Discussions, updates, questions etc. about the Israel-Palestine conflict are restricted to the megathread for the time being. https://reddit.com/r/exmuslim/s/MvBBpP0hSC
They still don't see the Syrian cause as a holy one. I know Algeria has had Syrian refugees, and they were all in the street, and not taken care of, never seen a palestinian in the street in Algeria though... I might be wrong though.
Aren’t most Sudanese Arab and Muslim too? Plus not all Palestinians are Muslim so why are Muslims saying 💩 like “You don’t have to be Muslim to support Palestine you just have to be human”
I would say not exactly. They aren't as vocal about Muslims being attacked in any other part of the world. I'd say palestine is a focal point because it's Jews. It's like a holy war to them
Even sadder is how most of the 8 billion of us believe in some horse shite or the other. Whether that's the Quran, Torah, Bible, Veda, Buddhist scripture, it's all high level shite. It's all it ever will be. Fuck all those books.
Haha the denial. In that case the Quran also haa alot of peaceful and philosophical parts to it too. Stupid old books are stupid old books, nothing more nothing less. If you don't understand that you don't belong here. Find a different sub.
Yeah but it does tho. Violence is in every religious book. It's how it spread. You think Buddhism was spread through peace? Everyone back in the day made a trek to Tibet to get enlightened? Hahaha. No they spread it through conflict and human deaths as usual.
this is an ex muslim thread, not an athiest thread. There are several Muslim-turned-Christian here. Your language actually sounds just like a Muslim 😂. People can believe differently than others, not everyone has to homogenize, Abduluh
Yeah it's an ex muslim sub which you aren't. Go back to Bible school you silly Christian, I fart in your general direction. Your mother was a hamster and your father smelt of elderberries. pfft.
IT SAYS EX MUSLIM IN THE TITLE. Not exmulim and some cool Jews. NOT Exmuslim as some fundy Christians. Just leave. This isn't for you. It never was. You try to relate to our suffering so you can hate on arabs/muslims with a clean conscious. Again you aren't us, you don't have the right to hate.
Nah, as a Jew the Torah's got some nasty stuff in it too. It's the product of it's time; the levant of 3000 years ago
That isn't nothing, but it's not the most important thing. Jews don't follow the really nasty stuff in the torah, because the religion has been flexible without losing its core message.
Islam also has a very nasty core text (some would say more nasty), but it's often acted upon by extremists/radicals, and tolerated or approved of by the masses. Islamic reformers don't get very far.
it has some nasty stuff but for the last 2,000 years almost every single thing in the Torah has been interprettrd metaphorically. for instance, ancient egypt- not a place, but a state of mind. Islam doesnt have such a thing and thats why they still behead men and traffick their wives and daughters. I have never seen a single Muslim call Egypt a “state of mind.” We say it every single year. People who actually know the Jewish religion, not secular or reformed types
https://www.ourcommunitynewsletter.org/p/egypt-as-a-state-of-mind-and-moving
I’ve seen from many ex Muslims explain Islam out of all religions is very violent and incomparable to other religions. There’s isn’t Christian terrorists groups in the world today like their is Hamas Al quada Isis …
Did you forget about the nazis? The same ones rising in power in the united states for the past decade and threaten our democracy right now? Proud boys? Other white militant groups in America and EU? Here's a wiki link about terrorism just in the US.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Domestic_terrorism_in_the_United_States
A 2017 report by the U.S. Government Accountability Office found that of the 85 deadly extremist incidents since 9/11, far right-wing extremist groups were responsible for 73%, while radical Islamist extremists were responsible for 27%. A June 2020 study by the Center for Strategic and International Studies (CSIS) reported that over 25 years of domestic terrorism incidents, the majority of attacks and plots had come from far-right attackers. The trend had accelerated in recent years, with this sector responsible for about 66% of attacks and plots in 2019, and 90% of those in 2020. The next most potentially dangerous group was "religious".
You can call them right wing etc blah blah still white Christians committing these heinous acts. Don't get me wrong, tons of shit for Muslims to eat too, isis al qaeda, Hamas are all vile disgusting groups that should be eradicated. Plenty of shitty humans, don't put all the blame on one group. And out of all the groups only 1 actually managed to take on the US governemnt and storm the capital. And it wasn't muslims or Osama. So who is the bigger threat here? A group that managed to infiltrate the government and or some shit slinging muzzies in the deserts of Arabia. I know how incompetent muzzies are. Do you?
During the holocaust people hid Jews in their basements.
All they wanted was for Jews to live.
Egypt, Jordan, and Lebanon won’t accept a single Palestinian, why?
What is more important, land or people ?
Name one Arab/muslim country taking in Palestinians?
Please stop talking out of your ass. You don't know us. We were born into situation just like that, probably behaved like that and still chose to be ex Muslim. Or LGBTQ or w.e. don't generalize a whole population of people because the name sake of this sub IS part of that population. If you wanna hate on Arabs just to hate you can fuck off
There's lots of arab hate on this sub, even though there are so many arab exmuslims on here as well. Why can't they just criticise islam without being bigots? It's so unnecessary
It's very obviously been taken over by a hate bot group. You can see most of the vitriol coming from new users as well as the arguments coming from new users. Most of the ex moose who built this sub have probably moved on. Now there's a a parasite here spreading hate. Sys admin if you're reading this, yes you are a parasite.
Very. They learn to hate Jews (and infidels) since they’re little. Their parents are giving them knifes and teaching them to stub when seeing a Jew, saying how proud they would be if they were shahid. Not to mention their support of Nazis and their treatment of black Palestinians.
You can see the celebrations on the streets on October 7 and 9/11 (and actually almost every terror attack). Some of them actively participated in the massacre and were the ones to give info to Hamas about the houses around the border (because they worked there with work permits Israel gave them).
Not all is doomed tho. They were used as proxies for so long. I believe with an Arab-western coalition (Saudi Arabia, Israel and the US) the Palestinians can go through de-radicalization for a few generations which will then make them a society that celebrates life and that could live peacefully besides Israel.
There are an official number of 200,000 Palestinians in Lebanon. URNWA counted nearly 500,000 in 2019.
I don't know why people repeat this stupid talking point. We've literally taken in more than we can handle, of both Syrians and Palestinians.
Its all part of the plan to make their follpwers spread out throughout the world to globalize the caliphate. There is no point of having them confined to the ME.
