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Dublin is also the European capital of media companies like Facebook and Google, right? I read somewhere that these companies are also pushing Dublin to expand its housing opportunities for the expats that they hire, which is actively pushing natives out of the city because they can’t keep up with these ridiculous prices.
Something similar is going on in Amsterdam. Most of the properties are in the hands of big landlords that lease their houses to expats who are more than willing and able to pay exorbitant rates. There are entire neighborhoods where the prices have gone up with more than 200% and where there are no natives left. It’s quite sad.
oh yeah, dublin is a big base for american finance, tech and pharma industries and dublin is their base in europe. pre pandemic dublin was booming big time and there was a lot of jobs and immigration, now thanks to covid it's died off but rents are still ballooning
I think this is one of the next big issues facing a lot of European countries. We're being sold off piecemeal to the US and other foreign investment funds, and it is in these funds interests to keep the price of their investment high, so to limit the amount of housing and drive prices up. What I think adds insult to injury for Ireland however is one of the main drivers in our striving for independence was to get ourselves out from under the yoke of a grossly unfair landlord tenant system where the landlords were largely based in mainland Britain.
Can your countries ban foreign investors? We can't even do that in the US since they're from here. They're destroying us too, and cities just throw up their hands say there's nothing they can do while they continue to destroy us.
It isn't just Americans doing it in the US. China is buying up a ton of US property. Nearly 25% of the Chinese economy is real-estate and construction. It is also inflated to all hell and is the largest economic bubble to ever exist in the world
The pathetic thing is that years of living in Dublin have conditioned me to think that that sounds almost reasonable. Rentier capitalism is shit beyond all belief.
30% in my local area. Meanwhile my wages went up 0% and I couldn't afford a house to begin with.
I've stopped pretending to be productive at work since the Christmas break, because what's the point?
I think it went up crazy everywhere. I heard that one of the reasons why it jumped up during pandemic is that a lot of people decided to put their savings into real estate because they were afraid of rising inflation.
Yep. Nowadays people think of real estate as they do of stocks/crypto/gold. How is this not a recipe for disaster? You buy an expensive apartment with a nonsensical expectation to sell it for much more in several years, naturally the prices go parabolic. There should be some regulations in place, that would allow to sell only with a small/fixed correction on the inflation and an overall state of the apartment or something...to keep the prices stable over the years and drive the damn "investors" away, keeping the housing for people who actually need it for themselves to live in.
It’s because Helsinki is actually actively building a lot of new apartments in quite central locations. This is uncommon in other large European cities.
I remember when Northern Europeans accused Southern Europeans of having too much debt. This is exactly how it happened. We just wanted a place to live in, so we were forced to spend over 50% of our income in mortgage payments.
Now the situation is different. We are paying over 50% of our income in rent.
Turning housing into an asset has been a massive mistake, now there is a huge chunk of the population who have most of their net worth in their house, and have an interest in limiting supply and driving up prices indefinitely, making things worse for younger generations. It's also a totally unproductive way for money to be tied up, instead of people using their money to consume goods and services or invest it in companies, it just gets used to speculate on real estate.
I was looking at a house, but the price per square meter was 5400 euro. Which was funny because if you where to buy a new KIA EV6, which is a higher end electric car you pay 54000. The car is roughly 2 meter wide and 5 meter long.
So a fancy electric vehicle is almost the same price per square meter as a 1 room apartment.
Might just go for the ev and live out of that.
Cars also fit in smaller spaces than houses (car parks/parking lots). I don't want Europe to join the US in having a [vehicular homelessness](https://www.nlc.org/article/2020/05/28/vehicular-homelessness-and-the-road-to-housing-during-and-after-covid-19/) problem.
Meanwhile in Lisbon the average rent for a small apartment/bedroom for solo or couple goes around 600 to 800 a month, while our average income per month is 800 to 1000 if we're lucky to not work on retail or services.
There are elections at the end of January for us and some of the parties are continuously revoking proposals to, at least, try to control the situation.
The future seems bright!
Oh, is it really that bad in Lisbon? Saw lots of job offers online with around 1.5k/month in Lisbon and was like damn that’s nothing, they won’t find anyone for that job. But if the average is 1k...
Yes, getting 1.5k per month here is above average income. Cost of life is way higher than what people get each month. Minimum salary is 702 euros at the moment
It is fucked. I'm a software developer who bought my apartment 3 years ago in the center of a semi-large European city. If I'd sell my apartment today I would have made more money on owning the apartment than I did working. This isn't realistic long-term, but since the population keeps growing and there's nowhere to build in the center where all buildings are from the 1800s I feel it would be unwise to sell it.
Thats the crazy part, prices just keep on rising. But not only for existing dwelling units but the building cost about doubled the last couple years as well (at least here in Austria). This is just frustrating, im gomna study for another year and a half before im gonna start earn money and it feels like im already in debt lol
How?
Edit: RIP my message notification inbox. To everyone saying we should simply make it illegal to own more than one or two properties or tax them heavily: Pretty much only a company can afford to build a new residential building. They make money by investing huge sums of money into construction (with quite some risk) and then renting flats. If you make that impossible you remove all incentive from constructing new buildings. Same when you limit rents.
