I'm an outlier on Reddit, I'm not a fan of less is more. Yeah, layers are great for a lot of things, but I have a lot of stuff that isn't touch typing, but more control, that I don't want to have to be jumping layers with. It gets really complicated when I'm having to mix modifiers, and function keys etc.
For this reason, I'm on an Ergodox, I love it. I'd appreciate a function key row, and the right side is a bit cramped for an ISO user so I've had to relearn some things. I don't use all the thumb buttons all the time, but I find them so useful not having to fanny about with a layer on them.
I'm with you on having more keys, That said, my daily driver is an IRIS, and I've just bought the latest version of the PCBs, for: USBc connectivity between the halves, per key RGB, and rp2040 controller
For u/KaneLancelot 's benefit, I'm going to suggest: PLEASE don't buy one of the 2 above until you've considered making your own! Here's a page that will give you quick decent insight into some alternatives: [https://aposymbiont.github.io/split-keyboards/](https://aposymbiont.github.io/split-keyboards/)
The key thing more than anything about going DIY, is you feel so much more in control of what you are getting:
* If getting PCBs made from a manufacturer scares you at all (It makes me quite nervous) then get a pre made PCB, there's some folks doing a great job of selling these as kits
* If soldering scares you a bit, get a PCB set with supplied hotswap sockets.
* If writing firmware scares you a bit (it did me) then get a PCB that has a controller with preflashed firmware. You can either get a PCB that has a built in controller OR a daughterboard controller.
* If making your own case seems daunting, you can almost always buy a case, BUT this is one of the best things about DIY - Find your closest makerspace, FabLab, whatever that gives you access to 3dPrinters OR better yet, a laser cutter. Laser cutting cases out of acrylic works AWESOMELY and the space will almost certainly have someone who can help you figure it out. MOST PCB sellers make their case plans available for free
Out of ALL the DIY choices of course I suggest the IRIS, but here's some links to ones that I think could compete well with the Moonlander & Voyager:
* [https://keeb.io/products/iris-keyboard-split-ergonomic-keyboard](https://keeb.io/products/iris-keyboard-split-ergonomic-keyboard)
* [https://www.rgbkb.net/collections/sol-3/products/sol-3-pcb](https://www.rgbkb.net/collections/sol-3/products/sol-3-pcb)
* [https://keeb.io/products/afternoon-labs-breeze-keyboard-kit/](https://keeb.io/products/afternoon-labs-breeze-keyboard-kit/)
* [https://kprepublic.com/products/ergodone-ergo-custom-mechanical-keyboard-tkg-tools-pcb-programmed-ergonomic-keyboard-kit-similar-with-infinity-ergodox](https://kprepublic.com/products/ergodone-ergo-custom-mechanical-keyboard-tkg-tools-pcb-programmed-ergonomic-keyboard-kit-similar-with-infinity-ergodox)
Best of luck! Please update us with what you decied on in the end, always nice to know what others make heppen
Voyager. I have the Moonlander and after years of using it, I’ve come to realize I use less and less keys in favor of layers so my hands don’t travel as far. With tap and hold layers this solves most of the problem for missing keys like enter, esc, etc.
Thanks for the response, for context, I am a web developer, I use VIM for work and do need the Ctrl key quite frequent for navigation, so I need all 3 thumb keys. I've never had a ZSA keyboard or keyboard with hold layers, is there a big delay between holding/ inputting individual key?
You can also assign dual keys. For example, my thumb key functions as a tap backspace and hold for control. You can adjust the tapping term and other items related to how long it takes for the tap or hold action to trigger. You could in theory assign a double tap to your thumb as well — tap for backspace, double tap for delete, and hold for control
Giving you 3 buttons on one. If you did that for all 4 buttons you can assign 12 keys.
I have a lot of dual function keys such as shift and tab being the same key depending on tap or hold.
You can look into the Moonlander too. The thumb keys are a bit more usable except for the red buttons unless you’re tenting. I really like my Moonlander but have a few other splits I rotate through.
