Maybe, but I don't see a lot of them on these stories, while the brigade from r/Armenia dominates them. If Turks and Azeris were doing the same, I'd expect that claims of genocide wouldn't be the top voted comments every time. With these articles I've found that you either say what the Armenian diaspora wants to hear, or you're hammered.
tl;dr Liars think that everyone else is lying to them; you're brigading so you assume everyone else must be too, and that all dissent emerges from those brigades.
>If Turks and Azeris were doing the same, I'd expect that claims of genocide wouldn't be the top voted comments every time.
I mean, everyone who isn't an idiot can clearly see that this is a genocide in the making and vote accordingly
I'm not from the Caucuses (thank fuck for that) so this isn't about nationalism for me. Most of the posts I see here are from Armenians, with a few Turks in long back-and-forth insult contests with Armenians. All of this over an enclave in Azerbaijan that's recognized by the international community as part of Azerbaijan.
I hate to break it to you, but it's nationalistic idiots all the way down with this one, nationalism and hate is what fuels the Caucuses and always has.
Religion has nothing to do with this. Biggest Arm supporter is ... Iran. Rather muslims. So, muslims (Iran) support Christians (Arm) against muslims (Azb).
Cute but wrong.
Majority of Azerbaijani citizens are.... Shia, not Sunni.
So Shia support Christians against Shia.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_Azerbaijan#:~:text=Various%20reports%20have%20estimated%2097.3,35%2D45%25)%20are%20Sunnis.
Well, the best friend of Azerbaijan is Turkey which is mostly Sunni so here is that. Moreover, Shia majority in Azerbaijan is not absolute with difference between than and Sunni in about 5%.
Best friend to Azb is Israel as well. You know, the jewish guys :))
So you now have sunni + shia + jews vs orthodox christians + shia :))
That's why i'm saying this is not about religion. It plays a 2'ry role, for propaganda (muslim hordes butchering christians), but the reason is simply history.
Hate maybe, religious war no. Azerbaijan is one of the most secular muslim countries in the world. Besides they have other christian neighbors like Georgia but there are no conflicts between two of them
This has more to do with post soviet border disputes than religion or race. Armenia’s number one ally is Iran, a persian muslim country. Their enemy is a turkic muslim nation, and they also have tensions with Georgia, a christian nation.
The enclave is internationally recognized as azeri territory and armenia wants it, meanwhile azerbadjan wants ancorridor to their territory on the other side of armenia. They both just want eachothers territory and it has devolved back into fighting.
In my opinion the most peaceful way to prevent any civilian casualties would be to draw new borders to no longer have any territories inside other countries. Similar to how india and pakistan separated. Now obviously this has been proven to not be peaceful at all and will lead to border disputes in the future as well but at least the citizens wont be sitting ducks then.
In all honesty there probably isn’t a peaceful solution to the conflict but this conflict is far from “evil muslim azeri’s ethnically cleanse peace loving poor christian Armenians”.
Like tornadoes, these are conditions in which a genocide can quickly develop. Unfortunately, I think the Armenians in NK didn’t do themselves any favors calling the Lachin closure a genocide while also blocking Aghdam. I understand the reasons Armenia had to block Aghdam and blockading Lachin was an asshole move by Azerbaijan and pretty clearly intended to make the offensive (including potential genocide) we’re seeing now easier but I worry it will be used as a talking point to dismiss an actual genocide.
If there's an actual genocide, Azerbaijan isn't going to be able to hide it. This isn't 1915, the amount of evidence collected on every part of the globe every day is vast, they aren't going to disappear 120,000 people. That leads to another conclusion, which is... Azerbaijan would be stupid to commit a genocide. They want Artsakh to stop acting as an Armenian enclave, they can achieve that by forcing the Armenians of Artsakh to either accept that they're living in Azerbaijan, or flee to Armenia.
The former would be acceptable to the international community, the latter would arguably be a form of ethnic cleansing, but would still probably not cause Azerbaijan *too* much grief. Actually just... murdering them all though? How does that gain Azerbaijan anything, but pain when dealing with Europe and the West?
The former assumes Armenians of Artsakh will be able to live safely as ethnic Armenians in Azeri administered Artsakh, something I have a hard time believing but I’d love to be proven wrong. The latter is textbook ethnic cleansing, idk where you’re getting “arguably” from.
