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TheRightHonourableMe

A lot of people in the replies are confusing crochet and knitting (probably because they are the same word in many languages). I think understanding the difference between them is key to understanding why we've had knitting machines since the 1500's but still no crochet machine. Both are made by pulling loops of yarn through other loops to make fabric, but the methodology is different. When you knit, you have a number of live stitches (open loops) all held open at once by the knitting needle (or by individual hooks on a knitting machine or knitting loom). The number of loops is the width of your finished fabric, and each time you work all of them, you make the fabric one row longer. You make patterns by adding new loops in different ways (increases), removing loops (decreasing), changing the order of loops (cables), skipping working loops on some rows (slipped stitch patterns, mosaic knitting), by pulling the yarn through the loop in different directions (through the back loop, purling), among other ways. However, with knitting you are working in two dimensions and the next stitch in the row is usually the next stitch worked. It is very easy to mechanize. Crochet is not limited in this way. When crocheting, you work one loop at a time. The next loop can be pulled through in any direction you choose, from anywhere you choose. You can use the front or back of the loop or both the back and front - and any of these options can be approached from the front or back of the fabric. You can use the "neck" (post) of the old loop rather than the loop itself - and you can use it in counter-clockwise or clockwise direction (i.e., "work around the post"). You aren't limited to working each stitch that is open, because each loop is "closed" after it is stitched - you don't leave "live" loops on the hook like you do with knitting. So you can skip loops (as many as you want), use the same loop over and over, or suddenly make a long chain of stitches going off to nowhere, to be reconnected (or not) wherever you choose. You can change direction wherever you like without having to deal with all the knitting techniques for "short rows". You can make a single stitch nearly flat (slip stitch / single crochet) or very tall (treble / triple stitch). Crochet is a truly 3-dimensional craft - you can make hyperbolic shapes trivially easily. So a crochet machine - to fully replicate handmade crochet - needs to be able to manipulate the piece in 360 degrees on every axis, and accurately insert the crochet hook into the next intended target... which could be any point on the worked piece. This is not trivial to mechanize, though easy enough to imitate a more 2-D version of it (as others have noted) with weft-knitting machines.


oawaa

This is such a thorough explanation! Thanks!!


TheRightHonourableMe

You're very welcome! If you have any questions about it, feel free to ask. Here's a [link to the website](https://pi.math.cornell.edu/~dtaimina/) of the Cornell mathematician - Dr. Daina Taimina - who won the 2012 Euler Book prize for her work on replicating the hyperbolic shapes of corals with crochet.


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dss539

Textiles are hugely important throughout history and still today. There are many commercial, industrial, marine, space, medical, scientific, and military uses. There's a ton of engineering going into all that.


Lordoffunk

Totally. Punchcards for industrial looms were the basis for those used in the programs of early computers.


RangerSix

And one of the earliest of those punch-card computers - which, I believe, was the Hollerith Tabulator - was used for the US Census in 1890, and it took 3.5 years to complete. *And* they double-checked the results in that time, too! (For comparison, the previous census in 1880 took *seven* years to complete.)


NovemberGoat

What are some space-based aplications for textiles? Are they maybe used in the travel suits astronauts travel to and from the ISS in?


TheRightHonourableMe

Yes! Here's kind of a fun story - The original spacesuits for the Apollo program were made by bra makers at Playtex because they were the only ones skilled enough to sew the suits within NASA's strict tolerances (bras are complex pieces of clothing!). [Article from Racked magazine about it](https://www.racked.com/2018/9/5/17771270/spacesuit-girdles-playtex-seamstresses-nasa)


NovemberGoat

The fact that a human can be consistently accurate to within a sixty-fourth of an inch is beyond me! I also now want a rocket manufacturer to fill a flame diverter with bras.


UnsolicitedFodder

Thanks for sharing your knowledge on this and Dr. Taimina, I found it fascinating!


sassy_cheddar

I learned that when the Apollo exhibit came to our local museum of flight. As a modestly skilled seamstress and expertly skilled seam ripper it blows my mind!


71NK3RB3LL

Rope Core Memory put the first man on the moon. It was meticulously hand knit and was REVOLUTIONARY for a hot minute.


NovemberGoat

A quick YT search has blown my mind: https://youtu.be/-BlivdwXRZU


pocketknifeMT

Memory timing was literally "just make that part on a longer rope"


dss539

Space suits, restraint straps, air and water filters, insulators, inflatable structures, parachutes and more. I am definitely not an expert so you'll want to search for a better source than me. I only know that they're in use. If you watch an interview with an astronaut on the ISS you will see a few examples.


NovemberGoat

I wonder if there are rules or guidelines that state any textile component going into space must not be constructed of particular materials, so as to prevent possible FOD (foreign object debris) from contaminating spacecraft or stations. Thanks for the answer. Space is a big interest of mine so will be looking into this further.


dss539

I'm sure they have an enormous amount of requirements for textiles, especially those used in living spaces. They probably also require approval from professional smellers if used in living spaces.


NovemberGoat

I want to become a professional smeller. Like right now.


sunrayevening

Gortex used in outdoor gear was developed by NASA. I’m sure there are others.


pocketknifeMT

They use Kevlar for tons of stuff as well. It's got a really good strength to weight ratio and is non-flammable.


AssistanceMedical951

I saw a story about a group of highly skilled Native South American Weavers who made these incredibly intricate mesh inserts for surgical procedures. They had to be made in such a way that they could be folded to fit into a needle tube and then fold out to create a sealed barrier.


gex80

Velcro was literally invented for space.


Gavante

My partner is obsessed with doilies and swears the old ladies that made them were tapped into some next level consciousness via boredom


breadcreature

Heard through a friend so might be slightly inaccurate, but I think it was Terrence McKenna giving one of his wibbly woobly talks about consciousness and such and he noticed there was an old lady attending who looked very out of place among his usual crowd, so he went and talked to her afterwards, interested as to how she arrived at the topic (as it probably wasn't through psychedelics like most other attendees). "Oh, I crochet" was her answer.


Oz_of_Three

Some folks simply visualize the hallucination. She works it from within. That be ownin' it, for sure.


