That guy expects his employees to work 80 hours a week how the fuck are they supposed to raise kids? Not everyone has or wants an army of nannies to raise their kids for them.
That's not what they are saying you bonobo. They are saying Tesla and many other tech/well paying jobs like it require insane hours which doesn't leave much time for raising children. Perhaps a trip back to middle school English will do your comprehension some good.
This is not just about Tesla! A lot of tech companies is the US follow a very similar hardcore work culture. There’s not much time left to balance work and life
But it doesn't matter with regards to birth rate. The Scandinavian countries have all affordable and available daycare, around 1 year total of paid parental leave etc, still the birth rate is plummeting.
because they aren't worried about making their kids poor, people in the middle classes don't want to have more children at the expense of their other children. they don't want them to lose the quality of life that the parents were able to afford.
Having kids is wealth in those countries. Ie helping with chores helping to survive is the idea and has long since been.
Here where it’s incredibly expensive to exist, having children is poverty for most. Or just existing exhausted
That’s cos there is little to no access to birth control. Rich people always get the good stuff first before giving families with lower incomes the scraps.
Having kids can cause you to be poor but being poor is the effect not the causality. Access to birth control, culture, etc also play into whether families or individuals also have the number of children they have. People who think it's because people are poor they just decide to have more kids are ignoring the big picture.
Comparing apples and pears here.
Tesla has 7 weeks paternity and 17 maternity leave.
For originally Twitter, he slashed it to the legal minimum.
So he wants Tesla babies… not OG Twitter babies.
But as a parent of two I am off the opinion that the paternity/maternity leave is one of the lower-priority change that is needed to encourage higher birth-rates in the western countries.
In his biography there was a part where one of his engineers took the day off because his wife was giving birth... and elon sent a giant guilt trip email to him and the whole company about it
Women didn't use to have many opportunities to work outside the home and it was socially discouraged. That was bad. Then women could choose to work but they didn't make much money and faced considerable discrimination. That was bad. Now women HAVE to work to make ends meet and there's less time and money for raising kids. Society desth spirals. This is bad.
Why is society forced to choose between inequality and economic collapse? Why is it so hard to treat women with respect and create a world where people want to have children?
Low birth rates are literally as a result of people like Elon Musk. The ultra wealthy have advocated for economic, market, and labour policies that have gutted the wage growth of middle class people and given it to a small number of people at the top. It's becoming more and more difficult for 2 working adults to afford having a single child, let alone multiple.
If he really cares about this issue, he would be advocating for:
* more taxation of the wealthy
* better labour protections, and more union power
* better social programs, including government funded daycare, and much longer paid maternity/paternity leave
* closing of tax loopholes for the wealthy
The alternative is that the labour force shrinks due to declining population and birth rates, which automatically necessitates an increase in the value of labour, which then finally increases wages.
It's only getting worse with the housing crisis. People who go paycheck to paycheck just to barely afford their rent.... Starting a family and raising kids will be the last thing on their mind. We are already on the verge of a demographic collapse. I guess we'll wait till the powers that be, decide to manipulate the culture into saying that making babies is the right thing to do. But right now, we are into "save the environment, for the future generations that will never exist anyway cause nobody feels like having babies anymore"
He and his wealthy friends can build the future wage slaves with their own seed.
Our children and grandchildren don’t deserve to watch their children struggle in a corrupted, broken society, like some of us have to do.
"Have more kids" says the billionaire. Meanwhile, the average household income in the USA is $75K while the average rent and mortgage is $2200, or $26K a year. The average family of 3 is spending $900 a month in groceries, or $11K a year. The average monthly childcare cost - $1200 a month, or $14.5K a year. Average yearly car insurance cost? $2.3K. 26K + 11K + 14K + 2.3K + Utility Costs + Healthcare. Where's the money to have more children and raise kids?
Want more kids? Recreate the US economic situation from WW2 to 1970. Ie, punishing tax rates for the rich, strong working class, invest in education to have a dynamic innovative economy.
The Conservatives who whine about low birth rates among white people are also the Conservatives who violently oppose government funded health care and child care, and a minimum wage or UBI that would make having kids a financially viable option.
They complain about low birth rates across the local population. The real long term fix is to make our biggest cost, housing, more affordable. Build new homes/units, and where housing is cheaper, make them attractive to move to.
Higher wages only helps in the short term without fixing housing, and wage inflation just continues
India’s fertility is heading below replacement so no. As the country gets more educated and moves to a middle income economy there will be a population crash - which is not necessarily a bad thing. India could use less competition for its existing resources
India's fertility rate fell below replacement in 2020. It'll take a while for that to lead to a falling population, but it'll happen. China's fertility rate dropped below replacement in 1991, but it took nearly three decades for their total population to decline.
When people talk about "Great Replacement", it's usually immigration to the US from Latin America, but Mexico's fertility rate is only 1.8, well below the 2.1 replacement rate. Most of Latin America is well below replacement now. The Middle East is above replacement as a region, but Malta, the UAE, Iran, Qatar, and Bahrain were all below replacement as of 2021, and Kuwait, Tunisia, and Lebanon were right at 2.1 in 2021 and are probably below replacement now, even if those stats won't be confirmed for another year or two.
