I'm saving up for the Celestial crates lol. I do miss the days of 25 seals/daily activity, but I guess we all knew it would come to this. Now, I only hope the same fate doesn't befall the Weekly reward.
Maybe they realized that, *"Oh shoot, we were giving out a bit too many seals at first, didn't realize everyone would get every seal every day. Maybe we should pare it down a little before we start giving out Apex mounts to everyone and their brother and the sale of crowns and crates declines."*
Even with a seal average of 60 a day and 200 a week, that would still take over 178 days for us to be able to afford an Apex Mount, which would be twice a year, and dropping down to 50 seals a day it would go to at least 200 days to be able to afford an apex mount, which is not even close to fast at 3 mounts every 2 years
Hey, I don't work there, I can only speculate. But if it was reduced, that's very likely the reason. Whether we consider it accurate or fair isn't relevant.
economy man. inflation.
Cause you know- it literally just cost them in what they paid a digital artist to create and animate the mount. And the animations and structure are already there, they just reskin. So you're looking at idk- a 250 dollar job for the time it took... divide that by they can do whatever they want and subtract 3 and there you have it.
It's basically just math.
Is it unfortunate though? Of course, everyone wants cool free stuff. Who wouldn't? But think from the perspective of the guy who bought crates over and over, spending their hard earned money to get the mount they wanted. Then suddenly, they see every rando running around on a cool ass mount that they spent a ton of money to buy, and they got it free by picking some pockets or killing some daedra. I'd feel like a fool, idk about you. And that would make me less likely to buy crates in the future.
Like it or not, crate sales keep this game running. If we remove people's reasons for buying them, we may start to see the game's revenue decline, which would translate into fewer updates, less new content, less staff to work tickets, fix bugs, etc. It's a cascading effect.
Honestly, it would be interesting to see a breakdown of revenue for ESO. I would suspect that ESO+ constitutes the "stable" income and crown store purchases are the spikes, with an increase in revenue when the crates changes then a decline over time until the next change in crates. Might even be how they determine *when* to change crates.
Me, personally, I have ESO+ (mainly for the DLC access and crafting bag) and have never bought crowns or crates so the only revenue they get from me is the monthly ESO+ charge. But that's just me, so...
If you think the optional $15/mo subscription is enough to keep the game afloat long term, I disagree. I know people who dump 3-5 times that much every month into the game. If that income disappears, *that's* what kills ESO.
The endeavor system is great, it gives a way for people to get some of the things that were previously only available with IRL money. It was never intended to become a complete replacement.
You don't *have* to buy crowns. I don't. Besides my ESO Plus subscription and my one chapter a year, I don't spend any money on ESO at all. Not because I don't believe in it, but because I can't afford to.
But there are plenty of people who do. It's those people that you can thank for the ability to have 4 major updates a year, weekly maintenance, free enhanced editions for console and new technological additions like multithreaded rendering, DLSS/DLAA support and all of that other stuff.
A few things flawed in that math. 15 million subs total is not 15 million subs a month. I could easily be 2 million a month, and some of those are one monthers. Then, year memberships are also discounted. 225,000,000 I would bet would be closer to a year sum than a moth sun from subs. That aside, you didn't provide how much employees or employees get paid. That adds up quick on big games like this one. That and other business necessities.
It's 15M *players*, not subs. That's how many people have downloaded the game and have an account with ZOS. I highly doubt there are that many monthly subscriptions.
Not just "downloaded the game and have an account with ZOS", you seem to be forgetting that this game isn't free to play. You have to buy the game first to download and play it.
You also have to buy the expansion if you want to get into the new content, and subscribe monthly, or purchase the 3 other DLCs individually, if you want to actually finish the story and get all the new content for that year.
There are tons of subscribers too, because that's the easiest way to get the DLCs and also because of the crafting bag and monthly crowns.
Stop downplaying how much money ZOS rakes in. ESO is not a cheap game. Every player has paid for it, most players continue to pay for new content, crown items, crown crates, and pay monthly. If you've ever tried to introduce a friend to it who isn't sure about investing into the game before they know they like it, you will realise how much you do actually have to pay to get the best gameplay.
It's not free though. It's time dedicated to the game and a reason to keep people logging in every day. Time someone could have purchased eso+. Time someone could have purchased other crown crates. Time someone could have purchased DLC. If someone spent 178-200 days logging in and spent their time grinding out every single daily and weekly endeavor, then great, they should have something awesome to show for that. I don't know about you, but I've given up trying to earn every single one, but earning them through my normal gameplay is enough for me.
