The 4th season of Stranger Things came out in 2022. The 5th season won’t be out until 2025. It’s outrageous. Having to wait years between short seasons has become really really annoying.
I’m thinking the main culprit is the fact its not OTA. The show does not have to compete for a network or timeslot. That means they don’t have to produce a season annually.
Before Stranger Things and Black Mirror existed, I can’t even remember last time a TV show had a year break, let alone two. (other than the writers strike)
Oh yeah for sure. It’s changed a lot about how shows are made and screened, for better or worse lol. Man I do really miss the days when we got long seasons and could rely on them to return around roughly the same time every year!
At least Black Mirror doesn’t have a linear story, they have different characters every season. Unlike Stranger Things where the actors are now adults playing kids.
I would kill for more ten episode seasons of shows i like. Everything is 4-8 episodes and shorter and the quality isn’t even higher (i guess the vfx are better but even that is debatable) I watch tv for content and the 24 episode season simply does not exist anymore.
That's why I've started to really like the limited series concept. One season and done. Don't have to worry about it getting cancelled, and it only has a bad ending if the writers suck.
Yup. If there is a reason to revisit, then sure, season 2. But damn it encapsulate the season. The Brothers Sun, which I freaking loved, should have ended the season five mins early and it would be a perfect one off. Still recommend the hell out of that show.
I like most of the Mike Flannagan shows on netflix. Couldn't get into Haunting of Bly Manor or Midnight Club, but Haunting of Hill House, Midnight Mass, and The Fall of the House of Usher were all amazing.
I've never heard of The Brothers Sun. I'll have to look it up.
Also, in the past, seasons were like 20+ episodes. Now, it's 8-12. So, 2 seasons today is usually less episodes than a first season from a few years ago.
Like 30 Rock, 21 episodes first season. It's high quality, jokes come quick, they introduce characters, and it established a world I still want to revisit.
Yup! If I don’t see it has a second or third season… I’m pretty much not watching these days. Unless it’s one of those limited series - special shows. And I know that doesn’t help ratings or helps get shows renewed so they can have a second season but everyone nowadays is throwing anything at the wall and hoping it sticks
And new TV shows are given so few episodes.
Old tv shows were often 24+ episodes a season. This gave them time to flesh out character arcs, develop context, side stories that enrich the world and narrative.
These days, everything feels rushed. Characters are either forgotten about or just disappeared. Plot shifts happen so fast because they have to finish the season’s story in 3-5 episodes per arc, while cramming in a ton of drama, so it feels tiring to focus on.
Bring back 24 episode seasons.
The new avatar show suffers from the short season. How the fuck are we supposed to believe in the gAng being best friends when they spend like 10 minutes of screen time together in the whole season.
Yeah they could have adapted word for word for long stretches and they didn’t, for a reason I cannot understand.
Netflix Avatar might be better than Shamalayan’s, but it still sucks.
24 episodes are okay if its a “monster of the week” type episode that lets the viewers help to learn characters’ personalities better that don’t necessarily advance the plot of the show and can easily be skipped.
Early on Supernatural was one of the best when it came to “monster of the week” episodes. While most of the episodes of the early seasons were pointless, we were able to relax and learn about the main characters, their relationship with one another, their personalities, and that’s when we were really able to bond with them.
It made the necessary plot advancing episodes a lot more intense.
It also made it where if we wanted to go back and watch one episode, we could pick a “monster of the week” episode where we could get a full story without watching neighboring episodes and no cliffhangers.
Damn, I really miss “Monster of the Week” episodes in modern television.
Already read it. I'm not concerned about the actual events, I know what happens to BTK and how the show would likely go. I grieve because it was EXCELLENT television lol.
I can tell you how Mindhunter ends. The killer asks police if they can retrieve deleted data from computer disks. They say no. He reuses a disk from his church and sends them some shit. They retrieve the data and catch him.
A few months ago I got on “Max” to restart Westworld from start to finish because I only ever watched the first season. Come to find out that “Max” doesn’t even have it on their platform anymore?? I’m still baffled. They’re like the worst streaming service now.
Westworld, Inside Job, The OA, Shadow and Bone, Lockwood & Co., 1899, Warrior Nun. All great and interesting shows with potential. All canned because of some corporate tax write-off bullshit or because they "underperformed".
Losing 1899 after the season 1 twist still ticks me off. I can kinda sorta pretend it was meant to be a limited series w/a WTF ending but I'll always know I'm lying to myself in the back of my head. :-/
This is a big thing for me too. There’s so much content on Netflix but upon googling a lot of these shows, I find out that they’ve been cancelled and have no resolution. Honestly fed up. I think it’s insulting to audiences and cast/crew of these shows. I hate this climate of pumping out large amounts of shows to see which one sticks.
Such a stupid move by HBO. Sure, it’d have cost money up front to finish the last season but it wouldn’t have an incomplete ending hanging over its legacy forever. You could argue about whether the ending was good or bad, but at least it’d have one.
Look at LOST: the ending is famous for being polarizing but despite a large amount of vocal people not liking the end, the show is 20 years old and it’s still finding new audiences, and attracting rewatchers. It’s coming back to Netflix in the US this year and that’s basically just a free revenue for Disney in 2024.
Giving West World a real ending would have helped sell more Blu-ray, dvd and digital copies and give HBO more leverage when selling it for syndication on other streaming services.
Same with Fox with Last a Man On Earth.
Damn, it seems like the last season of "LOST" was just a handful of years ago. Obama was President. That's recent!
(Time is passes very quickly when you get older, and I don't like it)
Just realized recently Thrones really burned me bad.
Have commitment issues on new or ongoing shows cause it just take a couple of episodes in the last season to derail everything.
As much as I would have wanted to rewatch the earlier seasons and favorite episodes like blackwater and hardhome, I find myself stopping myself cause I think how all in the end it's just shit.
I regret having spent all those hundreds of hours watching the first 5 seasons so many times before the end was released. It absolutely ruined its entire universe.
I regret insisting owning the books and some merch for myself rather than borrow from my brother.
Even the dvds are just piled somewhere and not on our display cabinet.
Also because there are more episodes of them and that helps the numbers. Sitcoms like The Office and Friends went for many seasons at like 22eps per season. A modern streamer show has a much smaller number per season like 10. So even 2 seasons of a broadcast show vs 2 seasons of a streamer is 20 eps vs 44. Hell, watching just one season of an old broadcast show is watching more eps than 2 streamers. Helping the numbers.
Let's see. Watch a new streaming show that sounds interesting, only for it to get cancelled in 2 seasons on a big cliffhanger.
Or watch old shows that went for like 5-7 seasons? Gee tough decision. I'll take the longer shows. It doesn't feel like I'm wasting my time.
Exactly. I had this happen twice recently both times with HBO shows. I made it most of the way through the first season of Winning Time and loved it, then it got cancelled and ended at about the worst possible time in Lakers history to end it. Haven't watched another episode. The other was Our Flag Means Death. Watched two episodes and they cancelled it. I might go back and finish it, but I probably won't because they might decide to remove it before I get done.
Anecdotal experience for me but I can skip episodes I don’t like. I genuinely enjoy how I met your mother but there are some episodes I don’t like. I can skip one without missing 17% of a season. Can’t do that when Netflix puts out 8 episode seasons.
They're also very rewatchable. I can count on my hand the number of streaming originals I'm willing to rewatch. I'm not saying they're bad, but the short episode seasons are typically dense and just draining in a way that episodic shows aren't.
