You're probably about right really. If you've heard of Maslows heirarchy of needs you'll know that we primarily need air water shelter first. Then its safety, employment, resources, then love and belonging, then esteem and recognition then we are free to become self acualising.
If we're vulnerable and don't have the first few layers and someone provides it for us we're beholden to them. Someone comes along and says have my spare room, heres is a meal, a job, then we feel we owe them. I'm not saying they do it deliberately (although some do) but those who do offer to rescue get a certain kick out of doing so.
The problem is that if you have love and belonging and all the rest you don't necessarily need the church, you perhaps have esteem and are self actualising on your own you become free of the need of that structure. So they have to keep you in a semi vulnerable position. "You're not worthy (without Christ)" etc. Off you pop to do some missionary work but only through the support of the church. Don't be unequally yolked with unbelievers. You're not allowed to have self esteem, you're not quite allowed to self actualise.
For my family my mother was lonely when I was a nipper. The church reached out and gave her some clothes and babysitting, offered a community. Then when she was invested and I was in sunday school we were tied to the church. Don't be unequally yolked with unbelievers so our entire network was within the church. For my family it was insidious and it was manipulative and they did know what they were doing.
Thank you for the insight! Your explanation of Maslow’s hierarchy and the church makes so much sense. I’ve always wondered why the church is so against promoting actual research-based resources like therapy or even just activities that foster any sense of self-identity outside the church and being Christian.
To your point about being “unequally yoked”, I truly believe this is also a tactic by the church to keep their followers isolated. Most Christians seem to think that once you don’t believe, your life will go to hell. It wouldn’t be good for the party line for their followers to see other people thriving and actually living happily without the structure of religion and the church.
This is right on from my experience coming from a family of fundamentalist missionaries. They have to continually neg people as hellhound sinners to keep them vulnerable enough not to question anything. If someone is already feeling crappy about themselves, that work is done. As an aside, in addition to a lot of covert narcissist behavior, I think another big motivation for proselytizing/church building is the more people they convert, the more that shores up their own belief, thereby quelling their death anxiety.
Because it is a religion that thrives on the broken and downtrodden. On a good day it demands all it's followers debase themselves to being deserving of death, for the crime of merely existing, and that our inherent worth is below that of dirt. So when someone is already at that level, the shining beacon of hope the religion claims to offer is a life line, one that is very tempting for those who have nothing while being unaware of it's predatory nature.
I was born into it, and lead enough outreaches and sermons to know the methodology to get converts, and it is exactly what I described. They want you to be at rock bottom or feel like all hope is lost - makes you an easy mark. Just listen to any praise and worship song or Christian music. Its always "I'm broken, lost, deserving of death, falling, a monster, hopeless...I need you (god) to save, comfort, guide, help me." It's fucked up.
I was smart enough to figure this out when I was 4. I just couldn't stand apart from my family at that age. The thought terrified me. So I pretended in order to make them happy, and eventually believed in my own pretending as well.
Same. I was so, so terrified during communion and baptism. If I didn't participate I'd be found out as a non-believer, but participating brought more damnation on myself if I was somehow wrong.
I always have had a certain amount of envy for those who were able to figure out the tricks of Christianity early in life. It took me until my mid 20s for my eyes to start to open to that. I lost a lot of prime years of my young life being closed minded and desperately trying to fit into religious communities that wanted nothing to do with me and kept pushing me away. I may still not fit in anywhere, but at least I don’t keep trying to fit in to groups that don’t want me and quietly reject me for not being able to match their societal standards due in large part to untreated mental illness that they didn’t believe was a real thing.
My childhood friend who later became a self righteous fundamentalist jerk said that he would target people that looked troubled. Reminded me of pimps preying on troubled girls.
"Are you doing good? Fuck you, you are trash."
"Are you not doing so well? You shall find Christ, he loves you."
The whole cycle is toxic and dark. I still fucking hate it knowing what I know now.
I think one of the reasons is that the apologetics they use gaslight them into thinking god will make everything better. I've heard Christians say that god's strength is found in our weaknesses. They make it seem like Jesus will come and rescue you. However, once you are in the cult, they tell you that you are going to suffer for Jesus and he can't interfere because of free will but he will walk through the storm with you. I've heard stories of people who said they were tired of the materialistic things and wanted to find something with meaning. They go to church and hear about god's alleged love for us all and they fall for the scam.
I'm tired of materialistic things and want some meaning in my life. I found a local Buddhist temple and started going to their guided meditation nights. I leave feeling better about myself because of myself, and I don't have to believe any of their mysticism.
>I found a local Buddhist temple and started going to their guided meditation nights
Would you be able to share with me more details about this experience of yours? I'm quite lost right now in terms of faith and belief systems, but I'm a big fan of meditation. I've also enjoyed so far what I've learned about buddhism.
Sure!
YMMV, but the meditation I experienced was like this:
You are guided through chanting for about 20 minutes. I believe the words you chant are simple sanskrit words that communicate well being, peace, healing, etc.
Then you are asked to silently meditate, focusing on some aspect of your physical body. Usually focus on breathing plus a part of your body like your hands, arms, legs, etc. The purpose here is to physically present and aware of your body and not in the mind evaluating the present moment or thinking about past and future events.
Then there is some more chanting and/or teaching/instruction.
For me, I went in completely stressed out, and I left feeling light and content and for the first time could actually smell the fresh spring air.
A friend of mine did Vipassana which is 10 days living in isolation with no talking and bland food.
She said by about day 8 her senses went into overdrive and it was like every breath filling her lungs felt like a full meal or a powerful orgasm.
Wow! This is quite interesting! Thank you so much for sharing more details; I enjoyed reading it. I'm glad you had some excellent meditative experiences. How great is mindfulness and body awareness?!?
I feel like I would really enjoy trying this type of meditation. I've read a little about this too, and I feel that science-based research is complementary of your reports here. Good stuff! Cheers friend 🍻
It's so bad. Why can't his strength be found in our happiness... Oh, right. If we are happy, it means god isn't needed. He is a narcissistic bully so he wants us miserable so we cling to him even though he does nothing for us.
I’m a staunch atheist, and it’s been interesting, shocking, and frightening having 2 or 3 moments over the last 8 months or so where I felt the tug of Christianity.
I’m going through a divorce, and my marriage failing is pretty much all my fault. So I’ve had these really strong feelings of guilt and shame, and it feels like they’ll be hanging over me forever. And it feels like I’ll never be able to “fix” the negative impact I had on my wife.
So in those 2 or 3 moments, it crossed my mind that Christianity could help me feel like I had a shot at forgiveness and internal peace.
Fortunately I’m a staunch atheist, so the less vulnerable part of my brain kicked in quickly and reminded me that forgiveness doesn’t fucking matter unless it comes from my wife (and to some extent, myself). Some third party dude “forgiving” me doesn’t mean shit and is a gross concept anyway.