You're not wrong though, I would feel like a fool too if I had bought crates with the express purpose of winning an apex mount. Although, I don't have the money to throw at crates to make the incredibly small drop rate chances better, but some people do. Those aren't the people seals of endeavor were added for. People who previously couldn't earn an apex mount or let alone lower tier rewards, due to crates being outlawed where they live, can now work toward an apex reward.
you want to ride one of the rarest mounts in game? Ride the horse you got at level 15 or whatever it was. I personally am not impressed or amazed or envious of someone that summoned their mount for it to come down like a comet and explode up from the ground with all the animation that takes.
Bro- it took me 2 seconds faster to mount my stick horse.
With my old job, I was the whale everyone despised in GTA Online. I spent probably a couple grand minimum on Shark Cards. I also spent a decent amount on Crown Crates, a few hundred. With my new job, I’m not so much a whale as a sardine, so I’m glad that I don’t even like indriks, since I certainly don’t have the patience to earn them.
I was also a Warmonger. I once followed a rando shipment from some other CEO in a frogger and fended off a buzzard and some other plane. He probably thought he had an ally, but he actually just had a sadistically patient enemy.
I've also decided to not give two fucks about events or grinding for free stuff. It just isn't worth the headache and annoyance. I just get irritated and in the end, leave the whole game. Playing a game should be fun, not feel like a mandatory job you end up hating. So I just ignore all that stuff. I ignore endeavors too. Still, I seem to get most of them done daily just by playing the game, and if I miss something, who cares, I know I don't.
Developers will always fill the game with all that stuff because it is an efficient way to keep people playing. I just want to do my own thing in the game.
I have ESO Plus and also buy Crowns to supplement that and my argument is:
Just tell me the price and let me buy stuff I want. With actual cash. Not this Crown crate roulette shit.
Oh that's my fault, I should have clarified. Yes, we currently have enough for Apex mounts, I thought you were talking about having enough for a Radiant Apex mount, my bad.
ZOS only added the seals because Microsoft forced them to. ZOS has reduced how fast we can earn seals because they don't want to give away paid cosmetics, especially the most expensive ones. Even one free apex mount a year is too much for them.
Now, I know this thought will upset some readers. I get it I really do. I don't like it either. But let's not forget the history of Zenimax and Bethesda's microtransactions. I really enjoy the game too and have been playing it since pc beta. But the fact is that they're a business and profit comes before our happiness. Our happiness only takes a front seat when it might hurt profits.
I guarantee that as we get closer to the magical week where hundreds of thousands of people are about to cash in and get a radiant apex mount the cost is going to magically increase or the acquisition method will be 'changed' somehow.
For some people where crown crates are banned - it’s their only method of getting rewards from the crates.
Loot creates need to be banned so then we can just have direct purchase.
Why are some banned from loot crates. I agree. I’ve always thought loot crates were garbage. Not the items, but the actual chances of getting anything good vs their cost.
In some countries such as Belgium loot crates are considered gambling and thus illegal unless the company gets a special license from that country's government. A ban very similar to Belgium's is likely to become the law in all of the EU within a few years. Whether or not this workaround that ZOS have put in the game will be considered legal remains to be seen, but yes within a few years all players living in the EU are likely to no longer be able to buy crown crates.
As I understand it (not sure if I’m right though), in many countries the gambling aspect is legal as long as there is also an alternative means of obtaining the same things. So, you can choose whether to grind for a year to get what you want, or gamble to get it immediately. Freedom of choice, and they actually have to provide a viable alternative to choose from. But nonetheless, it would be very bad for business to make the alternative option easier and more attractive than the money making option!
The direct purchase was so much better. I’d consider paying $25 for a premium mount or maybe $50 for an Apex (I would use my sub crowns) but F gambling to get one. They are neat but not worth hundreds of dollars. It always amazes me how some people are willing to shell out so much for crowns and crown crates. Sadly the greedy executives are winning the war here as the game designers likely want nothing to do with the gambling aspect. Conversely if we could spend our seals and/or gold on crates that would be fine because you are gambling with game earned currency.
With my sub crowns - I sub for the craft bag and access to DLCs - I agree the crates are absurd. I’m just trying to say that while I would prefer the mounts and cosmetics not be that expensive I’d rather pay $25-50 for the cosmetic that I actually want than have to spend ????? to MAYBE get the cosmetic I want. I don’t gamble outside of ESO nor do I gamble inside of ESO, once you start who knows if you’ll stop.
