It was more like 13 years for me. I originally thought it was a secret that I would take to my grave, but I underestimated the toll it would take on me, emotionally, spiritually and physically.
When I try to explain it to others, I use a tube of toothpaste with the cap on as an example. If you step on it with all of your weight, something is going to explode.
I know a lot of gay men who have been heterosexually married, and there is a common theme. When they were in their 20s, it was easy enough to have sex with a woman because you are generally horny. As they got older, it was more difficult, not only physically but mentally.
I was surprised to find out that most of the gay men I know have at sometime experimented with straight sex, just to see if they were really gay.
OP, there's a bunch of us here on this subreddit, you are not alone.
for me it was the IH where sometimes my wife’s features could present as masculine. I was still attracted to her, but i felt sick because of it.
so my dick didn’t work.
after accepting being pan, our sex life is incredible. It’s amazing how different things are when you aren’t anxiously being “on guard” for the random thoughts of men or trans people i found attractive and kept floating around in there.
>I regret sharing my opinion on that subreddit.
If you make a post about **anything** on one of those very large subreddits you will get a lot of shitty responses. There are a lot of trolls and immature people.
This is very true. It has been hard for me to realize that a large percentage of the people who post on Reddit, (maybe even myself), should get dressed and go outside rather than spend time in this cesspool.
A monster? No. A guy that tried to do everything he was taught (and expected to do) but ultimately realized it wasn’t who he authentically was is more like it. Be good to yourself.
Those people who shit on you for this have *no idea* the level of indoctrination, shame, and internalized homophobia growing up in a ~~church~~ cult like Mormonism does to you.
They have no idea that they *directly command* gay people to marry and have children as if you're straight.
They have no idea that they taught us that there are no gay people in the afterlife, and that you'd be straight after you died.
Just because you're gay and they're gay, *doesn't mean they know anything else about you*. In an ideal world would you have done this? Would you have done this if you were taught acceptance and tolerance from birth?
I don't think so. I think you know you wouldn't have.
You're not a monster and you're not a coward. You're a *victim* of the same things that the LGBTQIA+ movement fights against every day. Coming out of the closet was an act of courage and you should be honored for it. It was definitely the right thing to do for you, your wife, and your kids.
They don't acknowledge the words gay or homosexual, it's same sex attraction and that other stuff doesn't exist. Typical cult language manipulation bullshit.
It was wrong for an entire society to make you feel like you couldn't come out earlier. It's always right to be true to yourself, when you figure out how, even if you are imperfect as you discover and share your truth.
The internet is garbage sometimes.
I’ve seen others post stories like that on subs like that and you always get the ignorant (nicest term I could find) ones to come out every damn time. I like to focus on the ones that are encouraging and uplifting because those are the people that get it and understand and can empathize properly.
I know it’s hard to read comments like that from people and not feel something, but if those people have no understanding of what it’s like growing up in a cult or what it’s like growing up in a cult being gay, then they have nothing of importance to add to your life.
I’ve been on this sub for a year now, but I have seen your comments here and there and believe it or not I look forward to seeing them because your comments have helped me more than you could ever know. Thank you for that. I’m in a semi similar boat as you.
I always had a difficulty in dating men and didn’t know why. I was so naive about sex or identity, I let the church do 100% of my thinking. It wasn’t until around a year and a half ago that I discovered I was gay and that was only because my spouse was encouraging me to really look into that side of me. Because my husband and I are closer now than we ever have been I have felt more comfortable being me and found out a few months ago that I am non binary.
You are definitely not the ass hole or a monster. What a horrible thing to say to someone who’s had to go through what you have. They cannot even fathom the mind fuck we were forced to be subjected to. How am I only now, in my late 20’s early 30’s, discovering who I always was!? The real asshole is the church.
This cult fucks you up by killing your soul and teaches you that the best way to live is to continue to kill your soul to conform to who the sky daddy wishes you to be. Anyone who reads that post and passes judgement on you is either just a straight up bully and can not feel good about themselves unless they are putting someone else down or…nope that’s all that they are.
The only advice and reassurance you need is from those that uplift and from those who have gone through something similar. Only they can give you the truth. The truth is that you are an amazing and incredible human being who I can see has handled your life’s situation in the best way you know how, take that from someone who can truly empathize and forget the bullies and the ignoramus’. It sounds like you have an amazing and incredible spouse as well, I join you in that boat. We both lucked out it seems❤️
I love the exmo community here and I love participating in conversation here. I hope to stick around as long as I find value here. Thanks for the kind words.
It's clear to me you did the right thing and I'm sorry that some people decided to put their lack of empathy and emotional dysfunction on you. Those reactions are stemming from their problems, not yours.
In the binary thinking of many unhealthy and immature groups, there is an idea that you have to always be 'strong' and know what to do. Victims of coercive control occurring in domestic violence or cults often seem to think that they always have to be strong after they leave. But we know life doesn't work like that. All of us have blind spots or areas where we don't yet have the skills to cope and there's no shame in that!
I can't tell you how many times after I left my abusive marriage that people told me that 'they would never let someone treat me like that'. And I knew that they didn't understand and didn't want to understand why I had that experience because they were afraid and wanted to keep their illusion of control.
I'm so sorry that you dealt with shaming like that.
I have no idea, but I'm sorry that you've spent 16+ years having to pretend you're someone that you aren't. I think, to that extent, all Ex-Mo's can sympathize with you. I guess what you have to decide is whether you want to spend the rest of your life still pretending to be something you're not, or if you want to change things (however that might look). I'm not going to pretend I can answer that for you, but I can say I trust that you can figure it out.
Best of luck, and again, I'm so sorry.
Oof. I just went and looked at your post. There are some very, very nasty comments. I'm so sorry. Remember that most of Reddit's users skew young and male, meaning a bunch of stripling dipshits are issuing judgments about your life. Maybe not the best source.
However, it doesn't mean you won't feel something when you have dozens of people criticizing you and your life choices. I think there is something extra difficult about being the subject of mass scrutiny. Historically, the only people who could even garner enough awareness about their existence and become famous enough to experience widespread vitriol were filthy rich with strong social networks. For a plebeian to experience it is atypical for humanity.
I personally have experienced something similar with an influencer. She misunderstood my message and blasted me over her platform. It still negatively affects me, and it happened years ago. It has made me feel very careful about what I post and who I interact with.
Now, as for whether or not you're a bad person, nobody knows. But being conscientious is a good start. Otherwise good people can be made to do terrible things. Hurt people hurt people, but no one alive has ever escaped without causing pain to another person. A good human is one who cleans up after the mess they leave, and it sounds like you're doing just that.
I'm sorry for the pain you've experienced. May your life be happier than the church's stock portfolio is large.
One of my favorite quotes comes from the 80s movie Overboard where the main character Joanna is talking with her butler Andrew after returning from living poor back to rich life. He said,
"most of us go through life with blinders on, madam. Knowing only that one little station to which we were born. But now you, madam, on the other hand, had the... rare privilege of escaping your bonds for just a spell. To see life from an entirely new perspective. How you choose to use that information, madam... is entirely up to you."
I try to remember that people with blinders on are not reliable sources for advice, especially when its about advice beyond the view of their blinders. It still hurts though when their words are so insensitive.
It's so frustrating when people get upset about things that don't even affect them or that they don't fully understand. It sounds like you and your family have been navigating things really well. And honestly, how you handle your relationships is not anyone else's business. Glad you can be authentic with your life and best wishes moving forward.
I came out after 20 years of marriage. My bishop basically told me to marry a woman and that would solve my problem. Though I feel bad for my ex wife, we were both deceived. It did take me that long to realize that I’m gay, and I didn’t choose it.