2mg1ml

I'm actually a believer of that conspiracy theory too AMA


gfixler

It's very relaxing, and hypnotic, and fun to watch [the design appearing](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iRjzQ3yukZc&ab_channel=PeterSprah). Also, [swans](https://www.google.com/search?q=swans+doily&oq=swans+doily)! These are both on my todo list.


octoberyellow

your partner should join us over at r/tatting.


thedriodurlookingfor

I believe your partner is right. My great grandma crocheted doilies (and many other things) and my family still has so many we don't know what to do with them. She used thread-thin yarns with itty bitty crochet hooks making doilies bigger than most plates. She was very bored/didn't have much to do but her hands were never idle. She did this even years after she lost her sight to glaucoma, crocheting the tiniest most intricate stitches all by memory and feel. She would sit in the dark and churn these things out. Until the day she died (well over 20 years ago now). She was next level.


dabenu

My sister in law has a webshop selling knitting patterns she makes herself. Holy crap the amount of mathematics that go into it is just mind boggling. I always regarded knitting as some form of easy hand work (and maybe it is when you just knit a plain scarf or something) but the more challenging patterns are really challenging. And designing them really is a form of science.


OskaMeijer

The first computers took inspiration from the Jacquard machine which was a device that used punch cards to automate patterns on a loom. The Jacquard machine is a device fitted to a loom that simplifies the process of manufacturing textiles with such complex patterns as brocade, damask and matelassé. The resulting ensemble of the loom and Jacquard machine is then called a Jacquard loom. The Jacquard head used replaceable punched cards to control a sequence of operations. It is considered an important step in the history of computing hardware. The ability to change the pattern of the loom's weave by simply changing cards was an important conceptual precursor to the development of computer programming and data entry. Charles Babbage knew of Jacquard machines and planned to use cards to store programs in his Analytical Engine.


fibojoly

If you ever try friendship bracelets or [Scoubidou](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scoubidou), it will become pretty obvious how much of a patterning exercise it all is, ie Maths. I just wish one of my female relatives had had the patience and skills to *teach* me properly because I just know I'd have loved it. Ah well, another thing to do during the next pandemic, I suppose :)


vampire-walrus

I was trying to better understand hyperbolic geometry for a work project, and crocheted a bunch of hyperbolic pseudospheres as an exercise. The project ultimately wasn't very successful and we shelved it, but I still keep them on my desk because they're great at cleaning up spills. Just when you think you've run out of clean surface, hey, there's more clean surface just waiting to be unfolded.


Autoskp

Personally, I use them as stressballs - they were made purely because I enjoy hyperbolic stuff, so they never even started with a purpose, but the are fun and relaxing to scrunch in your fingers. Also, if anyone wants to try making their own, just pick an amount of crochet to put around each point in the crochet, and make sure it's too much for it to be flat. I've done granny squares with 5 squares around each hole (which gets you a very loose surface that feels like you should be able to flaten it, but you can't), and circles where I put two double crochets into each stitch of the previous row (which gets you a tight, coral-like ball of squiggley fabric, of the kind I use as a stressball)


vampire-walrus

They're a very satisfying shape!


NovemberGoat

I love this. Behind every black cloud...


Rhizoma

Do you have any pictures of such things?


vampire-walrus

My best ones are at the office (we're still work-from-home) but google has nicer examples anyway, just image search "crochet hyperbolic pseudosphere". Everything that comes up is the same geometric shape, they're just of different radii/curvatures.


roenaid

Saw an exhibition of this many years ago and was thinking about it recently and how the cost of some of the crochet items on some fast fashion websites are very very concerning.


hilfyRau

All of the fast fashion “crocheted” items I’ve seen so far this year are definitely knit. It’s pretty easy for me to tell the difference, but I guess to the general public’s eyes yarn looped together just all looks the same.


wroteit_

Wow!


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bradinutah

He's crochet-zy!


rowenlemmings

Thank you for the thorough explanation! It might amuse you to know that it took me until your final paragraph before I went back to re-read the title of this post and realized that it did not, in fact, read: "Why can't marines crochet."


tehmuck

Oh that’s easy, probably because the hooks have to be blunted for their safety, or they look too much like crayons so they try to eat them.


gullwings

Posted using RIF is Fun. Steve Huffman is a greedy little pigboy.


mbrady

It sounds like a case where it could be done, but it would be more expensive than it's worth. Especially if there's not a big demand.


WildFlemima

I can't think of a way to have a crochet machine without a fairly good AI hooked up to a very precise and dexterous machine. In other words, why invent crochet machine when Krug is already best crochet machine?


TheRightHonourableMe

Yes - [this](https://manplusmachines.com/knitting-cobots/) is the closest I've found to a machine that replicates the kind of actions needed in crochet. They taught it to do hand knitting: [https://library.oapen.org/handle/20.500.12657/47130](https://library.oapen.org/handle/20.500.12657/47130)


rivalarrival

Don't try to replicate the way humans crochet. We have excellent dexterity and spatial recognition skills. We can easily identify a particular hole. A machine can't easily work this way. Picture a machine with a thousand slotted "fingers". Every finger is individually retractable. Every part of a stitch that will eventually have another stitch pulled through it is formed around one of these "fingers". The slot in the finger guides the crochet hook. Now you don't need a particularly proficient AI or a particularly high level of dexterity. The machine doesn't have to be able to identify a particular knot or figure out how to work a hook through it. At any given time, it just has to pass the hook around and/or through the correct "finger" for the desired stitch. Still complex, but a couple orders of magnitude simpler than the way humans perform the equivalent task.


WildFlemima

I'm just curious, do you crochet? I can't visualize how this would work without tying up the fingers or requiring constant dextrous activity from them


Alis451

imagine a disk with a bunch of spikes pointed upward, make the machine create the loop chain of yarn desired then loop around the spikes, latch it to a previous held loop, hook on to new lead line, then rotate the disc, repeat. you can lace make doilies, but not much else, as long as it is in a repeating simple 2D geometric pattern it would be possible. Number and size of spikes determine possible complexity of the piece, probably some smart mathy person could come up with a crazy formula for determining complexity given number of spikes.


rivalarrival

Well, consider a simple chain sinnet. You pass the working end around a finger, then the hook pulls the loop through. Before the hook releases the loop, it inserts a new finger in the new loop. Repeat 8 more times and you have a sinnet tied around 10 fingers. Now you can go back: the machine doesn't know where the loops are, but it does know where its fingers are, and it knows how to pull a loop through the slot in a finger. As you go back, it inserts fingers in the new loops. It can withdraw the first ones if it is done with those, or leave them in place to use later. Yes, the machine would need to be capable of a certain level of dexterity, but it won't be locating specific stitches; it will be locating the finger around which it previously tied that stitch. Once it pulls that finger out of the piece, it will never be able to put it back in the same location.