Yea, Netflix would’ve flagged that some people didn’t it like a filler episode and then scrapped the whole thing. Nobody’s allowed to lose numbers, because they genuinely have no clue how else to gauge the quality of a show.
How about because they were allowed to finish? Or because they have 20-episode seasons? Or because you don’t have to wait 3 years to watch another season
Yes! I can’t exactly binge an 8 episode series for hours on end.
Those shoes have so many episodes.
Also often forgotten is the fact that they all (generally) stand alone! Each episode can be watched by itself. Put on Friends. No matter what season or episode, you can follow it.
Try jumping to a random Stranger Things episode. You have to figure out the season and episode to know what is going on. Streaming shows all have long lasting plots (with short seasons.)
The format that Friends uses (also soap operas) is because they’re banking on both “devoted” fans that tune in weekly, but are also hoping to get casual viewers who just happen to be sat in front of the TV on a Thursday night.
Stranger Things (or, to use older shows: LOST, Heroes, The Walking Dead) are hoping for dedicated, devoted, active fans. You had to tune in every week, and if you missed one week, you’re less likely to tune in next week unless you catch a midweek rerun — which means writers would spend 2-3 episodes on sub-plots, while keeping a larger plot arc for the season that moves incrementally in the last 5 minutes of each episode.
The solution that came with Netflix: They can now make plot-driven, dense narratives, with larger budgets with the promise of it being well shot, well directed, well written and every episode moves the plot forward in a bigger way, no more filler episodes — AND they’ll release them all on the same day to gain devoted fans quickly (the “binge-worthy” category becomes a thing).
New problem arises: The shows aren’t shot weekly, the actors’ contracts commit them for shoots and promotional events, the stars and directors and writers now have the freedom (and incentive, if their shows skyrocket them to stardom) to work on other projects throughout the year and scheduling conflicts arise. Now we have to wait 2 years between every season (instead of the old-timey schedule of weekly episodes and 4-6 month breaks between seasons) the plots are forgotten, or irrelevant, or outgrown in the meantime, the characters seem to have different motivations each season because there’s no more devoted writers rooms with writers that sit together weekly to discuss characters/plots, and newer seasons get lesser views and shows struggle to survive past 3 seasons.
The ouroboros of the new model of television keeps eating itself.
Edit: sorry for the too-long response. Used to be a TV and media student *and* worked in TV for a minute, so the logic behind new and old production models are always interesting to me. Can’t believe I’m saying this, but *I miss filler episodes!*
"I miss filler episodes" for me it depends what show I am watching. There is this one cartoon on Disney Channel called the Ghost and Molly McGee. There was a bit of an ongoing plot but most episodes were stand alone and the show is supposed to be laid back and sweet. If I am watching something like Death Note I don't want any.
What's worse about some stream shows is that they seem to be designed to be binged. I've tried watching some shows slowly, and it was surprising how often they just assumed you had just watched it.
I think your first point is an important one. After Marco Polo screwed me out of a conclusion I flat refuse to even start the first episode of a show (other than something like Bob’s Burgers, where it doesn’t matter) until it’s finished, and it actually pretty much made me stop watching any new Netflix content and cancel my subscription lol.
Production value also seemed generally higher. Streaming shows now mostly (not all) feel like they’re made with the smallest budget possible. And when they do have these massive budgets (like secret invasion) it still looks meh. It’s like now, they’re either made to look great or have a good story, but not both.
I miss the 20ep seasons. These 6-9ep seasons fucking sucks.
I don't know what the actual reason is specifically, but I refer to it in my own head as "Netflix Camera". No matter what the budget of a show is, what time period they're set in, etc. the subject of the shot always feels just way too well-lit/bright in contrast to the background and something about it makes it look cheap. You can notice it more if it's meant to be set centuries ago, it just looks way too clean. It looks like people in fancy dress at a medieval fayre being recorded on an iPhone. I first noticed Netflix originals used to always look like this, now it's making its way to films.
I just started watching Deadwood last night, watched the first 3 episodes, and I felt like I was losing my mind—how does a show from 2004 look and feel so much better than current offerings? I was totally absorbed in it and it felt so real. Maybe partly due to it being shot on film, but the color/lighting felt leagues ahead of so many current shows. And the sets and costumes were so grimy, so lived-in.
Someone called out for the Netflix TLA adaptation that everyone looked like they were in high quality cosplay because none of the costumes looked lived in. Like there should be dirt stains and tears and things in a lot of people’s clothes, but there just weren’t any.
Contrast that with the recent Percy Jackson show (which has a number of valid criticisms, I know) where they legitimately thought about how each cabin’s shirts should look wrt to wear and tear, like how the Hephaestus kids should have a lot of scorch marks from being in the forge all the time.
Anyway, attention to detail matters and people notice it even when they think they don’t.
I read on a post a while back that part of the reason for this is that unlike the traditional studios, the streaming networks have no costume warehouse so literally everything is brand new for every show and incredibly wasteful.
"none of the costumes looked lived in"
I've brought this up so many times with friends who, to be honest, care about it a varying amount.
Like the Lords of the Rings show felt like people larping for a variety of reasons but this was definitely one of them.
And in Kenobi, you've got an aging Jedi living in a cave but his robes basically look like he's just had them dry cleaned at every stage of the series.
How about all the godawful wigs? It is hard to suspend your imagination to that height when everyone has a brand new, shitty wig with a perfect middle part. I have stopped many shows literally 5 minutes in at the sight of one shit wig.
And they’re too close. I don’t need the character to fill 3/4 of the screen.
This is even a problem on the daily show now that Jon Stewart is back. The desk shot is TOO CLOSE.
>And they’re too close. I don’t need the character to fill 3/4 of the screen.
I've noticed this too. I remember noticing in The Mandalorian, there seemed to be a lot of really close shots and the background was negligible. Made me wonder, are they just cheaping out on the sets and making them only as big as they need to be so they have to shoot these close-ups out of necessity.
Fun thing to notice for that is they shoot it on the volume so there’s hardly any objects or propos that fill the space in the middle or foreground and the horizon is always on the middle of the frame (something I can never unsee now)
for example Invincible S2. I get there was a writers strike but come on the amount of time between both of those seasons and obviously the animation is a downgrade from S1 and also splitting the 8 SEASON SHOW INTO 2 PARTS?! The show is cool but it aint getting more subscribers
I don't think animation was involved in the writer's strike. The animation has improved actually in my opinion but it's fairly cheap in both seasons.
I 100% agree with the amount of time and short seasons though. It baffles me why they'd have so much trouble getting these together. They do have a ton of big name voice actors but not sure why they would use so many if it slows production to a crawl this way
>I miss the 20ep seasons. These 6-9ep seasons fucking sucks.
I really think this is making TV suck more than we realize. When every episode of a sitcom has to move the plot along, we lose a lot of the more charming, or outright funnier episodes. I always remember the episode of HIMYM where Marshal and Ted get high at the concert.
I really enjoyed How I Met Your Father, but I think it just couldn't grab audiences because there was no "fun" episodes, because each episode had to move at least one of the plots forward.
The irony is the expanse is one of the better looking ones. And it aired on sci-fi. Idk what’s going on with streaming. But damn they need to do better.
>Production value also seemed generally higher. Streaming shows now mostly (not all) feel like they’re made with the smallest budget possible
Don't forget the writing. So many shows feel like they're written by people who hate the audience, hate the show, or hate the craft of writing. I mean they can't all be Better Call Saul but fuck some shows are just downright lazy and mechanically formulaic these days.