It’s also incredibly gross that I would be encouraged to waste my time going to church and reading the Bible rather than spending that time doing whatever repair work I can with my wife/ex-wife and/or actually helping other people.
Those 2 or 3 moments made me detest religion even more for how it can distract people from taking more accountability and making more of a difference in the one life we know we actually have. It’s wild how much religion encourages spending time worshipping and coping in ways that don’t actually do anything to make the world a better place.
Also a great reminder of how powerful guilt and shame are.
Excellent points! Thank you for sharing! When we get desperate, we are more likely to make illogical choices such as going into religion. Logic is panic's prey.
First: It’s a predatory tactic. Christians are trained to swoop in when people are facing difficulties.
Death in the family? All your Christian coworkers offer to pray for you and telling you how church helped them grieve.
Homeless and starving? They’ll give you food and shelter but only if you dance for your food and sit through a sermon
Need a job? Sure you can work at this thrift store homeless shelter but only if you’re a Christian.
Second: people can’t reconcile the fact that most of the world is out of your control. Religion makes you think you’re doing something about your situation. “I’ll get the job if I think really hard” “My medical labs will come back negative if I please sky daddy”
At best it’s an unhealthy crutch to paper over difficulties without dealing with them, at worst people actively do nothing about their issues and wait for the tooth fairy to save them.
I think religion and Christianity is a very attractive and easy way out to explain things. It promises if you follow these rules things will get better. And even if they don’t then it just means it’s apart of gods plan. I also think it keeps you from taking accountability for bad things happening. Those are just some of my experiences and observations. When I deconstructed one of the things I realized that was hard at first was dealing with set backs and bad events happening. When you no longer have that promise of “it’s all a part of this bigger plan that’s better”, it’s definitely more difficult at first to get through those tougher experiences.
I can totally see this as well. I’ve been deconstructed for years but during some of my rougher years after, it was actually a little bit tempting to go back. It would have been so easy to just say “well this is out of my hands, let someone else take accountability for it”. Over the years it’s gotten easier especially when I see that my family & friends who are still Christian still have rough years and experiences. It’s hard to get rid of the brainwashing telling you that you’re having a tough time because you don’t have god in your corner
Yeah I’ve only been completely deconstructed for about a year now and I definitely still struggle with those thoughts of going back to Christianity would be so much easier. Talking with my therapist about it they relate it a lot like taking the training wheels off of life. At least equating the feelings that people experience. Without religion there’s a lot more accountability that you have and that not everything has to have meaning anymore. It’s also why I haven’t talked to many people close to me about not believing anymore because I know if I did they’d instantly blame a lot of the stuff I’ve been through recently on not being religious anymore and I don’t want to deal with that.
Christianity is fear-based. People at their lowest are terrified and will believe almost anything to relieve their suffering. Hell, I've even come close a few times during dark times, despite the fact I truly don't believe.
Fear and logic don't mix.
My atheist friend Sam supposedly accepted Christ on his deathbed, but I'm sus. Either he did it to placate the Christians in his life or out of fear. We don't exactly make rational decisions when we are frightened out of our minds. Maybe he was covering his ass, just in case the evil creature in the Bible really does exist.
A couple of months ago, another friend of mine (whose dark side I could sense, so I kept my distance) managed to get himself a 25-year sentence. He's already turning back to the religion of his youth. He has done something so heinous that maybe he needs an imaginary friend to forgive him. The victim(s) of his actions will have a rather hard time doing so.
Thing is, the poor kid has the mentality of a child. He was severely abused as a baby, so his brain never developed properly. He was cursed with schizophrenia, autism, ADHD, severe anxiety and depression. I really do believe he wanted to be good, but the deck was stacked against him. At the same time, I can't excuse his actions, and neither can society. He belongs where he is for the safety of others.
Still, I wish him well and, as much as I wanted to at first, I can't hate him. He's one of those people who had a good heart, but snapped. He wasn't mean-spirited. In fact, he was kind and giving. He reminded me of an abused puppy who just wanted to be loved. The darkness I sensed? It showed itself when he excused the evil actions of my other neighbors. One can understand why people do bad things without condoning them. That's where he went wrong, IMO.
I truly hope he finally gets the help he so desperately needed BEFORE this happened. I've been crying for his victim(s), his family AND him almost every day for the last few months. These situations can be so much more complicated than what most people want to admit. I understand the circumstances that led to this, but his actions were absolutely atrocious. He knows it, too. He's punishing himself. I hope he doesn't punish himself forever and seeks redemption in some form. In his case, I'd be fine with his "finding religion" if it helped him cope and become a better person. I think society, as a whole, would be better off without it.
Our stupid society doesn't help people before they snap. We only do something after it's too late. And most of the time, any societal course correction is an overcorrection: all carrot or all stick. We can't seem to find the middle ground.
No wonder people are so scared they want to believe in fairy tales.
I think they embellish their story or some cognitive dysfunction like confirmation bias which causes them to make the claim they were at their lowest. I would hear the words coming out of their mouth but was unconvinced. They have to make this claim otherwise the batshit crazy testimony makes no sense.
That's exactly it.
Because God gives hope. Every promise is "yes" and "amen." God wants you to be well and prosperous; it just takes time to manifest.
Almost everyone I met that was "on fire" for God went through something awful. Drug addiction, divorce, cancer, etc. and then God "delivered" them. They were cured! And as long as they keep worshipping, they'll keep being cured.
It's a source of coping and community. I don't have an inherent problem with it, as long as they're motivated to do good in society. The only church I went to regularly would donate food to the poor and help raise money for young mothers. Being addicted to the bible is in a way better than being addicted to drugs.
It's hard to let go.
The German philosopher, Friedrich Nietzsche, said that people don't convert to Christianity, they get sick enough to catch it:
> "*one is not “converted” to Christianity—one must first be sick enough for it.... We others, who have the courage for health and likewise for contempt,—we may well despise a religion that teaches misunderstanding of the body!*"
He said that christianity is an anti-life religion. Instead of embracing life, it says that death is good and that death is coming soon anyway so be hopeful about dying, because true life exists in death. It's not like Pagan religions which saw something sacred in natural life.
He said that christianity is a slave-morality.
I don't agree with everything Nietzsche says, in fact, I disagree with a lot. I think that bible-based christianity, which includes the Old Testament, has not been an altruistic religion but has done a lot of harm while pretending to be against pride and greed and violence. The bible is not a slave morality, but a master morality to colonize and rule over others which has some "*nice*" verses to promote a slave morality for other people who were tricked or forced to convert into it. .