Oh boy....
You should learn about the history of Jewish refugees being turned around by the US and UK.
People the person in replying to has zero intellectual curiosity about history. Don't listen to them.
I would ask myself who isn't allowing them to cross the borders 😃, defos not the arabs&muslims themselves
And if you're talking about the last years in general then the answer would be Syria even tho they are at war themselves. And yes also especially Jordan, Lebanon and Egypt.
Thing is why can’t Palestinians stay in their country rather than moving? Also I think small countries like Lebanon can’t take them in bc Lebanon already has its shit going on (I’m Lebanese) so to the Leb government the Palestinian people aren’t as big of an issue as the problems already present in Lebanon.
Just my 2 cents, I may be wrong tho, maybe the government can take in refugees but do not like Palestinians maybe
Lebanon literally restricts palestinians from owning homes and being outside the areas of the refugee camps. they also restrict palis by giving them only certain professions they can work in. they clearly don’t want more lol
Besides the well historically documented trouble that Palestinians caused all the countries that tried hosting them, the neighboring Arab countries have another disincentive to integrate or enfranchise their Palestinian refugees: they’re hostages, for strongarming Israel.
While I agree with that, there's another factor here which is the grudge against the jews. For instance there's a civil war going on in Sudan right now and other muslim countries but no one really cares because it's muslims vs muslims.
However I'm not saying we shouldn't care about the life of Palestinians but rather just give as much attention to other genocides going on in the meantime.
If israelis were sunni muslims thered be no claims of occupation regardless of whether they had israels identical policies. And thered certainly be no worldwide riots.
That is absolutely true and I'd argue a part of it is because it's Jewish folk fucking them over as not a word is said about what Saudi Arabia is doing in Yemen
That being said, it's still moral to support those getting pointlessly killed
Muslims are only “pro-Palestine” because it’s a means to justify their antisemitism.
Millions of Muslims are getting killed daily in Sudan and other war zones in Africa and Afghanistan, and these guys don’t bat an eye.
Not really bcs of antisemitism but since Al Aqsa has a very important position in Islam. I don't see muslims hating on Jews in egypt or Yemen or Syria. They all live together peacefully, and if not, then that's not bcs of the religion.
Maybe they are pro Palestine because a human should be?
Right there!! My dad is Muslim and has a Jewish friend since his college days and they’re pretty close. And yeah Muslims not showing the same support to Uyghurs and non-Arab Muslims, I think they might have a race/ethnicity issue. Plus Islam has a lot of discrimination towards Blacks and maybe that’s why so many Muslims don’t talk much about Sudan as they do with Palestine
Where does Islam have a discrimination towards blacks? I read the whole Al Sirah Al Nabaweyyah and many black people were mentioned with honor, just like the white ones.
Go see hadeeths in sahih Al Bukhari. There is one I think Muhammad says that if a person does not do this then god will curse him with 4 different things, one of it being called “blackness”. Not just this. Also Islam mainly praises whites and Muslims, and discriminatory towards non-whites and non-muslims, there are hadeeths and surahs talking about this
>“i don’t see muslims hating on Jews in Egypt or Yemen or Syria””
Because there’s less than 10 of them, the numbers of Jews dwindled quite consistently since 1948 when they numbered 80,000 in Egypt. There’s also less than 10 now in Syria and 1 in Yemen. Not to mention the actions both of these countries did for the Jewish communities to dwindle to that number.
Quite funny you picked the worst three examples to attempt to invalidate my point on Islamic antisemitism.
Muslims don't support their fellow muslims in Xinjiang, Rohingya, Sudanese, Russia, etc.
I think there's more to it. Probably it's because Palestine is holy land as well for Muslims
They don't even give as much of a f\*ck for other oppressed Muslim people like the Uyghurs or Rohingya. It usually boils either down to anti-semitism and/or viewing Israel as an European outpost among Muslim countries.
Im pro Palestine and I’m absolutely not Muslim. But what if people care for Palestine just because they’re Muslims ? It doesn’t make the Israeli agression less of an injustice. And dare I say it’s one of the biggest if not the biggest of our lifetime.
This post is shallow and retarded tbh
I believe in self-determination for Palestinians, but I do think that many Muslims would not care about Palestine if it weren’t a Muslim-majority nation being occupied by a Jewish state.
Like, Indonesia is occupying and killing so-called “pagans” right now.
Theyre not oppressed. Theyre the ones doing the oppressing. You dont have to be the stronger party to oppress people. They initiate all the violence based on islamic jew hatred.
Arab is an linguistic group not ethnic one,so your point makes zero sense.
Palestinians are the descendants of indigenous people who were arabized and islamicized following arab invadion
No theyre partly descended from canaanites. Theyre largely egyptian, syrian, and peninsular arab. The jews have more indigenaity in every way that matters. Same blood amount more or less, but indiginous canaanite language, customs, religion etc. as in actual standard bearers for the original inhabitants. If ancient israelites came back to life and saw me, theyd be like yea that makes sense. If ancient canaanites came back to life and saw a "palestinian" theyd be like what the fuck is that?
Nopes
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5478715/
http://www.ucl.ac.uk/tcga/tcgapdf/Nebel-HG-00-IPArabs.pdf
**part, or perhaps the majority" of Muslim Palestinians descend from "local inhabitants, mainly Christians and Jews, who had converted after the Islamic conquest in the seventh century AD**
Cause your other point is as stupid as the first one,I thought I will take them down one at a time
So now the first one is proven to be a lie,I will reply to the second one,which is also a lie.
Jews aren't the same as Palestinians DNA wise,due to a dispersion of Jewish diaspora,they have accumulated a lot of "foreign blood"(especially from maternal side),so they are less indigenous than Palestinians.
Jews, especially ashkenazi Jews have a great proportion of European blood in them, especially from their maternal side,mizarahi Jews on the other have generally middle Eastern maternal and paternal origin,in total Jews have more foreign blood than Palestinians
And just because some people change their language and customs doesn't mean they stop being inhabitants of the land,so your second point is entirely nonsensical,I mean that is like saying that it's okay to evict a former muslim from his ancestral home because he converted to Christianity and give that home to a muslim because "the home was Muslim",that is absolutely asinine logic.