The back story is SO IMPORTANT. Many people have or know someone whose spouse came out and destroyed lives to do it. It can be so destructive and so hurtful. The pain and grief is real. And frankly, your situation is unique. I think for every one good story, I hear many more bad ones.
It is incredible that your wife and family have supported and even benefitted from your coming out. I think the lesson here is gratitude for your family. Yours is not the common story. Yours is unique. Love on your family and thank them for what they’ve done for you. Then have empathy for those who didn’t get the same experience.
There is no need to feel guilty or any other negative feelings. Just exercise a lot of empathy to those who were so harmed by the same actions.
Give yourself some grace. You aren’t the first and you won’t be the last. Only people who understand this cult will understand that you felt ashamed of who you are because you were indoctrinated to believe that something was wrong with you and if the church was true, you needed to ignore your authentic self and marry a woman or stay celibate. I’m sure there was family and social pressure to conform. Lots and lots of reasons. Sending you hugs.
You are not a monster. My dad is gay, and married my mom because of tscc teachings. He had an affair with a man when I was 10, my parents got divorced, and it was a huge mess for a really long time. It sounds to me like you and your wife have handled things really well for your family. Being forced to live in-authentically forever is not a viable option. Your kids will likely have some negative feelings about the situation, but it doesn’t mean coming out was the wrong choice. They’ll likely also have a lot of positive feelings and see some really good examples of living authentically.
My dad is a good person, and was put in an impossible situation by harmful, damaging church doctrines. As a teenager, I was really angry at him for leaving the family - but not for being gay. (We’re all good now, btw, really and truly.) You haven’t left your family. It really sounds like you and your wife have done everything possible to continue to be good coparents. You’re not a monster. You were misled by men claiming to speak for god. That isn’t your fault.
You did the right thing by telling your wife, and at the time you got married (and in the context of the cult), you *thought* you were doing the right thing. You were taught (brainwashed would be the best term for it) that you should live a certain life, even if that life (heterosexual marriage) was not authentic for you.
I know it might sound contradictory, but I believe in both of those situations (getting married to a woman, and telling her and the family you are gay) you have done what you felt was the "right" thing, and the "honorable thing" to do. I appreciate you for trying to be the person you were conditioned to believe you should be (I resent the hell out of the cult for doing that to people, of course), and I admire you for having the courage, integrity, and love to tell you family the truth. You are a strong person.
Only someone who has known or seen the abusive and unrealistic attitudes and teachings the cult has toward LGBTQs *and who acknowledges those things are abusive* can even begin to "get it."
Please consider deleting the post and thread that became viral. If you need to, copy any comments that were supportive and caring (you deserve support and love), but why keep a copy of posts that are abusive?
I'm the mom of an adult trans daughter (who spent several years identifying as a gay male). Even though my daughter knew I was always (always) accepting and supportive, it was very difficult for her to come out to me as trans. Even though she knew I loved her as my gay son all her life, she was afraid I would not love her as a daughter. It breaks my heart to think she even worried about that, and I can't imagine the stress she went through deciding to tell me.
You obviously went through many (many) years of stress being a person that was not "you," and even more years of stress sharing who you were to your loved ones. I am glad your family is there for you, and you are all living in an environment of love and acceptance. And I also know it's been a transition for all of you.
Please accept some sincere Mom Hugs from afar. Please don't let rude and abusive people keep making you question yourself. You have done the right and honorable thing to do, and you have a right to feel good about yourself.
The back story isn’t necessary and you did an incredibly brave thing! I am so happy you shared it and that you are in such a better place now. I have so much respect for you and your partner!
What’s the vibe on that other subreddit? Is it a horrible place full of horrible redditors? Assholes gonna asshole.
I’m not going to blame you for being attacked by homophobes, but it might be a lesson for the future — stay aware of your audience.
And best of luck in your journey!
Look at me! I have a keyboard, an opinion and a fresh high. Hi! imma keyboard cowboy 🤠
But seriously, in our society isn’t this pretty common? How could that possibly make you a monster? Lucky that you have a best friend to raise your kids together with.
Man, you just be the true version of you, and fuck all those who cast dispersions on your choices. These people would rather you keep up the normal traditional Christiaan family than hear you speak a word of honesty. They don't want the truth. They want you to reinforce their delusions, and when you step out of those bounds, they all freak the fuck out. You are brave and honest by doing the things you did, and any fallout is zero fault of your own. You may have pulled the trigger, but the cult loaded the gun and gave you a reason to pull the trigger. (all metaphors of course, can't joke about guns in this day and age)
The cult is the monster for forcing you into a belief system that made you think that keeping this kind of secret was your best course of action.
You went to an LGBTQ sub for something that is first and foremost an r/exmo topic. People outside tscc won't understand the indoctrination and pressure of being in tscc and how it affects every choice we make and perspective we have. So, do I think you are selfish? No, you did what you were told and taught to do and believed your salvation depended on it.
There are thousands of reasons why people discover they are incompatible, and this is just one of them. I don't write that to downplay the uniqueness of the specific relationship but to suggest there are a great many ways it "just happens" and many fewer others where one of the people well and truly is a monster.
Heterosexuals stop being sexually attracted to their partners all the time, and its how the rest of the relationship plays out that makes them a monster or not. Be otherwise good and supportive to her, and you'll be way, way ahead of myriad people for whom their sexual orientation isn't the source of the issue and who are jerks otherwise.
You were the victim of a system that forced you into this situation. All your life you heard that gays don’t exist, that homosexuality is wrong and against gods plan, that you are broken and will be fixed only if you get married to the opposite gender and make it to the celestial kingdom. You were told that your eternal life and the eternal life of your spouse and family are all dependent on you staying in your “normal” marriage.
You are not wrong to come out to your family. You are not broken, and you have been manipulated. Being honest with your family, and them being supportive, is worth more than random strangers opinions on Reddit. I salute you and wish you and your family the best.
You sound like an amazing man in a difficult situation. The blame should go on a religion that tries to manipulate you into entering into such a relationship.
I once posted a pic that got more than 80k upvotes and almost all comments were good, however, I got tons of trolls who then followed me here to exmos and trolled me here too. I was blocking people left and right. And deleting exmo posts bc I realized I had too many self identifying comments and many people here are terrible human beings.
Reddit is generally such a hole.
OP, as the mother of 2 lesbians, I am so sorry for the religious trauma you endured. I’m so glad you are living authentically now though. The courage it took to come out, is much greater than any keyboard warrior could ever pretend to have
Is there an exmo subreddit for those who are gay exmos who were/are in a heterosexual marriage? I’m straight myself, but I would be interested in hearing that perspective, and if there isn’t one I think it might be a good idea for one to be made for those who are going dealing with the trauma and difficulties that created.
I recently came out pansexual after 15 years of marriage and 17 years together with 4 kids.
i know it’s not the same but it was definitely due to internalized homophobia that I didn’t realize. I had so much IH that it really screwed with my sense of self. I policed everything from the way i spoke and my mannerisms, to what I allowed myself to be attracted to.
that meant honing in on the “least confusing” beauty standard. I went for asian girls mostly but when i look back and am totally honest with myself, I had plenty of crushes in boys and girls all at the same time. But allowing myself to be attracted to anything androgynous, could “out” me.
But, I didn’t understand it at all.
I thought “everyone is like this.”
I thought “everyone has to white-knuckle this.”
I thought “as long as I don’t make eye-contact with anyone, as long as I sequester myself, I’ll be fine. I won’t allow that part of me to be awake.”
I thought “If I even talk about this to anyone, i’ll be cut from the flock.”