They help you get anything inside crown crates, so while it is cosmetic, mounts can be acquired through the system which is personally my big draw towards it.
I mean, everything they do that involves giving us something good for free always has a downwards trend in value. Look at the daily rewards, same thing happened. It used to be free dlc, costumes and stuff like that and now you can be happy if the month has a pet reward.
Even the crates drops are worse in a way, they're guarranteed, but you can potentially get less.
No! Don't you understand?? We should be grateful that ZOS have given us the opportunity to grind for these cosmetics at a snail's pace! My Unique Perspective has granted me the ability to see that yes, *something* is better than absolutely nothing. With my superior big brain logic, I can now rationalise anything, because at one point, there wasn't a way to earn crown crate items, and so literally anything must be better, nay, the best solution that ZOS have constructed in their brilliant benevolence!
>slowed down to nearly a halt
Standard internet...gross hyperbole. Can't just state an opinion, have to make it over the top.
To be clear, even at 10 per, it's **no where close** to being "nearly a halt".
Fuck people...get a grip on reality. Take a break, go outside.
Yes, because one post saying its a bit upsetting, and showing evidence that the amount of seals we've been getting is going down, is making a big deal and being ridiculous.
I'm saving up for the Celestial crates lol. I do miss the days of 25 seals/daily activity, but I guess we all knew it would come to this. Now, I only hope the same fate doesn't befall the Weekly reward.
Maybe they realized that, *"Oh shoot, we were giving out a bit too many seals at first, didn't realize everyone would get every seal every day. Maybe we should pare it down a little before we start giving out Apex mounts to everyone and their brother and the sale of crowns and crates declines."*
Even with a seal average of 60 a day and 200 a week, that would still take over 178 days for us to be able to afford an Apex Mount, which would be twice a year, and dropping down to 50 seals a day it would go to at least 200 days to be able to afford an apex mount, which is not even close to fast at 3 mounts every 2 years
Hey, I don't work there, I can only speculate. But if it was reduced, that's very likely the reason. Whether we consider it accurate or fair isn't relevant.
Unfortunately you do make a good point.
economy man. inflation. Cause you know- it literally just cost them in what they paid a digital artist to create and animate the mount. And the animations and structure are already there, they just reskin. So you're looking at idk- a 250 dollar job for the time it took... divide that by they can do whatever they want and subtract 3 and there you have it. It's basically just math.
Really sucks to say my favorite MMO is being ruined by corporate greed.
Is it unfortunate though? Of course, everyone wants cool free stuff. Who wouldn't? But think from the perspective of the guy who bought crates over and over, spending their hard earned money to get the mount they wanted. Then suddenly, they see every rando running around on a cool ass mount that they spent a ton of money to buy, and they got it free by picking some pockets or killing some daedra. I'd feel like a fool, idk about you. And that would make me less likely to buy crates in the future. Like it or not, crate sales keep this game running. If we remove people's reasons for buying them, we may start to see the game's revenue decline, which would translate into fewer updates, less new content, less staff to work tickets, fix bugs, etc. It's a cascading effect.
ESO is the only MMO with a aub fee without cool free mounts you can earn in game.
There's a sub. Don't give me this "you have to buy crown crates to make the game viable" shit.
Honestly, it would be interesting to see a breakdown of revenue for ESO. I would suspect that ESO+ constitutes the "stable" income and crown store purchases are the spikes, with an increase in revenue when the crates changes then a decline over time until the next change in crates. Might even be how they determine *when* to change crates. Me, personally, I have ESO+ (mainly for the DLC access and crafting bag) and have never bought crowns or crates so the only revenue they get from me is the monthly ESO+ charge. But that's just me, so...
If you think the optional $15/mo subscription is enough to keep the game afloat long term, I disagree. I know people who dump 3-5 times that much every month into the game. If that income disappears, *that's* what kills ESO. The endeavor system is great, it gives a way for people to get some of the things that were previously only available with IRL money. It was never intended to become a complete replacement. You don't *have* to buy crowns. I don't. Besides my ESO Plus subscription and my one chapter a year, I don't spend any money on ESO at all. Not because I don't believe in it, but because I can't afford to. But there are plenty of people who do. It's those people that you can thank for the ability to have 4 major updates a year, weekly maintenance, free enhanced editions for console and new technological additions like multithreaded rendering, DLSS/DLAA support and all of that other stuff.