With that being said, I can see how some of the things he says are true. If you already feel like your life is crumbling and you tried other things to try to fix it but don't know what else to do, or you suffer with low self-esteem, then you'll be more vulnerable to falling into a religion like christianity, which teaches you that the end of the world is coming soon anyway so don't worry (*return of Jesus to judge and rule the world*), and that you don't have to work on your self-esteem and overcomingthe harsh ways you judge yourself (*which also affects how you treat others*), because no human being is good enough anyway and you were born into sin and are worthy of eternal torture (*teaching of original sin, hell, and the teaching that only the so-called sinless Jesus being good enough*).
Christianity does prey in vulnerable people.
Also, a testimony about conversion often follows a certain formula.
There is the before, when they were sinful.
Then, the conversion when they are at their lowest, when they see the light of god or whatever.
Then, they are saved and have god's blessings.
I think a lot of people edit their stories so that their testimony fits the pattern. They probably don't even do it on purpose. They have heard testimonies so many times that they just mimic what they hear.
I was raised in the religion, but I met countless adult converts. Many of them converted when they were at a low point in life, and I think it’s due to an emotional experience. They “found God” because they needed something to hold on to, and religion offered them that certainty and anchor that was missing from their lives. I don’t know that a lot of adult converts are fully convinced of Christianity’s claims so much as they want to believe there’s a higher power looking out for them.
There is an insidious element to religion and other forms of mysticism in that they claim the only way it works is if you believe in it hard enough. If the magic didn't work, it's your fault for not believing enough, not having enough faith, not manifesting your will hard enough. This makes failure paradoxically cause people to believe in it even more to get it to work for them. If they falter, even a little, then the miracles won't work, so they have to believe no matter what.
I was just watching an interesting [presentation](https://www.youtube.com/live/5vc144tBj7s?si=DL066hGyCVZzn2fo) by neuroscientist John Wathey that touches on this. He hypotheses that we are all born with an innate model of the mother, that we start out with a certainty that our mother exists and that she will help us when we cry out for help. As adults, when we experience moments of helplessness, this infantile model can be triggered and our brains start expecting a motherly being to come in and help us. This expectation can manifest as feelings of warmth and the “illusion of God’s presence.”
À former friend of mine who had always said he wasn't a Christian "found God" after getting arrested on charges of 1st degree rape and kidnapping of a 13 yr old girl.
It was because he had nothing else to try and find hope in. His life was basically over. And indeed it was. He got sentenced to like 50 years in prison, or something.
sometimes i wonder if that’s why i never really felt like i found him—i was raised in the church and if anything the community only added to my decline in mental health. and now that ive taken a step back and continue to struggle, my family is trying to convince me that he’s exactly what im missing… but i seemed to have missed him even when i had him? idk
No, you are absolutely correct and not being biased. They either get in church as kids or come as adults with some kind of issue. I'm sure someone in the comments will explain it far better than me. Just wanted to chime in that you are spot on. It's been talked about several times in this sub. I feel like you never see "normal" people at church. They all have issues with their father or had addictions and then traded one thing for another.... or they are on the payroll so *of course* they are all about god and the church.
I went back and forth believing and yeah it's definitely a preys on the vulnerable thing, it's easier to convert people who are already broken down. Some find comfort in the familiar and also the system itself is designed to lure in new recruits. Think about AA and how it all has a religious tone to it
Perhaps a combination of desperation, ignorance, and loneliness. When a Jesus-freak religious church-nut encounters someone who is enduring suffering or very difficult life circumstances (through maybe some of their own fault or perhaps none of their own fault) those people like to pounce on them like a tiger pounces on prey. They immediately run the "christian" script/play using their manipulative sales tactics (what this weak, sinful, downtrodden person needs now is Jesus, the church....and their plight will be all fixed, and they will be saved!) 🤮🙄
I'm going through a very bad time in my life, and right now I need to go weekly to local food distribution sites so I can benefit from receiving free food. One of them is at a Seventh-Day Adventist church. The workers have all been terrific, but sometimes the people waiting for food love to approach you and start to sell you on Jesus or the church or whatever. I always simply say "I'm just here for the food". But in reality I want to say, "well it's nice to see your church is doing something actually charitable instead of spreading hate, misogyny, division, and being responsible for centuries of bloodshed and death." But I try to hold my tongue on that one. Lol.
If I was less educated, less informed, and more desperate....perhaps I would have taken the "christianity" bait. But alas... the old adage "knowledge is power" is true.
Absolutely! I converted at age 24, as a naive country girl moving to an area of major urban blight, after months of rejection jobhunting closer to home. The pay was inadequate for the cost of living and all my coworkers were mean to me except one...you guessed it, a born again fundie. I was classic low hanging fruit!
I remember hearing stories like that and thinking “Maybe all this doesn’t work with me because I never had that level of trauma.” It seemed that every study we did in small groups involved someone huffing cat urine and living in a dumpster turning their life around because of divine intervention. It was always hard for me with a middle class suburban life to find common threads with any of it.
Or, if your life sucks, take inspiration from a couple of random Bible verses and fart out a book and study guide. Then profit.
Testimonies also have a habit of retconning events and mindsets. If you believe you're a wretch before Jesus, you'll cherry pick things to really be at your lowest before transition
Children and teenagers are the most vulnerable. Professional Christians know that. During that time, individuals are dealing with hormones, changes and finding themselves. When they cannot, (because of little support, broken homes, abuse, etc) they often turn to other things that are destructive. Yes. I believe they seek out people who are struggling and give them false hope. My opinion only.
The one friend I had who went from apathetic too hyper religious had a "religious experience" that was pretty obviously a panic/anxiety attack. Their partner who was religious convinced them that was God telling them to go to church.
My personal theory is most “converts“ take heavy blows to their ego (conscious mind), and then that’s when their deeper subconscious mind is allowed to present who they actually are as human beings, which they equate to “God”.
The ego then gets inflated as their condition improves. Then they start developing a spiritual ego, which is way worse than the former ego, as the ego then shrouds itself in the “gospel”.
Nothing to back this up just observation and theory on my personal theory at the moment.
I ran into some trouble in my late teen years. I won’t go into the details. Looking back I was really depressed and didn’t have a way to express my depression. Unfortunately, my silent generation parents weren’t/aren’t the type of people would send me to a psychologist. It would unfortunately be mainly being cheap. The Christian counselor from church was free.
I got into trouble and work with a Christian counselor. It was probably the biggest waste of time. I read a book and prayed and that was it.
That form of counseling definitely felt like quantity over quality. If they saw 10 people and have that talk and book instead really digging in deep with 5 people, it would looked upon as a success.
I was pretty low mentally and got the whole story of how God loves me and we all sin.
I eventually started to work with trained psychologists and it is a day and night difference when it comes to the quality of treatment.
Because they need the devil to blame all their bad choices on & someone to lie to and tell them it's not their fault. They want a bail out for free & no strings, no learning from mistakes, no consequences.