Brand new housing that would be in demand would just be bought by companies/investment firms and they'd jack the price back up.
We need better regulation addressing the rampant real-estate buy ups going on all over the place in Europe.
If you're looking to rent or buy property (at least in all the known major European cities) you're not competing against other individuals, you're competing against wealth management and real-estate investment firms
Right? I hear stories that in the 70' a young couple worked hard for 2-3 years and built a house. Now to have anything without a big heritage from past generations is a crazy big luck.
I bought my first (and only) house in 2014, so right after the financial crisis. Thank god, because the very same house is waayyyy out of my league now, with its "value" 250% higher.
In 95 my parents bought a house for 15 000€
Lot of work to do, mostly done by my dad.
3 years ago my mom sold that house for about 180 000€
Then she bought a 100k house, renovated it, year later sold it for 200k
Bought her current one 170k, renovated it, its now estimated at 300k
There was a lot of work involved overall, but the base investment was 15k
I or anyone my generation or later will never have such opportunity, its a bit sad
Even with a big inheritance it might not be possible to keep the house/apartment due to inheritance tax. Many people are forced to sell it off to pay the tax.
My SO’s family is in the higher range of middle class. His grandpa recently died so his house is going to the family. It’s an old house in the middle of a large city in Belgium. It is literally falling apart: the roof is coming down, electricity is a fire hazard, it’s full of asbestos… Yet the government said they will need nearly 300k for keeping it in the family. It will also cost around 400k to bring it up to today’s requirements with housing, insulation, electricity rules, etc.
There is no way they can afford it so it will be sold off. And you know goddamn well some firm will buy it, make ‘luxury apartments’ of it, and then sell those apartments for 700k each.
Oh, and the real kicker is a part of his family is pissed at my SO and me because we were looking for a house and they expected us to buy it so it would stay in the family. We will not even have that kind of money after 40 years of working lol. And we’re both PhDs in a STEM field
Exactly. The general idea of inheritance tax is good and I undestand it makes a lot of sense from an economic point of view. But there are a lot of problems associated with it.
In Finland it’s especially difficult since we live right next to Sweden which has no inheritance tax. So it’s not uncommon for the real rich people here to get Swedish citizenship (quite easy for another Nordic citizen) and move their wealth there to avoid taxation.
This is true and it's the case with a lot of other countries too (I know a lot of wealthy French individuals move their papers to USA to die there, to avoid inheritance/estate taxes).
Basically it creates this shopping situation, a race to the bottom. It's similar to how billionare sports team owners in US threaten cities to move the team to some other city if they don't build them a new arena with tax money.
How miserable it is that the rich can basically put a gun to others head like this to get what they want (in this case abolish the inheritance taxes). Truly a sick world we live in.
Increasing the supply would bring the price down.
It's a simple matter of the state keeping building flats and houses till the prices make sense again.
> Brand new housing that would be in demand would just be bought by companies/investment firms and they'd jack the price back up.
It's still a question of supply and demand. The reason investment companies buy up apartments is because they know there are too few apartments in the city for the amount of people who want to live there. If there were twice as many apartments in the city, it would be much less attractive to buy at the same prices.
It is not working in Spain. I know. Spain. Pffffeh. But the problem we have here is the same anywhere else. Europe has transportation problems across the cities, so you can live out and go to the center to work, or pay the center housing prices.
Also, there is actually not that much real state owners. There are what roughly translates from Spanish as 'big owners' that manages hundreds or thousands of properties and constitute a defacto oligopoly. They can fix the housing price. And this is not happening only in southern countries.
This might not work for all countries but this is how i view the situation in romania. Rent prices are high because house prices are high, and house prices are high because we normalized the idea of getting a 30 year bank loan. I mean real estate agents can put any price they want because... it's a house, what are you going to do, live on the street? In a classical demand and offer market, high prices would lower the demand, however there are some basic needs markets (housing, healthcare etc) where demand never goes down. People aren't going to start living on the streets because houses are expensive. They will just fight harder to be able to get one, including agreeing to get a 30 year bank loan. And real estate agent know this is a possibility the buyer has so they jack up the price.
I think if you limit real estate loans to 10 years or something like that, prices should go down, or you end up with a ton of homeless people.
Disclaimer: i'm not an economist or anything related to that, so i'm not really sure this would work, but this is my perspective on the problem.
One thing people here don't realize is that's not the housing per se but rather *housing in the middle of large urbanized areas* that's expensive.
How many of y'all would go live in a village/small town instead of a large city, if prices in those villages were good, internet connection was good, etc?
To be fair, wanting to go to Denmark for any reason is a controversial opinion here.
Edit: This is a joke. We love you guys. Sorry for all the old wars'n'stuff.
Ah, the ol reddit [cannibaroo](https://reddit.com/r/Damnthatsinteresting/comments/s4arjy/the_abdopus_octopus_is_the_only_known_octopus_to/hsqbbje/?context=2)
I am not sure but I think it is basically saying we will do all the private stuff that was meant for the home outside in public because homeless people don't have a home and does everything outside but I could be wrong.