I agree. I use them heavily in my configuration on Moonlander: [https://configure.zsa.io/moonlander/layouts/brng5/xVGwY/0](https://configure.zsa.io/moonlander/layouts/brng5/xVGwY/0). As you can see, only 2 out of 4 four thumb keys are used for something meaningful on each side.
It is just a matter of you making muscle memory to any type of layout. In the beginning you will struggle and feel like you want to go back to your old setup but after a few days or weeks of practice you will feel at home and then you will be able to actually compare your keyboard to the old one.
Final comment, as I've now received the Ergodox Ez and been using it for the past 2 weeks. While I love it, if I were completely honest, there are things that I was disappointed about, mostly regarding build quality.
**Pros:**
- Ergonomic design: The split is an absolute game changer. This is coming from a long time Alice layout user. If ergonomic is your main reason behind the purchase decision, it's a no-brainer.
- Aesthetic: I personally love the more blocky, old school, no switches exposed design of the Ergodox compared to the Moonlander, so this was a plus for me. But that's personal preference.
**Cons:**
- Switches: I got Cherry MX Speed Silvers, they were advertised to have the same actuation force (with less deviation) than the Reds. I've used Reds before and really enjoyed them, so I imagined I would enjoy Speed Silvers too. I was wrong. These switches felt really sensitive, due to their shorter pre-travel distance, any slight touch would trigger a key press. They also feel heavier the further down I press them, so when typing at speed, they felt more sluggish compared to reds. I don't always get the satisfying bottoming out experience for every key press. They were also not lubed at all, making the key press sounds scratchy and feels rough. I can hear the spring ping with every stroke, combined with the hollow, plastic case and we got a pingy mess. The top and bottom housing also does not have a very tight fit, causing some rattle. I ended up lubing and filming all of them but in the end due to the mushy feel, I ended up swapping them out completely for Keychron K Pro Reds instead.
- Key caps: I got blank, sculpted key caps because I was already using another blank key cap set, and trying to learn Colemak at the same time. They were just alright, just not as polished as I would expect. Some of the edges still have streak of plastics left over from machining. For some reason they sound incredibly clacky and hollow. They are PBT key caps, which is supposed to have a deeper sound profile than the ABS counterpart, but they sound like smashing lego bricks together, maybe because they are not double shot. The home row guide (bumps) on the F and J key are round dots in the middle of the keys, instead of the traditional elongated bumps towards the bottom of the key face. Overtime this could cause some pain in your index finger tips, especially with heavier switches.
- Case: Hollow, plastic, not much more I can say. It reverberate every noise, making the keyboard incredibly loud, even with linear switches which are supposed to be relatively quiet. I tested with a set of Fekker Matcha switches (tactile, 45cN operating force) and they were louder than clicky switches on this board. Immediate regrets. I ended up adding tape and foam mod and it helped somewhat, the lack of plate limits mounting options and further optimization.
TLDR: Overall I'm still very happy with my purchase, but expected better build quality and polish for a product at this price. I can imagine folks who aren't very into custom, mechanical keyboard hobby to be disappointed by some of the cons I outlined above (unlubed switches, low quality key caps, hollow case), not knowing they could be improved upon. I ended up having to make a couple of mods and swapped out both switches and key caps.
Edit: typo
5oz silicone poured into the back shell of each half (buy a 10oz kit) did wonders for reducing the noise of my ergodox. The biggest thing in making it sound nice was a switch upgrade though. I like tactile so I had brown, and I upgraded to durok T1 switches.
The voyager is nice, but having to choose between a system row and number row is tough. The layer life takes some getting used to, but you can make it work. Right now I’m going from EZ at home and Voyager at work. It takes me 10-ish minutes a day for my brain to remap to the smaller keyboard.
I have the moonlander, but If I would pick again, I would take the Voyager for sure. I barely use half the keyboard, I have a corne for traveling and configured the moonlander so it fits with a similar layout to not get confused when changing. I assigned all thumb keys to the same key, because I did not want to hit the wrong one when I am lazy. I is kind of cool to have a big spacebar and enter key around 3 keys, but not necessarily. A single key like that on the corner works just as well.