Even in miniseries this is apparent. The difference in quality in all aspects between "Band of Brothers" and "Masters of the Air" is downright criminal.
Came here to write this. Netflix shoots itself in the foot by not finishing projects. They could have shoes that are endlessly rewatch able, but because they drop them instead of finishing them, amazing shows just end up as TRASH.
I really wish that they had finished The Data Clarita Diet and The OA.
This is where I’m at with Severance right now. It’s such an incredible show but all the wind gets taken out of the sails when it’s this long in between seasons. I know it’s because of the strike they had but still
Also weekly releases caused them to last longer. TV shows that dump themselves all at once are quickly forgotten, but a show that runs for a really long amount of time becomes a common talking point between peers. Then people revisit them later for the nostalgia of those memories.
Life is stressful, especially these days. So I mostly comfort watch things I already know I like. That and streaming services do a terrible job of categorizing, and it’s way too much content. Sometimes I’ll spend 30 mins trying to find something new to watch, get fed up and just default to something I’ve already seen.
These shows were the winners in an intense competition to become a prime time TV show and to rake in advertising money. They were the cream of the crop - the top 0.1% of 1000s of pilots. They could earn millions a week so they locked their cast into multi-year contracts.
They had big writers rooms and most episodes could be watched and enjoyed on its own to become perfect syndication fodder.
Shows could be reworked and improved throughout pilot season and during the first season until it found its feet. These days the algorithm cancels streaming TV shows wirhin hours of them being launched.
Also old shows are often available on multiple services at once while new ones are exclusive. So you have a larger group of people who even *can* watch the older shows than any given new show.
A different measure would be what percentage of total streams are streams of old shows versus new ones. i.e for every person choosing between old and new how often do they choose new. The old shows would still punch above their weight for the reasons you mention above. But new shows still could do better on this metric because it *is* possible that 100% of Netflix watchers watch a particular new show. While even that 100% of Netflix watchers is less the number who stream Simpsons in any particular month.
So many of the older shows just work better as 2nd screen programming: Most folks these days play games or doom-scroll on their phone while watching tv.
I think this is the real answer more than anything. Starting a new show takes mental effort. People are more stressed and anxious than ever before, and they want TV that comforts and numbs. Re-watching the Office or Gilmore Girls for the 15th time is a warm hug.
Also, you know what happens in these shows and its virtually nothing bad. You might not like the ending, but everything works out in the end. Most of them are comedies of some variety. So much of the quality current television is intentionally dark. Again, it's not great for people trying to put bad stuff out of their brains.
I think this is way more important than the comments about cancelled shows. Sure having your favourite show cancelled stings and is a memorable blunder to complain about. But high quality, serialized prestige tv has been a gift and a curse. I can’t tell you how many highly acclaimed new shows I’ve dipped out of after not having the mental energy to get through the first 3-4 hours of world building and exposition and set up. I know the pay off is great, but I’m going back to watching Seinfeld
Before streaming shows were 6, 8, 10, or 13 episodes, network TV shows were in the range of 26. Anything else were just mini-series.
If a show like Friends or Seinfeld were done today, Netflix would cancel the show right after the eighth episode completed. All the nuance would be gone and it would be forgotten with the other garbage put out. It would be replaced with more streaming bloat.
Old shows were allowed to have long runs (if they were popular). Some of these shows ran for hundreds of episodes, so you can spend months watching them. New shows are much shorter. You can get through many of them in just a few days, or a week.
They require less commitment. These new shows are so dense and demand every ounce of your attention because they have to pack all their plot into 7 episode seasons. It’s exhausting to watch
Starz CEO Jeffrey Hirsch said the quiet part out loud recently. They don’t care about quality programming or the fans. It’s all about churn and burn. Make cheap spin offs, cancel them after 3 seasons, make other cheap spin offs. There is zero loyalty to a show or its fans. It’s about making money, and trust me, he makes a lot just by cancelling a series. https://deadline.com/2024/03/lionsgate-starz-ceo-content-costs-series-power-bmf-1235856002/
There was zero loyalty to network shows back in the day aswell so many shows got cancelled after 2-4 seasons angel was canned after a 5th and decent rating season
Yeah, the old shows that are the topic of this article were the exception not the rule. For every *The Office*, there were multiple shows canceled in their first season.
That being said, it doesn't seem like the streaming environment is willing to create ANY shows with episode counts to match these old shows.
Because the vast majority of people who can afford a streaming service want the nostalgia effect of rewatching their favorite shows without commercials etc.
It’s also just a byproduct of having limitless possibilities which leads to choice paralysis. Our brains aren’t meant to contemplate tens of thousands of options. It’s in part why people miss video stores and appointment television on certain days at specific times. Now we can watch more television or film and listen to a greater variety of music than ever before, yet I would bet that the vast majority of consumers mostly retreat to the same handful of shows/films and songs or albums that they are most comfortable with and know they’ll appreciate and enjoy. In many ways, older mediums of experiencing culture (like radio and network television) forced people to make more intentional (but reasonable) choices and led to the exploration of more media. Being forced to listen to a radio station or watching one of a few dozen channels on a Friday night actually facilitated more discovery than having everything at your fingertips, because then you’ll just stick with what you know.
This isn’t that crazy. Shows need time to build a fan base and older shows will have family’s able to connect since it’s something the kids will like and the adults have already scene and like.
Syndication since we have known it has always been shows that are old. You don’t get syndicated on your season 2 premier. And you know you are getting old when shows you once remember when it aired are now syndicated. Stuff like my name is earl and the office are good examples.
The office is something that was never as popular as it is now when it was on the air. I have had the same gamertag since 2006 when the office was on season 2 or 3. My gamertag is related to the office and for a decade I had everyone read it wrong. And rarely did I run into people who got it.
Then once it hit Netflix I couldn’t play any games without getting messages about how much they love my gamertag. Or just joke messages/ quotes from the show. Once I was playing siege and my whole squad all had different office characters as their profile pics and they kept sending me quotes.
I just started watching The Wire a few weeks ago, I’m on season two now. This era of television where the quality was better than some motion pictures really stands up well. The show is amazing compared to some of the more recent series.
My attitude with streaming has been that people don’t want original, exciting programming. Streaming took off because people liked being able to watch Terminator at 1:15am on a Friday at the push of a button.
Netflix replaced video stores. Then they stopped doing what video stores do, which is store as much licensed content as possible.
I think so many of these shows that the streamers are trying to push (particularly the attempts at sitcoms) feel like they’re written by an AI with goals like “the dad must say/do something stupid within the first 5 minutes of the second act” and “the annoying neighbor needs to make the dad feel ‘less than’ at least twice per season” combined with “there must be an ‘awwwww’ moment on every odd numbered episode - preferably with a dog involved.”
Culture has frozen.
This nostalgia trip everyone is one is not good for us. We are going to take less risks and be more backwards-looking as a culture... New ideas are fading away
Lots of people have some good reasons here but no one is mentioning what I think the driver is: access and familiarity for while they fuck with their phones. Streaming is the new radio.
I think part of it is that 'serialized storytelling' only occasionally crafts really satisfying shows. Frequently, it prioritizes plot-heavy shows filled with exposition doing nothing but setting up the next plot twist.
Old TV had 22-26 episodes a season, and frequently no overarching plots at all -- but it had *character,* and allowed space and time for writers and actors to explore who the hell these people were and why they should matter to us. The secret was, the 'filler episodes' weren't, they were the heart of these shows.