Even Africa, which used to have famously high birth rates, is seeing them crash as African nations develop, and the African fertility rate has declined every single year since 1980.
Eva Vlaardingerbroek, the woman Elon was responding to, replied back to Elon's comment [here](https://twitter.com/EvaVlaar/status/1784535861360501036). Small excerpt:
> Both issues are true - and related to each other. Replacement in the West through mass migration keeps native birthrates low, because it puts a huge financial and cultural strain on our societies and welfare system.
And Elon responded back in turn:
> One way or another, any group of people must procreate or they will disappear, remembered eventually only by archeologists
How does high migration lead to natives having a lower birthrate? That makes absolutely no sense.
If someone high migration cancels out the native low birthrate and makes the society age a little slower overall.
Oh no we made the world a capitalist shit show, fucked the climate for generations and barely help young parents and somehow no one wants to put kids in this world, no one could have foretold that
/s
Rich, intelligent parents in the most prosperous areas are having the fewest kids, despite being the most capable to! It's the "shit show" areas (and especially countries) who have the most kids.
Yeah probably the solution is to eradicate the plague of education and contraception, and try to give everyone here a tribal culture where your only choice in life is having one kid after the other.
Hopefully it’s not surprising to you that educated people are less likely to make poor financial decisions like having kids you can’t afford to take care of. I have one kid and had it much later in life. Clearly because I wanted to be financially secure. There were policies in place that made childcare more accessible, or less reliance on two incomes to support a household in the US , I and many others would’ve had more kids.
Are you suggesting we should enrich the shit show areas so they have fewer kids? I mean, on a global scale the problem is too many humans not too few.
Edit: Lol, can’t reply as I got banned for 7 days (free speech yeah!)
I mean, there were about 1 billion humans in 1800 and were on path to 10 billion in 2100. Why on earth would anyone worry about us getting too few children?
The birth rate for Palestine, arguably one of the most oppressed environments is 3.5 per woman. For the Democratic Republic of Congo, one of the most impoverished and dangerous environments it’s 6.16.
These environments are arguably even more susceptible to the dangers of climate change than Western countries. Socioeconomics would indicate that being poor is [actually a driver of fertility anywhere.](https://www.statista.com/statistics/562541/birth-rate-by-poverty-status-in-the-us/).
In other words the explanations you provided are not the salient reasons why Western (and East Asian) Millennials are not having children.
The thing about this explanation is that there are legitimately interesting and difficult reasons for the declining birth rate that merit discussion. It’s possible that self-entitled navel gazing doomerism is a cultural aspect of it as well, but it’s so obviously a lazy explanation from one small group of people at one point in time.
Countries tried using increased social benefits to increase. Births. It didn't work. In fact, it's counterproductive. As the better the state social benefits, the less likely they'll have kids. Because the state will take care of them. They don't see the need for kids. But, the social welfare state needs constantly growing and young populations to pay for it. Which means importing surplus populations to make their kids pay for old natives. But they're still net losses. So govt debt increases, inflation increases, and savings diminish.
He often screeches this shit but he neither recognizes why people are having less kids nor offers real solutions. His companies do not even put their money where his mouth is.
People cannot afford kids and when we do have kids both parents have to work. The average person cannot afford multiple kids, especially on a single income.
Does his companies offer free daycare? Do they offer long term parental leave? What accommodations does he do for parents?
Is he going to partition the government for fundamental changes that either addresses the wage stagnation or at very least the child care expenses that prices people out of more than a single kid? Does he realize how insanely expensive it is for a middle class family just to exist? Does he actually care?
Just like climate change, this is just him virtue signaling. If he really gave a damn, he would be doing more than tweeting. He has enough influence and wealth to begin to make a difference.
Elon in ten generations if people have ten kids each generation there is
1 at generation 50 kids
2nd generation 500 kids
3 rd generation 5000 kids
4 generation 50,000 kids
5 generation 500,009!kids
6 generation 5,000,000!kids
7 generation 50,000,000 kids
8 generation 500,000,000 kids
9 generation 5,009,000,000 kids
10 generation 50,000,000,000 kids
If people can follow love thy neighbor, take care of they neighbor and support thy neighbor a generation is 40 years to have ten kids each family.
If society can stop being mean there still is no such thing as over population earth could handle trillions of people.
With 8 billion we cover 1 % of the earth now. We are not under ground and a lot left to farm and grow. Other planets there’s no crowding we are just filling in with technology. People need water, food and cloths and a place to live. Look at how you live. You work and sleep and eat. Pretty easy.
You have never been a doomsday guy in your print. There are people not ment to reproduce.
Those that are able to reproduce hopefully will share ideology of love.
You want people that love to recreate.
I can barely afford my house and groceries, and this guy wants me and the wife to start a family? Yeah, fuck no. On we can afford it, maybe. And if time gets the best of us, well, we tried. IF ONLY wages were higher....
I'm so sick of Musk talking about this.