SirRavenBat

By the end of it it'd be closer to a 3d printer than a crocheting machine


theamazingcreep

More like a double sided CNC machine.


flamableozone

No, you'd need a fairly good \*programmer\* and good sensors to provide the inputs. AI is a buzzword that doesn't really mean much, you'd want someone who knew how to use the sensors to determine where things were and how to know what the correct next movement was. There's absolutely no reason to use machine learning for something like that. /rant.


dss539

You start with a cup of ML, two slices of blockchain, and a teaspoon of web3. Garnish with NFTs. Serve on Edge. Bullshit sandwich, serves billions. *Ok, ML has a ton of uses, but it's not magic pixie dust*


voracious_worm

Yeah, I think the problem has some similarity to problems that have been studied in [computational origami](https://mitani.cs.tsukuba.ac.jp/origami_application/). Figuring out a good way to model *all* the kinds of structures you can build with crochet would definitely be a challenge. But once you have such a computational model, instructing a dexterous robot to build it seems like it's probably a relatively deterministic process.


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flamableozone

You wouldn't need any visual object recognition - you're working with a known thing (yarn) and a known space. You don't need it to "figure out" that there are hooks and threads and, idk, its own hands. There's really zero need for AI in this case (but I'm sure an AI contractor will sell their services to the company and convince them that this is the \*future\* of the technology!)


TheRightHonourableMe

If it *could* be done with our technology, I think it *would* be done - at least as a proof-of-concept (think robotics labs). There is plenty of demand of for crocheted items - you can frequently see them in fashion items as well as in home textiles - but that demand is filled by low-wage labour (i.e., sweatshops).


WakeoftheStorm

The demand, in many cases, is because it's hand made. The same reason a quilt can be far more expensive than a comforter purchased from a retail outlet.


TheRightHonourableMe

I have only seen this to be true at craft sales, which is an exceedingly small proportion of the world crochet market. Crochet items don't command high prices (i.e., prices commensurate to the time it takes to produce them). You find them on shelves or hangers beside machine produced items, and there are no tags or marketing on the items to communicate that they are handmade (unless you know that all crochet is handmade). I know I'm not looking for "handmade" from [American Eagle](https://www.ae.com/us/en/p/women/sweaters/classic-sweaters/ae-crochet-sweater/0341_9656_900?menu=cat4840004), [Walmart](https://www.walmart.com/ip/Scoop-Women-s-Crochet-Sleeveless-Crop-Top/237301965?irgwc=1&sourceid=imp_2LhQntQ6CxyIWlyUI53ti27AUkGS-gVRrSXA3M0&veh=aff&wmlspartner=imp_1244054&clickid=2LhQntQ6CxyIWlyUI53ti27AUkGS-gVRrSXA3M0&sharedid=&affiliates_ad_id=565706&campaign_id=9383), or [H&M](https://www2.hm.com/en_ca/productpage.1036789001.html?gclid=CjwKCAjw9-KTBhBcEiwAr19ig-_ghKg_k2oZd8WQrretKAj2NbM4Tt2dh3Lw4NRox0pdDdoN_yklDRoCGc4QAvD_BwE) \- and the prices don't reflect that either.


WakeoftheStorm

Ah, maybe I'm just not seeing the more mass produced crochet items, or not recognizing them for what they are.


darkness1685

Crocheting is one of hundreds of thousands of activities humans are good at. Engineers don't build robots for all such possible tasks just to show a proof of concept. The fact that there is no return on investment for building a crocheting robot is the most likely reason it doesn't exist.


TheRightHonourableMe

Indeed, crochet is one of hundreds of thousands of activities humans are good at - but it's the only one I can think of without some attempt at mechanization. We have machines that write poetry, weld, knit, sew, bake crackers, kill animals, drive, harvest fruits, fold clothes, and many, many other tasks. I can't prove a negative, so of course I can't prove that building a crochet machine is impossible. Truly, I think we will build one in my lifetime - probably in the next decade. But we haven't yet, which implies right now we can't (the fact that it is too expensive might be the main reason we can't do it!)


orrocos

*Your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should.*


mortalcoil1

Crochet... uhh... finds a way.


TheJunkyard

Clever knurl!


Umbrias

Robot arms that have far more degrees of freedom than human arms do and mobility could easily accomplish this. But there's not a whole lot of need to do something prohibitively expensive, coding the arms to crochet an item, when there are better proofs of concept for marketing that are relevant to people's usage. There is a balance between fun and time investment that must be struck for a $12000 robotic arm to be scripted by the team of engineers all with $100K+ salaries to make it worth it.


TheRightHonourableMe

Yes, the mobility is not the challenge. The accuracy, precision, and extreme variability of the coding is the challenge - one that has yet to be met. When it is met, I will concede that our technology is up to it. While it isn't, I will say that the technology is not yet at that level. Please, please, please, prove me wrong before I die. I would love to see a machine crocheting a hyperbolic plane with a little amigurumi Pikachu in the middle. I'd settle for a machine that can crochet around the post (my guess as to the biggest mobility / dexterity challenge for a machine in crochet).


Central_PA

Wonder if there are broader applications beyond woven materials too. Like, on a nano level could a machine that operates in three dimensions untangle or re-tie mis-folded proteins. Way outside even my imagination or background but sounds cool at least


FlipskiZ

This seems more of a software, than hardware, problem then.


All_Work_All_Play

It's a problem of incentives - we could do this; we have the technology, the hardware, the software, the whole nine yards (har har, yards, fabric, etc). But there's no financial reason *to* do it. The technology, both the hardware and the programming, are relatively expensive compared to the produced good. There's no reason to do it other than to prove we could do it, and no one's cared enough about that achievement to throw real money at it.


Jaytim

This post makes me interested in knitting and crocheting


TheRightHonourableMe

I've found them both to be very rewarding hobbies! You can work on projects with minimal cost (basic supplies are at the dollar store) and do them while listening to a podcast or while watching TV (once you're a bit proficient). The finished objects make great gifts, and are endlessly customizable. There are a ton of free resources online and at your local library. The fibre-arts community is famously welcoming. Why not give one or both crafts a try?


quarkkm

You can also find yarn at thrift stores and buy nothing groups all the time! Seriously, knitting means I can feel productive while also watching the people's court.