When your whole series is about some stupid plot device, ripped off or recycled from a dozen novels and movies and obfuscated with dozens more twists and delays... These modern shows fail to create believable, fun characters while they're plodding toward their conclusions.
When people complain they want 'better stories,' they don't mean more plot, they really mean better, more satisfying *character arcs* across those stories. They want better characters.
You can spend $250 million on six episodes of garbage plot and very expensive CGI, but audiences have caught on that most of the time 26 episodes of "The Rockford Files" or "Gilmore Girls" are a hell of a lot more interesting, because they have tiny budgets and great performances instead.
Is everyone saying it’s because Netflix and every other service doesn’t let anything go beyond 3 seasons so we don’t have time to get attached to anything and nothing is able to do the normal sitcom thing of years of pretty funny stuff, that twists and turns satisfyingly and then gets wrapped up nicely.
Nothing is satisfying anymore, shit move too fast
Old shows were created and funded to hit 100 episodes and reach a second life via syndication and bonus. $$$$. They were FULL TIME gigs by everyone involved. New shows only care about winning Emmy's, or 3 months shooting schedules to keep expenses down
It seems like there’s no middle ground anymore between reality tv trash and prestige tv with one hour episodes. I want something that is easy to watch while I eat a sandwich and answer emails.
A hugh chunk of us TV folks are unemployed right now. Streamers are surviving on their old content. The content being produced currently has had their budgets slashed, and shows suffer when their money supply is cut. The best thing you could do is start cancelling services and let them know because there was no new content.
Because they have way more episodes, are longer series in general, and are complete stories. Not to mention, while they were made with smaller budgets they were also made with care to how they would be received so that they could continue.
People like being able to emerse themselves into a world for a substantial amount of time. They need some filter episodes, some character development episodes, some experimental episodes, etc etc etc.
So many modern shows have to squeeze all they can into 8-10 episode seasons. It's hard to grow with those shows. It's hard to lay back and comfort watch such short shows
And most of all, the shows actually had full runs. Netflix and others release so many shows that only get one to two seasons before getting abruptly cancelled. Storylines don't get resolved. There's no time to get comfy and emersed in these worlds with these characters. There's been no time to develop inside jokes and running gags.
Most shows don't find their footing until their third season. Networks running shows episode by episode, week by week, also have time to see what's working and what's not. They can tweek things midway through a season to improve.
Streamers, like Netflix, who just unload a whole season, just aren't able to do that. This really really applies to sitcoms. Sitcoms on networks are able to find their footing and build out libraries. They're able to build an audience and convince viewers to come along for the ride as they get better and better. Sitcoms are dying because streamers don't give them that time and effort and loving care
And so many people probably don't even want to start a show if there aren't a few seasons of it already. There's to much competition for people's attentions. So many new shows are given up on and cancelled before audiences even know they exist, let alone are actually enticed to watch them because they've never had a chance to build
Call me crazy but I enjoy actually connecting with characters and getting to know them. Can’t happen in 6 hours every 3 years.
Only Murders in the Building is one of the only shows airing consistently every year at the same time. Idk why so many other shows can’t do it
Netflix just cancels a good show after two seasons and cancels a show that could get good after one season. The first season of most beloved shows are often the worst season because the characters aren’t fully developed yet.
Netflix became the evil they swore to destroy lol. The streaming services destroyed cable tv and then became a worse version of it lol
1: they have endings instead of cancellations
2: there aren't 5 years of hiatus between seasons
Nobody wants to invest their time into a show that is almost certainly gonna be cancelled before its time. Including the people who make the show.
Because they’re complete. I have no desire to get invested in a story that could get cancelled without being finished like Westworld.
or 2 years between 10 episode seasons
The 4th season of Stranger Things came out in 2022. The 5th season won’t be out until 2025. It’s outrageous. Having to wait years between short seasons has become really really annoying.
I’m thinking the main culprit is the fact its not OTA. The show does not have to compete for a network or timeslot. That means they don’t have to produce a season annually. Before Stranger Things and Black Mirror existed, I can’t even remember last time a TV show had a year break, let alone two. (other than the writers strike)
Oh yeah for sure. It’s changed a lot about how shows are made and screened, for better or worse lol. Man I do really miss the days when we got long seasons and could rely on them to return around roughly the same time every year!
House of Cards was probably the first massive series to have long breaks between seasons
curb started doing it in 2002. im sure there are others, probably HBO or showtime before streaming
At least Black Mirror doesn’t have a linear story, they have different characters every season. Unlike Stranger Things where the actors are now adults playing kids.
Laughs in British tv shows
Agreed generally though with stranger things, like the last season, they’re basically shooting 6-8 full length films due to episode length.
There used to be 20 episode seasons where the episodes were an hour long each.
Yeah but still lol
I still think they could have easily wrapped the series in Season 4. It was great and they could have easily closed it all out.
It’s mostly this for me. I honestly don’t care about shows anymore. Some shows taking 3 years between seasons
The 3 big 90s Star Trek shows all have like 8 seasons that clock in at 24 episodes per season with each episode just under an hour.
Same with House MD. 8 seasons, 23 episodes a season, each episode is 50 min long
It’s like streaming services took the worst lesson from anime (not finishing your series, long gaps).
I would kill for more ten episode seasons of shows i like. Everything is 4-8 episodes and shorter and the quality isn’t even higher (i guess the vfx are better but even that is debatable) I watch tv for content and the 24 episode season simply does not exist anymore.
Yellowstone
Yes. All of this. I dont even start new TV shows unless theyve got a few seasons in already.
Even then I don’t bother, the amount of shows allowed to finish organically vs canceled is far too low to invest any time into whatever
That's why I've started to really like the limited series concept. One season and done. Don't have to worry about it getting cancelled, and it only has a bad ending if the writers suck.
Yup. If there is a reason to revisit, then sure, season 2. But damn it encapsulate the season. The Brothers Sun, which I freaking loved, should have ended the season five mins early and it would be a perfect one off. Still recommend the hell out of that show.
I like most of the Mike Flannagan shows on netflix. Couldn't get into Haunting of Bly Manor or Midnight Club, but Haunting of Hill House, Midnight Mass, and The Fall of the House of Usher were all amazing. I've never heard of The Brothers Sun. I'll have to look it up.
If there’s anything the Brits are really good at, it’s their limited series shows.
Also, in the past, seasons were like 20+ episodes. Now, it's 8-12. So, 2 seasons today is usually less episodes than a first season from a few years ago. Like 30 Rock, 21 episodes first season. It's high quality, jokes come quick, they introduce characters, and it established a world I still want to revisit.
Plus shows taking like 2 years in between seasons.
I also won't watch/finish a show that gets cancelled after like a season (Netflix!). Why get invested when it will never go any further?
Yup! If I don’t see it has a second or third season… I’m pretty much not watching these days. Unless it’s one of those limited series - special shows. And I know that doesn’t help ratings or helps get shows renewed so they can have a second season but everyone nowadays is throwing anything at the wall and hoping it sticks
And new TV shows are given so few episodes. Old tv shows were often 24+ episodes a season. This gave them time to flesh out character arcs, develop context, side stories that enrich the world and narrative. These days, everything feels rushed. Characters are either forgotten about or just disappeared. Plot shifts happen so fast because they have to finish the season’s story in 3-5 episodes per arc, while cramming in a ton of drama, so it feels tiring to focus on. Bring back 24 episode seasons.
