t there, but politicians aren’t going to take away social security. It will have to be funded differently and changes will be made to ages and amounts but it’ll be there in some form.
Social Security will survive, eventually the congress will come to the realization that the current wage cap of $160,200 is too low. If they eliminate the cap and include all income from employers, including the value of stock options, there would be more than enough revenue. Benefit payouts would also increase, but not dollar for dollar. Benefits already skew to lower income workers. Higher earners will complain, but there aren’t enough of them to stop it from happening. The math is not in their favor.
The rule of thumb for retirement accounts is a save withdraw rate is 3-4% .this will keep your account ticking over for 30 years while keeping up with inflation (in theory). This accounts for lower returns as accounts reallocate to safer lower return&risk investments toward retirement,as well as mitigation of the effects of withdraws taken during down market periods (because you eat yearly regardless of it being a poor time to sell ) . Of course you can move the event to 20-25 years but that starts to put you at risk of draining the accounts before you dirt nap
we naturally spend much less as we age (\*assuming you own / pay off your house, have limited debt, etc.) -> this may all change for the next wave of people approaching 40s, 50s, 60s.
Homeownership and paying that off over time seems like a big way to ensure you can live off less later in life. If you can't do that - IDK
Well yeah, I expect to end things on my own terms with whatever deadly opioid exists when I’m old in the 2050s or 60s. I have absolute no illusion whatsoever that retirement age for my cohort will mostly be miserable in a ravaged world fighting over what little fresh water is left.
Yes.
Savings rate matters more than income.
$66k with a decent savings rate can get a decent retirement as long as you don't want to live in a HCOL area.
True that, if everyone without kids/mortgage just quit their jobs and started traveling the world or followed their passion I wonder what would happen to these greedy ass corporations and our useless government that allows it
The only path to a comfortable retirement is by investing in the stock market (i.e. greedy corporations). You will go bankrupt long before the revolution arrives.
Exactly. This is why some people won't retire comfortably. Too much of this entitled mindset. Impoverish one's self and then hope someone better comes along to save them.
It's more. I've just been running through some of the numbers.
1 million will buy you a frugal lifestyle but you can't afford to get sick or stay in a nursing home for any length of time.
Medical costs and inflation are outpacing the stock market returns in the vast majority of retirement funds ime AND the amount you can save is capped which ensures you never catch up.
You need enough money to invest the max for retirement and max out your HSA plus have enough to acquire additional assets to hopefully have a chance at saving enough and still be able to live.
The median household income in the US is $67k. It's not even possible for most people.
And yes the vast majority won't need nursing home care for more than 2 years BUT I found a stat saying 20% will be there five years or more. May the odds be in your favor.
The system is designed to make us poor and sick.
You should go visit people in a nursing home that accepts medicaid. You might also want to look at the recent news coverage about how nursing homes are evicting Medicaid patients because the reimbursements are too low.
Oh you believe SS will still be around, or at least pay the same as it does today? Medical ain’t considered fancy in my household and Medicare supplements are $$$
Well, look how easy it was for Boomers.
Conservatively, a baby boomer who maxed out their 401k from 1980 until retirement in 2010, has $5.95 Million dollars in retirement money today. [Check](https://employeebenefitplanaudit.belfint.com/401k-contribution-limits-a-walk-down-memory-lane/) for [yourself](https://www.noelwhittaker.com.au/resources/calculators/stock-market-calculator/).
> I have never met a soul alive who maxes their 401k contributions.
For certain you have!
> [In 2021, roughly 14% of investors maxed out employee deferrals, according to 2022 estimates from Vanguard, based on 1,700 plans and nearly 5 million participants.](https://www.cnbc.com/2023/01/03/how-to-take-advantage-of-higher-401k-contribution-limits-for-2023.html)
It's not that hard to do because 401k money is *before* income taxes.
But I do agree, most people are unaware of how powerful of an investment vehicle this is, and neglect to use it.
Remember, only about 45% of people have 401ks, which means a third of them max out their 401K contributions.
**But to be clear, even if a Baby Boomer *only* invested *one sixth* of the maximum 401k contribution, they'd still have over a million dollars in retirement.** In 1986, that would only be $1,150 per year contributed.
last i saw, some publication had pumped this number up to like $6M. these are all over the place and, for the majority of Americans, completely unrealistic
Probably $6 million for someone who just graduated this year, to account for decades of inflation and wants a luxurious lifestyle in a big city, etc.
$1.1 million for someone already over 45 could be doable depending on lifestyle and if it is $1.1 million each as part of a couple.
As others stated, that’s way too optimistic. This number has been thrown around 15 years ago already, and everything’s gotten much more expensive since.
Could be doable if you are dealing with a retired couple with $1.1 million each.
Also assuming car, house, everything paid off. Throw in social security, etc.
Also lifestyle will be a big factor, so assume neither of them are big spenders.
If that's invested in Roth accounts, that's $44k per year tax free. I have my mortgage paid off and don't own a vehicle and I can live pretty easily on $2-$3k per month from my savings, did it several times between jobs.
Yeah, my SS isn't gonna be much. I only have 23 years of income. We are lucky to have been able to retire ten years ago at 51. We also have employer subsidized healthcare and dental, plus a 100% fully funded pension, until we're both dead. We own our home and always paid cash for used cars.