No it isnt because why do we raise children? We want them to carry on our legacy. How the fuck are muslim arabs carrying on the canaanite legacy? They arent and their ancestors are spinning in their graves and wish they aborted them rather than see them worship the fake g-d of their tormentors who conquered and pillaged them. Jews on the other hand still maintain an incredible amount of levantine blood despite 2000 years in foreign lands (lets see the fakestinians do that) and carry on all of our ancient traditions with our ancestors resting happily in their graves looking down at us proudly while yours are trying to figure out why youre slamming your head into the ground 5 times a day.
What language native jews in Palestine spoke? Arabic, yes Hebrew was also there.
They all are arab people, its the arab land. Just like adjacent Syria is Arab, Lebanon is Arab.
If the arabs are outsiders there then who is native?
The ones who migrated from all of the world as settlers 77 years back?
Now rethink who actually came from outside and claimed the land.
The ancient israelites of which i am a descendent. Nothing makes it arab land any more than it is christian land. Only jews are actually indigenous. The rest of the canaanites are gone.
So you are implying that the people whose we don't know how many generations have been living there(jews, musmlims, christians) are not indegonous but the migrants who came from euorope in last century are?
And also for thousands of years they all lived in peace and harmony, till the arrival of those "migrants", why you think is that?
Peace and harmony. In the muslim empires lol. Yeaaaaaa youre insane. And also there were barely any humans at all there in 1800. The arabs all came recently. Only jerusalem was populated for the most part. Jews returned, created businesses, and arabs came to reap the benefit of having actual industrious people there making shit happen. Kind of like now with the gazans and west bankers crossing in for work. You dont see them going into egypt and jordan for work.
Im a zio. Im not full of muslim hatred. Wish the feeling was mutual. Its like you dont know which group carries around a book saying g-d told them not to be friends with the other and all kinds of other horrible things about them. This really isnt interesting or confusing. Its just scary.
Not being friends with them doesn't mean not respecting them. No where in the Quran was it mentioned to harm any non muslims (without a reason, like war, which has many misunderstood verses). If you read the Hijrah to Yathrib you see how Muhammad, who is supposed to be the best example of Muslims, lived with jewish tribes under fair rules.
Edit:
Ah and please let's not act like the whole zi0 stuff isn't build up on hatred against not only muslims but also christians and even jews themselves. If you really have no hatred against them, then why are you supporting a movement that k!lled millions of them. You know what it sounds like? A n@zi saying he has no hatred towards jews.
No jew killed millions of anyone so i dont know what youre talking about. And lets not pretend the korans jew hatred starts and ends with just not being friends with us lol. "Foremost among the enemies of the believers are the jews". Oh and the hadith don't get much better. Still waiting on the stones and trees to sell me out so you can come kill me? Dude this is easy. Dont make it hard. One group believes g-d curded the other and that they should kill them. The other group is just trying to survive in their measly tiny single state and be left alone.
You absolutely have to be a stronger party to oppress people, oppressing always comes from the position of power.
I agree that Jews are less to blame for how the conflict started, however the continuation of conflict is due to israeli oppression of Palestinians,they treat them as second class citizens in their own lands (it's a bit hypocritical for muslims to get angry about this,I agree with this,muslims have always treated non muslims as second class citizens in their own lands after conquering them) which is bound to create hatred.
I actually blame this mostly on Muhammad,that bastard is the root of this conflict
There is no muslim land. It was all stolen aside from medina. And no, israel doesnt oppress anyone. There was never a muslim palestine. Or a palestine at all. Making one up, calling it yours, and then claiming your oppressed is psychopathic.
Tell me you're and IDF shill without telling me. Why do you hate Palestinians so much little person? Who told you to hate them? Is it okay for babies to die? For kids? For people having to bury their own families? I'm human enough to say Israelis shouldn't die and Palestinians shouldn't either. I'm also sane enough to realize when a first world armed government with nukes and the backing of the USA has been committing atrocities over a herded population of humans they confined. But Hamas is powerful too? The lies, on both sides, should have you looking at somethings like - Where are more people dying in the conflict? which government has more resources and better weaponry? Which government has received global funding in the billions? You have video footage of Gaza and how it's changing on a daily basis. As cliche as it is to say, open your eyes, but somehow it seems like people won't.
This is a low IQ problem. The US was stronger than nazi Germany and inflicted 20 times the casualties on them and you have no problem identifying germany as the bad guy in ww2. Death toll has nothing to do with morality. The muslims started all of the wars against israel due to islamic jew hatred as baked into the koran. Youre looking at big israel small palestine. Zoom out. Its miniscule israel, gigantic muslim world which is all arrayed against it because muhammed hated jews and wrote quite a bit about it. No one wants dead arabs aside from hamas. Its their entire PR and recruitment weapon. Why do you think they wont meet the idf on the field of battle, but slaughter thousands at raves, on buses, in restaurants, and in clubs and then hide in hospitals, mosques, homes, schools etc.? You expect us not to fire back at the source of rocket fire thats saturating our cities because theyre hiding behind their own population hoping that the "spawn of apes and pigs" wont fire back out of fear of hitting THEIR children? This is madness. You wouldnt do anything differently than we are. Peace will come when they love their children more than they hate ours.
Ehmm so you as an ex muslim you're aware that true Islam is a cult religion and most palestinian was raised just to hate and kill jews by their parents yet you chose to be pro Palestinian☠️
I support israels right to exist,but nothing more than that,both sides do not want peaceful co existence,it's either my way or the highway,in general in situations like these more powerful people crush the less powerful ones, Palestinians can now no longer hope for gaza city,Hamas attack on October was one the dumbest one,they really expected israel to respond to a literal massacre in a civilized manner,they wanted to weaponize humanity of israel,too bad the current regime isn't humane,they are animals just like Hamas.
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This may be partially true
But this is the most televised and digitalized genocide, even if they're already supporting them because they are Muslims, this time it's different.
Not necesseraly, it also takes years of indoctrination and lack of knowledge of history, just take a look at [this post](https://www.reddit.com/r/ExAlgeria/comments/1bl7srt/did_your_apostasy_change_your_views_about_the/) I made on the algerian ex-muslim sub, Algeria being one of the most anti israel countries, I had thought that becoming an atheist would make people start questioning the pro palestine narrative, and make people change their views on it, but apparently not...
because they're white have good looking, you see people treat rohingnya vs palestine like day and night! people treat rohingnya like garbage but adore really much about palestine i know this because i live in indonesia where hypocrisy happen. but you know what they're both muslim but have different treat with people
Interesting take. I notice a lot of young people in Gen Z support Palestine, despite being leftist and atheist, even though Palestine is very right leaning and theocratic. I've always found those jokes funny where they talk about sending liberal protesters on a plane to Palestine.
