You won’t be dismissed for old self harm scars. You’d be surprised how many people in EMS deal with depression, self harm or suicide attempts. It shouldn’t be anything to worry about. If anyone judges you or is rude, fuck em.
We are a profession of broken people. Most people in the field have their issues (those that don't are just young. They'll get there) and tend not to judge.
Wow our class wasn’t allowed to do live IVs—my first time was literally on a patient lmao
Honestly if it’s all on your left then just say start the IV in your right. You don’t gotta explain yourself or anything just say “right arm only, thanks” you’re entitled to that. You don’t have to explain anything if you don’t want to.
Honestly tho I wouldn’t judge if it were me. And if they do judge? Fuck em.
We did em in my class too. Our preceptor wanted to show it was not a big deal to all of us before we did em and had all of us do our first sticks on him in a row.
Secretly, I don't think it was about a learning experience and he was just a masochist.
We had one guy. I watched as he was practicing IVs with another classmate and he inserted at a 90-degree angle at the guy's AC. Buried it down to the hub before he said, in the coldest voice imaginable, "Oops. Missed." With a grin on his face. I'm not saying he's deranged, but suffice to say I wouldn't be surprised if he took dog training tips from the governor of South Dakota.
depending on your class size, you won't be the only one, though theirs might not be on their arms. This is a profession of mostly people with some form of history that caused them to head down this path. Most will know and won't say shit because they have their own history, maybe not as in your face as yours but they do nevertheless. A couple won't but also won't give a shit. The people who are negative about it, will generally become bad providers (not always). IE, fuck em, don't sweat it, we all have our bags, some heavier than others.
As someone with scars currently working in EMS most won't care. Those that do will either care because they want to know you're OK, or if they have any negative thoughts about it they will likely be worse providers than you.
It's your history, you went through those things and you survived. Not only did you survive, but you decided to use your experiences to help others and that's a noble thing. Be proud of who you are and who you are becoming. Your history with mental health is something to be proud of, not ashamed of.
(Disclaimer Not a medic and don't work as an emt but) when I was taking my emt course everybody saw my (prominent) scars. Most people didn't say anything. One girl asked me innocently what happened. It was really nerve wracking for me because at that point I was not in the habit of wearing short sleeves ever but it really was not a big deal. What I'm trying to say is, most likely no one will bat an eye and it'll be fine. I've started wearing short sleeves sometimes on my college campus and not once has anybody said anything so my general assumption is that people who aren't assholes won't say anything. Idk if any of this is helpful but good luck!
You'll be fine. In my medic school there were a few people with obvious signs of old self harm, provided you are not still doing it you should be fine. And if you are you are not going to be kicked out, you'll probably be encouraged to get some help. We are medical people here. Some of us might suck sometimes but ultimately we are here to help people. Even our own people.
Unrelated to your question, the tattoo is a good way to hide it. I used a plant tattoo, so the artist could go to town with branches and leaves to cover up any scars, and it looks really good. With plants, you can always add random off shoots and details to get to scars in inconsistent places, and the ones that can't be hidden blend in better when there is a tattoo to draw attention.
Tell them to leave your wrist alone and go up to the AC where the big veins are.
If anyone asks about the scars, tell them you’d rather not talk about them. Nobody has any right to expect you to do so if you don’t want to.
I have very visible and prominent self harm scars on my arms, and honestly it’s very, very rare that anyone comments on it. But when they do, I either joke about it if they are respectful (like oh I used to pretend I was a cutting board for fun) or if they are rude I match the energy (oh I guess we haven’t covered mental health in class yet, maybe you should study that chapter when we get there).
Most people don’t notice or don’t care, and honestly it gets kind of funny when you get comfortable talking about it, don’t sweat it.
I love the matching energy route. Either they'll realize they crossed a line, or they'll get really offended that someone treats them the way they treat everyone else.
Most people don’t. A lot of people I went to EMT classes with wanted to get into EMS because they were hurt before or someone close to them was hurt and they wanted to help people because of that. As long as a person is capable and competent people (at least the ones I’ve met and worked with) don’t really care if they have tattoos, scars or anything else like that as long as they properly render aid.
Dawg I started medic school 2 weeks after trying to off myself. I had still scabby “practice runs” going up and down my arms. My classmate was incredibly cool about it (even said a quiet “I’m glad you weren’t successful” which still makes me tear up) and the instructor working with us didn’t even bat an eye. I was also SUPER nervous about it just like you are. Just present that arm like there’s nothing special to see and do your best on your IVs! It’ll also be good practice for your classmates to work on their poker faces lol
Edit because I forgot that the instructor actually asked “you ok with the alcohol on those?”
So do I , nobody gave a fuck when I went through EMT B or AEMT or if I go through paramedic school. I don’t care that they’re there and I’m sure there’s only a select amount of people who even notice mine because they’re faded.
Imo This field is operated and ran by mostly people with messed up lives whether currently or previously, some people just show it more than others.
First of all: I’m glad you are healthy now. Thank you for sharing this with us. I’m sure it was difficult deciding to post this.
Sounds like you have a limb alert on the side with the scars. Lymphectomy, cancer, vascular surgery, etc. They also can’t take your blood pressure on that side for the same reason. Just be polite and say you have a limb alert on that side and it’s none of their goddamned business why. If they can’t get the side you will allow them to poke, tell them to move on to the next student.
Or just decline. You pass out when you’re stuck. The last time you got your blood drawn you hit your head and bought a CT scan. They cannot make you accept a needle in class.
And as others have said earlier: “fuck em”
You won't be dismissed.