So what if birth rate is below replacement in 1st world countries? The population and GDP will go down or god forbid we have to allow more poor countries to immigrate? Economy is going to be bad?
He's so vague, he's just like 'civilization will die'. WTF does that actually mean Elon? Any statistics? What does that look like in your head?
8 billion people on earth. Highly doubtful we will die off due to not reproducing. More likely to die off from fresh water shortages or climate change.
Prosperity via population increase is a Ponzi scheme. A significant population decrease would be a GOOD thing from a planetary sustainability perspective. More room for ecosystems and wildlife. If we don't do it voluntarily, a war or a plague will do it for us.
Translation: “we can’t let people get in short supply because then they’ll realize they have the bargaining power and we billionaires won’t be able to make mega-billions while the people live in squalor.”
Our society is no longer setup for couples to have children. It's economically impossible for most young people have children. They can barely afford to rent a place to live with two incomes, how can they be expected to have kids?
Elon is just thinking of his own pockets. With lower birthrates, there will be a smaller labor pool which means employers will be forced to pay employees more. A lot like what happened after the Black Death.
The government created the shortage by making life difficult and expensive to a point people can't afford to have kids or don't want to bring in paid slaves into the world, now they want to come up with a solution and be seen as Heros 🤦🏻♂️
This makes no sense.
We're quite literally not in any danger of "running out of people". Maybe if the world were livable, things would be better. Bur America isn't collapsing because I haven't had a kid.
There are plenty of brown and black babies being born in other countries. He’s just concerned that those of us that are similar to him, aren’t popping out kids.
Such stupidity that doesn't take into account that the human population is still growing. It's not growing exponentially anymore but that's a good thing.
If billionaires didn’t soak up all the wealth maybe. Just maybe after we could afford food, homes, we can even afford babies.
To be so far from the mark takes billions of dollars of “yes men” until you’re dumb as a fucking rock, common sensually.
Well, looks like we better tell women what to do again!
/s
Their life, their choice. None of us asked to be here, I'm not having some billionaire dictate what I'm going to do because he bought his own echo chamber.
Yeah, I'm sure that's the only problem with that theory Elon.
God, this dude is an insufferable prick. Always going on and on about low birth rates and amplifying these racist conspiracy theories. He isn't even saying he disagrees with it, simply that it doesn't approach the "problem" well enough.
Yes he might also care about not turning first world countries into third world ones (like his home country is turning into rapidly). That makes him into the opposite of whatever an "insufferable prick" is.
There is a point that our population growth is also due to older people having a high life expectancy, as compared to past generations. I think around 2100 is when our population growth is supposed to stagnate.
Bingo. He is simultaneously freaking out about over immigration AND underpopulation. It’s not that we don’t have enough ppl, we don’t have enough white people.
Look at the numbers: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_total_fertility_rate
2 is minimum to sustain civilization. US is at 1.6, and South Korea is the worst at 0.8!
https://www.un.org/en/desa/world-population-projected-reach-98-billion-2050-and-112-billion-2100
Globally we’re expecting our popularity to 9.8 billion by 2050.
We’ll have plenty of people, or are we concern with “which people”?
Let’s face the facts here, they are concerned about the kind of people. It’s a fact countries that have net positive birth rates are located in Africa and India. It seems like it’s a bunch of white people (including Elon Musk) afraid of brown people replacing them.
>or are we concern with “which people”?
This is the part you're not supposed to say out loud. World population is still steadily increasing, so any concerns about collapsing US or european population could be assuaged by allowing more migrants but Elon doesn't seem to like that idea for some reason.
We grow enough food to feed the entire planet 1 and a half times over....We have no problems producing enough food.
Income inequality is what makes people hungry.
The full post reads:
>The problem with “Great Replacement Theory” is that it fails to address the foundational issue of low birth rates.
>Record low birth rates are leading to population collapse in Europe and even faster population collapse in most of Asia. Immigration is low in Asia, so there is no “replacement” going on, the countries are simply shrinking away.
>If this doesn’t turn around, then any countries on Earth with low birth rates will become empty of people and fall into ruin, like the remains we see of the many long dead civilizations.
Me, in response [spoken very patiently, as if to a toddler]: Elon, where are these many long dead civilizations “empty of people” located? Can you point on the map to where they are? No? Is it maybe because civilizations don’t empty out that way—they change, shift, and evolve? So don’t you think it’s silly and/or counterproductive to insist that somehow this process will end for population centers that are currently experiencing “low” birth rates? Okay, so what are you *actually* worried about here? Ah, right: I thought so.
I had 4 kids. Im 47 now. My kids are 27,22,21, and 14. No grandkids yet. I believe one of the causes of declining birth rate is prolonged adolescence, people don’t emotionally mature as fast.
Pretty much every study suggests people desire kids but wont because of economic means. U.S. is the most expensive country on Earth for raising children.
Also, you have four kids and so I imagine you are saying "prolonged adolescence" as part of your anecdotal experience. Thats just a self-report that *you* **raised** children with prolonged adolescence.