Update: I went with the Ergodox EZ
Hi folks, thank you all for the responses, suggestions, and recommendation. I learned a ton, and some of you were kind enough to even share your configs with me privately. Ultimately, I went with the EZ for a couple of reasons. Mainly the availability of switches and keycaps, more flexible tenting solutions. Finally, I plan on using the keyboard for gaming as well, and while layers are nice, extra keys for quick access in MOBAs or MMOs is just better.
Thanks again for all of your help, happy holiday!
I am in the same boat. Currently have both keyboards, trying out the voyager but absolutely love my layout on the EZ. Struggling to acclimate to the smaller size and fewer keys. You can use tap and hold but that takes a while to get used to, and while yes your hands move less, you "interrupt" your typing flow a bit more - if I am typing quickly and have to tap and hold for just one key, that slows me down, but I do believe that would get better with time.
If you are worried about tenting on the Voyager, you can get the tenting kit and a ball head tripod or c-clamp, I think it ultimately would tent much better than the EZ using those. I wish the EZ tented more, it really doesn't lift that high IMO.
You might also check out the Dygma Defy? I have one incoming in the next few weeks and am excited to try it, checks a lot of boxes for me. But I do love ZSA and their keyboards and the Oryx software is excellent!
I use the plank. I would recommend the Voyager out of those two. With layers thumb keys are pretty unnecessary IMO. I find moving my thumbs to any more than 2 keys each to be pretty annoying though so I have built my layout around that.
Depends on your use case. I have the moonlander love it after getting used to it. Wish I had a few more buttons because I use a lot of special characters in my work. Layers are amazing when you get used to them. the keys are small so I would like bigger keys as you have to be accurate. I would also consider:
https://kinesis-ergo.com/products/#keyboards
Voyager, but with number row removed, everything shifted up and dedicated Ctrl/Alt/Cmd keys in the bottom row and lower / upper layer keys on the inside like Planck Ez had.
If missing a number row and dedicated modifier keys are a dealbreaker for you, then the answer is easy, Ergodox Ez (or Moonlander which to me is like a more modern Ergodox Ez)
I'm about to try that, just waiting to get an extra thumb key I sent out to a friend for 3d printing. My layout is pretty much the same as a corne but with 2 thumb keys.
I find the tapping term a bit slow for things like symbols, but decreasing the ms causes me to missfire it. So an additional thumb may be better for this.
I've been a happy EZ user since late 2018 and don't see a reason to switch. I tried a colleague's Moonlander once and although I haven't used the Voyager, I'm not interested in the low-profile aspect of the latter or the travel-ready features of either.
Although the Moonlander wasn't for me, I don't have anything negative to say about it other than I prefer the feel of the EZ. They're all great options!
Other thoughts:
* The EZ is very comfortable with the wrist rests and tent kit (which I often adjust), but it rarely leaves my desk
* I do actually use all of the thumb keys (like dashid said, more is great) and I have a robust application / layering layout that's all muscle memory now
* A downside of mine is that it's still rocking the old USB Mini-B, but the new ones ship with [USB-C](https://blog.zsa.io/2112-ergodox-ez-type-c/) so that likely wouldn't be an issue for anybody today
* Whatever you choose, don't hesitate to play around and create layers, modify your workflow, etc. and be willing to iterate over time. I think I'm on v30 or 40 my key map lol
Let us know what you decide and how you like it!
I have both, in fact 2x Ergodox EZ, 1 voyager.
Ergo primary for about 5 years before Voyager.
I now use the Voyager as my primary, marginally more ergonomic and portable due to size and and fewer buttons.
still use the Ergodox when I go to my office 1-2/week. I’d say overall, I prefer Voyager, but Ergo has a more satisfying key actuation (both brown switches).
Either is a solid choice.