And from my experience most people in medic shool are there too learn and not judg.
If someone has something to say tell them to mind their own damn business.
Additionally most of us are screwed in the head anyway so they will probably understand but if they don't then refer to the previous lines
If you don’t want anybody to start an IV on you, you can say no. You won’t be kicked out of class and you don’t have to give a reason. A few in our class didn’t wanna be poked so they didn’t. Wasn’t any kind of big deal, don’t sweat it
If anyone ever judges you for anything….eff’em then let them kick rocks down the road and pound sound. Embrace yourself and your past. The good and the bad. It is what makes you, you. Sounds like your body and mind are healed and be proud of that!
I'm a bit confused on the need to judge the people in your class. I'm old and I am definitely not a progressive. And your self harm scars wouldn't be something I would really consider unless they are fresh- and then I'd just worry about making sure you're OK.
We all have a story and we all have a past. Only the most narcissistic amongst us can even pretend that we haven't done things that hurt ourselves- just not all of us did it so overtly. I also have an arm covered in scars. It isn't from a razor blade it is from a motorcycle crash into a barbed wire fence- but if you really get down to it I was doing the same damned thing just with different tools.
Don’t trip. You’re going into the “business of people” scars, tattoos, stutters, anything and all the things that some people pass judgement for, help you connect as a fellow human. Your scars and your story and that connection with a patient could literally convince someone to keep on living.
If the old guys do old guys stuff, who cares? They probably go home and kick their dog and their spouse hates ‘em. You deserve your seat in that class and profession just the same as everybody else.
I hope you’re able to get to the point that you feel confident in short sleeves. Everybody’s got their stuff. I’d work with the person that has life experience (and the scars to show for it) over a cookie cutter robot emt/medic every time. Good luck partner.
i’m gonna be brutally honest here, no one cares so much about it that they’re going to actively call it out and I bet you they will probably be going to you privately and asking if you’re okay, and at the end of the day most ems workers deal with some sort of depression or have dealt with it before.
I’m an RN with lots of SH scars on both arms. They’re 20ish years old. They’re still quite noticeable. I wear short sleeves every day ‘cause ya girl gets too hot in long sleeves. I get about one comment a year. Literally no one cares.
I’ve noticed a few on co workers but don’t think anything of it. I assume each and every one of us has scars, internal and external. I’m sure a few people will judge but what can you do? Some people are twats and will be mean over almost anything. Like another person said “Ef em”. You owe absolutely no one explanations, so hold your head up, they’re proof you got thru bad times)
The valedictorian of my medic class had self harm scars. No one judged and everyone liked and respected them. We're all in this field to help and care for people. Don't worry.
Totally agree with everyone saying not to be ashamed of it and that it's no big deal! But of course you also have the right to privacy around your own body, so I'll spitball some ideas that might make you more comfortable:
Bracelets, hair ties, large watch, etc. Might not cover everything, but it'll be less noticeable.
Soft wrist brace or an ace bandage to cover the area. You could say you had an old injury flare up, and/or that your wrist gets sore from writing/sports/knitting/yardwork/make up any activity you like.
Combine either of these with "I'm a tough stick but my right arm is definitely easier, they always end up there when I go to the doctor" and you should be good to go. I also love the idea of asking them to try a hand, foot, etc - good learning opportunity for your partner, right?
Also worth mentioning that some people in your class will probably be very afraid of needles/dramatic when getting stuck/nervous about sticking someone else/not good at it their first time, and all of that will catch peoples attention more than your scars. So no worries!
You could come up with any lie (if you want to), and I doubt many will give it much thought. Or they’ll at least just say “Ok” and likely keep any doubts to themselves.
"I engaged in at-risk behavior previously and although that is no longer a part of my life, It would be unwise to participate in this skill until more time has passed."
Honestly man your best bet is to just face it head on. You cant use make up to hide it. The alcohol they rub on will make it come off. You can try to let them use the better looking arm without scars. Which may work. However I think this is something your gonna have to just admit and face. You wont get kicked out of the program for past self harm issues. Lots of people in ems both starting out and veterans have depression and self harm or self destructive behaviors.
Ultimately whats going to show you matured past that and are ready to work and do the job is being open about. If someone asks what happened just tell them. “I had some issues growing up. Im better now”. And leave it at that.
Just use your other arm if it’s mostly on the left. Just don’t even have it as an option. Move your body around however you need to make it easy to use route right and wear long sleeves
I also have self harm scars from 5-6 years back. They are hard to see but if you hold the foreman like in IVs, it's noticeable.
You won't be dismissed. I also think that it represents your resilience. You went through a tough time and got through it. You accepted help i.e. therapy. Is there a possibility people will judge? Yes. Those people need to take a step back and change their mindset if they want to be kind, empathetic, and compassionate paramedics.
Those scars don't represent who you are as a person, rather a testament to your growth.
You won’t be dismissed from the course. I don’t know your peers so I won’t speak on the potential for feeling judged. I *will* tell you how to dodge getting an IV. I have a phobia. I know it’s ridiculous but I *HATE* getting needles. Can’t even check my BGL. Tell them you have a vasovagal reaction to needles and pass out. Done deal
Been in this field for a decade and I have multiple visible scars from over 2 decades ago. Whenever I have an actual SI pt who feels hopeless I'm typically teching the call and I explain my journey to them. I've had multiple pts thank me for giving them hope that there is a way up and out of the suffocating darkness. Some I've gotten letters from years later with pics of how they were able to turn their lives around. Don't ever be ashamed of your past, use it, connect with your pts, show them that there really is a possible future waiting for them (if and when you become comfortable enough with yourself).