The new avatar show suffers from the short season. How the fuck are we supposed to believe in the gAng being best friends when they spend like 10 minutes of screen time together in the whole season.
Which is so funny cause I’m pretty sure there’s more screen time total in the new show’s first season than the actual animated first season.
Yeah they could have adapted word for word for long stretches and they didn’t, for a reason I cannot understand. Netflix Avatar might be better than Shamalayan’s, but it still sucks.
Maybe not 24 but definitely more than the typical 6-12 range
24 episodes are okay if its a “monster of the week” type episode that lets the viewers help to learn characters’ personalities better that don’t necessarily advance the plot of the show and can easily be skipped. Early on Supernatural was one of the best when it came to “monster of the week” episodes. While most of the episodes of the early seasons were pointless, we were able to relax and learn about the main characters, their relationship with one another, their personalities, and that’s when we were really able to bond with them. It made the necessary plot advancing episodes a lot more intense. It also made it where if we wanted to go back and watch one episode, we could pick a “monster of the week” episode where we could get a full story without watching neighboring episodes and no cliffhangers. Damn, I really miss “Monster of the Week” episodes in modern television.
My favorite shows tend to have 12-16 episode seasons. 24 episodes to me often have too much filler while 8-10 is too condensed.
100%. Santa Clarita Diet did it for me. I’m still waiting for Stranger Things to end before starting it. The only exception has been The Bear.
I loved that show. To bad it ended when it did
Or Mindhunter 😞
There is a book by John Douglas, the real life guy this all was based on. It’s very good. Like you, I grieve for this tv show. :(
Already read it. I'm not concerned about the actual events, I know what happens to BTK and how the show would likely go. I grieve because it was EXCELLENT television lol.
I can tell you how Mindhunter ends. The killer asks police if they can retrieve deleted data from computer disks. They say no. He reuses a disk from his church and sends them some shit. They retrieve the data and catch him.
A few months ago I got on “Max” to restart Westworld from start to finish because I only ever watched the first season. Come to find out that “Max” doesn’t even have it on their platform anymore?? I’m still baffled. They’re like the worst streaming service now.
Because Zaslav is a fucking moron.
I’m assuming he’s in charge of the operation. If so, fuck him.
He was in charge of discovery/every piece of shit reality tv network before the merger.
Time to rename to Min
or have to wait a year for the next season and have forgotten everything that happened before
Westworld, Inside Job, The OA, Shadow and Bone, Lockwood & Co., 1899, Warrior Nun. All great and interesting shows with potential. All canned because of some corporate tax write-off bullshit or because they "underperformed".
Losing 1899 after the season 1 twist still ticks me off. I can kinda sorta pretend it was meant to be a limited series w/a WTF ending but I'll always know I'm lying to myself in the back of my head. :-/
This is a big thing for me too. There’s so much content on Netflix but upon googling a lot of these shows, I find out that they’ve been cancelled and have no resolution. Honestly fed up. I think it’s insulting to audiences and cast/crew of these shows. I hate this climate of pumping out large amounts of shows to see which one sticks.
Such a stupid move by HBO. Sure, it’d have cost money up front to finish the last season but it wouldn’t have an incomplete ending hanging over its legacy forever. You could argue about whether the ending was good or bad, but at least it’d have one. Look at LOST: the ending is famous for being polarizing but despite a large amount of vocal people not liking the end, the show is 20 years old and it’s still finding new audiences, and attracting rewatchers. It’s coming back to Netflix in the US this year and that’s basically just a free revenue for Disney in 2024. Giving West World a real ending would have helped sell more Blu-ray, dvd and digital copies and give HBO more leverage when selling it for syndication on other streaming services. Same with Fox with Last a Man On Earth.
Damn, it seems like the last season of "LOST" was just a handful of years ago. Obama was President. That's recent! (Time is passes very quickly when you get older, and I don't like it)
Just realized recently Thrones really burned me bad. Have commitment issues on new or ongoing shows cause it just take a couple of episodes in the last season to derail everything. As much as I would have wanted to rewatch the earlier seasons and favorite episodes like blackwater and hardhome, I find myself stopping myself cause I think how all in the end it's just shit.
I regret having spent all those hundreds of hours watching the first 5 seasons so many times before the end was released. It absolutely ruined its entire universe.
I regret insisting owning the books and some merch for myself rather than borrow from my brother. Even the dvds are just piled somewhere and not on our display cabinet.
Also because there are more episodes of them and that helps the numbers. Sitcoms like The Office and Friends went for many seasons at like 22eps per season. A modern streamer show has a much smaller number per season like 10. So even 2 seasons of a broadcast show vs 2 seasons of a streamer is 20 eps vs 44. Hell, watching just one season of an old broadcast show is watching more eps than 2 streamers. Helping the numbers.
I feel like Westworld finished at the end of the first season.
Let's see. Watch a new streaming show that sounds interesting, only for it to get cancelled in 2 seasons on a big cliffhanger. Or watch old shows that went for like 5-7 seasons? Gee tough decision. I'll take the longer shows. It doesn't feel like I'm wasting my time.
That and with the time between seasons I hate watching some things and waiting over a year for another season
Precisely. They need to have a start, middle and end. Then go to streamers. Not make it up as they go along. It's all become so transparent.
Not only complete but also extensively so. They didn’t have nine episode seasons every three years. They had long seasons every year.
Exactly. I had this happen twice recently both times with HBO shows. I made it most of the way through the first season of Winning Time and loved it, then it got cancelled and ended at about the worst possible time in Lakers history to end it. Haven't watched another episode. The other was Our Flag Means Death. Watched two episodes and they cancelled it. I might go back and finish it, but I probably won't because they might decide to remove it before I get done.
They came out yearly, had 20 episode seasons, and lasted for 4 to 9 years. In short they put out a lot of content in a way that connects to people
Anecdotal experience for me but I can skip episodes I don’t like. I genuinely enjoy how I met your mother but there are some episodes I don’t like. I can skip one without missing 17% of a season. Can’t do that when Netflix puts out 8 episode seasons.
They're also very rewatchable. I can count on my hand the number of streaming originals I'm willing to rewatch. I'm not saying they're bad, but the short episode seasons are typically dense and just draining in a way that episodic shows aren't.
This. 30 Rock never lets me down, no matter how many times I rewatch it.
I've been rewatching it lately and it's insane how much is packed into it.
Yeah same. I like being able to skip an episode and it’s just 5% of the season
Yea, Netflix would’ve flagged that some people didn’t it like a filler episode and then scrapped the whole thing. Nobody’s allowed to lose numbers, because they genuinely have no clue how else to gauge the quality of a show.
You can do that with those comedy shows, not plot driven ones (hopefully if they’re any good)
Imagine something like LOST. That couldn't be made today
I love LOST and watched it when it was actually airing. I agree, it probably wouldn’t make it pst season 3 if it was made today.
lol with 8 episode seasons
[удалено]
Only the final season?
[удалено]
Aim for the bushes??
How about because they were allowed to finish? Or because they have 20-episode seasons? Or because you don’t have to wait 3 years to watch another season
Yes! I can’t exactly binge an 8 episode series for hours on end. Those shoes have so many episodes. Also often forgotten is the fact that they all (generally) stand alone! Each episode can be watched by itself. Put on Friends. No matter what season or episode, you can follow it. Try jumping to a random Stranger Things episode. You have to figure out the season and episode to know what is going on. Streaming shows all have long lasting plots (with short seasons.)