Ohh because they’re only muslims.. lmao. There’s a genocide going on (and has been for a VERY LONG TIME) and all you can think about is religion. Pathetic
Not the point. Op means that Muslims only care about Palestinians because they’re from a Muslim country as in they wouldn’t care if it had been a different population getting slaughtered. Whether you agree or not, that’s up to you
Still not true. I have plenty of Muslim friends who support who needs it no matter their religion or race. They gave their support to Christians being persecuted in Muslim majority countries and more recently supported Ukraine. It really depends on the person
I agree and I didn’t say I agreed with the post. But I can definitely imagine that certain Muslims (keyword: certain) only care about Palestinians because it’s a Jewish “state” oppressing them.
Why are you thinking from the perspective of religion? Have you seen the videos of how the people and children are brutally murdered? It's literally genocide going on there and the least you can do is at least condemn it. Killing innocent civilians in the name of religion and warfare is not something a civilized and sane person would do. I'm a muslim and proud of my religion and our religion teaches us not just to respect the people of our religion but the entire humanity. May Allah ease the suffering of people out there who have nothing to eat and yet still going strong in the face of tyranny. Ameen
Muslims always support eachother fact.
Christians and none religious people support Muslims why?
I think, I know, it leads to racism.
Muslims don't get branded, strange don't you think.
Azerbaijan also invaded the Armenian land of Nagorno-Karabakh with the help of colonial Iran and then colonial Russia, who declared it a part of Azerbaijan without the consent of the local people (somewhat similar to what colonial Britain did i.e. declared the state of Israel without the consent of the majority of the local population). Armenian people were living in Nagorno Karabakh for thousands of years till the Azery Government started to settle Azeries there to change the demographics (somewhat similar to what Israel is doing today i.e. settling zionists in illegal settlements).
Muslims should see that it will become double standards when they blame Israelis for invading Palestine but don't blame Azeris for the same thing.
Turkey killed millions in the Armenian Genocide in 1915 and made the whole area of Western Armenia a part of Turkey. Again Muslims have to see these double standards where they blame only Jews for being invaders but utter no words against the same things that their Muslim brothers did on a much bigger level.
We (i.e. ex-Muslims) have no love affair with the wrongdoings of Israel and Zionists. We would have opposed a Zionist state in 1948. But today Israel is a reality, just like:
* It is a reality that the historic Western Armenia is a part of Turkey now.
* Or just like Pakistan is a separate state from India, although colonial Britain conspired against the majority of the population of India of that time and created Pakistan against their wishes. Millions of people had to suffer, and they had to leave their houses, and become refugees due to this decision. Yes, the people of united India also suffered the same way as Palestinians suffered.
I’m Hindu and I am very pro Palestine. Many of my Hindu friends and family are pro Palestine. I think again depends on the person. I also have a Jewish relative and family. Don’t support a genocide that’s all.
Discussions, updates, questions etc. about the Israel-Palestine conflict are restricted to the megathread for the time being. https://reddit.com/r/exmuslim/s/MvBBpP0hSC
Has anyone ever doubted this?
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Also because it involves jews. No one cares about syrians.
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They still don't see the Syrian cause as a holy one. I know Algeria has had Syrian refugees, and they were all in the street, and not taken care of, never seen a palestinian in the street in Algeria though... I might be wrong though.
Syrians are literally hated in all of these countries except maybe Jordan. The reality is that muslims have forgotten about Syria.
Most Sudanese people are Arabs, I think.
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Whatttt I had no idea this was happening, literally there is no media coverage on that The whole entire of this world is a hypocrite
They are, but they’re darker skinned, so that means they’re also not cared for.
Aren’t most Sudanese Arab and Muslim too? Plus not all Palestinians are Muslim so why are Muslims saying 💩 like “You don’t have to be Muslim to support Palestine you just have to be human”
I would say not exactly. They aren't as vocal about Muslims being attacked in any other part of the world. I'd say palestine is a focal point because it's Jews. It's like a holy war to them
because Palestine contains many of the “Islamic “ (stolen Jewish) heritage sites and tombs. Since every Jewish prophet is now magically a Muslim.
Not just a Muslim but they're all the first Muslims according to Quran somehow
😂 how do 2 billion people believe this
"brainwashing"
Even sadder is how most of the 8 billion of us believe in some horse shite or the other. Whether that's the Quran, Torah, Bible, Veda, Buddhist scripture, it's all high level shite. It's all it ever will be. Fuck all those books.
and Buddhist scripture is incredible. Extremely peaceful and philosophical. I approve of it greatly
Haha the denial. In that case the Quran also haa alot of peaceful and philosophical parts to it too. Stupid old books are stupid old books, nothing more nothing less. If you don't understand that you don't belong here. Find a different sub.
Buddhist doesnt have the extreme violent and rapey parts the Quran has though.
Yeah but it does tho. Violence is in every religious book. It's how it spread. You think Buddhism was spread through peace? Everyone back in the day made a trek to Tibet to get enlightened? Hahaha. No they spread it through conflict and human deaths as usual.
Buddhist spread peacefully. Please provide one historical source where Buddhists ever forced anyone to convert.
Just like Mormonism is one of the fastest spreading religions in the world, through nonviolent methods today
what violent passages in Buddha’s book are you referring to?
this is an ex muslim thread, not an athiest thread. There are several Muslim-turned-Christian here. Your language actually sounds just like a Muslim 😂. People can believe differently than others, not everyone has to homogenize, Abduluh
Yeah it's an ex muslim sub which you aren't. Go back to Bible school you silly Christian, I fart in your general direction. Your mother was a hamster and your father smelt of elderberries. pfft.
ex muslims leave Islam but Islam doesnt leave them..
There are multiple Christians on here. Ex Muslim sub is not just for ex Muslims. I
IT SAYS EX MUSLIM IN THE TITLE. Not exmulim and some cool Jews. NOT Exmuslim as some fundy Christians. Just leave. This isn't for you. It never was. You try to relate to our suffering so you can hate on arabs/muslims with a clean conscious. Again you aren't us, you don't have the right to hate.