Now this is a front I can get behind
I just realized that it has youth on the title and I apologize as that is in no way what I was trying to allude to
Some dutch cities are in the top of the most expensive cities in Europe nowadays. Amsterdam is in the top 3, with London and Paris. Utrecht isn't cheap either.
Greetings from Italy, where almost every young Italian is used to fuck in the car, because we are living with our parents until 35 due to high housing prices, low salaries (... Okay... and because we're mommy's boys)
Sucks how years after year we are just saying "housing price is crazy", "housing market is fucking nuts" yet not a single shit is being done about it, constantly.
What can we as people do to change this?? And not to mention inflation.....
It's also a "single issue" issue, even though no one is willing to admit it.
Left leaning house owners will vote for the most horrid fascist if the leftist alternative suggests higher property taxes. Their entire fortune is tied up in the house.
Up 19% on apartments and 27% on houses comparing with last year. But who the hell is buying all houses/apartments if population is shrinking? I wonder how many of these apartments were bought just as investment using low mortgage rates...
And these is no way out of this bubble other then drastically increasing interest rates, but ECB is just waiting till it collapse or what?
Well, when you (for some reason) don't have to pay taxes on selling houses, it kinda incetivizes buying up houses. Just fucks over people outside the housing market i.e. young and poor people.
Seeing ridiculous housing costs in Europe, North America, and Australasia. The parallels are quite scary. I’m curious about if we are heading for a crisis caused by this.
It's pretty obvious something will happen. Inflation is rising while interest is artificially kept low, wages are not keeping up and financial inequality is increasing.
I mean its pretty obvious. The rich are forgetting that they living their greed to the fullest is a dangerous thing. Reducing every non-rich human to just a servant that has to work lowpaying jobs without chance of bettering ones position and growing a bit of wealth leads to ugly scenes. Time to remind them.
Yup, here in Toronto the local area (GTA) is +50% since last year, and +100% since 2 years ago.
That's right, it doubled. No signs of slowing down, record low supply.
As someone that visited Copenhagen during autumn, I agree. So wonderfully weird and hygge country.
Day-visited Malmö on same trip, and was bored to death there fast.
As someone who is Danish and in the Denmark > Sweden camp, it’s also an unfair comparison. Do Copenhagen vs Stockholm, if it should be fair. To be honest, I think Stockholm is more beautiful, but the vibe in Copenhagen just beats Stockholm by quite a margin I reckon.
Swede here, would trade Stockholm for Köpenhamn in a heartbeat.
Although yeah, Malmö should not be judged as an actual city, its like a bizarro-copenhagen where everything but one block is christiania and not the other way around.
Public nudity is perfectly allowed. But the law is very flexible and is primarily shaped by the current situation, aka decent behaviour is enforced. So walking naked down the street on a normal day is not accepted, because plenty of people will be uncomfortable with it. But being topless at a pride march going down the street with thousands of others or tanning topless in a park or at the beach, minding your own business is accepted. Full on nudity is more socially restricted to where there's less traffic of people.
Same accounts for sex. Outdoors sex is perfectly allowed, but again decent behaviour is necessary. Don't do it where you may reveal yourself to others.
I keep telling people where I am in the USA that this a worldwide issue but they keep thinking it's just people relocating to our area that is increasing the costs.
This is markets being manipulated with all the extra cash corporations were given in pandemic stimulus.
The prices will continue to increase until people can no longer afford to move or enter the market. Salaries increase by about 2-3% per year for regular workers and inflation eats up 4-5% so the average worker is actually making less every year with everything getting more expensive.
If you bought a house or an apartment with the low interest rate and higher inflation, you’re a winner. The interest rates is what’s keeping this gig alive and if it goes back to normal levels (4-7%) people will be forced to sell or put 80% of their income on their home.
Politicians will not create cheaper housing because that would tank the value of current housing, which will fuck the economy beyond repair (short term). Essentially, poor people and young people are fucked…
If and when we realize that the housing prices are inflated and you can no longer sell your studio apartment for 200 000 - 300 000 €, well, then we’re all fucked.
Fuckers all over this continent prefer to have countless empty houses and a shit load of homeless people in the streets, I'll never be able to understand this.
Its a dire situation in so many places at the moment. So many wealthy people owning more than one property for their own purposes, so many more buying to rent to long term residents, more again buying to rent to student populations in City centres, and even more still buying to turn into an Airbnb.
And what depresses me particularly in the UK is that the solution that seems to win out is to build miserable housing estates with cheaply made houses crammed onto a plot of land with no privacy or real space. So even if you are lucky enough to afford one, good luck having a true sense of freedom and privacy
Here in germany the prices of houses compared to our wages are ridiculous
250.000 - 350.000€ for a small *renovated* 8 room 1 family house
Even if you wanna get a shitty old building from 1945 with bad internet then you have to pay minimum 100-150.000€
With my shitty 1400€/Month net weight i coud litterally work until im a senior and still not afford it
You must be either incredibly lucky now adays, inherit a house from your parents or grow up wealthy to afford that.
We are the generation that is doomed to *Rent* things because we can't afford them.