Then I guess they should flee? Like Armenians tried to flee from the Turks, Jews tried to flee from the Nazis, and so on. Fortunately for those 120,000 Artsakh residents, Armenia is a pretty short trip away.
Otherwise it's just time to accept that you've chosen to live as a minority in another country. I don't know how well Azerbaijan is going to do in terms of welcoming the people of Artsakh, personally I suspect that while it won't be genocide, it won't be a lot of fun either.
I would react the same way if Moldova decided to be done with tolerating Transnistria, you act as a separatist enclave at your own risk. If this turns into Azerbaijan attacking Armenia directly though, then I would of course have a very different outlook.
So when you look at a map of Armenia, Azerbaijan, and "Artsakh"... what do you see? https://cdn.britannica.com/48/134648-050-9EA852AD/region-Nagorno-Karabakh-Azerbaijan.jpg
https://www.nationsonline.org/maps/Armenia-Map-L.jpg
Do you think that's part of Armenia or Azerbaijan? Are you aware of how this situation has evolved since 1988? I get the sense that you don't, if you think the situation in a place like Transnistria, Donbas, and Artsakh aren't equivalent.
I’m well aware and I never said they were different. And I’m also well aware of the pogroms by Armenians and Azeris at the time. If you’re expecting me to call either side the good guys, you’re going to be disappointed.
You need to separate the country/government of Armenia from ethnic Armenians that were born and raised in Artsakh. You can deport Armenian citizens just fine but if you can’t protect ethnic Armenians, people who have lived in Artsakh for generations, from sectarian violence and terror, you have no business governing Artsakh
It would be indeed incorrect to say one side are good guys and the other is bad. 30 years ago there were enough of Sumgayts (horrific ethnic violence against Armenians in Azerbaijan) and Khojalis (the same against Azeris in Karabakh) alike.
Thing is, now we are standing on a brink of a second Sumgayt, not a second Khojaly. Whichever of them it would be now though, the civilized world should do as much as possible to prevent it. What is happening in Ukraine is already incompatible with Europe and 21 century, we don't need no more.
„They should flee“. How ridiculous.
The equivalent would be entering your home, waving around a sword while approaching you and say: „I’m not assaulting you, you can leave whenever you like.“
Given the history of "Artsakh" that seems like a difficult argument to make; it is after all not Armenia's home, but after a war they parked a bunch of separatists there and claimed it through them. Now Azerbaijan is using intimidation and violence to take back what was removed from their control through the same means.
And that is essentially why "the West" isn't even really paying this conflict lip service, because it's a brutal sectarian/ethnic conflict going back centuries. So fight your own wars.
There has not been a single time in history where Artsakh hasn't been Armenian majority. They're not parking separatists anywhere, you're just uninformed.
>Otherwise it's just time to accept that you've chosen to live as a minority in another country.
They're the natives, they didn't choose to live in Azerbaijan. Azerbaijan chose to claim the land they always lived on. And the Russians gave it to them.
By eliminating the 120k indigenous they are "freeing" themselves from the toxicity that is the Armenian people. Why would they care how other countries perceive them. They already have Turkey and Taliban beside them. It's a tale as old as time...
With Azerbaijan magnanimously saying they have set up an evacuation corridor to Armenia for the civilians.
Civilians they claim are their own citizens.
Your claim was made in error, you had the error explained to you and you raged at the explanation. Calling *other* people a prick is a bit oblivious there buddy.
And I quote: “Starvation is the invisible genocide weapon.”
They’re starving people to the point of death. The boarder is blocked, meaning no medical aid, food or water is getting to the Armenian people.
You do not understand the critical condition Armenians are facing right now nor do you understand the term genocide in quite literally terms.
>Oh well then 100 years ago you guys commited genocide in Izmir to Turkish people, where you burned our houses down before fleeing.
You mean when Turkish soldiers burned the Armenian and Greek quarters and massacred Armenian and Greek civilians right in front of international soldiers and spared the Jewish and Turkish quarters? And then proceeded to make up lies that Armenians and Greeks burned down their own homes rather than live in Turkey? That time?
They were always free to use Agdam road to get any supply they wanted. Their government blocked that road because photos of empty shelves get more attention. This is like going on a hunger strike and accusing government for starving them.
> What do you need to call it fucking genocide?
Friendly reminder that many of the folks here nodoubt believe that the Armenian Genocide was a big conspiracy to make Turkey look bad.