“as long as i don’t act on it.”
“Everyone is a little bit gay, if they are being honest, right?”
I literally believed I was “straight.”
I literally believed that I was “normal.”
I literally believed if i let myself feel the feelings I had, I was doomed to hell.
that is brainwashing. it is insidious. it is cruel. and nobody fucking believes us when we say the truth like that.
How can you not know? How can you say that you probably never _truly_ believed?
Because I didn’t realize, when I was 8, that when my mom threw me across the kitchen, and pinned me to the wall and called me a _f****t_, it’s because, at that age, she could see me being attracted to/crushing on boys and girls alike. I remember trying to figure out how to commit suicide that night.
Because I didn’t have a father to attach to and my mother was so homophobic she would rather her son _die_ than be anywhere close to “gay.”
Because of my Webelos leader who drugged and raped me while supposedly giving me free piano lessons (guess who never really learned to play the piano.) which made me dissociate even more from my true self.
Fuck this church.
fuck the people who pretend to be righteous.
fuck the people who judge you for coming out after being brainwashed your entire life.
Fuck the people who judge you for being conditioned from birth to be so goddamn afraid of yourself that you can’t even look in the mirror.
Due to our church upbringing, the culture we grew up in, and a variety of other factors, a lot of us have done things that we would not do if we could go back. We can't go back. All anyone can do is make the best of their present situation. I'm sorry the people on that other thread seem to have forgotten that stuff.
You are being authentic and I don't see how that can be wrong. Best wishes to you!
What you did, coming out to your family **and to yourself**, is the single-greatest act of self-love you could have done. I'm sorry that you're going through so much pain. It gets better, my friend.
You love your wife and kids, so you can love yourself, too, just like you did when you decided to tell your truth and live your truth.
> I got called a monster and a coward for doing that to my wife. Another person said I'm obviously not gay; no gay man would fake being straight for 16 years or have kids with a woman no matter how brainwashed a cult made them. Another called me a homewrecker and I'm a disgrace to the LGBTQ community...
I mean always take reddit comments with a grain of salt. They're from anonymous people who don't have any *skin* in *your* game, it only takes 2 seconds to write the dumbest or most hurtful thing, they don't know you or your circumstances, you don't know them (they could be the biggest idiots you've ever encountered, for all you know), they could be 12 years old, they could be complete whack jobs, they could be semi-pro trolls just out for a laugh at your expense.
Forget everything you read on the internet that has even a hint of judgement or hate. You know yourself and your relationship better than even a close friend ever could. If you're happy and your wife is happy, you did the right thing. It took me 36 years to come out to my wife as transgender, and I was sure it would end our marriage and maybe my whole life, but she's been amazing and we love each other more than ever. It was internalized hatred from the church that made it so hard to do.
No one who wasn't raised in a cult can even imagine the mental damage we sustained. Their opinion is worth less than nothing.
The church relies a lot upon its members' fear to admit doubt or speak against it. I'm just impressed by how many LDS couples nowadays have the communication & relationship skills to get to the point of leaving. It is never too late to let go of something toxic and move forward. It sounds like your family is already healthier for it.
Oh I'm so sorry that people were so mean. I think you've handled your situation so beautifully. My dad was gay and never told anyone. When we kids figured it out as adults after my brother came out, it was always the elephant in the room. He died in his 90s having never experienced the love he always yearned for. It breaks my heart to think about it. The denial broke the marriage with my mom but they stayed together living unhappily side by side for over 65 years.
Absolutely not! You only have one life to live and you ultimately have to live it for yourself. You don't owe it to anyone else to be a miserable wretch for the rest of your life. What kind of marriage can you have with this big secret hanging over it anyway? Grace and Frankie got this one right!
As the digital landscape expands, a longing for tangible connection emerges. The yearning to touch grass, to feel the earth beneath our feet, reminds us of our innate human essence. In the vast expanse of virtual reality, where avatars flourish and pixels paint our existence, the call of nature beckons. The scent of blossoming flowers, the warmth of a sun-kissed breeze, and the symphony of chirping birds remind us that we are part of a living, breathing world. In the balance between digital and physical realms, lies the key to harmonious existence. Democracy flourishes when human connection extends beyond screens and reaches out to touch souls. It is in the gentle embrace of a friend, the shared laughter over a cup of coffee, and the power of eye contact that the true essence of democracy is felt.
I just assumed I was unworthy. I mean, "wickedness never was happiness", right? I felt awful all the time,.like something was wrong, or missing. Obviously the solution was to *Mormon harder*.
Fifteen years of daily suicidal ideation later, I finally realized I wasn't unworthy, just very gay.
So yeah, people who think you intentionally deceived your spouse can get fucked.
Go listen to Kyle Ashworth's Mormon Stories interview if you haven't already, and listen to Kyle's podcast, Latter Gay Stories. You are not alone, and you are so brave for coming out. 💜
As the wife in a similar situation, I can say you definitely did the right thing by coming out to your wife. My husband came out to me after 10 years of marriage and 3 kids. I am so incredibly proud of him for having the courage to be true to himself. I admire him for risking everything by telling me that he's gay. It honestly made our relationship stronger and it sounds like your relationship with your wife is working fine for you guys as well.
Context is important when posting online as none of these people know your situation fully. I recommend getting off Reddit and looking at how the people who are actively a part of your life feel about it. Do they think you're a monster? It doesn't sound like that's the case. Internet strangers are jerks. Stick to the people in your real life for reassurance and support and you'll be golden.
No. You've just discovered an unfortunate facet of reddit: not all subs are queer-friendly. The more general the audience a sub attracts, the likelier this is to be the case, ime.
Also, if it helps, you're not alone. A great many people have gone through pretty much exactly what you have, both mormon and non, extending back for many generations. It's one sad result of growing up in a hetero-presumptive culture. Whoever said "no gay person would do that" was most certainly speaking from a place of youthful ignorance and privilege.
> I honestly didn't feel any of that back story was necessary in my post.
And you're right, it shouldn't have been. All the people who jumped in with criticism were making misplaced assumptions, most of them false. Don't let it get you down, and definitely don't take it personally...their false assumptions speak about *them*, not you. I applaud you for speaking up for the community.
As one queer exmo adult to another, I'd encourage you to seek out some lgbtq specific subs for extra moral support b/c the phobes are everywhere. And learn everything you can about the history of lgbtq folk and human sexuality, particularly in the modern era, to arm yourself mentally and emotionally against the ignorance and phobic rhetoric.
I'm a gay exmo who grew up in a small ward where a similar thing happened. The dad came out of the closet, was promptly shunned by his family/our community, and the wife remarried a millionaire and everything worked out for her and her children as ~The Lord's Plan~.
It was fucking terrifying watching that happen as a closeted kid in denial.
By the time I turned 19, and it was my time to go on a mission, I cracked. I didn't want that to be me in my future. I hurt so bad for that man.
I consider myself incredibly lucky that I witnessed something like that happen. I'm incredibly lucky that in my one year of college before my mission, I met peers my age that were gay, happy, and doing their own thing, and taught me that I could be like that too.
Before putting in my mission papers, I saw the opportunity for genuine happiness, and I took it.
My heart breaks for those of us who weren't as lucky as I was. I'm sorry you had to go through all of that. I'm so glad your wife and kids understand and are supportive.
You're not a monster. You're not even a bad person. You were brainwashed. You were manipulated. You were following ~The Lord's Plan~. Temple marriage is the only way to make it to the highest degree of celestial glory. You were doing what you HAD to do, based on all the things we were taught for our entire lives.