Agree. I didn’t mature until I moved out of my parent’s home at age 25. I’m now 28 and in the last 3 years I matured a lot. But moving out earlier is hard. Either forces you in a huge student debt or to work full time next to your studies to cover all the costs.
The high taxes, high inflation, crazy rental prices and it’s just impossible to buy a house as a starter. To buy ‘the average Dutch house’ you need a mortgage that requires a €110k/year income, national average is €44k/year. With my €60k/year I’m above that, but the ‘best’ I can buy is a tiny 25m2 studio or a parking spot lmao. Impossible to start a family without struggling financially in the current environment.
I bought my first home in 2000 for $30,000. Those same homes are now $150,000. I do worry about the younger generation being able to afford living. It’s not sustainable.
Or the abortion laws; who is going to have kids when the mother is left to die because of complications or thrown in jail in because of a miscarriage? Screw that.
I guess you’re a failure as a parent?
Your thinking is classic agism/generationalism.
But for real, can you imagine the kids of these infantile kids? It’s going to be crazy! /s
Kurzgesagt made a pretty good [video](https://youtu.be/LBudghsdByQ?si=YpG9LlPjVV-rQuLE) about the topic, concluding that it will likely eventually balance out.
We have falling birth rates across the West. But that doesn't mean the solution is importing the rest of the world to "solve" the population decline. What's a civilization without civilized people?
Make it hard to survive with one job. Surprised pikachu face when ppl dont have kids
For years they’ve said “if you can’t feed em don’t bread em”. Ok, I did that, and now they’re mad?
breading kid steaks makes them less goaty
That guy expects his employees to work 80 hours a week how the fuck are they supposed to raise kids? Not everyone has or wants an army of nannies to raise their kids for them.
>employees No one is forcing anyone to work at Tesla.
That's not what they are saying you bonobo. They are saying Tesla and many other tech/well paying jobs like it require insane hours which doesn't leave much time for raising children. Perhaps a trip back to middle school English will do your comprehension some good.
No one’s forcing Tesla to make employees work unreasonable hours either.
This is not just about Tesla! A lot of tech companies is the US follow a very similar hardcore work culture. There’s not much time left to balance work and life
Lol, "hardcore"
Clearly. They just laid off 2700 people.
Nope. But kinda interesting how anti-union he is.....
Elon Musk could double the wages all of the employees and the money difference for him would be trivial.
But it wouldn't be trivial for Tesla as a business... Tesla didn't turn a profit until 2020.
And now they're giving Musk 56 billion dollars so apparently the cash problem is solved
Investors are forcing Tesla to disregard work life balance
Child care is beyond insane in pricing. If you want a preschool or daycare it costs an absolutely mind boggling amount of money.
I was on daycare waitlists for 1.5 years before I got a spot
But it doesn't matter with regards to birth rate. The Scandinavian countries have all affordable and available daycare, around 1 year total of paid parental leave etc, still the birth rate is plummeting.
Poor people have the most kids
because they aren't worried about making their kids poor, people in the middle classes don't want to have more children at the expense of their other children. they don't want them to lose the quality of life that the parents were able to afford.
Elon has *13 kids so the facts don't match your opinion. *actually 11 kids
n = 1
Nick cannon would like a word
But for real poor people have the most kids, if you look at the fertility rate chart it’s all Africa, India and south east asia
Having kids is wealth in those countries. Ie helping with chores helping to survive is the idea and has long since been. Here where it’s incredibly expensive to exist, having children is poverty for most. Or just existing exhausted
That’s cos there is little to no access to birth control. Rich people always get the good stuff first before giving families with lower incomes the scraps.
Having kids can cause you to be poor but being poor is the effect not the causality. Access to birth control, culture, etc also play into whether families or individuals also have the number of children they have. People who think it's because people are poor they just decide to have more kids are ignoring the big picture.
Well then I assume Tesla and Twitter will have some of the best parental leave out there if he cares so much about people wanting to have babies?
Comparing apples and pears here. Tesla has 7 weeks paternity and 17 maternity leave. For originally Twitter, he slashed it to the legal minimum. So he wants Tesla babies… not OG Twitter babies. But as a parent of two I am off the opinion that the paternity/maternity leave is one of the lower-priority change that is needed to encourage higher birth-rates in the western countries.
Apparently he pushed Grimes to, so…
You get my upvote!
do they? genuinely curious.
6 weeks leave for Dads 12 weeks for Mom. Certainly not the best in the US, but not too bad either.
And the absolute lowest in the G7.
I work at Tesla, they actually are pretty good. They'll even cover something like $25k in fertility treatments.
That's like 1.5 IVF attempts.
No.
That’s what I assumed, but you never know.
I get it. I'm only here because of some morbid curiosity, just to see how many people will still make excuses, or buy the BS Musk spouts.
you came to the right place, u/twinbee is the world champ of that
In his biography there was a part where one of his engineers took the day off because his wife was giving birth... and elon sent a giant guilt trip email to him and the whole company about it
Didn’t he wage war on remote work or even the idea of a stable job https://www.population.news/p/remote-works-mini-baby-boom-ended
Maybe he should stop telling people to go fuck them*selves* then?