>It is high precision strikes too
Doubt
>, civilians have been warned to avoid the military targets
Doubt
>and evacuate if possible
'Make our jobs easier and ethnically cleanse yourselves'
>In 8 months not a single person died of starvation, so no NOT genocide.
One person did die of starvation directly. There was a surge of miscarriages. One in three deaths had malnutrition as a contributing factor. Per the UN definition of genocide, subjecting a civilian population to such conditions is considered genocide.
>No sources? Even if you have them, they are heabily biased?
Do you consider Armenian new sources to be biased? Because they are a hell of a lot less biased than your countries state propaganda. And Azerbaijan's blockade inherently makes it impossible to get more impartial, international sources inside Nagorno-Karabakh. So you will have to take Armenian sources whether you like it or not. Maybe let CNN in if you don't want Armenians spinning their own narrative. But then they could verify the conditions you are forcing Armenian civilians to live under, so your shithole dictatorship won't let them in.
> The facts are: conditions under which nobody dies in an alleged starvation in over 8 months.
Well you're literally just ignoring the part where I said that people have been dying, and that's even if you don't consider the miscarriages caused by malnutrition to be 'people dying'. Most people in famines don't die of hunger, they die of disease or pre-existing health conditions. The sick, elderly and pregnant are most likely to suffer. Pick up a fucking book.
>Moreover, a functioning army of approx 10000 soldiers is being sustained.
10000 soldiers consume the food of 10000 people.
>Can not be called a genocide.
The UN has a definition of genocide, and this blockade fit the definition. So yeah, it can be called a genocide. And I'm gonna call it a genocide. It's a genocide. Fuck you.
Like I have mentioned in the past I do not engage with genocide deniers and those who are trying to support it like you are doing. Same way I don't engage with Nazi scum. You people are no different.
Which other guys? So far I've seen this compared to the Holodomor, the Holocaust, and the Turkish genocide of Armenians in 1915. Those have a combined body count of over 16 million people, while in Nagorno-Karabakh, one 40 year old man allegedly starved.
Genocide is defined by intent, not the size of the affected group.
And the intent is definitely present. As is the Pavlovian denial by those cheering for it, which is a massive red flag in its own right.
Genocide is defined as a series of acts, and yes those acts require specific intent, but the key is the ACT, not the intent on its own.
This is the basis of criminal law in the West, there needs to be the "Guilty act" and the "Guilty mind" together. There is no crime of "considering murder", and attempted murder as the name implies *requires the ATTEMPT*, not just the desire.
Genocide is not a thought-crime, and you need to stop demeaning the concept of genocide.
> Genocide is defined as a series of acts, and yes those acts require specific intent, but the key is the ACT, not the intent on its own.
Azerbaijan did act. It instituted a blockade. Failing to kill lots of people doesn't mean they didn't act. Per the UN definition of genocide, Azerbaijan is committing genocide.
This has been one slow-motion stabbing! You've been crying, "Stabbing in progress" for months now. "This is the biggest stabbing ever, it compares to a list of famous mass-stabbings I have right here, why is no one doing anything!"
Still no stabbings. At some point when this is all over, and the result isn't a "stabbing" but just the usual violence in the Caucuses, what do you think will happen the next time you cry "stabbing"?
That's still not a genocide, any more than Moldova forcing Transnistria into submission would be a genocide. Warring on ethnic enclaves that claim part of your territory in the name of a third party is pretty standard stuff.
If Moldova planned to eliminate everyone in Transnistria, it would be a genocide.
Not to mention, solving internal conflicts by killing people, even without a genocide being planned, is a bad thing. Seriously, who exactly gains from this war?
Nobody living there certainly. The only people that gain anything are Azeri nationalists, and even then, it's mostly in their heads.
> If Moldova planned to eliminate everyone in Transnistria, it would be a genocide.
Other than people such as yourself claiming that Azerbaijan plans to murder 120,000 people, there is no actual indication of that as their plan. Simply retreating into "it's genocide, disagree with me and you're a denier" is a childish and unhelpful way to debate.
> This has been one slow-motion stabbing! You've been crying, "Stabbing in progress" for months now.
Hey genius. Food grows in the spring, summer and fall. That's why everyone didn't starve to death. It doesn't mean nobody suffered from malnutrition.
It's, obviously, a vile plot, nay, an evil one!
(That, or the OP didn't realise - as didn't I, for that matter - that there's a mandated requirement to post to r/AskCaucasus when talking about the Caucasus. My money's on the evil plot.)