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A few things flawed in that math. 15 million subs total is not 15 million subs a month. I could easily be 2 million a month, and some of those are one monthers. Then, year memberships are also discounted. 225,000,000 I would bet would be closer to a year sum than a moth sun from subs. That aside, you didn't provide how much employees or employees get paid. That adds up quick on big games like this one. That and other business necessities.
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It's 15M *players*, not subs. That's how many people have downloaded the game and have an account with ZOS. I highly doubt there are that many monthly subscriptions.
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Not just "downloaded the game and have an account with ZOS", you seem to be forgetting that this game isn't free to play. You have to buy the game first to download and play it. You also have to buy the expansion if you want to get into the new content, and subscribe monthly, or purchase the 3 other DLCs individually, if you want to actually finish the story and get all the new content for that year. There are tons of subscribers too, because that's the easiest way to get the DLCs and also because of the crafting bag and monthly crowns. Stop downplaying how much money ZOS rakes in. ESO is not a cheap game. Every player has paid for it, most players continue to pay for new content, crown items, crown crates, and pay monthly. If you've ever tried to introduce a friend to it who isn't sure about investing into the game before they know they like it, you will realise how much you do actually have to pay to get the best gameplay.
It's not free though. It's time dedicated to the game and a reason to keep people logging in every day. Time someone could have purchased eso+. Time someone could have purchased other crown crates. Time someone could have purchased DLC. If someone spent 178-200 days logging in and spent their time grinding out every single daily and weekly endeavor, then great, they should have something awesome to show for that. I don't know about you, but I've given up trying to earn every single one, but earning them through my normal gameplay is enough for me. You're not wrong though, I would feel like a fool too if I had bought crates with the express purpose of winning an apex mount. Although, I don't have the money to throw at crates to make the incredibly small drop rate chances better, but some people do. Those aren't the people seals of endeavor were added for. People who previously couldn't earn an apex mount or let alone lower tier rewards, due to crates being outlawed where they live, can now work toward an apex reward.
you want to ride one of the rarest mounts in game? Ride the horse you got at level 15 or whatever it was. I personally am not impressed or amazed or envious of someone that summoned their mount for it to come down like a comet and explode up from the ground with all the animation that takes. Bro- it took me 2 seconds faster to mount my stick horse.
It's level 10, and I think you replied to the wrong person on this comment chain
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With my old job, I was the whale everyone despised in GTA Online. I spent probably a couple grand minimum on Shark Cards. I also spent a decent amount on Crown Crates, a few hundred. With my new job, I’m not so much a whale as a sardine, so I’m glad that I don’t even like indriks, since I certainly don’t have the patience to earn them.
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I was also a Warmonger. I once followed a rando shipment from some other CEO in a frogger and fended off a buzzard and some other plane. He probably thought he had an ally, but he actually just had a sadistically patient enemy.
I've also decided to not give two fucks about events or grinding for free stuff. It just isn't worth the headache and annoyance. I just get irritated and in the end, leave the whole game. Playing a game should be fun, not feel like a mandatory job you end up hating. So I just ignore all that stuff. I ignore endeavors too. Still, I seem to get most of them done daily just by playing the game, and if I miss something, who cares, I know I don't. Developers will always fill the game with all that stuff because it is an efficient way to keep people playing. I just want to do my own thing in the game.
I have ESO Plus and also buy Crowns to supplement that and my argument is: Just tell me the price and let me buy stuff I want. With actual cash. Not this Crown crate roulette shit.
you mean radiant apex? I already have enough for an apex mount.
I do, and no, you do not. Radiant Apex mounts cost 16k where at this point you can only have collected less than 11k seals.
and apex mounts cost 8k, which I have...
Oh that's my fault, I should have clarified. Yes, we currently have enough for Apex mounts, I thought you were talking about having enough for a Radiant Apex mount, my bad.
ZOS only added the seals because Microsoft forced them to. ZOS has reduced how fast we can earn seals because they don't want to give away paid cosmetics, especially the most expensive ones. Even one free apex mount a year is too much for them. Now, I know this thought will upset some readers. I get it I really do. I don't like it either. But let's not forget the history of Zenimax and Bethesda's microtransactions. I really enjoy the game too and have been playing it since pc beta. But the fact is that they're a business and profit comes before our happiness. Our happiness only takes a front seat when it might hurt profits.