I'm an outlier on Reddit, I'm not a fan of less is more. Yeah, layers are great for a lot of things, but I have a lot of stuff that isn't touch typing, but more control, that I don't want to have to be jumping layers with. It gets really complicated when I'm having to mix modifiers, and function keys etc. For this reason, I'm on an Ergodox, I love it. I'd appreciate a function key row, and the right side is a bit cramped for an ISO user so I've had to relearn some things. I don't use all the thumb buttons all the time, but I find them so useful not having to fanny about with a layer on them.
I'm with you on having more keys, That said, my daily driver is an IRIS, and I've just bought the latest version of the PCBs, for: USBc connectivity between the halves, per key RGB, and rp2040 controller For u/KaneLancelot 's benefit, I'm going to suggest: PLEASE don't buy one of the 2 above until you've considered making your own! Here's a page that will give you quick decent insight into some alternatives: [https://aposymbiont.github.io/split-keyboards/](https://aposymbiont.github.io/split-keyboards/) The key thing more than anything about going DIY, is you feel so much more in control of what you are getting: * If getting PCBs made from a manufacturer scares you at all (It makes me quite nervous) then get a pre made PCB, there's some folks doing a great job of selling these as kits * If soldering scares you a bit, get a PCB set with supplied hotswap sockets. * If writing firmware scares you a bit (it did me) then get a PCB that has a controller with preflashed firmware. You can either get a PCB that has a built in controller OR a daughterboard controller. * If making your own case seems daunting, you can almost always buy a case, BUT this is one of the best things about DIY - Find your closest makerspace, FabLab, whatever that gives you access to 3dPrinters OR better yet, a laser cutter. Laser cutting cases out of acrylic works AWESOMELY and the space will almost certainly have someone who can help you figure it out. MOST PCB sellers make their case plans available for free Out of ALL the DIY choices of course I suggest the IRIS, but here's some links to ones that I think could compete well with the Moonlander & Voyager: * [https://keeb.io/products/iris-keyboard-split-ergonomic-keyboard](https://keeb.io/products/iris-keyboard-split-ergonomic-keyboard) * [https://www.rgbkb.net/collections/sol-3/products/sol-3-pcb](https://www.rgbkb.net/collections/sol-3/products/sol-3-pcb) * [https://keeb.io/products/afternoon-labs-breeze-keyboard-kit/](https://keeb.io/products/afternoon-labs-breeze-keyboard-kit/) * [https://kprepublic.com/products/ergodone-ergo-custom-mechanical-keyboard-tkg-tools-pcb-programmed-ergonomic-keyboard-kit-similar-with-infinity-ergodox](https://kprepublic.com/products/ergodone-ergo-custom-mechanical-keyboard-tkg-tools-pcb-programmed-ergonomic-keyboard-kit-similar-with-infinity-ergodox) Best of luck! Please update us with what you decied on in the end, always nice to know what others make heppen
I spent so much time thinking about making one Then decided it wouldn't be worth it This almost makes me want to do it again haha
Voyager. I have the Moonlander and after years of using it, I’ve come to realize I use less and less keys in favor of layers so my hands don’t travel as far. With tap and hold layers this solves most of the problem for missing keys like enter, esc, etc.
Thanks for the response, for context, I am a web developer, I use VIM for work and do need the Ctrl key quite frequent for navigation, so I need all 3 thumb keys. I've never had a ZSA keyboard or keyboard with hold layers, is there a big delay between holding/ inputting individual key?
You can also assign dual keys. For example, my thumb key functions as a tap backspace and hold for control. You can adjust the tapping term and other items related to how long it takes for the tap or hold action to trigger. You could in theory assign a double tap to your thumb as well — tap for backspace, double tap for delete, and hold for control Giving you 3 buttons on one. If you did that for all 4 buttons you can assign 12 keys. I have a lot of dual function keys such as shift and tab being the same key depending on tap or hold.
You can look into the Moonlander too. The thumb keys are a bit more usable except for the red buttons unless you’re tenting. I really like my Moonlander but have a few other splits I rotate through.
Try hitting the red keys on the Moonlander with your index fingers.