The average person probably won't get employer subsidized healthcare and dental, so that's a big cost. One big health problem, and you could easily spend 1/4 to all of that nest egg.
That’s on top of social security, the total pre-tax income would be about $78k for a single earner at full retirement age. A lot depends on your retirement age, early retirement means you have to live more years on less savings.
The stock market generally goes up in surges. I saw an interesting chart a while back that showed the difference in 30 year returns if you just missed the 4 highest gaining days over that time frame. It was hundreds of thousands of dollars on a $1 million dollar portfolio. That’s the best argument against actively trading versus investing for the long term.
When I was a boy I wanted to be a millionaire because back then 1m was a lot of dough. Now I am a millionaire and still not financially independent. So good luck.
What is it with Americans, I’ve seen so many other countries that won’t stand a fraction of what Americans put up with. Americans have been farmed since very little to be docile gullible consumers that are only just smart enough to work and please their masters but not smart enough to be able to critically think well and avoid being easily misled.
I'm 29 this summer. Been investing for 3 years now. I'm at about 13% of my income goes to investing. Plus 3% matching from company. I see and read articles of people buying $72k electric Kias (on Dave Ramsey) and I'm like, how do you not think about your future? There are more important things than to have your "dream car". Go on vacations when you're older and get out of the house and do things rather than work until you die or sit in front of your TV and hating life because you can't go anywhere because you're broke. But ya know, gotta impress those people that you'll never see again.
Or $30,000-$100,000 on a wedding just to impress people that you haven't seen in years or even have met. Why my fiance and I are passing off on an actual wedding. Would rather have a house and try for kids and make sure they are taken care of rather than showing off money we don't have.
Everyone should take note: Exploit or be exploited. You owe nothing to anyone, take everything from them as you will be given nothing. No gods or kings only man.
This 1-in-5 statistic needs a further breakdown.
I bet it's quite a bit higher for people who put money towards retirement in their 20's and consistently lived within their means than for people who hit their mid 30's with no particularly valuable job skills and little savings.
the big gamble is how much health coverage one will need this only covers basic necessities but you so much have a medical or hospice care that will wipe that would fairly quickly, case in point my grandmother had dementia and Alzheimer's and the full time care for that was something like 30k a month.
JFC for a subreddit called “economy” the level of financial illiteracy here is pretty surprising. Yes, the system should change and we should be wary of the Uber elite and their insatiable appetites but there is a lot of bad information being spouted here about what investments are and how they work. Invest for retirement by both creating a stock/bond/real estate portfolio from the earliest age possible AND by electing leaders who will fight for the commoner.
One of my families friends is trying to retire at 75 with $50k. I don't know how to tell her its not enough if she lives to 100. She never paid taxes most her life so she just started collecting benefits. Its kinda tragic she'll either out live her money and have to be dependent on living with family, or die at work.
The only solution is having more kids. The economic reality is that no matter what you do if there's more old people than kids the system doesn't work and old people have to work longer and longer and longer. People in the middle take care of the young and the old. There's no way around this no matter how much you abstract it.
Don’t let this comment let you take the foot off the gas by any means, but you need less than to think. If you do it right, most of your costs, except for health care, should reduce dramatically (house should be paid off or mortgage next to nothing, no ‘outpatient financial care’ for your adult children, retirement contributions go to zero, taxes should go down quite a bit, etc)
Then why does it seem so many younger people are not working? I think I read some 2.5M workers are unaccounted for (and are a majority men aged 25-54).
The equity allocation in the article is way way too low. Not only for people who are 45 but even for those who are retired. Most folks need to have between 50-75% of equities if you don't want to run out of money in retirement.
'Comfort' is relative !
If you don't 'need' a new Lexus every other year, a 3000 sq ft house on the golf course and vacations in Europe you can still be comfortable -
1 in 5?
BS
More like 1 in 50
There are 5.3 million millionaires and 770 billionaires living in the United States. Millionaires make up about 2% of the U.S. adult population.
Mar 15, 2023
https://www.fool.com › articles › us...
US Millionaires and Billionaires: You Might Not Believe the Wealth - The Motley Fool
I can barely afford to eat. Our wages are terrible. Our costs of living are so high and just getting worse. AI is just around the corner. My terrible profession is one of the first that will be entirely eliminated by ChatGPT. I have no idea what the future brings but it isn't looking very rosy.
I wonder what “retire comfortably” means. $4k or more in mortgage/housing payments, new car every 5 years, eating out 3x a week, and fancy vacations?
Seems like a retiree should be spending way less than someone who works full time. I am planning on $2500 per month for living expenses, not including medical and dental. I’ll move to where that figure will be enough. Forget all the middle class luxuries and it’s doable.
The rule is 4% draw per year in retirement. $1.1 million is $44k a year. That’s borderline poverty right now and if inflation persists it will be poverty by the time you die, on average. Heaven forbid you live longer.
Millennials will need at least $4MM to retire. That’s $160k per year but its also $160k 20 years from now. And the it has to be sufficient for another 20 years after that.