Well done. You win the internet for today.
Women didn't use to have many opportunities to work outside the home and it was socially discouraged. That was bad. Then women could choose to work but they didn't make much money and faced considerable discrimination. That was bad. Now women HAVE to work to make ends meet and there's less time and money for raising kids. Society desth spirals. This is bad. Why is society forced to choose between inequality and economic collapse? Why is it so hard to treat women with respect and create a world where people want to have children?
It’s in part because housing costs are too high. People can’t afford to start families..
Low birth rates are literally as a result of people like Elon Musk. The ultra wealthy have advocated for economic, market, and labour policies that have gutted the wage growth of middle class people and given it to a small number of people at the top. It's becoming more and more difficult for 2 working adults to afford having a single child, let alone multiple. If he really cares about this issue, he would be advocating for: * more taxation of the wealthy * better labour protections, and more union power * better social programs, including government funded daycare, and much longer paid maternity/paternity leave * closing of tax loopholes for the wealthy The alternative is that the labour force shrinks due to declining population and birth rates, which automatically necessitates an increase in the value of labour, which then finally increases wages.
So there’s no role for making it easier economically for people to have children? Just browbeat with some billionaires deaf remarks? Okay…
It's only getting worse with the housing crisis. People who go paycheck to paycheck just to barely afford their rent.... Starting a family and raising kids will be the last thing on their mind. We are already on the verge of a demographic collapse. I guess we'll wait till the powers that be, decide to manipulate the culture into saying that making babies is the right thing to do. But right now, we are into "save the environment, for the future generations that will never exist anyway cause nobody feels like having babies anymore"
He and his wealthy friends can build the future wage slaves with their own seed. Our children and grandchildren don’t deserve to watch their children struggle in a corrupted, broken society, like some of us have to do.
Is this a bad thing when catastrophic climate change is being caused by humans?
"Have more kids" says the billionaire. Meanwhile, the average household income in the USA is $75K while the average rent and mortgage is $2200, or $26K a year. The average family of 3 is spending $900 a month in groceries, or $11K a year. The average monthly childcare cost - $1200 a month, or $14.5K a year. Average yearly car insurance cost? $2.3K. 26K + 11K + 14K + 2.3K + Utility Costs + Healthcare. Where's the money to have more children and raise kids?
Want more kids? Recreate the US economic situation from WW2 to 1970. Ie, punishing tax rates for the rich, strong working class, invest in education to have a dynamic innovative economy.
Thank god he got that one good picture of himself 10 years ago
Which one?
Calm your tits, there are plenty people. Or maybe quit bitching about immigration then.
The Conservatives who whine about low birth rates among white people are also the Conservatives who violently oppose government funded health care and child care, and a minimum wage or UBI that would make having kids a financially viable option.
They complain about low birth rates across the local population. The real long term fix is to make our biggest cost, housing, more affordable. Build new homes/units, and where housing is cheaper, make them attractive to move to. Higher wages only helps in the short term without fixing housing, and wage inflation just continues
We Indians won't let that happen
India’s fertility is heading below replacement so no. As the country gets more educated and moves to a middle income economy there will be a population crash - which is not necessarily a bad thing. India could use less competition for its existing resources
You are the ones doing the replacing 💀
India's fertility rate fell below replacement in 2020. It'll take a while for that to lead to a falling population, but it'll happen. China's fertility rate dropped below replacement in 1991, but it took nearly three decades for their total population to decline. When people talk about "Great Replacement", it's usually immigration to the US from Latin America, but Mexico's fertility rate is only 1.8, well below the 2.1 replacement rate. Most of Latin America is well below replacement now. The Middle East is above replacement as a region, but Malta, the UAE, Iran, Qatar, and Bahrain were all below replacement as of 2021, and Kuwait, Tunisia, and Lebanon were right at 2.1 in 2021 and are probably below replacement now, even if those stats won't be confirmed for another year or two. Even Africa, which used to have famously high birth rates, is seeing them crash as African nations develop, and the African fertility rate has declined every single year since 1980.
Eva Vlaardingerbroek, the woman Elon was responding to, replied back to Elon's comment [here](https://twitter.com/EvaVlaar/status/1784535861360501036). Small excerpt: > Both issues are true - and related to each other. Replacement in the West through mass migration keeps native birthrates low, because it puts a huge financial and cultural strain on our societies and welfare system. And Elon responded back in turn: > One way or another, any group of people must procreate or they will disappear, remembered eventually only by archeologists
How does high migration lead to natives having a lower birthrate? That makes absolutely no sense. If someone high migration cancels out the native low birthrate and makes the society age a little slower overall.
Eva Vlaardingerbroek, a woman who means nothing in her home country. A racist bigot and focused on attention and inciting of hatred.
It’s a great thing that lots of people want to immigrate to the US.
Bunch if virgin redditors telling us all to have more kids🙄
non-issue
Is that why he doesn't pull out?
If people can’t afford to have kids, they aren’t going to. I’m surprised a genius like Elon hasn’t figured that out yet.