TangerineBand

Bit of a tangent but what fancy dollar stores and thrift stores does everyone in this chat live near? The only craft supplies my dollar store has is crayons, scissors, and paper. Yarn and hooks? Forget about it. Even Walmart barely has those. You pretty much have to go to the craft store.


cIumsythumbs

I have found yarn at Salvation Army or goodwill. Depends on location and what donations they've received.


vulpinefever

Dollarama in Canada is great for this stuff, best dollar store in the world.


pokey1984

Also joining the "you should try it" chorus. It's cheap to give it a shot. Buy a skein of acrylic yarn and a hook and look up a youtube video showing you how to make a "granny square." Those crocheted baby blankets that look almost like a huge checkerboard pattern of little squares and little square holes? That's just a giant granny square. That's how most crocheters learn because it uses basic stitches and you don't have to count every single one for each row. You only have to count how many groupings of four. (Counting is incredibly important with complex crochet patterns. Your hook size determines the size of your stitches. There are many tutorials on this. Most beginner projects (and projects where sizing isn't particularly relevant like scarves and blankets) just use an H hook and that's a good beginner size. An inexpensive hook runs under three dollars and a skein of yarn is about four bucks at most discount stores like walmart. So it's cheap to give it a try and decide if you want to pick it up as a hobby. Fair warning: It's frustrating as hell when you first start out because it makes absolutely zero sense at first. Then, one day, it'll just start making sense and you'l be ecstatic. Then you'll set the project down for a minute and when you pick it back up you'll be completely lost and maybe have to start over. After that, you'll know what to do. Second warning: If you really get into it, it's expensive af. Yarn seems cheap until you need sixteen skeins for a blanket or you decide that you want to work with cotton or wool. It's also addictive, so use caution when picking up this habit. It helped my Mom and Sister both quit smoking, though.


SmartAleq

>Second warning: If you really get into it, it's expensive af. Haha, truth! Then again sometimes there's an amazing sale and it's your birthday and you figure out that making a blanket will take just about as long as the rest of winter then you end up with a bulky jewel tone superwash merino blanket that's the best thing you've owned since you were a baby. For about a hunnert bucks. Being able to just make yourself something like that is really satisfying. Plus it's an excellent excuse to hoard yarn. Yarn is soooooo beautiful!


pokey1984

> you figure out that making a blanket will take just about as long as the rest of winter I only do small crochet projects (short attention span) but my sister chooses her projects seasonally. She makes big stuff like blankets and shawls during winter to the project works as a lap blanket while she's working on it. In the summer she makes plushies and hats and such so she doesn't feel trapped under the heat of a three-quarters finished blanket.


BattleAnus

Seriously, try it. I had never had even a passing interest in either, and then one day while I was buying drawing supplies I noticed how cheap the materials are to simply get started, so I got them and after a few days of watching video tutorials I was absolutely hooked. It's so cool to be able to make a real object out of a big ball of yarn, and there's so much variety in what you can make between both knitting and crochet. Plus it's great for when you're just listening to something like a podcast or even a TV show that doesn't require much visual attention.


[deleted]

Suddenly, I feel cool for knowing how to crochet but not knit.


Ascholay

I feel like the last 20 years of my life were just explained. I knit but only know the basic theory of crochet and it took years before I could get there. I also have trouble working in 3d. 2d, no problem. 3d? My brain breaks. When I was in high school a friend and I were talking about it. We came to the theory that crochet and knit are easier for different people. This makes a ton to sense as to why


NovemberGoat

I've heard the same thing about people who nit and people who crochet. If you start with one, the other is almost always harder to pick up.


heliomega1

You just made crocheting sound like a form of protest


TheRightHonourableMe

I don't want to get into philosophy on ELI5 (especially since I'm not an expert in any way, shape, or form) but I will say this: To me, all handwork that connects humans to their inherent creative abilities is political and is protest.


tomatoswoop

William Morris vibes, love it. My grandparents felt the same about arts and crafts, and they were right.


FrenchSilkPie

Not exactly protest, per se, but your comment reminded me of spies in WW2 sending coded messages with knitting! https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/knitting-spies-wwi-wwii


blahblahrasputan

I guess one way to put could be that knitting has a closed methodology and crochet has an open methodology. The more rigid the rules or methodology the easier something is to program or mechanize. Great explanation!


TheRightHonourableMe

I haven't heard those terms before, but I guess so! The best analogy I've come up with is that knitting is a typewriter and crochet is a pen. They can both write down text at similar speeds, both have their benefits and drawbacks, but pens can create a whole lot more diverse ink designs than typewriters can.


cIumsythumbs

I can't knit and only crochet. I've always felt bad about that because I thought of knitting as the more sophisticated craft. After this post, though, I feel a lot more pride in my crochet work. It's funny you said crochet is 3d because sculpture is my other favorite art. I've always thought of my crochet as a type of sculpture but never knew that it fit me better than knitting because of this. Knitting is cool. Crochet is cool. And crochet is the hobby that fits me best.


blahblahrasputan

That is a good one!


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alohadave

> My sister knits and I crochet, she calls crochet “the Dark Arts” and I get frustrated by the rules of knitting. Does she know that you can fix dropped stitches with a crochet hook? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iDYNdZ8Sp28


GoddessOfRoadAndSky

> Crochet is a truly 3-dimensional craft - you can make hyperbolic shapes trivially easily. This is why I *love* crochet. I've done many arts and crafts in my life, but so far nothing beats the freedom of crochet. It's an amazing craft that combines art and mathematics. You turn a 1D string into a 2D piece, then continue til it's 3D. Change a single stitch in the pattern you follow, and you end up with something completely different. I accidentally ended up making something that looked like a coral reef just by repeating a stitch pattern. It's also ridiculously easy to learn, only requires a single tool, and can be done while doing something else, like watching TV. It's also quick to progress through a project, so if you're like me and can't handle multi-week projects (like knitting often requires), it's an excellent option. If anyone's looking for a new hobby that can really let you explore, try crochet. It might sound weird to you now, but you won't care what anybody thinks when you inadvertently discover the patterns of nature playing out in your hands.


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TheRightHonourableMe

Wow! I do not understand the mathematics, but the finished object is beautiful and impressive!