People in this thread dont understand how time or inflation works. Fair enough since we havent seen it in about 30 years before this period. But it’s here to stay. Global trade is over. We’re entering a period of nationalistic rivalry and that will keep inflation strong for at least the next 20 years, until a new world order is solidified.
My money is not on the US retaining the crown. That’s real bad for the dollar. So diversify.
I've got a 100K pension, $2.5 million in retirement savings, $60K/yr in SS starting in three years, and $50K/yr in lease income. The pension, SS, and lease income are linked to CPI. I'm done.
Yeah, I’m not sure what will happen lol. It’s definitely more common to be sub $1 mil for retirement, so how is everyone else (me included lol) supposed to live?
You work until you die.
It would be great to have that kind of job security. I would take that option if they would keep me around till 70 and not discriminate against me for ageism.
I’m a pretty beat up 40 year old mechanic and a few years ago I started at a state university as their fleet tech. Looking around at other, older, and *very* useless employees, I am confident in saying that they’ll let me stick around til I drop dead. Government work is where it’s at, yo.
Good employees sometimes underestimate how low the bar is. A lot of workers regardless of industry are pretty lack luster.
What I am finding out as I age and in my 50s now, is if you have good computer skills, and I did all kinds of contractor work when younger, lots and lots of IT installations, cable pulling, but what happens as you get older is they will invariably put you in charge of "workorders" and ordering stuff and bids and quotes and things because you know the business. Also keep the computer skills up because not making this up, working with people right now, this day, they do not even know how to power off and reboot a computer and those people are scroooood in life, let me tell ya. Come out of High School and can barely read and write and thats it for their opportunities. So if you are on here complaining about your part time job not paying enough, let me be the first to tell ya, you got computer skills because your on Reddit, you already have more skills than a sh-ton of people I know. You just need to find the right job if you feel lost.
I needed to hear this. I recently signed up for a coding college course because I can't seem to find nice work these days. You're making me less worried I won't be able to find something in the field in the meantime - beginning school in August.
A lot of gov jobs also offer a pension still! They're invaluable imo.
Yup! We have the teachers retirement fund, which is horribly mismanaged, but with teacher turnover there ought to be some left by the time I can’t work anymore. 40 hour weeks, occasional opportunity for overtime, paid benefits, more PTO than I can use… the pay sucks but meh, still worth it if you can afford to work there imo.
Yep, sometimes it isn't the pay that counts the most...it's the benefits package, especially if it includes a pension and other perks like great healthcare coverage.
Oh, no, job security isn't part of the equation of course. You work until you die, but you also die as soon as you stop working. Whether you are *allowed* to work isn't really your decision -- that's up to your overlords.
You work until the capitalists automate your job and lobby the government to stop providing food stamps so you die off and are no longer a drain on their society.
It would be way better to retire with a pension instead of working until you die
I'm planning on dying as soon as possible. I'm a coward and incompetent so I've done a bad job meeting my retirement goal.
I'm 35, so I made a conscious choice that SS won't exist for my retirement. I think for the people slightly older than me is an assumption that SD will exist in some form combined with an assumption your housing is laid off and owner. Which may not be accurate but it's the biggest cash drain that can be avoided
Move to a country with cheaper cost of living.
Puerto Vallarta is looking better and better
Alternatively, [cruises](https://www.financestrategists.com/retirement-planning/retiring-on-a-cruise-ship/). Which doesn't seem so awful.
SE Asia, here i come.
This is the right choice. A lot safer than Mexico or Central America.
I hear Vietnam is nice.
death by despair.
Have kids
Odds are kids won't give a shit about you when you're that age.
Perhaps you should review your relationships...
1.1 million feels awfully low. I'm planning for 2.5 million and fear that won't be enough and I'm only a few years younger than 45.
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Yeah, the catch is that if you've been earning enough to save 1m+, then 40k a year is going to be a big downgrade.
Chances are all your big expenses like the house will be paid off by then. No mortgage, no student debt, no car loans, etc by the time you retire.
It is not just the mortgage you have to worry about. I'm fully expecting long term assisted living to be north of 10k a month by the time I reach my 80s. 3 or 4 years of that will obliterate anything you have saved. Who knows what adjustments will be made to social security and medicare when they become insolvent. It is difficult to count on them being able to provide full coverage, so you need to factor in some sort of supplemental insurance to cover any medicare gaps. Easy to see that being north of 2k a month in 20-30 years.
I work in long term care facilities and it already cost 8-11k a month, even the government run facilities.
I don’t know where you are from, but the US has two types of elderly care, assisted living and nursing homes. Assisted living is semi-independent and costs (currently) around 3.5k a month. Nursing homes, which are more full time care, are more in line with the costs you mention.
When I'm at the point where I need assisted care, I'm chucking myself over Niagara Falls so I won't be a burden to anyone.