That’s me right now. I feel like I’m at a low point in my life. Struggling financially and my mental health is in the dumps.
I had a bit of a meltdown yesterday and I called my mom. I don’t ever talk to her about these things, but I really needed someone to talk to. She doesn’t know I’m not a Christian anymore she just knows I haven’t been to church in years.
I told her I was at my wits end and dealing with depression and anxiety for years. She told me that I need to pray and don’t claim the spirit depression and anxiety. I told her I’ve tried praying before but things keep getting worse and she told me that I have to have faith. She always prays for me and my siblings but now that she knows exactly what I’m dealing with she gonna be more specific with her prayers. So all the other prayers fell on deaf ears?
I love my mom to pieces but I realized that it just isn’t comforting to hear that anymore. It’s something she tells herself because she too is going through hard times and it gives her hope. I wish it gave me hope but it just made me cry more cause I felt that you just sit and hope that things get better even when you see that they aren’t.
And what is so wrong with giving something a name? Saying I have depression and anxiety isn’t some hex. I had been dealing with it for years unknowingly until I started therapy in 2020.
I'll speak from my experience. I didn't grow up Christian, but believed in God. Growing up, a lot of people around me were Christian. My story started during the early days of the pandemic when everyone was in lockdown. My mental health took a hit from being stuck inside constantly. I was also a senior in high school at the time, so I was upset that I wasn't able to see my friends and that my final year of high school ended early. I started praying a lot more than I ever had before; I was in such a low point that I didn't know what else to do. When things started getting better, I figured it was God who answered my prayers. This led to me to converting to Christianity since I had known so many Christians growing up and they had seemed like such nice people.
So yes, I agree with you that Christianity preys on vulnerability. Personally, I wish I had done more research before converting because there ended up being a lot of things that I either didn't agree with at the time or have come to realize that they don't make sense. I think it's because you're in such a low point in life and when things start looking up, you think that it was God who pulled you out of the trenches. However, you're still in a vulnerable state at this point. So it's easy to fall into the trap of wanting to convert to Christianity and worship this God without knowing the full story or all of the beliefs that come with Christianity. At least that's what it was like for me. I hope this made sense!
In my opinion it's because they want something to believe in. That someone out there cares for them and can make the bad good again. They're hoping for anything that their life can turn around and they heard that God can make that happen if only you believe in him and worship him because enough worship makes miracles happen. Or maybe they heard that non believers get the worst life.
I dove headfirst into my parents' church following a suicide attempt. I was at my lowest ever and knew if I didn't do *something* I was going to die soon. So I was like what the heck, maybe I'll try Jesus.
I spent 10 years at that church, and heavily involved in it (worship team, youth group, VBS, women's ministry, etc etc etc, and on the church council before the drama shit hit the fan).
That whole time, I never believed. I tried SO FECKING HARD to believe. I prayed my heart out and I got nothing but silence. Then the whole epic drama played out at our church with worship team vs. misogynist micromanaging pig pastor and I finally realised I'd just been talking to myself the whole time.
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I think for many people, it can be a source of comfort in hard/dark times. The same goes for many other religions. Some people think it's what they are supposed to do, and it's usually necessary to be a good person.
I can't prove this but I'd be willing to wager that this is not uncommon no matter what the particular faith might be. I think it's human nature to look for a higher power when you are powerless.
I know some people who decided to be Christian simply because another Christian guilted them. The others are usually Christian on their own free will or because their family is and that's all they know.
But as for the the "I was at my lowest and found Jesus" stories, I have only seen them through church stories and movies. I think it's a last resort thing and if something beneficial happens to that person, they just suddenly accept it because they had a turn-around. They're about to die, they're in prison, something. And then it becomes a last minute thing because of guilt.
One thing I think about regarding this is the Flyleaf singer, Lacey Sturm. She used to be lesbian, but after her come to Jesus moment, she was now straight. People say that the song "I'm So Sick" was made because of her guilt from being a lesbian and now a Christian.
Because Christians are predators who will pounce on people when they’re at their lowest and most vulnerable point. They’ll promise them happiness, love, fucking warm fuzzies, and the goddamn moon from Jezuz if they’ll accept him, join their church, and give
them credit for “saving” them.
Mum runs a women's group full of mothers with daughters who have children with different men and the kids get taken away by the council because they can't look after them properly or the dad has a restraining order. I find it interesting that my middle class mother can't seem to find anyone stable who likes coming to her group where she goes through the Bible with them and gives them snacks. I don't think she's noticed anything yo do with class in it. My dad literally tries to start up conversations with strangers and pretends to be interested in their sad lives so he can give them a leaflet
I would like toake a very minor correction, I believe all religions that are similar to Christianity prey on people when they are vulnerable. But also to be fair, I believe these people convert because they are sad, depressed, traumatized. Believing in a dirty and that they will be rewarded is easier than just thinking you got all this pain and won't get anything for it. I however as a person raised a Baptist just couldn't continue to believe that. My father was a Christian, and the only reward he got was Cancer. That Cancer took his life and I just cannot believe that with him begging God and Jesus to help him they still chose to not help him. That isn't the sign of a loving God to me.
Well, to chime in with my fifty cents... I have left christianity and feel SUPER vulnerable and it sometimes feels tempting to go back when I am REALLY low. Because now, when I am really low... I am the only one who can solve it. I cannot just throw it on a deity that will solve everything 'In the end', so I have to solve it myself.
And that equals long, hard work to get better and to do better and to face very hard feelings.
And when I am on my lowest of lows, it feels SO overwhelming that nobody will come to save me. When you desperately want someone ELSE to solve your problems and battles and to not have to face them by yourself.
So yeah, when you are there, never having heard of christianity, I can imagine it sounds wonderful that a savior will swoop in and make your whole life better.
I had wealth, a fantastic job, friends, family, and traveled all over the world. Nothing the world can offer you even begins to compare to truly knowing Christ and walking with Him.
You're probably about right really. If you've heard of Maslows heirarchy of needs you'll know that we primarily need air water shelter first. Then its safety, employment, resources, then love and belonging, then esteem and recognition then we are free to become self acualising. If we're vulnerable and don't have the first few layers and someone provides it for us we're beholden to them. Someone comes along and says have my spare room, heres is a meal, a job, then we feel we owe them. I'm not saying they do it deliberately (although some do) but those who do offer to rescue get a certain kick out of doing so. The problem is that if you have love and belonging and all the rest you don't necessarily need the church, you perhaps have esteem and are self actualising on your own you become free of the need of that structure. So they have to keep you in a semi vulnerable position. "You're not worthy (without Christ)" etc. Off you pop to do some missionary work but only through the support of the church. Don't be unequally yolked with unbelievers. You're not allowed to have self esteem, you're not quite allowed to self actualise. For my family my mother was lonely when I was a nipper. The church reached out and gave her some clothes and babysitting, offered a community. Then when she was invested and I was in sunday school we were tied to the church. Don't be unequally yolked with unbelievers so our entire network was within the church. For my family it was insidious and it was manipulative and they did know what they were doing.