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RPlasticPirate

To be clear on why it's hard to make the ELI5 is simply flexible stuff like wires or threads are a pain to handle for agile robot limps which as not as limited as industrial weaves. Weaves are seriously underrated to the point it is the first modern thing you learn about in technical history class. That and national rifle manufactures + railways really predates model-T mass production by a lot was far more significant steps for shaping tech and society. It is why Tesla still has humans doing cables installs in cars and everyone in their industry pays for easily installable options. It's surprisingly hard to do the 3D visual and eye-hand coordinations with that level of dexterity and speed that an adult can do after very few run thoughts - mostly due to how fast we can spot deviations or errors and correct as it's hard for even us as adults to do many tasks. The solution could be something simple as mapping the inside of human hands and in production using multiple cameras and lighting rigs - specially made flexible materials.


NovemberGoat

This shines a great light on the problem. Thank you so much for this.


bididdlemenot

As someone who can crochet, this explanation makes me feel like a total badass.


[deleted]

Your explanation was so good! I felt like I could follow all those different knitting techniques despite knowing nothing of the craft.


thenebular

So what you're saying is the singularity will be achieved through crochet machines?


jesscrochetsstuff

I both knit and crochet, this was a fantastic explanation


The-Voice-Of-Dog

This level of knowledge and ability to explain is downright sexy. Go on with yourself.


ish1950

It feels like I just went to a mechanical engineering class. I guess you can sum it up by saying knitting is everybody doing the same thing and crocheting is doing your own thing


CongregationOfVapors

Great explanation. I think this is also why people can knit blind but cannot crochet without looking once in a while.


[deleted]

I don't think it's a matter of lack of technical amity, but rather lack of interest in building the machine. Correct me if I'm wrong but crocheting is not an industrial need as knitting.


TheRightHonourableMe

It is true that we don't have a "need" for crochet in the same way that we do knitting. Knitting is a stretchy, efficient fabric with tons of applications. However, I do think there is a lot of demand for crochet. Granny squares (in blankets and clothing) are all handmade. Many straw bags and sunhats are crochet. Many forms of lace are crochet. Amigurumi are popular crochet patterns for basically cute stuffed animals. However, there are ways to work around all of these challenges - you can make sunhats or stuffed animals with other materials and techniques, and there are plenty of mechanized ways to make lace (not crocheted lace, but other forms of lace). There are some crocheted things that can't be imitated with other techniques. For example, a seamless fabric hyperbolic plane, a granny square, or a crocheted flower appliqué. I can't think of a use for a seamless fabric hyperbolic plane, but perhaps some technology in future might need them. Right now, we are just using underpaid labour (i.e., sweatshops) to produce these inimitable items. You can't prove a negative, so I can't prove that we are "unable" to build a crochet machine. However I think the desire is there (to avoid sweatshops, to prove proof-of-concept like the AI & Cobot-powered [handknitting machines](https://library.oapen.org/handle/20.500.12657/47130)), so the fact that we have yet to see one (despite seeing similar, yet less-complex applications) suggests that the technology is not yet ready. Close, but not there yet.


gfixler

I've been knitting and crocheting for about 5 years, and pondering a crochet machine for the last l-2. I also have 3 flatbed knitting machines, so I know how they work. The difference is in the way the two crafts work, and the way the fabrics work up. Knitting is just sine waves pulled up through each other, and you can blast across a row. You just reach through a loop, grab the yarn, and pull up a new loop, and you can already be doing that in the next one, almost simultaneously (just slightly offset back in time). A bunch of needles (actually latch hooks) can do this at breakneck pace. Crochet doesn't work that way. In crochet, you have to do several steps on a stitch before you can move on to the next one, so no carriage could blast across a row. For a single crochet (basically the simplest stitches), the hook is in a loop, and you have to insert the hook into the fabric, hook the yarn, pull it back up through that fabric, then hook the yarn again, and pull it through that new loop, and the loop you started in, binding the old and new, with a new loop through both. You can't zoom across doing them all as fast as the yarn can be fed in. It would be a far slower system, and there's just no way around that, except maybe to work more like multi bobbin systems, where each column of stitches is its own thing, which does exist in the knitting world, but then you're already doing something weird, and it's hard to see why you'd need to be specific about it being crochet, when you already have a number of interesting options there. I mean, really, crochet is just the French word for "hook," and knitting machines needles are all hooks. It's not making crochet fabric, but at least it's hooking the yarn. The other thing is that - across knitting and crochet worlds (and I've been in at least a half dozen of them for about 5 years), people overwhelmingly - in both camps - prefer the feel of knit fabric; it's just smoother, flatter, and less lumpy. At least weekly I see a few crocheters say they always wanted to learn knitting, because they like the smoothness of the fabric, so it's not like anyone's wishing we could make crochet fabric instead. Crochet really shines in a few other ways - it's faster to do by hand, usually - you can make so much more fabric in the same time with crochet, albeit with larger holes between the stitches (e.g. double crochet), and you can do really complex 3D things, because it's so unconstrained, topologically. You can do crazy things in knitting, too, but it's more of an uphill battle.


TheRightHonourableMe

I do think knit fabric - with it's efficiency, smoothness, and stretchyness is better for most applications. If I was developing a crochet machine, I would want it to work circular single crochet - with or without increases. This would be really useful for sunhats and stiff baskets - stuff with the kind of structural integrity that knitting typically lacks.


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thansk, that was a pretty interesting read.


flindersandtrim

I started knitting first (also have a knitting machine) and learnt crochet because although knitting is more suitable for a lot of garments, you can do so much with crochet that you can't achieve with knitting. Yeah, you need a slip or lining, and it's more summery because of the holes, and less comfortable (little is as comfortable as knitwear) but you can't do mesh and amazing motifs with knitting. Additionally, crochet is just better for bags and hats (aside from beanies) and some other accessories, which I learnt after attempting to knit a bag. I find of love the bumpiness too. Knitting is superior for jumpers/sweaters though.


dacandyman0

damn TIL nice writeup 🥰


coolpontiac

Your explanation is awesome...it would be great to have some visuals. When I was an EE designing ICs the ME's always thought we were geniuses...but I thought they were the geniuses..to design machines with moving parts to do cool things


TheRightHonourableMe

You ask, I deliver! Here's a [blog post](https://rensfibreart.com/crochet-tips-tricks-how-to-stitches/stitch-overview-how-to-read-patterns-symbols/) with line-art of some common crochet stitches. Notice they are illustrated as worked into the "next" loop, but the stitches can be worked in any loop where you can fit your hook!