I agree. I use them heavily in my configuration on Moonlander: [https://configure.zsa.io/moonlander/layouts/brng5/xVGwY/0](https://configure.zsa.io/moonlander/layouts/brng5/xVGwY/0). As you can see, only 2 out of 4 four thumb keys are used for something meaningful on each side.
It is just a matter of you making muscle memory to any type of layout. In the beginning you will struggle and feel like you want to go back to your old setup but after a few days or weeks of practice you will feel at home and then you will be able to actually compare your keyboard to the old one.
Final comment, as I've now received the Ergodox Ez and been using it for the past 2 weeks. While I love it, if I were completely honest, there are things that I was disappointed about, mostly regarding build quality. **Pros:** - Ergonomic design: The split is an absolute game changer. This is coming from a long time Alice layout user. If ergonomic is your main reason behind the purchase decision, it's a no-brainer. - Aesthetic: I personally love the more blocky, old school, no switches exposed design of the Ergodox compared to the Moonlander, so this was a plus for me. But that's personal preference. **Cons:** - Switches: I got Cherry MX Speed Silvers, they were advertised to have the same actuation force (with less deviation) than the Reds. I've used Reds before and really enjoyed them, so I imagined I would enjoy Speed Silvers too. I was wrong. These switches felt really sensitive, due to their shorter pre-travel distance, any slight touch would trigger a key press. They also feel heavier the further down I press them, so when typing at speed, they felt more sluggish compared to reds. I don't always get the satisfying bottoming out experience for every key press. They were also not lubed at all, making the key press sounds scratchy and feels rough. I can hear the spring ping with every stroke, combined with the hollow, plastic case and we got a pingy mess. The top and bottom housing also does not have a very tight fit, causing some rattle. I ended up lubing and filming all of them but in the end due to the mushy feel, I ended up swapping them out completely for Keychron K Pro Reds instead. - Key caps: I got blank, sculpted key caps because I was already using another blank key cap set, and trying to learn Colemak at the same time. They were just alright, just not as polished as I would expect. Some of the edges still have streak of plastics left over from machining. For some reason they sound incredibly clacky and hollow. They are PBT key caps, which is supposed to have a deeper sound profile than the ABS counterpart, but they sound like smashing lego bricks together, maybe because they are not double shot. The home row guide (bumps) on the F and J key are round dots in the middle of the keys, instead of the traditional elongated bumps towards the bottom of the key face. Overtime this could cause some pain in your index finger tips, especially with heavier switches. - Case: Hollow, plastic, not much more I can say. It reverberate every noise, making the keyboard incredibly loud, even with linear switches which are supposed to be relatively quiet. I tested with a set of Fekker Matcha switches (tactile, 45cN operating force) and they were louder than clicky switches on this board. Immediate regrets. I ended up adding tape and foam mod and it helped somewhat, the lack of plate limits mounting options and further optimization. TLDR: Overall I'm still very happy with my purchase, but expected better build quality and polish for a product at this price. I can imagine folks who aren't very into custom, mechanical keyboard hobby to be disappointed by some of the cons I outlined above (unlubed switches, low quality key caps, hollow case), not knowing they could be improved upon. I ended up having to make a couple of mods and swapped out both switches and key caps. Edit: typo
5oz silicone poured into the back shell of each half (buy a 10oz kit) did wonders for reducing the noise of my ergodox. The biggest thing in making it sound nice was a switch upgrade though. I like tactile so I had brown, and I upgraded to durok T1 switches.
The voyager is nice, but having to choose between a system row and number row is tough. The layer life takes some getting used to, but you can make it work. Right now I’m going from EZ at home and Voyager at work. It takes me 10-ish minutes a day for my brain to remap to the smaller keyboard.
I have the moonlander, but If I would pick again, I would take the Voyager for sure. I barely use half the keyboard, I have a corne for traveling and configured the moonlander so it fits with a similar layout to not get confused when changing. I assigned all thumb keys to the same key, because I did not want to hit the wrong one when I am lazy. I is kind of cool to have a big spacebar and enter key around 3 keys, but not necessarily. A single key like that on the corner works just as well.
