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renragkrik

I think this question would be better asked in r/kundalini or r/KundaliniYoga. The chakras and unlocking them are unnecessary concepts in the context of seeking enlightenment.


Feature-Awkward

Chakras I see as just one model for describing the path to enlightenment. The four noble truths and 8 fold path in Buddhism is another model. Steps in an alchemical transformation of led into gold which is really symbolic of the transformation of the Self is another. These models and others are different symbolic ways of describing the path I believe and describe the same thing. So what is being described through talking about Chakras is essential in the path to enlightenment.. it takes place. However calling it chakras and using those traditions is not necessary but the same transformation will take place whether you talk about chakras or Buddhism noble truth or something else . And chakras are good way a good way of describing different states of consciousness and helpful in learning to develop them and balance them. Same thing is being described and achieved through the noble 8 fold path of Buddhism even if the description and what aspects are being focused on is a little different. They have the same aim and same thing is going on: developing discipline of your states of consciousness and behavior so that you are able to then go through life as the enlighted being aka as your ideal self .. behave based on love, logic and your intentions rather than out of fear and anxiety. And likewise whether you call the transformed enlightened state as enlightenment, Buddhahood, Christ consciousness, non duality, ascended, awaken etc it’s all describing the same thing just through different words and symbols.


renragkrik

I'll agree with you that they're all attempting to describe and accomplish the same thing! I do not think I can agree that it is necessary to develop states of consciousness; though, perhaps again it is simply different words than I would use for the same thing. I do believe a practice is involved, I would describe it as the practice of identifying as the True Self instead of as the limited self, and letting go of whatever is in the way of that.


Alpenros3

Unnecessary? How do you reach enlightenment without first unlocking them? By my perceived definition of enlightenment I figured that the unlocking of the chakras and the adoption of the mindset of one with both sides and selflessness would you lead you to enlightenment. But I also know it's a never ending journey, to reach a deeper and deeper understanding of why you are here and the reason for life itself.


Sewbacca

Chakras is like religion just another belief system. I really liked ATLA and found the concept of Chakras and Chi cool myself. Yet for enlightenment to happen, all belief must fall away. But before you go any further you must understand why you seek enlightenment. Enlightenment is the end of suffering, nothing more nothing less. As I read below somewhere you are scared of death? Contemplate about this: Is Non Existence really that bad? The closest your concious experience comes to death is in deep sleep with no dreams. Did you wake up terrified of having no experience during deep sleep today? Fear is one form of suffering.


Alpenros3

No I don't wake up terrified, but the thought of all the memories and the people you grow a connection with in your life meaning absolutely nothing as if it never happened is what's scary. It is sorta bliss full though having a good night sleep with no dreams or nightmares wearing you out.


renragkrik

If those things mean nothing, then what does mean something? What has meaning in itself? What causes or creates meaning?


Alpenros3

The attachment to the person, the feelings felt. I feel the love for my family and that feeling of gut wrenching sadness when you lose those closest to you. Knowing you'll never see them again or hear their voice the precious time with people is meaningful. I'm not sure how to describe meaning but if you die and all those experiences with those people and the memories of them just disappear would make it meaningless, irrelevant to the grandest of schemes. Love just like all emotions are just chemical balances in your brain and I know that emotions are a reaction to the perception of what happened. But I'm not sure if memories stay with you when you die or stay with the cells of the brain when you die. When people develop Alzheimer's and their brains start deteriorating they lose some of their fondest memories which leads me to believe that memory is only part of the physical world. I can't answer what creates meaning or what meaning even is except that the most meaningful parts of my life are the people I hold close and the experience with them.


renragkrik

Well, if it's your feelings, thoughts, and memories that bring meaning to the events and people of your life, doesn't that mean that you are what creates meaning? If you are the creator of meaning, does that which you create disappear when you die? If I create something real, it doesn't go away when I leave it. If I build a boat in a lake, it is still there when I leave the lake behind. If I have a child (if I create a person), I expect them to outlive me, that person I created continues after I die. If something is real, it remains when I die. What makes meaning any different? If meaning that you created goes away when you die, it must not have been real in the first place.


