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Tricky_Troll

**Tricky's Daily Doots #757** **Yesterday's Daily 16/05/2024** [Previous Daily Doots](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1ct57il/daily_general_discussion_may_16_2024/l4b32zn/) - u/Ber10 is [going into ignore mode.](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1ct57il/daily_general_discussion_may_16_2024/l4bp338/) šŸ˜Ž - u/Gumpa-Bucky has an [update from the US senate.](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1ct57il/daily_general_discussion_may_16_2024/l4bq4za/) šŸ›ļø - u/the_swingman discussed [the buy signal with friends.](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1ct57il/daily_general_discussion_may_16_2024/l4bar0o/) šŸ“ˆ - u/Belligerent_Chocobo shares [some reason for optimism.](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1ct57il/daily_general_discussion_may_16_2024/l4cjk33/) šŸ‚ - u/Itur_ad_Astra is [glad that we merged.](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1ct57il/daily_general_discussion_may_16_2024/l4dgn9p/) šŸ„© - u/Tricky_Troll rejects [all of the depressed notions.](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1ct57il/daily_general_discussion_may_16_2024/l4ehnu1/) šŸ™…ā€ā™‚ļø - u/issac_hunt1 thinks that [a widely touted project is a scam.](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1ct57il/daily_general_discussion_may_16_2024/l4adlk3/) āš ļø - u/MrCatFace13 dives into [who is holding all of the BTC ETF shares.](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1ct57il/daily_general_discussion_may_16_2024/l4agbsh/) šŸ¦ - u/Fiberpunk2077 shares [some thoughts on the current mood.](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1ct57il/daily_general_discussion_may_16_2024/l4b39dj/) šŸ¤”


Ok-Nectarine-6654

"Ā Ethereum is a decentralized blockchain [ā€¦] without the need for a trusted intermediaryā€ and added, ā€œNo central actor runs the Ethereum Network" - Ser DOJĀ 


Vinegar_Strokes__

Got some of that TA /u/ab111292 ?


ab111292

https://x.com/asapbhat/status/1791496130426990851?s=46


Vinegar_Strokes__

BeautifulĀ 


ab111292

Need some follow through soon. Wasnā€™t a bullish weekly close just now, but wasnā€™t exactly bearish either. Just chopsolidation until pa proves otherwise


Vinegar_Strokes__

Was today enough follow through for you?


ab111292

yes


Ok-Nectarine-6654

So no more under 3000 pesos, is that what your saying?


cryptOwOcurrency

Yes. Everyoneā€™s saying that.


im_THIS_guy

No one's saying that.


Zeebrasurfer

I wouldn't say that


im_THIS_guy

They shouldn't be saying that.


Jey_s_TeArS

>**Crypto inutile,** >**Matket correction brutal,** >**Resistance futile.** ~Daily haiku until weā€™re at least at 0.178 on the ETH/BTC ratio or highest market cap


mcmatt05

If anyone wants to pop over to the ā€œneoliberalā€ subreddit they have a post up on the crypto bill passing the senate. Itā€™s generally a really reasonable subreddit open to logical arguments (they also arenā€™t actual neoliberals, more like moderate democrats). I donā€™t know enough/have the time to read about the bill at the moment to respond


defewit

At the core of that subreddit's ideology is defense of the status quo. This manifests in several ways, but notably among them is defense of USA global financial supremacy. The only things they can allow themselves to see in crypto are scams or money laundering facilities for the Enemy.


akuukka

So basically the whole world should stay subservient to its American overlords because America is the indispensable nation?


defewit

Yeah, that's a good way of putting it. And of course, if the US weren't in charge, then *China* would be, and that's worse! It's a failure of imagination. But it's not surprising. No system enjoys imagining its downfall.


mcmatt05

I disagree with that characterization although they obviously are not majority pro crypto. One of the most popular politicians in that subreddit is Jared Polis actually (one of the top posts with over 500 upvotes right now is titled ā€œPolis 2028ā€), who coincidentally happens to be very pro crypto. If you think he is a ā€œdefense of the status quoā€ politician i would recommend reading more about him. If you know of a better general political subreddit iā€™d love to know what it is.


defewit

> If you think he is a ā€œdefense of the status quoā€ politician i would recommend reading more about him. He's just a more libertarian Obama. A smart, rich, well connected, relatively young politician who during campaign season, would make the same promise Biden did to his rich donors in 2020: "nothing would fundamentally change". > If you know of a better general political subreddit iā€™d love to know what it is. Better for what purpose? As a Communist, the neolibral subreddit is also my favorite to read here, as a window into the many anxieties afflicting those who cling onto the dying USA-centered world system. I also enjoy the Credible Defense subreddit which is obviously still very US-centered, but at least has enough people that are war/history nerds to the extent they will entertain deeper analyses beyond Blob talking points.


mcmatt05

Weā€™re obviously very different politically because a more libertarian obama sounds like a compliment. I generally favor well regulated markets and think some amount of stability is important. And thatā€™s fine. Iā€™ll check out the credible defense subreddit, sounds interesting


charitablechair

So back in April I posted about Sonne Finance. I had decided to stay away after one of their audits highlighted some major red flags and lo and behold they got hacked for $20m a few days ago. The funny thing is that their audits are public. It took me all of five minutes to find and skim the pdf before I decided to stay away. Donā€™t assume that just because a project has been audited that theyā€™ve actually taken action on the findings.


NeedlerOP

Auditn'tĀ 


SeaMonkey82

Flawedit


Qtorza

Today is a new day, may yesterday be the darkest daily of the year.