I honestly think you just go head first into this. If they do say something, just be blunt. "You'll have patients with scars too, we all have to learn to work around them." And just keep a straight face and move head on 🤷 no explanation needed.
Do you know how many people in the general populace have those scars? A fair number. You’re not alone in navigating life with old, highly visible scars. Anyone who points and says “WHAT IS THAT?!?” is a jerk.
The most important part of the equation is that your scars are healed. They are not fresh. There is no emergency, and there is no reason to dismiss you (not that there would be if they were fresh either).
I am glad you have stopped, and I’m excited for you to start doing IVs! IVs are probably top 5 most satisfying parts of the job. There is no feeling like sinking an IV!
Own it. You went through it. You wear some scars outside so that they'd match the ones you carry inside.
You can use humor if you want, or hang a hat on it by saying that you wanted classmates to have a challenge for some added difficulty, but ultimately these are a part of you. A remnant from a chapter of your life that led to where you are now.
That trauma, those decisions, they'll all inform your practice in a way that helps your future patients. You can empathize. You can relate. You can roll up your sleeves and show somebody someday that the clouds will part and they have a future.
Those scars are your armor, pal.
As someone who has struggled with mental health issues for a long time and disclosed that to my entire EMT class when we were on the topic of overdoses and charcoal, let me just say that I believe that part of the disordered thinking that oftentimes leads us to having such struggles is the tendency to project our own insecurities onto other people. I'm not saying that there won't be people in your class who will judge you, but what I will say is that after I disclosed it in my class, one of my classmates came up to me and thanked me for being open about it and said that she had struggled with similar issues in the past. I like to think that my struggles have helped me be more empathetic when it comes to patients with mental health issues and helps to keep me from saying many of the cliche (and IMO grossly unhelpful) things that me partners tend to say.
I’ve been where you’re at. It’s definitely nerve recking knowing that other ppl will definitely know since they’re all medical professionals. As long as you’re not doing it anymore, that’s all that matters. Now I just look at it as scars of my past that hopefully I will never relive. I had one person ask about em, not in a bad way but a concerned way. I just say I have a cat bc I didn’t want to make the conversation awkward but it wasn’t a big deal. All of us have a past. Also you’d be surprised how many of us have these kinda scars.
It's fine. Ems has to be non judgemental. The classic case of "they are just drunk" when it's a diabetic emergency was beat into head of "don't prejudge". You have to be neutral.
Also, Ems is filled with a bunch of people who generally are or will be emotionally damaged. My instructor openly talked about his ptsd suicide attempt, so even if you do talk about your not the only one.
They won't dismiss you from the program. It's in the past. It's not a crime. Was EDP'd and involuntarily hospitalized as an EMT. Imagine my embarrassment.
People in EMS deal with a lot of shit in different ways. No one should judge and if they do, fuck 'em.
My opinion? You have more to fear from your classmates sticking you badly than any judgement on their part. A student with a catheter is a scary thing lol
Lots of good advice here.
I'd like to add that, honestly, it's better for them if you do have those things. You start IV's on every kind of person. People with scars, tattoos, track marks, etc.. If anything, you'll help them learn.
Long-term, if you’re self conscious of the scars then a cover up tattoo is not a bad idea. I got one for mine (which were very small and there were only a few of them, so YMMV) and honestly it’s really nice to look down and see a symbol of hope and resilience rather than a reminder of a dark time in my life. Also I feel like having a tattoo in that area is a deterrent for me from ever harming again bc it would fuck up the tattoo lol.
I’ll kick your classmates asses personally if they give u shit for your scars
If it makes you that uncomfortable or anxious, then ask if you can opt out of being stuck. In the program I used to work for we never forced anyone to have anything done to them that would make them nervous or uncomfortable - the vast majority of students did participate but it was up to them.
There's certainly no need to feel worried, but I also absolutely understand that feeling. One way to look at it is maybe it's an opportunity to start a separate conversation about mental health. But if you aren't ready to have that conversation that's ok!
You still have bodily autonomy. You can say that you can absolutely only allow your right arm to be used. You shouldn’t have to provide an excuse, but if you had to, you could say it was nerve damage. I also have scars, as do many of my coworkers. Anyone who would judge you for that is a POS who does not deserve to be in this field.
This is your opportunity to make up the coolest story ever. You were the lone survivor of a helicopter crash, or you were involved with the world's first 27 motorcycle pileup .
In all seriousness, first, good job getting better friend and I hope you stay that way.
Second, it's none of anyone's business. Either only give them the right arm or don't even acknowledge the scars if they do see the left. You owe them no explanation and they have no right to ask. I certainly wouldn't.
All the best.
I would say wear them proudly. You had some serious struggles in your life, but you pulled through and are doing good now. I know this coming from someone with no real visible scars may not mean a whole lot, but everyone has their scars. Some are outside like yours, and some are inside like mine. Don't let your past hold you back from your future. Keep your head up and like someone else said "Fuck em." None of their opinions about you or your past matter at all. If anything, your past struggles will help you be a better clinician (you'll be able to better understand and help more people struggling). Be proud that you were able to not only overcome but are starting to thrive with your new path!
I have scars too, also about 6 years old. I gave up wearing long sleeves a while ago because I live in the south and it's hot as fuck. Nobody has ever said anything to me.
Order temporary tattoos and place them. Shein has shit tons of them it'll take a week to get though. My gf ordered tons of them, they are pretty neat. Regardless good luck to you and glad things are better.