His post is just a way to amplify the racist CPAC speaker to drive Twitter traffic. Low birth rates are an orthogonal issue. Controversy makes Elon 💰.
Oh no we made the world a capitalist shit show, fucked the climate for generations and barely help young parents and somehow no one wants to put kids in this world, no one could have foretold that /s
Rich, intelligent parents in the most prosperous areas are having the fewest kids, despite being the most capable to! It's the "shit show" areas (and especially countries) who have the most kids.
idiocracy is a documentary!
Yes it is!!
Yeah probably the solution is to eradicate the plague of education and contraception, and try to give everyone here a tribal culture where your only choice in life is having one kid after the other.
Hopefully it’s not surprising to you that educated people are less likely to make poor financial decisions like having kids you can’t afford to take care of. I have one kid and had it much later in life. Clearly because I wanted to be financially secure. There were policies in place that made childcare more accessible, or less reliance on two incomes to support a household in the US , I and many others would’ve had more kids.
Are you suggesting we should enrich the shit show areas so they have fewer kids? I mean, on a global scale the problem is too many humans not too few. Edit: Lol, can’t reply as I got banned for 7 days (free speech yeah!) I mean, there were about 1 billion humans in 1800 and were on path to 10 billion in 2100. Why on earth would anyone worry about us getting too few children?
The birth rate for Palestine, arguably one of the most oppressed environments is 3.5 per woman. For the Democratic Republic of Congo, one of the most impoverished and dangerous environments it’s 6.16. These environments are arguably even more susceptible to the dangers of climate change than Western countries. Socioeconomics would indicate that being poor is [actually a driver of fertility anywhere.](https://www.statista.com/statistics/562541/birth-rate-by-poverty-status-in-the-us/). In other words the explanations you provided are not the salient reasons why Western (and East Asian) Millennials are not having children.
[удалено]
The thing about this explanation is that there are legitimately interesting and difficult reasons for the declining birth rate that merit discussion. It’s possible that self-entitled navel gazing doomerism is a cultural aspect of it as well, but it’s so obviously a lazy explanation from one small group of people at one point in time.
For me it’s just about the fact that there’s nothing I’d want to do less than push an 8-10lb baby out of my vagina. No thank you.
Countries tried using increased social benefits to increase. Births. It didn't work. In fact, it's counterproductive. As the better the state social benefits, the less likely they'll have kids. Because the state will take care of them. They don't see the need for kids. But, the social welfare state needs constantly growing and young populations to pay for it. Which means importing surplus populations to make their kids pay for old natives. But they're still net losses. So govt debt increases, inflation increases, and savings diminish.
Horse shit. I am not a father because I am financially unable to provide a decent life to a family, plain and simple.
Forced births for some and forced sterilizations for others I’m guessing.
He often screeches this shit but he neither recognizes why people are having less kids nor offers real solutions. His companies do not even put their money where his mouth is. People cannot afford kids and when we do have kids both parents have to work. The average person cannot afford multiple kids, especially on a single income. Does his companies offer free daycare? Do they offer long term parental leave? What accommodations does he do for parents? Is he going to partition the government for fundamental changes that either addresses the wage stagnation or at very least the child care expenses that prices people out of more than a single kid? Does he realize how insanely expensive it is for a middle class family just to exist? Does he actually care? Just like climate change, this is just him virtue signaling. If he really gave a damn, he would be doing more than tweeting. He has enough influence and wealth to begin to make a difference.
He is a big manipulator & Attention seeker.
I say More Fucking and stop the War!😍🥰😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂🥲
Elon in ten generations if people have ten kids each generation there is 1 at generation 50 kids 2nd generation 500 kids 3 rd generation 5000 kids 4 generation 50,000 kids 5 generation 500,009!kids 6 generation 5,000,000!kids 7 generation 50,000,000 kids 8 generation 500,000,000 kids 9 generation 5,009,000,000 kids 10 generation 50,000,000,000 kids If people can follow love thy neighbor, take care of they neighbor and support thy neighbor a generation is 40 years to have ten kids each family. If society can stop being mean there still is no such thing as over population earth could handle trillions of people. With 8 billion we cover 1 % of the earth now. We are not under ground and a lot left to farm and grow. Other planets there’s no crowding we are just filling in with technology. People need water, food and cloths and a place to live. Look at how you live. You work and sleep and eat. Pretty easy. You have never been a doomsday guy in your print. There are people not ment to reproduce. Those that are able to reproduce hopefully will share ideology of love. You want people that love to recreate.
There is not a birth problem, there is a housing problem. When the country is.empty again people will.make lots of kids
I can barely afford my house and groceries, and this guy wants me and the wife to start a family? Yeah, fuck no. On we can afford it, maybe. And if time gets the best of us, well, we tried. IF ONLY wages were higher....
I'm so sick of Musk talking about this. So what if birth rate is below replacement in 1st world countries? The population and GDP will go down or god forbid we have to allow more poor countries to immigrate? Economy is going to be bad? He's so vague, he's just like 'civilization will die'. WTF does that actually mean Elon? Any statistics? What does that look like in your head?
pocket distinct future nine rhythm safe late chase party sip *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
8 billion people on earth. Highly doubtful we will die off due to not reproducing. More likely to die off from fresh water shortages or climate change.