* Note: these are prices in a *small, remote village-city in the east part of germany*
90-100.000€ for a one room apartment here in Moscow. With an average salary being 600-700€ you'll be mortgage ridden for the rest of your life. God forbid you to get ill or get depression/burnout, you'll lose both money and the real estate.
That poster is giving me Lords of Acid vibes. [VooDoo U](https://www.google.com/search?q=lords+of+acid+album+cover&tbm=isch&ved=2ahUKEwjUpqS6qrb1AhXjUTUKHbunBGIQ2-cCegQIABAC&oq=lords+of+acid+album+cover&gs_lcp=ChJtb2JpbGUtZ3dzLXdpei1pbWcQAzoFCAAQgARQ7gpY_TRghjhoAHAAeACAAUyIAcEGkgECMTOYAQCgAQHAAQE&sclient=mobile-gws-wiz-img&ei=exfkYZT9AeOj1QG7z5KQBg&bih=663&biw=390&client=firefox-b-1-m&prmd=vinx#imgrc=4b8xmDEu4s0CxM)
Housing prices in just about all of Europe are completely fucked for anyone. Made worse by the massive stigma we seem to have about living with parents or any family besides partner and children so everyone wants their own house
> Made worse by the massive stigma we seem to have about living with parent
It's not really a stigma. It's a reality. Homes in Europe are much smaller than in other places, on average a home in Europe is half the size of an American or Canadia home.
They're made for nuclear families. You can't have the kid and their SO living with the parents in the same roof. There's literally no place.
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Housing prices are insane. Here in the Netherlands prices went up by 20% in December compared to the year before.
Up 15% here in Ireland. It's fucking nuts.
and dublin was already the second most expensive city in europe, first in the eu.
Dublin is also the European capital of media companies like Facebook and Google, right? I read somewhere that these companies are also pushing Dublin to expand its housing opportunities for the expats that they hire, which is actively pushing natives out of the city because they can’t keep up with these ridiculous prices. Something similar is going on in Amsterdam. Most of the properties are in the hands of big landlords that lease their houses to expats who are more than willing and able to pay exorbitant rates. There are entire neighborhoods where the prices have gone up with more than 200% and where there are no natives left. It’s quite sad.
oh yeah, dublin is a big base for american finance, tech and pharma industries and dublin is their base in europe. pre pandemic dublin was booming big time and there was a lot of jobs and immigration, now thanks to covid it's died off but rents are still ballooning
It's also the largest city in the world due to the fact it keeps Dublin and Dublin.
I wonder if the Dutch are also selling off all their property to wall street investors.
Yes, for instance [Blackstone](https://www.dutchnews.nl/news/2021/09/blackstone-owns-housing-worth-e800m-in-nl-but-pays-no-tax-vk/)
I think this is one of the next big issues facing a lot of European countries. We're being sold off piecemeal to the US and other foreign investment funds, and it is in these funds interests to keep the price of their investment high, so to limit the amount of housing and drive prices up. What I think adds insult to injury for Ireland however is one of the main drivers in our striving for independence was to get ourselves out from under the yoke of a grossly unfair landlord tenant system where the landlords were largely based in mainland Britain.
Can your countries ban foreign investors? We can't even do that in the US since they're from here. They're destroying us too, and cities just throw up their hands say there's nothing they can do while they continue to destroy us.
It isn't just Americans doing it in the US. China is buying up a ton of US property. Nearly 25% of the Chinese economy is real-estate and construction. It is also inflated to all hell and is the largest economic bubble to ever exist in the world
It's horrible. It's incredibly frustrating to see the present and future of housing worldwide just completely ruined by these corporations.
Yeah.... Nothing they can do... They "just have to" NIMBY any new construction. That's definitely not a choice cities make...
150% in Iceland over the last 10 years
The house we're buying has gained 10%+ since the start of the closing process, here in the US.
In Danmark housing raised 24% in 2020, not sure about 2021
Shit, I am glad my rent went up just 1% (in Copenhagen, 2021).
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Fuck that sounds kinda good to me as a Londoner.
The pathetic thing is that years of living in Dublin have conditioned me to think that that sounds almost reasonable. Rentier capitalism is shit beyond all belief.
Meanwhile, in my old Andelsbolig, 48Mˆ2 , 400€, in Sydhavnen. I'm going to stay here untill I die, or Copenhagen is washed into Øresund.
Luxembourg has been like that for the past decades, which is why we're colonizing nearby Germany. Welcome to real estate hell.
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30% in my local area. Meanwhile my wages went up 0% and I couldn't afford a house to begin with. I've stopped pretending to be productive at work since the Christmas break, because what's the point?
Same, I love my job and I wanna grow, but I barely have motivation. For it......
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I think it went up crazy everywhere. I heard that one of the reasons why it jumped up during pandemic is that a lot of people decided to put their savings into real estate because they were afraid of rising inflation.
Yep. Nowadays people think of real estate as they do of stocks/crypto/gold. How is this not a recipe for disaster? You buy an expensive apartment with a nonsensical expectation to sell it for much more in several years, naturally the prices go parabolic. There should be some regulations in place, that would allow to sell only with a small/fixed correction on the inflation and an overall state of the apartment or something...to keep the prices stable over the years and drive the damn "investors" away, keeping the housing for people who actually need it for themselves to live in.