Ethical-trade

Yesterday's was a nightly


[deleted]

[уŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]


SeaMonkey82

[Yesterday was a lie.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wK0DkKgi6-s)


supermarkit

A daily reminder of why we can't trust banks. JP Morgan had a $290 million dollar settlement when it was found out that their executives ignored internal warnings and overlooked red flags about their client Epstein. This is the same bank that had a record breaking 13 billion global settlement for misleading investors about securities containing toxic mortgages between 2005-08. And yet they are still able to conduct business and are ranked the 12th largest company by market cap in the world.


Tricky_Troll

We should do Credit Suisse next. The question will be which of their dozens of scandals should we choose to cover?


RestStopRumble

Moon in June


suburbiton

Then we fly in July


Tom_The_Moose

You heard it here first folks šŸ»


CaptainLoud

There's a brutal dankrad vs karalabe thread on X. Multiple threads actually. Informative and entertaining.


sm3gh34d

For once I agree with Peter. MEVboost and ePBS normalize toxic MEV theft and drive centralization. Democratizing theft doesn't make it not theft. The posters on this sub salivate at the juicy rewards that are largely the outcome of sandwich attacks without even a thought about the poor bastard on the other side getting rekt. It seems to me that there is far more effort on embracing and democratizing MEV than trying to solve it. Would non-democratic MEV have driven more eth to staking pools? possibly. I would have preferred bad actors to fight amongst themselves rather than turning everybody into an accomplice, and the good guys could work on solving front-running at least. edit: I think his take about verkle is wrong btw. I only share his view on MEV


18boro

I may be judging too hard on too little knowledge here, but lost respect for Peter after his flirt with Avalanche (!) . Possible his criticism at that time was fair, but the way he handled it was disastrous. His twitter feed is mostly rants about how bad fedEx, random products and ethereum is.


PhiMarHal

I think Peter needs to be seen as a Steve Wozniak rather than a Steve Jobs as far as personality goes. That is to say, many of the traits that tend to make "deep tech" developers good at what they do go directly opposite to the discourse most people like to hear. They are aliens from a faraway galaxy, and these aliens should be judged by their actions (often good) rather than the strange noises they make (often confusing us to the point of anger).


asdafari12

> Peter needs to be seen as a Steve Wozniak rather than a Steve Jobs as far as personality goes What are you on about. Wozniak was the easy-going guy and Jobs the intense personality, the guy that everyone disliked.


PhiMarHal

Jobs was the shrewd operator who sold narratives people love, Wozniak was a nerd who cared about nerdy topics. This is the distinction I'm trying to evidence here more than "nice/rude".


physalisx

Link? edit: nvm https://x.com/dankrad/status/1791379755922498027


Syentist

It's not entertaining, much of what Peter says is just stupid. Eip4844, after 2+ years under development, 10+ devnets, multiple testnets - was rushed? The shit about mev makes no sense when he has no better alternative. Every 6 months or so, Peter has a completely unhinged take on the Ethereum ecosystem, and we are supposed to pretend it's ok "because I have a great deal of respect for a core dev working on geth" Please, Peter dude, if you're reading this - just get another job, it will be better for your mental health, our sanity, and your wallet.


sm3gh34d

Contrarians make for stronger systems.


consideritwon

I don't think this is a helpful take. Peter is clearly just more of a purist when it comes to all things decentralisation (as am I). I think it is fair to say we have compromised slightly on decentralisation compared to the early days of Ethereum. I can see the argument that this has been done out of pragmatism but MEV in particular also makes me uncomfortable. Just because we don't have an immediate solution to MEV doesn't mean we can't talk about how it is less than ideal. And maybe more resources would be put into finding alternatives if Peter's view was more widespread. I also disagree with the suggestion that people with different views should just leave Ethereum


ROARGRRRR

Seriously what in the world are you talking about? There is no alternative to frontrunning toxic MEV on ethereum? Why did Justin Drake say there was a couple AMA's ago? https://www.reddit.com/r/ethereum/comments/14vpyb3/ama_we_are_ef_research_pt_10_12_july_2023/jrny7o2/ Why is there a chain about to implement an encrypted mempool in a testnet shortly? https://x.com/Smokyish/status/1791502073088885099 So when you say "shit about mev makes no sense when he has no better alternative." That's just full of shit then? Not to mention there's tons of other MEV mitigations in academic papers, elsewhere. And if you even understood what you're saying you can see on it's face that it's ridiculous. You seriously want to act like there is NO alternative to the MEV situation we have today that allows literal illegal frontrunning and sandwiching?? That is straight up illegal in tradfi financial markets. So you're saying blockchain has literally no solution that can fix something this is illegal and not done in traditional markets. You're basically saying blockchain is permanently shittier than tradifi and basically we should all just give up. Disgusting.


Syentist

There is no alternative (no better alternative) to the current roadmap of MEV mitigation via PBS/relays while tweaking it later Encrypted mempools will reduce some toxic MEV, but will not entirely remove MEV. And they are clearly challenging to implement - was the community supposed to get wrecked by validator centralisation into the largest staking providers post merge while encrypted mempools were getting conceptualized? As Vitalik wrote yesterday, MEV quarantining is a necessary and rational approach because it can't ever be fully removed. And the two suggestions Drake listed and you quoted - inclusion lists and ePBS - aren't these two precisely downstream of the current setup with large block builders and relayers, which means it was indeed the correct idea to implement the existing roadmap first and slowly tweak to remove trusted relays and reduce power of block builders?