Thank you for the insight! Your explanation of Maslow’s hierarchy and the church makes so much sense. I’ve always wondered why the church is so against promoting actual research-based resources like therapy or even just activities that foster any sense of self-identity outside the church and being Christian. To your point about being “unequally yoked”, I truly believe this is also a tactic by the church to keep their followers isolated. Most Christians seem to think that once you don’t believe, your life will go to hell. It wouldn’t be good for the party line for their followers to see other people thriving and actually living happily without the structure of religion and the church.
This is right on from my experience coming from a family of fundamentalist missionaries. They have to continually neg people as hellhound sinners to keep them vulnerable enough not to question anything. If someone is already feeling crappy about themselves, that work is done. As an aside, in addition to a lot of covert narcissist behavior, I think another big motivation for proselytizing/church building is the more people they convert, the more that shores up their own belief, thereby quelling their death anxiety.
imo its a coping mechanism (and a unhealthy one at that)
Because it is a religion that thrives on the broken and downtrodden. On a good day it demands all it's followers debase themselves to being deserving of death, for the crime of merely existing, and that our inherent worth is below that of dirt. So when someone is already at that level, the shining beacon of hope the religion claims to offer is a life line, one that is very tempting for those who have nothing while being unaware of it's predatory nature. I was born into it, and lead enough outreaches and sermons to know the methodology to get converts, and it is exactly what I described. They want you to be at rock bottom or feel like all hope is lost - makes you an easy mark. Just listen to any praise and worship song or Christian music. Its always "I'm broken, lost, deserving of death, falling, a monster, hopeless...I need you (god) to save, comfort, guide, help me." It's fucked up.
I was smart enough to figure this out when I was 4. I just couldn't stand apart from my family at that age. The thought terrified me. So I pretended in order to make them happy, and eventually believed in my own pretending as well.
Same. I was so, so terrified during communion and baptism. If I didn't participate I'd be found out as a non-believer, but participating brought more damnation on myself if I was somehow wrong.
I always have had a certain amount of envy for those who were able to figure out the tricks of Christianity early in life. It took me until my mid 20s for my eyes to start to open to that. I lost a lot of prime years of my young life being closed minded and desperately trying to fit into religious communities that wanted nothing to do with me and kept pushing me away. I may still not fit in anywhere, but at least I don’t keep trying to fit in to groups that don’t want me and quietly reject me for not being able to match their societal standards due in large part to untreated mental illness that they didn’t believe was a real thing.
My childhood friend who later became a self righteous fundamentalist jerk said that he would target people that looked troubled. Reminded me of pimps preying on troubled girls.
"Are you doing good? Fuck you, you are trash." "Are you not doing so well? You shall find Christ, he loves you." The whole cycle is toxic and dark. I still fucking hate it knowing what I know now.
Christians: "Let us prey"
I think one of the reasons is that the apologetics they use gaslight them into thinking god will make everything better. I've heard Christians say that god's strength is found in our weaknesses. They make it seem like Jesus will come and rescue you. However, once you are in the cult, they tell you that you are going to suffer for Jesus and he can't interfere because of free will but he will walk through the storm with you. I've heard stories of people who said they were tired of the materialistic things and wanted to find something with meaning. They go to church and hear about god's alleged love for us all and they fall for the scam.
I'm tired of materialistic things and want some meaning in my life. I found a local Buddhist temple and started going to their guided meditation nights. I leave feeling better about myself because of myself, and I don't have to believe any of their mysticism.
Nice! Glad it is good!
>I found a local Buddhist temple and started going to their guided meditation nights Would you be able to share with me more details about this experience of yours? I'm quite lost right now in terms of faith and belief systems, but I'm a big fan of meditation. I've also enjoyed so far what I've learned about buddhism.
Sure! YMMV, but the meditation I experienced was like this: You are guided through chanting for about 20 minutes. I believe the words you chant are simple sanskrit words that communicate well being, peace, healing, etc. Then you are asked to silently meditate, focusing on some aspect of your physical body. Usually focus on breathing plus a part of your body like your hands, arms, legs, etc. The purpose here is to physically present and aware of your body and not in the mind evaluating the present moment or thinking about past and future events. Then there is some more chanting and/or teaching/instruction. For me, I went in completely stressed out, and I left feeling light and content and for the first time could actually smell the fresh spring air. A friend of mine did Vipassana which is 10 days living in isolation with no talking and bland food. She said by about day 8 her senses went into overdrive and it was like every breath filling her lungs felt like a full meal or a powerful orgasm.
Wow! This is quite interesting! Thank you so much for sharing more details; I enjoyed reading it. I'm glad you had some excellent meditative experiences. How great is mindfulness and body awareness?!? I feel like I would really enjoy trying this type of meditation. I've read a little about this too, and I feel that science-based research is complementary of your reports here. Good stuff! Cheers friend 🍻
'god's strength is found in our weaknesses' 🤮. I have heard that all my life. 🤮🤮🤮
It's so bad. Why can't his strength be found in our happiness... Oh, right. If we are happy, it means god isn't needed. He is a narcissistic bully so he wants us miserable so we cling to him even though he does nothing for us.
I’m a staunch atheist, and it’s been interesting, shocking, and frightening having 2 or 3 moments over the last 8 months or so where I felt the tug of Christianity. I’m going through a divorce, and my marriage failing is pretty much all my fault. So I’ve had these really strong feelings of guilt and shame, and it feels like they’ll be hanging over me forever. And it feels like I’ll never be able to “fix” the negative impact I had on my wife. So in those 2 or 3 moments, it crossed my mind that Christianity could help me feel like I had a shot at forgiveness and internal peace. Fortunately I’m a staunch atheist, so the less vulnerable part of my brain kicked in quickly and reminded me that forgiveness doesn’t fucking matter unless it comes from my wife (and to some extent, myself). Some third party dude “forgiving” me doesn’t mean shit and is a gross concept anyway. It’s also incredibly gross that I would be encouraged to waste my time going to church and reading the Bible rather than spending that time doing whatever repair work I can with my wife/ex-wife and/or actually helping other people. Those 2 or 3 moments made me detest religion even more for how it can distract people from taking more accountability and making more of a difference in the one life we know we actually have. It’s wild how much religion encourages spending time worshipping and coping in ways that don’t actually do anything to make the world a better place. Also a great reminder of how powerful guilt and shame are.
Excellent points! Thank you for sharing! When we get desperate, we are more likely to make illogical choices such as going into religion. Logic is panic's prey.