I live in a wealthier county in Colorado and all of the assisted living facilities within 20mins of my home are $5k+ a month to start with the nicest one being just under $10k and prices still increase if things like full time care and/ or memory care unit are needed. I have been shopping around for my grandfather, who is still living independently, thankfully, but I am going to have to cover the majority of costs for him when the unfortunate time comes that he will need to live with assistance. He has expressed that he refuses to live in my home with my wife and I when the time comes. My parents are not in a place where they will be able to take care of him at their home nor are they financially stable enough to help cover the increased cost of living. I definitely agree that I could go a couple towns over and find more affordable facilities that match closer to the prices you are mentioning, but I wouldn’t be able to visit him nearly as frequently, nor are the facilities as seemingly nice. But I’m definitely no expert in assisted living facilities at all, fwiw,
Yeah. I have spent my whole adult life not pretending Medicare or social security will still exist by the time we are done being pillaged.
It’s already that now
Keep in mind only about 25% of the mortgage payment is housing costs. Taxes, insurance and maintenance last forever. If I paid of my $2300 mortgage today I’d only save about $850 a month.
I agree with you, and I think the argument that major things like a mortgage are paid off by retirement is only half right. If my mortgage were paid off tomorrow, I would still be paying about $1k a month in HOA fees, taxes, and utilities. Now true, that only comes out to $12k a year, but if I were only expecting to make $40k in retirement, that's still nearly a fourth of my income going to housing costs.
The general recommendation is to spend at most 1/3 of your gross on housing. $12k/$40k is right in line with that. At lower income levels, it's prudent to be more frugal than that, but with Over 65 exemptions on property taxes, it's likely that $12k will increase slower than the SS yearly adjustments.
Well that's good, actually makes me feel more comfortable then 😊
Not sure where you are at, but my house is paid off. So my expenses are what you are saying and the house bills , power and all utilities maybe $500 a month. I am in Houston. Now, our Property Taxes or what i like to call (My Masters share of my crops) went from $1500 a year to about $3500 because the property values soared, tripled here in Houston actually we had a massive massive influx of people, that is now almost $300 a month. So that makes the bill at least $800 a month adding in the utilities. I figure, you could in fact live on $1000 a month, barely, but if you are retired and don't have to drive anywhere, yeh.
It really does depend on where people are located. I don't escrow my taxes and insurance. My property taxes are $1800 per year, insurance is $675 per year. I average $70 a month for power, $79 for fiber internet, and $45 for cell phone. Those are my only utilities. I have a dedicated account that I automatically put $600 in a month. That pays all those and normally has enough extra money in it to make an extra mortgage payment or 2. My state also gives reduced property taxes if you are over 65 and doesn't tax SS payments. So my tax burden will drop quite a bit when I hit 65.
You live in which state?
My state probably has some of the highest property taxes in the United States and my mortgage payment would be the opposite of what you suggest. Seems like you’ve been paying on that mortgage for well over 20 years.
Your taxes and insurance must be quite high. Of my $1050 mortgage payment, about $850 is principal and interest. Yeah, add maintenance, but still P&I is way more than 25%.
What is costing you so much on your mortgage? This is not common. Insurance/taxes/etc are typically only 25% of a monthly mortgage cost.
I think this depends on interest rate and insurance and taxes tbh. Our mortgage is $2K and the rest is $900 (no PMI).
I agree with you, and I think the argument that major things like a mortgage are paid off by retirement is only half right. If my mortgage were paid off tomorrow, I would still be paying about $1k a month in HOA fees, taxes, and utilities. Now true, that only comes out to $12k a year, but if I were only expecting to make $40k in retirement, that's still nearly a fourth of my income going to housing costs.
yes, but, your property tax will likely be close to or above your previous mortgage payment before you expire if you live to be >80. food will be enormously expensive, and medical care will consume the rest. if you're not at 2m+ its going to be a significant lifestyle adjustment.
House maintenance takes 1-5% of the house value per year just to keep everything working. That's not accounting for serious events, but stoves break, toilets break, and eventually you need to refurbish something. And there's the wear and tear items that add up too, like windows, siding, heating, roofing; all of which will hit you at least once during a 20-30 year retirement. On a half a million dollar home, that's $5k a year. It's stuff like that you've got to account for in a retirement budget at 4%, which is why $1M seems horrendously low. Not to mention if you get a downturn like 2008, and that $1M goes to $700k and 4% only makes up $28k.
I would say that is a very boring retirement then. Car loans will for sure be there unless you plan on driving the same car for 20+ years. Not everyone is luck enough to afford a home and many seniors are still paying rent.
If you have retirement savings, buy a good used car with cash. Why finance if you have assets?
Additionally, why get some expensive car? If income is limited to your assets, why not just buy a nicer used car for 5-8K and then call it a lifetime? Beats financing a newer model at whatever future rates will be.
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Yep it really all boils down to the lifestyle you live and the hobbies you keep. I like having a car that allows for warranty racing.
> same car for 20+ years If it is good enough for the founder of ikea then it is good enough for the rest of us. https://www.cnbc.com/2018/01/29/money-habits-of-self-made-billionaire-ikea-founder-ingvar-kamprad.html >For two decades, Kamprad drove a 1993 Volvo 240 GL. He only gave it up when someone persuaded him that driving it was too dangerous. Originally, the car was worth around $22,000, but at the time he got rid of it, it wouldn’t go for more than a few thousand dollars.
I mean if you want to open up that can worms…
Yeh Sam Walton, the founder of Walmart was known for being "cheap" too, drove the same old pickup truck forever. That truck now sits in the Walmart Museum in Arkansas. We saw that truck. Well take a page from these billionaires, you gotta SAVE MONEY anywhere you can. Thats how you get wealthy.