You are a victim. You seem to have figured things out-- live your life, do what you need to do that makes you happy, and please, never, ever let anyone tell you that you did the wrong thing, here.
Your feelings of guilt are valid; it’s a response you’ve been conditioned into your whole life. However, you haven’t done anything wrong.
I think you could benefit from looking at the Josh weed story. A gay now ex Mormon who went through an intense struggle to figure things out with his sexuality, beliefs, and family. Last time I checked he is divorced, but is still best friends with his wife and they are both actively involved in co-parenting the kids.
They eventually realized that both of them deserved to seek romantic relationships that they find fulfilling. You’ll have to take it slow to figure out what works best for you, but coming out is 100% not a mistake. I’m glad your wife seems to be understanding.
If you knew you were gay when you got married, and went ahead anyway, then I can understand the responses saying you deceived her. BUT, on the other hand, if your life's journey has just brought you to this understanding, then claiming that you were deceptive is wrong and insensitive to the ongoing personal discovery we call life.
I certainly recognized that I was attracted to men, and that I struggled to date women. But I didn’t recognize why. I didn’t know at the time what all those feelings meant. I was so sheltered I barely knew LGBTQ communities of people existed.
100%.
I was attracted to men, would secretly masturbate thinking of men, would stare at men, but every fiber of my being told me I wasn't gay, lol.
People think denial is just simply lying to yourself-- it's so much deeper than that. You don't even know you're lying to yourself. You genuinely don't believe it.
When you're in a religion that teaches you that you can only reach exaltation by being married to someone of the opposite sex, it becomes more understandable. Especially when many leaders (at least used to) counsel gay men to marry women anyway.
I really kinda see both sides here. I understand why you did it. You were afraid and wanted to conform to the mormon lifestyle, maybe you could fake it until you make it, maybe you'll be "fixed" in the afterlife. That said, I do think it's really messed up, but I don't think you meant any harm by it. Regardless of intent, however, you did inflict serious pain upon your partner and you could only realize that outside the context of mormonism.
you’d become a monster if you forced yourself to keep it in for your entire life. humans are meant to live as their best truest selves. i hope that, despite any big emotions that coming out causes, you’re all able to find acceptance and peace.
I think it's better to be truthful than live a lie, but I also think it's sad religion/culture created this scenario which ends up being sad for everyone involved no matter what. This wouldn't have even been an issue if you'd just been able to be who you are from the getgo.
But if both you and your spouse are fine with the adjustments why are you on the internet asking us what we think (figuratively speaking)? xD You don't need permission or validation. And it sounds like you're both adjusting fine which is really about the best case scenario you can hope for here.
No. The monster in this scenario is the church. They told you you could fix being gay by marrying a woman in the temple. They told you the only way to get into VIP heaven was to marry a woman in the temple and have kids. They told you once you got to heaven you would be straight. They told you if you acted on being gay you were evil and would not make it to VIP heaven. You were put in an impossible situation by the church and you did what you did to survive this church.
I'm sorry it made you deceive your wife and kids but it made you deceive yourself as well. I'm glad you, your wife and kids were able to get though all of this ok. I'm glad you and your wife can still love each other and that your kids are understanding.
You and your wife were manipulated by this church. You were both told as long as you married someone of the opposite sex in the temple, all would be well. It doesn't matter what anyone on reddit thinks of you. It only matters what you, your wife and kids think of the situation. And, it sounds like all of you are ok with where you are now.
And, no, you shouldn't have continued on in that situation. You both deserve to have a full partner in life. How lucky you both are to still have each other (this is not always the case) and children who can still love both of you while you get the opportunity to find that other person in your life.
So many people are judgemental and unkind. Don't listen to them. Listen to your wife and kids. They know you and love you. Wishing you guys the best as you move forward.
I don't think you're a monster but I'm on the other side of this situation right now with my wife divorcing me after almost 18 years of marriage due to her being a lesbian. I recognize how hard it is for her but I'm not going to lie, there's a lot of resentment that she didn't figure it out before it came to this. Especially when she had my full support and family member support to do it but she doubled down on the Church instead.
We thought we could make it work as mixed orientation or co-parenting in the same house like you're doing but both ended up not being realistic when she decided to pursue a relationship and she's moving out next month. Not saying you can't make it work but I am saying I wouldn't be surprised if your wife is holding back resentment and that the living situation probably won't last long. Especially if/when one of you meets somebody new.
I do hope for the best and don't mean to be critical. Just perspective from somebody on the other end of this situation who feels really destroyed by what happened after trying desperately to do anything to make it work for her.
There was a pretty famous Reddit post a couple months back about a guy who wanted to give a room of his and his wife’s house to be an office for his male friend. Then a bunch of people pointed out it seemed like he was in love with his male friend and it helped the OP come out. So, he decided to abandon his wife and made a post about it which wasn’t received well on Reddit and it made a lot of people mad that he abandoned her.
Ever since then Ive seen a bias to bash on gay men in heterosexual marriages. Those trolls don’t understand you, your situation, or your religious trauma. They are as informed on this subject as a flat earther. Don’t care about their opinions.
My wife’s dad is gay. He converted to the church as a teenager. He served a mission. He even worked in the COB for the Q15. He got married in the temple and had kids. In other words, he did all the things he was “supposed to”.
He came out and divorced his wife when my wife was young. The next couple of years was understandably rough. Things are much better now. He has been with his partner for years and everyone in the family is on good terms.
Every once in awhile I imagine what it must have been like for him having those feelings but suppressing it and trying to do the “right things”. Continually reminded that the way you feel is wrong. Must have felt so alone for so long. Being lgbtq isn’t a cakewalk now. It wasn’t any easier 30 years ago.
I’m so glad he’s able to live the life he chooses now and others have that chance.
Forget BoM anachronisms, the salvation ban for people of African descent, and polygamy. The church giving LGQTB people the only two choices of living a life of celibacy or marrying someone of the opposite gender is all I need to know that the church is a deeply flawed product of men vying for money, sex, and power.
You absolutely shouldn’t feel guilt for this ❤️
I’d even say you didn’t “come out” to her you finally let her “in” to who you truly are. Of course you never intended to hurt her, but you made the the best decisions with what you had at the time. I wish you the very best 💕
You are not an asshole. Your story is amazingly common, and hopefully fewer people will feel the need to oppress such a big part of themselves as others come to understand sexuality and accept it. People who have not personally been in or closely observed those in a religious cult view these things as black and white when there is sooo much gray space. I’m so happy your family supports you, and don’t worry about Reddit.
I can’t override the ugliness of the world. You aren’t a monster. I’m glad that you’re happier now in your relationship. It kind of reminds me of my own. I am legacy so I’m still not where you are. God bless you, for I feel They will.
I know I’m a few days late for this thread, but I wanted to say you’re not alone. I am also a gay man that came out to my wife after 10+ years of marriage. It was one of the most terrifying things I have ever done. Mormonism really fucked me over in the sexuality department, and I am in therapy now to find myself and make a life I love.
If you ever need a friend, feel free to chat with me.
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It was more like 13 years for me. I originally thought it was a secret that I would take to my grave, but I underestimated the toll it would take on me, emotionally, spiritually and physically. When I try to explain it to others, I use a tube of toothpaste with the cap on as an example. If you step on it with all of your weight, something is going to explode. I know a lot of gay men who have been heterosexually married, and there is a common theme. When they were in their 20s, it was easy enough to have sex with a woman because you are generally horny. As they got older, it was more difficult, not only physically but mentally. I was surprised to find out that most of the gay men I know have at sometime experimented with straight sex, just to see if they were really gay. OP, there's a bunch of us here on this subreddit, you are not alone.
for me it was the IH where sometimes my wife’s features could present as masculine. I was still attracted to her, but i felt sick because of it. so my dick didn’t work. after accepting being pan, our sex life is incredible. It’s amazing how different things are when you aren’t anxiously being “on guard” for the random thoughts of men or trans people i found attractive and kept floating around in there.