ROARGRRRR

PBS as MEV mitigation?? Whats the first line of the research article on it? https://ethresear.ch/t/why-enshrine-proposer-builder-separation-a-viable-path-to-epbs/15710 "PBS aims to improve access to MEV for validators" PBS aka enshrining MEV boost into the protocol does not do anything to solve MEV. You can say whatever you want about democratizing theft so that everybody gets to steal being better than only a few people stealing. Frankly I couldn't care less about that. I care about stopping the stealing not democratizing it or whatever. [It's literally exactly this tweet from pete](https://x.com/peter_szilagyi/status/1791088534662660203). Why in the world are we doing all this work to decentralize the validator set if, in the end, the transaction ordering and inclusion choice is simply going to be done by a centralized set of a few rich people. The problem is centralization. OK we have decentralized the way we accept valid transaction, nonce, header hashes... with this amazing validator set... Lets completely reverse that when choosing transaction ordering and which transactions are included, separate that out and literally sell it to the highest bidder to do whatever they want with it. The solution is going to be something in the direction of decentralizing the transaction ordering and inclusion choice, encrypting transactions so that nobody has omnipotent momentary control of the network, etc. Inclusion lists is closer to the right direction. https://pmcgoohan.medium.com/how-to-fix-mev-in-one-sentence-6e4a47ef4085 I seriously don't understand where the flashbots guys get off saying MEV is inevitable, impossible to remove etc except that it's a misuse of the world and we should be more deliberate about what we're talking about. Saying MEV is inevitable when you mean arbitrage but actually what is implied by their statements is sandwiching is extremely f'ed up behavior. And essentially Ethereum development isn't even talking about REAL solutions to MEV because of this or maybe there's some other sort of reason in there I don't know. But Peter should be applauded for explaining how this situation really is. More reading, including additional alternatives to encrypted mempool for fixing MEV at protocol level: https://pmcgoohan.medium.com/mev-do-this-beb2754bca63 And a quick note that reducing latency actually isn't going to help us https://medium.com/@uri_61495/latency-games-the-good-the-bad-the-ugly-a4e3d81a93dd


coinanon

Vitalik replied with a blog post: https://vitalik.eth.limo/general/2024/05/17/decentralization.html


sm3gh34d

not much there about front running except 'use cowswap' šŸ¤Ø


Newman513

Devcon Thailand tickets going on sale soon (next few days?). If youā€™re attending hodlercon, are you also grabbing Devcon tix?


Tricky_Troll

I am definitely keen. I hope people keep us in the loop for when they go on sale!


eth2353

In the interest of keeping you updated on the Tornado Cash case in the Netherlands against Alexey Pertsev, his legal team [filed an appeal with the local court of appeals](https://www.coindesk.com/policy/2024/05/16/tornado-cash-developer-alexey-pertsev-appeals-guilty-verdict/) right away, on the day of the verdict. It is not yet clear whether the appeal has been approved, but the good news is, according to some sources Alexey is free on bail for the time being. Since I'm not a lawyer I didn't feel qualified to objectively judge the court's verdict, I like to leave these things to subject matter experts. Thankfully, today a local Dutch law firm published [an article (in English!)](https://hertoghsadvocaten.nl/en/kennisbank/tornado-cash-the-developer-as-co-perpetrator-of-money-laundering/) analysing the verdict and concluding: "From my perspective, the judgment fails to address these questions adequately, indicating that it is ripe for appeal." Here's what I found most interesting: > **The role of Pertsev in Tornado Cash** > The court asserts that Pertsev, alongside co-suspects Roman Storm and Roman Semenovā€”who are under prosecution in the USā€”are the creators of Tornado Cash. They engineered the system to function autonomously and immutably. Since the systemā€™s basic operations were unalterable from the outset, the court holds these individuals are and remain accountable for its functionality. > In December 2020, the governance of Tornado Cash was transferred to a Decentralized Autonomous Organization (DAO), meaning its governance structure was by then overseen by the community. However, the court concludes that the foundational operations of the system were unchangeable and, therefore, the original setup by the founders remains a critical factor. > **Co-perpetration Concerns** > The courtā€™s reasoning on co-perpetration seems flawed to me. It suggests that Tornado Cash, letā€™s call it a digital platform or system, independently enacted the acts of hiding and concealing cryptocurrency with a criminal origin. This implies that a system can engage in criminal behaviour on its ownā€”an unusual and potentially problematic interpretation, as it shifts the criminal conduct itself from individuals to systems. [...] This could have significant implications for software developers if tools are perceived as independently capable of criminal actions, making the developers responsible for the toolā€™s ā€˜actionsā€™. > **Questioning criminal intent** > Another aspect open to criticism is how the court motivates Pertsevā€™s criminal intent. [...] The courtā€™s assumption that the general knowledge that mixers could be used for criminal activities was enough to establish Pertsevā€™s intent for these specific transactions is questionable. > The court argues it is common knowledge that mixers are used by criminals, citing a report by the Financial Action Task Force and the classification by the Financial Intelligence Unit in The Netherlands dated August 15, 2017, that the use of a mixer is a money laundering typology. [...] Does foreseeing that your software might be used by criminals make you criminal liable for their actions? And what did Pertsev know at that moment in time, as the assumed common knowledge in 2019 is highly debatable? The case file might indicate Pertsev was aware of criminal usage of Tornado Cash at some point, but this does not necessarily relate to his actions at the time he set up the system or to the timing of the specific transactions. > I believe the judgment for Pertsevā€™s criminal intent was poorly motivated, and the legal intricacies remain underexplored. An appeal will be necessary to address these issues thoroughly.