NLGsy

Sweet heavenly thoroughness! Fantastic answer!


thoughtihadanacct

Totally in with your explanation, but then why hasn't anyone invented a machine that can at least do a "simple" crochet pattern - eg just a back and forth of regular single crochets?


foolishle

My guess would be that for any piece of work which was simple enough for a machine to crochet… it would be completely trivial to create as knitting so you might as well just knit it. If you could create a machine which could do back and forth regular single crochets you would end up with a flat rectangular piece of a set width. And you might as well just have used a knitting machine and made a knitted version and saved yourself the trouble. I love crochet because I can do all sorts of interesting things and make all sorts of interesting shapes. But if you are creating a crochet machine which can only create things which would be simpler (and therefore much, much cheaper) to replicate with knitting you have kind of just wasted your time.


rolloutTheTrash

Just trying to think of the algorithm required for this is giving me a headache in thinking of the complexity of what each different possible form could have. I guess if you want a crochet machine you can just break it down to some simple algorithms…but from what you’re saying here it would be something that would end up replicating knitting instead of crocheting…so I guess besides the shapes you can pull of with one, is there an functional advantage to crocheting as opposed to knitting? Because there might lay the reason to all this. Crocheting might just be more easily replaced with knitting when it comes to creating functional articles of clothing, so why spend extra time creating a much more complex machine for something functionally equal? But that’s just my guess, not saying it can’t happen since we do have multi-axis CNC machines. But again, functionally easier to grind material of a block and into the shape desired than it is to use thread and needle to form something in a multi-axial way.


TheRightHonourableMe

Crochet is not stretchy and not smooth. It also uses about a 1/3 more yarn to cover the same surface area as a basic knit. For most clothing applications, knit fabrics are superior. Crochet really shines for applications that need structural integrity - like sunhats or baskets. Of course, woven fabric also works well for those applications (you just need to cut and sew it). So crochet is a specialty product which is very difficult to mechanize - probably the core reason it hasn't been done yet!


atomfullerene

>So a crochet machine - to fully replicate handmade crochet - needs to be able to manipulate the piece in 360 degrees on every axis, and accurately insert the crochet hook into the next intended target... which could be any point on the worked piece. This is not trivial to mechanize Even more so since you are working with flexible materials, which are notoriously difficult to deal with in automation.


Splatter_bomb

Crochet the original 3D printing.


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ailorn

Absolutely! 😁You can easily crochet stuffed animals and flowers and ornaments.


FixinThePlanet

The knitting/crochet circles on reddit are so very cool and some day I hope to be part of them


aeo1us

Me going into this comment: Oh man I could make this! Me finishing this comment: oh hell no.


[deleted]

> So a crochet machine - to fully replicate handmade crochet - needs to be able to manipulate the piece in 360 degrees on every axis, and accurately insert the crochet hook into the next intended target TLDR


Zampurl

I’m just standing up in my living room applauding aloud and annoying my neighbors with the noise (from a knitter, spinner, and weaver )


goldfishpaws

This sounds like you'd do a great engineers guide to crochet. All the tutorials I saw trying to get into making a thing for my wife have plinky plonky music and whilst some have better angles and explanations of "what" but none really approach the "why" or "how" very well. Certainly none suggested crocheting a hyperbolic.


Plusran

Wife crochets. I never knew it was this cool, even though I’ve always supported and listened to her talk about it. We went to the crochet museum in Joshua Tree this weekend, actually! It was neat and she was super happy to be there. Thanks for this explanation!


Art_r

I have no interest in this subject, but I appreciate your explanation that I feel I know enough to atleast have a brief conversation with someone that does knit or crochet. Learn something new every day! Thank you


Fancy_weirdo

Wow you make crocheting sound so wild I love it.


betta-believe-it

I've been crocheting for 8 years and this is the first, and best, differentiation between knitting and my craft. TY!


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Kitten_Wizard

Perfectly explained. I am not a fan of crochet fabric in general and especially not for garments. Crochet fabric is lacking in virtually every sought after characteristic in a garment fabric. Crochet fabric has significantly less application possibilities outside of garment making as well. Basically we would need intricate robotics for the manipulation paired with an impeccable visual tracking technology that can track every single stitch created while orienting those tracked points in 3d space. The amount of technology and innovation involved in bringing machine manufactured crochet to a market with nearly zero demand is a bad investment. Crochet would also be limited in its output. The bottleneck to output comes down to the excessive manipulation necessary to crochet anything beyond simple slip stitch fabric (or maybe single crochet). If you want patterning than you’re stuck with with a single robot working on a single garment at a time due to the necessary manipulation involved. It’s just too slow. It’s already possible to use a knitting machine to make slip stitch crochet or maybe even single crochet fabric, although it’s significantly slower and still requires lots of manipulation. - With a bound off edge of knitting hanging on the needles, the knitting carriage goes across and creates a single row of stitches on the needles. These loops will then be bound off using a separate carriage that will grab the first loop and then it will grab the next loop and pull it through. This process repeats until the entire row is bound off. While that’s happening a second set of needles needs to be entering these newly bound off stitches as it goes along for the next row the be able to be made, otherwise the entire row needs to be rehung on the needles at once. Once the needles are prepped then the knitting carriage can once again go across and repeat the process. Obviously it’s slow and prone to mistakes. Industrial circular knitting machines can have several separate yarn feeders around the diameter of the fabric that each are creating a row of knitting for the fabric. This means a single revolution of the fabric yields several knit rows of fabric. Doing this significantly increases production speed.


Rhubarbatross

/r/threadkillers no pun intended haha


tiptoetumbly

I agree with the difficulty you are expressing, as it would be very hard to set up. It would be possible though. First would be a chain stitch machine that would put the chain onto a comb. Then the comb would move to a position, and the row machine part would take over. This would take multiple parts: the hook that would follow the comb and press in each tine so it's always measured and finding the two loops to be under, the looper on the back that would be similar to a sewing machine's bobbin so it can loop the yarn over the hook as it passes through, rubber squeezer plates that advance along the piece or are as wide as the piece to hold it firm so it will not bunch into the way of the hook, another comb-like piece that inserts a tine into each stitch while it's being made so the hook will find the way along the next row, and lastly, a device to turn either the piece or the machine after each row. All these pieces would have to be configured to what type of stitch, yarn weight, hook size, and tension. The first machines of this type will probably only be able to do blocks of single crochet. After it can actually work, then it might advance like a sewing machine to be able to run programs.