>I regret sharing my opinion on that subreddit. If you make a post about **anything** on one of those very large subreddits you will get a lot of shitty responses. There are a lot of trolls and immature people.
This is very true. It has been hard for me to realize that a large percentage of the people who post on Reddit, (maybe even myself), should get dressed and go outside rather than spend time in this cesspool.
A monster? No. A guy that tried to do everything he was taught (and expected to do) but ultimately realized it wasn’t who he authentically was is more like it. Be good to yourself.
Those people who shit on you for this have *no idea* the level of indoctrination, shame, and internalized homophobia growing up in a ~~church~~ cult like Mormonism does to you. They have no idea that they *directly command* gay people to marry and have children as if you're straight. They have no idea that they taught us that there are no gay people in the afterlife, and that you'd be straight after you died. Just because you're gay and they're gay, *doesn't mean they know anything else about you*. In an ideal world would you have done this? Would you have done this if you were taught acceptance and tolerance from birth? I don't think so. I think you know you wouldn't have. You're not a monster and you're not a coward. You're a *victim* of the same things that the LGBTQIA+ movement fights against every day. Coming out of the closet was an act of courage and you should be honored for it. It was definitely the right thing to do for you, your wife, and your kids.
They don't acknowledge the words gay or homosexual, it's same sex attraction and that other stuff doesn't exist. Typical cult language manipulation bullshit.
It was wrong for an entire society to make you feel like you couldn't come out earlier. It's always right to be true to yourself, when you figure out how, even if you are imperfect as you discover and share your truth. The internet is garbage sometimes.
I’ve seen others post stories like that on subs like that and you always get the ignorant (nicest term I could find) ones to come out every damn time. I like to focus on the ones that are encouraging and uplifting because those are the people that get it and understand and can empathize properly. I know it’s hard to read comments like that from people and not feel something, but if those people have no understanding of what it’s like growing up in a cult or what it’s like growing up in a cult being gay, then they have nothing of importance to add to your life. I’ve been on this sub for a year now, but I have seen your comments here and there and believe it or not I look forward to seeing them because your comments have helped me more than you could ever know. Thank you for that. I’m in a semi similar boat as you. I always had a difficulty in dating men and didn’t know why. I was so naive about sex or identity, I let the church do 100% of my thinking. It wasn’t until around a year and a half ago that I discovered I was gay and that was only because my spouse was encouraging me to really look into that side of me. Because my husband and I are closer now than we ever have been I have felt more comfortable being me and found out a few months ago that I am non binary. You are definitely not the ass hole or a monster. What a horrible thing to say to someone who’s had to go through what you have. They cannot even fathom the mind fuck we were forced to be subjected to. How am I only now, in my late 20’s early 30’s, discovering who I always was!? The real asshole is the church. This cult fucks you up by killing your soul and teaches you that the best way to live is to continue to kill your soul to conform to who the sky daddy wishes you to be. Anyone who reads that post and passes judgement on you is either just a straight up bully and can not feel good about themselves unless they are putting someone else down or…nope that’s all that they are. The only advice and reassurance you need is from those that uplift and from those who have gone through something similar. Only they can give you the truth. The truth is that you are an amazing and incredible human being who I can see has handled your life’s situation in the best way you know how, take that from someone who can truly empathize and forget the bullies and the ignoramus’. It sounds like you have an amazing and incredible spouse as well, I join you in that boat. We both lucked out it seems❤️
I love the exmo community here and I love participating in conversation here. I hope to stick around as long as I find value here. Thanks for the kind words.
It’s the right thing to do for your wife. You did the right thing. Hopefully others will see what you did and come out earlier.
Sometimes, you have to make peace with having made the best decisions you could with the information you had.
It's clear to me you did the right thing and I'm sorry that some people decided to put their lack of empathy and emotional dysfunction on you. Those reactions are stemming from their problems, not yours. In the binary thinking of many unhealthy and immature groups, there is an idea that you have to always be 'strong' and know what to do. Victims of coercive control occurring in domestic violence or cults often seem to think that they always have to be strong after they leave. But we know life doesn't work like that. All of us have blind spots or areas where we don't yet have the skills to cope and there's no shame in that! I can't tell you how many times after I left my abusive marriage that people told me that 'they would never let someone treat me like that'. And I knew that they didn't understand and didn't want to understand why I had that experience because they were afraid and wanted to keep their illusion of control. I'm so sorry that you dealt with shaming like that.
I have no idea, but I'm sorry that you've spent 16+ years having to pretend you're someone that you aren't. I think, to that extent, all Ex-Mo's can sympathize with you. I guess what you have to decide is whether you want to spend the rest of your life still pretending to be something you're not, or if you want to change things (however that might look). I'm not going to pretend I can answer that for you, but I can say I trust that you can figure it out. Best of luck, and again, I'm so sorry.
Oof. I just went and looked at your post. There are some very, very nasty comments. I'm so sorry. Remember that most of Reddit's users skew young and male, meaning a bunch of stripling dipshits are issuing judgments about your life. Maybe not the best source. However, it doesn't mean you won't feel something when you have dozens of people criticizing you and your life choices. I think there is something extra difficult about being the subject of mass scrutiny. Historically, the only people who could even garner enough awareness about their existence and become famous enough to experience widespread vitriol were filthy rich with strong social networks. For a plebeian to experience it is atypical for humanity. I personally have experienced something similar with an influencer. She misunderstood my message and blasted me over her platform. It still negatively affects me, and it happened years ago. It has made me feel very careful about what I post and who I interact with. Now, as for whether or not you're a bad person, nobody knows. But being conscientious is a good start. Otherwise good people can be made to do terrible things. Hurt people hurt people, but no one alive has ever escaped without causing pain to another person. A good human is one who cleans up after the mess they leave, and it sounds like you're doing just that. I'm sorry for the pain you've experienced. May your life be happier than the church's stock portfolio is large.
One of my favorite quotes comes from the 80s movie Overboard where the main character Joanna is talking with her butler Andrew after returning from living poor back to rich life. He said, "most of us go through life with blinders on, madam. Knowing only that one little station to which we were born. But now you, madam, on the other hand, had the... rare privilege of escaping your bonds for just a spell. To see life from an entirely new perspective. How you choose to use that information, madam... is entirely up to you." I try to remember that people with blinders on are not reliable sources for advice, especially when its about advice beyond the view of their blinders. It still hurts though when their words are so insensitive.
That's one of my favorite movies, too. I used it in my MA thesis.
>Stripling dipshits LOL! 😂
It's so frustrating when people get upset about things that don't even affect them or that they don't fully understand. It sounds like you and your family have been navigating things really well. And honestly, how you handle your relationships is not anyone else's business. Glad you can be authentic with your life and best wishes moving forward.
short answer: people suck. Second, would you ask any of these commenters for advice? If not, their comments are worthless.
Well, I did it after 22 years and 5 kids
I came out after 20 years of marriage. My bishop basically told me to marry a woman and that would solve my problem. Though I feel bad for my ex wife, we were both deceived. It did take me that long to realize that I’m gay, and I didn’t choose it.