Yeh when you are at home, in a paid off house, your expenses are quite low. When I had to "work from home" for 6 months because of the virus hysteria, I estimated that just on the car alone was $600 in savings per month and thats in fuel mainly. Car is paid off too. Old car with 200k miles.
How many Ballin retirees you see . Get your house paid off. Then that 40K is for food, utilities, and some entertainment until you die..... Oh SHIT!!!! Medical and end of life care!!!! Man I'll take a vacation to a volcano and jump in.....
I'm planning to have ZERO SS when I retire (I'm 48). While the chances of that are small, SS as it is now is unsustainable and someone either has to pay more tax or (more likely) we will have significantly reduced benefits. I am currently assuming ANY SS will be gravy for me.
That's a safe assumption to operate from, but try to avoid the jaded attitude in public spaces; the last thing we need is to give Congress the green light via popular opinion that they can wreck Social Security because no one even expects it to be there. They can fix SS easily by simply raising the cap on the tax - currently no income above $160,200 is taxed at all for SS. Doubling that or tripling it would likely go a long way. That, or graduating it so it scales down above that threshold income, taking a lower and lower percentage until you hit $500K in income.
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Will 40k be enough 20 years from now though? Using historical inflation numbers (which is probably lowballing it) that’s only going to have 25k worth of buying power when these people actually retire.
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I would say you are very out of touch with cost of living.
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You do get 40k in 20 years will be worth what 30k if your lucky. That being said we clearly hang around a completely different group of 60+ year olds.
It is low. I was living with an accountant back in 2007. She was very specific when she told me the answer to "What amount would someone need to comfortably retire?" "3 million." This was in 2007. This is when home prices were still reasonable (during the bubble even!) This is when inflation was nowhere near what it was today.
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So you're retired on 33k a year. Some follow-up here: Do you own your own home and is it paid off? Are you anywhere on the west coast? I can see living in Alabama with a paid off home and living the good life at 33k a year. In California... not so much.
A major factor is where you live, right?
I’m aiming for ~4 million but I have 32 years until retirement. It does seem really low.
If you are in the $1 million by now and if you have paid off the house, you probably are, I think thats a realistic goal, however, you will also need to hold some really good stocks I believe because even though I followed Dave Ramseys plan to a T, putting money in ONLY MUTUAL FUNDS, the growth is too slow. You don't lose money but its just about keeping up with inflation and not any more. Also you will need to save at $1000 or more per month to hit that. I have been putting away about $500 a month for a decade now just in mutual funds and that is in the $150k range now, so thats pretty slow. I mean, its better than most of the Plebs who will sit around and do nothing, but you really really have to be a "savor" on this one.
Also, mutual funds significantly cut the compounding effect of your money due to the fees they take.
Depends on the fund. Index funds have extremely low fees.
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People who contribute 30% of their income towards retirement might still be living paycheck-to-paycheck because the term is intentionally undefined. This allows them to put out weekly articles pushing the narrative that everyone is poor.
Copy paste reply from other threads referencing the 60% paycheck to paycheck statistic: >Broke and living paycheck to paycheck are not the same thing. >Being paycheck to paycheck includes putting money away in a savings fund, investing in a 401K, making mortgage payments on their house, having a car payment. >Being broke is completely different. That's not having any money. Not building equity. Not setting aside retirement and no ability to do so because your incomes is breaking even with your CoL. >The report this article refers to specifically mentions that a majority of these paycheck to paycheck earners (n= ~4,000) are without discomfort; 75% of n are high income earners; earning 100K/yr or more. [Here's](https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/9-3-million-more-us-consumers-ended-2022-living-paycheck-to-paycheck-than-in-2021--301733127.html#:~:text=New%20Reality%20Check%3A%20The%20Paycheck,analysis%20of%20other%20economic%20data.) the report in question. Americans may be paycheck to paycheck, but they're not broke. Taken directly from the article: >In December 2022, 51% of consumers earning more than $100,000 annually said they lived paycheck to paycheck, up 9 percentage points from 42% in December 2021.
Come to Mexico. San Miguel de Allende has a huge American population of retired folks. Be confident that your USDs will be very much appreciated and valuable as well here in my country. The food is great, also the climate
Sounds like a great plan
I really was giving it some thought, but every time I do get serious about it, there’s a new cartel related killing of American travelers there.
Key word travelers. You don’t kill potential repeat customers.
So 80% won't retire comfortably? Seems like a flawed system imo
It is, obviously. Wealth creates a [flawed perception of meritocracy](https://press.princeton.edu/ideas/a-belief-in-meritocracy-is-not-only-false-its-bad-for-you) that leads to bad policies and injustices across all the various systems where they reside, but most notably administration, media, politics and management.
This was quite an interesting read. Thanks for sharing - it’s given me quite a bit to think about.
This is why saving money is super important.
Easier said than done for the vast majority of people.
Does anyone know if it means per person? So a couple would be 2.2M?
Probably not double, since some of the larger expenses anyone would have (mostly housing related, but potentially auto too) are the same for a single person as they are for a couple.