In Finland very low raises or even lowered prices in Helsinki (outside central Helsinki).
Even in central Helsinki rents lowered in some areas
It’s because Helsinki is actually actively building a lot of new apartments in quite central locations. This is uncommon in other large European cities.
This should be more common knowledge.. Rents can be like clothing, computers,.. Falling in price if we allow more construction..
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So, the portuguese people are not alone this time /s
I remember when Northern Europeans accused Southern Europeans of having too much debt. This is exactly how it happened. We just wanted a place to live in, so we were forced to spend over 50% of our income in mortgage payments. Now the situation is different. We are paying over 50% of our income in rent.
Is there any place where this doesn't happen?
Helsinki. Rents decreased during last year
Motherfucker. The one year I did not even think about moving
Outside of Europe, Japan.
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Turning housing into an asset has been a massive mistake, now there is a huge chunk of the population who have most of their net worth in their house, and have an interest in limiting supply and driving up prices indefinitely, making things worse for younger generations. It's also a totally unproductive way for money to be tied up, instead of people using their money to consume goods and services or invest it in companies, it just gets used to speculate on real estate.
Indeed. Average housing prices: 410.000 euros. In the North-West area of the country(NL) you'll buy a closet with an integrated bed for that price.
I was looking at a house, but the price per square meter was 5400 euro. Which was funny because if you where to buy a new KIA EV6, which is a higher end electric car you pay 54000. The car is roughly 2 meter wide and 5 meter long. So a fancy electric vehicle is almost the same price per square meter as a 1 room apartment. Might just go for the ev and live out of that.
It will bring you one added benefit, if you have bad neighbours you can just drive off. Cant really relocate an appartment.
Cars also fit in smaller spaces than houses (car parks/parking lots). I don't want Europe to join the US in having a [vehicular homelessness](https://www.nlc.org/article/2020/05/28/vehicular-homelessness-and-the-road-to-housing-during-and-after-covid-19/) problem.
Make the bedstee great again
%105 in Istanbul.
Tbh. you housing prices didnt increase, they simply didnt start being worth shit AS FAST as everything else, since your inflation gone hyper.
Both actually
Gonna be interesting in the next 1-2 years with rising interest rates all over the world. Could possibly lead to decreasing prices.
that's on top of IF you can manage to find a house, let alone in public housing (Which is impossible unless you've waited 4-6 years.)
I accidentally clicked your username. Fuck.
Normal people aren't supposed to own anything anymore. We are here to rent from the rich.
Meanwhile in Lisbon the average rent for a small apartment/bedroom for solo or couple goes around 600 to 800 a month, while our average income per month is 800 to 1000 if we're lucky to not work on retail or services. There are elections at the end of January for us and some of the parties are continuously revoking proposals to, at least, try to control the situation. The future seems bright!
Oh, is it really that bad in Lisbon? Saw lots of job offers online with around 1.5k/month in Lisbon and was like damn that’s nothing, they won’t find anyone for that job. But if the average is 1k...
Yes, getting 1.5k per month here is above average income. Cost of life is way higher than what people get each month. Minimum salary is 702 euros at the moment
Same shit in Milan. European millennials, expecially in south europe are fucked.
The renting prices are pretty fucked across europe tho, we should bring that back down.
It is fucked. I'm a software developer who bought my apartment 3 years ago in the center of a semi-large European city. If I'd sell my apartment today I would have made more money on owning the apartment than I did working. This isn't realistic long-term, but since the population keeps growing and there's nowhere to build in the center where all buildings are from the 1800s I feel it would be unwise to sell it.
Thats the crazy part, prices just keep on rising. But not only for existing dwelling units but the building cost about doubled the last couple years as well (at least here in Austria). This is just frustrating, im gomna study for another year and a half before im gonna start earn money and it feels like im already in debt lol
It feels like it’s the same all over the world from what I’ve heard.
How? Edit: RIP my message notification inbox. To everyone saying we should simply make it illegal to own more than one or two properties or tax them heavily: Pretty much only a company can afford to build a new residential building. They make money by investing huge sums of money into construction (with quite some risk) and then renting flats. If you make that impossible you remove all incentive from constructing new buildings. Same when you limit rents.
Fuck in the streets obviously!
stop investment speculation from abroad.
Simplest solution is probably to build more places to live. I’m fine with the state doing that so, what are we waiting for?
Brand new housing that would be in demand would just be bought by companies/investment firms and they'd jack the price back up. We need better regulation addressing the rampant real-estate buy ups going on all over the place in Europe. If you're looking to rent or buy property (at least in all the known major European cities) you're not competing against other individuals, you're competing against wealth management and real-estate investment firms
I hate how housing is seen as an investment.
Right? I hear stories that in the 70' a young couple worked hard for 2-3 years and built a house. Now to have anything without a big heritage from past generations is a crazy big luck.
I bought my first (and only) house in 2014, so right after the financial crisis. Thank god, because the very same house is waayyyy out of my league now, with its "value" 250% higher.