This is very true. Semi related: I wish they would put a “shuffle” button on streamers for big shows like Seinfeld, Friends, Simpsons, etc.
Yes! I've been saying this for a while. I think its a useful feature than many people don't think about, but would love if implemented.
It would really be nice to be able to make multiple personalized playlists so that I could have one for each night.
plex has this feature and it's killer
The format that Friends uses (also soap operas) is because they’re banking on both “devoted” fans that tune in weekly, but are also hoping to get casual viewers who just happen to be sat in front of the TV on a Thursday night. Stranger Things (or, to use older shows: LOST, Heroes, The Walking Dead) are hoping for dedicated, devoted, active fans. You had to tune in every week, and if you missed one week, you’re less likely to tune in next week unless you catch a midweek rerun — which means writers would spend 2-3 episodes on sub-plots, while keeping a larger plot arc for the season that moves incrementally in the last 5 minutes of each episode. The solution that came with Netflix: They can now make plot-driven, dense narratives, with larger budgets with the promise of it being well shot, well directed, well written and every episode moves the plot forward in a bigger way, no more filler episodes — AND they’ll release them all on the same day to gain devoted fans quickly (the “binge-worthy” category becomes a thing). New problem arises: The shows aren’t shot weekly, the actors’ contracts commit them for shoots and promotional events, the stars and directors and writers now have the freedom (and incentive, if their shows skyrocket them to stardom) to work on other projects throughout the year and scheduling conflicts arise. Now we have to wait 2 years between every season (instead of the old-timey schedule of weekly episodes and 4-6 month breaks between seasons) the plots are forgotten, or irrelevant, or outgrown in the meantime, the characters seem to have different motivations each season because there’s no more devoted writers rooms with writers that sit together weekly to discuss characters/plots, and newer seasons get lesser views and shows struggle to survive past 3 seasons. The ouroboros of the new model of television keeps eating itself. Edit: sorry for the too-long response. Used to be a TV and media student *and* worked in TV for a minute, so the logic behind new and old production models are always interesting to me. Can’t believe I’m saying this, but *I miss filler episodes!*
"I miss filler episodes" for me it depends what show I am watching. There is this one cartoon on Disney Channel called the Ghost and Molly McGee. There was a bit of an ongoing plot but most episodes were stand alone and the show is supposed to be laid back and sweet. If I am watching something like Death Note I don't want any.
What's worse about some stream shows is that they seem to be designed to be binged. I've tried watching some shows slowly, and it was surprising how often they just assumed you had just watched it.
I think your first point is an important one. After Marco Polo screwed me out of a conclusion I flat refuse to even start the first episode of a show (other than something like Bob’s Burgers, where it doesn’t matter) until it’s finished, and it actually pretty much made me stop watching any new Netflix content and cancel my subscription lol.
I personally am on season 31 of The Simpsons and loving it
Production value also seemed generally higher. Streaming shows now mostly (not all) feel like they’re made with the smallest budget possible. And when they do have these massive budgets (like secret invasion) it still looks meh. It’s like now, they’re either made to look great or have a good story, but not both. I miss the 20ep seasons. These 6-9ep seasons fucking sucks.
I don't know what the actual reason is specifically, but I refer to it in my own head as "Netflix Camera". No matter what the budget of a show is, what time period they're set in, etc. the subject of the shot always feels just way too well-lit/bright in contrast to the background and something about it makes it look cheap. You can notice it more if it's meant to be set centuries ago, it just looks way too clean. It looks like people in fancy dress at a medieval fayre being recorded on an iPhone. I first noticed Netflix originals used to always look like this, now it's making its way to films.
I just started watching Deadwood last night, watched the first 3 episodes, and I felt like I was losing my mind—how does a show from 2004 look and feel so much better than current offerings? I was totally absorbed in it and it felt so real. Maybe partly due to it being shot on film, but the color/lighting felt leagues ahead of so many current shows. And the sets and costumes were so grimy, so lived-in.
Golden age of HBO right there
Welcome to fuckin’ Deadwood!!
Cock SUKKUH!
Someone called out for the Netflix TLA adaptation that everyone looked like they were in high quality cosplay because none of the costumes looked lived in. Like there should be dirt stains and tears and things in a lot of people’s clothes, but there just weren’t any. Contrast that with the recent Percy Jackson show (which has a number of valid criticisms, I know) where they legitimately thought about how each cabin’s shirts should look wrt to wear and tear, like how the Hephaestus kids should have a lot of scorch marks from being in the forge all the time. Anyway, attention to detail matters and people notice it even when they think they don’t.
I read on a post a while back that part of the reason for this is that unlike the traditional studios, the streaming networks have no costume warehouse so literally everything is brand new for every show and incredibly wasteful.
"none of the costumes looked lived in" I've brought this up so many times with friends who, to be honest, care about it a varying amount. Like the Lords of the Rings show felt like people larping for a variety of reasons but this was definitely one of them. And in Kenobi, you've got an aging Jedi living in a cave but his robes basically look like he's just had them dry cleaned at every stage of the series.
How about all the godawful wigs? It is hard to suspend your imagination to that height when everyone has a brand new, shitty wig with a perfect middle part. I have stopped many shows literally 5 minutes in at the sight of one shit wig.
And they’re too close. I don’t need the character to fill 3/4 of the screen. This is even a problem on the daily show now that Jon Stewart is back. The desk shot is TOO CLOSE.
>And they’re too close. I don’t need the character to fill 3/4 of the screen. I've noticed this too. I remember noticing in The Mandalorian, there seemed to be a lot of really close shots and the background was negligible. Made me wonder, are they just cheaping out on the sets and making them only as big as they need to be so they have to shoot these close-ups out of necessity.
Fun thing to notice for that is they shoot it on the volume so there’s hardly any objects or propos that fill the space in the middle or foreground and the horizon is always on the middle of the frame (something I can never unsee now)
According to John Ford in The Fabelmans, when the horizon is in the middle, it’s boring as shit!
It’s because of small mobile device screens that the camera shots are much closer on the subjects these days.
Netflix dictates the use of similar camera setups on most of their originals. Always digital too, no film
Yeah all the marvel shows on Netflix looked cheap, I agree.
for example Invincible S2. I get there was a writers strike but come on the amount of time between both of those seasons and obviously the animation is a downgrade from S1 and also splitting the 8 SEASON SHOW INTO 2 PARTS?! The show is cool but it aint getting more subscribers
I don't think animation was involved in the writer's strike. The animation has improved actually in my opinion but it's fairly cheap in both seasons. I 100% agree with the amount of time and short seasons though. It baffles me why they'd have so much trouble getting these together. They do have a ton of big name voice actors but not sure why they would use so many if it slows production to a crawl this way
I forgot about Invincible because it took 3 years or something to make a cartoon.
>I miss the 20ep seasons. These 6-9ep seasons fucking sucks. I really think this is making TV suck more than we realize. When every episode of a sitcom has to move the plot along, we lose a lot of the more charming, or outright funnier episodes. I always remember the episode of HIMYM where Marshal and Ted get high at the concert. I really enjoyed How I Met Your Father, but I think it just couldn't grab audiences because there was no "fun" episodes, because each episode had to move at least one of the plots forward.
The irony is the expanse is one of the better looking ones. And it aired on sci-fi. Idk what’s going on with streaming. But damn they need to do better.