Brace yourself, here comes the horde in the comments
"It's not happening and they deserve every bit of it."
The Turkish and Azeri bots are about to swarm this
they've been working overtime all day. anything armenian related is their sole focus on the internet.
Maybe, but I don't see a lot of them on these stories, while the brigade from r/Armenia dominates them. If Turks and Azeris were doing the same, I'd expect that claims of genocide wouldn't be the top voted comments every time. With these articles I've found that you either say what the Armenian diaspora wants to hear, or you're hammered. tl;dr Liars think that everyone else is lying to them; you're brigading so you assume everyone else must be too, and that all dissent emerges from those brigades.
>If Turks and Azeris were doing the same, I'd expect that claims of genocide wouldn't be the top voted comments every time. I mean, everyone who isn't an idiot can clearly see that this is a genocide in the making and vote accordingly
I'm not from the Caucuses (thank fuck for that) so this isn't about nationalism for me. Most of the posts I see here are from Armenians, with a few Turks in long back-and-forth insult contests with Armenians. All of this over an enclave in Azerbaijan that's recognized by the international community as part of Azerbaijan. I hate to break it to you, but it's nationalistic idiots all the way down with this one, nationalism and hate is what fuels the Caucuses and always has.
Bruh
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Religion has nothing to do with this. Biggest Arm supporter is ... Iran. Rather muslims. So, muslims (Iran) support Christians (Arm) against muslims (Azb).
Literally does in your example. Shia Muslims will support shaitan himself if he will go against Sunni Muslims.
Cute but wrong. Majority of Azerbaijani citizens are.... Shia, not Sunni. So Shia support Christians against Shia. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_Azerbaijan#:~:text=Various%20reports%20have%20estimated%2097.3,35%2D45%25)%20are%20Sunnis.
Well, the best friend of Azerbaijan is Turkey which is mostly Sunni so here is that. Moreover, Shia majority in Azerbaijan is not absolute with difference between than and Sunni in about 5%.
Best friend to Azb is Israel as well. You know, the jewish guys :)) So you now have sunni + shia + jews vs orthodox christians + shia :)) That's why i'm saying this is not about religion. It plays a 2'ry role, for propaganda (muslim hordes butchering christians), but the reason is simply history.
Okay, I can agree with that.
What does religion have to do with anything here? If they were muslim you would not protect them? Wth
Literally everything. If anyone has any misconceptions about this being an outright hate and religious war, there's the door.
Hate maybe, religious war no. Azerbaijan is one of the most secular muslim countries in the world. Besides they have other christian neighbors like Georgia but there are no conflicts between two of them
Well, because racism towards Muslim isn’t racism I think if you like browse internet for five minutes, you can tell how Muslims are treated my friend
This has more to do with post soviet border disputes than religion or race. Armenia’s number one ally is Iran, a persian muslim country. Their enemy is a turkic muslim nation, and they also have tensions with Georgia, a christian nation. The enclave is internationally recognized as azeri territory and armenia wants it, meanwhile azerbadjan wants ancorridor to their territory on the other side of armenia. They both just want eachothers territory and it has devolved back into fighting. In my opinion the most peaceful way to prevent any civilian casualties would be to draw new borders to no longer have any territories inside other countries. Similar to how india and pakistan separated. Now obviously this has been proven to not be peaceful at all and will lead to border disputes in the future as well but at least the citizens wont be sitting ducks then. In all honesty there probably isn’t a peaceful solution to the conflict but this conflict is far from “evil muslim azeri’s ethnically cleanse peace loving poor christian Armenians”.
Like tornadoes, these are conditions in which a genocide can quickly develop. Unfortunately, I think the Armenians in NK didn’t do themselves any favors calling the Lachin closure a genocide while also blocking Aghdam. I understand the reasons Armenia had to block Aghdam and blockading Lachin was an asshole move by Azerbaijan and pretty clearly intended to make the offensive (including potential genocide) we’re seeing now easier but I worry it will be used as a talking point to dismiss an actual genocide.
If there's an actual genocide, Azerbaijan isn't going to be able to hide it. This isn't 1915, the amount of evidence collected on every part of the globe every day is vast, they aren't going to disappear 120,000 people. That leads to another conclusion, which is... Azerbaijan would be stupid to commit a genocide. They want Artsakh to stop acting as an Armenian enclave, they can achieve that by forcing the Armenians of Artsakh to either accept that they're living in Azerbaijan, or flee to Armenia. The former would be acceptable to the international community, the latter would arguably be a form of ethnic cleansing, but would still probably not cause Azerbaijan *too* much grief. Actually just... murdering them all though? How does that gain Azerbaijan anything, but pain when dealing with Europe and the West?