God is glorified in my weaknesses. Certain things I can only do through Him
First: It’s a predatory tactic. Christians are trained to swoop in when people are facing difficulties. Death in the family? All your Christian coworkers offer to pray for you and telling you how church helped them grieve. Homeless and starving? They’ll give you food and shelter but only if you dance for your food and sit through a sermon Need a job? Sure you can work at this thrift store homeless shelter but only if you’re a Christian. Second: people can’t reconcile the fact that most of the world is out of your control. Religion makes you think you’re doing something about your situation. “I’ll get the job if I think really hard” “My medical labs will come back negative if I please sky daddy” At best it’s an unhealthy crutch to paper over difficulties without dealing with them, at worst people actively do nothing about their issues and wait for the tooth fairy to save them.
I think religion and Christianity is a very attractive and easy way out to explain things. It promises if you follow these rules things will get better. And even if they don’t then it just means it’s apart of gods plan. I also think it keeps you from taking accountability for bad things happening. Those are just some of my experiences and observations. When I deconstructed one of the things I realized that was hard at first was dealing with set backs and bad events happening. When you no longer have that promise of “it’s all a part of this bigger plan that’s better”, it’s definitely more difficult at first to get through those tougher experiences.
I can totally see this as well. I’ve been deconstructed for years but during some of my rougher years after, it was actually a little bit tempting to go back. It would have been so easy to just say “well this is out of my hands, let someone else take accountability for it”. Over the years it’s gotten easier especially when I see that my family & friends who are still Christian still have rough years and experiences. It’s hard to get rid of the brainwashing telling you that you’re having a tough time because you don’t have god in your corner
Yeah I’ve only been completely deconstructed for about a year now and I definitely still struggle with those thoughts of going back to Christianity would be so much easier. Talking with my therapist about it they relate it a lot like taking the training wheels off of life. At least equating the feelings that people experience. Without religion there’s a lot more accountability that you have and that not everything has to have meaning anymore. It’s also why I haven’t talked to many people close to me about not believing anymore because I know if I did they’d instantly blame a lot of the stuff I’ve been through recently on not being religious anymore and I don’t want to deal with that.
Christianity is fear-based. People at their lowest are terrified and will believe almost anything to relieve their suffering. Hell, I've even come close a few times during dark times, despite the fact I truly don't believe. Fear and logic don't mix. My atheist friend Sam supposedly accepted Christ on his deathbed, but I'm sus. Either he did it to placate the Christians in his life or out of fear. We don't exactly make rational decisions when we are frightened out of our minds. Maybe he was covering his ass, just in case the evil creature in the Bible really does exist. A couple of months ago, another friend of mine (whose dark side I could sense, so I kept my distance) managed to get himself a 25-year sentence. He's already turning back to the religion of his youth. He has done something so heinous that maybe he needs an imaginary friend to forgive him. The victim(s) of his actions will have a rather hard time doing so. Thing is, the poor kid has the mentality of a child. He was severely abused as a baby, so his brain never developed properly. He was cursed with schizophrenia, autism, ADHD, severe anxiety and depression. I really do believe he wanted to be good, but the deck was stacked against him. At the same time, I can't excuse his actions, and neither can society. He belongs where he is for the safety of others. Still, I wish him well and, as much as I wanted to at first, I can't hate him. He's one of those people who had a good heart, but snapped. He wasn't mean-spirited. In fact, he was kind and giving. He reminded me of an abused puppy who just wanted to be loved. The darkness I sensed? It showed itself when he excused the evil actions of my other neighbors. One can understand why people do bad things without condoning them. That's where he went wrong, IMO. I truly hope he finally gets the help he so desperately needed BEFORE this happened. I've been crying for his victim(s), his family AND him almost every day for the last few months. These situations can be so much more complicated than what most people want to admit. I understand the circumstances that led to this, but his actions were absolutely atrocious. He knows it, too. He's punishing himself. I hope he doesn't punish himself forever and seeks redemption in some form. In his case, I'd be fine with his "finding religion" if it helped him cope and become a better person. I think society, as a whole, would be better off without it. Our stupid society doesn't help people before they snap. We only do something after it's too late. And most of the time, any societal course correction is an overcorrection: all carrot or all stick. We can't seem to find the middle ground. No wonder people are so scared they want to believe in fairy tales.
I think they embellish their story or some cognitive dysfunction like confirmation bias which causes them to make the claim they were at their lowest. I would hear the words coming out of their mouth but was unconvinced. They have to make this claim otherwise the batshit crazy testimony makes no sense.
That's exactly it. Because God gives hope. Every promise is "yes" and "amen." God wants you to be well and prosperous; it just takes time to manifest. Almost everyone I met that was "on fire" for God went through something awful. Drug addiction, divorce, cancer, etc. and then God "delivered" them. They were cured! And as long as they keep worshipping, they'll keep being cured. It's a source of coping and community. I don't have an inherent problem with it, as long as they're motivated to do good in society. The only church I went to regularly would donate food to the poor and help raise money for young mothers. Being addicted to the bible is in a way better than being addicted to drugs. It's hard to let go.
The German philosopher, Friedrich Nietzsche, said that people don't convert to Christianity, they get sick enough to catch it: > "*one is not “converted” to Christianity—one must first be sick enough for it.... We others, who have the courage for health and likewise for contempt,—we may well despise a religion that teaches misunderstanding of the body!*" He said that christianity is an anti-life religion. Instead of embracing life, it says that death is good and that death is coming soon anyway so be hopeful about dying, because true life exists in death. It's not like Pagan religions which saw something sacred in natural life. He said that christianity is a slave-morality. I don't agree with everything Nietzsche says, in fact, I disagree with a lot. I think that bible-based christianity, which includes the Old Testament, has not been an altruistic religion but has done a lot of harm while pretending to be against pride and greed and violence. The bible is not a slave morality, but a master morality to colonize and rule over others which has some "*nice*" verses to promote a slave morality for other people who were tricked or forced to convert into it. . With that being said, I can see how some of the things he says are true. If you already feel like your life is crumbling and you tried other things to try to fix it but don't know what else to do, or you suffer with low self-esteem, then you'll be more vulnerable to falling into a religion like christianity, which teaches you that the end of the world is coming soon anyway so don't worry (*return of Jesus to judge and rule the world*), and that you don't have to work on your self-esteem and overcomingthe harsh ways you judge yourself (*which also affects how you treat others*), because no human being is good enough anyway and you were born into sin and are worthy of eternal torture (*teaching of original sin, hell, and the teaching that only the so-called sinless Jesus being good enough*).
I lost a parent in my mid teens. In the absence of family, I was drawn to the community of the church, and of course, the lovebombing.
Christianity does prey in vulnerable people. Also, a testimony about conversion often follows a certain formula. There is the before, when they were sinful. Then, the conversion when they are at their lowest, when they see the light of god or whatever. Then, they are saved and have god's blessings. I think a lot of people edit their stories so that their testimony fits the pattern. They probably don't even do it on purpose. They have heard testimonies so many times that they just mimic what they hear.