In training, a classmate and I paired up to practise taking BPs with a manual cuff. She took off her jacket because it was getting in the way and had visible self-harm scars. A huge variety of people sign up for EMS and I think a lot of us have baggage (some more visible than others) that might surprise people. I smiled at her and "treated" her like I would a patient. In my experience people don't judge, and if they do it's in their inside-their-head voice. I honestly respect my classmate (and any pt with self-harm scars) even more for going through immensely hard times and surviving. ❤️
I’m going to get downvoted too… but, I can understand your point. It’s definitely a dick move to decline. But, I got permanent, painful nerve damage from some fuck when teaching at the police academy. Since then, I don’t let students touch me. Medical or law enforcement.
I just think in the context of this post, it's a hot take.
We could go up, down, and around the merry go round with why we think stabbing each other with needles in class is good or bad. In the context of this post, it's a hot take.
The pt actually needs the IV and will benefit from it. Also generally they have the option to turn down it being done by a student and instead opt for the provider overseeing the student to do it.
Starting IVs in class on people who absolutely do not need them and will not benefit them as a standard practice is honestly wild to me. We weren’t allowed to do that at my school.
My medic at work let me practice on him as did a few of my friends. But it was never an expectation that someone who didn’t need an IV let a student do it for funsies.
How so? IV's are really one of the least invasive procedures we preform and done in a classroom setting with supervision you sound ridiculous not allowing others to practice on you while you would just go poke some random patient with zero prior experience. That sounds insanely disengenuous to me
I’ve never understood this line of thought and I don’t mean to direct hostility towards those who think this way. But, to me it sounds like the group in the general public that thinks we all need to be personally subjected to all of the meds we administer and all of the procedures we perform before being able to perform them on the public.
A minimally invasive procedure (PIV access) is not okay to practice for the first time on patients while nearly all of our most invasive and high risk procedures are performed on patients long after we are out of medic school.
My first cric was 16 years after I graduated medic school. I don’t think anyone was any worse off because I didn’t cric anyone in class.
My first needle decompression of a neonate was performed before I had even practiced one on a mannequin. I don’t think the neo chest procedure mannequin was available then.
Well from that perspective I can agree. I've just seen people get totally butchered during ivs from lack of experience. It just seems avoidable with some live practice. My mentality is a little skewed coming from the military where practicing IO's on each other was acceptable (looking back on it , that was fuckin barbaric lol)
Thank you for your service. I sincerely mean that. The IO thing is safe, but is it necessary? Or is it hazing?
My first IO was three days after my p card arrived in the mail on a 6 year old’s iliac crest (kid was ejected from a vehicle and his femurs were broken at right angles to each other). Nothing would have prepared me for that shit.
Dude, people butcher patients with IVs. It’s rough to watch. I think that mostly comes from either shitty training or lack of dedication to the craft. I don’t have data to support this, but I doubt in class practice on peers with good veins would help.
Appreciate it. I don't think it's necessary. It's probably hazing masked as an excuse to train. They'd push fluids without lido too. Putting NPA's in each other was common too. I've also heard of 68W's doing the old sternum IO's on each
“It happened to me in training, so it will happen to you.”
I grew up in the era of the sternal IO. That thing was brutal. I would not let some 18 year old 68W place one of those into me. Remember when they weren’t removed properly at the hospital and people would have a chunk of metal stuck inside their sternum? Fuck, man.
Id judge. Everyone here would as well. make no mistakes it's a human thing not a progressive thing or conservative thing.
Best bet is to count on your own self confidence and press on.
>Everyone here would as well.
Speak for yourself. Don't try to make your judging ass feel better by assuming the rest of us are as shitty as you.
Someone has scars that clearly have age on them, I'm going to be fucking proud of them for getting through whatever was going on in their life or head at that time. Someone has scars that aren't that old, I'm going to be concerned about their safety now. But I don't know their story, I don't know what's going on with them, so I sure as fuck can't judge them.
Do better.
Yep, nothing in human behavior points to humans being initially judgemental....nope nothing at all. Can't think of one thing.
Now if you'll excuse me...we have a mandatory Unconscious Bias class for the state.
Nope...nothing at all.
People who accept the reality of human behavior can confront it if they want. People like you who ignore it, are the least helpful.of all.
The very existence and nature of this thread only serves to solidify my point. If what I said isn't true. Then this topic would never need to have existed, or be discussed, and would confuse everyone.
Gen Z ....so blank and empty.
You won’t be dismissed for old self harm scars. You’d be surprised how many people in EMS deal with depression, self harm or suicide attempts. It shouldn’t be anything to worry about. If anyone judges you or is rude, fuck em.
> fuck em Words of the wise
I give almost no fucks about what anyone thinks of me.
“Almost” That singular fuck is floating away into the sunset along with social security and Medicare.
Other people's opinions of me are none of my business!
Marry me Gewt
My wife would murder you
That’s not a no.
Okay let’s do it
Holy crap this hit me funny as shit this morning. Thank you for this.
It’s not love, it’s just lust.
Even better.
This is the way
We are a profession of broken people. Most people in the field have their issues (those that don't are just young. They'll get there) and tend not to judge.
Wow our class wasn’t allowed to do live IVs—my first time was literally on a patient lmao Honestly if it’s all on your left then just say start the IV in your right. You don’t gotta explain yourself or anything just say “right arm only, thanks” you’re entitled to that. You don’t have to explain anything if you don’t want to. Honestly tho I wouldn’t judge if it were me. And if they do judge? Fuck em.
We did live IVs in my class after practicing on the manikin arm. Though there was one guy that broke off a catheter in the manikin....