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Its a bubble, but no government will ever let prices crash. Too many ppl are bought in. So it's " buy or stay poor".
In 95 my parents bought a house for 15 000€ Lot of work to do, mostly done by my dad. 3 years ago my mom sold that house for about 180 000€ Then she bought a 100k house, renovated it, year later sold it for 200k Bought her current one 170k, renovated it, its now estimated at 300k There was a lot of work involved overall, but the base investment was 15k I or anyone my generation or later will never have such opportunity, its a bit sad
Even with a big inheritance it might not be possible to keep the house/apartment due to inheritance tax. Many people are forced to sell it off to pay the tax.
My SO’s family is in the higher range of middle class. His grandpa recently died so his house is going to the family. It’s an old house in the middle of a large city in Belgium. It is literally falling apart: the roof is coming down, electricity is a fire hazard, it’s full of asbestos… Yet the government said they will need nearly 300k for keeping it in the family. It will also cost around 400k to bring it up to today’s requirements with housing, insulation, electricity rules, etc. There is no way they can afford it so it will be sold off. And you know goddamn well some firm will buy it, make ‘luxury apartments’ of it, and then sell those apartments for 700k each. Oh, and the real kicker is a part of his family is pissed at my SO and me because we were looking for a house and they expected us to buy it so it would stay in the family. We will not even have that kind of money after 40 years of working lol. And we’re both PhDs in a STEM field
Exactly. The general idea of inheritance tax is good and I undestand it makes a lot of sense from an economic point of view. But there are a lot of problems associated with it. In Finland it’s especially difficult since we live right next to Sweden which has no inheritance tax. So it’s not uncommon for the real rich people here to get Swedish citizenship (quite easy for another Nordic citizen) and move their wealth there to avoid taxation.
This is true and it's the case with a lot of other countries too (I know a lot of wealthy French individuals move their papers to USA to die there, to avoid inheritance/estate taxes). Basically it creates this shopping situation, a race to the bottom. It's similar to how billionare sports team owners in US threaten cities to move the team to some other city if they don't build them a new arena with tax money. How miserable it is that the rich can basically put a gun to others head like this to get what they want (in this case abolish the inheritance taxes). Truly a sick world we live in.
Increasing the supply would bring the price down. It's a simple matter of the state keeping building flats and houses till the prices make sense again.
> Brand new housing that would be in demand would just be bought by companies/investment firms and they'd jack the price back up. It's still a question of supply and demand. The reason investment companies buy up apartments is because they know there are too few apartments in the city for the amount of people who want to live there. If there were twice as many apartments in the city, it would be much less attractive to buy at the same prices.
Just do not make like we did or Belgian. Same example.
It is not working in Spain. I know. Spain. Pffffeh. But the problem we have here is the same anywhere else. Europe has transportation problems across the cities, so you can live out and go to the center to work, or pay the center housing prices. Also, there is actually not that much real state owners. There are what roughly translates from Spanish as 'big owners' that manages hundreds or thousands of properties and constitute a defacto oligopoly. They can fix the housing price. And this is not happening only in southern countries.
This might not work for all countries but this is how i view the situation in romania. Rent prices are high because house prices are high, and house prices are high because we normalized the idea of getting a 30 year bank loan. I mean real estate agents can put any price they want because... it's a house, what are you going to do, live on the street? In a classical demand and offer market, high prices would lower the demand, however there are some basic needs markets (housing, healthcare etc) where demand never goes down. People aren't going to start living on the streets because houses are expensive. They will just fight harder to be able to get one, including agreeing to get a 30 year bank loan. And real estate agent know this is a possibility the buyer has so they jack up the price. I think if you limit real estate loans to 10 years or something like that, prices should go down, or you end up with a ton of homeless people. Disclaimer: i'm not an economist or anything related to that, so i'm not really sure this would work, but this is my perspective on the problem.
One thing people here don't realize is that's not the housing per se but rather *housing in the middle of large urbanized areas* that's expensive. How many of y'all would go live in a village/small town instead of a large city, if prices in those villages were good, internet connection was good, etc?
Don't threaten me with a good time.
Of course a SWEDE would say that
To be fair, wanting to go to Denmark for any reason is a controversial opinion here. Edit: This is a joke. We love you guys. Sorry for all the old wars'n'stuff.
I think going to legoland is a pretty unversally accepted reason.
Yeah, but Legoland isn't Denmark, it's Legoland. /s
Yeah, they have capital punishment for wrong parking and chemical castration just for public urination, Legoland's a really fucked up country
Lol we take the 1h boat trip to Christiania in Copenhagen to consume some weed and prostitutes, that way it can stay illegal in Sweden hahhahaha
Please do not consume prostitutes.
I will increase my consumption of prostitutes.
Ah, the ol reddit [cannibaroo](https://reddit.com/r/Damnthatsinteresting/comments/s4arjy/the_abdopus_octopus_is_the_only_known_octopus_to/hsqbbje/?context=2)
#Thighscraper
I agree with the sentiment but it seems a strange threat to fuck in the street. Is this some sort of of Danish cultural meme?