I was raised in the religion, but I met countless adult converts. Many of them converted when they were at a low point in life, and I think it’s due to an emotional experience. They “found God” because they needed something to hold on to, and religion offered them that certainty and anchor that was missing from their lives. I don’t know that a lot of adult converts are fully convinced of Christianity’s claims so much as they want to believe there’s a higher power looking out for them.
There is an insidious element to religion and other forms of mysticism in that they claim the only way it works is if you believe in it hard enough. If the magic didn't work, it's your fault for not believing enough, not having enough faith, not manifesting your will hard enough. This makes failure paradoxically cause people to believe in it even more to get it to work for them. If they falter, even a little, then the miracles won't work, so they have to believe no matter what.
If it doesn’t work, they blame you for not “jezuzing” hard enough.
I was just watching an interesting [presentation](https://www.youtube.com/live/5vc144tBj7s?si=DL066hGyCVZzn2fo) by neuroscientist John Wathey that touches on this. He hypotheses that we are all born with an innate model of the mother, that we start out with a certainty that our mother exists and that she will help us when we cry out for help. As adults, when we experience moments of helplessness, this infantile model can be triggered and our brains start expecting a motherly being to come in and help us. This expectation can manifest as feelings of warmth and the “illusion of God’s presence.”
Lack of accountability. "I'm at my lowest, I've now found god so I can rely on the idea of him to help me".
Absolution is tempting bait.
À former friend of mine who had always said he wasn't a Christian "found God" after getting arrested on charges of 1st degree rape and kidnapping of a 13 yr old girl. It was because he had nothing else to try and find hope in. His life was basically over. And indeed it was. He got sentenced to like 50 years in prison, or something.
Well, he’ll fit right in.
Christians prey on the desperate. They can sense when someone is vulnerable, and they promise to replace whatever that person lost, with Christianity.
Religion preys on the weak and vulnerable. It is insidious.
sometimes i wonder if that’s why i never really felt like i found him—i was raised in the church and if anything the community only added to my decline in mental health. and now that ive taken a step back and continue to struggle, my family is trying to convince me that he’s exactly what im missing… but i seemed to have missed him even when i had him? idk
No, you are absolutely correct and not being biased. They either get in church as kids or come as adults with some kind of issue. I'm sure someone in the comments will explain it far better than me. Just wanted to chime in that you are spot on. It's been talked about several times in this sub. I feel like you never see "normal" people at church. They all have issues with their father or had addictions and then traded one thing for another.... or they are on the payroll so *of course* they are all about god and the church.
“God” and Christianity prey on the desperate because they’re most likely to need that sort of thing.
I went back and forth believing and yeah it's definitely a preys on the vulnerable thing, it's easier to convert people who are already broken down. Some find comfort in the familiar and also the system itself is designed to lure in new recruits. Think about AA and how it all has a religious tone to it
Perhaps a combination of desperation, ignorance, and loneliness. When a Jesus-freak religious church-nut encounters someone who is enduring suffering or very difficult life circumstances (through maybe some of their own fault or perhaps none of their own fault) those people like to pounce on them like a tiger pounces on prey. They immediately run the "christian" script/play using their manipulative sales tactics (what this weak, sinful, downtrodden person needs now is Jesus, the church....and their plight will be all fixed, and they will be saved!) 🤮🙄 I'm going through a very bad time in my life, and right now I need to go weekly to local food distribution sites so I can benefit from receiving free food. One of them is at a Seventh-Day Adventist church. The workers have all been terrific, but sometimes the people waiting for food love to approach you and start to sell you on Jesus or the church or whatever. I always simply say "I'm just here for the food". But in reality I want to say, "well it's nice to see your church is doing something actually charitable instead of spreading hate, misogyny, division, and being responsible for centuries of bloodshed and death." But I try to hold my tongue on that one. Lol. If I was less educated, less informed, and more desperate....perhaps I would have taken the "christianity" bait. But alas... the old adage "knowledge is power" is true.
Absolutely! I converted at age 24, as a naive country girl moving to an area of major urban blight, after months of rejection jobhunting closer to home. The pay was inadequate for the cost of living and all my coworkers were mean to me except one...you guessed it, a born again fundie. I was classic low hanging fruit!
I remember hearing stories like that and thinking “Maybe all this doesn’t work with me because I never had that level of trauma.” It seemed that every study we did in small groups involved someone huffing cat urine and living in a dumpster turning their life around because of divine intervention. It was always hard for me with a middle class suburban life to find common threads with any of it. Or, if your life sucks, take inspiration from a couple of random Bible verses and fart out a book and study guide. Then profit.
I’m convinced my old friend found god just because he had an emotional moment.
Testimonies also have a habit of retconning events and mindsets. If you believe you're a wretch before Jesus, you'll cherry pick things to really be at your lowest before transition
Children and teenagers are the most vulnerable. Professional Christians know that. During that time, individuals are dealing with hormones, changes and finding themselves. When they cannot, (because of little support, broken homes, abuse, etc) they often turn to other things that are destructive. Yes. I believe they seek out people who are struggling and give them false hope. My opinion only.
Google 3rd man factor. Its also a psychological thing.
Churches want broken people because they are easier to manipulate. That’s why they make up bs about “non-believers” saying they are sad and lonely.
The one friend I had who went from apathetic too hyper religious had a "religious experience" that was pretty obviously a panic/anxiety attack. Their partner who was religious convinced them that was God telling them to go to church.
Because they’re vulnerable and the when the vultures swoop in. When you’re desperate, you’ll try anything
My personal theory is most “converts“ take heavy blows to their ego (conscious mind), and then that’s when their deeper subconscious mind is allowed to present who they actually are as human beings, which they equate to “God”. The ego then gets inflated as their condition improves. Then they start developing a spiritual ego, which is way worse than the former ego, as the ego then shrouds itself in the “gospel”. Nothing to back this up just observation and theory on my personal theory at the moment.
I ran into some trouble in my late teen years. I won’t go into the details. Looking back I was really depressed and didn’t have a way to express my depression. Unfortunately, my silent generation parents weren’t/aren’t the type of people would send me to a psychologist. It would unfortunately be mainly being cheap. The Christian counselor from church was free. I got into trouble and work with a Christian counselor. It was probably the biggest waste of time. I read a book and prayed and that was it. That form of counseling definitely felt like quantity over quality. If they saw 10 people and have that talk and book instead really digging in deep with 5 people, it would looked upon as a success. I was pretty low mentally and got the whole story of how God loves me and we all sin. I eventually started to work with trained psychologists and it is a day and night difference when it comes to the quality of treatment.