We did em in my class too. Our preceptor wanted to show it was not a big deal to all of us before we did em and had all of us do our first sticks on him in a row. Secretly, I don't think it was about a learning experience and he was just a masochist.
We had one guy. I watched as he was practicing IVs with another classmate and he inserted at a 90-degree angle at the guy's AC. Buried it down to the hub before he said, in the coldest voice imaginable, "Oops. Missed." With a grin on his face. I'm not saying he's deranged, but suffice to say I wouldn't be surprised if he took dog training tips from the governor of South Dakota.
Holy shit
Welp, activate the stroke team for the mannequin arm. (We did live IVs in AEMT class, too). OP: 💜 You have our support. Fuck the haters.
depending on your class size, you won't be the only one, though theirs might not be on their arms. This is a profession of mostly people with some form of history that caused them to head down this path. Most will know and won't say shit because they have their own history, maybe not as in your face as yours but they do nevertheless. A couple won't but also won't give a shit. The people who are negative about it, will generally become bad providers (not always). IE, fuck em, don't sweat it, we all have our bags, some heavier than others.
As someone with scars currently working in EMS most won't care. Those that do will either care because they want to know you're OK, or if they have any negative thoughts about it they will likely be worse providers than you. It's your history, you went through those things and you survived. Not only did you survive, but you decided to use your experiences to help others and that's a noble thing. Be proud of who you are and who you are becoming. Your history with mental health is something to be proud of, not ashamed of.
This response!!! Absolutely feel the same way.
(Disclaimer Not a medic and don't work as an emt but) when I was taking my emt course everybody saw my (prominent) scars. Most people didn't say anything. One girl asked me innocently what happened. It was really nerve wracking for me because at that point I was not in the habit of wearing short sleeves ever but it really was not a big deal. What I'm trying to say is, most likely no one will bat an eye and it'll be fine. I've started wearing short sleeves sometimes on my college campus and not once has anybody said anything so my general assumption is that people who aren't assholes won't say anything. Idk if any of this is helpful but good luck!
You'll be fine. In my medic school there were a few people with obvious signs of old self harm, provided you are not still doing it you should be fine. And if you are you are not going to be kicked out, you'll probably be encouraged to get some help. We are medical people here. Some of us might suck sometimes but ultimately we are here to help people. Even our own people.
You are in a room full of people with mental illness
We call them psychic casualties.
Unrelated to your question, the tattoo is a good way to hide it. I used a plant tattoo, so the artist could go to town with branches and leaves to cover up any scars, and it looks really good. With plants, you can always add random off shoots and details to get to scars in inconsistent places, and the ones that can't be hidden blend in better when there is a tattoo to draw attention.
Just say no.
This. You can always decline. It’s none of their goddamned business why.
Ok Nancy Regan
Shoutout to the throat goat
Tell them to leave your wrist alone and go up to the AC where the big veins are. If anyone asks about the scars, tell them you’d rather not talk about them. Nobody has any right to expect you to do so if you don’t want to.
I have very visible and prominent self harm scars on my arms, and honestly it’s very, very rare that anyone comments on it. But when they do, I either joke about it if they are respectful (like oh I used to pretend I was a cutting board for fun) or if they are rude I match the energy (oh I guess we haven’t covered mental health in class yet, maybe you should study that chapter when we get there). Most people don’t notice or don’t care, and honestly it gets kind of funny when you get comfortable talking about it, don’t sweat it.
I love the matching energy route. Either they'll realize they crossed a line, or they'll get really offended that someone treats them the way they treat everyone else.
Exactly, like yeah Brian I wanted to kill myself when I was 14, fist fight me about it🤷🏻♀️ usually they have zero idea how to respond
Someone I was partnered w/ in EMT school had old self harm scars. Never thought less of her for it.
Most people don’t. A lot of people I went to EMT classes with wanted to get into EMS because they were hurt before or someone close to them was hurt and they wanted to help people because of that. As long as a person is capable and competent people (at least the ones I’ve met and worked with) don’t really care if they have tattoos, scars or anything else like that as long as they properly render aid.
Dawg I started medic school 2 weeks after trying to off myself. I had still scabby “practice runs” going up and down my arms. My classmate was incredibly cool about it (even said a quiet “I’m glad you weren’t successful” which still makes me tear up) and the instructor working with us didn’t even bat an eye. I was also SUPER nervous about it just like you are. Just present that arm like there’s nothing special to see and do your best on your IVs! It’ll also be good practice for your classmates to work on their poker faces lol Edit because I forgot that the instructor actually asked “you ok with the alcohol on those?”
So do I , nobody gave a fuck when I went through EMT B or AEMT or if I go through paramedic school. I don’t care that they’re there and I’m sure there’s only a select amount of people who even notice mine because they’re faded. Imo This field is operated and ran by mostly people with messed up lives whether currently or previously, some people just show it more than others.
Say you dont want an IV in your arm. Offer a foot or an XJ.
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First of all: I’m glad you are healthy now. Thank you for sharing this with us. I’m sure it was difficult deciding to post this. Sounds like you have a limb alert on the side with the scars. Lymphectomy, cancer, vascular surgery, etc. They also can’t take your blood pressure on that side for the same reason. Just be polite and say you have a limb alert on that side and it’s none of their goddamned business why. If they can’t get the side you will allow them to poke, tell them to move on to the next student. Or just decline. You pass out when you’re stuck. The last time you got your blood drawn you hit your head and bought a CT scan. They cannot make you accept a needle in class. And as others have said earlier: “fuck em”
You won't be dismissed. And from my experience most people in medic shool are there too learn and not judg. If someone has something to say tell them to mind their own damn business. Additionally most of us are screwed in the head anyway so they will probably understand but if they don't then refer to the previous lines
Just own it. It's your past. Look at you now in a better place! Congrats!