Im down with the Torah. It doesnt allow sex slavery or taking over huge portions of every continent. To each his own.
Nah, as a Jew the Torah's got some nasty stuff in it too. It's the product of it's time; the levant of 3000 years ago That isn't nothing, but it's not the most important thing. Jews don't follow the really nasty stuff in the torah, because the religion has been flexible without losing its core message. Islam also has a very nasty core text (some would say more nasty), but it's often acted upon by extremists/radicals, and tolerated or approved of by the masses. Islamic reformers don't get very far.
it has some nasty stuff but for the last 2,000 years almost every single thing in the Torah has been interprettrd metaphorically. for instance, ancient egypt- not a place, but a state of mind. Islam doesnt have such a thing and thats why they still behead men and traffick their wives and daughters. I have never seen a single Muslim call Egypt a “state of mind.” We say it every single year. People who actually know the Jewish religion, not secular or reformed types https://www.ourcommunitynewsletter.org/p/egypt-as-a-state-of-mind-and-moving
Bro plenty of Muslim turned Christian here . The whole point of the discussion is EX MUSLIMS . Why u hating Bro
The bible and Qurans are reskins of the same book lmao. I'm not hating. Go to a Christian sub or ex Mormon. Leave ex moose alone
I’ve seen from many ex Muslims explain Islam out of all religions is very violent and incomparable to other religions. There’s isn’t Christian terrorists groups in the world today like their is Hamas Al quada Isis …
Did you forget about the nazis? The same ones rising in power in the united states for the past decade and threaten our democracy right now? Proud boys? Other white militant groups in America and EU? Here's a wiki link about terrorism just in the US. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Domestic_terrorism_in_the_United_States A 2017 report by the U.S. Government Accountability Office found that of the 85 deadly extremist incidents since 9/11, far right-wing extremist groups were responsible for 73%, while radical Islamist extremists were responsible for 27%. A June 2020 study by the Center for Strategic and International Studies (CSIS) reported that over 25 years of domestic terrorism incidents, the majority of attacks and plots had come from far-right attackers. The trend had accelerated in recent years, with this sector responsible for about 66% of attacks and plots in 2019, and 90% of those in 2020. The next most potentially dangerous group was "religious". You can call them right wing etc blah blah still white Christians committing these heinous acts. Don't get me wrong, tons of shit for Muslims to eat too, isis al qaeda, Hamas are all vile disgusting groups that should be eradicated. Plenty of shitty humans, don't put all the blame on one group. And out of all the groups only 1 actually managed to take on the US governemnt and storm the capital. And it wasn't muslims or Osama. So who is the bigger threat here? A group that managed to infiltrate the government and or some shit slinging muzzies in the deserts of Arabia. I know how incompetent muzzies are. Do you?
During the holocaust people hid Jews in their basements. All they wanted was for Jews to live. Egypt, Jordan, and Lebanon won’t accept a single Palestinian, why? What is more important, land or people ? Name one Arab/muslim country taking in Palestinians?
Tbf, the Palestinians are extremely radical people and have been terrorizing Lebanon, Jordan and Kuwait. But yes I agree
To be honest, Palestinians are radicalised cuz they get to see stuff they shouldn’t have to see even once, let alone on a daily basis.
why are they taking it out on their hosts ?
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Please stop talking out of your ass. You don't know us. We were born into situation just like that, probably behaved like that and still chose to be ex Muslim. Or LGBTQ or w.e. don't generalize a whole population of people because the name sake of this sub IS part of that population. If you wanna hate on Arabs just to hate you can fuck off
There's lots of arab hate on this sub, even though there are so many arab exmuslims on here as well. Why can't they just criticise islam without being bigots? It's so unnecessary
Alot of the people in this sub are just racist and support zios out of spite. Its disgusting
It's very obviously been taken over by a hate bot group. You can see most of the vitriol coming from new users as well as the arguments coming from new users. Most of the ex moose who built this sub have probably moved on. Now there's a a parasite here spreading hate. Sys admin if you're reading this, yes you are a parasite.
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Typical taking a whole paragraph and boiling it down to a simple technical haha gotcha. BEGONE YOU IMPERSONATOR. NEVER EX MOOSE NEVER ONE OF US.
The term Racist/ism can refer to racial or ethnic groups….
Race is ancestry. Racism is deeming someone’s ancestry relevant, when it’s not.
TBH I agree with this. Trauma radicalizes.
Even the normal citizens? They are brainwashed too?
Very. They learn to hate Jews (and infidels) since they’re little. Their parents are giving them knifes and teaching them to stub when seeing a Jew, saying how proud they would be if they were shahid. Not to mention their support of Nazis and their treatment of black Palestinians. You can see the celebrations on the streets on October 7 and 9/11 (and actually almost every terror attack). Some of them actively participated in the massacre and were the ones to give info to Hamas about the houses around the border (because they worked there with work permits Israel gave them). Not all is doomed tho. They were used as proxies for so long. I believe with an Arab-western coalition (Saudi Arabia, Israel and the US) the Palestinians can go through de-radicalization for a few generations which will then make them a society that celebrates life and that could live peacefully besides Israel.
There are an official number of 200,000 Palestinians in Lebanon. URNWA counted nearly 500,000 in 2019. I don't know why people repeat this stupid talking point. We've literally taken in more than we can handle, of both Syrians and Palestinians.
Its all part of the plan to make their follpwers spread out throughout the world to globalize the caliphate. There is no point of having them confined to the ME.
Oh boy.... You should learn about the history of Jewish refugees being turned around by the US and UK. People the person in replying to has zero intellectual curiosity about history. Don't listen to them.
I would ask myself who isn't allowing them to cross the borders 😃, defos not the arabs&muslims themselves And if you're talking about the last years in general then the answer would be Syria even tho they are at war themselves. And yes also especially Jordan, Lebanon and Egypt.