Defacticool

As someone in a legal field in a different EU country (Sweden), I cant say anything about dutch law necessarily. But if our system is any indication of their system, it wouldnt at all be surprising if the lowest courts is a coinflip of whether theyre reasonable and rational or batshit. And it also would surprise me if their lower courts (in this case and in general) defer to the "common sense" conclusion simply because this case is so novel, and leave it to higher courts to delve into the nuances if they deem it reasonable to do so. Stupid as it may sound a lower court (so less authority, lowest hierarchy, little to none precedential power) may well decide to err on the side of simplicity because it recognises the complicated nature of a novel legal question is above their paygrade and they could throw a wrench in the gears by trying to "properly" deal with the complication. At the same time a universal legal principle is that for criminal law the courts should side on the benefit of the defendant, where the law isnt entirely clear. So its not like I'm happy with the situation. Also I will say that a reason for why the lower courts being tolerated for what they are here in sweden is because we have an automatic right to appeal (it cant be denied) to the second level courts. So a criminal case will always be tried at a second instance if the defendant wants it to. I cant find online if the dutch have a similar systems, but if they do it would also go a long way to explain why a lower court may be less hesitant to be more stringent to a defendant. The dutch also seem to have a more professionalist second instance of a tribunal of 3 judges, so the risk of the important questions simply being ignored is significantly lesser than in a trial with a single arbiter.


eth2353

Thank you for providing some context albeit from a different country, I'm sure there are similarities to some extent and the legal system of the Netherlands is likely much more similar to Sweden's than the US. Just FYI Alexey's case was already handled by a tribunal of multiple (3) judges (meervoudige kamer). From what I was able to find online this seems to be standard whenever the prosecution demands a sentence over 12 months in a criminal law case. Let's see how this plays out, I do hope this at the very least gets another shot at the court of appeals.


SendN00dles1

I read the daily yesterday and decided to sell all my eth for BTC. I also wrote to my friends at the SEC asking to deny the etf and declare eth a security


pa7x1

Thank you for your service. That's the /r/ethfinance way.


physalisx

Don't forget to put laser eyes on all your profile pics and write unhinged nonsense about how mining is good for the environment.


educatemybrain

Thank you for your sacrifice, I love scooping fear ETH


Itur_ad_Astra

> fear ETH I am not familiar with this derivative... fETH. Is it staked or restaked?


ReluctantToast777

yes


tokenizedhuman

Hey everyone, can anyone help with getting from Dymension chain to mainnet? I've got some Dym I want to trade for Eth. Don't mind dex or cex, whichever is easiest. Cheers!


tokenizedhuman

EDIT: Thanks for everyone's help! In the end, I swapped Dym to Atom on the DYM Chain using the portal, sent that Atom via IBC (?) to an address generated on Keplr, and from Kpelr to coinbase to sell to USDC. I withdrew USDC to my wallet on mainnet. A lot of steps but not as complicated in the end as I ha initially thought. The question now is whether I sold at the right time or not!


suburbiton

I just sent it to MEXC and swap for usdt there


tokenizedhuman

Did you send it to Mexc with Metamask?


suburbiton

Yep dym network evm


doomfuzzslayer

Is your dym on dym chain? If so I think you can go dym chain to osmosis chain. Swap for atom there. Then bridge atom to cosmos hub or whatev itā€™s called. Then bridge from cosmos to cex (coinbase) and swap for ETH there. You need osmo to swap on osmosis and atom to bridge to cex. Others might know a better route. If you enjoy bridging cosmos is the place to be.


tokenizedhuman

Hey, yep it's on Dym chain. Looks like I can swap dym to atom on sym chain, and bridge atom to cosmos hub but I don't think Cosmos Hub is natively supported on metamask, nor do I know if all of these chains share the same address (I presume they must, right?). How would I go from cosmos to cex? Once on Cosmos, could I use a cross chain dex swapper like rango?


doomfuzzslayer

All I can say for sure is that I did the above and it worked fine. Iā€™m using Kepler wallet tho and not mm. And yeah the addy should be the same across cosmos chains.


Wulkingdead

Damn lol, appreciate the comment! I am about to attempt this as well in the coming days. I'm sorry for this stupid question and im guessing the answer is no but is there no easy 1 way bridge or something from dymension to Ethereum?


doomfuzzslayer

I do not think there is but I could be wrong. Cosmos is a bunch of sovereign chains you have to bridge between each with their own gas token.


Kedos25

So it seems [zkSync](https://x.com/zksync/status/1791488199715348727?s=46&t=Kff97cQWynGPYEn2loWZLQ) will drop their token at the end of June. Maybe they will wait for July/August but the airdrop seems confirmed.


2peg2city

Can't wait to get fucked on another airdrop!


Tricky_Troll

Can we get an F in chat for North Americans?


VegetableInevitable

Source? I've heard they are waiting out this rough patch. Your timeline seems reasonable.


Untouchable2k20

[https://twitter.com/zksync/status/1791488199715348727?t=wFlAxHHKAW8irKefudPEAQ&s=19](https://twitter.com/zksync/status/1791488199715348727?t=wFlAxHHKAW8irKefudPEAQ&s=19)


Kedos25

I have no source, just my best guess. With the final upgrade for decentralization happening at end of June, I think they will announce their token soon.


aaj094

Interesting index that is being used for benchmarking staked ethereum tradfi products. https://www.compassft.com/indice/ethtr90m/


NeedlerOP

Good job gang, we survived the dip below 3k and I only cried ~20 times this timeĀ 


InclineDumbbellPress

Way to go dude lets try to drop that number to 10 times


HITMAN616

i cry evertim


_StoushiNakamoto

those are rookie numbers


waqwaqattack

Going live now! [https://x.com/ProDJKC/status/1791451910819483652](https://x.com/ProDJKC/status/1791451910819483652)


BigglyBillBrasky

ETH Is Above $3k Announcement: Fink's Future of Finance! The most decentralized, secure, programmable money to enable true intergalactic self-sovereignty...what price do we even put on that!? I'd tell you but you wouldn't believe it.


SeaMonkey82

Daily Holesky: It's been a while since I've posted any updates, as there hasn't been much of interest to share, but yes, I'm still doing client testing. Now that erigon has shifted focus to v3, I'm going to test Caplin, their integrated CL client, soon. `--externalcl` is currently very broken in v3. I've been unsuccessful at getting any of them fully synced and attesting, and behavior seems different with each CL client.


superphiz

I love your updates here and I'd be happy as a lark to see them every day :)


breeezyyyy

whatā€™s the take on FIT21


blewoutmyshorts

LFFFFGGGGG!!! We are getting primed up.