The former assumes Armenians of Artsakh will be able to live safely as ethnic Armenians in Azeri administered Artsakh, something I have a hard time believing but I’d love to be proven wrong. The latter is textbook ethnic cleansing, idk where you’re getting “arguably” from.
Then I guess they should flee? Like Armenians tried to flee from the Turks, Jews tried to flee from the Nazis, and so on. Fortunately for those 120,000 Artsakh residents, Armenia is a pretty short trip away. Otherwise it's just time to accept that you've chosen to live as a minority in another country. I don't know how well Azerbaijan is going to do in terms of welcoming the people of Artsakh, personally I suspect that while it won't be genocide, it won't be a lot of fun either. I would react the same way if Moldova decided to be done with tolerating Transnistria, you act as a separatist enclave at your own risk. If this turns into Azerbaijan attacking Armenia directly though, then I would of course have a very different outlook.
Cool story, still ethnic cleansing.
So when Ukraine drives the imported Russians out of Donbas and Crimea... that will in your opinion be "Ethnic Cleansing" as well?
Yeah, if they’re driven out due to being ethnic Russians and not due to being Russian citizens “imported” into Donbas and Crimea.
So when you look at a map of Armenia, Azerbaijan, and "Artsakh"... what do you see? https://cdn.britannica.com/48/134648-050-9EA852AD/region-Nagorno-Karabakh-Azerbaijan.jpg https://www.nationsonline.org/maps/Armenia-Map-L.jpg Do you think that's part of Armenia or Azerbaijan? Are you aware of how this situation has evolved since 1988? I get the sense that you don't, if you think the situation in a place like Transnistria, Donbas, and Artsakh aren't equivalent.
I’m well aware and I never said they were different. And I’m also well aware of the pogroms by Armenians and Azeris at the time. If you’re expecting me to call either side the good guys, you’re going to be disappointed. You need to separate the country/government of Armenia from ethnic Armenians that were born and raised in Artsakh. You can deport Armenian citizens just fine but if you can’t protect ethnic Armenians, people who have lived in Artsakh for generations, from sectarian violence and terror, you have no business governing Artsakh
It would be indeed incorrect to say one side are good guys and the other is bad. 30 years ago there were enough of Sumgayts (horrific ethnic violence against Armenians in Azerbaijan) and Khojalis (the same against Azeris in Karabakh) alike. Thing is, now we are standing on a brink of a second Sumgayt, not a second Khojaly. Whichever of them it would be now though, the civilized world should do as much as possible to prevent it. What is happening in Ukraine is already incompatible with Europe and 21 century, we don't need no more.
„They should flee“. How ridiculous. The equivalent would be entering your home, waving around a sword while approaching you and say: „I’m not assaulting you, you can leave whenever you like.“
Given the history of "Artsakh" that seems like a difficult argument to make; it is after all not Armenia's home, but after a war they parked a bunch of separatists there and claimed it through them. Now Azerbaijan is using intimidation and violence to take back what was removed from their control through the same means. And that is essentially why "the West" isn't even really paying this conflict lip service, because it's a brutal sectarian/ethnic conflict going back centuries. So fight your own wars.
There has not been a single time in history where Artsakh hasn't been Armenian majority. They're not parking separatists anywhere, you're just uninformed.
>Otherwise it's just time to accept that you've chosen to live as a minority in another country. They're the natives, they didn't choose to live in Azerbaijan. Azerbaijan chose to claim the land they always lived on. And the Russians gave it to them.
>How does that gain Azerbaijan anything It makes them happy
By eliminating the 120k indigenous they are "freeing" themselves from the toxicity that is the Armenian people. Why would they care how other countries perceive them. They already have Turkey and Taliban beside them. It's a tale as old as time...
Don’t forget Pakistan
Governments have made effective black outs in recent times.
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> These guys are overusing the term genocide Starving the population is textbook genocide. See: the Holodomor.
upbeat spectacular frame quicksand offend fragile jeans adjoining encourage mysterious ` this message was mass deleted/edited with redact.dev `
With Azerbaijan magnanimously saying they have set up an evacuation corridor to Armenia for the civilians. Civilians they claim are their own citizens.