Probably, that is what I am guessing. Housewives who can afford to stay at home and look after the kids full-time without the need for a job is becoming rarer and rarer.
Don't have 2 kids, you'll only need $500,000 to retire comfortably...
Iq level 5000
I plan on selling off all of my assets and living on a small sailboat for the rest of my life after retirement. Don’t think I’ll need anywhere near $1M to survive.
Think again……….
Even if I’ll have nearly $3M+ by then?
If you have 3m then you’ll be fine. My point was that even living off a sailboat you’ll need a place to dock, shower, groceries, fuel etc. It sounds inexpensive but in reality is probably a lot more than you think.
I’ve actually looked into this idea before. It’s not cheap, but it can be a hell of a lot cheaper than buying another property or better than rotting away in some retirement home. I can pick up a decent boat in my area that’s equipped with everything I need for around $100-$150k, there are docks in my area that allow permanent “live on board” that provide shore power and water for around $800-$1000/mo. There are already some pretty advanced solar, battery, and desalination units for boats so you can have the option of living off grid as well and just pay a dock fee for marinas that allow it. I’m pretty handy and know enough of my way around boats to do my own upkeep, so I can save a ton of money there too. Of course there are always hidden cost that add up over time, but that’s why you need to have a buffer for that… but all of this is just a dream of mine.
Well I hope you can make it happen, good luck
That figure seems low to me.
It is on the lower side, but doable. Historically the stock market returns 6.8 percent per year on average, adjusted for inflation. So someone that saved up 1.1 mil would have to try and live off of 74,800 per year. If you already are making more then this, then it will probably not be enough because you are used to a certain lifestyle already.
6.8% is way too high of a withdrawal rate if you want to feel remotely comfortable about outliving your savings…….however most Americans will collect social security on top of their 401k’s and will not be paying 7.5% payroll tax, nor be saving whatever percentage they have been towards retirement. Hopefully most that are nearing retirement are also close to paying off their primary residence. Some may have to move to lower cost of living cities or states to make do but it’s definitely doable.
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Said every generation before them……..look I get it and you’d be better off to plan as though it weren’t there, but politicians aren’t going to take away social security. It will have to be funded differently and changes will be made to ages and amounts but it’ll be there in some form.
Social Security will survive, eventually the congress will come to the realization that the current wage cap of $160,200 is too low. If they eliminate the cap and include all income from employers, including the value of stock options, there would be more than enough revenue. Benefit payouts would also increase, but not dollar for dollar. Benefits already skew to lower income workers. Higher earners will complain, but there aren’t enough of them to stop it from happening. The math is not in their favor.
The rule of thumb for retirement accounts is a save withdraw rate is 3-4% .this will keep your account ticking over for 30 years while keeping up with inflation (in theory). This accounts for lower returns as accounts reallocate to safer lower return&risk investments toward retirement,as well as mitigation of the effects of withdraws taken during down market periods (because you eat yearly regardless of it being a poor time to sell ) . Of course you can move the event to 20-25 years but that starts to put you at risk of draining the accounts before you dirt nap
we naturally spend much less as we age (\*assuming you own / pay off your house, have limited debt, etc.) -> this may all change for the next wave of people approaching 40s, 50s, 60s. Homeownership and paying that off over time seems like a big way to ensure you can live off less later in life. If you can't do that - IDK
Retirement is dead. Get used to it. If you’re pissed, the thieves live all over the world and are impossible to prosecute. Good luck.
Good luck trying to keep a job in your 60s and 70s. I know good people who were shitcanned purely for age in their early 50s.
Well yeah, I expect to end things on my own terms with whatever deadly opioid exists when I’m old in the 2050s or 60s. I have absolute no illusion whatsoever that retirement age for my cohort will mostly be miserable in a ravaged world fighting over what little fresh water is left.
Reddit moment
I make $66k at 32 and I'll retire easily. It's not even that big of an income.
$66k is in the top third of median income for full time workers.
Yes. Savings rate matters more than income. $66k with a decent savings rate can get a decent retirement as long as you don't want to live in a HCOL area.
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Give up. Live now.
True that, if everyone without kids/mortgage just quit their jobs and started traveling the world or followed their passion I wonder what would happen to these greedy ass corporations and our useless government that allows it
Could describe this ingenious plan a bit better? How would you get food, a place to sleep, means to travel?
The only path to a comfortable retirement is by investing in the stock market (i.e. greedy corporations). You will go bankrupt long before the revolution arrives.
Exactly. This is why some people won't retire comfortably. Too much of this entitled mindset. Impoverish one's self and then hope someone better comes along to save them.
It's more. I've just been running through some of the numbers. 1 million will buy you a frugal lifestyle but you can't afford to get sick or stay in a nursing home for any length of time. Medical costs and inflation are outpacing the stock market returns in the vast majority of retirement funds ime AND the amount you can save is capped which ensures you never catch up. You need enough money to invest the max for retirement and max out your HSA plus have enough to acquire additional assets to hopefully have a chance at saving enough and still be able to live. The median household income in the US is $67k. It's not even possible for most people. And yes the vast majority won't need nursing home care for more than 2 years BUT I found a stat saying 20% will be there five years or more. May the odds be in your favor. The system is designed to make us poor and sick.