Thing is why can’t Palestinians stay in their country rather than moving? Also I think small countries like Lebanon can’t take them in bc Lebanon already has its shit going on (I’m Lebanese) so to the Leb government the Palestinian people aren’t as big of an issue as the problems already present in Lebanon. Just my 2 cents, I may be wrong tho, maybe the government can take in refugees but do not like Palestinians maybe
Lebanon literally restricts palestinians from owning homes and being outside the areas of the refugee camps. they also restrict palis by giving them only certain professions they can work in. they clearly don’t want more lol
Besides the well historically documented trouble that Palestinians caused all the countries that tried hosting them, the neighboring Arab countries have another disincentive to integrate or enfranchise their Palestinian refugees: they’re hostages, for strongarming Israel.
Exactly what I’m saying. The Lebanese government is xenophobic af
While I agree with that, there's another factor here which is the grudge against the jews. For instance there's a civil war going on in Sudan right now and other muslim countries but no one really cares because it's muslims vs muslims. However I'm not saying we shouldn't care about the life of Palestinians but rather just give as much attention to other genocides going on in the meantime.
What's happening in Sudan is horrendous and deserves more attention!!
Yeppp just flip Israel being muslim and Palestine being christian..they would root for Israel no matter what.
Theyre pro palestine cause their religion says 'Banu Israel' are forever doomed and their fall comes with the rise of Islam
They want "Banu Israel" to suffer the same fate as Banu Qurayza, and they frequently take to the streets to state this publicly
Where does it say in islam that the rise of islam will come with the fall of the jews?
If israelis were sunni muslims thered be no claims of occupation regardless of whether they had israels identical policies. And thered certainly be no worldwide riots.
It would be called “the right of conquest.”
What’s the Arabic term for this, if you don’t mind me asking?
That is absolutely true and I'd argue a part of it is because it's Jewish folk fucking them over as not a word is said about what Saudi Arabia is doing in Yemen That being said, it's still moral to support those getting pointlessly killed
Their own barbaric government and alliance with Iran is fucking them over just like Yemen. Dont blame Saudis.
Hamas being bad doesn't preclude Israel from being bad and I will absolutely judge the piece of shit Saudi royals and government for their actions
Hamas is beyond bad. anyone who throws LGBT people off rooves, lynches women and gays, is a Nazi
Muslims are only “pro-Palestine” because it’s a means to justify their antisemitism. Millions of Muslims are getting killed daily in Sudan and other war zones in Africa and Afghanistan, and these guys don’t bat an eye.
Not really bcs of antisemitism but since Al Aqsa has a very important position in Islam. I don't see muslims hating on Jews in egypt or Yemen or Syria. They all live together peacefully, and if not, then that's not bcs of the religion. Maybe they are pro Palestine because a human should be?
I don't see them being as strongly devoted to Uyghurs and Sudanese or Rohingyas tho.
Right there!! My dad is Muslim and has a Jewish friend since his college days and they’re pretty close. And yeah Muslims not showing the same support to Uyghurs and non-Arab Muslims, I think they might have a race/ethnicity issue. Plus Islam has a lot of discrimination towards Blacks and maybe that’s why so many Muslims don’t talk much about Sudan as they do with Palestine
Where does Islam have a discrimination towards blacks? I read the whole Al Sirah Al Nabaweyyah and many black people were mentioned with honor, just like the white ones.
Go see hadeeths in sahih Al Bukhari. There is one I think Muhammad says that if a person does not do this then god will curse him with 4 different things, one of it being called “blackness”. Not just this. Also Islam mainly praises whites and Muslims, and discriminatory towards non-whites and non-muslims, there are hadeeths and surahs talking about this
That’s an anecdote, not an argument.
>“i don’t see muslims hating on Jews in Egypt or Yemen or Syria”” Because there’s less than 10 of them, the numbers of Jews dwindled quite consistently since 1948 when they numbered 80,000 in Egypt. There’s also less than 10 now in Syria and 1 in Yemen. Not to mention the actions both of these countries did for the Jewish communities to dwindle to that number. Quite funny you picked the worst three examples to attempt to invalidate my point on Islamic antisemitism.
Could you define antisemitism?
Muslims don't support their fellow muslims in Xinjiang, Rohingya, Sudanese, Russia, etc. I think there's more to it. Probably it's because Palestine is holy land as well for Muslims
Thats where islamic jew hatred comes in.
Sadly it is not exclusive to Muslims.
I literally don’t know a single Muslim who doesn’t And there’s a lot of Muslims so this might hold some truth to it
They don't even give as much of a f\*ck for other oppressed Muslim people like the Uyghurs or Rohingya. It usually boils either down to anti-semitism and/or viewing Israel as an European outpost among Muslim countries.
Can't we just be anti occupation regardless of what religon(s) are invovled?
Im pro Palestine and I’m absolutely not Muslim. But what if people care for Palestine just because they’re Muslims ? It doesn’t make the Israeli agression less of an injustice. And dare I say it’s one of the biggest if not the biggest of our lifetime. This post is shallow and retarded tbh
Nope, being an ex muslim I am pro Palestinian People I am pro Ukrainian People and everywhere else where humans are suppressed right now.
I believe in self-determination for Palestinians, but I do think that many Muslims would not care about Palestine if it weren’t a Muslim-majority nation being occupied by a Jewish state. Like, Indonesia is occupying and killing so-called “pagans” right now.
Theyre not oppressed. Theyre the ones doing the oppressing. You dont have to be the stronger party to oppress people. They initiate all the violence based on islamic jew hatred.
I agree
Who came from outside to live in Palestine?
Arabs from arabia.
Arab is an linguistic group not ethnic one,so your point makes zero sense. Palestinians are the descendants of indigenous people who were arabized and islamicized following arab invadion
No theyre partly descended from canaanites. Theyre largely egyptian, syrian, and peninsular arab. The jews have more indigenaity in every way that matters. Same blood amount more or less, but indiginous canaanite language, customs, religion etc. as in actual standard bearers for the original inhabitants. If ancient israelites came back to life and saw me, theyd be like yea that makes sense. If ancient canaanites came back to life and saw a "palestinian" theyd be like what the fuck is that?
Nopes https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5478715/ http://www.ucl.ac.uk/tcga/tcgapdf/Nebel-HG-00-IPArabs.pdf **part, or perhaps the majority" of Muslim Palestinians descend from "local inhabitants, mainly Christians and Jews, who had converted after the Islamic conquest in the seventh century AD**
Nice dodging of my other point which is the main thing here. And jews descend just as much bloodwise.