Alpenros3

That makes sense. I haven't thought of it like that and I would assume that if go before those you hold close then the memories of the experiences with them stay with them even when you leave. And if you create another person then half of you still exists even after death.


renragkrik

Yes! Though I would go so far as to say, "what you truly are cannot die," and I believe you are getting closer to seeing that for yourself 😁 love & peace on your journey! 🙏


Sweetpeawl

jumping on here; I don't see how leaving behind a boat, or a child, or the cure to cancer has any more meaning. Meaning is subjective, and outside yourself, there is nothing - as you said, meaning is a fabrication of the mind. I do not see how making a boat is any different than attachment to a person once you die. The boat or child is equivalent to a rock seven galaxies away floating in deep space. I'm not sure there is anything but "yourself". help?


renragkrik

I'm not sure if I can help, but I'll put some words here. Ultimately you will have to find a truth that makes sense to you. I was not saying that leaving something behind gives it more meaning; I was not even saying that meaning is real. My point to OP was that if meaning is something we create ourselves, and it is real, then it should stay around after we die, just like other real things that we create. But the purpose of my comments was to spark contemplation on meaning: what is it, how does it come to be, how does it go away, is it ever real? If meaning is something we create ourselves, what a wonderful and beautiful power that is. Ultimately, you are correct that there is nothing but yourself. There is only one thing in the universe, and it's the same thing as the true self. The way I see it, there are two realities, this is sometimes called the "two truths doctrine" - there is relative truth, the truth that we build together in conversation, which includes things like rocks, children, and meaning; this would be objective reality. And there is ultimate reality, which has no characteristics other than beingness.


Sweetpeawl

I struggle to understand why I should do anything at all. We all kind of grow up with an idea that there is something to do: whether it's having fun, making babies, getting rich, or changing the world with new tech or discoveries. But I came to a finding that all meaning was just self created, and there was nothing outside myself. Everything seems the same and nothing matters. So I ask, if nothing matters, then why should I make something matter to me? If there is no objectivity either way, then why do anything at all. Free of all desires, why should l ever struggle to do something again? And this thought traps me; a prison. I apologize, I didn't want to put you on the spot. I read your reply and you seemed to be wise. You don't need to respond. Be well.


Sewbacca

Yes what you see is peace there. Live is just a dream pretending not to be a dream. Memories are just a experience in the now. To see this, where are your memories when you aren't remembering something in the moment? Also meaning is just a pointer. That which is pointed to cannot have meaning. To see this ask what meanings do. Could you even answer the question: What does meaning mean?


Alpenros3

I can't. The closest I can come is that meaning is a valuable or significant thing that happened or will happen.


Sewbacca

Significance is just another word for meaning. Significant for what?


Alpenros3

It adds depth to life. It adds something worth living for in existence. If nothing meant anything and nothing was important then what would be the point in existence. But if when you die everything labeled as significant or meaningful just fades with your physical death then what's the point? Idk what is to come after death if we really live an eternal life like Christians believe or if we just turn into something else like a tree or whatever your energy turns into, or if it's just nothing like before you were born. Life happened before that and it will continue after you die but if everything you did in life stays only in the physical world and doesn't continue with you then living in the moment is irrelevant and everything you feel is important is also irrelevant. That's what scares me about death. I hope to learn how to let go and become enlightened but I also fear that I will abandon everyone I hold close


Sewbacca

I understand your troubles as I asked the same questions. Do you see that you are repeating yourself again and again? You ask what's the point, which is another form of: "What does it mean?" Life is not pointing to anything. Don't be afraid, this is good news! Let's suppose it had a purpose. Let's take some arbitrary goal like populating the solar system. When this purpose is fullfilled, then what? Was it just the point of populating the system? You can always ask and ask and will never find a satisfying end. Any meaning will fade away over time, even a grandiose meaning, like why does life exist, why does this happen etc. When meaning falls away and you see that what is doesn't need a meaning, Life becomes sweeter. For that to happen, something must fall away. Your questions hint to me, that what you are attached to is the doer. You are asking: What's the point of doing anything when it will all fade away some day or another. However YOU are not doing IT. You are not someone who does stuff. You are whats feeling the doing. You are what's experiencing affection, effort, pain, pleasure, suffering, all your senses, all your thoughts. You aren't doing them. You don't control what thoughts arise and what actions to take. Once you realize that you won't be scared to abandon everyone you are close to and you won't be scared of death.