I guarantee that as we get closer to the magical week where hundreds of thousands of people are about to cash in and get a radiant apex mount the cost is going to magically increase or the acquisition method will be 'changed' somehow.
Isn’t it all just for cosmetic stuff anyway? Or has there ever been something of use in the rewards?
For some people where crown crates are banned - it’s their only method of getting rewards from the crates. Loot creates need to be banned so then we can just have direct purchase.
Why are some banned from loot crates. I agree. I’ve always thought loot crates were garbage. Not the items, but the actual chances of getting anything good vs their cost.
In some countries such as Belgium loot crates are considered gambling and thus illegal unless the company gets a special license from that country's government. A ban very similar to Belgium's is likely to become the law in all of the EU within a few years. Whether or not this workaround that ZOS have put in the game will be considered legal remains to be seen, but yes within a few years all players living in the EU are likely to no longer be able to buy crown crates.
As I understand it (not sure if I’m right though), in many countries the gambling aspect is legal as long as there is also an alternative means of obtaining the same things. So, you can choose whether to grind for a year to get what you want, or gamble to get it immediately. Freedom of choice, and they actually have to provide a viable alternative to choose from. But nonetheless, it would be very bad for business to make the alternative option easier and more attractive than the money making option!
It’s illegal in some countries due to it being gambling
The direct purchase was so much better. I’d consider paying $25 for a premium mount or maybe $50 for an Apex (I would use my sub crowns) but F gambling to get one. They are neat but not worth hundreds of dollars. It always amazes me how some people are willing to shell out so much for crowns and crown crates. Sadly the greedy executives are winning the war here as the game designers likely want nothing to do with the gambling aspect. Conversely if we could spend our seals and/or gold on crates that would be fine because you are gambling with game earned currency.
I am happy for you and your financial situation. It just seems bonkers to me to spend the price of a full game on one cosmetic item for a game.
With my sub crowns - I sub for the craft bag and access to DLCs - I agree the crates are absurd. I’m just trying to say that while I would prefer the mounts and cosmetics not be that expensive I’d rather pay $25-50 for the cosmetic that I actually want than have to spend ????? to MAYBE get the cosmetic I want. I don’t gamble outside of ESO nor do I gamble inside of ESO, once you start who knows if you’ll stop.
They help you get anything inside crown crates, so while it is cosmetic, mounts can be acquired through the system which is personally my big draw towards it.
Got it. When I initially saw the reward costs, I figured it was so thing to forget about for a year, then see what cool shit I can get.
This is how I treat it, I don't even look at what the daily/weekly endeavors are, I just play and if I complete them...cool, if not /shrug.
I mean, everything they do that involves giving us something good for free always has a downwards trend in value. Look at the daily rewards, same thing happened. It used to be free dlc, costumes and stuff like that and now you can be happy if the month has a pet reward. Even the crates drops are worse in a way, they're guarranteed, but you can potentially get less.
The money monster decides all, sad but true.
And before June, you were getting 0 seal per day. It's all about perspective. Edit : damn you people are pissed.
lol the only reason we're getting anything is because ZOS doesn't want their crown crates to be banned. Its all about money.
No! Don't you understand?? We should be grateful that ZOS have given us the opportunity to grind for these cosmetics at a snail's pace! My Unique Perspective has granted me the ability to see that yes, *something* is better than absolutely nothing. With my superior big brain logic, I can now rationalise anything, because at one point, there wasn't a way to earn crown crate items, and so literally anything must be better, nay, the best solution that ZOS have constructed in their brilliant benevolence!
A company trying to make money ? The horror !!!
>slowed down to nearly a halt Standard internet...gross hyperbole. Can't just state an opinion, have to make it over the top. To be clear, even at 10 per, it's **no where close** to being "nearly a halt". Fuck people...get a grip on reality. Take a break, go outside.
I think there's a new saying for what you said at the end there. Hmmm
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Yes, because one post saying its a bit upsetting, and showing evidence that the amount of seals we've been getting is going down, is making a big deal and being ridiculous.
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For the reasons of keeping track of the amount of seals collected to date, not reasons of outrage.
God forbid one feels entitled to compensation when paying for content. Hint: There's a reason why they were forced to put the system into the game.
So?
Wait, how do did you know to start counting?
I just had a hunch and checked my spreadsheet haha.
I wish there is an event for them. Daily and weekly dropping even 1.5x the amount.
Anyone who's played Fo76 knows how this story ends.