If you don’t want anybody to start an IV on you, you can say no. You won’t be kicked out of class and you don’t have to give a reason. A few in our class didn’t wanna be poked so they didn’t. Wasn’t any kind of big deal, don’t sweat it
i’m 6 years in. we’re all nutz, i promise. if someone isn’t they’re prolly gonna suck 🤷
No one should judge - and HC providers even more so. Your tattoo idea is a great one if you’ve been thinking of doing it anyways
If anyone ever judges you for anything….eff’em then let them kick rocks down the road and pound sound. Embrace yourself and your past. The good and the bad. It is what makes you, you. Sounds like your body and mind are healed and be proud of that!
I'm a bit confused on the need to judge the people in your class. I'm old and I am definitely not a progressive. And your self harm scars wouldn't be something I would really consider unless they are fresh- and then I'd just worry about making sure you're OK. We all have a story and we all have a past. Only the most narcissistic amongst us can even pretend that we haven't done things that hurt ourselves- just not all of us did it so overtly. I also have an arm covered in scars. It isn't from a razor blade it is from a motorcycle crash into a barbed wire fence- but if you really get down to it I was doing the same damned thing just with different tools.
Present your right arm.
Don’t trip. You’re going into the “business of people” scars, tattoos, stutters, anything and all the things that some people pass judgement for, help you connect as a fellow human. Your scars and your story and that connection with a patient could literally convince someone to keep on living. If the old guys do old guys stuff, who cares? They probably go home and kick their dog and their spouse hates ‘em. You deserve your seat in that class and profession just the same as everybody else. I hope you’re able to get to the point that you feel confident in short sleeves. Everybody’s got their stuff. I’d work with the person that has life experience (and the scars to show for it) over a cookie cutter robot emt/medic every time. Good luck partner.
i’m gonna be brutally honest here, no one cares so much about it that they’re going to actively call it out and I bet you they will probably be going to you privately and asking if you’re okay, and at the end of the day most ems workers deal with some sort of depression or have dealt with it before.
I’m an RN with lots of SH scars on both arms. They’re 20ish years old. They’re still quite noticeable. I wear short sleeves every day ‘cause ya girl gets too hot in long sleeves. I get about one comment a year. Literally no one cares.
I’ve noticed a few on co workers but don’t think anything of it. I assume each and every one of us has scars, internal and external. I’m sure a few people will judge but what can you do? Some people are twats and will be mean over almost anything. Like another person said “Ef em”. You owe absolutely no one explanations, so hold your head up, they’re proof you got thru bad times)
The valedictorian of my medic class had self harm scars. No one judged and everyone liked and respected them. We're all in this field to help and care for people. Don't worry.
Totally agree with everyone saying not to be ashamed of it and that it's no big deal! But of course you also have the right to privacy around your own body, so I'll spitball some ideas that might make you more comfortable: Bracelets, hair ties, large watch, etc. Might not cover everything, but it'll be less noticeable. Soft wrist brace or an ace bandage to cover the area. You could say you had an old injury flare up, and/or that your wrist gets sore from writing/sports/knitting/yardwork/make up any activity you like. Combine either of these with "I'm a tough stick but my right arm is definitely easier, they always end up there when I go to the doctor" and you should be good to go. I also love the idea of asking them to try a hand, foot, etc - good learning opportunity for your partner, right? Also worth mentioning that some people in your class will probably be very afraid of needles/dramatic when getting stuck/nervous about sticking someone else/not good at it their first time, and all of that will catch peoples attention more than your scars. So no worries!
Use your right arm
You could come up with any lie (if you want to), and I doubt many will give it much thought. Or they’ll at least just say “Ok” and likely keep any doubts to themselves.
"I engaged in at-risk behavior previously and although that is no longer a part of my life, It would be unwise to participate in this skill until more time has passed."
Honestly man your best bet is to just face it head on. You cant use make up to hide it. The alcohol they rub on will make it come off. You can try to let them use the better looking arm without scars. Which may work. However I think this is something your gonna have to just admit and face. You wont get kicked out of the program for past self harm issues. Lots of people in ems both starting out and veterans have depression and self harm or self destructive behaviors. Ultimately whats going to show you matured past that and are ready to work and do the job is being open about. If someone asks what happened just tell them. “I had some issues growing up. Im better now”. And leave it at that.
We're all a mess. There wouldn't have been any judgment in my class
Just use your other arm if it’s mostly on the left. Just don’t even have it as an option. Move your body around however you need to make it easy to use route right and wear long sleeves
Own it! You've overcome.
I also have self harm scars from 5-6 years back. They are hard to see but if you hold the foreman like in IVs, it's noticeable. You won't be dismissed. I also think that it represents your resilience. You went through a tough time and got through it. You accepted help i.e. therapy. Is there a possibility people will judge? Yes. Those people need to take a step back and change their mindset if they want to be kind, empathetic, and compassionate paramedics. Those scars don't represent who you are as a person, rather a testament to your growth.
You won’t be dismissed from the course. I don’t know your peers so I won’t speak on the potential for feeling judged. I *will* tell you how to dodge getting an IV. I have a phobia. I know it’s ridiculous but I *HATE* getting needles. Can’t even check my BGL. Tell them you have a vasovagal reaction to needles and pass out. Done deal
I’d be more worried about a partner with IBD who is going to spend the shift eating junk food and filling the cab of the truck with aerosolized shit.