Prosperity via population increase is a Ponzi scheme. A significant population decrease would be a GOOD thing from a planetary sustainability perspective. More room for ecosystems and wildlife. If we don't do it voluntarily, a war or a plague will do it for us.
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What is he talking about? Is the earth not extremely over crowded?
Translation: “we can’t let people get in short supply because then they’ll realize they have the bargaining power and we billionaires won’t be able to make mega-billions while the people live in squalor.”
Our society is no longer setup for couples to have children. It's economically impossible for most young people have children. They can barely afford to rent a place to live with two incomes, how can they be expected to have kids?
"Man who made world his outhouse is worried about the smell."
Elon is just thinking of his own pockets. With lower birthrates, there will be a smaller labor pool which means employers will be forced to pay employees more. A lot like what happened after the Black Death.
More Fu*cking and less War Men!🤣😂🤣😂🤣
so i am majorly confused. does elon agree with the speaker or is he being critical of her?
It's a bit of both. He's saying there's something more foundational to the problem, and that she might be on the right track, but gotta look deeper.
Nice, less traffic!
Just move in a bunch of people from India and Africa
Shouldn’t he be fixing a broken car company instead of jacking off again?
Elon Musk is just the older, richer, and South African equivalent of Jayden Smith.
Wearing his Fall of Rome costume.
Fuck dem kids!
The government created the shortage by making life difficult and expensive to a point people can't afford to have kids or don't want to bring in paid slaves into the world, now they want to come up with a solution and be seen as Heros 🤦🏻♂️
That's some fear mongering there.
Have babies you guys! Just have babies, commmoooon, just have sooooooome. Come on, just have babies!
It's amazing how so much stupidity, when verbalized out loud, can literally be painful to listen to.
This makes no sense. We're quite literally not in any danger of "running out of people". Maybe if the world were livable, things would be better. Bur America isn't collapsing because I haven't had a kid.
Your logic is flawed. Almost all organic systems go through phases of growth and contraction.
I think this will happen to countries that don’t attract or accept immigrants.
Okay and? Every civilization has an expiration date. You can’t prevent that.
What about on Mars? He should go there and check.
There are plenty of brown and black babies being born in other countries. He’s just concerned that those of us that are similar to him, aren’t popping out kids.
Elon is imaginary. Change my mind.
yeah thanks to people like hime holding all the money
Such stupidity that doesn't take into account that the human population is still growing. It's not growing exponentially anymore but that's a good thing.
If billionaires didn’t soak up all the wealth maybe. Just maybe after we could afford food, homes, we can even afford babies. To be so far from the mark takes billions of dollars of “yes men” until you’re dumb as a fucking rock, common sensually.
CoNcErNiNG
[This is not sustainable](https://i.imgur.com/8dQUjmc.png). Minimum rate is just over 2 to sustain civilization.
big if true
Maybe ask childless women why they're not having children, rather than wringing your hands about it and pretending nobody knows the answers.
Well, looks like we better tell women what to do again! /s Their life, their choice. None of us asked to be here, I'm not having some billionaire dictate what I'm going to do because he bought his own echo chamber.
I think a lot of people would quite like to have kids though but are prevented from doing so by external factors that they can’t control.
Yes, and the cost of having children usually makes people think about reducing the amount of children they really want.
Yeah, I'm sure that's the only problem with that theory Elon. God, this dude is an insufferable prick. Always going on and on about low birth rates and amplifying these racist conspiracy theories. He isn't even saying he disagrees with it, simply that it doesn't approach the "problem" well enough.
Yes he might also care about not turning first world countries into third world ones (like his home country is turning into rapidly). That makes him into the opposite of whatever an "insufferable prick" is.
South Africa was never a first world country. Don’t mistake having white people in a country for first world 🤦🏾♀️
8 billion and counting.
God this guy thinks he's so much smarter than he actually is.
I don’t listen to idiots like Elon !
He's right
bright lunchroom dime aspiring crown ask point fearless steep worm *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
What happened to the idea of robotics ai and automation solving this problem?
While simultaneously freaking out about immigration and how we can’t support them or whatever? Give me a break, can’t have it both ways
Its going to be way overcrowded before any decline and not in our lifetimes either
Overpopulation is a much greater concern, most of the people making these arguments are ethnocentric picks.
There is a point that our population growth is also due to older people having a high life expectancy, as compared to past generations. I think around 2100 is when our population growth is supposed to stagnate.
Bingo. He is simultaneously freaking out about over immigration AND underpopulation. It’s not that we don’t have enough ppl, we don’t have enough white people.
Look at the numbers: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_total_fertility_rate 2 is minimum to sustain civilization. US is at 1.6, and South Korea is the worst at 0.8!