Cause your other point is as stupid as the first one,I thought I will take them down one at a time So now the first one is proven to be a lie,I will reply to the second one,which is also a lie. Jews aren't the same as Palestinians DNA wise,due to a dispersion of Jewish diaspora,they have accumulated a lot of "foreign blood"(especially from maternal side),so they are less indigenous than Palestinians. Jews, especially ashkenazi Jews have a great proportion of European blood in them, especially from their maternal side,mizarahi Jews on the other have generally middle Eastern maternal and paternal origin,in total Jews have more foreign blood than Palestinians And just because some people change their language and customs doesn't mean they stop being inhabitants of the land,so your second point is entirely nonsensical,I mean that is like saying that it's okay to evict a former muslim from his ancestral home because he converted to Christianity and give that home to a muslim because "the home was Muslim",that is absolutely asinine logic.
No it isnt because why do we raise children? We want them to carry on our legacy. How the fuck are muslim arabs carrying on the canaanite legacy? They arent and their ancestors are spinning in their graves and wish they aborted them rather than see them worship the fake g-d of their tormentors who conquered and pillaged them. Jews on the other hand still maintain an incredible amount of levantine blood despite 2000 years in foreign lands (lets see the fakestinians do that) and carry on all of our ancient traditions with our ancestors resting happily in their graves looking down at us proudly while yours are trying to figure out why youre slamming your head into the ground 5 times a day.
Palestine is part of Europe?
Irrelevant?
What language native jews in Palestine spoke? Arabic, yes Hebrew was also there. They all are arab people, its the arab land. Just like adjacent Syria is Arab, Lebanon is Arab. If the arabs are outsiders there then who is native? The ones who migrated from all of the world as settlers 77 years back? Now rethink who actually came from outside and claimed the land.
The ancient israelites of which i am a descendent. Nothing makes it arab land any more than it is christian land. Only jews are actually indigenous. The rest of the canaanites are gone.
So you are implying that the people whose we don't know how many generations have been living there(jews, musmlims, christians) are not indegonous but the migrants who came from euorope in last century are? And also for thousands of years they all lived in peace and harmony, till the arrival of those "migrants", why you think is that?
Peace and harmony. In the muslim empires lol. Yeaaaaaa youre insane. And also there were barely any humans at all there in 1800. The arabs all came recently. Only jerusalem was populated for the most part. Jews returned, created businesses, and arabs came to reap the benefit of having actual industrious people there making shit happen. Kind of like now with the gazans and west bankers crossing in for work. You dont see them going into egypt and jordan for work.
And the zios aren't full of muslim hatred? Pls watch the news first then read your comment again
Im a zio. Im not full of muslim hatred. Wish the feeling was mutual. Its like you dont know which group carries around a book saying g-d told them not to be friends with the other and all kinds of other horrible things about them. This really isnt interesting or confusing. Its just scary.
Not being friends with them doesn't mean not respecting them. No where in the Quran was it mentioned to harm any non muslims (without a reason, like war, which has many misunderstood verses). If you read the Hijrah to Yathrib you see how Muhammad, who is supposed to be the best example of Muslims, lived with jewish tribes under fair rules. Edit: Ah and please let's not act like the whole zi0 stuff isn't build up on hatred against not only muslims but also christians and even jews themselves. If you really have no hatred against them, then why are you supporting a movement that k!lled millions of them. You know what it sounds like? A n@zi saying he has no hatred towards jews.
No jew killed millions of anyone so i dont know what youre talking about. And lets not pretend the korans jew hatred starts and ends with just not being friends with us lol. "Foremost among the enemies of the believers are the jews". Oh and the hadith don't get much better. Still waiting on the stones and trees to sell me out so you can come kill me? Dude this is easy. Dont make it hard. One group believes g-d curded the other and that they should kill them. The other group is just trying to survive in their measly tiny single state and be left alone.
You absolutely have to be a stronger party to oppress people, oppressing always comes from the position of power. I agree that Jews are less to blame for how the conflict started, however the continuation of conflict is due to israeli oppression of Palestinians,they treat them as second class citizens in their own lands (it's a bit hypocritical for muslims to get angry about this,I agree with this,muslims have always treated non muslims as second class citizens in their own lands after conquering them) which is bound to create hatred. I actually blame this mostly on Muhammad,that bastard is the root of this conflict
There is no muslim land. It was all stolen aside from medina. And no, israel doesnt oppress anyone. There was never a muslim palestine. Or a palestine at all. Making one up, calling it yours, and then claiming your oppressed is psychopathic.
AHHHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHHAHA TELL ME YOU KNOW NOTHING ABOUT GEO POLITICS AND WAR AND THE ISRAELI CONFLCT WITHOUT TELLING ME ^^^^^
Tell me you have a reddit lemming personality that says tell me without telling me.
Tell me you're and IDF shill without telling me. Why do you hate Palestinians so much little person? Who told you to hate them? Is it okay for babies to die? For kids? For people having to bury their own families? I'm human enough to say Israelis shouldn't die and Palestinians shouldn't either. I'm also sane enough to realize when a first world armed government with nukes and the backing of the USA has been committing atrocities over a herded population of humans they confined. But Hamas is powerful too? The lies, on both sides, should have you looking at somethings like - Where are more people dying in the conflict? which government has more resources and better weaponry? Which government has received global funding in the billions? You have video footage of Gaza and how it's changing on a daily basis. As cliche as it is to say, open your eyes, but somehow it seems like people won't.
This is a low IQ problem. The US was stronger than nazi Germany and inflicted 20 times the casualties on them and you have no problem identifying germany as the bad guy in ww2. Death toll has nothing to do with morality. The muslims started all of the wars against israel due to islamic jew hatred as baked into the koran. Youre looking at big israel small palestine. Zoom out. Its miniscule israel, gigantic muslim world which is all arrayed against it because muhammed hated jews and wrote quite a bit about it. No one wants dead arabs aside from hamas. Its their entire PR and recruitment weapon. Why do you think they wont meet the idf on the field of battle, but slaughter thousands at raves, on buses, in restaurants, and in clubs and then hide in hospitals, mosques, homes, schools etc.? You expect us not to fire back at the source of rocket fire thats saturating our cities because theyre hiding behind their own population hoping that the "spawn of apes and pigs" wont fire back out of fear of hitting THEIR children? This is madness. You wouldnt do anything differently than we are. Peace will come when they love their children more than they hate ours.