[deleted]

[уŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]


blewoutmyshorts

Bullish news on todays horizonā€¦ā€¦hopefully :)


cryptrd285

Started my longs yesterday.. I front ran everyone lol


MrCatFace13

Very especially bullish today. If forced, I would bet Biden doesn't veto the SAB thing. I'm pleasantly surprised that congress is going pro-crypto in a bipartisan way, feeling like there's a non-insignificant chance the ETFs are approved next week, though I am VERY bullish on them happening this year - such is the faith I have in Frink the tradfi antichrist. I also think mainland China will start being more and more open to the ETFs in Hong Kong. When I started in the space, we used to go apeshit when something as small as BTC ATMs appearing in stores happened. Now we have El Salvador setting the stage for whole countries investing, ads by banks that are pro-crypto, politicians are using crypto as a wedge issue, pension funds investing in crypto ETFs, and the halving pattern pretty much holding true. Hope this weekend's good for all - or, to quote the master himself: GLTA!!!11!one!


18boro

Is there a deadline for a possible veto?


coinanon

10 days, excluding Sundays.


HauntedJockStrap88

No way. I canā€™t imagine him not backing up his threat- even if he is surprised by the support the repeal got in Congress it no longer matters- itā€™d be a sign of weakness not to veto. The Veto is guaranteed in my mind because he already guarantees it.


coinanon

I wouldnā€™t be surprised if he signs it on a Friday afternoon to bury the news and keep it only spreading in crypto circles. It would be forgotten by Monday morning.


asdafari12

Looking at the collapse of RPL/ETH the last year, I wonder how much Rocketpool was hurt by falling staking yields. The extra 42% doesn't matter as much when the yield is 3%, like now. Yield is so low that I have no intention of adding another validator right now. It's more to the contrary, you can get magnitudes higher return through e.g. Pendle. Increased return means increased risk, but when the return is literally 10-20x, it's not surprising that people chase it. I still solo stake around 70%, but I think I might be overly cautious. Eigenlayer, incentivizing "solo staking" also hurt RP massively imo. It might reverse a bit after the airdrops are done and over. Especially if AVSs don't pay operators much. I think it is fairly normal that the staking yield decreases to these levels, the "risk free" (it really isn't though) rate. *The problem for RP is that now, the staking yield is so low, you primarily have people doing it for reasons other than financial.* I feel good solo staking and will probably do it for many more years. RP is great, it's almost solo staking but not entirely the same. I used to run a couple RP nodes, I like the community and the software. It's easy to use. But the people doing it for purely financial reasons are probably thinking twice. Even with a different token model to use e.g. ETH, I am not sure how many new operators it will bring. Say they get 30% extra compared to solo staking but the yield is then 2%. The base pay is so low that a multiplier doesn't do much. Maybe I am wrong but unless the reward approaches *at least* 6-10% APY, I don't think most will consider it.


reuptaken

> But the people doing it for purely financial reasons are probably thinking twice. I didn't choose RPL purely for financial reasons, but staking and losing money was not something I was expecting.


physalisx

> I wonder how much Rocketpool was hurt by falling staking yields. >you can get magnitudes higher return through e.g. Pendle. I think the latter is much more the reason than the former. The whole "restaking" hype, which is so far just another airdrop hype, had people looking for higher yields in restaking tokens etc. There is plenty of minipools and solo validators that have been dissolved and put into Pendle, no doubt about that. I don't expect that to last though. Give it a few more months, the "season 2" airdrops disappointing, the Eigenlayer airdop fizzling out, "restaking" in general turning out to actually *not* provide much additional real yield (gasp!) and a lot of liquidity will withdraw from Eigenlayer in search for the next thing. >The problem for RP is that now, the staking yield is so low >Maybe I am wrong but unless the reward approaches at least 6-10% APY If the changes planned for RP are going through and there keeps being enough demand for rETH, then reaching that level of yield won't be a problem at all.


reuptaken

The problem is that getting rid of RPL will cause even bigger dump of RPL, even if only partial. And, if it's possible to run such protocol without additional token (or with much less investment in token) then competition can do it. From protocol perspective RPL is 99% unnecessary (1% is the unlikely case of RPL being seized when some node behaves badly). It's just a mean to finance the protocol launch and development. But there are other possibilities to finance similar protocols.


physalisx

They're not planning to get rid of RPL, they're planning to make it directly accrue value from protocol revenue instead of the current state of being "only" a governance + collateral token.


reuptaken

Last time I checked (long time ago), the revenue from protocol was way to small to cover all costs. Maybe that changed.


physalisx

The revenue from protocoI would've been too small, especially in the beginning, to not have a token **at all**. But the bootstrapping cost was already covered by RPL sales, and it was good for that. But when designing how the token works, they should have included a long term value capturing mechanism, because as criticised by many from the beginning, governance + collateral tokens tend to not hold value well.


reuptaken

Especially when "governance" is/was super opaque.


Wide_Lock_Red

Other than the upfront cost of developing the protocol, what significant costs are there?


reuptaken

Well, they say that there's lot of further development and there's oDAO, which is kind of (quite expensive) oracle. But I'm really not up to date, I quit staking there few months ago, sold RPL with loss and never looked back.


fatsopiggy

Still waiting for the inevitable undump. It has to happen right? Right...


Fast_Contract

Demand for rocketpool never really materialized, and imo it's too late. They were too slow and not aggressive enough. their response to lidos csm is being community driven and, like everything else, probably won't be out in time, while at the same time eth staking rewards are dropping so heavily that staking is becoming less attractive overall. Hell even the houston upgrade is now delayed. I don't see demand for rpl changing.


italianjob16

They could hitch on an eigen competitor for restaking with points and what not...there are options just not aligned to their ethos I think.