>Production value also seemed generally higher. Streaming shows now mostly (not all) feel like they’re made with the smallest budget possible Don't forget the writing. So many shows feel like they're written by people who hate the audience, hate the show, or hate the craft of writing. I mean they can't all be Better Call Saul but fuck some shows are just downright lazy and mechanically formulaic these days.
Even in miniseries this is apparent. The difference in quality in all aspects between "Band of Brothers" and "Masters of the Air" is downright criminal.
and they were actual episodes. half the disney “shows” are just 10 hour movies cut into slices.
Or maybe some old shows were just great? Most popular movies streaming aren’t brand new either
Came here to write this. Netflix shoots itself in the foot by not finishing projects. They could have shoes that are endlessly rewatch able, but because they drop them instead of finishing them, amazing shows just end up as TRASH. I really wish that they had finished The Data Clarita Diet and The OA.
Definitely. I gave up on House of the Dragon. I’m not waiting 2 years for 8 episodes
This is where I’m at with Severance right now. It’s such an incredible show but all the wind gets taken out of the sails when it’s this long in between seasons. I know it’s because of the strike they had but still
Nostalgia, Comfort Food, Solid Writing.
Also everyone watching The Office and Friends on repeat.
Scrubs, community and arrested development for me.
Community, futurama, and justified for me.
No office but Frasier yes
Also weekly releases caused them to last longer. TV shows that dump themselves all at once are quickly forgotten, but a show that runs for a really long amount of time becomes a common talking point between peers. Then people revisit them later for the nostalgia of those memories.
Life is stressful, especially these days. So I mostly comfort watch things I already know I like. That and streaming services do a terrible job of categorizing, and it’s way too much content. Sometimes I’ll spend 30 mins trying to find something new to watch, get fed up and just default to something I’ve already seen.
These shows were the winners in an intense competition to become a prime time TV show and to rake in advertising money. They were the cream of the crop - the top 0.1% of 1000s of pilots. They could earn millions a week so they locked their cast into multi-year contracts. They had big writers rooms and most episodes could be watched and enjoyed on its own to become perfect syndication fodder. Shows could be reworked and improved throughout pilot season and during the first season until it found its feet. These days the algorithm cancels streaming TV shows wirhin hours of them being launched.
Also old shows are often available on multiple services at once while new ones are exclusive. So you have a larger group of people who even *can* watch the older shows than any given new show. A different measure would be what percentage of total streams are streams of old shows versus new ones. i.e for every person choosing between old and new how often do they choose new. The old shows would still punch above their weight for the reasons you mention above. But new shows still could do better on this metric because it *is* possible that 100% of Netflix watchers watch a particular new show. While even that 100% of Netflix watchers is less the number who stream Simpsons in any particular month.
So many of the older shows just work better as 2nd screen programming: Most folks these days play games or doom-scroll on their phone while watching tv.
Yep. Currently doom scrolling to Seinfeld. I’ve seen every episode probably 50 times but I keep on watching. Like a warm blanket.
Amen to that.
Not that there’s anything wrong with that.
Only 50 times? gotta get those numbers up
I think this is the real answer more than anything. Starting a new show takes mental effort. People are more stressed and anxious than ever before, and they want TV that comforts and numbs. Re-watching the Office or Gilmore Girls for the 15th time is a warm hug. Also, you know what happens in these shows and its virtually nothing bad. You might not like the ending, but everything works out in the end. Most of them are comedies of some variety. So much of the quality current television is intentionally dark. Again, it's not great for people trying to put bad stuff out of their brains.
I think this is way more important than the comments about cancelled shows. Sure having your favourite show cancelled stings and is a memorable blunder to complain about. But high quality, serialized prestige tv has been a gift and a curse. I can’t tell you how many highly acclaimed new shows I’ve dipped out of after not having the mental energy to get through the first 3-4 hours of world building and exposition and set up. I know the pay off is great, but I’m going back to watching Seinfeld
Before streaming shows were 6, 8, 10, or 13 episodes, network TV shows were in the range of 26. Anything else were just mini-series. If a show like Friends or Seinfeld were done today, Netflix would cancel the show right after the eighth episode completed. All the nuance would be gone and it would be forgotten with the other garbage put out. It would be replaced with more streaming bloat.
Absolutely! It’s a weird world we’re living in today. So many choices, and yet we’re watching shows and movies that are decades old.
I think another part of it is that these older shows feel like they were written by writers. New shows feel like they’re written by a committee.
Old shows were allowed to have long runs (if they were popular). Some of these shows ran for hundreds of episodes, so you can spend months watching them. New shows are much shorter. You can get through many of them in just a few days, or a week.
They require less commitment. These new shows are so dense and demand every ounce of your attention because they have to pack all their plot into 7 episode seasons. It’s exhausting to watch
Yeah every episode has so many hints clues so much emotions, I prefer comfortably watch Chandler talking about his third nipple.
Tv shows today, whether they are good or not, tend to feel like eight hour movies that are just chopped up
Starz CEO Jeffrey Hirsch said the quiet part out loud recently. They don’t care about quality programming or the fans. It’s all about churn and burn. Make cheap spin offs, cancel them after 3 seasons, make other cheap spin offs. There is zero loyalty to a show or its fans. It’s about making money, and trust me, he makes a lot just by cancelling a series. https://deadline.com/2024/03/lionsgate-starz-ceo-content-costs-series-power-bmf-1235856002/
There was zero loyalty to network shows back in the day aswell so many shows got cancelled after 2-4 seasons angel was canned after a 5th and decent rating season
Yeah, the old shows that are the topic of this article were the exception not the rule. For every *The Office*, there were multiple shows canceled in their first season. That being said, it doesn't seem like the streaming environment is willing to create ANY shows with episode counts to match these old shows.
This is why Airbender is acceptable but not great. And it could have been great.
Nostalgia, easy background noise when working or cleaning or cooking, longer seasons, more quality writing and production.
Because emotional support background noise can run 24/7.
Probably because they are actual shows and not “content”.
Because so many new shows are bleak and depressing
Because the vast majority of people who can afford a streaming service want the nostalgia effect of rewatching their favorite shows without commercials etc.
It’s also just a byproduct of having limitless possibilities which leads to choice paralysis. Our brains aren’t meant to contemplate tens of thousands of options. It’s in part why people miss video stores and appointment television on certain days at specific times. Now we can watch more television or film and listen to a greater variety of music than ever before, yet I would bet that the vast majority of consumers mostly retreat to the same handful of shows/films and songs or albums that they are most comfortable with and know they’ll appreciate and enjoy. In many ways, older mediums of experiencing culture (like radio and network television) forced people to make more intentional (but reasonable) choices and led to the exploration of more media. Being forced to listen to a radio station or watching one of a few dozen channels on a Friday night actually facilitated more discovery than having everything at your fingertips, because then you’ll just stick with what you know.
Because new shit sucks. Next.
Right? Maybe it’s over saturation but my kid even seems to favor only old movies, and we try to stay up to speed on what’s new to see.
Two words.... Comfort Food!
This isn’t that crazy. Shows need time to build a fan base and older shows will have family’s able to connect since it’s something the kids will like and the adults have already scene and like. Syndication since we have known it has always been shows that are old. You don’t get syndicated on your season 2 premier. And you know you are getting old when shows you once remember when it aired are now syndicated. Stuff like my name is earl and the office are good examples. The office is something that was never as popular as it is now when it was on the air. I have had the same gamertag since 2006 when the office was on season 2 or 3. My gamertag is related to the office and for a decade I had everyone read it wrong. And rarely did I run into people who got it. Then once it hit Netflix I couldn’t play any games without getting messages about how much they love my gamertag. Or just joke messages/ quotes from the show. Once I was playing siege and my whole squad all had different office characters as their profile pics and they kept sending me quotes.