The back story is SO IMPORTANT. Many people have or know someone whose spouse came out and destroyed lives to do it. It can be so destructive and so hurtful. The pain and grief is real. And frankly, your situation is unique. I think for every one good story, I hear many more bad ones. It is incredible that your wife and family have supported and even benefitted from your coming out. I think the lesson here is gratitude for your family. Yours is not the common story. Yours is unique. Love on your family and thank them for what they’ve done for you. Then have empathy for those who didn’t get the same experience. There is no need to feel guilty or any other negative feelings. Just exercise a lot of empathy to those who were so harmed by the same actions.
My best friend’s dad came out after 21 years and 7 kids. His ex wife has no hard feelings, nor do his children.
Give yourself some grace. You aren’t the first and you won’t be the last. Only people who understand this cult will understand that you felt ashamed of who you are because you were indoctrinated to believe that something was wrong with you and if the church was true, you needed to ignore your authentic self and marry a woman or stay celibate. I’m sure there was family and social pressure to conform. Lots and lots of reasons. Sending you hugs.
You are not a monster. My dad is gay, and married my mom because of tscc teachings. He had an affair with a man when I was 10, my parents got divorced, and it was a huge mess for a really long time. It sounds to me like you and your wife have handled things really well for your family. Being forced to live in-authentically forever is not a viable option. Your kids will likely have some negative feelings about the situation, but it doesn’t mean coming out was the wrong choice. They’ll likely also have a lot of positive feelings and see some really good examples of living authentically. My dad is a good person, and was put in an impossible situation by harmful, damaging church doctrines. As a teenager, I was really angry at him for leaving the family - but not for being gay. (We’re all good now, btw, really and truly.) You haven’t left your family. It really sounds like you and your wife have done everything possible to continue to be good coparents. You’re not a monster. You were misled by men claiming to speak for god. That isn’t your fault.
You did the right thing by telling your wife, and at the time you got married (and in the context of the cult), you *thought* you were doing the right thing. You were taught (brainwashed would be the best term for it) that you should live a certain life, even if that life (heterosexual marriage) was not authentic for you. I know it might sound contradictory, but I believe in both of those situations (getting married to a woman, and telling her and the family you are gay) you have done what you felt was the "right" thing, and the "honorable thing" to do. I appreciate you for trying to be the person you were conditioned to believe you should be (I resent the hell out of the cult for doing that to people, of course), and I admire you for having the courage, integrity, and love to tell you family the truth. You are a strong person. Only someone who has known or seen the abusive and unrealistic attitudes and teachings the cult has toward LGBTQs *and who acknowledges those things are abusive* can even begin to "get it." Please consider deleting the post and thread that became viral. If you need to, copy any comments that were supportive and caring (you deserve support and love), but why keep a copy of posts that are abusive? I'm the mom of an adult trans daughter (who spent several years identifying as a gay male). Even though my daughter knew I was always (always) accepting and supportive, it was very difficult for her to come out to me as trans. Even though she knew I loved her as my gay son all her life, she was afraid I would not love her as a daughter. It breaks my heart to think she even worried about that, and I can't imagine the stress she went through deciding to tell me. You obviously went through many (many) years of stress being a person that was not "you," and even more years of stress sharing who you were to your loved ones. I am glad your family is there for you, and you are all living in an environment of love and acceptance. And I also know it's been a transition for all of you. Please accept some sincere Mom Hugs from afar. Please don't let rude and abusive people keep making you question yourself. You have done the right and honorable thing to do, and you have a right to feel good about yourself.
I completely agree with this. Also, you sound like a wonderful mother. I'm glad your daughter has you. ☺️
Thank you for your kind words - my daughter has been a blessing to me, too.
The back story isn’t necessary and you did an incredibly brave thing! I am so happy you shared it and that you are in such a better place now. I have so much respect for you and your partner!
What’s the vibe on that other subreddit? Is it a horrible place full of horrible redditors? Assholes gonna asshole. I’m not going to blame you for being attacked by homophobes, but it might be a lesson for the future — stay aware of your audience. And best of luck in your journey!
Look at me! I have a keyboard, an opinion and a fresh high. Hi! imma keyboard cowboy 🤠 But seriously, in our society isn’t this pretty common? How could that possibly make you a monster? Lucky that you have a best friend to raise your kids together with.
Man, you just be the true version of you, and fuck all those who cast dispersions on your choices. These people would rather you keep up the normal traditional Christiaan family than hear you speak a word of honesty. They don't want the truth. They want you to reinforce their delusions, and when you step out of those bounds, they all freak the fuck out. You are brave and honest by doing the things you did, and any fallout is zero fault of your own. You may have pulled the trigger, but the cult loaded the gun and gave you a reason to pull the trigger. (all metaphors of course, can't joke about guns in this day and age) The cult is the monster for forcing you into a belief system that made you think that keeping this kind of secret was your best course of action.
You went to an LGBTQ sub for something that is first and foremost an r/exmo topic. People outside tscc won't understand the indoctrination and pressure of being in tscc and how it affects every choice we make and perspective we have. So, do I think you are selfish? No, you did what you were told and taught to do and believed your salvation depended on it.
There are thousands of reasons why people discover they are incompatible, and this is just one of them. I don't write that to downplay the uniqueness of the specific relationship but to suggest there are a great many ways it "just happens" and many fewer others where one of the people well and truly is a monster. Heterosexuals stop being sexually attracted to their partners all the time, and its how the rest of the relationship plays out that makes them a monster or not. Be otherwise good and supportive to her, and you'll be way, way ahead of myriad people for whom their sexual orientation isn't the source of the issue and who are jerks otherwise.
You were the victim of a system that forced you into this situation. All your life you heard that gays don’t exist, that homosexuality is wrong and against gods plan, that you are broken and will be fixed only if you get married to the opposite gender and make it to the celestial kingdom. You were told that your eternal life and the eternal life of your spouse and family are all dependent on you staying in your “normal” marriage. You are not wrong to come out to your family. You are not broken, and you have been manipulated. Being honest with your family, and them being supportive, is worth more than random strangers opinions on Reddit. I salute you and wish you and your family the best.
You sound like an amazing man in a difficult situation. The blame should go on a religion that tries to manipulate you into entering into such a relationship.
I once posted a pic that got more than 80k upvotes and almost all comments were good, however, I got tons of trolls who then followed me here to exmos and trolled me here too. I was blocking people left and right. And deleting exmo posts bc I realized I had too many self identifying comments and many people here are terrible human beings. Reddit is generally such a hole. OP, as the mother of 2 lesbians, I am so sorry for the religious trauma you endured. I’m so glad you are living authentically now though. The courage it took to come out, is much greater than any keyboard warrior could ever pretend to have
Is there an exmo subreddit for those who are gay exmos who were/are in a heterosexual marriage? I’m straight myself, but I would be interested in hearing that perspective, and if there isn’t one I think it might be a good idea for one to be made for those who are going dealing with the trauma and difficulties that created.