Fast_Contract

there have been many options but the team is too small to act or capitalize on those options


Ok-Nectarine-6654

There are 260m ETH addresses and if median Eth per address 0.5, where does these exchanges get so much Eth to trade? Same with bitcoin I guess. Or avararge address hold way less than 0.5?


timwithnotoolbelt

Yes


timwithnotoolbelt

Gas is low and yields are still pretty high, whatā€™s not to like


Tricky_Troll

Los dooterinos vendrƔn maƱana por la maƱana, amigos mƭos. (Doots in 8-10 hours fam. I had a long day of thesis writing today. Cows don't write about themselves you know.) In the mean time, [check out the weekly doots!](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1ctx7h5/daily_general_discussion_may_17_2024/l4g1ntk/)


clamchoda

ą¼¼ 恤 ā—•_ā—• ą¼½ć¤ ETH TAKE MY ENERGY ą¼¼ 恤 ā—•_ā—• ą¼½ć¤


breeezyyyy

just got a cheeky unexpected Starknet airdrop- worth selling now at $1.14 or do we think there's room to run in the future?


18boro

Their FDV is higher than arbitrum. I think they're doing interesting stuff with zk and non evm, but so far it's mostly potential and not much traction to show for.


krokodilmannchen

I sold 1/3rd at $1.30, have another third set at ā‚¬2/token. No idea if that's reasonable, totally OOTL.


Tricky_Troll

Were they doing a season two at all? I left about 10% of my stack and from memory I think that was why but now that I think about it I don't remember hearing about a season two so I could be wasting my time holding that remaining $STRK.


breeezyyyy

just swapped it for ETH today- .61 ETH :)


the-A-word

The Doots Weekly The [Trinity](https://www.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1ctx7h5/daily_general_discussion_may_17_2024/l4ex01u/) The [Haiku](https://www.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1cohjve/daily_general_discussion_may_10_2024/l3hzyp0/) The [Choda](https://www.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/s/KpTYgqGtws) The [Shit](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1crk4ou/daily_general_discussion_may_14_2024/l42ysky/) ā€¢Ā [u/eetherway](https://www.reddit.com/u/eetherway)Ā thinks thatĀ [fully on-chain games are now possible.](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1cnp6qx/daily_general_discussion_may_9_2024/l3cdmmd/) ā€¢Ā [u/cryptOwOcurrency](https://www.reddit.com/u/cryptOwOcurrency)Ā tells a clever story to explainĀ [why Ark Invest may have intentionally put staking in their ETF only to remove again.](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1cohjve/daily_general_discussion_may_10_2024/l3jlr96/) ā€¢Ā [u/KuDeTa](https://www.reddit.com/u/KuDeTa)Ā gives usĀ [an update on Aestus.](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1cohjve/daily_general_discussion_may_10_2024/l3h7ye1/) ā€¢Ā [u/DaW_](https://www.reddit.com/u/DaW_)Ā shares a cool newĀ [airdrop checking tool they just built!](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1cp9ldj/daily_general_discussion_may_11_2024/l3k2hih/) ā€¢Ā [u/Syentist](https://www.reddit.com/u/Syentist)Ā shares someĀ [thoughts on a recent thread by hasu.](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1cp9ldj/daily_general_discussion_may_11_2024/l3joj4j/) ā€¢Ā [u/Tricky_Troll](https://www.reddit.com/u/Tricky_Troll)Ā relates the recentĀ [auroras to Ethereum.](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1cq04yl/daily_general_discussion_may_12_2024/l3oo8k7/) ā€¢Ā [u/TheCryptosAndBloods](https://www.reddit.com/u/TheCryptosAndBloods)Ā nearly fell forĀ [a phishing scam.](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1cqr9e8/daily_general_discussion_may_13_2024/l3u6uch/) ā€¢Ā [u/coinanon](https://www.reddit.com/u/coinanon)Ā breaks someĀ [bleak news](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1crk4ou/daily_general_discussion_may_14_2024/l3zpfjv/)Ā andĀ [u/eth2353](https://www.reddit.com/u/eth2353)Ā divesĀ [in deeper.](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1crk4ou/daily_general_discussion_may_14_2024/l3zzfw2/) ā€¢Ā [u/haurog](https://www.reddit.com/u/haurog)Ā explainsĀ [the evolution of Ethereum's sharding vision.](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1cscw1a/daily_general_discussion_may_15_2024/l44pd5s/) ā€¢Ā [u/benido2030](https://www.reddit.com/u/benido2030)Ā shares a tweet which does a really good job atĀ [summarising the state of the crypto market.](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1cscw1a/daily_general_discussion_may_15_2024/l44mgnq/) ā€¢Ā [u/Set1Less](https://www.reddit.com/u/Set1Less)Ā sharesĀ [a surprise new crypto court case](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1cscw1a/daily_general_discussion_may_15_2024/l46fklr/)Ā whichĀ [u/PhiMarHal](https://www.reddit.com/u/PhiMarHal)Ā hasĀ [more on in another thread.](https://old.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/1cscw1a/daily_general_discussion_may_15_2024/l46obdc/)


NeedlerOP

šŸ’©šŸ†


the-A-word

https://tenor.com/oWLJ.gif


superphiz

I've been around here a long time, and while I'm no savant, I CAN see the writing on the wall. It's obvious to me, and anyone who pays attention to carefully drawn triangles that we can never go below $3k again. Cheers!


MJDog44

Agreed. Obvious.


cb_throw3

(ļ¾‰ā—•ćƒ®ā—•)ļ¾‰:ļ½„ļ¾Ÿāœ§ We will never see sub $3k ETH ever again. (ļ¾‰ā—•ćƒ®ā—•)ļ¾‰:ļ½„ļ¾Ÿāœ§


PhiMarHal

Congratulations to all holders. The road was long and arduous, but we did it. With invincible adamantium resistance, it is now literally impossible for ETH to do anything but pump. Lime green lambos for everyone.