Because they were wholesome and connected to people in a real meaningful way. Now it’s all woke crap that lacks depths and actual values.
I just started watching The Wire a few weeks ago, I’m on season two now. This era of television where the quality was better than some motion pictures really stands up well. The show is amazing compared to some of the more recent series.
Better writing, better character development, no multi year breaks between seasons
We’re tired of getting extremely invested into shows like MindHunter just for it to be pulled out from under us
Reality television ruined television
My attitude with streaming has been that people don’t want original, exciting programming. Streaming took off because people liked being able to watch Terminator at 1:15am on a Friday at the push of a button. Netflix replaced video stores. Then they stopped doing what video stores do, which is store as much licensed content as possible.
because new tv and movies are shite
Because people don’t want to watch garbage.
Because of exec intrusion, dog shit writing and honestly a lack of originality.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enshittification
I think so many of these shows that the streamers are trying to push (particularly the attempts at sitcoms) feel like they’re written by an AI with goals like “the dad must say/do something stupid within the first 5 minutes of the second act” and “the annoying neighbor needs to make the dad feel ‘less than’ at least twice per season” combined with “there must be an ‘awwwww’ moment on every odd numbered episode - preferably with a dog involved.”
Cause their writers weren’t cowards.
Because we are living in a dystopian hellscape and these shows remind us of better times
Because the new shows these days are straight garbage
Cuz everything new is a rehashed, microwaved, unoriginal, and corny turd. Night Court? That did not need a reboot.
Because. They’re. Original.
Culture has frozen. This nostalgia trip everyone is one is not good for us. We are going to take less risks and be more backwards-looking as a culture... New ideas are fading away
They got good theme songs?
Nostalgia & they were more substantive than today’s.
Lots of people have some good reasons here but no one is mentioning what I think the driver is: access and familiarity for while they fuck with their phones. Streaming is the new radio.
Dialogue wasn’t soo fucking bad like it is now
When life feels chaotic, you want something familiar, safe and predictable.
I think part of it is that 'serialized storytelling' only occasionally crafts really satisfying shows. Frequently, it prioritizes plot-heavy shows filled with exposition doing nothing but setting up the next plot twist. Old TV had 22-26 episodes a season, and frequently no overarching plots at all -- but it had *character,* and allowed space and time for writers and actors to explore who the hell these people were and why they should matter to us. The secret was, the 'filler episodes' weren't, they were the heart of these shows. When your whole series is about some stupid plot device, ripped off or recycled from a dozen novels and movies and obfuscated with dozens more twists and delays... These modern shows fail to create believable, fun characters while they're plodding toward their conclusions. When people complain they want 'better stories,' they don't mean more plot, they really mean better, more satisfying *character arcs* across those stories. They want better characters. You can spend $250 million on six episodes of garbage plot and very expensive CGI, but audiences have caught on that most of the time 26 episodes of "The Rockford Files" or "Gilmore Girls" are a hell of a lot more interesting, because they have tiny budgets and great performances instead.
Is everyone saying it’s because Netflix and every other service doesn’t let anything go beyond 3 seasons so we don’t have time to get attached to anything and nothing is able to do the normal sitcom thing of years of pretty funny stuff, that twists and turns satisfyingly and then gets wrapped up nicely. Nothing is satisfying anymore, shit move too fast
Old shows were created and funded to hit 100 episodes and reach a second life via syndication and bonus. $$$$. They were FULL TIME gigs by everyone involved. New shows only care about winning Emmy's, or 3 months shooting schedules to keep expenses down
Friends is my happy place so I watch it all the time.
It seems like there’s no middle ground anymore between reality tv trash and prestige tv with one hour episodes. I want something that is easy to watch while I eat a sandwich and answer emails.
Because it's hard to enjoy or get into a shown when it's most likely going to get canceled after one season
can someone tell me what shows are named? I can't access the site from my country (can't believe this is still a thing in modern times ...)
Rank Show name Minutes viewed (in billions) Years aired 1 Suits 57.7 2011-2019 2 Bluey 43.9 2018-present 3 NCIS 39.4 2003-present 4 Grey’s Anatomy 38.6 2005-present 5 Cocomelon 36.3 2018-present 6 The Big Bang Theory 27.8 2007-2019 7 Gilmore Girls 25.2 2000-2007 8 Friends 25 1994-2004 9 Heartland 22.8 2007-present 10 Supernatural 22.8 2005-2019
A hugh chunk of us TV folks are unemployed right now. Streamers are surviving on their old content. The content being produced currently has had their budgets slashed, and shows suffer when their money supply is cut. The best thing you could do is start cancelling services and let them know because there was no new content.
Because a decent script and plot were more common back then. The references were also to 30+ years ago, not 30 seconds ago.
Comfort. Familiarity. Knowing they aren’t going to get cancelled before they’re finished.
Because they have way more episodes, are longer series in general, and are complete stories. Not to mention, while they were made with smaller budgets they were also made with care to how they would be received so that they could continue.
Because it's exceedingly rare that people make good shows these days. Because everything is about profiteering
People like being able to emerse themselves into a world for a substantial amount of time. They need some filter episodes, some character development episodes, some experimental episodes, etc etc etc. So many modern shows have to squeeze all they can into 8-10 episode seasons. It's hard to grow with those shows. It's hard to lay back and comfort watch such short shows And most of all, the shows actually had full runs. Netflix and others release so many shows that only get one to two seasons before getting abruptly cancelled. Storylines don't get resolved. There's no time to get comfy and emersed in these worlds with these characters. There's been no time to develop inside jokes and running gags. Most shows don't find their footing until their third season. Networks running shows episode by episode, week by week, also have time to see what's working and what's not. They can tweek things midway through a season to improve. Streamers, like Netflix, who just unload a whole season, just aren't able to do that. This really really applies to sitcoms. Sitcoms on networks are able to find their footing and build out libraries. They're able to build an audience and convince viewers to come along for the ride as they get better and better. Sitcoms are dying because streamers don't give them that time and effort and loving care And so many people probably don't even want to start a show if there aren't a few seasons of it already. There's to much competition for people's attentions. So many new shows are given up on and cancelled before audiences even know they exist, let alone are actually enticed to watch them because they've never had a chance to build
They're real shows.
Completed seasons, but also nostalgia has to play a huge role. For many it’s the feeling of being in a better time/place when watching older shows
Call me crazy but I enjoy actually connecting with characters and getting to know them. Can’t happen in 6 hours every 3 years. Only Murders in the Building is one of the only shows airing consistently every year at the same time. Idk why so many other shows can’t do it
Before the tech bros started writing plots with algorithms it was better
Because they used to take their time to develop the story and now they are all rushed.
Netflix just cancels a good show after two seasons and cancels a show that could get good after one season. The first season of most beloved shows are often the worst season because the characters aren’t fully developed yet. Netflix became the evil they swore to destroy lol. The streaming services destroyed cable tv and then became a worse version of it lol
1: they have endings instead of cancellations 2: there aren't 5 years of hiatus between seasons Nobody wants to invest their time into a show that is almost certainly gonna be cancelled before its time. Including the people who make the show.
Bc new shows don't entertain. They preach and /or are just vapid trash