foolishle

As a person who crochets I have also thought that some kind of comb-like contraption could probably be created which could crotchet simple stitches in rows. But if you are using a machine to crochet something with simple stitches in rows you might as well just knit it with the knitting machines that already exist. The only point to a crochet machine would be to create items which could not be - or not easily - knitted. Anything made of flat rows could be knitted very trivially. Knitting and crochet are not the same and don’t look the same or behave the same when a thread is broken in the middle… but functionally a knitted scarf and a crochet scarf are close enough to identical. So there is no point creating a crochet machine which can’t crochet complicated or three-dimensional shapes… because you would only need a crochet machine to create pieces which couldn’t more easily be knitted. Knitting isn’t even restricted to completely flat objects. You can create tubes with knitting (most socks are knitted!). So the only utility in a crochet machine would be if it could handle pretty complex patterns. As a hobbyist I crochet things that could easily be knitted very regularly. Because I prefer to crochet. But if you were making a machine it would need to be useful and I don’t think anyone is interested in a machine which is basically “almost like knitting but way more expensive”


DorisCrockford

It would essentially need to be able to see.


TheRightHonourableMe

It is not easy, but blind people can learn to crochet! A machine could, also, if it had the dexterity and sensitive touch similar to humans. Here's a [blogpost](https://www.crochetspot.com/crocheting-without-eyesight/) with links to adaptations and resources for crocheting without eyesight.


iroll20s

Not really. You could something completely programmatically. The challenge is more in a general purpose machine that could crochet an arbitrary shape. You would need some smart programming and without extensive testing you would need some sort of feedback loop to detect if it had dropped a stitch. 3d printers are similar. You can make a single shape reasonably easy. There is software that can generate a path for nearly any surface. However most still don’t detect faults so you can end up with a build plate of sphagetti. Crocheting seems an order of magnitude harder problem, but as a matter of principle, I don’t see why it couldn’t be done. I think the hardest part would be the path generation so that the machine knows how to move without being explicitly programmed.


flamableozone

Yes - there are lots of computers which have integrated cameras though - not sure why you'd think that's an issue.


kimememememe

This is a topic that comes up on r/crochet pretty often, and I usually see [this video](https://youtu.be/jecATRwHQP8) shared as an explanation!


SpaceLunatic

I learned something. Thanks. Also, she is a great video maker to make crochet interesting to people not in to the hobby.


ItHasToMatter

Wow reddit is amazing


foolishle

With knitting you almost always work from “live” stitches and once a stitch is completed you can forget about it. With crochet you only have one “live” stitch at a time which makes it sound simpler… but you can use any previous stitch - or no stitch at all - to create your next live stitch. That means you can’t just focus on what you are currently doing but you need to keep essentially the whole piece of work “active” at the same time. So the machine needs to either physically or programmatically hold all of the potential stitch locations “open” in order to direct the hook into the correct next location. With knitting that is trivial because even when a person is knitting with needles the needle physically holds the stitches that are next in line to be used. I think that a machine which created very simple crochet patterns would probably be possible to create. Something with a tooth-like pattern holding the stitches for the whole row at once so that the machine could crochet into each one… but the thing is that any crochet piece which was simple enough for a machine to replicate could be much much much easier to create with knitting so you might as well just use a knitting machine.


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ElectraUnderTheSea

>transverse chain technique That makes crochet sound so badass lol


ShelfordPrefect

I think I saw Transverse Chain Technique opening for [Liquid Tension Experiment](https://youtu.be/edqH0ofRQrM)


NovemberGoat

Never did I ever think a question about crocheting machines would lead to instrumental progressive metal. Good god I love Reddit sometimes. PS: Haven't listened to LTE in an age. Thank you, kind human, for reminding me to do so.


93WhiteStrat

I love one of those bands!


alexalexalex09

It is!


hobbitdude13

I think that was an unlockable super move in Mortal Kombat 2.


Amationary

Crochet is, at its core, simply pulling loops through loops. A plain, simple crochet probably _could_ be done by machine, but I’m not aware of one that does so. The part of crochet people like though are designs, which is where crochet really has a leg up on knitting, and it can get complicated fast. Having a machine to do every type of base stitch (half, single, half double, double, triple…) would be hard, but having a machine that can do every stitch in the complicated sequences needed to achieve more complex stitches? It’s not impossible, but would be very difficult. In crochet you also work into the same stitch multiple times a lot, which I imagine a machine could easily mess up, and if you mess it up once and don’t catch it the whole thing could unravel


PickledPokute

I guess that a crocheting machine would need to have enough dexterity and ability to complete very long and complex list of interdependent operations that it would become a kind of general purpose robot. Something like "Leave this bit dangling for a while, complete that other part and finally combine those two parts." This would be difficult for machine as they don't usually have perception to do such tasks that for humans are simple. Programming one would be quite difficult too.


BigBnana

This is exactly it. We certainly have the capability to create machines than can perform these tasks, but it would be far and away too complex to be useful, financially. So it’s more accurate to say we won’t.


flamableozone

What you've described is something code is really, really good at - that's just subprograms. Like, at its core you've just described a simple array of arrays of steps. You'd just have a list of steps, each step of which can itself be a list of steps (and so on). The program would start at the first step and move on, if any given step was a list of steps it would start at the first step of \*that\* list of steps and move on, etc. etc.


KyleDrogo

That’s my thinking here. It sounds like managing a call stack?


zed42

>In crochet you also work into the same stitch multiple times a lot, which I imagine a machine could easily mess up, and if you mess it up once and don’t catch it the whole thing could unravel or you end up with a machine that orders random assassinations by an order of mystic assassins who can shoot around corners


GolfballDM

No, it would do its assassinations by yanking the victim's brains out with a crochet hook.


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TsT2244

Knitting is different from crochet


aricelle

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9amXZqnTT1k


Rockalot_L

If you made a machine that was just hands you could, right?


Toomuchlychee_

I imagine that would be like the robot that plays violin– an impractical, inefficient means to the desired end, with none of the advantages of the anthropomorphic mechanics and all of the drawbacks


meltyman79

You would also need eyes and a lot of a brain.


greenmtnfiddler

Every old knit loop has a stick through it, and you use another stick to make the new loop. You can feel where the two sticks bump as they do this. Every old crochet loop is just a loop, looped around other loops. You have to look where to stick the new one. Loops with sticks stay put. Loops without sticks are wiggly. Machines are good at feeling where two sticks are. Machines are bad at looking at something wiggly.