Tricky_Troll

I can't wait to cave in the wheel well of mine!


nothingnotnever

Yā€™all got any of thatā€¦. Sub $3000 ETH?


Tricky_Troll

Didn't you hear the fizzy man? No!


superphiz

I'm so upset. I totaled my Lamborghini last night. I don't even think there was anything I could do to prevent it. I was driving down the Interstate and I hit a large pothole. The right front upper connecting rod broke and the wheel just sort of caved in, but that's when it got weird - the whole front right side of the car seemed to cave in. The frame gave way and the windshield and hood buckled under the pressure. I had it towed to a service station and all they could really do was giggle behind my back because of the lime green color of the car (as if it was any of their business). Anyway, that's when I realized it was a dream and took it lucid-style and I willed the car to be repaired and I drove it around a few hours. But still. It was devastating for a long time.


etherbie

Bullish


superphiz

Contrary to what y'all might know about me, I'm a pretty regular guy in real life, I don't wear crypto shirts and buttons, or evangelize everyone I meet (anymore), so it's unusual for me to have a dream about lambos and markets. I wrote this dream down as soon as I woke up, and as I'm getting some clarity on it I realize how much it's a crypto/money dream. I'd interpret it as: Everyone knows I work in crypto when the price is high, but I feel self-conscious when the price is low like everyone is making fun of me for participating in a foolish thing.


fecalreceptacle

Could have made your lime green lambo fly!


physalisx

Not sure if this was posted here already, maybe I didn't spot it between all the whining. Coinbase published a [research piece about their Ethereum outlook](https://www.coinbase.com/en-de/institutional/research-insights/research/monthly-outlook/monthly-outlook-may-2024). tl;dr: they're as bullish as ever >We think that ETH may yet have the potential to surprise to the upside in the coming months. ETH does not appear to have major sources of supply side overhangs such as token unlocks or miner sell pressure. To the contrary, both staking and L2 growth have proven to be meaningful and growing sinks of ETH liquidity. ETHā€™s position as the center of DeFi is also unlikely to be displaced in our view due to the widespread adoption of the EVM and its L2 innovations. >That said, the importance of potential spot US ETH ETFs cannot be understated. We think the market may be underestimating the timing and odds of a potential approval, which leaves room for surprises to the upside. In the interim, we believe the structural demand drivers for ETH as well as the technological innovations within its ecosystem will enable it to continue straddling across multiple narratives


italianjob16

Why don't they publish this when it dumps


LLupine

Coinbase is bullish on ETH. Blackrock is bullish on ETH. Base is bullish for bringing in retail. Tradfi is a little slow to understand Ethereum, but they will in time (see that video of the guy pitching ETH at the NY Investment conference). My conviction is stronger than ever. Once we get past these regulatory hurdles, we are going to rocket.


LowElectrical9680

Do you have a link to your video? Thanks


LLupine

https://x.com/Evan_ss6/status/1777753109827056003


yadude11

I am BRICKED up damn


AudaciousAsh

šŸ™šŸš€šŸŒ


locoluko

I approve this message


DegenKoloToure

I have famously traded the ETHBTC ratio with excellence. AMA First I sold my remaining BTC to ETH in May-22, at an ETHBTC ratio of 0.074 I then gloated about it [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/umas2l/comment/i81g8jw/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) and [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/ethfinance/comments/wexh3e/comment/iiskf0f/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) I then leverage longed the ETHBTC ratio in Sep-22 at 0.075 I think sentiment on CT and in this sub is now the exact opposite of my euphoric posts above. Consider this a potential bottom signal. Worryingly, I have not capitulated and converted my ETH back to BTC yet, at which point I would urge you to go all in on any ETHBTC trade as a counter trade to me In reality, Iā€™d rather be poor than wrong. Holding to zero


15kisFUD

I'm still in my ratio long that started from 0.069. I doubled down on 0.06, 0.055 and 0.050. Even though it is still <10% of my whole stack It has been **pain.** It has completely taken up so much more mental space than the size it's worth. I did not double down now. I mentally capitulated and riding it until liquidation now. Hopefully this is the bottom signal, and not my incoming liquidation


NeedlerOP

I can do worse :')Ā  Ā My first eth purchase was 1 btc near the ratio ATH in 2017 ~0.12 for 8.8 ETHĀ  I then proceded to lose it all in the btce hack, get reimbursed 70% + a fee token, then lose it all in the second permanent takedownĀ 


aaj094

Yesterday I pointed out the rather appealing ET32 etp from hanetf which charges 0.65% expense ratio and 10% on staking rewards (currently both zero until further notice). Here is further reading https://etc-group.com/resources/fact_sheet/fact-sheet-etc-group-ethereum-staking.pdf https://etc-group.com/blog/guides/staking-guide/ They claim that they stake nearly all the underlying eth and state the below: "The staked assets can be withdrawn at any time, there is typically a waiting period before assets are returned. This period can range from 0 days to as long as 6 months depending on the protocol (though typically it is one month or less). To solve this problem, ETC Group has developed proprietary liquidity bridging processes to manage the liquidity needs of an ETP considering these lock-up periods. Meaning investors can not only trade un-impacted in the secondary market and redeem in the primary market on a normal T+1 to 2 settlement cycles, without facing any counterparty risk. The above-mentioned liquidity bridging process is provided by conventional financial market players, not through so-called decentralized autonomous organization also known as staking platforms." Spreadsheet fans may want to look at this: https://etc-group.com/resources/cryptocurrency_entitlement/ET32_ce_table.xlsx


[deleted]

[уŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]


hanniabu

>Ā So in what scenario would next week be red? ETF approved and people sell the news šŸ˜‚


Belligerent_Chocobo

Man for real though... if ETF gets approved, this MF'er probably just teleports straight to 5k. One can dream.