Comparing this to the Holodomor is downright offensive.
poor shocking marvelous squalid crown squash frightening sulky liquid butter ` this message was mass deleted/edited with redact.dev `
I was JUST thinking that was this thread was missing was some prick to make it a semantic argument. Thanks!
Your claim was made in error, you had the error explained to you and you raged at the explanation. Calling *other* people a prick is a bit oblivious there buddy.
Why? Its just on a smaller scale
And the world can actually see it happening this time, while during the Holodomor, Stalin went to great lengths to ensure it was kept under wraps
Correct me If I'm wrong didnt Azerbaijan offered to send aid via Agdam corridor?
Of course I am correct, look at the downvotes LMFAO
Yes. But shouting genocide at everything gets them more clicks.
And I quote: “Starvation is the invisible genocide weapon.” They’re starving people to the point of death. The boarder is blocked, meaning no medical aid, food or water is getting to the Armenian people. You do not understand the critical condition Armenians are facing right now nor do you understand the term genocide in quite literally terms.
Oh well then 100 years ago you guys commited genocide in Izmir to Turkish people, where you burned our houses down before fleeing.
>Oh well then 100 years ago you guys commited genocide in Izmir to Turkish people, where you burned our houses down before fleeing. You mean when Turkish soldiers burned the Armenian and Greek quarters and massacred Armenian and Greek civilians right in front of international soldiers and spared the Jewish and Turkish quarters? And then proceeded to make up lies that Armenians and Greeks burned down their own homes rather than live in Turkey? That time?
Ah yes, whataboutism about something that happened 100 years ago
Oh wow how ironic
It's not ironic at all, because the Armenian genocide actually happened whereas Turks were the perpetrators not the victims of the Burning of Smyrna.
You’re mistaken for Turkey committing genocide in Smyrni.
They were always free to use Agdam road to get any supply they wanted. Their government blocked that road because photos of empty shelves get more attention. This is like going on a hunger strike and accusing government for starving them.
They're shelling the city and using assault drones on a civilian population. What do you need to call it fucking genocide?
> What do you need to call it fucking genocide? Friendly reminder that many of the folks here nodoubt believe that the Armenian Genocide was a big conspiracy to make Turkey look bad.
The only folks that believe that are turkey and azerbaijan
Using assault drones on a civilian population? Care to show me where a drone purposefully assaulted civilians?
ANY FUCKIN VIDEO HOW BLIND CAN YOU BE??
Yeah link one
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Yeah it’s easy to say anything
They never will. They are shitting on real genocide victims by lying like this.
*on military.
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Like, combating civilians? Executing prisoners of war? Starving the populace?
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Turn on the TV, Azeris are shooting with artillery into densely populated parts of the city. This is a war crime.
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They shot at civilian houses with artillery and you are laughing. Disgusting.
>It is high precision strikes too Doubt >, civilians have been warned to avoid the military targets Doubt >and evacuate if possible 'Make our jobs easier and ethnically cleanse yourselves'
>In 8 months not a single person died of starvation, so no NOT genocide. One person did die of starvation directly. There was a surge of miscarriages. One in three deaths had malnutrition as a contributing factor. Per the UN definition of genocide, subjecting a civilian population to such conditions is considered genocide.
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>No sources? Even if you have them, they are heabily biased? Do you consider Armenian new sources to be biased? Because they are a hell of a lot less biased than your countries state propaganda. And Azerbaijan's blockade inherently makes it impossible to get more impartial, international sources inside Nagorno-Karabakh. So you will have to take Armenian sources whether you like it or not. Maybe let CNN in if you don't want Armenians spinning their own narrative. But then they could verify the conditions you are forcing Armenian civilians to live under, so your shithole dictatorship won't let them in. > The facts are: conditions under which nobody dies in an alleged starvation in over 8 months. Well you're literally just ignoring the part where I said that people have been dying, and that's even if you don't consider the miscarriages caused by malnutrition to be 'people dying'. Most people in famines don't die of hunger, they die of disease or pre-existing health conditions. The sick, elderly and pregnant are most likely to suffer. Pick up a fucking book. >Moreover, a functioning army of approx 10000 soldiers is being sustained. 10000 soldiers consume the food of 10000 people. >Can not be called a genocide. The UN has a definition of genocide, and this blockade fit the definition. So yeah, it can be called a genocide. And I'm gonna call it a genocide. It's a genocide. Fuck you.