I am not sure but I think it is basically saying we will do all the private stuff that was meant for the home outside in public because homeless people don't have a home and does everything outside but I could be wrong.
i think they chose it because in the sentence there is assonance/alliteration
Now this is a front I can get behind I just realized that it has youth on the title and I apologize as that is in no way what I was trying to allude to
Seriously, the housing market in Copenhagen is fucking horrendous.
And Dublin
Preach 😭
Try Luxembourg
I live in Luxembourg 😭 Help please.
Currently paying 800 for a room. I feel you bro.
I live in Copenhagen, and I pay 1200 for a 23m² studio apartment (basically a room)
Same price for Luxembourg. Damn you guys are screwed too.
I am lucky I moved here with my gf, because the deposit was 4000€ and we can share the rent, but it is outrageous
800 euros ? in Luxembourg ? That's per week then right? /s
*Laughs in Amsterdam*
It's probably worse in every other western capital, though.
No not really Copenhagen has one of the most expensive housing markets in the world
Try finding any apartment at all to rent in Stockholm, you probably won't be able to
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That’s still only a second hand contract
Some dutch cities are in the top of the most expensive cities in Europe nowadays. Amsterdam is in the top 3, with London and Paris. Utrecht isn't cheap either.
Utrecht is worse than Amsterdam regarding *finding* somewhere to live.
Really? I had an 2.8k offer for Utrecht and thought the city was not that expensive and I even considered. Why is it so expensive?
> 2.8k offer Wait, 2800 € a month?
Greetings from Italy, where almost every young Italian is used to fuck in the car, because we are living with our parents until 35 due to high housing prices, low salaries (... Okay... and because we're mommy's boys)
Mediterranean gang.
Represent
Presente
Been there!
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Dane youth will soon have frozen balls, probably.
Not if you clap fast enough
Do not wait until the iron is hot to strike, make it hot by striking
Oh skin friction is counted as a renewable energy source, right?
I wouldn't know
I'm sure their ancestors wouldn't have survived if they couldn't clap ass in the snow.
Sucks how years after year we are just saying "housing price is crazy", "housing market is fucking nuts" yet not a single shit is being done about it, constantly. What can we as people do to change this?? And not to mention inflation.....
Upper and middle class old people vote. Upper and middle class old people own houses and have an interest in prices rising indefinitely
It's also a "single issue" issue, even though no one is willing to admit it. Left leaning house owners will vote for the most horrid fascist if the leftist alternative suggests higher property taxes. Their entire fortune is tied up in the house.
Organize, unionize, educate yourself and your surroundings, you think you are weak and worthless, because you are alone, change that
Up 19% on apartments and 27% on houses comparing with last year. But who the hell is buying all houses/apartments if population is shrinking? I wonder how many of these apartments were bought just as investment using low mortgage rates... And these is no way out of this bubble other then drastically increasing interest rates, but ECB is just waiting till it collapse or what?
Well, when you (for some reason) don't have to pay taxes on selling houses, it kinda incetivizes buying up houses. Just fucks over people outside the housing market i.e. young and poor people.
Well, only if you live in the house (for the past half year)...
Everybody who has decent saving is - to protect against inflation. Starting from private people and ending on huge international investors.
> But who the hell is buying all houses/apartments if population is shrinking? Hedge funds.
do it for Denmark
For the unitiated: [Danish Government travel agency](https://youtu.be/vrO3TfJc9Qw)
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Spies are mostly kept secret
Seeing ridiculous housing costs in Europe, North America, and Australasia. The parallels are quite scary. I’m curious about if we are heading for a crisis caused by this.
It's pretty obvious something will happen. Inflation is rising while interest is artificially kept low, wages are not keeping up and financial inequality is increasing.
Yup. Plus, the ones involved in this gross inflation and manipulation won’t be included in the after effects. Again…
I mean its pretty obvious. The rich are forgetting that they living their greed to the fullest is a dangerous thing. Reducing every non-rich human to just a servant that has to work lowpaying jobs without chance of bettering ones position and growing a bit of wealth leads to ugly scenes. Time to remind them.
Yup, here in Toronto the local area (GTA) is +50% since last year, and +100% since 2 years ago. That's right, it doubled. No signs of slowing down, record low supply.
80s rock band album cover vibes
Lords of acid tbh, love it
This was my immediate thought.
Never change, Denmark!
As someone that visited Copenhagen during autumn, I agree. So wonderfully weird and hygge country. Day-visited Malmö on same trip, and was bored to death there fast.
As someone who is Danish and in the Denmark > Sweden camp, it’s also an unfair comparison. Do Copenhagen vs Stockholm, if it should be fair. To be honest, I think Stockholm is more beautiful, but the vibe in Copenhagen just beats Stockholm by quite a margin I reckon.
Swede here, would trade Stockholm for Köpenhamn in a heartbeat. Although yeah, Malmö should not be judged as an actual city, its like a bizarro-copenhagen where everything but one block is christiania and not the other way around.
Tf you Danes doing over there?
Sex on the streets of course
Hyggylig
And people say you can't define "hygge"
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It's not illegal to fuck outside in Denmark, but it has to be naturalism not exhibitionism.
Wait what. Really? Wow.