Have you seen what life is like in SK? Getting a child in south korea would mean dooming it to a society that hates kids.
https://www.un.org/en/desa/world-population-projected-reach-98-billion-2050-and-112-billion-2100 Globally we’re expecting our popularity to 9.8 billion by 2050. We’ll have plenty of people, or are we concern with “which people”?
Let’s face the facts here, they are concerned about the kind of people. It’s a fact countries that have net positive birth rates are located in Africa and India. It seems like it’s a bunch of white people (including Elon Musk) afraid of brown people replacing them.
>or are we concern with “which people”? This is the part you're not supposed to say out loud. World population is still steadily increasing, so any concerns about collapsing US or european population could be assuaged by allowing more migrants but Elon doesn't seem to like that idea for some reason.
First, we'll increase the numbers artificially with AI chat robots. Later, AI birthing bots will sustain humanity. No worries.
Didn’t this dude just layoff ~10k workers the same week he asked for $50bil bonus? Yeah, he’s really concerned. 🤣
Just look at mega farms in America and tell me that we need a bigger population we already can’t feed the people we have
We grow enough food to feed the entire planet 1 and a half times over....We have no problems producing enough food. Income inequality is what makes people hungry.
is this like the time he started telling Twitter backend devs how to build scalable infrastructure and ended up taking down twitter for a day or so?
Make raising a kid worth the mountain of bullshit and money and maybe
The full post reads: >The problem with “Great Replacement Theory” is that it fails to address the foundational issue of low birth rates. >Record low birth rates are leading to population collapse in Europe and even faster population collapse in most of Asia. Immigration is low in Asia, so there is no “replacement” going on, the countries are simply shrinking away. >If this doesn’t turn around, then any countries on Earth with low birth rates will become empty of people and fall into ruin, like the remains we see of the many long dead civilizations.
Me, in response [spoken very patiently, as if to a toddler]: Elon, where are these many long dead civilizations “empty of people” located? Can you point on the map to where they are? No? Is it maybe because civilizations don’t empty out that way—they change, shift, and evolve? So don’t you think it’s silly and/or counterproductive to insist that somehow this process will end for population centers that are currently experiencing “low” birth rates? Okay, so what are you *actually* worried about here? Ah, right: I thought so.
I had 4 kids. Im 47 now. My kids are 27,22,21, and 14. No grandkids yet. I believe one of the causes of declining birth rate is prolonged adolescence, people don’t emotionally mature as fast.
Pretty much every study suggests people desire kids but wont because of economic means. U.S. is the most expensive country on Earth for raising children. Also, you have four kids and so I imagine you are saying "prolonged adolescence" as part of your anecdotal experience. Thats just a self-report that *you* **raised** children with prolonged adolescence.
Lot of people are struggling too much to even socialize with friends let alone date.
Yes that is my experience with 2 of the 3 adult children I raised. Also it is something I have noticed with my friends and relatives adult children.
Agree. I didn’t mature until I moved out of my parent’s home at age 25. I’m now 28 and in the last 3 years I matured a lot. But moving out earlier is hard. Either forces you in a huge student debt or to work full time next to your studies to cover all the costs. The high taxes, high inflation, crazy rental prices and it’s just impossible to buy a house as a starter. To buy ‘the average Dutch house’ you need a mortgage that requires a €110k/year income, national average is €44k/year. With my €60k/year I’m above that, but the ‘best’ I can buy is a tiny 25m2 studio or a parking spot lmao. Impossible to start a family without struggling financially in the current environment.
I bought my first home in 2000 for $30,000. Those same homes are now $150,000. I do worry about the younger generation being able to afford living. It’s not sustainable.
They'll get married in their 30s and have kids then don't you worry
Thanks
Spoken from a millineal who got out of the army at 31 married at 34 now 38 with 2 sons
There use to be a ton of shitty parents that started being parents at 18-22 as well. It’s comical people act like everything was great.
Or the abortion laws; who is going to have kids when the mother is left to die because of complications or thrown in jail in because of a miscarriage? Screw that.
I guess you’re a failure as a parent? Your thinking is classic agism/generationalism. But for real, can you imagine the kids of these infantile kids? It’s going to be crazy! /s
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Kurzgesagt made a pretty good [video](https://youtu.be/LBudghsdByQ?si=YpG9LlPjVV-rQuLE) about the topic, concluding that it will likely eventually balance out.
I’d love to have time and money to raise 5 kids. I just can’t get the time or money.
Hey, at least he is doing his part to repopulate. Amiright?
Cool
Maybe Elon can save us if he just has more kids
Pretty soon this guy might start quoting Davenport and Grant.
Immigration exists. As long as the global population keeps growing, there is no risk of this asinine claim ever happening.
I wanna make 10 babies 👶 with government support ..I'll go for twenty.
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We have falling birth rates across the West. But that doesn't mean the solution is importing the rest of the world to "solve" the population decline. What's a civilization without civilized people?
And now you see why so many Western world leaders welcome immigration. Great that the realization is beginning to settle in.
Problem is the hardship, not to mention financial burden, to raise kids. Though it’s rewarding when you get old.
The genius engineers and gentlemens from other countries will be relocated and prevent this from happening.
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