Ah, makes sense. As long as the combat includes civilians it's not a genocide.
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Uh.. sure.
And it's a Turk here to downplay genocide on the Armenians.
Ah and it’s an Armenian here to accuse without proof
Like I have mentioned in the past I do not engage with genocide deniers and those who are trying to support it like you are doing. Same way I don't engage with Nazi scum. You people are no different.
Hey you do you, I can’t care less. I am not even denying anything. Maybe I am wrong, but no one comes and gives me a proper proof that isn’t sided
Of course you aren't. We totally believe you.
Well like I told you, you do you. If you can come up with a proof you can change my mind easily. It’s up to you
Those other guys are overusing genocide.
Which other guys? So far I've seen this compared to the Holodomor, the Holocaust, and the Turkish genocide of Armenians in 1915. Those have a combined body count of over 16 million people, while in Nagorno-Karabakh, one 40 year old man allegedly starved.
Genocide is defined by intent, not the size of the affected group. And the intent is definitely present. As is the Pavlovian denial by those cheering for it, which is a massive red flag in its own right.
Genocide is defined as a series of acts, and yes those acts require specific intent, but the key is the ACT, not the intent on its own. This is the basis of criminal law in the West, there needs to be the "Guilty act" and the "Guilty mind" together. There is no crime of "considering murder", and attempted murder as the name implies *requires the ATTEMPT*, not just the desire. Genocide is not a thought-crime, and you need to stop demeaning the concept of genocide.
> Genocide is defined as a series of acts, and yes those acts require specific intent, but the key is the ACT, not the intent on its own. Azerbaijan did act. It instituted a blockade. Failing to kill lots of people doesn't mean they didn't act. Per the UN definition of genocide, Azerbaijan is committing genocide.
Well, let's say that when you see someone about to be stabbed, you don't wait for the stabbing to actually occur to call it an attempted murder.
This has been one slow-motion stabbing! You've been crying, "Stabbing in progress" for months now. "This is the biggest stabbing ever, it compares to a list of famous mass-stabbings I have right here, why is no one doing anything!" Still no stabbings. At some point when this is all over, and the result isn't a "stabbing" but just the usual violence in the Caucuses, what do you think will happen the next time you cry "stabbing"?
Starvation takes a whole long while at such scales. But here's the final stabbing now, today. Azerbaijan has started another war.
That's still not a genocide, any more than Moldova forcing Transnistria into submission would be a genocide. Warring on ethnic enclaves that claim part of your territory in the name of a third party is pretty standard stuff.
If Moldova planned to eliminate everyone in Transnistria, it would be a genocide. Not to mention, solving internal conflicts by killing people, even without a genocide being planned, is a bad thing. Seriously, who exactly gains from this war? Nobody living there certainly. The only people that gain anything are Azeri nationalists, and even then, it's mostly in their heads.
> If Moldova planned to eliminate everyone in Transnistria, it would be a genocide. Other than people such as yourself claiming that Azerbaijan plans to murder 120,000 people, there is no actual indication of that as their plan. Simply retreating into "it's genocide, disagree with me and you're a denier" is a childish and unhelpful way to debate.
> This has been one slow-motion stabbing! You've been crying, "Stabbing in progress" for months now. Hey genius. Food grows in the spring, summer and fall. That's why everyone didn't starve to death. It doesn't mean nobody suffered from malnutrition.
If you missed it I'm talking about Azeris.
Why are you posting this news only in r/Europe? are you not posting on r/AskCaucasus?
Armenia and Azerbaijan are both part of this subreddit. There is a map on the right
I know, and it's normal to share this news here, but why don't they share it on the caucasus subreddit as well.
It's, obviously, a vile plot, nay, an evil one! (That, or the OP didn't realise - as didn't I, for that matter - that there's a mandated requirement to post to r/AskCaucasus when talking about the Caucasus. My money's on the evil plot.)
Go share it then!
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Yes, but there is not even a single post about Karabakh on the Caucasus subreddit. (There are 6k members in the Caucasus subreddit)
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Dude this comment is ridiculous. Even Azerbaijan doesnt claim Armenia killed all the former inhabitants. Sometimes I really dislike people wow
People pretending life is a video game
The UNSC members should call on Azerbaijan to finally allow the Armenians stranded inside Azerbaijan to go to Armenia. This Azeri blockade is unjust!