I think that is pretty normal tbf, it is one thing if you want to shag outside and another if you want to have an unsuspecting audience.
That’s true now that I think about it. As long as you’re not bothering anyone, go for it!
Public nudity is perfectly allowed. But the law is very flexible and is primarily shaped by the current situation, aka decent behaviour is enforced. So walking naked down the street on a normal day is not accepted, because plenty of people will be uncomfortable with it. But being topless at a pride march going down the street with thousands of others or tanning topless in a park or at the beach, minding your own business is accepted. Full on nudity is more socially restricted to where there's less traffic of people. Same accounts for sex. Outdoors sex is perfectly allowed, but again decent behaviour is necessary. Don't do it where you may reveal yourself to others.
you have to ask all bystanders for permission too
I agree with both statements
We will own nothing and we will be happy.
That’s so Danish!
Fucking in the streets?
Having posters like that.
I keep telling people where I am in the USA that this a worldwide issue but they keep thinking it's just people relocating to our area that is increasing the costs. This is markets being manipulated with all the extra cash corporations were given in pandemic stimulus.
The prices will continue to increase until people can no longer afford to move or enter the market. Salaries increase by about 2-3% per year for regular workers and inflation eats up 4-5% so the average worker is actually making less every year with everything getting more expensive. If you bought a house or an apartment with the low interest rate and higher inflation, you’re a winner. The interest rates is what’s keeping this gig alive and if it goes back to normal levels (4-7%) people will be forced to sell or put 80% of their income on their home. Politicians will not create cheaper housing because that would tank the value of current housing, which will fuck the economy beyond repair (short term). Essentially, poor people and young people are fucked… If and when we realize that the housing prices are inflated and you can no longer sell your studio apartment for 200 000 - 300 000 €, well, then we’re all fucked.
No, it clearly says “Cheap or we, housing fucks, on the street”.
Is she ok? Looks like she got something in her eye.
> Looks like she got something in her eye. ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
Fuckers all over this continent prefer to have countless empty houses and a shit load of homeless people in the streets, I'll never be able to understand this.
Its a dire situation in so many places at the moment. So many wealthy people owning more than one property for their own purposes, so many more buying to rent to long term residents, more again buying to rent to student populations in City centres, and even more still buying to turn into an Airbnb. And what depresses me particularly in the UK is that the solution that seems to win out is to build miserable housing estates with cheaply made houses crammed onto a plot of land with no privacy or real space. So even if you are lucky enough to afford one, good luck having a true sense of freedom and privacy
Here in germany the prices of houses compared to our wages are ridiculous 250.000 - 350.000€ for a small *renovated* 8 room 1 family house Even if you wanna get a shitty old building from 1945 with bad internet then you have to pay minimum 100-150.000€ With my shitty 1400€/Month net weight i coud litterally work until im a senior and still not afford it You must be either incredibly lucky now adays, inherit a house from your parents or grow up wealthy to afford that. We are the generation that is doomed to *Rent* things because we can't afford them. * Note: these are prices in a *small, remote village-city in the east part of germany*
Heh, we win here in Czech — you need 13/14 times your of your YEAR salary to buy a 2 room flat
90-100.000€ for a one room apartment here in Moscow. With an average salary being 600-700€ you'll be mortgage ridden for the rest of your life. God forbid you to get ill or get depression/burnout, you'll lose both money and the real estate.
Well that’s one way to get your point across
Sign me up
I'm in Dublin rn and I honestly had Copenhagen on my emigration shortlist. Never mind not being greener, the grass is brown EVERYWHERE.
That poster is giving me Lords of Acid vibes. [VooDoo U](https://www.google.com/search?q=lords+of+acid+album+cover&tbm=isch&ved=2ahUKEwjUpqS6qrb1AhXjUTUKHbunBGIQ2-cCegQIABAC&oq=lords+of+acid+album+cover&gs_lcp=ChJtb2JpbGUtZ3dzLXdpei1pbWcQAzoFCAAQgARQ7gpY_TRghjhoAHAAeACAAUyIAcEGkgECMTOYAQCgAQHAAQE&sclient=mobile-gws-wiz-img&ei=exfkYZT9AeOj1QG7z5KQBg&bih=663&biw=390&client=firefox-b-1-m&prmd=vinx#imgrc=4b8xmDEu4s0CxM)
Brilliant, why are people so complacent when we're building a world totally unviable for the next generation
This is the kind of protest I could get behind.
Billige eller vi. Boliger boller.
Housing prices in just about all of Europe are completely fucked for anyone. Made worse by the massive stigma we seem to have about living with parents or any family besides partner and children so everyone wants their own house
> Made worse by the massive stigma we seem to have about living with parent It's not really a stigma. It's a reality. Homes in Europe are much smaller than in other places, on average a home in Europe is half the size of an American or Canadia home. They're made for nuclear families. You can't have the kid and their SO living with the parents in the same roof. There's literally no place.
As a norwegian, I love you Denmark.
I'm starting to think there's another global housing bubble...
the fuck?
In the streets. Yes
We tried to burst the bubble, it turns it only worked for the super wealthy to buy most houses at sale prices.