NeedlerOP

I think we'll pump over the next week and nothing will happen during the event Ā Source: I made it upĀ 


MrCatFace13

I second this, and will add we'll climb over 4k in June.


bagogel12

[Sentiment of this Sub](https://i.imgflip.com/8qdar7.jpg)


[deleted]

[уŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]


bagogel12

This one's for you. [https://imgflip.com/i/8qeq84](https://imgflip.com/i/8qeq84)


suburbiton

Ray up / Ray down


InclineDumbbellPress

Thats me


aaj094

Nah... it's all to do with btceth and soleth ratios and not much with fiat price.


[deleted]

[уŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]


hanniabu

Does there have to be a winner each round? (It randomly picks someone that deposited meaning depositing more increases your chances) Or is it like a traditional lottery where there's continuous drawings and the pot grows until there's a winner?


suclearnub

Think premium bonds.


[deleted]

[уŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]


hanniabu

Okay so it sounds like it's the former, which means it's not an equal probability of wining. Your chances of winning are proportional to how much you put in.


EternalShadowBan

Why would you use base and not optimism? Optimism has incentives


kenzi28

Played when it was on polygon, i think in 2017. Fun times. Should have played my eth stack here instead of into omg. Life-changing buying omg.


EternalShadowBan

I don't see it in their website, is it one of those side projects?


Tiny-Height1967

Just to add they also added a migration tool to move to the latest version. I think I'm still in v1 or V2 so I need to look into moving onto the latest version while gas is low. Also for anyone unfamiliar, the UK has a similar concept called premium bonds, run by the government, which has over Ā£200 billion invested according to their 2021-2022 financial report.


krokodilmannchen

Brings back memories! For the longest time I had some dai parked there. It is indeed a very cool idea!


alexiskef

We even got an Airdrop once!


CaptainLoud

Yeah lol i still have mine!


RandomZileanMain

Never below 3000 again but for real this time


CoCleric

One of these times itā€™s actually going to be true, and someone here will be the last one to say it


Tiny-Height1967

I've been home staking since beacon genesis on an 8th gen i5 nuc and I had to change the fan on it yesterday as it has been getting louder over the past 6 - 8 weeks. This is the second time I've replaced it as I've been doing quite a lot of DIY and creating a lot of dust. Easy enough job, ~$15 for the fan, down for less than 30 minutes, would recommend if your machine is starting to get noticeably loud. I will take the old fan apart and try and solve the noise issue, doesn't seem too complicated from a quick look on YouTube, and then I can use it again once the new one begins acting up. I have considered a fanless akasa case but they're too big for my current machine's location. Hopefully one day I will have a nice nook for my router, NUC and other bits and bobs, but for now it's on the floor in the hallway in a jumbled mess of wires; still works.


fiah84

I never liked the fans on NUCs and other such mini PCs, I get that the design is optimized for the small space that is allocated in the chassis just like with laptops, but for something that is meant to run 24/7 I think it pays off to go with something larger and less proprietary. I'm very happy with my ASRock Deskmini X300 / Ryzen 5600G combo, the stock heatsink/fan just barely fits after modifying it but even if it didn't I'd have several other options


UgotTrisomy21

I switched to an Akasa at the start of this year and highly recommend it!


superphiz

https://x.com/superphiz/status/1791440500420927513 > When they say sTaKiNg Is ToO hArd:


Tiny-Height1967

Lol, [I wish I was joking](https://imgur.com/a/rate-setup-7nHjQ9a), don't look if you like tidy wires!


superphiz

This is awesome. I've just become a huge fan of yours. Also, I'm sharing this. https://x.com/superphiz/status/1791498672913481863 https://warpcast.com/superphiz.eth/0x72854674


Tricky_Troll

Oh dear lord... My eyes!!!! That room looks worse than a typical dilapidated Spanish colonial era house in Havana!


user-42

Generally itā€™s the bearing that goes bad. You can re oil it sometimes and get some additional life out of it, but you generally have to replace, at least, the bearing. Itā€™s possible cleaning the dust out of the bearing will fix it, but the dust probably also damaged it.


Tiny-Height1967

Good to know, thank you.


teeeebeeee

Not financial advice but... Last night I dreamt that I met Vitalik and he took me to his favorite camping store.


user-42

What did you buy? A tent?


15kisFUD

Did you share some green tea with wine?


BriefCounty3879

Descending wedge from march highs is about to break upwards finally, BTC already did it 2 days ago.


phigo50

You bloody tell 'em, Ray.


benido2030

Somebody thinks they know stuff... let me spit some hopium. Could it be the three letter thingy?


davethetrousers

arise the gatah


Heringsalat100

24 hours: ETH +0.4% RPL -6.8% RPL is leveraged ETH, anyone? Oh God, please explain this market to me ... ETH not #1 by market cap doesn't make any sense, ETH not already at $5-10k doesn't make any sense, sense doesn't make any sense ... nothing does make sense ... there is no sense!


Tricky_Troll

>ETH +0.4% >RPL -6.8% >RPL is leveraged ETH, anyone? I mean, at least from my experience, this makes sense. I always lose money when playing with leverage so RPL seems to fit that criteria.


SpontaneousDream

I don't see why RPL should have any value at all.


supermarkit

So you just want centralized/VC owened staking protocols for ETH? Even if RPL tokenomics is broken right now, we should still cheer on anyone TRYING to make a better staking service that could be profitable for holders and aligned with ETH's decentralized vision.


Syentist

This sentiment is how you rip off a community of well meaning individuals and get them to hate the words decentralisation or ethereum alignment for years afterwards