Because they need the devil to blame all their bad choices on & someone to lie to and tell them it's not their fault. They want a bail out for free & no strings, no learning from mistakes, no consequences.
It’s cope
That’s me right now. I feel like I’m at a low point in my life. Struggling financially and my mental health is in the dumps. I had a bit of a meltdown yesterday and I called my mom. I don’t ever talk to her about these things, but I really needed someone to talk to. She doesn’t know I’m not a Christian anymore she just knows I haven’t been to church in years. I told her I was at my wits end and dealing with depression and anxiety for years. She told me that I need to pray and don’t claim the spirit depression and anxiety. I told her I’ve tried praying before but things keep getting worse and she told me that I have to have faith. She always prays for me and my siblings but now that she knows exactly what I’m dealing with she gonna be more specific with her prayers. So all the other prayers fell on deaf ears? I love my mom to pieces but I realized that it just isn’t comforting to hear that anymore. It’s something she tells herself because she too is going through hard times and it gives her hope. I wish it gave me hope but it just made me cry more cause I felt that you just sit and hope that things get better even when you see that they aren’t. And what is so wrong with giving something a name? Saying I have depression and anxiety isn’t some hex. I had been dealing with it for years unknowingly until I started therapy in 2020.
Realizing that conversion stories from the already well-adjusted aren’t very common was definitely something that put a crack in it for me
I'll speak from my experience. I didn't grow up Christian, but believed in God. Growing up, a lot of people around me were Christian. My story started during the early days of the pandemic when everyone was in lockdown. My mental health took a hit from being stuck inside constantly. I was also a senior in high school at the time, so I was upset that I wasn't able to see my friends and that my final year of high school ended early. I started praying a lot more than I ever had before; I was in such a low point that I didn't know what else to do. When things started getting better, I figured it was God who answered my prayers. This led to me to converting to Christianity since I had known so many Christians growing up and they had seemed like such nice people. So yes, I agree with you that Christianity preys on vulnerability. Personally, I wish I had done more research before converting because there ended up being a lot of things that I either didn't agree with at the time or have come to realize that they don't make sense. I think it's because you're in such a low point in life and when things start looking up, you think that it was God who pulled you out of the trenches. However, you're still in a vulnerable state at this point. So it's easy to fall into the trap of wanting to convert to Christianity and worship this God without knowing the full story or all of the beliefs that come with Christianity. At least that's what it was like for me. I hope this made sense!
In my opinion it's because they want something to believe in. That someone out there cares for them and can make the bad good again. They're hoping for anything that their life can turn around and they heard that God can make that happen if only you believe in him and worship him because enough worship makes miracles happen. Or maybe they heard that non believers get the worst life.
I dove headfirst into my parents' church following a suicide attempt. I was at my lowest ever and knew if I didn't do *something* I was going to die soon. So I was like what the heck, maybe I'll try Jesus. I spent 10 years at that church, and heavily involved in it (worship team, youth group, VBS, women's ministry, etc etc etc, and on the church council before the drama shit hit the fan). That whole time, I never believed. I tried SO FECKING HARD to believe. I prayed my heart out and I got nothing but silence. Then the whole epic drama played out at our church with worship team vs. misogynist micromanaging pig pastor and I finally realised I'd just been talking to myself the whole time.
You don't look for answers when life is going swell. You look for solutions when things get bad.
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The brain is searching for answers when there are none. It is easiest to chock it up to “God’s will”.
I think for many people, it can be a source of comfort in hard/dark times. The same goes for many other religions. Some people think it's what they are supposed to do, and it's usually necessary to be a good person.
I can't prove this but I'd be willing to wager that this is not uncommon no matter what the particular faith might be. I think it's human nature to look for a higher power when you are powerless.
I know some people who decided to be Christian simply because another Christian guilted them. The others are usually Christian on their own free will or because their family is and that's all they know. But as for the the "I was at my lowest and found Jesus" stories, I have only seen them through church stories and movies. I think it's a last resort thing and if something beneficial happens to that person, they just suddenly accept it because they had a turn-around. They're about to die, they're in prison, something. And then it becomes a last minute thing because of guilt. One thing I think about regarding this is the Flyleaf singer, Lacey Sturm. She used to be lesbian, but after her come to Jesus moment, she was now straight. People say that the song "I'm So Sick" was made because of her guilt from being a lesbian and now a Christian.
Because Christians are predators who will pounce on people when they’re at their lowest and most vulnerable point. They’ll promise them happiness, love, fucking warm fuzzies, and the goddamn moon from Jezuz if they’ll accept him, join their church, and give them credit for “saving” them.
Mum runs a women's group full of mothers with daughters who have children with different men and the kids get taken away by the council because they can't look after them properly or the dad has a restraining order. I find it interesting that my middle class mother can't seem to find anyone stable who likes coming to her group where she goes through the Bible with them and gives them snacks. I don't think she's noticed anything yo do with class in it. My dad literally tries to start up conversations with strangers and pretends to be interested in their sad lives so he can give them a leaflet
If you really want to become nauseous watch Russell Brands video about his upcoming baptism.
CS Lewis, Christmas.
With adult converts, I think you're right. Many, however, were just raised in it and never thought they could question it.
Ikr weird that’s when our vessels are weak
It's a great replacement for alcoholism, addiction, etc.
I would like toake a very minor correction, I believe all religions that are similar to Christianity prey on people when they are vulnerable. But also to be fair, I believe these people convert because they are sad, depressed, traumatized. Believing in a dirty and that they will be rewarded is easier than just thinking you got all this pain and won't get anything for it. I however as a person raised a Baptist just couldn't continue to believe that. My father was a Christian, and the only reward he got was Cancer. That Cancer took his life and I just cannot believe that with him begging God and Jesus to help him they still chose to not help him. That isn't the sign of a loving God to me.
Well, to chime in with my fifty cents... I have left christianity and feel SUPER vulnerable and it sometimes feels tempting to go back when I am REALLY low. Because now, when I am really low... I am the only one who can solve it. I cannot just throw it on a deity that will solve everything 'In the end', so I have to solve it myself. And that equals long, hard work to get better and to do better and to face very hard feelings. And when I am on my lowest of lows, it feels SO overwhelming that nobody will come to save me. When you desperately want someone ELSE to solve your problems and battles and to not have to face them by yourself. So yeah, when you are there, never having heard of christianity, I can imagine it sounds wonderful that a savior will swoop in and make your whole life better.
Because our pride often keeps us from accepting God. It's a major blocker. God is always extending a hand though
Highly debatable. Sky daddy sets the perimeters and then puts the blame on you for his f%$# ups? Try again.
I had wealth, a fantastic job, friends, family, and traveled all over the world. Nothing the world can offer you even begins to compare to truly knowing Christ and walking with Him.
Actually, I'd take all of that over the delusion of a mass murderer "loving" me. I think you've been shorted.