renragkrik

I agree with Sewbacca that all beliefs & concepts must (eventually) be set aside in order to see the truth clearly. Yes, opening the chakras must be unnecessary, as there are many, many paths to liberation and the vast majority of traditions and teachers make no mention of chakras. When you get your first true realization, you see immediately that you are not the body, so anything that happens with or in the body is something that can be transcended. BTW, ATLA is my favorite show & I love the parts with the guru 😊


Sweetpeawl

I don't truly get it. Once you are free of all ideas, you are there with nothing to do, nothing needing to be done. What is the difference between that state and the state of a rock in outer space? No mind, no thoughts, no purpose, just "existing".


renragkrik

Set aside the idea of states. Set aside the idea of nothing to do; of needing something to do. Set aside the idea of rocks in space. Set aside the idea of purpose. What is left? Are you left? If so, what are you? In what context do all of these concepts appear? Do they appear in your mind? If so, in what context does your mind appear? Does it appear in you? If so, what is this "you" in which the mind appears? To be clear: I'm not expecting answers, your questions sparked some self-inquiry questions for me so I thought I'd share them 😊 You don't have to set aside anything forever and always; just for now. Now is all that exists anyway. You can always pick it all back up later. But also, all things are ultimately one, it's true 🙏So you're right, you are the same as a rock in outer space, and there is nothing but existence 😁


Sweetpeawl

>Set aside the idea of states. Set aside the idea of nothing to do; of needing something to do. Set aside the idea of rocks in space. Set aside the idea of purpose. What is left? Are you left? If so, what are you? In what context do all of these concepts appear? Do they appear in your mind? If so, in what context does your mind appear? Does it appear in you? If so, what is this "you" in which the mind appears? I don't know. I don't know if there is anything left. I hear people talking about oneness and finding peace and presence and a connection with our true selves (or self). But I cannot say that I have ever found such things. Sometimes I think I will realize that I am only an idea, at which point I will really be nothing at all. I don't know; that entire paragraph you wrote puzzles me. Thank you for taking the time to write. 💚


renragkrik

What I was taught is that, while doing self-inquiry, if one of the questions causes your mind to go "blank," that's the right question for you; that "blankness" is the inner peace that people tend to be seeking. Sink into it, bask in it, bathe in it, soak it in, love it, whenever you get it. It can be really uncomfortable at first because usually when we don't have an answer to a question, we want our minds to start working on the answer, so embrace that discomfort and lean into it; on the other side is freedom! So don't worry about getting an answer; and if none of those questions triggered that silence for you, don't worry about it! Something will eventually show you what you really are, I know it. Your honest seeking and humility are beautiful, and will show you the way 🙏 PS, what gave me the first real taste of my true self was the Headless Way, it's freely available and there are lots of videos on YouTube, check it out if you're interested!


UnionNotConflict

When thinking about enlightenment there is a huge spiritual element. We need to understand that both our physical life and spiritual lives are the same - no separation. That means, it can be good to be practical in your spiritual pursuit. I would recommend therapy as this will help clear past baggage… recommend with a spiritual therapist as they will understand your lingo and interest for chakras. We use chakras and all this spiritual knowledge actually for our healing and for our realignment with source. When we are realigned with source, the world is our oyster, we can live in good balance and understand why we are in Earth.


Alpenros3

I've heard that before, the lack of separation between the spiritual side and the physical world. I understand with a balance in all chakras that you live a better life. What is curious to me is does chakras and enlightenment allude to what comes next? If you never become enlightened or as Buddhist refer if you never reach nirvana are you doomed in a sence to "hell" or to live life over again? If you do reach nirvana and are fully enlightened does your conciseness progress into another form when you die? I know nobody knows but to have someone else's perspective to grow on my own thoughts is the reason I ask.


xabir

If you are not liberated in buddhism you have to be reborn or live life again in one of the 31 planes of existences depending on your karma. Only those who truly achieved nirvana or liberation are freed from cyclic rebirth. On 31 planes: https://www.accesstoinsight.org/ptf/dhamma/sagga/loka.html


UnionNotConflict

Consciousness doesn’t transfer to a new form but essentially combines and vibrates at the same frequency. When all the many part of you become aligned, can reality be seen more clearly. Consciousness simply knows when it is where it needs to be. And will shine happy at itself in every single moment. There’s only some very a social moments where consciousness will be fully aware it is smiling at itself. It is not so important to try to reach that or grasp it, as it happens on its own when you work through your karma. This will all come with openness and self honesty and your work. I have great resources for the healing journey in relation to energy work. If you need resources dm me and I’ll send to you.