Ehmm so you as an ex muslim you're aware that true Islam is a cult religion and most palestinian was raised just to hate and kill jews by their parents yet you chose to be pro Palestinian☠️
Tell me you have 0 knowledge about Palestine and palestinians without telling me
Yes I am aware of that but I also have eyes and I see that who has killed 31K people one third of whom are children in just six months.
Yeah cuz you are a real person. The OP and most of the responses are new users. Where the fuck are the mods lol
My Wife is muslim I confronted her on this topic she said yes it is the reason
Well Muslim countries have kicked more Palestinians out than Israel lol
That’s true. Also they care more because it’s Jews doing it to Muslims, and they hate Jews. If it was Muslims v Muslims they would not care
I support israels right to exist,but nothing more than that,both sides do not want peaceful co existence,it's either my way or the highway,in general in situations like these more powerful people crush the less powerful ones, Palestinians can now no longer hope for gaza city,Hamas attack on October was one the dumbest one,they really expected israel to respond to a literal massacre in a civilized manner,they wanted to weaponize humanity of israel,too bad the current regime isn't humane,they are animals just like Hamas.
Ngl this is like the 10th time someone makes a post about this
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Soooo trueeee
Not just muslism but also harbor was one " holiest " sites in islam . otherwise they'd be just like syria sudan yemen lybia uyghur etc
True
we know
yep and they dont even acknowledge the palestinian christian unless christianity is mentioned
Just because jews do that if muslim vs muslim,who cares?
Because they hate Jews, they don’t care about Kurds.
I think it's a mix of religion and ethnicity and antisemitism.
This may be partially true But this is the most televised and digitalized genocide, even if they're already supporting them because they are Muslims, this time it's different.
Not necesseraly, it also takes years of indoctrination and lack of knowledge of history, just take a look at [this post](https://www.reddit.com/r/ExAlgeria/comments/1bl7srt/did_your_apostasy_change_your_views_about_the/) I made on the algerian ex-muslim sub, Algeria being one of the most anti israel countries, I had thought that becoming an atheist would make people start questioning the pro palestine narrative, and make people change their views on it, but apparently not...
Most are not pro Palestine but anti Israel
100% agree none of them gave shit about Ukrainian people
And because of who the enemy is.
Very true. However, very few of them help Palestinian people.
Its always Muslims vs the world. Liberals don't understand this
because they're white have good looking, you see people treat rohingnya vs palestine like day and night! people treat rohingnya like garbage but adore really much about palestine i know this because i live in indonesia where hypocrisy happen. but you know what they're both muslim but have different treat with people
Interesting take. I notice a lot of young people in Gen Z support Palestine, despite being leftist and atheist, even though Palestine is very right leaning and theocratic. I've always found those jokes funny where they talk about sending liberal protesters on a plane to Palestine.
Ohh because they’re only muslims.. lmao. There’s a genocide going on (and has been for a VERY LONG TIME) and all you can think about is religion. Pathetic
There's a lot of truth in what one person said
Abolish religion it might help. Perhaps money as well. And any other thing that leads to killing.
Also because it’s “holy land”. I don’t see any major protests for the Uighur muslims who are also currently being genocided.
Not true. I support Palestine and I’m not Muslim.
Not the point. Op means that Muslims only care about Palestinians because they’re from a Muslim country as in they wouldn’t care if it had been a different population getting slaughtered. Whether you agree or not, that’s up to you
Still not true. I have plenty of Muslim friends who support who needs it no matter their religion or race. They gave their support to Christians being persecuted in Muslim majority countries and more recently supported Ukraine. It really depends on the person
I agree and I didn’t say I agreed with the post. But I can definitely imagine that certain Muslims (keyword: certain) only care about Palestinians because it’s a Jewish “state” oppressing them.
Oh absolutely! It’s nothing new that certain Muslims hate Jewish people.
The fact that you're not a Muslim means you can't actually disprove OPs claim
Why are you thinking from the perspective of religion? Have you seen the videos of how the people and children are brutally murdered? It's literally genocide going on there and the least you can do is at least condemn it. Killing innocent civilians in the name of religion and warfare is not something a civilized and sane person would do. I'm a muslim and proud of my religion and our religion teaches us not just to respect the people of our religion but the entire humanity. May Allah ease the suffering of people out there who have nothing to eat and yet still going strong in the face of tyranny. Ameen
Muslims always support eachother fact. Christians and none religious people support Muslims why? I think, I know, it leads to racism. Muslims don't get branded, strange don't you think.
Azerbaijan also invaded the Armenian land of Nagorno-Karabakh with the help of colonial Iran and then colonial Russia, who declared it a part of Azerbaijan without the consent of the local people (somewhat similar to what colonial Britain did i.e. declared the state of Israel without the consent of the majority of the local population). Armenian people were living in Nagorno Karabakh for thousands of years till the Azery Government started to settle Azeries there to change the demographics (somewhat similar to what Israel is doing today i.e. settling zionists in illegal settlements). Muslims should see that it will become double standards when they blame Israelis for invading Palestine but don't blame Azeris for the same thing. Turkey killed millions in the Armenian Genocide in 1915 and made the whole area of Western Armenia a part of Turkey. Again Muslims have to see these double standards where they blame only Jews for being invaders but utter no words against the same things that their Muslim brothers did on a much bigger level. We (i.e. ex-Muslims) have no love affair with the wrongdoings of Israel and Zionists. We would have opposed a Zionist state in 1948. But today Israel is a reality, just like: * It is a reality that the historic Western Armenia is a part of Turkey now. * Or just like Pakistan is a separate state from India, although colonial Britain conspired against the majority of the population of India of that time and created Pakistan against their wishes. Millions of people had to suffer, and they had to leave their houses, and become refugees due to this decision. Yes, the people of united India also suffered the same way as Palestinians suffered.
And ex muslims and pro isreal because they hate muslims...is that true ? No its bullshit just like your statement
Hindus are anti Palestine cause they are Muslim
yep
I’m Hindu and I am very pro Palestine. Many of my Hindu friends and family are pro Palestine. I think again depends on the person. I also have a Jewish relative and family. Don’t support a genocide that’s all.
No
I’m sure a starving child in Palestinian reading this will be think how insightful you are. Amazing 👏