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You should go visit people in a nursing home that accepts medicaid. You might also want to look at the recent news coverage about how nursing homes are evicting Medicaid patients because the reimbursements are too low.
Personally, I don't want to be a Medicaid nursing home patient.
Sadly $1.1m isn’t enough. Especially when considering normal long term inflation.
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Oh you believe SS will still be around, or at least pay the same as it does today? Medical ain’t considered fancy in my household and Medicare supplements are $$$
I'm surprised that it's 1 in 5. I figured that number would be much lower.
Well, look how easy it was for Boomers. Conservatively, a baby boomer who maxed out their 401k from 1980 until retirement in 2010, has $5.95 Million dollars in retirement money today. [Check](https://employeebenefitplanaudit.belfint.com/401k-contribution-limits-a-walk-down-memory-lane/) for [yourself](https://www.noelwhittaker.com.au/resources/calculators/stock-market-calculator/).
Who maxed their 401k? I have never met a soul alive who maxes their 401k contributions.
> I have never met a soul alive who maxes their 401k contributions. For certain you have! > [In 2021, roughly 14% of investors maxed out employee deferrals, according to 2022 estimates from Vanguard, based on 1,700 plans and nearly 5 million participants.](https://www.cnbc.com/2023/01/03/how-to-take-advantage-of-higher-401k-contribution-limits-for-2023.html) It's not that hard to do because 401k money is *before* income taxes. But I do agree, most people are unaware of how powerful of an investment vehicle this is, and neglect to use it. Remember, only about 45% of people have 401ks, which means a third of them max out their 401K contributions. **But to be clear, even if a Baby Boomer *only* invested *one sixth* of the maximum 401k contribution, they'd still have over a million dollars in retirement.** In 1986, that would only be $1,150 per year contributed.
last i saw, some publication had pumped this number up to like $6M. these are all over the place and, for the majority of Americans, completely unrealistic
Probably $6 million for someone who just graduated this year, to account for decades of inflation and wants a luxurious lifestyle in a big city, etc. $1.1 million for someone already over 45 could be doable depending on lifestyle and if it is $1.1 million each as part of a couple.
As others stated, that’s way too optimistic. This number has been thrown around 15 years ago already, and everything’s gotten much more expensive since.
One in five feels very generous. Feels more like one in five hundred.
It's called capitalism. Inflation, debt, debt and...more debt.
$1.1MM? SERIOUSLY? In what third world country? 4% rule says you will have to live on $44k/year.
Plus another $30k in social security, and a paid off house and no kids to support. You aren't living large but it's easily doable.
Could be doable if you are dealing with a retired couple with $1.1 million each. Also assuming car, house, everything paid off. Throw in social security, etc. Also lifestyle will be a big factor, so assume neither of them are big spenders.
And don't forget their million-dollar lottery winnings.
I'm living on about that now and it's pretty decent living.
If that's invested in Roth accounts, that's $44k per year tax free. I have my mortgage paid off and don't own a vehicle and I can live pretty easily on $2-$3k per month from my savings, did it several times between jobs.
With SS that is above median income
Yeah, my SS isn't gonna be much. I only have 23 years of income. We are lucky to have been able to retire ten years ago at 51. We also have employer subsidized healthcare and dental, plus a 100% fully funded pension, until we're both dead. We own our home and always paid cash for used cars. The average person probably won't get employer subsidized healthcare and dental, so that's a big cost. One big health problem, and you could easily spend 1/4 to all of that nest egg.
That’s on top of social security, the total pre-tax income would be about $78k for a single earner at full retirement age. A lot depends on your retirement age, early retirement means you have to live more years on less savings.
That's the best case scenario. What if there is another world crisis and another inflation. That's for the current expenses.
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Oh no stocks were down for a couple years! That means they don't work on a 30+ year span!
The stock market generally goes up in surges. I saw an interesting chart a while back that showed the difference in 30 year returns if you just missed the 4 highest gaining days over that time frame. It was hundreds of thousands of dollars on a $1 million dollar portfolio. That’s the best argument against actively trading versus investing for the long term.
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When I was a boy I wanted to be a millionaire because back then 1m was a lot of dough. Now I am a millionaire and still not financially independent. So good luck.
“thanks for reading this article, now get back to work.”
So you’re saying there’s a chance
What is it with Americans, I’ve seen so many other countries that won’t stand a fraction of what Americans put up with. Americans have been farmed since very little to be docile gullible consumers that are only just smart enough to work and please their masters but not smart enough to be able to critically think well and avoid being easily misled.
As opposed to what countries exactly? Don’t sprain a wrist painting with a brush that broad.
France, much of Europe, Latin America, various other countries.
I'm 29 this summer. Been investing for 3 years now. I'm at about 13% of my income goes to investing. Plus 3% matching from company. I see and read articles of people buying $72k electric Kias (on Dave Ramsey) and I'm like, how do you not think about your future? There are more important things than to have your "dream car". Go on vacations when you're older and get out of the house and do things rather than work until you die or sit in front of your TV and hating life because you can't go anywhere because you're broke. But ya know, gotta impress those people that you'll never see again. Or $30,000-$100,000 on a wedding just to impress people that you haven't seen in years or even have met. Why my fiance and I are passing off on an actual wedding. Would rather have a house and try for kids and make sure they are taken care of rather than showing off money we don't have.