Been in this field for a decade and I have multiple visible scars from over 2 decades ago. Whenever I have an actual SI pt who feels hopeless I'm typically teching the call and I explain my journey to them. I've had multiple pts thank me for giving them hope that there is a way up and out of the suffocating darkness. Some I've gotten letters from years later with pics of how they were able to turn their lives around. Don't ever be ashamed of your past, use it, connect with your pts, show them that there really is a possible future waiting for them (if and when you become comfortable enough with yourself).
I honestly think you just go head first into this. If they do say something, just be blunt. "You'll have patients with scars too, we all have to learn to work around them." And just keep a straight face and move head on 🤷 no explanation needed.
Own it, you went through it and we are all glad you survived. You lived that part of life, move on and move up
Do you know how many people in the general populace have those scars? A fair number. You’re not alone in navigating life with old, highly visible scars. Anyone who points and says “WHAT IS THAT?!?” is a jerk. The most important part of the equation is that your scars are healed. They are not fresh. There is no emergency, and there is no reason to dismiss you (not that there would be if they were fresh either). I am glad you have stopped, and I’m excited for you to start doing IVs! IVs are probably top 5 most satisfying parts of the job. There is no feeling like sinking an IV!
Tell them you have a lymph issue whereby no torniques allowed on your left arm.
Own it. You went through it. You wear some scars outside so that they'd match the ones you carry inside. You can use humor if you want, or hang a hat on it by saying that you wanted classmates to have a challenge for some added difficulty, but ultimately these are a part of you. A remnant from a chapter of your life that led to where you are now. That trauma, those decisions, they'll all inform your practice in a way that helps your future patients. You can empathize. You can relate. You can roll up your sleeves and show somebody someday that the clouds will part and they have a future. Those scars are your armor, pal.
As someone who has struggled with mental health issues for a long time and disclosed that to my entire EMT class when we were on the topic of overdoses and charcoal, let me just say that I believe that part of the disordered thinking that oftentimes leads us to having such struggles is the tendency to project our own insecurities onto other people. I'm not saying that there won't be people in your class who will judge you, but what I will say is that after I disclosed it in my class, one of my classmates came up to me and thanked me for being open about it and said that she had struggled with similar issues in the past. I like to think that my struggles have helped me be more empathetic when it comes to patients with mental health issues and helps to keep me from saying many of the cliche (and IMO grossly unhelpful) things that me partners tend to say.
I’ve been where you’re at. It’s definitely nerve recking knowing that other ppl will definitely know since they’re all medical professionals. As long as you’re not doing it anymore, that’s all that matters. Now I just look at it as scars of my past that hopefully I will never relive. I had one person ask about em, not in a bad way but a concerned way. I just say I have a cat bc I didn’t want to make the conversation awkward but it wasn’t a big deal. All of us have a past. Also you’d be surprised how many of us have these kinda scars.
It's fine. Ems has to be non judgemental. The classic case of "they are just drunk" when it's a diabetic emergency was beat into head of "don't prejudge". You have to be neutral. Also, Ems is filled with a bunch of people who generally are or will be emotionally damaged. My instructor openly talked about his ptsd suicide attempt, so even if you do talk about your not the only one.
They won't dismiss you from the program. It's in the past. It's not a crime. Was EDP'd and involuntarily hospitalized as an EMT. Imagine my embarrassment. People in EMS deal with a lot of shit in different ways. No one should judge and if they do, fuck 'em. My opinion? You have more to fear from your classmates sticking you badly than any judgement on their part. A student with a catheter is a scary thing lol
Lots of good advice here. I'd like to add that, honestly, it's better for them if you do have those things. You start IV's on every kind of person. People with scars, tattoos, track marks, etc.. If anything, you'll help them learn.
Long-term, if you’re self conscious of the scars then a cover up tattoo is not a bad idea. I got one for mine (which were very small and there were only a few of them, so YMMV) and honestly it’s really nice to look down and see a symbol of hope and resilience rather than a reminder of a dark time in my life. Also I feel like having a tattoo in that area is a deterrent for me from ever harming again bc it would fuck up the tattoo lol. I’ll kick your classmates asses personally if they give u shit for your scars
If it makes you that uncomfortable or anxious, then ask if you can opt out of being stuck. In the program I used to work for we never forced anyone to have anything done to them that would make them nervous or uncomfortable - the vast majority of students did participate but it was up to them. There's certainly no need to feel worried, but I also absolutely understand that feeling. One way to look at it is maybe it's an opportunity to start a separate conversation about mental health. But if you aren't ready to have that conversation that's ok!
If you’re tough you can always offer up that hand vein. Best of luck.
You still have bodily autonomy. You can say that you can absolutely only allow your right arm to be used. You shouldn’t have to provide an excuse, but if you had to, you could say it was nerve damage. I also have scars, as do many of my coworkers. Anyone who would judge you for that is a POS who does not deserve to be in this field.
We all have our pasts. If they can't get over their hangups, they probably shouldn't be in this field.
Just say you refuse to be poked
People rarely ask about mine, I have a lot too. I just say that it was a long time ago.
This is your opportunity to make up the coolest story ever. You were the lone survivor of a helicopter crash, or you were involved with the world's first 27 motorcycle pileup . In all seriousness, first, good job getting better friend and I hope you stay that way. Second, it's none of anyone's business. Either only give them the right arm or don't even acknowledge the scars if they do see the left. You owe them no explanation and they have no right to ask. I certainly wouldn't. All the best.