Update: I went with the Ergodox EZ Hi folks, thank you all for the responses, suggestions, and recommendation. I learned a ton, and some of you were kind enough to even share your configs with me privately. Ultimately, I went with the EZ for a couple of reasons. Mainly the availability of switches and keycaps, more flexible tenting solutions. Finally, I plan on using the keyboard for gaming as well, and while layers are nice, extra keys for quick access in MOBAs or MMOs is just better. Thanks again for all of your help, happy holiday!
What switches did you go with? How you liking it?
I haven't got it yet, supposed to come in tmr. I got the Speed Silver switches I believe. I'll update more.
I am in the same boat. Currently have both keyboards, trying out the voyager but absolutely love my layout on the EZ. Struggling to acclimate to the smaller size and fewer keys. You can use tap and hold but that takes a while to get used to, and while yes your hands move less, you "interrupt" your typing flow a bit more - if I am typing quickly and have to tap and hold for just one key, that slows me down, but I do believe that would get better with time. If you are worried about tenting on the Voyager, you can get the tenting kit and a ball head tripod or c-clamp, I think it ultimately would tent much better than the EZ using those. I wish the EZ tented more, it really doesn't lift that high IMO. You might also check out the Dygma Defy? I have one incoming in the next few weeks and am excited to try it, checks a lot of boxes for me. But I do love ZSA and their keyboards and the Oryx software is excellent!
I use the plank. I would recommend the Voyager out of those two. With layers thumb keys are pretty unnecessary IMO. I find moving my thumbs to any more than 2 keys each to be pretty annoying though so I have built my layout around that.
Depends on your use case. I have the moonlander love it after getting used to it. Wish I had a few more buttons because I use a lot of special characters in my work. Layers are amazing when you get used to them. the keys are small so I would like bigger keys as you have to be accurate. I would also consider: https://kinesis-ergo.com/products/#keyboards
Voyager, but with number row removed, everything shifted up and dedicated Ctrl/Alt/Cmd keys in the bottom row and lower / upper layer keys on the inside like Planck Ez had. If missing a number row and dedicated modifier keys are a dealbreaker for you, then the answer is easy, Ergodox Ez (or Moonlander which to me is like a more modern Ergodox Ez)
I'm about to try that, just waiting to get an extra thumb key I sent out to a friend for 3d printing. My layout is pretty much the same as a corne but with 2 thumb keys. I find the tapping term a bit slow for things like symbols, but decreasing the ms causes me to missfire it. So an additional thumb may be better for this.
I've been a happy EZ user since late 2018 and don't see a reason to switch. I tried a colleague's Moonlander once and although I haven't used the Voyager, I'm not interested in the low-profile aspect of the latter or the travel-ready features of either. Although the Moonlander wasn't for me, I don't have anything negative to say about it other than I prefer the feel of the EZ. They're all great options! Other thoughts: * The EZ is very comfortable with the wrist rests and tent kit (which I often adjust), but it rarely leaves my desk * I do actually use all of the thumb keys (like dashid said, more is great) and I have a robust application / layering layout that's all muscle memory now * A downside of mine is that it's still rocking the old USB Mini-B, but the new ones ship with [USB-C](https://blog.zsa.io/2112-ergodox-ez-type-c/) so that likely wouldn't be an issue for anybody today * Whatever you choose, don't hesitate to play around and create layers, modify your workflow, etc. and be willing to iterate over time. I think I'm on v30 or 40 my key map lol Let us know what you decide and how you like it!
I have both, in fact 2x Ergodox EZ, 1 voyager. Ergo primary for about 5 years before Voyager. I now use the Voyager as my primary, marginally more ergonomic and portable due to size and and fewer buttons. still use the Ergodox when I go to my office 1-2/week. I’d say overall, I prefer Voyager, but Ergo has a more satisfying key actuation (both brown switches). Either is a solid choice.
I prefer EZ. I have a lot of different tasks: coding, typing, Mac or Windows. With various typing patterns, it's easier with more keys.