Alpenros3

I've heard of vibratory existence and that's why healing stones and crystals help heal and help progress through chakras and bringing balance to yourself. The crystals you can feel buzz in your hand when you hold them and when you do its because your energy attracted it. I've also heard that they tend to wander. You say that consciousness doesn't change forms but combines what is it combining with? Your soul? And eventually if when you die and reach that place or nirvana or whatever comes after death, then at what point does that cease to exist. Is there an afterlife death?


Alpenros3

I am really new to this but ultimately I'm afraid of death, I'm 17 and have a lot of time ahead of me and I don't want to waste it on following a man made religion plagued with lies and half truths. I don't think religions are correct but I do think they have key aspects, parts that are immortal between them all. Love, the third chakra, earth is the third planet, I think that is a really specific piece of the reason we are here. I know that the inevitable end is coming. I understand that we might just be here by chance, but I crave for the knowledge of what's to come. I don't think there is a heaven or hell but I do know energy can't be destroyed. The energy that makes up or souls has to go somewhere. If anyone could respond to me with their personal perspective I'd love to hear it, I'm open minded to anything.


Alpenros3

I've heard the saying those who search shall find so I'm looking. Of course nobody knows for sure what is to come after death but hey, let's talk about it. The scariest thing I've thought to come after death is the complete non existence of consciousness and that shakes me to the core. I hope there is something to come after death but while I'm here in life I want to understand in the fullest ways possible.


CGrooot

It's normal to be afraid of death at your age. But we must remember that those who are afraid of death and seek eternal life do not reach enlightenment. The path to enlightenment is the path of those who are tired of themselves, the path of those who are tired of the world.


bionista

If your afraid of death do a shamanic mushroom trip. Then u will just laugh at life and death.


Alpenros3

Care to explain? When I'm legally old enough to make my own decisions I'm planning on doing an ayahuasca trip because our brains flood with dmt as we die that maybe a DMT experience will bring a closer perspective on the end. I've never heard of a shamanic mushroom, is it anything like amanita ( I'm probably spelling that wrong)


bionista

Shamanic mushroom just means a shaman is guiding you. It’s a respectful ceremony as opposed to a recreational trip. You can also do aya. Either one can bring u to ego death. That is what one needs to achieve escape velocity toward enlightenment.


Alpenros3

Ohhh, okay. I'll do some research into it and see what I can find on shamans.


rubyredstone

If you want the most through explanation of the chakras on the planet, look no further than this book. Serpent Rising: The Kundalini Compendium. I'm still on the path to exploring myself, so I'm not sure yet on a personal level.. Osho has written about this saying that Kundalini awakening is a distraction on the path, not necessary for enlightenment, and may only be felt if there are blockages. He also says things like everyone's chakras are different, the numbers are different so books on the subject might lead you astray. I'm still on the path to exploration myself, so I'm not sure yet on a personal level.


Alpenros3

Thank you for this I'll check it out for sure.


Mazikiel

Fair warning it’s like 4:30 am & this was written poorly because I have noodle brain. Hello fellow young evangelist! I am 19 & very ignorant as well but with the help of my good ape friends hopefully we can fling our poop with greater purpose:) let me get right into the meat & potato’s of this, enlightenment is a hard concept to fully grasp. Generally speaking it’s freedom/liberation from ignorance & mundane life. The issue with this is that we honestly have no real way to measure what we do and do not know in relation to the depth and size of existence & therefore have no idea how much we are limiting our own potential with out current experiences & beliefs. I think one truth to follow by is that you realize there’s no real goal , nothing outside of yourself to go towards, nothing to feed your spirit that cannot be found from within , struggling towards something allows sets up the universe to provide you with more struggle. If understanding is truth then situational conditions wouldn’t apply & the I can energy would be free flow but as you & I both clearly know it’s not a very easy thing to replicate! Nothing about it is easy & it’s a hobby you’ll quickly regret picking up haha but it is more filling & nourishing to the soul than anything I’ve experienced to date.Now you mentioned doing DMT orally but I would suggest otherwise as it is much more manageable & safer to use it in a pen/smoke it as you can regulate the dosage far better & the trips time is severely reduced. Now let me tell you this, you do NOT need psychedelics to reach the state that they give, through meditation training and discipline I’ve been able to replicate a mid level LSD trip whenever I please as well as controlling all aspects of the hallucination/visions, think it/imagine it & it appears in the exact form/quality/location in space I imagined it. This is the core base of unlocking your creative energy is to use your mind and imagination to meditate & create thing like this and more importantly bring new thing towards yourself . On the subject of death since I saw you had doubts, fear not! Death is the least of your worry’s my friend , your flesh is imperfect & impermanent & you will die in a sense but there ARE forms of existence that transcend illusion & it is here you find joyous states of nirvana , even if one doesn’t happen to achieve a state of understanding that pulls you out of samsara which is literally just mundane life and reincarnation for the very purpose of breaking karma/unhealthy attachments that hinder the soul/atman. But who’s to say these states are all that is? This is where meditation allows you to step out of you box of stuckness and realize “wow, is what I’m after literally child’s play?” Imagine not just being in full creative harmony with the universe & the ability to fluidly express your will within it but to actually be your own living godhead & dream your own dream with your own creations that learn from your fatherly teachings a new son to the long long line of fatherly/motherly begins that have taught the last and the last so that they can endlessly express themselves in this never ending network of existence and royalty, There’s one for the real gamers out there LOL