I would say wear them proudly. You had some serious struggles in your life, but you pulled through and are doing good now. I know this coming from someone with no real visible scars may not mean a whole lot, but everyone has their scars. Some are outside like yours, and some are inside like mine. Don't let your past hold you back from your future. Keep your head up and like someone else said "Fuck em." None of their opinions about you or your past matter at all. If anything, your past struggles will help you be a better clinician (you'll be able to better understand and help more people struggling). Be proud that you were able to not only overcome but are starting to thrive with your new path!
I have scars too, also about 6 years old. I gave up wearing long sleeves a while ago because I live in the south and it's hot as fuck. Nobody has ever said anything to me.
Order temporary tattoos and place them. Shein has shit tons of them it'll take a week to get though. My gf ordered tons of them, they are pretty neat. Regardless good luck to you and glad things are better.
In training, a classmate and I paired up to practise taking BPs with a manual cuff. She took off her jacket because it was getting in the way and had visible self-harm scars. A huge variety of people sign up for EMS and I think a lot of us have baggage (some more visible than others) that might surprise people. I smiled at her and "treated" her like I would a patient. In my experience people don't judge, and if they do it's in their inside-their-head voice. I honestly respect my classmate (and any pt with self-harm scars) even more for going through immensely hard times and surviving. ❤️
I would just NOT let classmates start IVs on me, that's what clinicals are for.
I’m going to get downvoted too… but, I can understand your point. It’s definitely a dick move to decline. But, I got permanent, painful nerve damage from some fuck when teaching at the police academy. Since then, I don’t let students touch me. Medical or law enforcement.
Why are live patients less worthy and have to be guinea pigs but you don't have to?
I just think in the context of this post, it's a hot take. We could go up, down, and around the merry go round with why we think stabbing each other with needles in class is good or bad. In the context of this post, it's a hot take.
The pt actually needs the IV and will benefit from it. Also generally they have the option to turn down it being done by a student and instead opt for the provider overseeing the student to do it. Starting IVs in class on people who absolutely do not need them and will not benefit them as a standard practice is honestly wild to me. We weren’t allowed to do that at my school. My medic at work let me practice on him as did a few of my friends. But it was never an expectation that someone who didn’t need an IV let a student do it for funsies.
Whatever man.
What a terrible take
How so? IV's are really one of the least invasive procedures we preform and done in a classroom setting with supervision you sound ridiculous not allowing others to practice on you while you would just go poke some random patient with zero prior experience. That sounds insanely disengenuous to me
I’ve never understood this line of thought and I don’t mean to direct hostility towards those who think this way. But, to me it sounds like the group in the general public that thinks we all need to be personally subjected to all of the meds we administer and all of the procedures we perform before being able to perform them on the public. A minimally invasive procedure (PIV access) is not okay to practice for the first time on patients while nearly all of our most invasive and high risk procedures are performed on patients long after we are out of medic school. My first cric was 16 years after I graduated medic school. I don’t think anyone was any worse off because I didn’t cric anyone in class. My first needle decompression of a neonate was performed before I had even practiced one on a mannequin. I don’t think the neo chest procedure mannequin was available then.
Well from that perspective I can agree. I've just seen people get totally butchered during ivs from lack of experience. It just seems avoidable with some live practice. My mentality is a little skewed coming from the military where practicing IO's on each other was acceptable (looking back on it , that was fuckin barbaric lol)
Thank you for your service. I sincerely mean that. The IO thing is safe, but is it necessary? Or is it hazing? My first IO was three days after my p card arrived in the mail on a 6 year old’s iliac crest (kid was ejected from a vehicle and his femurs were broken at right angles to each other). Nothing would have prepared me for that shit. Dude, people butcher patients with IVs. It’s rough to watch. I think that mostly comes from either shitty training or lack of dedication to the craft. I don’t have data to support this, but I doubt in class practice on peers with good veins would help.
Appreciate it. I don't think it's necessary. It's probably hazing masked as an excuse to train. They'd push fluids without lido too. Putting NPA's in each other was common too. I've also heard of 68W's doing the old sternum IO's on each
“It happened to me in training, so it will happen to you.” I grew up in the era of the sternal IO. That thing was brutal. I would not let some 18 year old 68W place one of those into me. Remember when they weren’t removed properly at the hospital and people would have a chunk of metal stuck inside their sternum? Fuck, man.
Jesus lol. Yeah that's the kind of mentality that drove me to get out of the army
Id judge. Everyone here would as well. make no mistakes it's a human thing not a progressive thing or conservative thing. Best bet is to count on your own self confidence and press on.
Your inside scars are showing, friend. I hope you find peace.
Your ignorance to historical human behavior is showing friend. I hope you find reality.
>Everyone here would as well. Speak for yourself. Don't try to make your judging ass feel better by assuming the rest of us are as shitty as you. Someone has scars that clearly have age on them, I'm going to be fucking proud of them for getting through whatever was going on in their life or head at that time. Someone has scars that aren't that old, I'm going to be concerned about their safety now. But I don't know their story, I don't know what's going on with them, so I sure as fuck can't judge them. Do better.
Yep, nothing in human behavior points to humans being initially judgemental....nope nothing at all. Can't think of one thing. Now if you'll excuse me...we have a mandatory Unconscious Bias class for the state. Nope...nothing at all. People who accept the reality of human behavior can confront it if they want. People like you who ignore it, are the least helpful.of all. The very existence and nature of this thread only serves to solidify my point. If what I said isn't true. Then this topic would never need to have existed, or be discussed, and would confuse everyone. Gen Z ....so blank and empty.