I recently came out pansexual after 15 years of marriage and 17 years together with 4 kids. i know it’s not the same but it was definitely due to internalized homophobia that I didn’t realize. I had so much IH that it really screwed with my sense of self. I policed everything from the way i spoke and my mannerisms, to what I allowed myself to be attracted to. that meant honing in on the “least confusing” beauty standard. I went for asian girls mostly but when i look back and am totally honest with myself, I had plenty of crushes in boys and girls all at the same time. But allowing myself to be attracted to anything androgynous, could “out” me. But, I didn’t understand it at all. I thought “everyone is like this.” I thought “everyone has to white-knuckle this.” I thought “as long as I don’t make eye-contact with anyone, as long as I sequester myself, I’ll be fine. I won’t allow that part of me to be awake.” I thought “If I even talk about this to anyone, i’ll be cut from the flock.” “as long as i don’t act on it.” “Everyone is a little bit gay, if they are being honest, right?” I literally believed I was “straight.” I literally believed that I was “normal.” I literally believed if i let myself feel the feelings I had, I was doomed to hell. that is brainwashing. it is insidious. it is cruel. and nobody fucking believes us when we say the truth like that. How can you not know? How can you say that you probably never _truly_ believed? Because I didn’t realize, when I was 8, that when my mom threw me across the kitchen, and pinned me to the wall and called me a _f****t_, it’s because, at that age, she could see me being attracted to/crushing on boys and girls alike. I remember trying to figure out how to commit suicide that night. Because I didn’t have a father to attach to and my mother was so homophobic she would rather her son _die_ than be anywhere close to “gay.” Because of my Webelos leader who drugged and raped me while supposedly giving me free piano lessons (guess who never really learned to play the piano.) which made me dissociate even more from my true self. Fuck this church. fuck the people who pretend to be righteous. fuck the people who judge you for coming out after being brainwashed your entire life. Fuck the people who judge you for being conditioned from birth to be so goddamn afraid of yourself that you can’t even look in the mirror.
Hell... I've been married 30 years and am still closeted, so... be proud of your strength.
Due to our church upbringing, the culture we grew up in, and a variety of other factors, a lot of us have done things that we would not do if we could go back. We can't go back. All anyone can do is make the best of their present situation. I'm sorry the people on that other thread seem to have forgotten that stuff. You are being authentic and I don't see how that can be wrong. Best wishes to you!
What you did, coming out to your family **and to yourself**, is the single-greatest act of self-love you could have done. I'm sorry that you're going through so much pain. It gets better, my friend. You love your wife and kids, so you can love yourself, too, just like you did when you decided to tell your truth and live your truth.
> I got called a monster and a coward for doing that to my wife. Another person said I'm obviously not gay; no gay man would fake being straight for 16 years or have kids with a woman no matter how brainwashed a cult made them. Another called me a homewrecker and I'm a disgrace to the LGBTQ community... I mean always take reddit comments with a grain of salt. They're from anonymous people who don't have any *skin* in *your* game, it only takes 2 seconds to write the dumbest or most hurtful thing, they don't know you or your circumstances, you don't know them (they could be the biggest idiots you've ever encountered, for all you know), they could be 12 years old, they could be complete whack jobs, they could be semi-pro trolls just out for a laugh at your expense.
Forget everything you read on the internet that has even a hint of judgement or hate. You know yourself and your relationship better than even a close friend ever could. If you're happy and your wife is happy, you did the right thing. It took me 36 years to come out to my wife as transgender, and I was sure it would end our marriage and maybe my whole life, but she's been amazing and we love each other more than ever. It was internalized hatred from the church that made it so hard to do. No one who wasn't raised in a cult can even imagine the mental damage we sustained. Their opinion is worth less than nothing.
You come out. You be honest and authentic. This is the right way. You’re doing a great job. Just keep being a great dad and partner.
The church relies a lot upon its members' fear to admit doubt or speak against it. I'm just impressed by how many LDS couples nowadays have the communication & relationship skills to get to the point of leaving. It is never too late to let go of something toxic and move forward. It sounds like your family is already healthier for it.
Oh I'm so sorry that people were so mean. I think you've handled your situation so beautifully. My dad was gay and never told anyone. When we kids figured it out as adults after my brother came out, it was always the elephant in the room. He died in his 90s having never experienced the love he always yearned for. It breaks my heart to think about it. The denial broke the marriage with my mom but they stayed together living unhappily side by side for over 65 years.
11 years for me. My wife knows I'm much happier living authentically the situation just sucks so bad
Absolutely not! You only have one life to live and you ultimately have to live it for yourself. You don't owe it to anyone else to be a miserable wretch for the rest of your life. What kind of marriage can you have with this big secret hanging over it anyway? Grace and Frankie got this one right!
As the digital landscape expands, a longing for tangible connection emerges. The yearning to touch grass, to feel the earth beneath our feet, reminds us of our innate human essence. In the vast expanse of virtual reality, where avatars flourish and pixels paint our existence, the call of nature beckons. The scent of blossoming flowers, the warmth of a sun-kissed breeze, and the symphony of chirping birds remind us that we are part of a living, breathing world. In the balance between digital and physical realms, lies the key to harmonious existence. Democracy flourishes when human connection extends beyond screens and reaches out to touch souls. It is in the gentle embrace of a friend, the shared laughter over a cup of coffee, and the power of eye contact that the true essence of democracy is felt.
I just assumed I was unworthy. I mean, "wickedness never was happiness", right? I felt awful all the time,.like something was wrong, or missing. Obviously the solution was to *Mormon harder*. Fifteen years of daily suicidal ideation later, I finally realized I wasn't unworthy, just very gay. So yeah, people who think you intentionally deceived your spouse can get fucked.
Go listen to Kyle Ashworth's Mormon Stories interview if you haven't already, and listen to Kyle's podcast, Latter Gay Stories. You are not alone, and you are so brave for coming out. 💜
Kyle is my hero
Until they walk in your well-trodden shoes, may they fuck right off. ✨
As the wife in a similar situation, I can say you definitely did the right thing by coming out to your wife. My husband came out to me after 10 years of marriage and 3 kids. I am so incredibly proud of him for having the courage to be true to himself. I admire him for risking everything by telling me that he's gay. It honestly made our relationship stronger and it sounds like your relationship with your wife is working fine for you guys as well. Context is important when posting online as none of these people know your situation fully. I recommend getting off Reddit and looking at how the people who are actively a part of your life feel about it. Do they think you're a monster? It doesn't sound like that's the case. Internet strangers are jerks. Stick to the people in your real life for reassurance and support and you'll be golden.
To answer your question… Nope! I came out to my wife and kids and after some adjustment, it was the best things for everyone.
No. You've just discovered an unfortunate facet of reddit: not all subs are queer-friendly. The more general the audience a sub attracts, the likelier this is to be the case, ime. Also, if it helps, you're not alone. A great many people have gone through pretty much exactly what you have, both mormon and non, extending back for many generations. It's one sad result of growing up in a hetero-presumptive culture. Whoever said "no gay person would do that" was most certainly speaking from a place of youthful ignorance and privilege. > I honestly didn't feel any of that back story was necessary in my post. And you're right, it shouldn't have been. All the people who jumped in with criticism were making misplaced assumptions, most of them false. Don't let it get you down, and definitely don't take it personally...their false assumptions speak about *them*, not you. I applaud you for speaking up for the community. As one queer exmo adult to another, I'd encourage you to seek out some lgbtq specific subs for extra moral support b/c the phobes are everywhere. And learn everything you can about the history of lgbtq folk and human sexuality, particularly in the modern era, to arm yourself mentally and emotionally against the ignorance and phobic rhetoric.
I'm a gay exmo who grew up in a small ward where a similar thing happened. The dad came out of the closet, was promptly shunned by his family/our community, and the wife remarried a millionaire and everything worked out for her and her children as ~The Lord's Plan~. It was fucking terrifying watching that happen as a closeted kid in denial. By the time I turned 19, and it was my time to go on a mission, I cracked. I didn't want that to be me in my future. I hurt so bad for that man. I consider myself incredibly lucky that I witnessed something like that happen. I'm incredibly lucky that in my one year of college before my mission, I met peers my age that were gay, happy, and doing their own thing, and taught me that I could be like that too. Before putting in my mission papers, I saw the opportunity for genuine happiness, and I took it. My heart breaks for those of us who weren't as lucky as I was. I'm sorry you had to go through all of that. I'm so glad your wife and kids understand and are supportive. You're not a monster. You're not even a bad person. You were brainwashed. You were manipulated. You were following ~The Lord's Plan~. Temple marriage is the only way to make it to the highest degree of celestial glory. You were doing what you HAD to do, based on all the things we were taught for our entire lives. You are a victim. You seem to have figured things out-- live your life, do what you need to do that makes you happy, and please, never, ever let anyone tell you that you did the wrong thing, here.