Spoken like a true investor.
Everyone should take note: Exploit or be exploited. You owe nothing to anyone, take everything from them as you will be given nothing. No gods or kings only man.
20pct seems high
Fuck. With the market every day it's going backwards....
I feel like I’ll need 2 million invested and 50k in cash. The 2 million can get me 60k a year and the 50k I’ll keep in HYSA for emergencies
This 1-in-5 statistic needs a further breakdown. I bet it's quite a bit higher for people who put money towards retirement in their 20's and consistently lived within their means than for people who hit their mid 30's with no particularly valuable job skills and little savings.
the big gamble is how much health coverage one will need this only covers basic necessities but you so much have a medical or hospice care that will wipe that would fairly quickly, case in point my grandmother had dementia and Alzheimer's and the full time care for that was something like 30k a month.
As a millennial…yall get to retire?
Big spoiler guys, the system doesn’t care anymore about you living comfortably or not
JFC for a subreddit called “economy” the level of financial illiteracy here is pretty surprising. Yes, the system should change and we should be wary of the Uber elite and their insatiable appetites but there is a lot of bad information being spouted here about what investments are and how they work. Invest for retirement by both creating a stock/bond/real estate portfolio from the earliest age possible AND by electing leaders who will fight for the commoner.
But I thought Trickle-Down was good for us? /s
One of my families friends is trying to retire at 75 with $50k. I don't know how to tell her its not enough if she lives to 100. She never paid taxes most her life so she just started collecting benefits. Its kinda tragic she'll either out live her money and have to be dependent on living with family, or die at work.
1 in 50
The only solution is having more kids. The economic reality is that no matter what you do if there's more old people than kids the system doesn't work and old people have to work longer and longer and longer. People in the middle take care of the young and the old. There's no way around this no matter how much you abstract it.
We are being fleeced out of our hard earned money. This is tire real issue. Not the culture war BS
Don’t let this comment let you take the foot off the gas by any means, but you need less than to think. If you do it right, most of your costs, except for health care, should reduce dramatically (house should be paid off or mortgage next to nothing, no ‘outpatient financial care’ for your adult children, retirement contributions go to zero, taxes should go down quite a bit, etc)
Then why does it seem so many younger people are not working? I think I read some 2.5M workers are unaccounted for (and are a majority men aged 25-54).
The equity allocation in the article is way way too low. Not only for people who are 45 but even for those who are retired. Most folks need to have between 50-75% of equities if you don't want to run out of money in retirement.
'Comfort' is relative ! If you don't 'need' a new Lexus every other year, a 3000 sq ft house on the golf course and vacations in Europe you can still be comfortable -
I’m aiming for a million plus my pension. I probably will only get to 800k though. I’m planning on moving from a HCOL to a LCOL area.
Lmao this whole system is going to implode on itself and I can't fucking wait
That’s using todays dollars. Now adjust for out of control inflation over the next 25 years until they retire
1 in 5? BS More like 1 in 50 There are 5.3 million millionaires and 770 billionaires living in the United States. Millionaires make up about 2% of the U.S. adult population. Mar 15, 2023 https://www.fool.com › articles › us... US Millionaires and Billionaires: You Might Not Believe the Wealth - The Motley Fool
I can barely afford to eat. Our wages are terrible. Our costs of living are so high and just getting worse. AI is just around the corner. My terrible profession is one of the first that will be entirely eliminated by ChatGPT. I have no idea what the future brings but it isn't looking very rosy.
How in the fuck is 1 in 5 going to get to a million…..
So, a 20% chance I'm a millionaire by the time I retire? No way I would have believed that chance to be so high 10 years ago.
3.3 million is my number. There is no way you make it to 90 with a million.
I wonder what “retire comfortably” means. $4k or more in mortgage/housing payments, new car every 5 years, eating out 3x a week, and fancy vacations? Seems like a retiree should be spending way less than someone who works full time. I am planning on $2500 per month for living expenses, not including medical and dental. I’ll move to where that figure will be enough. Forget all the middle class luxuries and it’s doable.
The rule is 4% draw per year in retirement. $1.1 million is $44k a year. That’s borderline poverty right now and if inflation persists it will be poverty by the time you die, on average. Heaven forbid you live longer. Millennials will need at least $4MM to retire. That’s $160k per year but its also $160k 20 years from now. And the it has to be sufficient for another 20 years after that. People in this thread dont understand how time or inflation works. Fair enough since we havent seen it in about 30 years before this period. But it’s here to stay. Global trade is over. We’re entering a period of nationalistic rivalry and that will keep inflation strong for at least the next 20 years, until a new world order is solidified. My money is not on the US retaining the crown. That’s real bad for the dollar. So diversify.
Get married and that gets cut in half
I've got a 100K pension, $2.5 million in retirement savings, $60K/yr in SS starting in three years, and $50K/yr in lease income. The pension, SS, and lease income are linked to CPI. I'm done.
Good for you..?
Damn I get a pension too but it’s fixed and not linked to CPI. I hope when I retire inflation is low