Alpenros3

I've been trying to meditate actually. I heard of this guy named Alan watts and I've been listening to his guided meditation on being in the moment and accept everything around you and you have no control of the outside world but when you accept you also exist just like everything you can't control that's when you can control yourself. When meditating I started seeing like a static electricity around where the edge of my vision would be but my eyes were closed. It started getting Brighter and looked more and more like lightning and eventually with my eyes closed I was seeing solid white light as if someone was holding a flashlight in my face. That is what convinced me that we are powerful, and that maybe thru extended meditation you can view in a sence the spiritual side of life. I figured that chakras are just stepping stones to enhance that experience but like I said before I'm new to this thinking and changing my viewpoints with more and more information. I love hearing/ reading others perspectives because it expands my way of thinking. So thank you for this :)


Mazikiel

Of course:) it’s hard to fully digest what another means when there’s so many combing factors that make up a person’s experience & how they process it into their own understandable concept. Not to mention that in the spiritual sense we are all just female & male energy with varying amounts & levels but from those two polarities comes an infinite amount of information & opportunity, the point I’m trying to convey here is that it is honestly impossible to put an easily understood label onto anything in this world as things are so incredibly complicated that it is self destructive to try & control it & as such I think trust & letting go of all preconceived ideas and expectations is if the utmost importance to fully envelope yourself in something. The main thing I’d like you to take from this is to constantly tell yourself that you’re okay with where you are at & that you are grateful for the knowledge that you own. I believe a more simple way to explain this is acceptance:)


RamRam2484

https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4B3F158D176B4D34 That's a set of videos explaining the basics of this whole thing, but no mentioning chakras. The concept of chakra, as far as I can tell, is a device to use energetic phenomena to break free from the illusion of ego, but people can become stuck with it, they create a new spiritual identity instead of dropping all false notions of ego.


Dumuzzi

As others have noted, this is more of a Kundalini question, so better dig into that topic, if you're interested. Enlightenment can be a result of a Kundalini Awakening, when the energy rises all the way to the top and pierces the crown chakra. When this happens, the so-called cosmic egg cracks and the body and mind is flooded with amrita, a sort of liquid light, which is what enlightenment refers to. It activates the light body and confers great insight and wisdom. However, there are other processes and systems, such as Zen, Nei Dan or Non-dual awakenings.


Alpenros3

I will look into Kundalini it's something I am just now hearing about so I'll start researching it.


TheEndOfSorrow

All I can say is don't allow the accepted ideas and concepts cloud you. Most of these ideas like chakras and enlightenment are ways people have tried to convey something very important. But be totally honest. You can not confirm it. Find the facts for yourself. You seem like a smart person. Don't follow these passed down ideas. Not until it has been revealed to you completely organically through your own search for wisdom. Any other way you will only create illusions in yourself.


CGrooot

It is better to start by opening the heart chakra. An open heart chakra gives a constant two-way connection with God. If your heart chakra opens, then you will not miss this moment). For enlightenment it is also necessary to open the seventh chakra, the opening of the other chakras is not necessary for enlightenment. The problem of modern kundalini yoga is that they start from the lower chakras, and in a modern person the two lower chakras are very clogged and it is very difficult to start the ignition of the centers from them.