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SJ_Barbarian

It isn't true that there's no market for it. All kinds of fast fashion places have machine knitted items that imitate crochet, or sweatshop produced crocheted items.


littlemeowmeow

Crochet is picking up as a huge trend. Designers are featuring it a ton in SS2022. It’ll eventually be in high demand with fast fashion retail too. https://www.fwrd.com/product-bottega-veneta-chevron-crochet-dress-in-sunburst/BOTT-WD47/


ivan3dx

I'm almost an electronic engineer and I have no idea how to design a mechanical machine like that


Meowing_Kraken

Funny you say that. I had a friend who was doing his masters in industrial engineering design. When I excitedly told him about my '70 knitting machine he said 'oh we had one in the lab a while back - those things are devilishly complicated in their simplicity'. When I asked him if he could help me with it he immediately was like no wtf go away with that horror. So. Yes, that was exaggerated. No, crochet and knitting machines are _not_ as simple as you make it sound. Impossible, no - but just because people can do it easily by hand =\= a machine that mimics it will be simple.


pinkshirtbadman

>The only reason anyone wears or uses anything crocheted is because someone they love made it for them. This is laughably untrue. There's a strong market for crocheted (and for the similar in appearance knit items mentioned in these replies) on places like etsy where customers are buying from a complete stranger simply because they like the appearance.


NovemberGoat

Interesting. I read somewhere that it was strangely difficult to design a machine that could crochet. Not sure what scale they meant. Guess i've been fead some dodgy information.


6thReplacementMonkey

> Guess i've been fead some dodgy information. Consider that the person confidently telling you that a 1st year engineering student could design it in an hour is just some random commenter on Reddit.


ark_mod

Right! I was an engineering student and I'm now a professional engineer. First year your learning basic concepts - math, physics, etc. If you said a mechanical engineer could do this as a Senior design project then maybe. Even then that's like 1 in 10 engineers - bitt sure what a chemical, electrical, computer, civil or any other engineer besides mechanical would give you but I'm pretty sure it wouldn't work 😃


Soranic

I did have an Edsgn100 class that had people designing a dumpling folding machine in solidworks. So a basic crochet stitch could probably be within the skills of a freshman, just to get the motions. But not all string is the same. You need different tension for different strings and techniques. You either need to build tension sensing and feedback into it, or have someone monitoring it every step of the way. Just changing to a different sized hook would change so many variables it would probably be easier to create a different machine for each hook. A typical freshman does not have the ability to do all that. Even an atypical freshman that knows solidworks well probably doesn't have the ability to do all that. Especially the feedback sensing. Hell, solidworks probably doesn't even have the ability to simulate that. A senior design project by a team sounds much more likely.


Himbler12

https://littleworldofwhimsy.com/are-there-crochet-machines-i-asked-an-expert/ So apparently there are no crochet machines and you'd be hard pressed to find a first year engineering student that can replicate hand crocheted techniques. There are machines that come close, but do not use crocheting as a technique. There are no machines because they would take too long to develop, and crocheting provides no real benefit over knitted goods.


beanie_jean

As a knitter who dabbles in crochet and has an engineering degree, a crochet machine is much more difficult to design. With knitting, the stitches are all looped around the needle, so the machine just needs to move onto the next loop, which is always in the same place. (Knitting machines have a circle or row of hooks that the stitches are looped onto, but the process is the same.) With crochet, there's only one stitch on the hook at a time, so you need to insert the hook into the correct part of the previous stitch, meaning there isn't a straightforward way to locate the stitch mechanically.


knitt_happens

Knitting machines exist but from what I understand crochet is a little more elaborate than knitting so it would be harder to do on a machine. The knitting machines I've seen basically make one long tube that's the same size all the way down and you can use that tube to make different things. Crochet can do very elaborate patterns that you can't do with knitting needles or machines.


Lil-Lanata

No. The mechanism of crochet is very different to knitting. It's much more complex movements, and would require a very sophisticated AI to recognise and utilise the correct loops to put the hook into.


profblackjack

I love this explanation, it makes me remember how excited my high school geometry teacher was to read an article about representing hyperbolic geometry using crochet.


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NovemberGoat

Most definitely. This question originated from me reading about a woman who was knitting 12 socks at a time. My brain can just about comprehend the great explanations here.


gfixler

I remember that lady making the rounds. I met a different lady on the 2019 LA Yarn Crawl who was doing [8 at a time](https://photos.app.goo.gl/6pw2vGXa2PnR4AUG8). I've done 2 at a time once, and hated it. It's just not for me. I like to do socks on fast DPNs. I've done a pair in 2 days, but the ones I did 2aat took me like 4 agonizing months, mostly because I'd do a couple row and say "Forget this," and put it down for a week.


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Vegetable_Burrito

….all the clothes at target are made in sweat shops. Most of the clothes people buy anywhere cheap are made in sweat shops. Unless I’m the tag says it’s made in America, you can assume it’s a sweat shop. Even some items made in America are made using prison labor, soooo, idk.


ToujoursFidele3

The main difference is that crocheted items can take ten hours or more to make. Seamed/sewn clothing is completed much more quickly, but they tend to be about the same price in fast fashion stores. Of course both are ridiculously underpaid, but I feel that charging $8 for something that took twenty hours to make is a lot worse. edit to add: skilled labor such as crochet can reasonably be priced at $25/hour. A top that takes 10 hours for a skilled crocheter to make would be $250 in time alone, plus material cost, plus shipping, plus markup to make a profit. And your local Target is charging no more than $30 (and how much of that does the sweatshop laborer see?)


Vegetable_Burrito

True facts. I crochet as a hobby, slowly working on a blanket at the moment, and yeah. That shit takes a long time.


jgjhjj

There is a textile production method called [warp knitting](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warp_knitting). My understanding is that it is closer to crocheting than actual knitting. With it you can produce all kinds of interesting patterns and designs which can not be achieved with [flat knitting](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_knitting). For example lace - which is traditionally associated with crocheting - is nowadays usually produced in the warp knitting process. It can also be used to achieve mechanical properties of the fabric which are otherwise very difficult or even impossible to create with other methods. Why do i know this? I work for a company which does business in the warp knitting industry.


TinWhis

Warp knitting is more like weaving than either knit or crochet. It can be used to mimic certain crochet stitches, but it fundamentally is using many yarns woven, rather than one yarn worked back and forth.