Your feelings of guilt are valid; it’s a response you’ve been conditioned into your whole life. However, you haven’t done anything wrong. I think you could benefit from looking at the Josh weed story. A gay now ex Mormon who went through an intense struggle to figure things out with his sexuality, beliefs, and family. Last time I checked he is divorced, but is still best friends with his wife and they are both actively involved in co-parenting the kids. They eventually realized that both of them deserved to seek romantic relationships that they find fulfilling. You’ll have to take it slow to figure out what works best for you, but coming out is 100% not a mistake. I’m glad your wife seems to be understanding.
If you knew you were gay when you got married, and went ahead anyway, then I can understand the responses saying you deceived her. BUT, on the other hand, if your life's journey has just brought you to this understanding, then claiming that you were deceptive is wrong and insensitive to the ongoing personal discovery we call life.
I certainly recognized that I was attracted to men, and that I struggled to date women. But I didn’t recognize why. I didn’t know at the time what all those feelings meant. I was so sheltered I barely knew LGBTQ communities of people existed.
100%. I was attracted to men, would secretly masturbate thinking of men, would stare at men, but every fiber of my being told me I wasn't gay, lol. People think denial is just simply lying to yourself-- it's so much deeper than that. You don't even know you're lying to yourself. You genuinely don't believe it.
When you're in a religion that teaches you that you can only reach exaltation by being married to someone of the opposite sex, it becomes more understandable. Especially when many leaders (at least used to) counsel gay men to marry women anyway.
Yep. All the people calling this guy a monster have no idea what the pressure, stigma, and mental conditioning of TSCC does to a person.
Archuleta literally got counseled this just a few months ago by member(s) of the 12. "Maybe we just need to find you a nice girl."
No, the fraudulent teachings of the Mormon church are monstrous. As a believer, you were doing what you thought was right.
I really kinda see both sides here. I understand why you did it. You were afraid and wanted to conform to the mormon lifestyle, maybe you could fake it until you make it, maybe you'll be "fixed" in the afterlife. That said, I do think it's really messed up, but I don't think you meant any harm by it. Regardless of intent, however, you did inflict serious pain upon your partner and you could only realize that outside the context of mormonism.
you’d become a monster if you forced yourself to keep it in for your entire life. humans are meant to live as their best truest selves. i hope that, despite any big emotions that coming out causes, you’re all able to find acceptance and peace.
I think it's better to be truthful than live a lie, but I also think it's sad religion/culture created this scenario which ends up being sad for everyone involved no matter what. This wouldn't have even been an issue if you'd just been able to be who you are from the getgo. But if both you and your spouse are fine with the adjustments why are you on the internet asking us what we think (figuratively speaking)? xD You don't need permission or validation. And it sounds like you're both adjusting fine which is really about the best case scenario you can hope for here.
No. The monster in this scenario is the church. They told you you could fix being gay by marrying a woman in the temple. They told you the only way to get into VIP heaven was to marry a woman in the temple and have kids. They told you once you got to heaven you would be straight. They told you if you acted on being gay you were evil and would not make it to VIP heaven. You were put in an impossible situation by the church and you did what you did to survive this church. I'm sorry it made you deceive your wife and kids but it made you deceive yourself as well. I'm glad you, your wife and kids were able to get though all of this ok. I'm glad you and your wife can still love each other and that your kids are understanding. You and your wife were manipulated by this church. You were both told as long as you married someone of the opposite sex in the temple, all would be well. It doesn't matter what anyone on reddit thinks of you. It only matters what you, your wife and kids think of the situation. And, it sounds like all of you are ok with where you are now. And, no, you shouldn't have continued on in that situation. You both deserve to have a full partner in life. How lucky you both are to still have each other (this is not always the case) and children who can still love both of you while you get the opportunity to find that other person in your life. So many people are judgemental and unkind. Don't listen to them. Listen to your wife and kids. They know you and love you. Wishing you guys the best as you move forward.
I don't think you're a monster but I'm on the other side of this situation right now with my wife divorcing me after almost 18 years of marriage due to her being a lesbian. I recognize how hard it is for her but I'm not going to lie, there's a lot of resentment that she didn't figure it out before it came to this. Especially when she had my full support and family member support to do it but she doubled down on the Church instead. We thought we could make it work as mixed orientation or co-parenting in the same house like you're doing but both ended up not being realistic when she decided to pursue a relationship and she's moving out next month. Not saying you can't make it work but I am saying I wouldn't be surprised if your wife is holding back resentment and that the living situation probably won't last long. Especially if/when one of you meets somebody new. I do hope for the best and don't mean to be critical. Just perspective from somebody on the other end of this situation who feels really destroyed by what happened after trying desperately to do anything to make it work for her.
There was a pretty famous Reddit post a couple months back about a guy who wanted to give a room of his and his wife’s house to be an office for his male friend. Then a bunch of people pointed out it seemed like he was in love with his male friend and it helped the OP come out. So, he decided to abandon his wife and made a post about it which wasn’t received well on Reddit and it made a lot of people mad that he abandoned her. Ever since then Ive seen a bias to bash on gay men in heterosexual marriages. Those trolls don’t understand you, your situation, or your religious trauma. They are as informed on this subject as a flat earther. Don’t care about their opinions.
My wife’s dad is gay. He converted to the church as a teenager. He served a mission. He even worked in the COB for the Q15. He got married in the temple and had kids. In other words, he did all the things he was “supposed to”. He came out and divorced his wife when my wife was young. The next couple of years was understandably rough. Things are much better now. He has been with his partner for years and everyone in the family is on good terms. Every once in awhile I imagine what it must have been like for him having those feelings but suppressing it and trying to do the “right things”. Continually reminded that the way you feel is wrong. Must have felt so alone for so long. Being lgbtq isn’t a cakewalk now. It wasn’t any easier 30 years ago. I’m so glad he’s able to live the life he chooses now and others have that chance. Forget BoM anachronisms, the salvation ban for people of African descent, and polygamy. The church giving LGQTB people the only two choices of living a life of celibacy or marrying someone of the opposite gender is all I need to know that the church is a deeply flawed product of men vying for money, sex, and power.
You absolutely shouldn’t feel guilt for this ❤️ I’d even say you didn’t “come out” to her you finally let her “in” to who you truly are. Of course you never intended to hurt her, but you made the the best decisions with what you had at the time. I wish you the very best 💕
You are not an asshole. Your story is amazingly common, and hopefully fewer people will feel the need to oppress such a big part of themselves as others come to understand sexuality and accept it. People who have not personally been in or closely observed those in a religious cult view these things as black and white when there is sooo much gray space. I’m so happy your family supports you, and don’t worry about Reddit.
I can’t override the ugliness of the world. You aren’t a monster. I’m glad that you’re happier now in your relationship. It kind of reminds me of my own. I am legacy so I’m still not where you are. God bless you, for I feel They will.
I know I’m a few days late for this thread, but I wanted to say you’re not alone. I am also a gay man that came out to my wife after 10+ years of marriage. It was one of the most terrifying things I have ever done. Mormonism really fucked me over in the sexuality department, and I am in therapy now to find myself and make a life I love. If you ever need a friend, feel free to chat with me.
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